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mzimme
02-02-2015, 05:34 PM
Saw this... had me wonder:

edit - looks like Supra is the new sponsor. Wonder whats up?

http://us1.campaign-archive1.com/?u=a8e01e206bf7bb07c531ae976&id=f61580d779


https://fbcdn-sphotos-d-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-prn2/v/t1.0-9/10151801_10152588562540614_8073532743357516362_n.j pg?oh=dc6f9b43566aeb17f4104e541c790a51&oe=55646E2B&__gda__=1432947624_afc17c2ad0dc02202906eb818d01f46 f

snork
02-02-2015, 05:45 PM
Nope, PWT has nothing to do with wakesurfing

mzimme
02-02-2015, 05:48 PM
Nope, PWT has nothing to do with wakesurfing

Well, you're wrong. MC's out... Supra's in. 8p

Turns out Supra's making a pretty nice boat these days!

lashburn1
02-02-2015, 06:02 PM
Well, you're wrong. MC's out... Supra's in. 8p

Turns out Supra's making a pretty nice boat these days!

PWT is not a WakeSurfing event? right?
I think he is suggesting MC is following there new buyer base and that is no longer dominated by people WakeBoarding...

mzimme
02-02-2015, 06:03 PM
PWT is not a WakeSurfing event? right?
I think he is suggesting MC is following there new buyer base and that is no longer dominated by people WakeBoarding...

Ahhhh.... I thought he meant Supra only makes surf boats hahah.

swatguy
02-02-2015, 06:15 PM
Mc cut their relationship at the end of last season w the PWT in search of " bigger and better things"

scott023
02-02-2015, 06:25 PM
That's a very nice looking Supra.

mzimme
02-02-2015, 06:27 PM
That's a very nice looking Supra.

Yeah, their new line looks good. That's the SE550 (24 footer). 6.2L Supercharged 550hp Raptor motor. :D

Droooool.

ATLX30
02-02-2015, 06:59 PM
Nope, PWT has nothing to do with wakesurfing

:uglyhamme

Mastercraftdave
02-02-2015, 07:19 PM
I think if the pro tour was beneficial for MC they would still be involved. The way the sport is going these days the pro tour doesn't generate the revenue and exposure as it did in the past.

Supra will do anything to get in the big three.

2RLAKE
02-02-2015, 08:01 PM
well good for Supra ... they make a good boat and i thoroughly enjoyed my two ... i always remember their motto of luxury ski boats and they were. Dan Miller and the gang there must be excited

dt37803
02-02-2015, 08:02 PM
Here is the news brief from last fall
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MasterCraft Withdraws Sponsorship of the Pro Wakeboard Tour
MasterCraft Boat Company announced today it has chosen to withdraw its sponsorship of the 2015 Pro Wakeboard Tour season, opting out of the final year of its contract with World Sports and Marketing, the event-marketing firm that activates the PWT. MasterCraft and World Sports & Marketing have over 25 years of bringing pro watersports and its pro athletes to fans all over the country. However due to the ever changing landscape of wakeboarding, event marketing, athlete and fan expectations, MasterCraft has chosen to move forward with a new direction for the 2015 summer season.

“MasterCraft thanks the team at World Sports for over 25 years of making the Pro Tour such a highly regarded event,” said Aarne Clow, MasterCraft team and event manager. “Despite our wonderful history, there have been so many changes to the wake scene over the last few years that have resulted in the slow decline of attendance and participation, we felt it was the right time to go back to the drawing board, work with our team of world class athletes and deliver a different experience for 2015 and beyond.”

While details of MasterCraft’s forthcoming event is still under lock and key, its goal remains to bring a premium experience that progresses and exposes the sport, improves the life of the athlete and rejuvenates the fans of wake sports. More information will be coming out in the early spring of 2015.

bturner2
02-03-2015, 07:07 AM
Probably a good time to pull out. The edgy look/feel of wakeboarding that you could somehow feel a part of has left the building. What was once a sport it's fan base could relate/aspire to has evolved into a contest of moves only the gifted can compete in. Line lengths are longer, speeds are higher and the falls are just too painful for the everyday weekend warrior too deal with.

In their quest to take the sport to new heights they've alienated the very fan base that built the sport. I see it sort of like NASCAR with the "race it on Sunday and sell it on Monday" mentality. When the cars stopped looking like what you could buy in the showroom the brand loyalty and fan base started to erode. Worse yet for the manufactures customers stopped going to the showrooms on Monday. I remember going to the tour, watching it on TV or buying videos then going out and trying to pull off the moves they were throwing the next day. A lot of the moves were achievable with practice and determination. If a board upgrade, bigger ballast bags or even a new boat could help you progress you were likely to purchase or at least dream of buying that gear. At least it worked on me. Over the course of 15 years I've had at least 4 new boards and 3 v-Drive boats.

There's not a lot of us out there that are going to go to the tour and come home and try that back double Lutz with a stale fish hambone grab that their throwing today. At least not without a visit to urgent care that afternoon. What was something that you could possible relate to has now become a pure spectator sport for most of us regardless of the boat or equipment we buy. While the X-Star is a marvel of technology in all honesty it's probably the last boat in the product line up that I personally would be looking at. IMO there are just better boats in the line up that surf better, ski better and are cheaper that would fit my lifestyle better. I feel (and I could very well be wrong) that I'm probably close to this changing target market for these very expensive boats. If that's the case then it would be very wise for MC to change with the market if they want to stay in business.

CheeseSteak1
02-03-2015, 08:54 AM
That bimini resembles what I've seen on the NXT. Can't say Im a fan...yet. Good looking boat though

snork
02-03-2015, 09:23 AM
nothing is as UGLY as the MC bimini on the NXT

willyt
02-03-2015, 10:26 AM
supra is making a nice boat... but they still have a ways to go before making it 'the big 4'. I got to check out an SE at the cincy boat show and there are things on that boat that just dont make any sense:
walk through width - i'm a small guy and i barely fit through
bow storage - there's a compartment under the pickle that isnt for an anchor, isnt for a cooler, probably too small to fit life jackets, and just doesnt make any sense.

i would however, like to check out the wake on one..

Rebel Skier
02-03-2015, 10:33 AM
Just my opinion, and I am maybe an old geezer that needs to get a clue, but to be a real water sports contender you still need to make a 3 event boat.

Supra and Mooba, Skiers Choice, do not have one in their lineup.

mzimme
02-03-2015, 10:45 AM
Just my opinion, and I am maybe an old geezer that needs to get a clue, but to be a real water sports contender you still need to make a 3 event boat.

Supra and Mooba, Skiers Choice, do not have one in their lineup.

A slalom tug would be cool, but I'm sure the numbers just don't make sense. From what I hear, the SA's wake flattens out pretty nicely at speed with some weight in the front. I'm sure it's nothing like the prostar or any other DD boat, but it gives some rec skiers pleasure.

bobx1
02-03-2015, 11:18 AM
That's a very nice looking Supra.

Yes, but my OCD would have cleaned the tires prior to the photo shoot.

CantRepeat
02-03-2015, 11:38 AM
They needed someone to pick up the sponsorship since MC dumped them.

scott023
02-03-2015, 12:00 PM
Yes, but my OCD would have cleaned the tires prior to the photo shoot.

That might be a bit over the top. :D

lashburn1
02-03-2015, 12:28 PM
Yes, but my OCD would have cleaned the tires prior to the photo shoot.

i thought is was Snow from a Frozen Lake? Did I get that wrong?? :confused:

mzimme
02-03-2015, 12:29 PM
The random guy walking around in the background cracks me up... What ya doin guy?

scott023
02-03-2015, 12:41 PM
i thought is was Snow from a Frozen Lake? Did I get that wrong?? :confused:

No, that's not snow. Most certainly sand.

The random guy walking around in the background cracks me up... What ya doin guy?

