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mattb
01-12-2012, 12:19 PM
Hi everyone,

I am looking to purchase my first MasterCraft - a 1984 Stars & Stripes with the 440 Big Block. The boat has a professionally rebuilt velvet drive, 1300 hours, completely re-done interior (dash, carpet, seats, stereo, etc... it is flawless), blue and white gel coat (in fair condition).

My biggest concerns are the velvet drive, price, and the costs involved with owning a 440 big block. Ballpark, what is a fair price for a SS configured this way? I really have no idea what would be reasonable for this. Is there anything in particular I should look out for/be aware of when going to look at the 440? Are there any common 440 problems, failures, and the overall reliability of the big bock??

Any and all insight is greatly appreciated! I hope to join the MC club shortly!!! Thanks in advance.

ski_king
01-12-2012, 12:46 PM
Hi Matt,

There are not many of the 440's out there. Mine has the 351, so I have no real input on the 440.

Regarding the transmission, is it the powerslot (1.5:1) or the 1:1 drive.

Have any photos?

liledgy
01-12-2012, 12:58 PM
Or, you could look at this 84 in boats for sale!!

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12-03-2011, 12:05 PM
liledgy
TT Enthusiast
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Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: midwest
Posts: 174
1984 Mastercraft stars and stripes
$6000
1984 Mastercraft stars and stripes, 840 hours, fiberglass is in exceptional condition with no chips, blisters, fading or gouges. Interior is in good condition with no rips or tears in seats. Boat Starts, runs, steers and accelerates as it should. Trailer is in great condition, new bunks and carpet, bearing buddies etc. Search 1984 Mastercraft on YouTube for videos of boat running in water.

mattb
01-12-2012, 01:42 PM
ski king- It has the velvet drive trans, so I'm assuming it is the 1:1 you are referring to. The owner said it was 1:23 or something like that though? I've heard the power slot is a little stronger and better. I can attach some pictures later on tonight.

liledgy - I saw your boat on youtube actually. Looks good!

Typically, what do similar models go for? I don't want to get raped on the price due to being uneducated. The boat may, or may not, have 1300 actual hours. The previous owner ran the power for the radio off the hour meter so any time the ignition was keyed the hour meter ran. I'm a little uneasy about the hours and the overall reliability of the big block.

Will a big block drive hook up to a small block and vice versa?

EricB
01-12-2012, 01:50 PM
Matt;
A 440 in an 84 is rare. It may of been used as a ski team boat (maybe). Don't know, but there was not alot of other reasons for getting big blocks back in 84.
Since there is not alot of BB powered boats of that vintage, not alot of problems (engine wise) has been documented. The hull will be subject to the same sorts of problems as the small blocks.

I would suggest that the biggest detriment to a 440 is going to be gas consumption. You had better sock away some extra cash to feed this thing. I know the small blocks are not what one would consider to be economical to operate, but the big block will consume alot more fuel than you think.

Lastly, the boat is worth what you are willing to pay. Do more searching to compare and you will be able to determine how much you are willing to spend.

mattb
01-12-2012, 02:46 PM
Thanks EricB - the guy that owns it now is the second owner of the boat. He bought it from a family that lived on a small lake with 4 sons that skied every day.

I'm not too worried about the gas to be honest. It can't be that much worse then a small block anyways, and i wont be running it everyday.

I've been searching for prices but some are so far off from each other its hard to really gauge what these are going for.

01-12-2012, 05:14 PM
Reliability???It is an 1984 and is still running...any other questions!!!


A total overhaul on the bullet proof tranny is $850-$1200 depending on what it needs

You have a 440 SUPERSLOT...sometimes called the BAREFOOTER. You probably have a 1.5 to 1 tranny not a 1:23 to 1. I can be verified by the brass ID on the tranny itself

[email protected]

mattb
01-12-2012, 07:33 PM
Reliability???It is an 1984 and is still running...any other questions!!!


A total overhaul on the bullet proof tranny is $850-$1200 depending on what it needs

You have a 440 SUPERSLOT...sometimes called the BAREFOOTER. You probably have a 1.5 to 1 tranny not a 1:23 to 1. I can be verified by the brass ID on the tranny itself

[email protected]

Thanks Jim! I need to uploads some pictures of this thing. From what I've read on this forum and just across the internet it seems like ~$5000-5500 is the going rate for an SS in pretty good shape. Does that sound about right?

03geetee
01-12-2012, 07:34 PM
MUST SEE PICS OF THIS BEAST!!!!

I agree with Jim it most likely has the powerslot option making it a Superslot. I love how big the motor box cover is on these boats!

With out seeing it and just your description I would guess around 6-7500 wouldnt be unreasonable. Trailer? Cover? Extras?

JTR

mattb
01-12-2012, 07:37 PM
Comes with a trailer with brand new tires, brand new cover, and a freshly teaked swim platform.

I'll attach a link with some pictures shortly.

mikeg205
01-12-2012, 07:41 PM
Reliability???It is an 1984 and is still running...any other questions!!!


