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browsielover
04-28-2006, 10:03 AM
We own a 97 PS205 w/tandem axle trailer.
We make short trips to the local boat ramp that does not require a 4wd vehicle. Twice a year, we will take a weekend trip to a cabin in Northern Wisconsin and drive about 230mi to get there.
The bottom line - we could spend gobs of $$ and get another SUV w/ a V8, but with gas so high, etc, you know...
Any thoughts on Chryslers Town and Country (yeah- I am a family guy and the vehicle would spend most of it's time running kids to this and that). They say, with the tow package it has a tow capacity of 3800.
Also considering mid sized SUVs like Pathfinder and 4runner, but they are about $10k more expensive than a nice minivan.
Going from a Toyota Sequoia, I have a realy problem with this, so I just wanted to run this one out there.
THanks!

Tom023
04-28-2006, 10:59 AM
I think you are in the 4500# range with your boat, trailer and maybe some gear, so I would be looking for a vehicle with a tow rating of 5000# or more. I'm not sure if any mini vans have that, plus front wheel drive doesn't do as well at a slippery ramp. 4Runner with V6 would be a good choice.

BrianS
04-28-2006, 11:14 AM
Unfortunately I don't think a minivan is going to cut it. You're going to be well over 3800# when loaded with the family, gear and fuel.

I tow my '93 190 with a '03 Tacoma and it does fine. The older boats are narrower and sit down on the trailer and hide behind the truck which makes it much easier. If I had a newer boat that was wider or taller than the truck I don't think it would do as well. Wind resistance can be a killer.

The newer 4runners and Tacoma's are bigger and have more power than my truck. IMO, either would be adequate to get you and your family to the lake. Also consider the Honda Pilot, a friend tows his 190 with one and it does fine. Probably has better non-towing gas mileage as well.

LakePirate
04-28-2006, 11:31 AM
TMC#01 tows with a mini-van.

(For some reason I feel like I should say nah-nah-nah-nah-nah-nah)

We once had a mini-van growing up, towing wasn't the problem...stopping on the other hand, well that was an adventure. If you have trailer brakes it shouldn't be a problem.

Footin
04-28-2006, 11:32 AM
I have a ski buddy that use to tow his Supra ts6m on a tandum trailer with a 98 or 99 Town and Country. It did ok out on the road, but one time on a bad ramp the had to have someone pull the van and boat up the ramp.

If your ramps are good and you don't trailer much, I think you will be ok.

Ric
04-28-2006, 11:38 AM
TMC#01 tows with a mini-van.

(For some reason I feel like I should say nah-nah-nah-nah-nah-nah)

We once had a mini-van growing up, towing wasn't the problem...stopping on the other hand, well that was an adventure. If you have trailer brakes it shouldn't be a problem.
you know though... tmc01's van is rwd and a torquey vortech six... I think the t&c van is most likely v6 and fwd which makes quite a difference at the ramp and the road, I think

east tx skier
04-28-2006, 11:41 AM
I was going to say that TMCNo1 will be the guy to ask on this one. I've towed ours with my wife's 6 cyl explorer on a couple of decent trips. It has been fine on the highway. Only one ramp issue. We just had someone sit in the bow and it was enough extra weight for the tires to get traction. That said, the expedition does a lot better. But I understand your dilema.

pepi
04-28-2006, 11:44 AM
My humble suggestion would be to keep the Sequoia, and get a used Safari/Astro Van as a tow vehicle. Rear wheel drive (or all-wheel), full frame, reliable drive trains, cheap parts, lots of room etc.

Datdude
04-28-2006, 11:45 AM
We just got my wife a Nissan Murano and she loves it. It is AWD and quite fun to drive. Her mileage is in the low 20's right now, but the car only has 3000 miles on it. I am not sure what the towing capacity is but it might be worth a look?

P-hat_in_Cincy
04-28-2006, 11:48 AM
I pulled this picture of wakeboarder.com. :eek:
Story behind it is that it's used 2 times/yr to drop boat in and pull it out. And I guess to a from the dealership?

