Go Back   TeamTalk > General MasterCraft Topics > Tow Vehicles

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #11  
Old 09-26-2011, 07:57 PM
Thrall's Avatar
Thrall Thrall is offline
MC Maniac
 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Boat: '06 X2 MCX
Location: Eagle River, AK!
Posts: 3,807
No lift pump on a DMax unless it's aftermarket.
You probably mean the injection pump (Bosch CP3) which is not cheap. Get a 2nd opinion of they tell you it's the inj pump as the FPR is in line after the pump and typically the only problem with the pump is not enough pressure. Same with injectors. If they tell you it's a bad injector as for a balance rate test on your injectors if they haven't done that then they can't tell if the injectors are bad.
__________________
'06 X2 MCX

"I understand why some people may not want to do this the way I have recommended but I can't understand the death grip some people have on a toilet plunger with a hose fitting." -JimN
Reply With Quote
  #12  
Old 09-26-2011, 09:12 PM
Cloaked Cloaked is offline
MC Maniac
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Boat: MasterCraft
Location: Kingston,TN USA
Posts: 4,602
Quote:
Originally Posted by Thrall View Post
No lift pump on a DMax unless it's aftermarket.
You probably mean the injection pump (Bosch CP3) which is not cheap. Get a 2nd opinion of they tell you it's the inj pump as the FPR is in line after the pump and typically the only problem with the pump is not enough pressure. Same with injectors. If they tell you it's a bad injector as for a balance rate test on your injectors if they haven't done that then they can't tell if the injectors are bad.
Kennedy Diesel for a nice lift pump setup. They are worth the investment.
__________________
93 190
.
Don't be a boot licker
.

Hose picture (internal) http://www.mastercraft.com/teamtalk/...68&postcount=8



Quote:
Originally Posted by Thrall View Post
..Some of you give a whole new meaning to the phrase "another @sshole with a Mastercraft."

RE: Thrall, Welcome to the club....
NEW SKINS in TN... Leading Edge Marine Interior

feedback on a TN company: http://www.mastercraft.com/teamtalk/...ad.php?t=58767

.
Reply With Quote
  #13  
Old 09-27-2011, 01:50 AM
Thrall's Avatar
Thrall Thrall is offline
MC Maniac
 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Boat: '06 X2 MCX
Location: Eagle River, AK!
Posts: 3,807
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cloaked View Post
Kennedy Diesel for a nice lift pump setup. They are worth the investment.
I get it for high power applications, but my LB7 never ran out of fuel even on the Edge Juice level 6 (150hp or something).
What I don't understand is why Cummins motors with essentailly the same CP3 feeding similar injectors need a lift pump even in stock configuration and DMaxes don't.
__________________
'06 X2 MCX

"I understand why some people may not want to do this the way I have recommended but I can't understand the death grip some people have on a toilet plunger with a hose fitting." -JimN
Reply With Quote
  #14  
Old 09-27-2011, 07:17 AM
timvan's Avatar
timvan timvan is offline
TT Enthusiast
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
Boat: none
Location: Allatoona, Ga
Posts: 430
Quote:
Originally Posted by Thrall View Post
I get it for high power applications, but my LB7 never ran out of fuel even on the Edge Juice level 6 (150hp or something).
What I don't understand is why Cummins motors with essentailly the same CP3 feeding similar injectors need a lift pump even in stock configuration and DMaxes don't.
The cummings would run without a lift pump as well. You can add a lift pump to your dmax, I put a tts unit in mine and its a major difference. It will also prevent premature cp3 failure as the fuel is always under pressure waiting..
__________________
2002 Maristar 230 VRS
Reply With Quote
  #15  
Old 09-27-2011, 07:41 AM
tplane2 tplane2 is offline
TT Newbie
 
Join Date: Sep 2011
Boat: None
Location: Southeast
Posts: 16
Quote:
Originally Posted by Thrall View Post
I get it for high power applications, but my LB7 never ran out of fuel even on the Edge Juice level 6 (150hp or something).
What I don't understand is why Cummins motors with essentailly the same CP3 feeding similar injectors need a lift pump even in stock configuration and DMaxes don't.
The Cummins lift pump is inline from the tank to the CP3, just as if you put an aftermarket on a Duramax. But if the Cummins fails, the way the pump is designed causes to much restriction for fuel to flow under throttle, unlike the aftermarket pumps for GMs. So if the pump was completely removed, it would/could run better than if was pump was still inline and bad.
Dodge put it on there for the same reasons we put aftermarkets on ours (cp3 life and performance). Just at a lower gallons per hour rate, less flow.

Quote:
Originally Posted by timvan View Post
The cummings would run without a lift pump as well. You can add a lift pump to your dmax, I put a tts unit in mine and its a major difference. It will also prevent premature cp3 failure as the fuel is always under pressure waiting..
It would run, but as soon as you put throttle in, it would fall on its face.
Reply With Quote
  #16  
Old 09-27-2011, 07:55 AM
jkski jkski is offline
MC Devotee
 
Join Date: Jun 2005
Boat: 2008 40th Anniv. Prostar 197 MCX and Powerslot
Location: Akron, Ohio
Posts: 1,910
Everything on the truck is stock so as you stated, no lift pump....I am learning!
The truck went to the dealership yesterday for a second opinion, so we will see what the verdict turns out to be.
I appreciate the advice and will be sure to ask the questions suggested if need be.
Reply With Quote
  #17  
Old 09-27-2011, 05:10 PM
Thrall's Avatar
Thrall Thrall is offline
MC Maniac
 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Boat: '06 X2 MCX
Location: Eagle River, AK!
Posts: 3,807
Hope you get it sorted out quickly now. I'm not as patient as you and would have someone's @ss by now if my truck sat for a week and the mech didn't know what was wrong with it!

tplane, so you're saying if you eliminated the lift pump completely on a Dodge it would or wouldn't run well?
Not discounting what anyone is saying and I know lots of poeple put lift pumps on DMaxes and lots go to aftermarket LP's on Cummins', but if there's a million Dmaxes running around with the same inj pump pushing the same Bosch CR injectors (2 more in fact not that it really matters), at the same rail pressures and they run fine for lots of miles, then why would Dodge put a LP behind their CP3 on the Cummins? Seems counter intuititve.

