bama to Spy on Citizens' Bank Accounts

[GoneBoatN]

Originally Posted by captain planet

"Those who would give up Essential Liberty to purchase a little Temporary Safety, deserve neither Liberty nor Safety." - Thomas Jefferson

Originally Posted by captain planet

My pleasure.

Americans need to pick up The Constitution once and a while and read it.

Thomas Jefferson lived from 1743 to 1826. It's sort of like saying we should still keep defending ourselves with the musket. Unfortunately we live in the day and age where people for enough money can get access to stuff they should not. Just one more tool for defense against the seriously bad people. People want total freedom and then something like 9/11 (pick the event to your liking) happens and then they cry that enough was not done to stop it. How exactly to you find the bad people if you don't go looking? It's not like they have a sign tattooed to their forehead.

Oh, by the way, I have read the constitution, thank you very much/

[thatsmrmastercraft]

Originally Posted by GoneBoatN

Thomas Jefferson lived from 1743 to 1826. It's sort of like saying we should still keep defending ourselves with the musket. Unfortunately we live in the day and age where people for enough money can get access to stuff they should not. Just one more tool for defense against the seriously bad people. People want total freedom and then something like 9/11 (pick the event to your liking) happens and then they cry that enough was not done to stop it. How exactly to you find the bad people if you don't go looking? It's not like they have a sign tattooed to their forehead.

Oh, by the way, I have read the constitution, thank you very much/

Perhaps you missed this part from the article:

"He said one of the problems with the plan is that there is “wiggle room” on how the information will be used. In the past, the National CounterTerrorism Center, which is supposed to ensure that critical threat information is shared among various agencies, was obliged to “promptly identify and purge any innocent U.S. person information.”

But the guidelines were subsequently loosened so that “not only can they keep the data for a number of years, but they can continue to use it,” German said."


I don't think anyone suggests that we don't look for the bad guys, but this isn't supposed to be an open invitation to compile bank records of people who fall into the "innocent" category, as suggested by the article.

[GoneBoatN]

Originally Posted by thatsmrmastercraft

Perhaps you missed this part from the article:

"He said one of the problems with the plan is that there is “wiggle room” on how the information will be used. In the past, the National CounterTerrorism Center, which is supposed to ensure that critical threat information is shared among various agencies, was obliged to “promptly identify and purge any innocent U.S. person information.”

But the guidelines were subsequently loosened so that “not only can they keep the data for a number of years, but they can continue to use it,” German said."


I don't think anyone suggests that we don't look for the bad guys, but this isn't supposed to be an open invitation to compile bank records of people who fall into the "innocent" category, as suggested by the article.

One of the problems with analyzing data is knowing exactly what you are looking for at the time you are looking at the data. So there is a need to keep it. Seems to me terrorism is typically long planned out. Terrorist operate over a long period of time. It would be necessary to keep the information for a long period of time to be useful.

The point becomes that the information is used only for the intent that it was obtain and that it does not become public. IMO someone stating "wiggle room" (surely the document does not use these terms) is using FUD (Fear, Uncertainty and Doubt) to incite people rather than state facts. I myself would want to know the details before passing judgement on it. I myself believe that to this day the CIA and others are a necessary evil.

But, yes I did skip over that part while reading/skimming the article.

[mikeg205]

Ah this is a slippery slope... unfortunately our leaders continue down a path once a gate is open.....

[JimN]

Originally Posted by captain planet

"Those who would give up Essential Liberty to purchase a little Temporary Safety, deserve neither Liberty nor Safety." - Thomas Jefferson

So, no thoughts of your own?

[JimN]

I never wanted to live in another country until recently. The problem is, "Which one?".

It's too bad- two of my ancestors came here from England in 1654.

[thatsmrmastercraft]

Originally Posted by GoneBoatN

One of the problems with analyzing data is knowing exactly what you are looking for at the time you are looking at the data. So there is a need to keep it. Seems to me terrorism is typically long planned out. Terrorist operate over a long period of time. It would be necessary to keep the information for a long period of time to be useful.

The point becomes that the information is used only for the intent that it was obtain and that it does not become public. IMO someone stating "wiggle room" (surely the document does not use these terms) is using FUD (Fear, Uncertainty and Doubt) to incite people rather than state facts. I myself would want to know the details before passing judgement on it. I myself believe that to this day the CIA and others are a necessary evil.

But, yes I did skip over that part while reading/skimming the article.

No argument on this.

[GoneBoatN]

Originally Posted by JimN

I never wanted to live in another country until recently. The problem is, "Which one?".

It's too bad- two of my ancestors came here from England in 1654.

Too bad Canada is so cold and taxes (based only upon hearsay) are so high. Maybe global warming will make it more appealing. It would be interesting to hear some other country complaining about all the illegal aliens from the US.

[thatsmrmastercraft]

Originally Posted by GoneBoatN

Too bad Canada is so cold and taxes (based only upon hearsay) are so high. Maybe global warming will make it more appealing. It would be interesting to hear some other country complaining about all the illegal aliens from the US.

Great point. Might have to wait a while to find any.

[JimN]

Originally Posted by GoneBoatN

Too bad Canada is so cold and taxes (based only upon hearsay) are so high. Maybe global warming will make it more appealing. It would be interesting to hear some other country complaining about all the illegal aliens from the US.

I'm sick of the cold and Milwaukee's crappy roads, etc. Beats the crap out of cars and trucks, yet they just passed legislation that makes it impossible to sue the city for damages caused by potholes. I'm waiting for someone to hit a major hole, go out of control and kill someone. The shytestorm will be impressive- I'm sure it will be noticed outside of our city.