A total overhaul on the bullet proof tranny is $850-$1200 depending on what it needs

You have a 440 SUPERSLOT...sometimes called the BAREFOOTER. You probably have a 1.5 to 1 tranny not a 1:23 to 1. I can be verified by the brass ID on the tranny itself

[email protected]

+1 on this..... considering reading about failures of younger boats... a 440 on and S&S what was the spec'd horsepower and speed at WOT. How was it propped.....did it have sick hole shot....

johnlanguab
01-12-2012, 07:46 PM
I've got an 89' 454 Big Block with the powerslot. It's not too bad on gas, I wouldn't let the fuel consumption scare you off. Also, I like uniqueness a big block is, much less an old Chrysler.

If the stringers are good and the rest of the boat is in overall good condition $6-7k would be reasonable.

mattb
01-12-2012, 07:50 PM
PICTURES: http://www.flickr.com/photos/[email protected]/sets/72157628845096363/

Here are all the pictures so far. What do you guys think and what would you pay?

waterlogged882
01-12-2012, 07:52 PM
..........

mattb
01-12-2012, 07:54 PM
I've got an 89' 454 Big Block with the powerslot. It's not too bad on gas, I wouldn't let the fuel consumption scare you off. Also, I like uniqueness a big block is, much less an old Chrysler.

If the stringers are good and the rest of the boat is in overall good condition $6-7k would be reasonable.

They suck on gas either way is how I'm looking at it. Im not buying it to drive to work everyday, so I'm not too worried about gas. I think the big block is pretty cool, I'm just a little concerned about getting exhaust manifolds, water pumps, etc.. things like that.

I'm going to go look at it on Sunday. What's a good way to check the stringers? What should I be looking for?

mattb
01-12-2012, 07:55 PM
For me and my personal experience with a Chrysler engine, I'd not allow someone to pay me $5000 to take it.

Pass on it.

.

That bad huh? What happened?

johnlanguab
01-12-2012, 08:33 PM
It looks great. I like it.

Parts will be much more scarce on the old Chrysler. I googled 440 exhaust manifolds and they are still available. Too, I know the old 318 Chrysler marine engines were tough as nails,

Typically, on other boats you torque the bolts on the motor mounts to see if the stringers are solid. However, on a Mastercraft I'm not familiar with how to check the stringers other than removing the backseat along with the floor panel over the shaft and poking around with a rigid object.

I'm sure someone else on this thread could offer more insight regarding stringers. I do know you don't want to replace them. It's a nasty and expensive job.

With that being said, I think $6k would be more accurate given the season and the year (prior to the elimination of wood in 1986).

Good Luck!

waterlogged882
01-12-2012, 08:34 PM
..........

mikeg205
01-12-2012, 08:41 PM
just as an example...I picked up a 95 prostar 205 for 10K with 526 hours on it...

mattb
01-12-2012, 08:42 PM
It looks great. I like it.

With that being said, I think $6k would be more accurate given the season and the year (prior to the elimination of wood in 1986).

Good Luck!

I was under the impression that MC's prior to 1983-84 were all fiberglass?

mattb
01-12-2012, 08:46 PM
just as an example...I picked up a 95 prostar 205 for 10K with 526 hours on it...

Wow, thats a great deal. That makes me want to hold out and keep looking. It can't hurt to look at this one though.

Basically, I'm young, I recently graduated, I am working in my field of study and I would like to get back on the water in a way that won't break the bank. All my siblings are older now so my parents no longer have the boat - I miss it everyday. I'm just looking for a good starter boat that I think is cool, performs well, and looks nice.

mattb
01-12-2012, 08:50 PM
Pass.....

I am not fond of a Chrysler anything. Engine was not reliable in my case.

Look, if these things were proven and hot sellers, you'd see a sh!t load of them to this day. There's a reason they're rare.... a dang good reason. And with as many deals there are on the Ford or Chevy engines, don't waste your time on an antiquated engine. Others may like what "they" have and so beit.

Pass. Find a proven engine that parts are readily available. And last thing, the pictures of that engine look like crap. Your call but like I said, there's a reason that all of these boats are not sporting a Chrysler engine, regardless of it's purpose.

.

All good points. Chrysler engines aren't in a lot of tow boats, but they seem to be pretty common in a lot of other type of older boats. The engine doesn't look that clean which is a little off-putting, but it may just be a little dirty. Im not set on this boat, even though I really like it and think its pretty nice looking for an old boat, but that's it.

I appreciate all the help so far. I'm just trying to load myself with enough knowledge to have somewhat of a bargaining chip if i decide to make and offer and to make as much of an educated decision as possible.

waterlogged882
01-12-2012, 08:50 PM
..........

thatsmrmastercraft
01-12-2012, 08:51 PM
It looks great. I like it.