Ric
04-28-2006, 11:56 AM
I pulled this picture of wakeboarder.com. :eek:
Story behind it is that it's used 2 times/yr to drop boat in and pull it out. And I guess to a from the dealership?
they do alot with those small cars in those foreign lands :D

peason
04-28-2006, 12:06 PM
I have used my 1999 Toyota Sienna to pull our PS209 on several trips. The only problems I have had is when I had a bad ramp to pull the boat out. And I always figured I could ask someone to get the boat on flat ground if I could not find a ramp that was okay.
The 4 trips I took all were about 250 miles each. I have the tow package on it and I actually liked towing the newer boat on with it, because prior I had a trailer that did not have brakes.
We now have a trailblazer that does the job, but if all you are talking about is one longer trip a year - I would consider a Toyota Sienna - we really like ours and it runs like a horse.

VTJC
04-28-2006, 12:14 PM
Donít forget there is a V8 in the MC that can help push(or take the load off) the tow vehicle up the ramp. There is a rough ramp near me and a guy with a 2wd tow vehicle was always doing this. Just make sure itís well secured to the trailer!

BeavenX5
04-28-2006, 01:15 PM
I am using my volvo V70XC AWD 5 cyl twice a year to take the boat in and out of the water from a gravel ramp. and about 5 miles away. I have no problem doing it what so ever. Bringing the boat to the dealer in the city (about 60 miles away) I borrow a fried truck as I don't want to put too much stress on my car transmission. The Volvo is rated 3500lb towing :rolleyes:

My friend tows his Malibu a few time a year 120 miles with his Pontiac Montana without any problem. He uses someone else 4X4 to put it in and out of the water from his beach.

Thrall
04-28-2006, 01:25 PM
You wn't win any races towing w/ the minivan, but if you're only making 1 trip a yr and the kid carrier is what best suits your needs otherwise, it'll be ok. I'd just make sure you have operational trailer brakes and probably airbags/overlaods, something to hold up the back of the van.
I towed a 8-9000lb trailer all over the country w/ a 1/2 ton chevy p/u. A little over the rated towing capacity, but fine w/ trailer brakes, slow going up the hills.

T5_Steve
04-28-2006, 01:52 PM
You might want to consider a Chevy Venture AWD. It's rated at 3500# towing, seats 7 ~ 8, and has AWD. Gas mile should be in the mid-20's combined with the 3.8l v-6.

My primary tow vehicle is a Suburban, but I bought my wife a 2002 Venture AWD last year and I'm planning to install a hitch this Spring and try it out towing my T-5. The Venture AWD seems a bit sluggish when not towing, so it might be a bit of a turtle when towing a 4000# boat.

92 190 PS
04-28-2006, 01:59 PM
We use a 2005 Honda Pilot to tow our 190 and it's not a problem. The pilot has AWD standard in the EX and a 4500 LB towing capacity. We did put a trans cooler on it when we did the hitch, but other than that it's stock. Great vehicle when not towing with a ton of space (seats 8 standard) and good fuel economoy over 20.

88 PS190
04-28-2006, 02:12 PM
Ha ha, yea the Iowa Ski team used and town and country to pull the moomba, but of course they give it a boost w/ the boat too, you should see the fatty front drive burn outs the van does going up the ramp.

TMCNo1
04-28-2006, 02:13 PM
TMC#01 tows with a mini-van.

(For some reason I feel like I should say nah-nah-nah-nah-nah-nah)

We once had a mini-van growing up, towing wasn't the problem...stopping on the other hand, well that was an adventure. If you have trailer brakes it shouldn't be a problem.


In 1988, ordered Chev. Astro 4.3L 160 hp with 6000 lb factory installed towing package, which included 4 speed automatic transmission with heavy duty transmission oil cooler, cruise control, engine oil cooler, heavy duty radiator, heavy duty alternator, hitch, 7 wire wiring harness and 3:73 posi-traction rearend.
To date van has 55,512 miles, with 29,912 towing the boat @ 15.2 mpg and without boat 20.3 mpg!
It has been a dream to own and use, towed boat 20,705 miles without trailer brakes, then in 1997 redid trailer and installed UFP Disc Brakes and now have towed 9,207 miles with brakes.
It's all about paying attention, knowing your limits and sticking to them!

