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  #11  
Old 09-01-2013, 11:07 AM
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JimN JimN is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mark rsa2au View Post
I am now over this POS!

Today ran the boat on the lake, Fathers day over here and a very nice spring day to get out on the water.

Last few weeks checked everything I can think of. Fuel pressure ( on trailer 30psi and on lake full throttle approx 30 PSI across the range). Timing at 10 degrees as per manual. All sensors checked or replaced. Plugs, leads, distributer and rotor replaced. Battery cables and connections replaced, earth connections cleaned and checked.
Boat starts first time every time. Dash guage shows temp slowly warming up to 160 and stays there give or take slight movement. Then the engine check light comes on so I disconnect the switch ( note this is just the on off switch- set to 180F- to the check engine light not the temp sensor).

Boat is now running rich again... on occasion have black smoke (replaced everything related so far except ECU), and will still not run above 4500rpm with out spluttering and poping or misfiring. Below this it pulls like a freight train.

Then the water intake hose splits at shower connection, and we almost sink...water over the floor boards. Lucky we now always cary tools on the Disastercraft, so wrap plastic and race tape (strong Duct tape) arround the pipe and carry on. No apparant dammage to motor dispite not having water. ( did not care anyway I'm so over this thing) Impellar checked and all good.

Guages still work on and off when they feel like it. Oil pressure guage now no longer works after today. Speedo's still slow to react and still leak from below dash (have replaced with new tubes as well).

Used a full tank (32 gallons) in just short of 3 hours measured on Tacho. Mainly water skiing, some wake boarding and a couple of tube rides. Boat cannot get to barefooting speed so we cannot foot behind it.

Finally the check engine light came on at the end of the day and stayed on, we were worried it would not restart so we left the engine running untill we put it on the trailer. Now parked on the verge as I could not be bothered to park it in the garage. No I have not checked the code yet..

The Disastercraft is THE most unreliable boat I have ever owned ( 5th boat). I have never had to work so hard to get a boat to run properly especialy one with just 270 hours on it.

Of course the Malibu in the team keeps purring along perfectly as it has done for the last 5 seasons, and the Australian made Sleekline (also 350 chev motor) still runs like a Swis Watch after 20 years. We can no longer ski our favorite spots because the family are scared the Disastercraft will break down and not get us back.

Does anyone have any ideas on what to check/replace next? Or we will have to trade it before summer.
If you aren't the original owner, it's very possible that something happened before, that's causing your problems. MC used the same engines as Malibu/PCM/Mercruiser/Volvo-Penta and any other brand with a Chevy and Indmar supplied then to MC and Malibu, so it's not an inherent problem with that. The speedo(s) leaking is usually caused by not purging the water out of the tubes at the end of the season and if the temperature drops below freezing, the water damages the diaphragm in the control box for the gauges. Once the water gets in, the electronics fail- this gauge package is common and these problems occur with all of the brands using it, but we don't see the incidents because most of us aren't exposed to them. A hose splitting is odd, but if the oil cooler (IIRC, it's after the raw water pump on your boat) is clogged, it could cause this.

The temperature sender for the gauge has nothing to do with what the ECM sees, or the check engine light. The coolant temperature sender with yellow/black wires is the one you need to check and I suspect this sender is behind the black smoke/rich/check engine light.

I don't remember if we discussed checking for codes, but that's the first thing needed now.
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  #12  
Old 09-01-2013, 01:12 PM
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Rossterman Rossterman is offline
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Boat: 2001 prostar 205V
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Check engine to find the code using the paperclip method. As to what can illuminate the CEL, there are several items. One (i recently dealt with) was caused by a faulty high temp sensor. As was stated, this is different than the temp sender the ecu reads to determine if engine is hot or cold. If that sensor is reading cold when engine is warmed up, it will run too rich but i believe this feeds the dash guage too so probably is OK. . Knock sensor could be retarding timing if bad as well. You can buy one of those adhesive timing tapes from a speed shop that you put on the harmonic damper and check with a timing light if advance is working for ~ $10 if you want to 100% rule this out.