I don't think that's a random guy... thinks he's a plant for the pic.

lashburn1
02-03-2015, 12:42 PM
Saw this... had me wonder:

edit - looks like Supra is the new sponsor. Wonder whats up?

http://us1.campaign-archive1.com/?u=a8e01e206bf7bb07c531ae976&id=f61580d779


https://fbcdn-sphotos-d-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-prn2/v/t1.0-9/10151801_10152588562540614_8073532743357516362_n.j pg?oh=dc6f9b43566aeb17f4104e541c790a51&oe=55646E2B&__gda__=1432947624_afc17c2ad0dc02202906eb818d01f46 f

I like the LOOK of this Boat...but when i went to the WeBsite to "build" a boat they started at $110-115k... ?
Unless there is Massive wiggle room, I could not see buying this over an MC X-30 X-23

This boat would need to come in at $90k Loaded on a Trailer out the door..to begin jarring my interest....
Am I missing something here..?

scott023
02-03-2015, 12:45 PM
I like the LOOK of this Boat...but when i went to the WeBsite to "build" a boat they started at $110-115k... ?
Unless there is Massive wiggle room, I could not see buying this over an MC X-30 X-23

This boat would need to come in at $90k Loaded on a Trailer out the door..to begin jarring my interest....
Am I missing something here..?

Tige is in that price range as well. Just had a good friend buy one of them and I was surprised by the price tag.

lashburn1
02-03-2015, 12:47 PM
I like the LOOK of this Boat...but when i went to the WeBsite to "build" a boat they started at $110-115k... ?
Unless there is Massive wiggle room, I could not see buying this over an MC X-30 X-23

This boat would need to come in at $90k Loaded on a Trailer out the door..to begin jarring my interest....
Am I missing something here..?

..

ALSO there is ONE DEALER 300 Mi From me... I guess this boat was not an option anyway...
I withdraw my above comments

MC25
02-03-2015, 12:48 PM
Wonder if this thread will get locked soon

mzimme
02-03-2015, 12:51 PM
I like the LOOK of this Boat...but when i went to the WeBsite to "build" a boat they started at $110-115k... ?
Unless there is Massive wiggle room, I could not see buying this over an MC X-30 X-23

This boat would need to come in at $90k Loaded on a Trailer out the door..to begin jarring my interest....
Am I missing something here..?

110-115 is about what an SE550 would run after negotiations. Pretty good for 24 footer IMO.

mzimme
02-03-2015, 12:52 PM
Wonder if this thread will get locked soon

Hope not... I was genuinely curious since I didn't see their press release on the most ignored portion of this forum.

lashburn1
02-03-2015, 01:06 PM
110-115 is about what an SE550 would run after negotiations. Pretty good for 24 footer IMO.

pretty good for a an MC or BU...

but for that particular boat...$90 k would need to be the #

swatguy
02-03-2015, 01:22 PM
Supra without a doubt is trying to reach the top tier of boats. Their new designs are pushing the envelope and I don't think you can argue against the fact that their wakes are definitely on par with the big boys. They seem to be the boat trying to get there the most. I thought Tige was going to take a run with the ASR but it just isn't there.


What do you think is holding them back from being considered a top tier boat??? Their final product is 10 fold what it used to be. The materials and accessories are all of the same quality as other top tier mfg's.

lashburn1
02-03-2015, 01:24 PM
I just got an email from them (SUPRA)
they just branched to a dealer an hour from Me , same as MC..
I shall go take a peek up close when they come in...
I hold off judgment until then..

captain planet
02-03-2015, 01:34 PM
Saw this... had me wonder:

edit - looks like Supra is the new sponsor. Wonder whats up?

http://us1.campaign-archive1.com/?u=a8e01e206bf7bb07c531ae976&id=f61580d779


https://fbcdn-sphotos-d-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-prn2/v/t1.0-9/10151801_10152588562540614_8073532743357516362_n.j pg?oh=dc6f9b43566aeb17f4104e541c790a51&oe=55646E2B&__gda__=1432947624_afc17c2ad0dc02202906eb818d01f46 f

....that makes me wonder as well.....is there enough fiberglass in that hull to make it heavy enough to warrant a triple-axle trailer??? :confused:

mzimme
02-03-2015, 01:37 PM
....that makes me wonder as well.....is there enough fiberglass in that hull to make it heavy enough to warrant a triple-axle trailer??? :confused:

Doubt it. It's a "bling" thing broseph.

lashburn1
02-03-2015, 01:44 PM
Doubt it. It's a "bling" thing broseph.

CORRECt.. Dual Axle trailer can carry much more (X-80)
However..I like the look of a Pimped out triple axle ..LOL

scott023
02-03-2015, 02:09 PM
CORRECt.. Dual Axle trailer can carry much more (X-80)
However..I like the look of a Pimped out triple axle ..LOL

I don't like the looks of the bill to replace all seven tires though. Ouch

CantRepeat
02-03-2015, 02:51 PM
Hey if you build crappy boats you can always bling up the trailer, right?

mzimme
02-03-2015, 03:08 PM
Hey if you build crappy boats you can always bling up the trailer, right?

lulz. such a homer if you think SC boats are "crappy".

CantRepeat
02-03-2015, 03:15 PM
lulz. such a homer if you think SC boats are "crappy".

Just like you to think I was talking about a specific brand when I was just talking about overly blinged trailers. You're such a homer!! :D:D:D

scott023
02-03-2015, 03:16 PM
lulz. such a homer if you think SC boats are "crappy".

I don't think Supra has ever made crappy boats. May not have been tier 1 boats, but certainly not crappy.

CantRepeat
02-03-2015, 03:28 PM
I don't think Supra has ever made crappy boats. May not have been tier 1 boats, but certainly not crappy.

Easy now, he's already a little salty and now you say his boat isn't a tier 1 boat he may just snap! :D

For the record, we know ALL boat manufactures make up for short-comings with blinged out crap.

scott023
02-03-2015, 03:40 PM
Easy now, he's already a little salty and now you say his boat isn't a tier 1 boat he may just snap! :D

For the record, we know ALL boat manufactures make up for short-comings with blinged out crap.

HA. That's why I put the "may not HAVE been". Left it open for your own opinion. :D

CruisinGA
02-03-2015, 06:47 PM
Transom on that boat looks like a 90's maristar and the lines down the side look like the 240sc.

Almost there

mzimme
02-04-2015, 09:46 AM
Just like you to think I was talking about a specific brand when I was just talking about overly blinged trailers. You're such a homer!! :D:D:D

You realize I have an MC banner hanging over my boat right? Love the MC's, and would sell mine in a second for one if the right deal came up.

You specifically say "when you make a crappy boat, just bling out the trailer!" and then say you're not talking about the boat? I guess boatmate trailers suck now too? I'm confused on what you actually meant by that apparently. You take your meds today?

I think you're still mad about some MC t-shirts.

kvw4x4
02-05-2015, 01:43 AM
I rode behind this boat. One of The first new model supra's off the line. A monster boat. It was the 450 tho. And struggled to keep speed loaded up wakeboarding. The wake was nothing special our x15 with 3k lbs has a nicer wake. It did have a huge wake surf wave. But that's not what I was looking for. The 550 with good options goes for $120k-$125k. The super charged small block would make me nervous more things to go wrong. Nice boat tho.

Mastercraftdave
02-05-2015, 08:43 AM
I would never pay over 100K for a Supra. People can say what they want about them being good now but they have a long history of being a second/third tier boats. I like how they make new models and them automatically step them up in price to a X23 and G23. They look nice but they aren't even in the same class as MC/CC yet they demand that kind of price..

mzimme
02-05-2015, 09:30 AM
I would never pay over 100K for a Supra. People can say what they want about them being good now but they have a long history of being a second/third tier boats. I like how they make new models and them automatically step them up in price to a X23 and G23. They look nice but they aren't even in the same class as MC/CC yet they demand that kind of price..

SE550 = $115,000
G23 = $140,000
X23 = $130,000

FourFourty
02-05-2015, 10:03 AM
SE550 = $115,000 Would have to be pretty stripped
G23 = $140,000 Loaded
X23 = $130,000 Loaded

The SE is cheaper, but not THAT much cheaper. Heck, 115k is the BASE MSRP for the SE 450......125k Base for the SE 550. That is with no options at all.... Add Swell, ballast bags, board racks, bimini, stereo, etc. etc... And you are easily hitting a mid 150k to 160k MSRP. After a typical Discount, you are looking at 125k sale price.

It is pretty darn close on price. The MSRP spread might be a bit more than that, however, Supra runs on a narrower margin gap than MC, Bu, and CC. And they always have.

At a 20% discount (Which is really good on a new Supra) from MSRP on the SE 550, my local dealer was only $3200.00 cheaper than the X23 that I ordered. Spec'd exactly the same, except that the Supra obviously had the 6.2SC, and the X23 has the 7.4l.

