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  #21  
Old 09-13-2013, 02:28 PM
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Originally Posted by EarmarkMarine View Post
From the photo, the glue seam did not fail. The spider fatiqued and was torn at the most vulnerable point close to the voice coil from excessive excursion (when it was completely stretched out the back and forth bend became extreme at the termination). This can be a result of simply being over-driven and abused. This can also be a result of the wrong crossover point, using bass boost or eq when you shouldn't, or an enclosure without a terminal cup and/or that was unsealed by some other means. Any woofer will have obvious distortion before it fails in that manner.

David
I installed the IB sub for now and turned down the gains a bit more. It seemed as though there were a bit too high because I could hear the non-damaged sub bottoming.

Its difficult to tune on the driveway in our neighbourhood as I dont want to play loud music for long periods of time.
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  #22  
Old 09-13-2013, 03:29 PM
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As much as I like the sound quality of the M10W5's, I think people in our boat are there for the party (loud music) and could careless about SQ. I just hope that if I buy and install a set of high output (SPL) type subs that I don't dislike the sound they produce. I am willing to give up some SQ for volume.

Going back a few years I replaced a JL sub with an Alpine Type R. Hated the sound of the Type R, didnt seem to be faithfully reproducing the music, so I removed them. that was in a vehicle tho.
Again, as explained before, to get an output increase from the same size woofer you will give up bandwidth and linearity (smoothness). Higher 'Q'. Higher Fs. Higher sensitivity. Peaky response. Simply put...more peak output over a narrower bandwidth. Not more average output.
Or, a woofer can be designed to handle more power. Multiple spiders=more moving mass=less agility. Larger gauge voice coil windings for greater thermal capacity=more voice coil winding layers to equal the same resistance=greater voice coil inductance=less midbass responsiveness and less articulation.
A woofer is a tuned circuit. Mass=inductance. Compliance=capacitance. Etc. It's mathematical. You can move all the numbers around with the same size of woofer but you can't get more of something without sacrificing something else. Just like a sub enclosure. Make it smaller and it will provide more of a midbass peak and more output over a narrower bandwidth at the cost of low bass extension.
Listen to all the YouTube videos of all the SPL woofers that sound like a compressor with a broken gasket or a flap disc hooked up to a weedwacker. One note wonders with tons of distortion.
If you want more output then increase the woofer size in a larger enclosure with a larger amplifier. Everything else is a trade-off.

David
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  #23  
Old 09-13-2013, 06:49 PM
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The unfortuate thing is that dont have enough space to put 12's in the place where 10's are. I do have a pair of "boat shakers" (13W6's on HD1200 amps) in the rear lockers so they do provide some low bass.

I would like to get more out of the direct radiating space I have. Bottom line is I need to hear these SPL subs to see if they are right for me. That would mean buying them and taking my chances.

Last edited by craig3972; 09-18-2013 at 04:38 PM.
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  #24  
Old 09-13-2013, 08:45 PM
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craig,
A SPL woofer uses a paper cone for a reason....the same reason a guitar amplifier uses paper.... lighter and therefore more sensitive. You will certainly get more peak output from a paper SPL woofer if that is the over-riding priority. There is no risk in that. You just have to reconcile the pros and cons.

David
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  #25  
Old 09-15-2013, 01:02 AM
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Does this mean that the plastic injection molded cones on the JL's are less than desirable when it comes to output and SQ?
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Old 09-15-2013, 10:25 AM
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Does this mean that the plastic injection molded cones on the JL's are less than desirable when it comes to output and SQ?
Oh, heck no. The JL Audio woofer is far and away superior in SQ. Now a JL Audio automotive speaker will have a bit more output than the marine speaker. Only the marine speaker is suitable for off-shore usage.
Paper is just typically lighter, cheaper and an off-the-shelf China part. Cheap/China is a major part of the Sundown equation. Paper is also more prone to cone break-up modes, in other words, distortion. For an idea of what 'break-up modes' are, read this blog and view the corresponding graphic.
http://earmarkcaraudio.blogspot.com/...&max-results=7
A paper cone will also absorb moisture in a boat and that will change the weight of the cone and therefore the Thiele/Small parameters, so over time, it is a crap shoot as to what you have.

Think of a speaker as something similar to a guitar string. Make the string thinner, lighter and stretch it tighter...and the resonance goes higher. Make the string thicker, heavier and make it more compliant...and the tone goes lower. It's a tuned circuit. And all the parts (cone, spider, magnet and voice coil) of a speaker are a tuned circuit. An SQ circuit is a balanced circuit that provides more output over a broader bandwidth with less deviation and less distortion. An SPL circuit is an unbalanced circuit that is erratic in its response and compromises all the other performance attributes for a more singular pursuit.

Now set your priorities and your compromises and pick one woofer. You can't have it all in one speaker. PERIOD!

David
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