Sorry to hear you are having so many problems. Usually these boats are pretty trouble free ( provided they recieve the proper maintenance) but sometimes a boat just turns out to be a turd no matter how well maintained. No different than buying a car and getting a lemon.

One point in you note still puzzles me- why the PO was adjusting the fuel pressure regulator? These boats are FI so could be that the injectors are leaking by which can cause a rich idle if the temp sensor turns out to be OK. You may want to look in the throttle bore while at idle and at speed to see if they are both working correctly as well. These were used on tons of early chevys so you can look for ideas on the web there to get ideas. I remember one post where the injector was cutting out at high rpm due to loose wiring connection.

Good luck with your investigation and let us know what you find
Ross

Last edited by Rossterman; 09-01-2013 at 01:24 PM.
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  #13  
Old 09-01-2013, 08:23 PM
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Mark rsa2au Mark rsa2au is offline
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Boat: Mastercraft X5 2001. 310hp preditor
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Thanks JimN and Rossterman, sorry about the rant but I am so frustrated at the amount of time and money I am throwing at this boat. I do appreciate your replys!!

While the motor is a generic block, it is the Mastercraft specification / indmar electronics that seem to be causing the issues. I know these motors should be reliable which is why I bought one.

The Temp sender unit was replaced with a generic unit that was close to origional but not exact, so I replaced with an Indmar version. Boat does same with either Temp sender unit.

Melbourne does not get below freezing so I am not sure if the diaphram at fault. Started boat this morning on the verge and Oil guage is working again......? Might have to order a new MDC and guage pack.

Hose split at shower connection, plastic connection failed. Trans oil cooler checked and cleaned before it was put into the water.

We had an over fueling issue and the PO decided to take 3 turnes out of the fuel pressure regulater to try to reduce the overfueling. Now back to Standard

Checked code this morning = 44: (seen this one before and replaced MAF sensor)
Did not know if this motor has an O2 sensor.. Maf Sensor is new. Fuel Injectors are new, Fuel Pressure is 30psi across the range (approx at 4500rpm as it was hard to hold on at WOT and the motor popping and stuttering). Have run several tanks of fresh fuel, drained and cleaned fuel tank and replaced fuel filters, and cleaned fuel pump wire mesh. Cant understand Lean condition with black smoke out the back that smells like fuel.
Maybe the fuel pump is failing and is intermittant causing lean conditions then over fueling?
CODE 44
Trouble Code 44 indicates that the O2 sensor is showing a persistently high exhaust oxygen content (lean), despite the efforts of the ECM to increase injector on-time (thus increasing fuel delivered). Integrator and BLM numbers may indicate > 128 by a substantial margin.
The conditions for setting this code are:
no Code 33 or Code 34 (MAF Error) present, and
the O2 sensor voltage remains below 250 mVolts, and
the ECM is in Closed Loop control, and
the above conditions exist for more than 50 seconds.
Typical causes for this code include:
1) O2 sensor defective or lead shorted
2) Lean injectors (dirty or blocked)
3) Water in fuel
4) Exhaust leaks upstream of O2 sensor
5) Fuel pressure or volume too low
6) MAF sensor reading lower airflow than is actually present


Appreciate any ideas? Just not the one that suggests I take it into the MC Stealership....
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  #14  
Old 09-02-2013, 03:46 AM
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Rossterman Rossterman is offline
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You sure you have a tbi predator? These don't have a maf sensor, rather use a map sensor for measuring manifold pressure. If tbi you will have a small round flame arrestor sitting where a carb would normally sit. If it has a big aluminum plenum and a throttle body pointing down at the front (or back depending if dd or vd), then it's a 330hp ltr with injector for each cylinder. Take a pic and we can confirm.

There is no 02 sensor so wierd that the code is saying that.

Just Checked online and code 44 is for a bad knock sensor not o2 sensor. If bad, it will reduce the timing and power...