With all of that said, the G23 and X23 are 23'ers not 24'. Although, the G feels just as big (if not bigger) inside, as the SE. And the G also has WAY more storage. The X23 feels almost as big inside, and also has more storage because you lose the entire bow storage in the SE, and the cavern storage is about half the size of the X23.

Supra is catching up in leaps and bounds. They are making one heck of a boat these days, but they are charging for it.

mzimme
02-05-2015, 10:24 AM
The SE is cheaper, but not THAT much cheaper. Heck, 115k is the BASE MSRP for the SE 450......125k Base for the SE 550. That is with no options at all.... Add Swell, ballast bags, board racks, bimini, stereo, etc. etc... And you are easily hitting a mid 150k to 160k MSRP. After a typical Discount, you are looking at 125k sale price.

It is pretty darn close on price. The MSRP spread might be a bit more than that, however, Supra runs on a narrower margin gap than MC, Bu, and CC. And they always have.

At a 20% discount (Which is really good on a new Supra) from MSRP on the SE 550, my local dealer was only $3200.00 cheaper than the X23 that I ordered. Spec'd exactly the same, except that the Supra obviously had the 6.2SC, and the X23 has the 7.4l.

With all of that said, the G23 and X23 are 23'ers not 24'. Although, the G feels just as big (if not bigger) inside, as the SE. And the G also has WAY more storage. The X23 feels almost as big inside, and also has more storage because you lose the entire bow storage in the SE, and the cavern storage is about half the size of the X23.

Supra is catching up in leaps and bounds. They are making one heck of a boat these days, but they are charging for it.

I'm not arguing that Supra is on the same level at all... because they're not, and despite what our old creepy friend Tim thinks, I don't care about what "level" supra currently is at. They are a well made boat, however, and their fit and finish is above many other in the luxury towboat segment as well... so I guess it just kind of comes down to personal preference on a lot of things. If it were me, and I was debating between an X23 and an SE450/550, It would be a very hard decision. There's other things that would go into that decision, like support for the product. This website is an incredible resource, and there are plenty of places to find MC parts. I can't find a cockpit cover for my boat from 2006... so there's that.

I'd probably lean toward the MC, even as the more expensive option if I had the choice, but I don't think it takes away from the fact that Supra is offering a pretty comparable product these days. I actually love the look in the water that those boats have. They're low slung and menacing looking IMO. MC's just have a more conservative look to them, which is nice because they look like they could be a brand new design 20 years down the road if taken care of.

The boat we should really be comparing is the SG450/550... as that's their new boat in the 23 foot class. I don't know prices on that, however, and cant build one yet on Supra's website.

CantRepeat
02-05-2015, 10:36 AM
I'm not arguing that Supra is on the same level at all... because they're not, and despite what our old creepy friend Tim thinks, I don't care about what "level" supra currently is at. They are a well made boat, however, and their fit and finish is above many other in the luxury towboat segment as well... so I guess it just kind of comes down to personal preference on a lot of things. If it were me, and I was debating between an X23 and an SE450/550, It would be a very hard decision. There's other things that would go into that decision, like support for the product. This website is an incredible resource, and there are plenty of places to find MC parts. I can't find a cockpit cover for my boat from 2006... so there's that.

I'd probably lean toward the MC, even as the more expensive option if I had the choice, but I don't think it takes away from the fact that Supra is offering a pretty comparable product these days. I actually love the look in the water that those boats have. They're low slung and menacing looking IMO. MC's just have a more conservative look to them, which is nice because they look like they could be a brand new design 20 years down the road if taken care of.

The boat we should really be comparing is the SG450/550... as that's their new boat in the 23 foot class. I don't know prices on that, however, and cant build one yet on Supra's website.

Let me know when you get over it, Mike.

FourFourty
02-05-2015, 12:59 PM
Totally agree, Mzimmie. :toast:

lashburn1
02-05-2015, 04:13 PM
The SE is cheaper, but not THAT much cheaper. Heck, 115k is the BASE MSRP for the SE 450......125k Base for the SE 550. That is with no options at all.... Add Swell, ballast bags, board racks, bimini, stereo, etc. etc... And you are easily hitting a mid 150k to 160k MSRP. After a typical Discount, you are looking at 125k sale price.

It is pretty darn close on price. The MSRP spread might be a bit more than that, however, Supra runs on a narrower margin gap than MC, Bu, and CC. And they always have.

At a 20% discount (Which is really good on a new Supra) from MSRP on the SE 550, my local dealer was only $3200.00 cheaper than the X23 that I ordered. Spec'd exactly the same, except that the Supra obviously had the 6.2SC, and the X23 has the 7.4l.

With all of that said, the G23 and X23 are 23'ers not 24'. Although, the G feels just as big (if not bigger) inside, as the SE. And the G also has WAY more storage. The X23 feels almost as big inside, and also has more storage because you lose the entire bow storage in the SE, and the cavern storage is about half the size of the X23.

Supra is catching up in leaps and bounds. They are making one heck of a boat these days, but they are charging for it.

"They are making one heck of a boat these days, but they are charging for it."

Just got MSRP for an SE550 loaded from our NEW Dealer in SOCAL
$150,000.00 + $2k Frieght $1500 prep.... Inclided a Pimp 3 axle trailer.....

After discount maybe $125k ?? sound right??
That is WAY to close to an X-23 on a Trailer after negotiations??

bturner2
02-05-2015, 04:20 PM
You guys all lost me a $60K. Looks like it's the used MC market for this guy, for ever.

The crazy part is when you get in your 50s, go to a boat show and the salesman try's to hook you by offering a 25 year note on the boat. And to think that baby could be all mine when I'm 80.......

mzimme
02-05-2015, 04:43 PM
You guys all lost me a $60K. Looks like it's the used MC market for this guy, for ever.

The crazy part is when you get in your 50s, go to a boat show and the salesman try's to hook you by offering a 25 year note on the boat. And to think that baby could be all mine when I'm 80.......

Just wait til you retire and social security kicks in. You'll be dropping half you benefits towards your boat payment for the first 15 years of collecting it! hahaha

MC25
02-05-2015, 04:48 PM
"They are making one heck of a boat these days, but they are charging for it."

Just got MSRP for an SE550 loaded from our NEW Dealer in SOCAL
$150,000.00 + $2k Frieght $1500 prep.... Inclided a Pimp 3 axle trailer.....

After discount maybe $125k ?? sound right??
That is WAY to close to an X-23 on a Trailer after negotiations??

SE is a 24ft boat. the X23 with the 7.4 on a custom triple axle would be 150+ "discounted"

lashburn1
02-05-2015, 04:54 PM
SE is a 24ft boat. the X23 with the 7.4 on a custom triple axle would be 150+ "discounted"

Lets Just say your closer to right than Me...
Im Not dropping $125 on a Supra Loaded, when MY local MC dealer has an X-23 in stock for the same $$$

Mastercraftdave
02-05-2015, 04:59 PM
"They are making one heck of a boat these days, but they are charging for it."

Just got MSRP for an SE550 loaded from our NEW Dealer in SOCAL
$150,000.00 + $2k Frieght $1500 prep.... Inclided a Pimp 3 axle trailer.....

After discount maybe $125k ?? sound right??
That is WAY to close to an X-23 on a Trailer after negotiations??

Thats pretty close to where I am with an X23 SS with a 6.2 OPS. I'm also getting wetsounds tower speakers with my boat. My dealer is taking care of me and that's why he is great..

SE is a 24ft boat. the X23 with the 7.4 on a custom triple axle would be 150+ "discounted"

you can get that boat for less than 150K. Its a foot larger but not even close to MC when it comes to fit/finish and resale. Supra builds these new boats and automatically puts a 100K+ price tag. To me that is crazy.

That would be equivalent to Chevy designing a luxury car and charge as much as a Mercedes. It just doesn't work like that.....

lashburn1
02-05-2015, 05:19 PM
Thats pretty close to where I am with an X23 SS with a 6.2 OPS. I'm also getting wetsounds tower speakers with my boat. My dealer is taking care of me and that's why he is great..



you can get that boat for less than 150K. Its a foot larger but not even close to MC when it comes to fit/finish and resale. Supra builds these new boats and automatically puts a 100K+ price tag. To me that is crazy.

That would be equivalent to Chevy designing a luxury car and charge as much as a Mercedes. It just doesn't work like that.....

It just doesn't work like that....

