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View Full Version : A Tip Regarding.....Hot Stalls


theDano
06-04-2006, 07:31 PM
Food for Thought:

So I have read a lot of posts regarding hot stalls with my 93 351 4010 carb and I too have recently been trying to figure out what to do with the issue.

So after giving her a complete tuneup and adjusting screws on the carb for air/fuel mixture as well as idle and thinking I had her running like a top I still had the issue today with hot stalls.

So (I am on my 3rd "So" ;) in case you are keepin track) I realized that after running her and then shutting her down for like 15-60 mins that when I would start her back up then she would be acting like she was starving for fuel and would want to stall.

So 8p I started letting her idle at about 1400-1500 rpms for about 45secs - 1 min and all is good after that point.

My only thought on the issue is that maybe the cooler fuel allows the 4010 to run better or something. I did this multiple times and did not have any issues at all even when it did want to stall and then later picking up people, idling up to the dock, or putting her on the trailer resulted in no stalling :banana:

I just thought I would pass this on to others in the hope that it might help someone debug their issue.

JimN
06-04-2006, 08:57 PM
You can also turn the blower on for a while before trying to do anything. Gets some cool air around the motor and avoids/lessens vapor lock. Gas boils at a really low temperature and is the reason cars and trucks have their pump in the tank. Better to keep the gas under pressure than trying to draw it through the line when it wants to boil. Once it boils, the bubbles connect and you get a big void in the fuel line, making the motor run like garbage.

If you need to, you can prop the motor box open a few inches and let cool air in while you're under way.

TMCNo1
06-04-2006, 10:03 PM
On our '89, especially when the air temp was really hot I had a hot start problem, which I felt and was told was vapor lock.
It was suggested I run the blower all the time, which I had always done, use aluminum foil and/or wooden clothes pins on the gas line from the fuel pump to the carb to draw the heat away from the gas line, but it was a ugly sight. I ordered a replacement gas line which was S/S and had it polished to reflect the heat, but it was 1/4" short and would not work, so, I had a braided S/S made up at a street rod shop to replace the original black painted steel line and I have not had a single vapor lock incident since.

theDano
06-04-2006, 10:21 PM
Well I do turn on the blower for a bit probably not for as long as I should (manual says 4 minutes...yeah right :D ). I do for about 15 seconds. I am not too keen on lifting the cover up to air it out or prop it open while I am driving.....call me lazy but I would rather turn the blower on for a bit and fire it up and let it idle up for a very short time and take off than have to go through all the girations with the cover.

Anyway...wasn't meaning for this to go into a debate or a long thread but was just posting what I found hoping to give someone another option for the issue.

G-man
06-04-2006, 10:53 PM
Put the old style 4160 on it and you won't have anymore problems. There are numerious post on the crappy aluminum fishbowl carb.

JimN
06-05-2006, 12:44 AM
Dano- 15 seconds does almpst nothing since the blower doesn't move a lot of air. That's the reason for the 5 minute recommendation. If you think about it, running it with all of the heat still under the motor box shouldn't do anything since there isn't a fan to blow it out. If you have a chunk of a 2x4, you can prop it up with that and it won't affect anything other than the heat loss. Heat soak occurs with cars, too. Run yours when it's hot and shut it down for about 15 minutes. When you need to go again, just turn the key to ON and note the temperature. It's a lot higher than you would expect but unless it's an old car, it'll run because the gas is being pushed toward the motor and you won't have any chance of vapor lock.

east tx skier
06-05-2006, 11:38 AM
Put the old style 4160 on it and you won't have anymore problems. There are numerious post on the crappy aluminum fishbowl carb.

Dano, I'm glad you are having some success coping with the 4010, but I still have to agree with George. The 4160 is money well spent. You won't believe how happy you'll be when you can just crank it up, take out the rope slack, and hit it.

MarkP
06-05-2006, 12:09 PM
Dano, I'm glad you are having some success coping with the 4010, but I still have to agree with George. The 4160 is money well spent. You won't believe how happy you'll be when you can just crank it up, take out the rope slack, and hit it.
I donít think anyone is saying they cant do that now.

theDano
06-05-2006, 02:22 PM
yah I understand what has all been posted regarding the 4160 and how much better it is and that it solves the problem. My point was that... well I am stuck for now with what I have and we have spent a lot of money on purchasing the boat plus all of the equipment that comes with outfitting 3 people. So right now dishing out another 420-500 bucks is not an option.