Parts will be much more scarce on the old Chrysler. I googled 440 exhaust manifolds and they are still available. Too, I know the old 318 Chrysler marine engines were tough as nails,

Typically, on other boats you torque the bolts on the motor mounts to see if the stringers are solid. However, on a Mastercraft I'm not familiar with how to check the stringers other than removing the backseat along with the floor panel over the shaft and poking around with a rigid object.

I'm sure someone else on this thread could offer more insight regarding stringers. I do know you don't want to replace them. It's a nasty and expensive job.

With that being said, I think $6k would be more accurate given the season and the year (prior to the elimination of wood in 1986).

Good Luck!

Wood stringers were gone by either 1982 or 1983, so that is not an issue. I too wouldn't be worried about fuel consumption. Sure it will be more than a 351, but the fuel consumption isn't that bad in a 351.

Clearly cloaked is very much against the Chrysler, but so far he is the only one. There weren't that many big block boats made, so there aren't a lot of people who can chime in. I am not a Chrysler fan, but the 440 engines survived a long run powering muscle cars to motorhomes. I would consider this boat if everything checks out and the price is right.

mattb
01-12-2012, 08:53 PM
I hear you man. Thanks a lot!

mattb
01-12-2012, 08:56 PM
Wood stringers were gone by either 1982 or 1983, so that is not an issue.

I would consider this boat if everything checks out and the price is right.

I didn't think these boats still had any wood in them. The right price is still something I am trying to determine...

waterlogged882
01-12-2012, 08:56 PM
..........

mattb
01-12-2012, 08:58 PM
Basically, I'm young, I recently graduated,

I'm not 18, I just finished getting my MBA so I'm not that young... plus I have grown up on the water and for the most part can wrench on anything I have. Im just trying to collect as much info as possible so i know what I'm getting myself into. Love it or hate it, I still appreciate the information and opinion.

01-12-2012, 09:19 PM
It looks great. I like it.

Parts will be much more scarce on the old Chrysler. I googled 440 exhaust manifolds and they are still available. Too, I know the old 318 Chrysler marine engines were tough as nails,

With that being said, I think $6k would be more accurate given the season and the year (prior to the elimination of wood in 1986).
Good Luck!

STOP BAD INFO RIGHT THERE!!! That boat has fiberglass stringers!!! 1983 1/2 was the change over and this one has fiberglassI was under the impression that MC's prior to 1983-84 were all fiberglass?

1983 1/2 MID YEAR CHANGE. THis has been discussed 1000 times on here. The metal
plate on each side of the engine is your indicator!!!

I'm not 18, I just finished getting my MBA so I'm not that young... plus I have grown up on the water and for the most part can wrench on anything I have. Im just trying to collect as much info as possible so i know what I'm getting myself into. Love it or hate it, I still appreciate the information and opinion.

STAY EDUCATED...start at $5000 and buy it for $6000...It will be a ton of fun, a learning experince and will create a TON of memories!!! GO FOR IT!!!

[email protected]

mattb
01-12-2012, 09:29 PM
STOP BAD INFO RIGHT THERE!!! That boat has fiberglass stringers!!! 1983 1/2 was the change over and this one has fiberglass

1983 1/2 MID YEAR CHANGE. THis has been discussed 1000 times on here. The metal
plate on each side of the engine is your indicator!!!



STAY EDUCATED...start at $5000 and buy it for $6000...It will be a ton of fun, a learning experince and will create a TON of memories!!! GO FOR IT!!!

[email protected]

Thanks again Jim! Sorry for all the newb questions, I need to search the site some more.

liledgy
01-12-2012, 09:35 PM
Hey Matt. The boat appears to be in decent condition. Your stringers and floor are all fiberglass, so you will have no expensive and time consuming hull rebuilding work. The interior appears to be tastefully redone. I may be in the minority here but I always liked the fiberglass engine covers. I also like how it is well above the sides (gunnels).
The trailer leaves a lot to be desired. Defiantly not a mastercraft trailer, more like a cheap trailmaster. The scratches on the sides might be able to be wet sanded out. They probably are not noticible more than a few feet away anyway ( it is an 84!).
As far as the motor, small block PCM fords were the motor of choice for tournament drivers in the 80's. The dash looks like it has a bit of fading on it ( where the slalom skier and slalom times are). I think the motor could be a bargaining point for you. On my lake, it's nice to know I can walk over to my neighbors ( who could have a nautique, supra, Malibu, supreme, etc.) and borrow an old cap, rotor, starter, impeller, etc, etc, etc and be able to get my boat running in a pinch ( never needed to though). I don't think you would ever be able to do that with that motor. The million dollar question is though. HOW MUCH?

mattb
01-12-2012, 09:48 PM
The trailer leaves a lot to be desired. Defiantly not a mastercraft trailer, more like a cheap trailmaster. The scratches on the sides might be able to be wet sanded out. They probably are not noticible more than a few feet away anyway ( it is an 84!). The million dollar question is though. HOW MUCH?

I didn't think the trailer was an original. All the 80's trailers seems to have the fiberglass fenders/steps. The boat's a '84, like you said the paint won't be perfect and i'm okay with putting a little time and work into it.