I have to agree...
MC -X-23 Base + Trailer + 6.2 = $125,000
Supra SE450 = $115,000 (includes a trailer and 6.2)
There are many factors and options to consider ...of course
But in this case for $10k ...I'll take the MC

Infact IN MY CASE , I would stay with the 5.7 for $115,000.00 as we surf and cruise only.

ARIC, I realize this is not the boat or price point you are getting...and yours sounds and looks like a great deal..
this a whole diff conversation..

mzimme
02-05-2015, 05:32 PM
Ok... so just for giggles... since we are comparing a 24 foot boat, to a 22'9" (X23), lets flip it around and go with the smaller model of Supra in the SA450, at 22' 6", so only 3" shorter rather than over a foot longer (regarding the supra).

Just priced one of those, with 6.2L, loaded, and pimped out trailer, and it came in at 123k MSRP. Figure 20% off, and you're at $98,400.

So, is 3" of length, and the MC brand now worth an extra 20k to you? I think the SA is more comparable to an SE. And the SG would be a direct comparison, but we don't have prices on it. I'd guess its somewhere in the middle though, say 135-140k MSRP, which would bring it in around $108k after negotiating (pure guess here).

At those price points, the Supra can make a case IMO. I completely agree, paying top dollar on an apples to apples comparison, MC wins for me. But we haven't been comparing apples to apples with the SE compared to an X23. The SA/SG is close to apples to apples here.

MC25
02-05-2015, 05:40 PM
It just doesn't work like that....

I have to agree...
MC -X-23 Base + Trailer + 6.2 = $125,000
Supra SE450 = $115,000 (includes a trailer and 6.2)
There are many factors and options to consider ...of course
But in this case for $10k ...I'll take the MC

Infact IN MY CASE , I would stay with the 5.7 for $115,000.00 as we surf and cruise only.

ARIC, I realize this is not the boat or price point you are getting...and yours sounds and looks like a great deal..
this a whole diff conversation..

I decided against the moomba.. Lol. I encourage you to go check out the supras though. Not an mc for sure, but nice. All boats are to expensive

Mastercraftdave
02-05-2015, 05:40 PM
It just doesn't work like that....

I have to agree...
MC -X-23 Base + Trailer + 6.2 = $125,000
Supra SE450 = $115,000 (includes a trailer and 6.2)
There are many factors and options to consider ...of course
But in this case for $10k ...I'll take the MC

Infact IN MY CASE , I would stay with the 5.7 for $115,000.00 as we surf and cruise only.


I think you are on point with taking a MC for 10K over a supra. I would think that the lowest engine I would put on this boat would be a 6.0 which would get you some interested buyers when you are ready to sell. People laugh at the Mastercraft people for paying what we pay yet Im sitting here laughing at them for paying that much for a Supra.

Mastercraftdave
02-05-2015, 05:41 PM
I decided against the moomba.. Lol. I encourage you to go check out the supras though. Not an mc for sure, but nice. All boats are to expensive

wait what happen with the Moomba?????

mzimme
02-05-2015, 05:44 PM
I think you are on point with taking a MC for 10K over a supra. I would think that the lowest engine I would put on this boat would be a 6.0 which would get you some interested buyers when you are ready to sell. People laugh at the Mastercraft people for paying what we pay yet Im sitting here laughing at them for paying that much for a Supra.

People laugh because they can't afford it. Hell, I can't afford it (yet), but I recognize that there is a difference in quality between an MC and some other brands. That gap is getting smaller, however.... IMO of course.

lashburn1
02-05-2015, 05:48 PM
Ok... so just for giggles... since we are comparing a 24 foot boat, to a 22'9" (X23), lets flip it around and go with the smaller model of Supra in the SA450, at 22' 6", so only 3" shorter rather than over a foot longer (regarding the supra).

Just priced one of those, with 6.2L, loaded, and pimped out trailer, and it came in at 123k MSRP. Figure 20% off, and you're at $98,400.

So, is 3" of length, and the MC brand now worth an extra 20k to you? I think the SA is more comparable to an SE. And the SG would be a direct comparison, but we don't have prices on it. I'd guess its somewhere in the middle though, say 135-140k MSRP, which would bring it in around $108k after negotiating (pure guess here).

At those price points, the Supra can make a case IMO. I completely agree, paying top dollar on an apples to apples comparison, MC wins for me. But we haven't been comparing apples to apples with the SE compared to an X23. The SA/SG is close to apples to apples here.

If you are JUST comparing length..this would be a $10,000 swing... I could see that..hard to do real apples here.
This is a case of you MAY get what you pay for...or you MAY pay to much

lashburn1
02-05-2015, 05:50 PM
I decided against the moomba.. Lol. I encourage you to go check out the supras though. Not an mc for sure, but nice. All boats are to expensive

All boats are to expensive

when will I realize this

Mastercraftdave
02-05-2015, 05:54 PM
Ok... so just for giggles... since we are comparing a 24 foot boat, to a 22'9" (X23), lets flip it around and go with the smaller model of Supra in the SA450, at 22' 6", so only 3" shorter rather than over a foot longer (regarding the supra).

Just priced one of those, with 6.2L, loaded, and pimped out trailer, and it came in at 123k MSRP. Figure 20% off, and you're at $98,400.

So, is 3" of length, and the MC brand now worth an extra 20k to you? I think the SA is more comparable to an SE. And the SG would be a direct comparison, but we don't have prices on it. I'd guess its somewhere in the middle though, say 135-140k MSRP, which would bring it in around $108k after negotiating (pure guess here).

At those price points, the Supra can make a case IMO. I completely agree, paying top dollar on an apples to apples comparison, MC wins for me. But we haven't been comparing apples to apples with the SE compared to an X23. The SA/SG is close to apples to apples here.

I think it was said earlier that you wont expect to get that much off of a supra. I honestly have no clue as I never gave them that much looking into as there is no dealer in my area. It was either MC or Malibu in South Louisiana, well there is Tige now but talking to the dealer (who is a motorbike shop) they don't know anything about them. I started asking questions and from my little bit of research I was telling them about the boat. All he could tell me about was the speakers.....

mzimme
02-05-2015, 05:59 PM
I think it was said earlier that you wont expect to get that much off of a supra. I honestly have no clue as I never gave them that much looking into as there is no dealer in my area. It was either MC or Malibu in South Louisiana, well there is Tige now but talking to the dealer (who is a motorbike shop) they don't know anything about them. I started asking questions and from my little bit of research I was telling them about the boat. All he could tell me about was the speakers.....

HAHA... good selling point.

"Well, not sure about the motor, but the stereo can be heard 300 ft away!"

AlbertaSurfer
02-05-2015, 06:04 PM
If a person is spending over $100K on a boat, or any amount for that matter, get whatever you want. The $10-$30K price difference only matters if you consider not buying a MasterCraft "settling".

I'd say the boats everyone builds are nice, and peoples tastes will pull them in whatever direction, but who cares what other's think is "better". Skiers Choice boats are built the with the same hand laid fiberglass and attention to detail as anyone else. I'm sure Supra jumped on the vacant PWT slot to floss their new boats, and I'm sure it will help sales, even with the interest in wakeboarding getting smaller all the time.

If you don't think the Supra is a good buy, don't buy it...

Mastercraftdave
02-05-2015, 06:05 PM
HAHA... good selling point.

"Well, not sure about the motor, but the stereo can be heard 300 ft away!"

That what he was telling me. Then I realized they were the wetsounds ICON8s and I started laughing. My wife told me I was rude to the guy.

I went there to look at a 4wheeler and he noticed my MC sticker on my truck. That's when he proceeded to tell me about the Tige and the STEREO. He said Tige was better than MC overall. So I played his game and talked price for ****s/giggles and he wasn't coming much off of MSRP for a RZ4 and wouldn't give me much for my MC as he said the X45 isn't a popular model.

Needless to say I'm not buying anything from this guy....:D

MC25
02-05-2015, 06:10 PM
wait what happen with the Moomba?????

I don't want a moomba haha. For a 22ft boat the wakes weren't what I wanted.

lashburn1
02-05-2015, 06:23 PM
I don't want a moomba haha. For a 22ft boat the wakes weren't what I wanted.

there will ALWAYs be another Boat

lashburn1
02-05-2015, 06:28 PM
That what he was telling me. Then I realized they were the wetsounds ICON8s and I started laughing. My wife told me I was rude to the guy.