Thinking there might be people in similiar situations with having to stick with what they have (4010), I thought it would be good to share with all on something that I have discovered to help somebody out..... This forum has helped me with things and I am trying to give back :D

east tx skier
06-05-2006, 02:36 PM
I know what you mean. There ought to be a warning with these boats that they'll cause you to happily spend all your money even after the initial purchase given all the extra toys and hobbies that go along with them.

G-man
06-05-2006, 02:51 PM
theDano

We all understand the situation your in just getting the boat with all the extras that come with a boat. The fishbowl carb is one of those ideas that should have never been used on boats. Some people got one and haven't had any problems, most have the same problem as you. There is no easy fix just expensive ones. When you do decide to change out the carb besure and get a new fuel line to run from the fuel pump to the carb.

east tx skier
06-09-2006, 11:45 AM
Dano, check this out. Rebuilt Marine 4160. Starting bid of $99.

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=4648252961&sspagename=ADME%3AB%3***%3AUS%3A1

stevo137
06-09-2006, 11:49 AM
Put the old style 4160 on it and you won't have anymore problems. There are numerious post on the crappy aluminum fishbowl carb.
Yep, my 4160 runs beautiful.

Leroy
06-09-2006, 12:00 PM
Why not mount another blower right where you need it, blowing on carb and fuel line?

east tx skier
06-09-2006, 12:01 PM
Yep, my 4160 runs beautiful.

Wait a minute! You have a 4160 on yours? Is it the 285 hp engine?

stevo137
06-09-2006, 12:05 PM
Wait a minute! You have a 4160 on yours? Is it the 285 hp engine?

Yes it is the 285 HO and it screams! :)

east tx skier
06-09-2006, 12:22 PM
Well, shoot, you should've said it had the 4160. Is it listed in the marketplace?

G-man
06-09-2006, 12:37 PM
Yep, my 4160 runs beautiful.

Steve

You got one of the luckey ones, my friends 92 PCM engine of that era was great the whole time he owned it never had a problem.

east tx skier
06-09-2006, 12:43 PM
I'm still confused. Steve, do you have a 4160, or a 4010 and you're lucky?

stevo137
06-09-2006, 12:51 PM
Well, shoot, you should've said it had the 4160. Is it listed in the marketplace?
Yes, the link is in my signiture.
Check it out Doug.

east tx skier
06-09-2006, 12:52 PM
Found it (I'm blind). So who replaced the fishbowl carb or did it for some odd reason just come with the 4160?

stevo137
06-09-2006, 01:12 PM
Found it (I'm blind). So who replaced the fishbowl carb or did it for some odd reason just come with the 4160?
I believe that it is original.I just had the carb rebuilt at Pinecrest because the float stuck during winter storage and the mechanic said that he thought that it was the first time that it was rebuilt. I had it out on Memorial weekend and it is running beautiful. Idles @ 700rpms and. 700rpms in neutral, just how I like it!

G-man
06-09-2006, 02:06 PM
stev0

to clear up my muddled mind is your carb brass/gold in color a 4160 single feed or is it silver/aluminum in color a 4110 duel feed

The 4110 is the one with all the problems in my past post

If it is the brass carb it must have been changed out at sometime

I still can't believe your selling it, but I understand.

eastie you need to jump on this one

east tx skier
06-09-2006, 02:39 PM
Gorgeous boat for sure. Which carb is one factor. The fact that it's not down the street is another. And then there's the I already have a boat thing. ;)

G-man
06-09-2006, 03:18 PM
Gorgeous boat for sure. Which carb is one factor. The fact that it's not down the street is another. And then there's the I already have a boat thing. ;)


All good points Doug but nothing you can't handle. You pay and I would help you go get it.

east tx skier
06-09-2006, 03:27 PM
Shoot, it's tempting, but I want SteveO to get every dollar he's looking to get out of that boat. He deserves it.

But I very much appreciate the offer to help me go get it. I'll be honest, when I heard 4160, my ears perked up.

stevo137
06-09-2006, 03:56 PM
stev0

to clear up my muddled mind is your carb brass/gold in color a 4160 single feed or is it silver/aluminum in color a 4110 duel feed

The 4110 is the one with all the problems in my past post

If it is the brass carb it must have been changed out at sometime

I still can't believe your selling it, but I understand.

eastie you need to jump on this one
G, I'm out on the road now but the boat is in the garage and I'll open it up tonight and check it out.

