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  #41  
Old 10-30-2013, 08:08 AM
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mikeg205 mikeg205 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by east tx skier View Post
Tell me something I don't know.
That's awesome... I knew it...
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  #42  
Old 10-30-2013, 02:24 PM
bsloop bsloop is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by varun View Post
Clearly I'm not an expert at this, hence I do not understand the lingo. What is MCODumb and DUMB in reference to the past two comments/posts?
I understand that you do not want to run the motor dry w/o water as it will overheat, I get that. I do not want to fill water in the motor to begin with, I am looking at winterizing hence I will first drain as much water as I can, then fill 5-6 gal of RV AF via this bucket method.
Do I need to splice this Perko Flush Pro valve permanently into the water lines/plumbing of my boat, or connect it only when im doing the flush? Anyone know how thick those hoses are on a late model x25? So if I'm not mistaken, this Perko Flush Pro is the same gizmo that M/c installs in their boats as the 'engine flush kit'?
Perko is the flush kit many OEM install. The primary use is for those in salt/brackish water to easily flush the engine after each use to reduce corrosive damage of salt exposure.
A side benefit is it makes running the engine out of water very easy for any maintenance. It does cost $100 and is permanently installed which requires splicing into the raw water intake between the scupper and oil cooler. Takes an hour if you know what you are doing and have good tools, 2hrs for your first time and have to hack through the wire reinforced hose.
Like many other preventative maintenance accessory items, there is a trade off in $$, install time and long term use.

Usually with the Flush valve, a short section of garden hose is used to suck AF out of a bucket. The difference is there is no fabrication of a bucket apparatus, unhooking of other engine hoses or spilling if dumping direct from a bottle.
Perko's original design had a tendency to crack at the hose neck (happened to me), this was fixed in a redesign several years ago if you run across web banter.

Raw water intake is usually 1 1/4" ID.

Quote:
Originally Posted by thatsmrmastercraft View Post
The Dumb part comes from a "gentleman" on here who is taking personal shots at a well respected member here who evidently feels insulted somehow. Please disregard his offensive behavior.
Once again, there was no personal shot, if he took it personal, I am sorry, he can reread my statements.
All three of you mega posters provide very insightful advice. It is not however above question nor out of the realm of public discussion to have a differing opinion.
It appears my opinions would be questioned not by facts but by small snips and one off examples, much like radical political factions tend to do.

Case in point -
Quote:
Originally Posted by thatsmrmastercraft View Post
You aren't really serious that you run your engine at WOT on the trailer connected to a hose, are you?
Sarcasm does not transfer well in print, being a mod I feel you should know this. Since my answer was sincere as was the original question, I assume this question / insinuation was as well. In which case it hurts my respect for you since you should know better than most that a non regulated, carb engine can free rev to damaging RPM at WOT.
My statement-
Quote:
Originally Posted by bsloop View Post
Even WOT on the trailer, the engine is not under load thus not burning max fuel or producing the heat. .
My statement in context is still true, even at WOT there is not sufficient heat generated for damage, RPMs may cause damage due to moving mass long before heat.
Most might infer WOT to be in the 4,400-4,600rpm range since that is what a BB is rated for under operating load.
I would not be afraid to run it up to that rpm range and hold long enough do checks such as belt play, timing, carb or throttle cable adjustment.

Quote:
Originally Posted by east tx skier View Post
And I read that other post of yours on the subject, too. A few thoughts ...

I had water pressure issues at my house for years. I realized the extent of it after sticking my garden hose in the raw water supply hose, turning it on, running the boat, and not getting any water flow. Yes, the hose works fine most of the time, but it's not a universal fix. So I stick with the $8 bucket solution that works well for me. Yes, I get peace of mind from watching the engine draw the water. Oddly enough, I just pour antifreeze into the tstat.

To your other point, as far as winterization goes, you are correct. You don't need a lakes worth of water to keep the engine cool. All you are doing is warming up the engine to warm up the oil and transmission fluid and move stabilized fuel into all the necessary places. Most of us are keeping it under 1,200 rpm during this process. If it weren't for the lubricating properties of water required by the impeller, I'm not sure you need any water at all to do this. It will happen more quickly without any water. The point is, if you keep things lubricated and shut the boat off when you get up to temp, it doesn't really matter how much water you used to get there or how you got it there.