I went there to look at a 4wheeler and he noticed my MC sticker on my truck. That's when he proceeded to tell me about the Tige and the STEREO. He said Tige was better than MC overall. So I played his game and talked price for ****s/giggles and he wasn't coming much off of MSRP for a RZ4 and wouldn't give me much for my MC as he said the X45 isn't a popular model.

Needless to say I'm not buying anything from this guy....:D

I my line of work..He "Knew just enough talk to sound stupid"

MC25
02-05-2015, 06:28 PM
There already is haha. Won't disclose until I take real delivery

lashburn1
02-05-2015, 06:29 PM
There already is haha. Won't disclose until I take real delivery

...good , Idea..I did this with an X-80 ,,,I never ended up getting..LOL

Mastercraftdave
02-05-2015, 07:24 PM
There already is haha. Won't disclose until I take real delivery

So what's the new boat? You were raving about moons and ow your not getting one. What's the deal? Where's the review?

snork
02-05-2015, 08:01 PM
So what's the new boat? You were raving about moons and ow your not getting one. What's the deal? Where's the review?

no doubt, whats up aric, I didn't think you had Moomba blood in you, better peel that sticker off your truck :D
but a new boat in the works, "we'll see" and thats an exact quote from your dad
us dads know what that means

MC25
02-05-2015, 08:03 PM
So what's the new boat? You were raving about moons and ow your not getting one. What's the deal? Where's the review?

I'm officially in a certain club that floats around this forum. Budman and jersey Dave and a few others are in this club.

That sticker didn't last 8 hours lol

Mastercraftdave
02-05-2015, 08:16 PM
Star?

MC25
02-05-2015, 08:28 PM
Nope.

Mastercraftdave
02-05-2015, 08:34 PM
Nope.

Keeping quite to keep the roasting to a minimum. I see what your doing there....

MC25
02-05-2015, 08:38 PM
Well since the paperwork is finalized I guess I'll only say this-


I am now in the elusive two mc club

Mastercraftdave
02-05-2015, 08:43 PM
Pics?

MC25
02-05-2015, 08:44 PM
Not till Saturday. I'd make a thread but it would get locked

Mastercraftdave
02-05-2015, 08:48 PM
Not till Saturday. I'd make a thread but it would get locked
Why is that? I saw your other one got closed....

MC25
02-05-2015, 09:03 PM
It'd turn into the normal thread of people being jelly lol

lashburn1
02-05-2015, 09:27 PM
Well since the paperwork is finalized I guess I'll only say this-


I am now in the elusive two mc club

Can we guess?
and
Is it New/Demo
Or
Used?

dt37803
02-05-2015, 09:43 PM
Got to be wakeboat for surfing, has already got a ski boat

MC25
02-05-2015, 09:50 PM
Got to be wakeboat for surfing, has already got a ski boat

I don't surf so knock that out lol


Used

MC25
02-05-2015, 09:55 PM
It was bought from tx mc and is still in their used inventory on their website.

AlbertaSurfer
02-05-2015, 09:56 PM
I don't surf so knock that out lol


Used

You knock that off... Evvvvverrryybody loves surfing! Haven't you noticed every boat promo video shows 75% surfing?!? That's where it's at!

Mastercraftdave
02-05-2015, 10:00 PM
It's either a star or an epic

MC25
02-05-2015, 10:02 PM
It can surf well. Has the Ly6

lashburn1
02-05-2015, 10:16 PM
IF it's for ARICs needs
It's
This Boat

http://www.texasmastercraft.com/vehicle/used-2013-mastercraft-x-25-1780847.cfml?refby=dealersite#ar_top

Mastercraftdave
02-05-2015, 10:20 PM
I never pictured you as an x30 guy

lashburn1
02-05-2015, 10:22 PM
But most likely this

http://www.texasmastercraft.com/vehicle/used-2012-mastercraft-x-45-1788709.cfml?refby=dealersite#ar_top

Jayhawk
02-05-2015, 10:54 PM
Love the colors...you keeping those graphics?

Tristarboarder
02-05-2015, 11:03 PM
HA! I called it....hope it's the MB Sports.......

not really......

Welcome back :D

snork
02-05-2015, 11:04 PM
all I can say is you don't want any MC over 22' with a 6.0L weighted like you want

mzimme
02-05-2015, 11:21 PM
Some variation of 205V? That's my guess.

Tristarboarder
02-05-2015, 11:31 PM
It must be that 30......I as well figured like an earlier Xstar, maybe Bud's X1, or a 1st Gen X2.
I'm not biased or anything :D

Nice 30 though, me likey

swatguy
02-05-2015, 11:54 PM
My guess is the 11 green and black Star with the LY6........and if so that thing is dead sexy

MC25
02-06-2015, 12:11 AM
I'll keep you guys guessing until I pick it up

scott023
02-06-2015, 12:49 AM
My guess is the 11 green and black Star with the LY6........and if so that thing is dead sexy

That's got to be it... the only unit on the lot posted with an LY6.

MC25
02-06-2015, 12:51 AM
its not the 11 star. although extremely sick thats not it lol

Tristarboarder
02-06-2015, 12:53 AM
Except the X30 that states it's equipped with the LY6....

I love boring Winter pastimes we do :D

MC25
02-06-2015, 12:54 AM
Im honestly impressed my indecisive boat guessing game has gone this far on a thread that is completely unrelated to the OP haha

Wakerider16
02-06-2015, 08:39 AM
Just make a new thread with pics... Give us folks buried under snow something to look at.


Another foot coming monday =(

Mastercraftdave
02-06-2015, 08:41 AM
Just make a new thread with pics... Give us folks buried under snow something to look at.


Another foot coming monday =(
That just sounds miserable. Shoot its 40 degrees here in Louisiana and im freezing. the high for the weekend is 70

ChandlerR
02-06-2015, 08:42 AM
Im honestly impressed my indecisive boat guessing game has gone this far on a thread that is completely unrelated to the OP haha

It's winter time, even in Texas, and we all need something to do. :D

mzimme
02-06-2015, 09:13 AM
Im honestly impressed my indecisive boat guessing game has gone this far on a thread that is completely unrelated to the OP haha

I'll let you derail my thread this one time... do it again, and I'll have a problem with you again. 8p

Edit- only stipulation is that you PM me what your new boat is going to be. I can keep secrets.

willyt
02-06-2015, 09:21 AM
wow. this thread has totally gotten jacked.

aric, glad you demoed. While i think supra makes a nice boat, i havent been impressed by anything i've ridden behind/havent heard good things. Now, that is coming from a guy who slams the p!ss out of his star...

mzimme
02-06-2015, 09:28 AM
wow. this thread has totally gotten jacked.

aric, glad you demoed. While i think supra makes a nice boat, i havent been impressed by anything i've ridden behind/havent heard good things. Now, that is coming from a guy who slams the p!ss out of his star...

Not the SE... but here's a pic of the SG's wakeboard wake (geared more towards surfing).

http://www.wakeworld.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=37664&stc=1&d=1419448574

Mastercraftdave
02-06-2015, 09:41 AM
Not the SE... but here's a pic of the SG's wakeboard wake (geared more towards surfing).

http://www.wakeworld.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=37664&stc=1&d=1419448574

Man that thing needed extra ballast to look that good. I thought those boats were built that no additional ballast was needed.

mzimme
02-06-2015, 10:04 AM
Man that thing needed extra ballast to look that good. I thought those boats were built that no additional ballast was needed.

Guy that posted it on WW said he put it in there to "simulate more people". I mean, it is an empty boat, so that makes sense. 4-5 more people in there would add that weight.

Regardless, it's a pretty big wake.

scott023
02-06-2015, 10:26 AM
Except the X30 that states it's equipped with the LY6....

I love boring Winter pastimes we do :D

You're right. I missed that one. Hopefully they redo the teak platform if that's the one he got. Is looks to be in rough shape.

swatguy
02-06-2015, 11:04 AM
Apparently the 30 is it. Woulda thought that was a little dated and didn't have the maximum wake he was looking for..........that's why I went XStar instead of the 30. Dang it

swatguy
02-06-2015, 11:05 AM
Not the SE... but here's a pic of the SG's wakeboard wake (geared more towards surfing).

http://www.wakeworld.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=37664&stc=1&d=1419448574

That wake looks money I don't care if there is a sac on the floor. Even steep by Supra standards. I am drooling just a bit. Way to put this back on track Mz

Mastercraftdave
02-06-2015, 11:08 AM
the wake looks washed out to me.....

mzimme
02-06-2015, 11:10 AM
the wake looks washed out to me.....