G-man
06-09-2006, 04:12 PM
eastie

just take your son to see it, he'll fall in love with and explain to the wife you did it for him and not you. Worked on my 93 purchase, but my wife didn't fall for it completely. It's a good thing she likes going to the lake.
Remeber you did it for the kid.

east tx skier
06-09-2006, 04:50 PM
I pick him up every afternoon. As I carry him into the house, we stop and he pats the boat while I say "Boat." Then he giggles.

So my story is that I cut down on the seating for the kid? 8p Okie dokie!

starman205
06-09-2006, 05:04 PM
Eastie, shame on you!!!, its not a boat its a Mastercraft!!! You should be teacing your son to say MASTERCRAFT!!!!! :headbang:

east tx skier
06-09-2006, 05:06 PM
At 10 months (this weekend), I'd be thrilled if I could get him to say "boat."

stevo137
06-09-2006, 06:28 PM
Here's a pic of the engine. Doug, I would not hesitate to sell it to you any anyone that I know. I am surprised that it isn't gone yet.
(I didn't clean the engine yet)


http://i36.photobucket.com/albums/e27/stevo137/Engine011.jpg

east tx skier
06-09-2006, 06:50 PM
4160 indeed. And probably cleaner than mine is under the hood for sure. Summer's just getting started. I'm sure she'll sell before you know it. What happened to your fire fighting potential buyer?

stevo137
06-09-2006, 07:15 PM
4160 indeed. And probably cleaner than mine is under the hood for sure. Summer's just getting started. I'm sure she'll sell before you know it. What happened to your fire fighting potential buyer?
Never heard back from him, have one seriously interested and one fairly interested but you know how that goes. It takes someone who really knows what this boat is about. I knew the first time that I saw the add. Talked to the owner one time and that was it, on my way down to Beau country to get er'.

Upper Michigan Prostar190
06-09-2006, 10:02 PM
Stevo and I just got off the phone(nice talkin to you steve :wavey: ) and during the conversation we started talkin carbs. SO curiosity got the best of me and I had to know what carb I had. I went out in the boat and pulled the cover off the carb, and mine looks just like Stevos in that pic. same color, and layout.

TMCNo1
06-09-2006, 10:26 PM
Stevo and I just got off the phone(nice talkin to you steve :wavey: ) and during the conversation we started talkin carbs. SO curiosity got the best of me and I had to know what carb I had. I went out in the boat and pulled the cover off the carb, and mine looks just like Stevos in that pic. same color, and layout.


That's nice, identical carbs, born at different times together! :eek:

theDano
06-10-2006, 09:29 AM
Thanks ETS for the thought on the used rebuilt 4160. Funny that I never thought about getting a used one. Sometimes you get stuck in thinking always buying new you know? Thanks for keeping me in mind. ;) Unfortunately that link never came up. Must be an issue on ebay or sumting. Will try later.

Stevo...That boat is nice! That should go quick I would think. Very Clean too. That engine is as clean as mine :)

Time to get me a cup o' joe.

You all are probably out on the lake as I type now. If so, have a great weekend. I am going out Sunday and teaching my wife and son (he is 8) how to ski. They never have before and I am excited to teach.....wish all of us luck... should be a memorable experience for sure.

G-man
06-10-2006, 11:17 AM
Stevo

Your luckey that adds some value to the boat in just knowing you won't have the hot stall problems. Have you done an ad in boat trader.com, all the shops in this area use it.

stevo137
06-10-2006, 11:53 AM
Stevo

Your luckey that adds some value to the boat in just knowing you won't have the hot stall problems. Have you done an ad in boat trader.com, all the shops in this area use it.
Thanks for the tip G. I have only listed it in TT, time to try a few others.

east tx skier
06-10-2006, 12:03 PM
UMP, if I understand things correctly, everything pre 1992 came with the 4160. 92 and 93 had the 4010 stock on the 351 HO and the 4160 stock on the 351. 94 and up was all injection.

TMCNo1
06-10-2006, 03:29 PM
UMP, if I understand things correctly, everything pre 1992 came with the 4160. 92 and 93 had the 4010 stock on the 351 HO and the 4160 stock on the 351. 94 and up was all injection.