I have a pretty good lead on nearly the identical boat with the small block PCM, so we'll see how things play out.

The guy has two listings, one for $7500 and the other for $6900. I'm thinking I wouldn't pay more than $5-6k for it.

mattb
01-12-2012, 09:52 PM
BTW - this is a great forum!!! I greatly appreciate how willing everyone is to help a new member out. Whether it be with this boat or not, I hope to soon join the MC club.

Shooter McKevin
01-12-2012, 10:34 PM
PICTURES: http://www.flickr.com/photos/[email protected]/sets/72157628845096363/

Here are all the pictures so far. What do you guys think and what would you pay?

I want one!

waterlogged882
01-12-2012, 10:40 PM
..........

Shooter McKevin
01-12-2012, 10:45 PM
The reliability in the modified marinization stinks.... If I thought it was a decent engine like anyone else here does (or does not) we'd all have a Chrysler engine. This is a boat not a car. No comparison.

Do you stop at a restaurant on Sat night with your wife and or significant other, prime time eating, and there is one car in the lot where the next door restaurant's parking lot is jamb-packed? :D Yea, I'd jump right on that empty parking lot... Burgers $1.50...



.

You may be right, I'm not sure. But there may be other reasons MC didn't use them more. They didn't stop using Indmar due to poor quality.

I'd feel more comfortable with a 351, but the uniqueness and big power is pretty cool. (does anyone know what the hp rating is?)

thatsmrmastercraft
01-12-2012, 10:47 PM
I have seen worse trailers than that. Nothing that a bunch of elbow grease wouldn't take care of. Cleaned, painted and some nice wheels would do a lot for it.

mattb
01-13-2012, 07:28 AM
I'd feel more comfortable with a 351, but the uniqueness and big power is pretty cool. (does anyone know what the hp rating is?)

I'd feel a lot more comfortable as well. Everything i've read points to 330hp. Not too bad for being fed by that tiny single barrel carb.

sethro
01-13-2012, 08:59 AM
Matt,

Is that boat owned by a guy named Rick?

TRBenj
01-13-2012, 09:35 AM
Look, if these things were proven and hot sellers, you'd see a sh!t load of them to this day. There's a reason they're rare.... a dang good reason.
I do believe the "dang good reason" the vast majority of the boats from this era had the 351w in them is because that motor was cheap, reliable and had more than enough power for a 19' ski boat. There was simply no reason to check the option box for the big blocks... they are heavier and more expensive- and deemed unnecessary by dealers and consumers alike.

S&S's with the 454 are pretty rare too, but that doesnt mean the big block chevy is a bad engine.

I have no 440 experience, so I would recommend doing your research. Make sure they were not prone to cooling, oiling, or other issues... but my guess is that they werent. Parts are likely to be a little more expensive (compared to the SBF) due to the lower volume of them produced, but I doubt things are going to become "unobtainable". Likewise, so-called "experts" on the engine may be fewer and further between- but its not like working on these things is rocket science.

I cant see the pictures, but Id base my decision on condition and price. The big block would actually add some "cool" factor, in my opinion... but I wouldnt necessarily pay more for it. Do a compression check on the engine, at a minimum- and do a water test.

89BigBlock
01-13-2012, 09:57 AM
Hi, I've have no experience with that motor but I do have an 89' with a GM 454. I bought mine with 600hr for $8500 from a 3rd owner that trashed it! My intention's were to restore it little by little. Within 1yr the motor had spun a bearing! I was not planning on this to say the least but I had found a replacement block and installed for $2500. With that said the fuel IS a noticeable difference. Other than that, I've had to replace normal things like fuel pumps, fuel sender, carb rebuild, and cooling hoses (typical). The flooring was also an upgrade that HAD to be done. The fiberglass/marine panels started to get spongy and eventually my foot actually went through. I had aluminum replacements made.

The boat looks like a nice example from that era and also looks to be kept in pretty good shape from the pics at least. One thing to keep in mind is that those early boats are very narrow and with a Big Block motor in it, it will effect the shape and size of the wake. I purposely ski with half a tank or less because of this to offset. I hope I'm not scaring you away from the boat because it has a very nice price point and depending on how your going to use it will make the difference.

Cheers.

thatsmrmastercraft
01-13-2012, 10:16 AM
A 460 Ford big block was an option for a while in the stars & stripes, but I don't think I have encountered one.

89BigBlock
01-13-2012, 10:19 AM
Hi, I've have no experience with that motor but I do have an 89' with a GM 454. I bought mine with 600hr for $8500 from a 3rd owner that trashed it! My intention's were to restore it little by little. Within 1yr the motor had spun a bearing! I was not planning on this to say the least but I had found a replacement block and installed for $2500. With that said the fuel IS a noticeable difference. Other than that, I've had to replace normal things like fuel pumps, fuel sender, carb rebuild, and cooling hoses (typical). The flooring was also an upgrade that HAD to be done. The fiberglass/marine panels started to get spongy and eventually my foot actually went through. I had aluminum replacements made.