Sure... if you ride at 105 foot line lengths.... 8p

CantRepeat
02-06-2015, 12:17 PM
the wake looks washed out to me.....

I'd be more concerned about the rooster tail. Is that a jetboat?

GoneBoatN
02-06-2015, 12:20 PM
That wake looks money I don't care if there is a sac on the floor. Even steep by Supra standards. I am drooling just a bit. Way to put this back on track Mz


++++++++++1!!!!!!!!!

That looks like a launch ramp to me! Besides who doesn't put sac's in their boat - the most boring wakes on the water and those that go and sit at "ski beach" while others are wakeboarding.

GoneBoatN
02-06-2015, 12:21 PM
I'd be more concerned about the rooster tail. Is that a jetboat?

It's what's behind the rooster tail that I crave.

lashburn1
02-08-2015, 07:10 PM
sort of...
Supra Opened a Dealer in Southern Cal (needed) and received some new Stock just this week.

Right near Lake Perris, where I was helping Scalpels shoot footage of his latest Shaper revision..
I stopped by on my way home to take a closer look.

I was interested in and only spent time in the SE450 ..they had a few others..
Pictures don't quite give a feel for size , but this is a big boat...

1st - I think they are nice looking Boats
2nd they Are very big inside and should be comped to an X-46 or 55 on interior layout and Feel.
(i had recently posted about comping to an X-23, which is unfair on the Room and size battle)

The actual material finish on the Seating is quite nice, all the stiching looks and feels well done...
The Drivers seat is actual Better than the MC, flip up Bolster great.
The Feel on your body on is quite Firm compared MasterCraft, its more like the Naughtique, not bad just not something I would NOT ask for in my cushions...
MC 2006 X-2 and 2013 X-30 were both more COMFY, softer?.... I like that..
But what you do get looks great and well fabricated.

The Lay out is Standard BIG Lounge Seating and Plenty of it.
They had a Rear Convertible seat that has one function I like more than MCs,
It converts to a Nice Drink and snack tray.(photo).. Great for Breaks at the Cove or Beach.
20+ cup holders at least...

This Thing is rated for 18 peeps!
2 Families or 4 Couples would not feel cramped on the longest of days on the River.
The Bow was Huge (photo) I sat backwards in it towards the driver, my feet were 6" from touching the other side. I am 5'10".
NO folding arm rest like MC's of this size though. Also NO Gulwing type Storage. I really like that on the MCs.

Driver and Passenger Dash are Simple and just a bit dated looking but they do the trick I guess.
The Passanger Dash grove Box is that of pre 2010 MC era... And its Nice looking Heavy Billit door just kind of Plopped open , squeaky hinge in this case too... It jus did not looked "finished"

Plenty of deep storage everywhere, Most seats had hinges, but felt a bit more flimsy than MC...
Cooler seat Door falls on your head just like MC (until now)...

Rear Sunpad engine hatch was typical 3 pc job, opened and closed fine,
Nice Raptor 6.2 under the hood (photo)

The rear of the boat (photo) Had tiered seating with Cup holders and ready grab Cooler space..
Photo show just how much more Freeboard this boat has to adjust seating height on Transom..
Pretty deep.

Swim Platform (photo)itself is very small (wake surf modified for drag)

Tower looked good and Had 4 speakers you could aim as needed.
The Wake/Surf swivel racks on this were a Bummer.Just Old rubber bands things Blah....Clamping racks are a must on a luxury Boat like this.
I think they may be an option..

Trailer was a nice Tandem standard profile wheels. Looked very nice like MC.

The MSRP on this is $130,800.00 as I saw it.
You factor what you know about the business and local taxes to figure the rest in a real world purchase.

In the end, i did not test it or Surf it.... so I won't comment.
But this a very Roomy Boat for those who entertain a lot and want to spend longs days on the water...

not to fair to compare, but if you Like the X-46 more.. A demo or 1 season model could probably be fetch for the Same $$$ .... but thats not really what we are talking about when buying brand new...

lashburn1
02-08-2015, 07:17 PM
Rear view , Swim Platform and Board racks

scott023
02-08-2015, 07:21 PM
Great write up Larry. Looks and sounds likea darn nice boat.

lashburn1
02-08-2015, 07:44 PM
Great write up Larry. Looks and sounds likea darn nice boat.

I think so Scott, I'm just not sure at what price point a buyer says..."well for a bit more I could just get an MC or..."

over $100k you start throwing $10k around like you didn't earn it...
If you are a DETAILS oriented buyer... you may spot there diff between these boats Just as you might with a Top shelf Hyundai vs a Nice Mercedes.... question , is do you care enough for the $10k ++ upcharge .

scott023
02-08-2015, 08:35 PM
I think so Scott, I'm just not sure at what price point a buyer says..."well for a bit more I could just get an MC or..."

over $100k you start throwing $10k around like you didn't earn it...
If you are a DETAILS oriented buyer... you may spot there diff between these boats Just as you might with a Top shelf Hyundai vs a Nice Mercedes.... question , is do you care enough for the $10k ++ upcharge .

You're absolutely right. Warranty only goes so far when your toy spends most of its operating season in the shop...

501s
02-08-2015, 08:42 PM
My Moomba was every bit as reliable as my MC.

snork
02-08-2015, 09:26 PM
Boatmate trailer

lashburn1
02-08-2015, 09:28 PM
My Moomba was every bit as reliable as my MC.

thats good to hear 501,
I don't know much about these boats..the older ones don't always look so great, but you never know what type of Parent it had..

I just keep wanting NON MC boats to be way cheaper (affordable) and the are not...

CantRepeat
02-08-2015, 09:33 PM
Did I just log into the Supra forums or is this the Twilight Zone?

lashburn1
02-08-2015, 09:37 PM
Did I just log into the Supra forums or is this the Twilight Zone?

Tim,
I was just getting the THREAD back where it had kind of started , which was a Supra trying to step it s game up..sponsoring Wake tour..etc..

We just got a dealer this week, so I thought I would pop in and see the product to make my own evaluations..,
Kind of fun .

AlbertaSurfer
02-08-2015, 09:48 PM
I don't think people who buy other brands sit at home, wishing they had spent more and gone with the MC. I know it's a MasterCraft forum, but theres no scientific, proven fact MasterCraft is the best. It's all personal opinion. I'm sure Supra will sell these boats to people who, *gasp* buy it on purpose!

The pics posted show the Supra to have beautiful construction and it looks like a great boat. Why is it everyone in here refuses to admit it's priced properly and will move units?

MasterCraft let the PWT go, and Supra took it, I hardly think that makes their boat inferior. Let the season play out and see how it goes, it doesn't affect anybody in here...

lashburn1
02-08-2015, 10:10 PM
I don't think people who buy other brands sit at home, wishing they had spent more and gone with the MC. I know it's a MasterCraft forum, but theres no scientific, proven fact MasterCraft is the best. It's all personal opinion. I'm sure Supra will sell these boats to people who, *gasp* buy it on purpose!

The pics posted show the Supra to have beautiful construction and it looks like a great boat. Why is it everyone in here refuses to admit it's priced properly and will move units?

MasterCraft let the PWT go, and Supra took it, I hardly think that makes their boat inferior. Let the season play out and see how it goes, it doesn't affect anybody in here...


I agree. I just WANT them to be cheaper.
They probably ARE exactly less money than the short comings I noticed.
That is to say they are equal when weighted factors are applied.

AlbertaSurfer
02-08-2015, 10:16 PM
MasterCraft pricing their boats where they do gives lisence to the other companies to price their boats higher. If MC is a top brand, and their boats are around the $150k CAD mark, it opens the doors to everyone else approaching the $100k CAD plus mark. There's some serious collusion in the boating industry...

lashburn1
02-08-2015, 10:23 PM
MasterCraft pricing their boats where they do gives lisence to the other companies to price their boats higher. If MC is a top brand, and their boats are around the $150k CAD mark, it opens the doors to everyone else approaching the $100k CAD plus mark. There's some serious collusion in the boating industry...

collusion in the boating industry...

or as we Yankees call it..."Industry"

scott023
02-08-2015, 11:21 PM
My Moomba was every bit as reliable as my MC.