I had a Dmax, got rid of it when it was still a baby at 100k mi, but ahve seen ALOT of them running around with 200-250k mi on the orig CP3.
Now got a Dodge 5.9 CRD with a LP. Is it really going to make the CP3 last longer? Even if the LP doesn't take a crap and starve the CP3, killing it?
__________________
'06 X2 MCX

"I understand why some people may not want to do this the way I have recommended but I can't understand the death grip some people have on a toilet plunger with a hose fitting." -JimN
Reply With Quote
  #18  
Old 10-06-2011, 09:05 AM
jkski jkski is offline
MC Devotee
 
Join Date: Jun 2005
Boat: 2008 40th Anniv. Prostar 197 MCX and Powerslot
Location: Akron, Ohio
Posts: 1,910
OK guys, here is a new one for you. I finally got the FPR replaced (by the dealer) and picked the truck up yesterday. As soon as I started it, I knew it was not right as I could still hear some of cackling noise although the fuel pressure, temp and oil pressure were all good. Talked to the tech before I even drove it away and he said to drive it and see.....never a good sign I know.
So, I proceeded to drive it 20 minutes to pick-up my boat and by the time I got there, the cackling had increased and the truck was idiling very rough, but the power was good as it was before I ever had the issue. So, I hooked onto the boat and drove about 2 minutes down the road and the truck fell flat on it's face, acting just like it did prior to the FPR being replaced. The cackling was back in full force and there was very limited power....barely pulled the 197 back to the garage.
So, it's back at the shop but does anyone have any thoughts? I have already posted this on the duramax site and dieselplace but truthfully you guys are better at responding.
The most troubling part about this is that when I picked it up, other than the reduced cackling noise (which a Duramax does not normally have), the truck ran fine, so it leaves me to wonder if there isn't something damaged internally? Could it be something as simple as an injector gone bad or maybe the transfer pump?
Thanks in advance.
Reply With Quote
  #19  
Old 10-06-2011, 11:54 AM
jkski jkski is offline
MC Devotee
 
Join Date: Jun 2005
Boat: 2008 40th Anniv. Prostar 197 MCX and Powerslot
Location: Akron, Ohio
Posts: 1,910
New update on the saga:
Mechanic/Tech just called and said that injector #5 is bad and staying open, so the good news is that this would explain why is was running badly even after having replaced the FPR, the bad news is that he stated that if 1 injector goes bad then others generally follow suit. So, my questions now are:
1) Could a bad injector cause the knocking/cackling noise I was hearing?
2) How likely is it that other injectors will soon follow in failure?

Thanks in advance.
Reply With Quote
  #20  
Old 10-06-2011, 05:27 PM
tplane2 tplane2 is offline
TT Newbie
 
Join Date: Sep 2011
Boat: None
Location: Southeast
Posts: 16
Quote:
Originally Posted by Thrall View Post
Hope you get it sorted out quickly now. I'm not as patient as you and would have someone's @ss by now if my truck sat for a week and the mech didn't know what was wrong with it!

tplane, so you're saying if you eliminated the lift pump completely on a Dodge it would or wouldn't run well?
Not discounting what anyone is saying and I know lots of poeple put lift pumps on DMaxes and lots go to aftermarket LP's on Cummins', but if there's a million Dmaxes running around with the same inj pump pushing the same Bosch CR injectors (2 more in fact not that it really matters), at the same rail pressures and they run fine for lots of miles, then why would Dodge put a LP behind their CP3 on the Cummins? Seems counter intuititve.

I had a Dmax, got rid of it when it was still a baby at 100k mi, but ahve seen ALOT of them running around with 200-250k mi on the orig CP3.
Now got a Dodge 5.9 CRD with a LP. Is it really going to make the CP3 last longer? Even if the LP doesn't take a crap and starve the CP3, killing it?
From what I've been told: Yes, it would run the same as a Duramax. IIRC Dodge put them on the for longevity and ease of prime.
You are correct there are tons of Dodges with lots of miles, but how old are they really compared to Duramaxes. Are you thinking P-Pumps or the VP44 (?) from the CRD 03-07. The stock cp3 on a duramax lasts about 200-250k. Thats without any fuel demanding performance upgrade added. IMO thats not very long.

Quote:
Originally Posted by jkski View Post
New update on the saga:
Mechanic/Tech just called and said that injector #5 is bad and staying open, so the good news is that this would explain why is was running badly even after having replaced the FPR, the bad news is that he stated that if 1 injector goes bad then others generally follow suit. So, my questions now are:
1) Could a bad injector cause the knocking/cackling noise I was hearing?
2) How likely is it that other injectors will soon follow in failure?

Thanks in advance.
1) Possibly
2) Probably sooner than later. The fuel systems on diesels are pretty delicate as far as malfunction due to contamination. Usually if one injector has prematurely failed it was due to fuel. Thats why most people replace all injectors if one goes down. If you keep clean/waterfree fuel you can run a while on the stock fuel system. But like Thrall said, it all depends on the balance rates of the injectors. So go check and make sure they are +/- 4 at park, and +/- 6 in drive at idle, motor warmed up.
Also...It sounds like the technician who is working on your truck doesn't know what he is doing.
Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 02:33 PM.