The boat looks like a nice example from that era and also looks to be kept in pretty good shape from the pics at least. One thing to keep in mind is that those early boats are very narrow and with a Big Block motor in it, it will effect the shape and size of the wake. I purposely ski with half a tank or less because of this to offset. I hope I'm not scaring you away from the boat because it has a very nice price point and depending on how your going to use it will make the difference.

Cheers.

mattb
01-13-2012, 11:22 AM
Matt,

Is that boat owned by a guy named Rick?

I'm not sure who owned it prior to the current owner, but his name is not Rick.

mattb
01-13-2012, 11:25 AM
I have no 440 experience, so I would recommend doing your research.

I cant see the pictures, but Id base my decision on condition and price. The big block would actually add some "cool" factor, in my opinion... but I wouldnt necessarily pay more for it. Do a compression check on the engine, at a minimum- and do a water test.

That's exactly how I feel. I'm here to find out as much as I can and arm myself with as much knowledge as possible. I will definitely do a compression test if it comes down to making an offer. I haven't figured out the logistics of doing a water test in the middle of January in Michigan?? (even though is has been 50 degrees the majority of winter so far).

mattb
01-13-2012, 11:27 AM
The boat looks like a nice example from that era and also looks to be kept in pretty good shape from the pics at least. One thing to keep in mind is that those early boats are very narrow and with a Big Block motor in it, it will effect the shape and size of the wake. I purposely ski with half a tank or less because of this to offset. I hope I'm not scaring you away from the boat because it has a very nice price point and depending on how your going to use it will make the difference.

Cheers.

Bigblock - Thanks for all the information. You're not scaring me off, I appreciate hearing both sides of things. I kind of figured this thing would be a hog on gas, but pretty much all boats are so im not too worried about it.

rjracin240
01-13-2012, 12:17 PM
That's exactly how I feel. I'm here to find out as much as I can and arm myself with as much knowledge as possible. I will definitely do a compression test if it comes down to making an offer. I haven't figured out the logistics of doing a water test in the middle of January in Michigan?? (even though is has been 50 degrees the majority of winter so far).
When I bought my boat I had intentions of doing a compression test, did not plan for my spark plug socket not fitting due to the exhaust manifold! Just saying bring a handful of wrenches with you in order to pull plugs. Know what kind of pressure you should see on a compression check for this motor before going.
Did read the part where you feel comfortable wrenching, not trying to diss you just throwing a suggestion.

Good luck

ski_king
01-13-2012, 12:28 PM
By the way, the photos verified that it is a SuperSlot, (1.52:1) transmission.

NIce!

Shooter McKevin
01-13-2012, 12:36 PM
After second and third thoughts, I say buy it. It should be had for $6000, hours of TLC and enjoyment.

Hey Cloaked, you did a 180 so I have to ask about your level of sarcasm...

are you saying "(100's of) hours of TLC and (very few hours of) enjoyment"?

mattb
01-13-2012, 01:59 PM
When I bought my boat I had intentions of doing a compression test, did not plan for my spark plug socket not fitting due to the exhaust manifold! Just saying bring a handful of wrenches with you in order to pull plugs. Know what kind of pressure you should see on a compression check for this motor before going.
Did read the part where you feel comfortable wrenching, not trying to diss you just throwing a suggestion.

Good luck

I'm glad you pointed this out. I'll be sure to bring a variety of handtools with me.

Hey Cloaked, you did a 180 so I have to ask about your level of sarcasm...

are you saying "(100's of) hours of TLC and (very few hours of) enjoyment"?

Lol, I read it that way too.

Shooter McKevin
01-13-2012, 02:09 PM
I was tempted to go to Phoenix to look at this boat back in 2008. The ad didn't say anything about it just '84, $5000.00. Found my 2000 locally instead.
74351

aquaman
01-13-2012, 04:31 PM
Bigblock - Thanks for all the information. You're not scaring me off, I appreciate hearing both sides of things. I kind of figured this thing would be a hog on gas, but pretty much all boats are so im not too worried about it.

Nice boat.....but that engine will be a BIGGER hog for gas than you can imagine.

add that to expense of repairs and parts and you will wish you had gone for a boat with 351 or similar power. they ARE bulletproof.

rare engines are cool, but they are troublesome and expen$ive to keep running. the slight HP bump will not be worth the trouble. imo.


any model MC will be fun. but reliability and expense are real buggers. :)

03geetee
01-13-2012, 05:02 PM
I think the moral of the story is if this was your first MC and or boat you might wanna step in to the game with the 351 and get your feet wet, without nickel and dimeing your self to death killing the fun. However if you are into boats, been in them or owned a few and dont mind some extra kinks in the line (possibly) then go for the unique boat and get her where you want her to be.

JTR

waterlogged882
01-13-2012, 06:54 PM
..........

mattb
01-13-2012, 07:11 PM
I hope the guy moves his boat but the original poster here is looking for advice about owning his first MBA boat. Figure that one... invest into a sink hole? :D :D

.