I wasn't implying that the Supra, or any other boat, is less reliable. I was going to ask what the warranty was on the Supra, but apparently I decided to answer my own question in the post. Regardless of the warranty, all makes of boat can end un in the shop...

scott023
02-08-2015, 11:22 PM
MasterCraft pricing their boats where they do gives lisence to the other companies to price their boats higher. If MC is a top brand, and their boats are around the $150k CAD mark, it opens the doors to everyone else approaching the $100k CAD plus mark. There's some serious collusion in the boating industry...

Agreed, the prices of all makes are out of control.

501s
02-08-2015, 11:34 PM
They sure can Scott. My Moomba was great after 4 years and 400 hours. True we babied it, but the motor and construction was as solid as could be. I would say it was the little things (Vinyl, tower, etc..) that start to go after time.

After 2 seasons and 200 hours, my MC is showing ZERO signs of wear and has had not a single issue. It's been perfect. I would buy it again, no question.

Interestingly enough, I was talking to the guys at MMS, and this year Moomba has a 5 year bow to stern warranty similar to MC. I thought that was pretty good for a budget brand.

swatguy
02-09-2015, 12:08 AM
Interestingly enough, I was talking to the guys at MMS, and this year Moomba has a 5 year bow to stern warranty similar to MC. I thought that was pretty good for a budget brand.


Honestly is there a budget brand anymore???? Axis started there and Moomba used to be it, but both boat lines are priced right in the middle of everything. Moomba's Outback V is pretty much the only budget boat left.

The newer hull designed Moombas are priced and outfitted like Supra used to be and Supra is gunning for a Malibu / big 3 spot and priced just under. The only Axis boat under 65 k these days is the A20. The A22 and T22 are both over 65 minimally optioned with just wake necessities. The budget boat days are gone if you ask me. I think we are more realistically down to 2 tiers of boats and I put supra in the lower end of the top tier. It's MC , Nautique , Bu, and Supra. Tige I think is knocking on the door of a higher tier but it's just not there. Then you pretty much have all the other MFG. Axis is no longer the original stripped down wake boat it came out as. It has gotten some huge revamps and upgrades ultimately upping their prices. Bu is like the sleeper. They just keep chugging along under the radar still making a high quality product, but they just don't get all the talk.

GoneBoatN
02-09-2015, 12:55 AM
Honestly is there a budget brand anymore???? ...

Yes and no. Look at the price of a basic 22ft boat. Compare the price of MC vs MB. Unfortunately I don't there their are any models that are 100% apples to apples. However, take into account the F22 base engine is the 6.2 Raptor. Take into account 2800lbs of stock ballast. No doubt MC has very high end pricing leaving room for competition below with still very desirable boats.

$78k sounds like a big figure to a lot of us. But many of us grew up when gas hitting $1 a gallon was a big freaking deal. Many kids are growing up in areas where the median price of a home is over $750k, yes median! Now maybe boat prices have moved up in the scheme of things price wise but so has groceries.

It ultimately comes down to supply & demand. I don't see any new supply being created, if anything the boat industry is consolidating over the years.

mzimme
02-09-2015, 09:32 AM
Thanks Lash for the pictures. I still haven't seen one in person... we don't have a dealer here in KC anymore, closest one is down in the Ozarks, and I've yet to visit when I go there because I just want my lake time when I'm there!

Looks nice though... And agreed the SE is more comparable to an X46. The SG is Supra's 23 footer... did you notice if they had one there yet? Would have been a traditional bow 23 footer.

lashburn1
02-09-2015, 11:15 AM
Thanks Lash for the pictures. I still haven't seen one in person... we don't have a dealer here in KC anymore, closest one is down in the Ozarks, and I've yet to visit when I go there because I just want my lake time when I'm there!

Looks nice though... And agreed the SE is more comparable to an X46. The SG is Supra's 23 footer... did you notice if they had one there yet? Would have been a traditional bow 23 footer.

Mzimme,
they did have an SC400 there and 2 other Moomba Series (Mondo and Outback)
No SG yet...
I poked my nose into the other 3 but was not really interested in knowing more....
I really spent a lot of Time in the SE , opening and closing things, checking storage and finish.
I was in the Boat a good 30 minutes without a sales person slowing me down...

mzimme
02-09-2015, 11:51 AM
Mzimme,
they did have an SC400 there and 2 other Moomba Series (Mondo and Outback)
No SG yet...
I poked my nose into the other 3 but was not really interested in knowing more....
I really spent a lot of Time in the SE , opening and closing things, checking storage and finish.
I was in the Boat a good 30 minutes without a sales person slowing me down...

Yeah, the SC is the 21 footer... wouldn't really interest me either, although it is supposed to make quite a nice surf/wakeboard wake. Thanks for the review.

lashburn1
02-09-2015, 08:08 PM
...I went to Build the SE and SG boats this afternoon on there online site..
Here is something I found ODD..
The SE series is there Biggest Model ..Like an X-46 or more...PickleFork bow
The SG series is smaller lighter and less Cap... Traditional Bow

The SE comes with 450 Raptor standard
The SG comes with 400 Raptor standard

as soon as you click on the 450 Raptor option the SG become $1,140.00 MORE than its Big Brother??
interesting price structure
All other options and stands seem to be equal ..

errr???

lashburn1
02-10-2015, 11:09 AM
...I went to Build the SE and SG boats this afternoon on there online site..
Here is something I found ODD..
The SE series is there Biggest Model ..Like an X-46 or more...PickleFork bow
The SG series is smaller lighter and less Cap... Traditional Bow

The SE comes with 450 Raptor standard
The SG comes with 400 Raptor standard

as soon as you click on the 450 Raptor option the SG become $1,140.00 MORE than its Big Brother??
interesting price structure
All other options and stands seem to be equal ..

errr???

The capacities of the 2 boats were different too?? I'm I missing something??

mzimme
02-19-2015, 12:21 PM
Looks like Supra is also the official Towboat of the first Pro Wakesurf Tour. That's big news.

http://www.wakeboardingmag.com/news/2015/02/19/new-supra-boats-pro-wakesurf-tour-announced/

Mastercraftdave
02-19-2015, 12:27 PM
I guess Supra is desperate to get people to like there boats.

I would be curious to see what the wakeboarders think about this...

mzimme
02-19-2015, 12:34 PM
I guess Supra is desperate to get people to like there boats.

I would be curious to see what the wakeboarders think about this...

I don't think it would matter what name was on a boat, as any manufacturer would line up to have their brand plastered all over the pro tour. That's huge exposure. Obviously mastercraft didn't want it for wakeboarding, as they pulled out last year. Not sure if they were trying to gear more towards the surf (their boat lineup would suggest so), but looks like they're not pursuing the pro tour yet? Maybe they did, but Supra got the nod? I dunno... just reporting the news.

Wakerider16
02-19-2015, 12:35 PM
So at the boat show I got on the supra and thought it was pretty good. All the cushions and everything else felt good. Had a couple of gripes though, 1 being the sun pad layout as we always stop for swimming so those rear facing seats are a big bonus for me, as some of the wives only want to get their feet wet. My biggest gripe though was the wake plate and cruise were like car levers that felt like could be easily broken if pushed the wrong way. Not sure if that was because of the dealer choice or how all these boats go but that was kind of off putting. Didn't have a chance to fire up the helm to check out the controls for everything but that is a big thing for me (easier controls are better for my wife when she needs to drive). I would still demo a Supra to try it out but if given a choice I will put up the extra cash to go with an MC.

Got on a Moomba and had an okay feeling. Some of the stuff just looked cheap and the cushions and vinyl weren't comfortable. Also some of the finish on it felt cheap (plastic vs aluminum ect ect).

Sat down on a Malibu and that is the one I would say pretty dam close to the quality and features of the Mastercraft. Being the tech whore I am, I was impressed with the full touchscreen display on the boats. I understand electronics and water don't mix but part of me was still impressed with the simplicity of the controls as well as their joystick controller on the side which takes care of almost all the major control aspects with one hand (pretty nice).

Guy came over from the factory full of himself asking what color I want and ect ect. He then proceeded to bash Mastercraft saying Malibu outsells them by nearly double and that the NXT mold was a re-used mold from the 205V and that is the only boat worth a dam from Mastercraft (all others are crap). Told him I was in the used market as I didn't want to buy a 100k+ boat but wouldn't mind taking a look at used stuff in the 40k to 50k. He instantly tried putting me in the Axis and was baffled when I said no way, its cheap and ugly as hell. I told him I would rather by a used MC than a brand new Axis. He proceeded to tell me how much better the Axis was and at that point I walked away.

