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-   -   Ford's Cash Cow (http://www.mastercraft.com/teamtalk/showthread.php?t=53870)

GoneBoatN 04-24-2013 09:43 PM

Ford's Cash Cow
 
Holly carp -

http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2013-0...r-detroit.html
Ford Motor Co. (F)s F-Series pickup accounts for 90 percent of its global auto profits, while GMs pickups and sport-utility vehicle derivatives generate two-thirds of worldwide earnings, Jonas said. The Detroit automakers control 93 percent of the U.S. pickup market, their last bastion of dominance.
talking about all your nuggets in one basket...

thatsmrmastercraft 04-24-2013 10:21 PM

Well, the F series trucks have been the best selling truck on the U.S. for the last 37 years...........

mustangtexas 04-25-2013 12:05 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by thatsmrmastercraft (Post 928935)
Well, the F series trucks have been the best selling truck on the U.S. for the last 37 years...........

Only because GMC and Chevy are not combined under GM. Combined they kill the F-series.

Kyle 04-25-2013 12:19 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mustangtexas (Post 928957)
Only because GMC and Chevy are not combined under GM. Combined they kill the F-series.

Maybe do but ford is by far a superior truck.

I have had 4 Chevys 1/2 tons and 1 f150. I absolutely love my f150 KR. Pulls better and rides nicer.


Ford also didn't have the bail out. If I went out of business Obama wouldn't help me and I understand it keeps people at work but it really burns me up that someone got a second chance to mess up their finances again. I have a hard time with that. But ford flat out hauls better.

MC25 04-25-2013 12:30 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mustangtexas (Post 928957)
Only because GMC and Chevy are not combined under GM. Combined they kill the F-series.

No, dont think so. show me the numbers, or better yet, ill show you.

http://news.pickuptrucks.com/2012/12...uck-sales.html

http://news.pickuptrucks.com/2012/10...uck-sales.html

http://news.pickuptrucks.com/2012/09...uck-sales.html

http://news.pickuptrucks.com/2012/07...uck-sales.html

http://www.f150forum.com/f38/2012-u-...-sales-198271/


2 trucks cant even outsell one.. so sad. ill take my f150 all day over any GM truck.

mustangtexas 04-25-2013 01:17 AM

I should have been more specific I guess. I have a dog on both sides of the fight as a VP under a dealership group that includes both Chevy and Ford. I was referring to the statement of 37 years not last year. I took a risk jumping into the most heated argument of all time. I should have kept my fingers in my pockets.

bbymgr 04-25-2013 01:32 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kyle (Post 928958)
Maybe do but ford is by far a superior truck.

I have had 4 Chevys 1/2 tons and 1 f150. I absolutely love my f150 KR. Pulls better and rides nicer.


Ford also didn't have the bail out. If I went out of business Obama wouldn't help me and I understand it keeps people at work but it really burns me up that someone got a second chance to mess up their finances again. I have a hard time with that. But ford flat out hauls better.

You're right....they didn't officially get any "bail out" money, but they sure did take out a whole bunch of low interest Government loans at a very opportunistic time. They also received some timely Government help in the 80's with the transmission "recall" that didn't end up being a recall. The Big 3 have all gotten plenty of Government "bail outs" over the years.

http://www.forbes.com/sites/joannmul...ut-commercial/

coz 04-25-2013 09:05 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Aric'sX15 (Post 928960)
ill take my f150 all day over any GM truck.

Me too, and that goes for my Expedition over any Tahoe or Suburban as well :D

zsqure 04-25-2013 09:31 AM

The government will bail out any large group when it comes to an election......
And after owning Chevy, Ford, and Dodge, in a family construction business and actually working the trucks, the ford has been the most dependable pickup we have had. Period.

h2oskifreak 04-25-2013 11:24 AM

I do think that Ford is a good truck, but my ski buddy just spent 6K in repairs to his diesel Ford and it was all caused by a high pressure oil pump and ended w/ injectors. Ouch. I was shocked it was that much with out a serious engine failure. 90K miles BTW. Seems like a diesel should go a lot more miles than that before 6K in repairs?

zsqure 04-25-2013 11:59 AM

H2o, my '02 and '04 Chevy diesels had new injectors and injector pumps at 60k and 120k. Both $6000 bills covered under warranty. Big bills for big toys.

captain planet 04-25-2013 12:17 PM

I'll jump into this and add what I know. My buddies that are in the marine industry who do a lot of towing all agree that GM is preferred without hesitation. For construction vehicles that don't do a lot of towing the F-250 and up has the edge over GM.