EricB
04-28-2006, 03:03 PM
We used to have a 1998 T&C w/3.8 L. We took some trips once in a while towing our 1983 S&S and it seemed to work just fine. Just be easy on it, and shift out odf OD going up grade.
It will probably be just fine, just take it easy on the Mini-van.

Workin' 4 Toys
04-28-2006, 05:18 PM
We own a 97 PS205 w/tandem axle trailer.
We make short trips to the local boat ramp that does not require a 4wd vehicle. Twice a year, we will take a weekend trip to a cabin in Northern Wisconsin and drive about 230mi to get there.
The bottom line - we could spend gobs of $$ and get another SUV w/ a V8, but with gas so high, etc, you know...
Any thoughts on Chryslers Town and Country (yeah- I am a family guy and the vehicle would spend most of it's time running kids to this and that). They say, with the tow package it has a tow capacity of 3800.
Also considering mid sized SUVs like Pathfinder and 4runner, but they are about $10k more expensive than a nice minivan.
Going from a Toyota Sequoia, I have a realy problem with this, so I just wanted to run this one out there.
THanks!
Try a Dodge MAGNUM on for size. V6 in RWD or AWD.
I think Steve will back me up here.

Ric
04-28-2006, 05:43 PM
You might want to consider a Chevy Venture AWD. It's rated at 3500# towing, seats 7 ~ 8, and has AWD. Gas mile should be in the mid-20's combined with the 3.8l v-6.

My primary tow vehicle is a Suburban, but I bought my wife a 2002 Venture AWD last year and I'm planning to install a hitch this Spring and try it out towing my T-5. The Venture AWD seems a bit sluggish when not towing, so it might be a bit of a turtle when towing a 4000# boat.
welcome.... what's a T5?

PointTaken
04-28-2006, 05:47 PM
welcome.... what's a T5?
Obviously the follow-up model to the T-4 :D

Ric
04-28-2006, 05:50 PM
Obviously the follow-up model to the T-4 :D
The predecessor to the T6.....

PointTaken
04-28-2006, 05:51 PM
The predecessor to the T6.....
LOL. We have it surrounded.

east tx skier
04-28-2006, 07:42 PM
...and 3:73 posi-traction rearend

That's the ticket right there.

east tx skier
04-28-2006, 07:44 PM
Actually, there were some issues with Perfect Pass, so it's the predecessor to the T5ng v12. ;)

TMCNo1
04-29-2006, 01:07 PM
That's the ticket right there.


Your right Doug, the lower rear gear keeps the rpm's up in the torque range and your not throwing fuel in with no results, like with a 3:42 or a 3:08. Lived that life once with a straight drive pickup with a 3:08 rear gear, was fouling out a spark plug or two every other week, from so much fuel being thrown in going up hills and had to change over to a 3:73 posi-traction and was amazed at the results. Never did foul out any plugs after that and the gas mileage nearly doubled overall when towing the boat!

ecelis
04-30-2006, 01:16 PM
I think this picture is from Sweden.
In Europe heavy tow vehicles are very expensive. Expensive to buy, expensive in yearly taxes, insurance and gas...
I think that nice Malibu is quite a stretch though for that Jetta (or Passat) .
I towed a 22 foot cabin boat one time for about 30 miles with a Ford Sierra (long time ago) and it pulled it (in Holland, all flat), but the temperature gauge was constantly flirting with the red. When we sold the car, we removed the hitch and we noticed that it ripped the mounts half though the bottom plate of the trunk...

T5_Steve
04-30-2006, 05:04 PM
welcome.... what's a T5?