I'm just trying to gather information and all the pro's and cons, thats really all. This isn't my first boat, but it will be the first MC that I will truly own. I grew up on the water with boats - parent-owned boats (the best boats ever, free maintenance!! - read with sarcasm).

I appreciate you clearly laying out the con's of this boat. I still think a $6000 " first MBA boat" is a smarter investment than buying a new $60-80k boat. To each his own, thanks for the input.

mattb
01-13-2012, 07:12 PM
I was tempted to go to Phoenix to look at this boat back in 2008. The ad didn't say anything about it just '84, $5000.00. Found my 2000 locally instead.
74351

That's a great looking boat!

waterlogged882
01-13-2012, 07:22 PM
..........

HDAVIS
01-13-2012, 07:32 PM
You know having a "big block" might be "cool", but I learned a long time ago that I would not touch a boat with out fuel injection. This boat might be great, but unless you know how to do a few things yourself, like correctly adjusting a carb ect. you got problems.

mikeg205
01-13-2012, 08:08 PM
This one had me drooling a few months back.....had to keep the picture...

waterlogged882
01-13-2012, 08:14 PM
..........

Footin
01-13-2012, 08:32 PM
Oh I hear you. I have had fun poking back and forth. If you spend some dang $60 - 80k for a boat, go back to your graduate school and ask for a refund....:D

I realize your a fart smeller (my Grandma's funny) or rather a smart feller......:D

That brown 84 model for $6K is a buy. Not a steal but certainly a fair price. Nice looking boat and all. There are several out there. I'd have already entertained that boat but I am looking for another stars boat of particular details.

Best,
Sporty

Give'm hell Chuck.

mikeg205
01-13-2012, 09:07 PM
It's still for sale at $10,900 - 79 model. I saw it somwhere in the last few days.


http://atlanta.craigslist.org/sat/boa/2776186612.html



.

thanks...lol...now I need a spare $10K - I am sure I could get it for less...the I would have a white and black MC.

03geetee
01-13-2012, 09:28 PM
What still shocks me is that these boats, regardless of the economy, arent selling for more money. I know there isnt much to them, but seriously to be able to get on the water with the best boats ever made for 5K up front and maybe 1500-2K invested afterward is a STEAL!

Just stating my opinion, but as most of you know I have loved these boats since I could swim and never have stopped.

JTR

mattb
01-13-2012, 09:44 PM
You know having a "big block" might be "cool", but I learned a long time ago that I would not touch a boat with out fuel injection. This boat might be great, but unless you know how to do a few things yourself, like correctly adjusting a carb ect. you got problems.

Old small blocks don't have fuel injection either. Hell, some of the newer marine engines are still aren't fuel injected. Computers and fuel injection create all kinds of problems that are much more difficult than rebuilding, cleaning, or adjusting a few needles.

mattb
01-13-2012, 09:45 PM
Oh I hear you. I have had fun poking back and forth. If you spend some dang $60 - 80k for a boat, go back to your graduate school and ask for a refund....:D

LOL, I never should have even mentioned that. I just didn't want you to think I was talking about graduating from high school.

thatsmrmastercraft
01-13-2012, 10:20 PM
What still shocks me is that these boats, regardless of the economy, arent selling for more money. I know there isnt much to them, but seriously to be able to get on the water with the best boats ever made for 5K up front and maybe 1500-2K invested afterward is a STEAL!

Just stating my opinion, but as most of you know I have loved these boats since I could swim and never have stopped.

JTR

I couldn't agree more. And for the guy who is willing and capable to do some work, a guy can get into one for less than the 5K.

mattb
01-14-2012, 09:15 AM
What still shocks me is that these boats, regardless of the economy, arent selling for more money. I know there isnt much to them, but seriously to be able to get on the water with the best boats ever made for 5K up front and maybe 1500-2K invested afterward is a STEAL!

Just stating my opinion, but as most of you know I have loved these boats since I could swim and never have stopped.

JTR

Good to know guys! Stay tuned. I'm going to go look at her tomorrow.

89BigBlock
01-14-2012, 09:24 AM
What still shocks me is that these boats, regardless of the economy, arent selling for more money. I know there isnt much to them, but seriously to be able to get on the water with the best boats ever made for 5K up front and maybe 1500-2K invested afterward is a STEAL!

Just stating my opinion, but as most of you know I have loved these boats since I could swim and never have stopped.

JTR


Iono..my opinion is a little different. The newer boats are WAY overpriced IMO and the older boats are priced well. They're not cars! Essentially your talking about a fiberglass hull and an engine. Now I realize there's a lot of R&D and design of the hull for today's boats but not enough for me to drop 50k+! The upholstery, stereo's, ballast system's, trailer, heck even the engine doesn't justify the prices to me. You can get a crate motor from GM for well under 5k! Don't get me wrong, I drool over the new models every yr in the show room, but my 89' puts a smile on my face every day.