Funny that Dodge isn't in the conversation. Too bad they can keep a tranny together behind that Cummins in their trucks.

As for the overall premise of this thread, something seems skewed. The Focus is the #1 selling car in the world. Ford sold over 1 million units last year across the globe. That has to account for something.

Traxx822 04-25-2013 12:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by captain planet (Post 929062)
I'll jump into this and add what I know. My buddies that are in the marine industry who do a lot of towing all agree that GM is preferred without hesitation. For construction vehicles that don't do a lot of towing the F-250 and up has the edge over GM.

Funny that Dodge isn't in the conversation. Too bad they can keep a tranny together behind that Cummins in their trucks.

As for the overall premise of this thread, something seems skewed. The Focus is the #1 selling car in the world. Ford sold over 1 million units last year across the globe. That has to account for something.

I love all the complaining about Ford and GM. When in reality most are drooling over GM equipped boats, they want or already own.

500

Retoxtony 04-25-2013 01:05 PM

I work as a gasfield operator so me and my coworkers put alot of hard miles on our trucks. Right now there are 3 of us running new Fords. All of us are extremely unhappy with them. Lots of time in the shop, and lots of fighting to get warranty work done. I`ve actually gone back to using my 91 GMC 2500 for a work truck because i have less downtime with it. I find it sad that my old girl with 319,193 KM on it is more reliable than my new truck. I still use my Ford to get to work and back but i don`t trust it as a field truck.

gweaver 04-25-2013 01:13 PM

I don't know much about brand quality for any of the Big 3, but I'd assume that for the most part, they're all about the same. I think for me, if considering the purchase of a new vehicle, I'd have to go with which one moves me. I like the body styles of the Ford and Chevy truck, but I think the Dodge is the only one that offers a crew cab and a full size bed in the 1/2 ton. That 5-5 1/2 foot bed on the other two is a deal breaker for me. Just not enough room for hauling. That, and the apparent decision of Dodge to make the 1500 available with a diesel V6...drool!!!
Does anyone know why you can't get a 1/2 ton with crew cab + 6 1/2' bed? What's so special about that combo that it's only available in 3/4 ton or 1 ton?
G

captain planet 04-25-2013 01:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by gweaver (Post 929081)
I don't know much about brand quality for any of the Big 3, but I'd assume that for the most part, they're all about the same. I think for me, if considering the purchase of a new vehicle, I'd have to go with which one moves me. I like the body styles of the Ford and Chevy truck, but I think the Dodge is the only one that offers a crew cab and a full size bed in the 1/2 ton. That 5-5 1/2 foot bed on the other two is a deal breaker for me. Just not enough room for hauling. That, and the apparent decision of Dodge to make the 1500 available with a diesel V6...drool!!!
Does anyone know why you can't get a 1/2 ton with crew cab + 6 1/2' bed? What's so special about that combo that it's only available in 3/4 ton or 1 ton?
G

I guess that they assume if you are buying a Ford or GM you are actually going to use the bed of the truck and not just pose with it?! :D

aquaman 04-25-2013 01:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by captain planet (Post 929062)
I'll jump into this and add what I know. My buddies that are in the marine industry who do a lot of towing all agree that GM is preferred without hesitation. For construction vehicles that don't do a lot of towing the F-250 and up has the edge over GM.

Funny that Dodge isn't in the conversation. Too bad they can keep a tranny together behind that Cummins in their trucks.

As for the overall premise of this thread, something seems skewed. The Focus is the #1 selling car in the world. Ford sold over 1 million units last year across the globe. That has to account for something.

Good point.

Ford has some very innovative models this year ......besides the F150.
Ford is not a "1" car company.