Threadjack ON:

A Centurion T5 Comp w/tower. Sorry... hope ya'll don't mind a non-MC owner lurking and posting, although not very often, on TeamTalk. :) Just so ya know, the T5 had a lot of features for the price and is a solid boat, however, my next inboard will be a Mastercraft. I'd really like to have a PS 197 w/tower, new or used. Still trying to convince the wife! :rolleyes:

Threadjack OFF:

6ballsisall
04-30-2006, 05:12 PM
Wouldnt recommend a minivan even for the few times you are towing. You can have all the go but no whoa you want but you're still dangerous. A minivan won't give you any whoa or go.

I can personally say many years ago my uncle and aunt had a minivan and was pulling our families 16' runabout and on more than one occasion on that trip we all had to check our drawers. Get something that has the suspension and brakes to handle the load. If anything get the smaller engine option in whatever you buy, just don't scrimp on the brakes!

aerojt
04-30-2006, 07:51 PM
I tow with a 96 Chevy Blazer, has done great so far. They are cheap too if you look around. All Blazers came with the 4.3 V6, and most have 4wd which is nice to have on a slippery ramp. Goodluck!

Jerseydave
05-01-2006, 10:56 AM
IMO, I wouldn't give up that Toyota Sequioa. That's a very nice vehicle for towing, as well as solo driving.

Why not keep that and get a fuel-sipping daily driver, 4 cyl. 5 door like a Matrix or Jetta? The dealer will not be generous on the trade in value of your Toyota, since you are really trading DOWN!

#47of100TeamMC
05-01-2006, 11:10 AM
"Threadjack on, again:"

I like the look of the Centurion!

"Threadjack off:"

east tx skier
05-01-2006, 12:36 PM
IMO, I wouldn't give up that Toyota Sequioa. That's a very nice vehicle for towing, as well as solo driving.

Why not keep that and get a fuel-sipping daily driver, 4 cyl. 5 door like a Matrix or Jetta? The dealer will not be generous on the trade in value of your Toyota, since you are really trading DOWN!

I think the new Jettas require 93 octane or diesel. Great cars to drive, but that's some spendy fuel.

Ric
05-01-2006, 01:22 PM
Threadjack ON:

A Centurion T5 Comp w/tower. Sorry... hope ya'll don't mind a non-MC owner lurking and posting, although not very often, on TeamTalk. :) Just so ya know, the T5 had a lot of features for the price and is a solid boat, however, my next inboard will be a Mastercraft. I'd really like to have a PS 197 w/tower, new or used. Still trying to convince the wife! :rolleyes:

Threadjack OFF:
It doesn't bother me about the pics, but admin said not to do it...
ask rodltq about all that, but it's ok to post a supra if it's grounded 20ft up on the rocks ;)

Jerseydave
05-01-2006, 01:42 PM
Eastie,

My wife's Infiniti says "use premium for better performance" but we have always used reg. with no problems. Not sure about the VW's.

Even so, way cheaper to run on premium than to run his SUV around getting way less mileage.

I have a suburban 6.0 liter and it gets used just for towing the boat or if I have to take 1/2 dozen people somewhere. Other than that, it sits in the garage.

east tx skier
05-01-2006, 01:44 PM
I read a review on the jetta/passat once that basically said you can run less, but it doesn't like it much. Sure, it's going to get better mileage for sure.

browsielover
05-22-2006, 11:49 PM
Your (collective) advice was helpful.
No minivan. The Seqoia stays as both grocery getter and tow vehicle. I just bought a pretty low mi '01 Subaru Outback to handle the rest of the family miles. There is a lot of car there for the buck. Maybe I'll put a hitch on it some day and really put to the test!

T Scott
05-22-2006, 11:58 PM
I suggest one of these :D I used it today to tow my x-star.....Literally didn't even feel it back there. Got 14.8 mpg towing the boat. 19 mpg without. This one is for sale...2004 Dodge Ram 3500, Cummins diesel 4x4. $28,900 PM me for more pics.

dapicatti
05-23-2006, 12:56 AM
Anyone ever pull with a Jeep Grand Cherokee? We picked up the 06 X-2 this weekend, and it seems to be working well with our 03 Limited, however we did some damage to the transmission on our 96 Grand Cherokee Limited pulling a 79 Cobalt. We are thinking bigger rig for the boat....it looked dwarfed in front of the X-2! Any thoughts? :confused:

#47of100TeamMC
05-23-2006, 09:20 AM
Yes, I would think the cherokee wouldn't handle it for long with out problems. My brother towed his old Ski Supreme with a similar jeep and toasted the tranny in less than 500miles.

