PDA

View Full Version : waterski


bcampbe7
07-28-2004, 09:56 PM
I am fairly new to slalom sking and was wondering what the terminology for the horizontal fin that screws into the main fin. Here is a picture. One side got bent during shipment and I was wanting to see if I could get a new one.

stevo137
07-28-2004, 10:06 PM
BC,
That is called the spoiler.
I like mine at close to 0 degrees or neutral.
Everyone is different though and so are skis.
One small adjustment can make a big difference.
There are some good posts regarding this subject in the old forum.

bcampbe7
07-28-2004, 10:10 PM
Thanks Stevo...
I wanted to be sure I told the guy exactly what I needed.

BriEOD
07-28-2004, 10:16 PM
Beau,

It is called a spoiler. When you complete the turn and start to pull back through, the spoiler pulls the back of the ski down into the water.

I recommend, unless you're really a serious course skier, that's pretty good, just remove it. If your just intermediate-beginner you don't need it. I took mine off.

bcampbe7
07-28-2004, 10:37 PM
OK cool, so I don't need it...
When I get my bindings in I will try it without it. :D

stevo137
07-28-2004, 10:47 PM
Brian,
I have seen your pics. IMO, you should put it back on and see what happens.

BriEOD
07-28-2004, 11:04 PM
Beau, nope I don't think you need it. I don't use it, most of the guys at my level and a little better that I've skied with don't use it either. Just my opinion.

Steveo,
I'm still trying to "feel" out a ski I have, maybe when I get a little better.

Mr. Incredible
07-28-2004, 11:12 PM
In slalom circles, it's typically know as the wing and the "set up" is known as wing angle.....

Bob

stevo137
07-28-2004, 11:13 PM
That's fine. It would be interesting to try it at neutral anyway just to see what happens. How long since you have had the ski and since you took it off?

DanC
07-29-2004, 03:04 AM
It's called a wing. It is pretty well established that you should not use one unless you already have good to very good form. It's main advantage (and genisis) is the braking effect it has during the deceleration phase going into the turn. With the wing you can break at the hips and use what we call "poopy pants" and still get good deceleration. Using the wing for deceleration instead of good body postion and good ski attitude will eventually limit your progress. Most "experts" I have been around don't recommend using a wing until you get to at least 22' off. A lot of people get fooled into using one because they immediately see an improvement (because it does help deceleration and holds the ski in the turn) but it comes with worsening form.

bradamerry
07-29-2004, 10:24 AM
So, if we ski worse than Brian, which I do, just take the flipping thing off??? Farmer Ted and I both free ski at 22' off, but we need to take the flipping thing off, right? :confused:

east tx skier
07-29-2004, 11:45 AM
I also refer to it as the wing. When we first saw them as kids, we called it the cheater. In many circles, the rule of thumb is that you should just take it off until you're running 28off or shorter.

However, there is an alternative. The wing has two functions, as mentioned above. One is deceleration in the preturn, i.e., when you release your edge and begin your turn around the bouy. The other is getting your ski tail down in the water.

What was recommended to me at ski school was not to remove it, but rather to flip it. This is what I remember them telling me. Someone correct me if I've got it backwards. When right side up, the foil is higher on the fin and acts more toward putting the ski tail in the water. But when flipped, the preturn braking function is dominant.

I run mine flipped at approximately 7 degrees up. I don't think running it neutral or flat equates to it not being there at all. Your ski tail is never flat in the water. I played with a couple of settings and found one that worked well for me. Again, just my somewhat informed $.02.

DanC
07-29-2004, 01:23 PM
Everybody is different. The main thing is to not let using the wing become a crutch and lead to bad form in the preturn.
I don't think there is really a neutral postion for the wing. As Doug pointed out the ski attitude changes constantly from preturn, to turn, to edging.... In fact, if you make the wing parallel to the bottom of the ski, it will lift the tail of the ski :eek:

Mr. Incredible
07-29-2004, 11:28 PM
DanC, you are right on the mark with the explanation!

Bob

stevo137
07-29-2004, 11:49 PM
My KD 7000 spoiler was at 5 degrees from the factory. To me, it was slow in all aspects. When I changed it to 0, the speed increased dramatically. I might try it without it and see what happens.

89PROSTAR
08-04-2004, 04:49 PM
I noticed that the wing made it harder for my ski to keep up after the turn. I was reall breaking at the waste waiting for my ski to come out of the turn. I took the wing off and the ski made the turn with me. Thats sking at 15' off at 33-34mph. I'm certainly no expert that's just me. Nobody likes "poopy pants" :eek:

betsy&david Harrison
08-12-2004, 02:26 AM
I'm with Dan on this one. Dump it until your can run the course at 22 off at your designated speed...34 or 36. I'm getting close and have been skiing a long time..hate to admit that sometimes. B