Traxx822 04-25-2013 01:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by gweaver (Post 929081)
I don't know much about brand quality for any of the Big 3, but I'd assume that for the most part, they're all about the same. I think for me, if considering the purchase of a new vehicle, I'd have to go with which one moves me. I like the body styles of the Ford and Chevy truck, but I think the Dodge is the only one that offers a crew cab and a full size bed in the 1/2 ton. That 5-5 1/2 foot bed on the other two is a deal breaker for me. Just not enough room for hauling. That, and the apparent decision of Dodge to make the 1500 available with a diesel V6...drool!!!
Does anyone know why you can't get a 1/2 ton with crew cab + 6 1/2' bed? What's so special about that combo that it's only available in 3/4 ton or 1 ton?
G


You can buy a Dodge Crew cab, not the Mega cab with an 8 foot bed in the 1/2 ton and 1 ton and dually. I think it only comes in a lariat trim package though but I could be wrong.

I drove one of those 1 ton duallies for work pulling a lot of concrete equipment. It was an 2008 and had a Jake brake and everything. Cummins Diesel. Thats the only way I would buy a dodge. In that exact set up.

As far as quad cabs and full sized beds. I wasn't aware that wasn't something you couldn't order from GM. I know they did in 2000. But they may have stopped with the offset of the box style around that year with GMC

Retoxtony 04-25-2013 01:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by gweaver (Post 929081)
I don't know much about brand quality for any of the Big 3, but I'd assume that for the most part, they're all about the same. I think for me, if considering the purchase of a new vehicle, I'd have to go with which one moves me. I like the body styles of the Ford and Chevy truck, but I think the Dodge is the only one that offers a crew cab and a full size bed in the 1/2 ton. That 5-5 1/2 foot bed on the other two is a deal breaker for me. Just not enough room for hauling. That, and the apparent decision of Dodge to make the 1500 available with a diesel V6...drool!!!
Does anyone know why you can't get a 1/2 ton with crew cab + 6 1/2' bed? What's so special about that combo that it's only available in 3/4 ton or 1 ton?
G

Pretty sure ford offers a 6.5 foot bed with the crew cab. Mines a 5.5 foot but i do wish it was longer.

gweaver 04-25-2013 01:46 PM

I know when I've played around with the 'Build Your Own' feature on the Ford/Chevy websites, if you want a crew cab, it automatically gives you the 5.5' bed. I don't know, maybe a dealer can do something special and get a standard bed. I've seen what look like crew cab F150s with full size beds driving around, but I've never seen one close up.
G

tdelong 04-25-2013 01:51 PM

The thing with vehicles is that they cant all be perfect. The sad fact is that it is very likely that you will buy a truck that underperforms and falls apart. It's also very possible that you buy three fords after each other and they all fall apart. On the other hand, the opposite is also true: you may never come in contact with a truck that has many problems that it shouldn't. Just because you buy three fords/whatever else and they all fall apart doesnt mean that the brand sucks. You just got unlucky :(.

As far as all eggs in one basket. Well in 1978 foreign competitors began sale in the US and because they could make smaller and more efficient vehicles, the Big Three focused more on the advancement of their trucks. Now they had to play catch up with the compact cars but their trucks were more advanced. But that is only one of the many reasons that american trucks are the most popular

MC25 04-25-2013 02:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by gweaver (Post 929081)
I don't know much about brand quality for any of the Big 3, but I'd assume that for the most part, they're all about the same. I think for me, if considering the purchase of a new vehicle, I'd have to go with which one moves me. I like the body styles of the Ford and Chevy truck, but I think the Dodge is the only one that offers a crew cab and a full size bed in the 1/2 ton. That 5-5 1/2 foot bed on the other two is a deal breaker for me. Just not enough room for hauling. That, and the apparent decision of Dodge to make the 1500 available with a diesel V6...drool!!!
Does anyone know why you can't get a 1/2 ton with crew cab + 6 1/2' bed? What's so special about that combo that it's only available in 3/4 ton or 1 ton?
G

have you looked? you can get a ford 150 with a 6 1/2 foot bed.