To each his own...

ahhudgins
01-14-2012, 10:00 AM
I think the moral of the story is if this was your first MC and or boat you might wanna step in to the game with the 351 and get your feet wet, without nickel and dimeing your self to death killing the fun. However if you are into boats, been in them or owned a few and dont mind some extra kinks in the line (possibly) then go for the unique boat and get her where you want her to be.

JTR

I agree 100%. If I am looking for a MC that's going to be my one and only mode of being on the water, there are tons of older S&S boats for sale with the standard 351W. The 351W is a very simple engine to work on and finding ANY part is not an issue. If you do have an engine problem that you can't figure out, any local mechanic can help you out.

Now if you just want a "rare boat", then go for it.
I've learned over the years that if I'm making a major purchase and I have any amount of hesitation in my gut, I walk away.

Lumbergh
01-14-2012, 10:19 AM
I agree 100%. If I am looking for a MC that's going to be my one and only mode of being on the water, there are tons of older S&S boats for sale with the standard 351W. The 351W is a very simple engine to work on and finding ANY part is not an issue. If you do have an engine problem that you can't figure out, any local mechanic can help you out.

Now if you just want a "rare boat", then go for it.
I've learned over the years that if I'm making a major purchase and I have any amount of hesitation in my gut, I walk away.

This is sage advise. "Rare" anything mechanical = expensive and a hassle to deal with.

There is no shortage of nice older MC out there. I would let this slide and make it someone elses problem.

madcityskier
01-14-2012, 11:07 AM
I'd look carefully at what a crack near the rub rail that the pictures seem to show. The engine as has been said to no end will use gas, but the bigger issue to me is the space you'll lose. My 85 w/ 351 has considerably more room in the back seat than that, and it's still pretty cramped. If you plan to leave the seat home, ride a lot, and leave gear there, no problem. If you see yourself grabbing 4 or 5 friends to go cruise around, that space will be sorely missed. If you're into barefooting that engine will be a godsend. Think I saw someone say 330hp? Compared to the 240 from my 351 that's awesome. Might be worth the occasional parts headache.

waterlogged882
01-14-2012, 11:09 AM
..........

mattb
01-14-2012, 11:14 AM
I'd look carefully at what a crack near the rub rail that the pictures seem to show. The engine as has been said to no end will use gas, but the bigger issue to me is the space you'll lose. My 85 w/ 351 has considerably more room in the back seat than that, and it's still pretty cramped. If you plan to leave the seat home, ride a lot, and leave gear there, no problem. If you see yourself grabbing 4 or 5 friends to go cruise around, that space will be sorely missed.

I'm looking at pictures of the big block boat compared to the 84 SS 351 I took down with me to kentucky and the space does seem to be significantly reduced with the bigger motor. Already a small boat to begin with, I too think the space would be greatly missed.


Oh and another thing..............

Congrats on the MBA. I recently completed a graduate program and I know it's a lot of work.



Now, make me proud...... Did I mention a PCM 351? :D

.

Thanks! I think you may have mentioned that before. Between the loss of space and the potential headaches I'm thinking it might be better to walk away.

03geetee
01-14-2012, 11:17 AM
Besides for the money you save on a 351 powered boat, with a few tricks (GT40P heads, lower intake, proper running carb and a mild cam bump) you will be making at least equal or more then that tired Mopar would make now, and have the most space these already small boats can offer.

If you have the money keep on looking there are alot of these boats out there in various condition so finding one that fits will happen, you will know when its right I did.

JTR

thatsmrmastercraft
01-14-2012, 11:45 AM
Besides for the money you save on a 351 powered boat, with a few tricks (GT40P heads, lower intake, proper running carb and a mild cam bump) you will be making at least equal or more then that tired Mopar would make now, and have the most space these already small boats can offer.

If you have the money keep on looking there are alot of these boats out there in various condition so finding one that fits will happen, you will know when its right I did.

JTR

That and the space would make a 351 powered boat the choice, as long as the big block cool factor doesn't play into it.

Shooter McKevin
01-17-2012, 10:40 AM
Hey Matt,

Give us an update man, how did the viewing go? Let me guess, you fell in love and bought it, now you're not exactly sure how to tell us...

If you didn't buy it, check this out.http://www.mastercraft.com/teamtalk/showpost.php?p=811247&postcount=4705

aquaman
01-17-2012, 10:58 AM
Hey Matt,

Give us an update man, how did the viewing go? Let me guess, you fell in love and bought it, now you're not exactly sure how to tell us...

If you didn't buy it, check this out.http://www.mastercraft.com/teamtalk/showpost.php?p=811247&postcount=4705

Thats a nice looking boat.

thatsmrmastercraft
01-17-2012, 11:21 AM
Thats a nice looking boat.

No doubt...........at a fair price from the looks of it.

