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  #41  
Old 11-11-2012, 09:31 AM
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Originally Posted by GoneBoatN View Post
Funny thing is I notice my mastercraft manual (2010) says to change the impeller every 100hrs while the Indmar manual says to inspect every 100hrs and change every 2 years.
Have you ever seen an "Indmar dealer"? No, you see MasterCraft, Malibu, Supra/Moomba, Nautique and other names on the dealership. The boat may use Indmar drives but the manufacturer usually does the service training and is the first line when it comes to warranty coverage. By stating that replacement should be at 100 hours, MC is saying that it's better to be careful than lucky. Also, WRT boat owners who want to do their own service- how were they trained? The vast majority have no idea how their engine and its control system work, yet they steam ahead and do things to a boat that costs a whole lot more than their car(s). Do they know what to look for when inspecting an impeller? If they think having all of the vanes is the extent of this, they're asking for trouble. If they overheated, did they stop the repair at replacing the impeller and gasket (the gasket WAS changed, right?) or did they also inspect the whole exhaust system? If the engine overheated, there's a good chance that nothing was going through the rest of the engine or exhaust.

Last edited by JimN; 11-11-2012 at 09:35 AM.
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  #42  
Old 11-11-2012, 03:24 PM
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Originally Posted by JimN View Post
Have you ever seen an "Indmar dealer"? No, you see MasterCraft, Malibu, Supra/Moomba, Nautique and other names on the dealership. The boat may use Indmar drives but the manufacturer usually does the service training and is the first line when it comes to warranty coverage. By stating that replacement should be at 100 hours, MC is saying that it's better to be careful than lucky. Also, WRT boat owners who want to do their own service- how were they trained? The vast majority have no idea how their engine and its control system work, yet they steam ahead and do things to a boat that costs a whole lot more than their car(s). Do they know what to look for when inspecting an impeller? If they think having all of the vanes is the extent of this, they're asking for trouble. If they overheated, did they stop the repair at replacing the impeller and gasket (the gasket WAS changed, right?) or did they also inspect the whole exhaust system? If the engine overheated, there's a good chance that nothing was going through the rest of the engine or exhaust.
Well, while I agree about the 100 hr (I personally do so as this is the amount of hours I tend to put on the boat in the course of the season and I put in a new one at the beginning of each season), the dealership affialted to the brand processes the warranty, the engine manufacture provides the warranty for the engine itself, not Mastercraft. Mastercraft may be the first point of contact, MC will be quick to push any engine warranty item to the engine manufacturer - rightfully so. When I had an issue with an oil leak (one of those so small of a leak it was a real PITA), it was Indmar who authorized the warranty work and told the dealer to pull the engine for testing.

IMO: I think most people are capable of inspecting and replacing an impeller, at least those that take the time to research the issue properly. It's almost equivalent to saying people are too stupid to change/inpect the air cleaner on thier automobile. Yes, some will make bad decisions to save a couple of bucks. Others will look at the cost of $35 as a minute expense in the grand scheme of boating. On the other hand if I put 110 hours on an impeller in a season, I would not change it until the beginning of the following season. Paying a trained mechanic's hourly shop rate of $200 to spend the time to change oil or an impeller is silly considering that I enjoy doing it myself.

Also, don't the engine manufacturers conduct the engine service/maintenance training not Mastercraft?
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  #43  
Old 11-11-2012, 04:26 PM
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Originally Posted by GoneBoatN View Post
Well, while I agree about the 100 hr (I personally do so as this is the amount of hours I tend to put on the boat in the course of the season and I put in a new one at the beginning of each season), the dealership affialted to the brand processes the warranty, the engine manufacture provides the warranty for the engine itself, not Mastercraft. Mastercraft may be the first point of contact, MC will be quick to push any engine warranty item to the engine manufacturer - rightfully so. When I had an issue with an oil leak (one of those so small of a leak it was a real PITA), it was Indmar who authorized the warranty work and told the dealer to pull the engine for testing.

Yes, some will make bad decisions to save a couple of bucks. Others will look at the cost of $35 as a minute expense in the grand scheme of boating. On the other hand if I put 110 hours on an impeller in a season, I would not change it until the beginning of the following season. Paying a trained mechanic's hourly shop rate of $200 to spend the time to change oil or an impeller is silly considering that I enjoy doing it myself.

Also, don't the engine manufacturers conduct the engine service/maintenance training not Mastercraft?
MC sells the engine as part of the package and is the first line WRT warranty coverage but neither MC nor Indmar pays full shop rate if the techs aren't trained. This is a multi-part way to get the dealers to send the techs for training and, from what I have read here since I arrived, this isn't working.