Traxx822 04-25-2013 03:02 PM

Just saw one on the road about minute ago. (I'm waiting for the water department to deliver a meter for one of my rehab jobs) driving through the neighborhood. Had to be a 2012 Silverado. Quad cab and was for sure an 8' bed. .... They do exist!!

Sent from my HTC VLE_U using Tapatalk 2

TN Barefooter 04-25-2013 03:44 PM

I've owned both Ford and Chevy. I'm not married to either one :D . The Chevy was a 3500 dually extended cab, long bed with the converted 454 diesel engine, not very good, I had continuous problems with the injector pump. They since have come out with the duramax which seems to work pretty good. I now own a 2001 F350 Diesel Dually with the crew cab, long bed, 7.3 Diesel (they now have the 6.0?)and we've put over 200,000 miles on it during the 12 years we have owned it. We use our truck primarily to haul horses, the boat and farm equipment. I have replaced the front hubs on both front tires, replaced the pumpkin, had to replace the transmission after 150,000 + miles and I have had trouble keeping it aligned. I figured that's not too bad considering we bought to haul equipment and not as a daily driver. I have not owned a Dodge yet but I would like to one day and see how their diesel's hold up. I think you will find good and bad in any truck you purchase. I've enjoyed following this thread, keep it going.

http://i254.photobucket.com/albums/h...ps62238803.jpg

TN Barefooter 04-25-2013 03:46 PM

I saw a bumper sticker that read: yes it's my truck, no I will not help you move! By the way the transmission problems began after I lent my truck out, go figure!

Retoxtony 04-25-2013 04:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tdelong (Post 929096)
The thing with vehicles is that they cant all be perfect. The sad fact is that it is very likely that you will buy a truck that underperforms and falls apart. It's also very possible that you buy three fords after each other and they all fall apart. On the other hand, the opposite is also true: you may never come in contact with a truck that has many problems that it shouldn't. Just because you buy three fords/whatever else and they all fall apart doesnt mean that the brand sucks. You just got unlucky :(.

As far as all eggs in one basket. Well in 1978 foreign competitors began sale in the US and because they could make smaller and more efficient vehicles, the Big Three focused more on the advancement of their trucks. Now they had to play catch up with the compact cars but their trucks were more advanced. But that is only one of the many reasons that american trucks are the most popular


I think your comments were directed at me? So what your saying is if 3 different contractors each buy a different truck at different dealers, 3-4 months apart yet we all have the IDENTICAL issues over and over again, we are all just "unlucky"? I think a more likely explanation is that Ford has a few issues they need to get figured out on their trucks.

mustangtexas 04-25-2013 04:20 PM

On the 2013 Ford F150 SuperCrew you can get a 5.5' bed or a 6.5' bed. With the 2013 Chevy 1500 CrewCab you can only get 5.5' bed. The new 2014 Chevy 1500 CrewCab that goes into production over the next couple of weeks you will be able to get the 5.5' or the 6.5' bed.

onewheat 04-25-2013 04:53 PM

My B-I-L is an equipment manager for a large construction company. They buy all Ford trucks and have many of them. From what I hear from him - the 7.4's are great - they have several of them with 400k on them and little to no problems, the 6.0's have been nothing but problems. He drove one of them for a few years and he broke down and got towed enough times to lose track of the number. He now has the 6.4 or whatever the new Ford designed engine is - same fuel system problem - 80k on the truck and they wanted $9000 for fuel system repairs - refused to cover it under warranty. Said he had old fuel contamination, although he fills at work where they buy 12,000 gallons every other week. If you Google it - they have a MAJOR problem with this. He used to drive F150's (in the 90's) and there were no major engine problems, but he had electrical and differential problems on several trucks. Dodge has their transmission problems (friend who has had 3 of them has had 8 trannys between them, although he has 400k on his Cummins - other two gas trucks), but for me, the fact that you can't find a 10 year old Dodge around here without rust perforation is a MAJOR issue. I like Dodge exterior styling and some of their innovation, but their interiors are BLAND and rust perforation is a deal breaker for me. You can fix mechanical things, but a rust fix is temporary or massively expensive.