Shooter McKevin
01-17-2012, 11:31 AM
I thought I'd surf some info on Chrysler Marine. A few interesting facts but nothing overly exciting in this article http://www.allpar.com/history/marine.html

Except:
"In January of 1986, Chrysler premiered a 340 horsepower V8 at the New York Boat Show as a way of signaling a re-emergence of its former glory days, but the introduction did not lead to anything substantial. Chryslerís marine operations disappeared from view after this. J.P. Joans wrote that the last part of Chryslerís inboard engine business was sold to Canadian firm Idmar in 1989 or 1990."

At first it seemed like "Indmar" spelled wrong (and not Canadian). The web doesn't show much, but it seems like Idmar Marine did exist. Buying parts for one of those would sure be annoying.

mattb
01-17-2012, 07:40 PM
Hey Matt,

Give us an update man, how did the viewing go? Let me guess, you fell in love and bought it, now you're not exactly sure how to tell us...

If you didn't buy it, check this out.http://www.mastercraft.com/teamtalk/showpost.php?p=811247&postcount=4705

I actually did not go see it Sunday because of the snow we got up here. Hopefully this weekend. That's a great looking boat too. Thanks for the link. I'll keep you guys posted on any progress.

mattb
01-17-2012, 07:42 PM
I thought I'd surf some info on Chrysler Marine. A few interesting facts but nothing overly exciting in this article http://www.allpar.com/history/marine.html


I skimmed through that article as well. There's not a ton out there on these motors unfortunately.

1redTA
01-17-2012, 08:41 PM
another negative of the Chrysler engine is that not many will be able to help with any problems. On the other hand a unique big block engine is cool and a competent shade tree mechanic should be able to handle most engine problems

Rick_Seebeck
01-23-2012, 01:24 PM
I have owned a 1983 with the 440 and have used it nearly every day during the summer months in Michigan. I ski, barefoot, pull my kids on tubes and wakeboards, cruise the lake etc. The boat is a work horse! It has never let me down and pulls like the Budwieser Clydesdales.

I have had no issues with the motor or finding normal maintenance parts including those for the electronic ignition.

The only problem I have had is that the oil pump (which is mounted externally on the 440) will lose prime when you change the oil. Not a big deal but a pain none the less.

Keep a good in line gas filter on the beast, change the oil each year and let her rip. I paid 5 thousand for mine and it was in about the same shape as yours.

You are welcome to call me if you need more info - 989 429 0619

MIskier
01-23-2012, 01:48 PM
I have owned a 1983 with the 440 and have used it nearly every day during the summer months in Michigan. I ski, barefoot, pull my kids on tubes and wakeboards, cruise the lake etc. The boat is a work horse! It has never let me down and pulls like the Budwieser Clydesdales.

I have had no issues with the motor or finding normal maintenance parts including those for the electronic ignition.

The only problem I have had is that the oil pump (which is mounted externally on the 440) will lose prime when you change the oil. Not a big deal but a pain none the less.

Keep a good in line gas filter on the beast, change the oil each year and let her rip. I paid 5 thousand for mine and it was in about the same shape as yours.

You are welcome to call me if you need more info - 989 429 0619

Where are you at in Michigan? I grew up in Muir which is a 989 area code.

Ypsi-Rider
01-25-2012, 08:03 AM
When I was in the market I talked to the guy selling this boat. He has had it on the market since last summer. In mid November I offered him $6000 cash. He wouldn't take it. He is under the impression that the boat is worth much more. I'm sure that with spring coming up he is going to be trying to get top dollar...

mattb
01-25-2012, 09:58 AM
I have owned a 1983 with the 440 and have used it nearly every day during the summer months in Michigan. I ski, barefoot, pull my kids on tubes and wakeboards, cruise the lake etc. The boat is a work horse! It has never let me down and pulls like the Budwieser Clydesdales.

I have had no issues with the motor or finding normal maintenance parts including those for the electronic ignition.

The only problem I have had is that the oil pump (which is mounted externally on the 440) will lose prime when you change the oil. Not a big deal but a pain none the less.

Keep a good in line gas filter on the beast, change the oil each year and let her rip. I paid 5 thousand for mine and it was in about the same shape as yours.

You are welcome to call me if you need more info - 989 429 0619

Thanks for the info! Good to know! I think I am going to hold out for a 351 and something newer in the $10k price range.

Shooter McKevin
02-14-2012, 07:12 PM
Matt,
I see from your post in the '95 190 for sale thread that you bought one. Congratulations. We need the update and the photos!! (and you gotta talk to a mod about fixing your guest status).
Kevin

mattb
02-14-2012, 07:15 PM
Matt,
I see from your post in the '95 190 for sale thread that you bought one. Congratulations. We need the update and the photos!! (and you gotta talk to a mod about fixing your guest status).
Kevin

That is correct! I'm making the long haul to Kentucky this weekend to pick it up. Needless to say, I'm pretty excited to get this deal finalized and have her back in Michigan awaiting some nice weather.

I'll PM one of the Mod's about this. My status keeps going from guest to TT regular?

03geetee
02-14-2012, 09:01 PM
Sick congrats!

JTR

madcityskier
02-14-2012, 10:44 PM
Where in MI and where in KY? Lived in both.