I tow with a '05 Nissan Titan. LOVE IT. Lots of neat features (Extendable side mirrors, Back-up sensors, Vertical sliding rear window glass, standard bedliner, Utilitrack system, side storage compartment for Receiver hitch insert...)and the motor is BIG. Tons of HP and Torque. Biggest interior room of any Half Ton pickup. I would highly recommend it!

jraben8
05-23-2006, 11:58 AM
What mileage is your Titan getting?

jraben8
05-23-2006, 12:03 PM
I read a review on the jetta/passat once that basically said you can run less, but it doesn't like it much. Sure, it's going to get better mileage for sure.


I bought my wife a Passat about 4 weeks ago and with the 2.0T motor she already gets 34 mpg on her way to work rolling down the highway and that's on 87 octane. When we bought it the dealer said that yes, you will get better mileage with premium but regular isn't bad for it either and that's what they are putting in their demo cars.

Workin' 4 Toys
05-23-2006, 12:05 PM
Anyone ever pull with a Jeep Grand Cherokee?
Yup, no problem.
And one of the other guys has been towing with his for years.

Wes
05-23-2006, 12:20 PM
Our tow vehicle is a Windstar, (until next year). No problem towing, or stopping (tandem axle with brakes). Just have to watch those slippery ramps. I towed it from LA to Vancouver (1200 miles) no trouble at all.

If you have something else I would use it, but seems to work for us, considering the price of gas here in Canada, around the $4.00 US per gallon mark.

#47of100TeamMC
05-23-2006, 12:26 PM
What mileage is your Titan getting?

I'm getting 14mpg highway or city. I'll respond with a long trip pulling the boat after this coming memorial day weekend. It will be the first long distance pull. I think I'll just hit 6kmiles this weekend too. So she's maybe not quite broken in just yet either. But I guess I didn't buy it for the mileage.

wtrjock
05-23-2006, 12:44 PM
I am towing with a 2002 Silverado 6L. Tows great from gas station to gas station! I get about 10mpg without the boat and about 8mpg with the boat.

But damn does it look good!

Travis

Ric
05-23-2006, 12:47 PM
I am towing with a 2002 Silverado 6L. Tows great from gas station to gas station! I get about 10mpg without the boat and about 8mpg with the boat.

But damn does it look good!

Travis

lookin good!

did you recal the speedo for that tire size? If not, I'd bet you are getting better gas mileage than you think :friday:

Wes
05-23-2006, 12:51 PM
That does look good...

wtrjock
05-23-2006, 12:59 PM
I recal'd the speedo with the Hypertec power programmer. I was getting 8.5mpg before the programmer. Problem is that this is a 1500HD instead of a 2500HD. The 1500HD comes with 3.56 gears and the 2500HD comes with 4.10. The effective gears to stock is about 4.15, so if I put new gears in, then I would get a little better gas mileage, around 13mpg would be my guess. The gears are $1150 installed. I haven't pulled the trigger yet.

The 4.10 or 4.56 would give me more pulling power as well, so I will probably do it sometime this year.

Thanks.

Thrall
05-23-2006, 01:08 PM
Had to throw in a pic here. A bit overkill for my 190, but the DMax is puttin' out roughly 400hp and 700 lb/ft and tows the little boat at whatever speed desired w/ the cruise on! Beat's my 1/2 ton Dodge hands down.
Went out last wknd for the first time w/ the new (to me) truck and even pulling 6% grades at 7kft altitude never even down shifted.
Edit: I don't run the higher hp when towing.