I have always had good luck with my Chevys - not a work truck - Crew Cab 1500HD as a daily driver and there have been a few issues, but zero warranty work and for 150k miles, acceptable repairs and general maintenance only. I have been looking at new trucks and I have to say that I am really torn. I'm not sure I like the way GM has gone with their styling. I have seriously looked at Ford for the first time. The Eco-Boost V6 is really impressive. I still won't give Dodge a serious look - I'm just not there with them. I will most likely end up with a 3/4-Ton GM or Ford this time (rules out the Eco-Boost) but I don't know what yet. I might have to wait until the 2014's come out and see if anything changes - although a friend who works at Ford told me I need to seriously wait and check out the Ford Atlas (possible F-150 replacement) when it makes it's appearance.

tdelong 04-25-2013 05:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Retoxtony (Post 929145)
I think your comments were directed at me? So what your saying is if 3 different contractors each buy a different truck at different dealers, 3-4 months apart yet we all have the IDENTICAL issues over and over again, we are all just "unlucky"? I think a more likely explanation is that Ford has a few issues they need to get figured out on their trucks.

No they weren't directed at anybody but it definitely seems like it could be...Sorry haha. I'm also not saying all these issues are only because of luck cuz that is just superstitious bs. What im trying to say is there are trucks that will perform perfectly and some that will perform poorly from the same brand and same model.In situations like yours i agree with you, it sounds like Ford has some issues to work out. I think people write off a whole brand too easily sometimes saying that the brand makes nothing but terrible vehicles because the trucks they bought underperformed or couldnt even perform. I am not saying this is what you are doing at all and my first comment was not directed at you at all.

And I agree with you 100%. If you buy a truck it better be tough and it better be easy to have warranty work done (as easy as it could be anyway). I feel the same way and I'd be upset just like you or your buddies.

captain planet 04-25-2013 05:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by onewheat (Post 929160)
My B-I-L is an equipment manager for a large construction company. They buy all Ford trucks and have many of them. From what I hear from him - the 7.4's are great - they have several of them with 400k on them and little to no problems, the 6.0's have been nothing but problems. He drove one of them for a few years and he broke down and got towed enough times to lose track of the number. He now has the 6.4 or whatever the new Ford designed engine is - same fuel system problem - 80k on the truck and they wanted $9000 for fuel system repairs - refused to cover it under warranty. Said he had old fuel contamination, although he fills at work where they buy 12,000 gallons every other week. If you Google it - they have a MAJOR problem with this. He used to drive F150's (in the 90's) and there were no major engine problems, but he had electrical and differential problems on several trucks. Dodge has their transmission problems (friend who has had 3 of them has had 8 trannys between them, although he has 400k on his Cummins - other two gas trucks), but for me, the fact that you can't find a 10 year old Dodge around here without rust perforation is a MAJOR issue. I like Dodge exterior styling and some of their innovation, but their interiors are BLAND and rust perforation is a deal breaker for me. You can fix mechanical things, but a rust fix is temporary or massively expensive.

I have always had good luck with my Chevys - not a work truck - Crew Cab 1500HD as a daily driver and there have been a few issues, but zero warranty work and for 150k miles, acceptable repairs and general maintenance only. I have been looking at new trucks and I have to say that I am really torn. I'm not sure I like the way GM has gone with their styling. I have seriously looked at Ford for the first time. The Eco-Boost V6 is really impressive. I still won't give Dodge a serious look - I'm just not there with them. I will most likely end up with a 3/4-Ton GM or Ford this time (rules out the Eco-Boost) but I don't know what yet. I might have to wait until the 2014's come out and see if anything changes - although a friend who works at Ford told me I need to seriously wait and check out the Ford Atlas (possible F-150 replacement) when it makes it's appearance.

I saw a Dodge the other day, couldn't be more than about 5 years old, and already had rust around the wheel well at the bed of the truck, unbelievable.

pmkkdx 04-25-2013 06:41 PM

I guess all this rust ya'll are referring to on the Dodge's are from areas that have a lot of snow/ice where salt/chemicals are used on the roadways that causes the rusting issues???

stuartmcnair 04-25-2013 06:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by h2oskifreak (Post 929039)
I do think that Ford is a good truck, but my ski buddy just spent 6K in repairs to his diesel Ford and it was all caused by a high pressure oil pump and ended w/ injectors. Ouch. I was shocked it was that much with out a serious engine failure. 90K miles BTW. Seems like a diesel should go a lot more miles than that before 6K in repairs?