The practical concern is keeping the impeller from getting burned up during this process. Some water will do this. None will result in your having to fish a bunch of impeller bits from every nook and cranny of the cooling system and beyond. In my case, I was paying close attention and didn't burn up the impeller. The real benefit of the bucket method over a non-opaque hose is that you know immediately that everything is working in that regard.

As mentioned above, based on having it not work, I prefer this bit of reassurance. If you are confident that the water pressure, etc. at your house will perform the exact same way as it always has (I know I once felt this way), then good on you. Whistle a happy tune from a great feeling of superiority over us poor dullards that heave those massive empty five gallon buckets into our boats, spend an extra minute of our lives attaching a hose to the transmission cooler, dropping that hose into the bucket and feeding that bucket with a hose not unlike the one you cram into a raw water hose and clamp down.


And, for what it's worth, I don't have MC OCD. I dont' even have a MC.
ET, I appreciate your one off example of where lack of water flow or a kinked hose might pose a problem. Most would have verified this prior to hooking up and visually inspect water is indeed coming out exhaust or not leaking significantly from a fake a lake then keep ears sensitive enough to listen for the burbling exhaust splash while working.

Again, each method has plus and minus. A bucket plumbed to supply water serves the same end purpose as any other. Water in will equal water out, sufficient cooling will be maintained from the flow of most garden hoses.

My only contention is against the fallacy that a full water supply is necessary to run an engine.
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  #43  
Old 10-30-2013, 04:36 PM
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east tx skier east tx skier is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bsloop View Post

ET, I appreciate your one off example of where lack of water flow or a kinked hose might pose a problem. Most would have verified this prior to hooking up and visually inspect water is indeed coming out exhaust or not leaking significantly from a fake a lake then keep ears sensitive enough to listen for the burbling exhaust splash while working.

Again, each method has plus and minus. A bucket plumbed to supply water serves the same end purpose as any other. Water in will equal water out, sufficient cooling will be maintained from the flow of most garden hoses.

My only contention is against the fallacy that a full water supply is necessary to run an engine.
Full water supply, no. However, in my example, my supply of water was definitely more than a dribble and no kinked hose. For whatever reason though, when clamped into the raw water hose, even with some, albeit lackluster, pressure, the water was not making it to the system.

This is a sincere question. At some point, even though a modicum of water pressure, and the suction from the water pump all seem to be pushing/pulling water the same direction, is there something that would cause there to exist a vacuum in the works (not a kinked hose) that would simply cause there to be no flow at lower pressures?

This has always baffled me. That same day, I unhooked the hose from the raw water hose and dropped it in a bucket and filled the bucket enough to run the boat without issue.

The real beauty of the bucket method and why I recommend it is as follows:
(1) it's cheap (under $6 in parts I didn't have on hand---mine is not a hard plumbed affair),
(2) it's easy, and
(3) it's pretty much idiot proof (you can see it working and keep your eye on it).

The fact that with this method you have the reassurance that the pump and impeller are working (pulling water from the bucket unassisted) and, therefore, have an indicator of future on-water performance of these components a bonus, albeit one unrelated to the winterization process (which, of course is your point).

Of course, the hose cram method is cheap and easy, too. I would call it slightly less idiot proof, however, based on my own, well, instance of idiocy.
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Last edited by east tx skier; 10-30-2013 at 04:58 PM.
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  #44  
Old 10-31-2013, 04:59 PM
bsloop bsloop is offline
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I have never used the method you seem to describe - pulling the raw water hose from the scupper and simply letting a hose run into it, "clamping" to hold the hose in place?

Seems like a one off scenario a person would have to be there for to have seen the exact setup at that moment.
In the craziness of all the steps buzzing around one's head, I might first suspect a link in the hose, clamp restriction or somehow the raw water hose was kinked not allowing flow to motor.
If the motor was not taking up water, it should have been spilling back into the bilge. If there was no water coming out of the hose, there had to be a restriction.

IF there was a low flow, you simply might not have let the motor run long enough to fill with water and expel? Much like the OP that only used 3 gal and didn't have anything come out?

I could hypothesize an odd scenario like using the perko flush (or another inline threaded tap source) with scupper sealed so no air could be drawn in, the pumps might be able to create enough vacuum to collapse a small diameter hose with a weakened wall. That is really stretching though.

Sorry, I really think it was a case of "ya had to be there"
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  #45  
Old 11-01-2013, 09:58 AM
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A 5 gallon water bucket is emptied in less then 30 seconds at idle and at 1500 rpm the bucket is emptied in just about 10 seconds.
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