Some of the 1993 S/S boats and the 25th Anniversary Limited Edition boats had the Chev. LTI injected and there was the Chev. 350 TBI available also as an option till Indmar ran out of Ford 351s for MC in the change over to the Chevrolet fuel injected boats as std. equipment.

theDano
06-10-2006, 03:53 PM
UMP, if I understand things correctly, everything pre 1992 came with the 4160. 92 and 93 had the 4010 stock on the 351 HO and the 4160 stock on the 351. 94 and up was all injection.

So I picked the lucky year ;)

east tx skier
06-10-2006, 05:01 PM
One of two lucky years in that regard. You can take comfort in the fact that that year also had one heck of a hull for slalom.

east tx skier
06-10-2006, 05:03 PM
Some of the 1993 S/S boats and the 25th Anniversary Limited Edition boats had the Chev. LTI injected and there was the Chev. 350 TBI available also as an option till Indmar ran out of Ford 351s for MC in the change over to the Chevrolet fuel injected boats as std. equipment.

Harold, are you saying there were some TBIs in 93? I know all of the 190 Ltds had the LT1 and that it was an option that year, but my manual and brochure don't mention any TBIs for 93. Or are you saying there were a few 351s in 94? :confused:

Upper Michigan Prostar190
06-10-2006, 08:17 PM
UMP, if I understand things correctly, everything pre 1992 came with the 4160. 92 and 93 had the 4010 stock on the 351 HO and the 4160 stock on the 351. 94 and up was all injection.
Well I would bet my money on that being accurate Eastie, I would defer to your knowledge any day. :worthy: I was wondering when those 4010 were offered. All I really know is I havent had any hot stall problems. I got the electronic conversion, carb rebuild, tune up, new thermostat, and that boat runs like a top. :) Thanks for the info Eastie.

Hoosier Bob
06-10-2006, 08:25 PM
The 4010 is from my understanding a bad arse carb. The further you go toward bad arse more maintaining of the carb will be required. I love mine and at some point I am sure it will be due for a total rebuild. As for now she runs and she runs with careful upkeep! :D Eastie is correct that fuel injection was in 93 as an option but as far as I know did not become standard until 1994. Also as far as I know the 4010 ws standard on the 92 and 93 HO Ford 5.8 351 engines. The 4010 gets knocked but can work well and looks awesome! :D

G-man
06-11-2006, 09:56 PM
I wouldnt own a boat with one, 9 out of 10, 4110 are crap. I have had 150 hrs of hell owning one then got the 4160 by writting numerous letters during the warranty period. My 4160 I put over 400 hours in about 10 years and never did a rebuild.

TMCNo1
06-11-2006, 10:46 PM
[QUOTE=east tx skier]Harold, are you saying there were some TBIs in 93? I know all of the 190 Ltds had the LT1 and that it was an option that year, but my manual and brochure don't mention any TBIs for 93. Or are you saying there were a few 351s in 94? :confused:[/QUOTE

As far as I know there were no 351's in '94, as that was the first full year of EFI, but '93 was a transition year and I think there was a few late '93s that had the TBI once the 351's were used up from Indmar. Don't know how many but just a few and it wouldn't have been in the brochure or manuals as it was late in the year model and all the printing for the '93 models were done in the summer of '92.
A very few of the real early [july/august '92]'93 LTD anniversary boats built had 351's in them, as a friend of mine had worked out a deal to get an LTD with the 454 in it because he didn't want a Ford, then he ordered a '93 S/S when he found out MC was going to build the S/S and got the LT1 when he found out it was available. Most if not all of the LTD's still at the factory when the LT1 came were changed over from the 351 to the LT1.
Doug, I didn't mean to sound like a know it all, but I worked for the guy mentioned above, who worked out a deal with MC to get the serial no. 1 of 25 LTD boats and lived with his ranting and raving for 3 mos. the summer of '92 over all the LTD vs S/S vs 351/454/LT1 mess and as it turned out, Richard Bean of Sherwood Arkansas wound up with the boat he originally wanted, a LTD, serial no. 1 of 25 with the LT1 engine.

east tx skier
06-11-2006, 11:52 PM
Harold, I didn't think you sounded like a know-it-all. I was just curious as you seem to have some very unusual facts at your fingertips. :)

Sorry HB. I'm glad it's working for you, but like George, I'll never own a boat with a 4010 again. It hits with a bit more response than the 4160, but that was not worth all the sputtering and dying when I had a skier on the line. I hated that thing. I wish I'd never bothered having it rebuilt. The 4160 has been trouble free for me since 2004.