Ric
05-23-2006, 01:40 PM
I recal'd the speedo with the Hypertec power programmer. I was getting 8.5mpg before the programmer. Problem is that this is a 1500HD instead of a 2500HD. The 1500HD comes with 3.56 gears and the 2500HD comes with 4.10. The effective gears to stock is about 4.15, so if I put new gears in, then I would get a little better gas mileage, around 13mpg would be my guess. The gears are $1150 installed. I haven't pulled the trigger yet.

The 4.10 or 4.56 would give me more pulling power as well, so I will probably do it sometime this year.

Thanks.
I have the 1500HD 6.0 but mine has 3.73 gears and I thought my 02 1500HD had 3.73 as well?
my tires are 305/70/16 and yours appear to be alot larger than that.
I had a westers tune with a recal and was towing at about 12 or 13mpg if I didnt doggg it all the time.

I got rid of the tune, so my speedo is off and naturally my mileage calculator is off as well. But I am towing at about 9.5 mpg on the screen which I roughly translate to 10.5mpg in reality....

wtrjock
05-23-2006, 01:52 PM
I think you are right about the 3.73. I much have been thinking about 4.56, and typed 3.56 instead of 3.73. Oops. I am running 35"x12"x17" tires, so the gears are off a little.

Addons:
Hypertec Power Programmer
Magnaflow exhaust dual in dual out
K&N FIPK cold air intake
6" lift

I haven't towed over the mountain yet to get a good reading of MPG when towing. I just got this truck in January, so I am still learning a little.

Why did you get rid of the Westers tune? I heard those are prtty good for the money.

Ric
05-23-2006, 04:07 PM
I think you are right about the 3.73. I much have been thinking about 4.56, and typed 3.56 instead of 3.73. Oops. I am running 35"x12"x17" tires, so the gears are off a little.

Addons:
Hypertec Power Programmer
Magnaflow exhaust dual in dual out
K&N FIPK cold air intake
6" lift

I haven't towed over the mountain yet to get a good reading of MPG when towing. I just got this truck in January, so I am still learning a little.

Why did you get rid of the Westers tune? I heard those are prtty good for the money.
I expected better mileage for you but maybe the 35's are more load than I think... I havent run 35's since I did a leaf spring blazer in the 80s so my experience is from long ago

westers tune was awesome power increase, but they did 5 different re-tunes for me because when he increased power, I'd get clatter, when he retarded timing, clatter was gone and speedo was off, fixed the speedo and then I had a downshift hiccup... on the fifth tune, the rep killed my truck and I had to tow it to the dealer the next day for ecm replacement..... there was no way in hell I was continuing that agony...
that said, my buddy got his same truck done at the same time and never had a single issue... I have a black cloud over my head

I think my gearhead rep was the main problem...

Diesel
05-23-2006, 04:16 PM
Had to throw in a pic here. A bit overkill for my 190, but the DMax is puttin' out roughly 400hp and 700 lb/ft and tows the little boat at whatever speed desired w/ the cruise on! Beat's my 1/2 ton Dodge hands down.
Went out last wknd for the first time w/ the new (to me) truck and even pulling 6% grades at 7kft altitude never even down shifted.
Edit: I don't run the higher hp when towing.

Thrall, what year is your truck? Do you know which engine you have, LB7, LLY, LBZ??

Thrall
05-23-2006, 08:32 PM
Thrall, what year is your truck? Do you know which engine you have, LB7, LLY, LBZ??

'02, LB7, just bought it a few months ago w/ 27k on the odometer.

#47of100TeamMC
05-30-2006, 09:21 AM
I'm getting 14mpg highway or city. I'll respond with a long trip pulling the boat after this coming memorial day weekend. It will be the first long distance pull. I think I'll just hit 6kmiles this weekend too. So she's maybe not quite broken in just yet either. But I guess I didn't buy it for the mileage.

Titan got 12mpg towing the boat at 65-70mph with the cruise on and A/C cranked. (it was hott!) So I'm pretty pleased over all. Confirmed the love for the Titan.