Who the he!! charges $200/hour? Tell me, so I can get a job there! When I was doing this, shop rates topped out at about $75-$85/hour, although that was in '01. However, there's nothing that would get me to pay $200/hr.

You wrote "IMO: I think most people are capable of inspecting and replacing an impeller, at least those that take the time to research the issue properly. It's almost equivalent to saying people are too stupid to change/inpect the air cleaner on thier automobile."

WRT "at least those that take the time to research the issue properly"- you may be a member of more than one forum or user group- asking a question that's easily found is rampant because people are too lazy to check for themselves. Sometimes, they'll end up at the forum or group because the search engine linked to it but NOT using a search engine is nothing, if not lazy. When trained service techs tell others what they have seen, heard and learned, there's a reason for it- they're trying to keep people from having the problems they had to fix. When someone boasts that they got four years from one impeller, it's piss poor logic to follow that recommendation when many others have posted actual or anecdotal evidence to the contrary.

As far as being too stupid to change/inspect the air filter on their car, look around for cars that have a big exhaust smudge on the rear bumper for your answer. More often, it's people who never learned that these things need to be checked and changed. I went out with someone who saw the check engine light on her dash but ignored it. Her dad or brother would have gladly checked it for her, but she didn't bother to ask what it meant. Book-smart but a biatch on wheels (her- it has nothing to do with cars). No oil pressure- cooked the engine.

MC may still do their own training- last time I talked to the head of service, he said they were doing theirs at the factory instead of Syracuse, IN. Their working arrangement has ended, AFAIK but the training was excellent.

Last edited by JimN; 11-11-2012 at 04:29 PM.
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  #44  
Old 11-11-2012, 05:34 PM
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...Who the he!! charges $200/hour?...
My bad. $109 an hour on my last bill. It said 3.15 hours for the 100 hour service.
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  #45  
Old 11-11-2012, 05:38 PM
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Also, just too hard to tell the difference between a impeller that still has life on it vs one that is nearing it's end of life. On an older boat (I/O but some issue), I had to remove the impeller after only about 10 hours of use. I compared it against my old one and both looked like they had the same amount of "set". Felt like the same amount of flex. Just plain easier to spend the $35.
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  #46  
Old 11-12-2012, 12:14 AM
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$124/hr, couldn't imagine $200!

But techs salaries, training, tools, diagnostic equipment, etc get more expensive every season!

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  #47  
Old 11-12-2012, 12:39 AM
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Originally Posted by erkoehler View Post
$124/hr, couldn't imagine $200!

But techs salaries, training, tools, diagnostic equipment, etc get more expensive every season!

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Just out of curiosity, can you PM me with a general range of pay for marine techs? I'd like to see how that has changed since I did this.
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  #48  
Old 11-12-2012, 01:37 AM
mybobtail mybobtail is offline
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ok thanks for all the feedback. but i just want to clarify a couple things. the boat is 3 hours old and hasnt been sitting i used it the week before.and as to the dry start i dont actaully turn the motor over completley i just turn the key for a bout 2 seconds just to see if there is enough kick . i did it with my X14 for 2 years and had done it with my jetski prior to that.
i have attached a pic of the impeller. Dealer said maybe at the factory they might have done a few dry starts.anyway it has been replaced and all go for poets day .
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  #49  
Old 11-12-2012, 03:13 AM
jwp1504 jwp1504 is offline
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Using Fake-a-lake

Hi Guys,

I have bought myself a 2000 x star and it doesnt have anywhere to hook a garden hose in to the motor, and research tells me that a fake-a-lake is the thing to use. So i went a bought one, hooked it up, turned the hose one, and started the engine.. But no water came out the exhaust..

Was i doing something wrong? Isn't water supposed to come out the exhaust??

I ran the boat for only 1-2 minutes but i know that is more than enough time to ruin an impeller!
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  #50  
Old 11-12-2012, 07:11 AM
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Originally Posted by mybobtail View Post
ok thanks for all the feedback. but i just want to clarify a couple things. the boat is 3 hours old and hasnt been sitting i used it the week before.and as to the dry start i dont actaully turn the motor over completley i just turn the key for a bout 2 seconds just to see if there is enough kick . i did it with my X14 for 2 years and had done it with my jetski prior to that.
i have attached a pic of the impeller. Dealer said maybe at the factory they might have done a few dry starts.anyway it has been replaced and all go for poets day .
A jet ski and a boat with a car engine are two completely different machines and a jet ski doesn't have a rubber impeller- it has a metal one.

If you crank it for two seconds, you aren't doing much to the impeller. If the impeller was destroyed, something else is going on- does the hour meter show 3 hours, or is that how much time YOU put on it? The factory doesn't do many dry starts- it would be absolutely irresponsible for them to do that and leave it to the dealer to handle this kind of abuse. Did you check the oil cooler, yet?
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