Here's a post including info on the fact it can be bought at a auto parts store since isn't a marine specific part:

http://www.mastercraft.com/teamtalk/...ad.php?t=41782

Last edited by Rossterman; 09-02-2013 at 01:15 PM.
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  #15  
Old 09-02-2013, 05:18 AM
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Mark rsa2au Mark rsa2au is offline
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Boat: Mastercraft X5 2001. 310hp preditor
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Hey Rossterman, Thanks.

Is is a 310hp TBI Preditor motor with the 2 injectors on the top of the throttle body. Yep sorry MAP sensor that attaches to the throttle body. It was replaced like for like.

I will investigate the knock sensor!
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  #16  
Old 09-02-2013, 05:28 AM
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Rossterman Rossterman is offline
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Here's the indmar MEFI book showing codes, how to check all sensors, etc

[PDF]Indmar Diagnostic Manual - Bakes Online
http://www.bakesonline.com/images/Me...EFI4manual.pdf
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  #17  
Old 09-02-2013, 05:34 AM
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Rossterman Rossterman is offline
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Saw one of your earlier post and how much crap was in the pump and filter. If stuff got past the filter and into the pump, it's through the whole system. You could have junk in the injectors causing them to leak by at idle and be flow restricted at speed. They are very intolerant of any debris.
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  #18  
Old 09-02-2013, 06:21 AM
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Mark rsa2au Mark rsa2au is offline
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Boat: Mastercraft X5 2001. 310hp preditor
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rossterman View Post
Saw one of your earlier post and how much crap was in the pump and filter. If stuff got past the filter and into the pump, it's through the whole system. You could have junk in the injectors causing them to leak by at idle and be flow restricted at speed. They are very intolerant of any debris.
That fuel filter was shot!!! I have flushed the fuel lines and replaced the injectors with new ones. No harm pulling it out and cleaning again. The injectors dont leak/drip at idle or when shut down, and the spray pattern looks nice and even to the naked eye...?

and thanks for the diagnostic manual, some bedtime reading...
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  #19  
Old 09-02-2013, 06:47 AM
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petermegan petermegan is offline
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Boat: 2000 Matercraft Prostar 190, LTR330,powerslot,PP,heater
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Man o man, you are having some problems. No help from me, but I did say just bring the slab not the boat for my Lake opening I am sure you will get this sorted. I have a spare brain box for your gauges if you want a loan?? Just let me know and can pop in the mail. Have Fun...
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  #20  
Old 09-02-2013, 09:54 AM
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JimN JimN is offline
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Join Date: Jul 2004
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rossterman View Post
Check engine to find the code using the paperclip method. As to what can illuminate the CEL, there are several items. One (i recently dealt with) was caused by a faulty high temp sensor. As was stated, this is different than the temp sender the ecu reads to determine if engine is hot or cold. If that sensor is reading cold when engine is warmed up, it will run too rich but i believe this feeds the dash guage too so probably is OK. . Knock sensor could be retarding timing if bad as well. You can buy one of those adhesive timing tapes from a speed shop that you put on the harmonic damper and check with a timing light if advance is working for ~ $10 if you want to 100% rule this out.

Sorry to hear you are having so many problems. Usually these boats are pretty trouble free ( provided they recieve the proper maintenance) but sometimes a boat just turns out to be a turd no matter how well maintained. No different than buying a car and getting a lemon.

One point in you note still puzzles me- why the PO was adjusting the fuel pressure regulator? These boats are FI so could be that the injectors are leaking by which can cause a rich idle if the temp sensor turns out to be OK. You may want to look in the throttle bore while at idle and at speed to see if they are both working correctly as well. These were used on tons of early chevys so you can look for ideas on the web there to get ideas. I remember one post where the injector was cutting out at high rpm due to loose wiring connection.

Good luck with your investigation and let us know what you find
Ross
The ECT (Engine Temperature Sender) with two wires ONLY sends signal to the ECM, not the gauge and your comment contradicts itself.
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