Something not right here...the diesel for engine, including the HPOP, has a 100,000 mile warranty. At least mine did...

onewheat 04-25-2013 07:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by stuartmcnair (Post 929212)
Something not right here...the diesel for engine, including the HPOP, has a 100,000 mile warranty. At least mine did...

Ford blames fuel contamination, which is NOT covered by warranty. My B-I-L had no engine light or Fuel Contamination light or whatever is supposed to come on and changes filters, etc religiously and they always have fresh fuel in their tanks.

onewheat 04-25-2013 07:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by pmkkdx (Post 929211)
I guess all this rust ya'll are referring to on the Dodge's are from areas that have a lot of snow/ice where salt/chemicals are used on the roadways that causes the rusting issues???

Apparently - I know Texas trucks don't have that problem. Y'all just have the paint burn off and maybe a bit of surface rust. Up here in the salt belt - we see a bit more of that rust.

Traxx822 04-25-2013 07:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by onewheat (Post 929228)
Apparently - I know Texas trucks don't have that problem. Y'all just have the paint burn off and maybe a bit of surface rust. Up here in the salt belt - we see a bit more of that rust.

All of the big 3 have tell tale "salt belt" rust spots on them.

Example is GM rear cab corners are always first to go.

Sent from my HTC VLE_U using Tapatalk 2

onewheat 04-25-2013 08:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Traxx822 (Post 929240)
All of the big 3 have tell tale "salt belt" rust spots on them.

Example is GM rear cab corners are always first to go.

Sent from my HTC VLE_U using Tapatalk 2

I have a lot of friends with a lot of trucks in Cincinnati, where they like their road salt. The only ones with rust holes are the Dodges - rear rocker panels and tailgates seem to be common. I'm talking <10 year old trucks. If you go back further, you definitely see more of them from all MFG's with rust.

TN Barefooter 04-25-2013 08:26 PM

I forgot to mention that when my pumpkin/front differential went out at 110,000 miles the dealer that I purchased my F-350 from wanted to charge me $1,000.00 to replace it. They didn't tell me that Ford had a 75 - 25 warranty after the original warranty ran out. I took it to another Ford dealer and they took care of me. It only cost me $250.00 to replace the front differential. Guess who has gotten my business ever since that happened.

bcd 04-25-2013 09:03 PM

I'm more of a Chevy guy, but have bought a Ford before. Any of you Ford guys want to comment on the 5.4L spitting spark plugs or having them break off in the head? 3 threads of aluminum engagement for a spark plug isn't good. My buddy had his spit a plug at 60K. Ford told him $3000 for a new head. I looked online and found people complaining about paying for the fix only to have it happen again. When his popped, they weren't even allowing heli-coil repairs. Ford wouldn't stand behind their mistake, and I have a hard time ever considering one again.

Of course if you're #1 a long time running and you have a design issue, that's a lot of recalls, especially when it's a $3000 repair.

bobx1 04-25-2013 10:11 PM

2000 F250 Crew Powerstroke 4x4 - great truck

Traded above in for 2003 (same options) - great truck

Traded above for 2007 (same options) - HORRIBLE nothing but expensive problems after 80k miles. After 100k the problems started to come out of my pocket with no help whatsoever from Ford. The trade value was horrendous because everyone knew it was a lemon.

Purchased 2010 F150 4x4 Crew - great truck until 50k miles then 6 grand in repairs later, I moved to a 2013 GMC 1500 crew 4x4. We will see how the GMC holds up.

east tx skier 04-25-2013 11:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by coz (Post 928996)
Me too, and that goes for my Expedition over any Tahoe or Suburban as well :D

My 01 Expedition keeps on plugging away with no signs of trouble (knock wood). My 89 Mustang was a POS, but Ford does well with trucks. Frankly, I wish we could get the Focus RS over here. Supposedly it goes pretty well, although, frankly, the MkVII GTI looks phenomenal.


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