I could understand an over eager sales guy acting like that but a factory rep that spent more time bashing other boats than talking about the features of their boat... that put a bad taste in my mouth. Pushed us to sign up to demo behind a Malibu but more than likely I will not be paying a visit to them due to the experience because of that rep.

Mastercraft13
02-19-2015, 08:10 PM
So at the boat show I got on the supra and thought it was pretty good. All the cushions and everything else felt good. Had a couple of gripes though, 1 being the sun pad layout as we always stop for swimming so those rear facing seats are a big bonus for me, as some of the wives only want to get their feet wet. My biggest gripe though was the wake plate and cruise were like car levers that felt like could be easily broken if pushed the wrong way. Not sure if that was because of the dealer choice or how all these boats go but that was kind of off putting. Didn't have a chance to fire up the helm to check out the controls for everything but that is a big thing for me (easier controls are better for my wife when she needs to drive). I would still demo a Supra to try it out but if given a choice I will put up the extra cash to go with an MC.

Got on a Moomba and had an okay feeling. Some of the stuff just looked cheap and the cushions and vinyl weren't comfortable. Also some of the finish on it felt cheap (plastic vs aluminum ect ect).

Sat down on a Malibu and that is the one I would say pretty dam close to the quality and features of the Mastercraft. Being the tech whore I am, I was impressed with the full touchscreen display on the boats. I understand electronics and water don't mix but part of me was still impressed with the simplicity of the controls as well as their joystick controller on the side which takes care of almost all the major control aspects with one hand (pretty nice).

Guy came over from the factory full of himself asking what color I want and ect ect. He then proceeded to bash Mastercraft saying Malibu outsells them by nearly double and that the NXT mold was a re-used mold from the 205V and that is the only boat worth a dam from Mastercraft (all others are crap). Told him I was in the used market as I didn't want to buy a 100k+ boat but wouldn't mind taking a look at used stuff in the 40k to 50k. He instantly tried putting me in the Axis and was baffled when I said no way, its cheap and ugly as hell. I told him I would rather by a used MC than a brand new Axis. He proceeded to tell me how much better the Axis was and at that point I walked away.

I could understand an over eager sales guy acting like that but a factory rep that spent more time bashing other boats than talking about the features of their boat... that put a bad taste in my mouth. Pushed us to sign up to demo behind a Malibu but more than likely I will not be paying a visit to them due to the experience because of that rep.

Being in sales, if you don't have anything positive to say about your brand your last resort is to bash your competitors. Yes, we all bash the competition behind closed doors but never to a customer/potential customer.

501s
02-20-2015, 12:21 AM
I guess Supra is desperate to get people to like there boats.

I would be curious to see what the wakeboarders think about this...

How can you hate on them for running both tours while MC does none?

Wakerider16
02-20-2015, 08:32 AM
Being in sales, if you don't have anything positive to say about your brand your last resort is to bash your competitors. Yes, we all bash the competition behind closed doors but never to a customer/potential customer.

I agree. I was a little set back that he spent 5 mins highlighting the features of his boat and 20 minutes bashing Mastercraft. Don't get me wrong I still liked the boat and if given the opportunity would still purchase however after that experience not going to go out of my way to by a bu

dt37803
02-20-2015, 08:36 AM
Did you maybe have a MC shirt on ??

Mastercraftdave
02-20-2015, 08:55 AM
How can you hate on them for running both tours while MC does none?

I don't hate I just think they are desperate to get buyers to run both. BY no means are they the best wake boat or the best surf boat but they are trying to get exposure any way they can.

To me, if it was beneficial for MC to stay in the Pro Tour I think they could have. I would have rather see someone like centurion do wake surfing as I think they are boats set up for this.

I'm not the biggest fan of supra and I probably never will be. It gives me a bad taste when these companies outside of the big three start building boats and demand a 100K price tag with no history and terrible resale. I just don't see how its possible. MC/CC/Malibu have great reputation of t building high end towboats with great resale.

I have Owned 2 Malibu's and was able to barley lose any money on them after 5+ years of ownership and the same goes with my X45.

lashburn1
02-20-2015, 08:59 AM
I agree. I was a little set back that he spent 5 mins highlighting the features of his boat and 20 minutes bashing Mastercraft. Don't get me wrong I still liked the boat and if given the opportunity would still purchase however after that experience not going to go out of my way to by a bu


I just came from the LA show last night.
I spent time with each of the Players in wake Boats , except Centurion.
I just don't like the way they look....

Anyway-
None of the reps or dealers said much about the other Brands, they just focused on their product.
When I greeted them I said , "I wake Surf and want to know more about your system and how it is unique. "

A most conversations lead to discussing my 2 MCs. But know "bashing"
One dealer , did say MasterCraft is/thinks it's untouchable .... I believe it was Nautique dealer.

That same guy confessed "I have no idea how people afford these" when I questioned the $121,000.00 "boat show" price for a G-21

Wakerider16
02-20-2015, 09:09 AM
I just came from the LA show last night.
I spent time with each of the Players in wake Boats , except Centurion.
I just don't like the way they look....

Anyway-
None of the reps or dealers said much about the other Brands, they just focused on their product.
When I greeted them I said , "I wake Surf and want to know more about your system and how it is unique. "

A most conversations lead to discussing my 2 MCs. But know "bashing"
One dealer , did say MasterCraft is/thinks it's untouchable .... I believe it was Nautique dealer.

That same guy confessed "I have no idea how people afford these" when I questioned the $121,000.00 "boat show" price for a G-21


To be honest I think it was just the cocky and arrogant rep that I had. The nautique guys were really nice.

Wakerider16
02-20-2015, 09:11 AM
Did you maybe have a MC shirt on ??

No if I did I would understand the dick attitude.

mzimme
02-20-2015, 09:20 AM
I don't hate I just think they are desperate to get buyers to run both. BY no means are they the best wake boat or the best surf boat but they are trying to get exposure any way they can.

To me, if it was beneficial for MC to stay in the Pro Tour I think they could have. I would have rather see someone like centurion do wake surfing as I think they are boats set up for this.

I'm not the biggest fan of supra and I probably never will be. It gives me a bad taste when these companies outside of the big three start building boats and demand a 100K price tag with no history and terrible resale. I just don't see how its possible. MC/CC/Malibu have great reputation of t building high end towboats with great resale.

I have Owned 2 Malibu's and was able to barley lose any money on them after 5+ years of ownership and the same goes with my X45.

Without sounding like a Supra fanboy, this just isn't correct. Supra's boats are holding value just fine. Hell, the old 80's boats are getting more than an equivalent year Mastercraft. Despite your opinion, Skiers Choice actually does build a quality product. They hand lay their fiberglass, just like MC does, and they use high quality vinyl/stitching, just like MC does. Thanks to Supra, we all enjoy the open bow ski boats that we have today. That was an idea that stemmed from the designers there, because they wanted to still have their family in the boat while they went skiing.

Have they produced the best slalom tug over there years with TS6M? Probably not... but it did pull in multiple championships, so it wasn't just another copycat to hit the water. Have they always made the "best" wakeboarding wake? Probably not, but they certainly have wakes that can throw any one of us flying through the air at heights way past our abilities. If you're some pro wakeboarder, then I'll listen to your rants about wake quality, but until then they're just fine.

The quality statement is funny to me though. Moomba might not be up to the same standards, albeit they're much better since skiers choice bought them, but Supra is not some low quality rattling piece of crap on the water. They have solid construction, solid components inside, they look sleek and unique (subjective of course), and they do what they're built to do.

I love MC boats, and I think they make an incredibly high end product that you can just tell by looking at one is true. Their quality is top notch, fit and finish is top notch, and their reputation precedes itself. But they're not the end all be all of wake boats. Some people like other options, and that's where competition comes into play. You like a MC, then by all means buy one. You like a Moomba? Buy it. You want to buy a Bayliner cause you think it's a good value? Go ahead.

Slapping a 100k price tag on a boat isn't because they just want to. It's to make a profit, like every other business out there. When they take into account their cost of overhead, materials, labor, marketing, etc, etc, and come up with a figure to make money on their boats, then that's what they need to sell them at. If its too expensive, the market will tell them so and they'll likely react.

501s
02-20-2015, 12:45 PM
I don't hate I just think they are desperate to get buyers to run both. BY no means are they the best wake boat or the best surf boat but they are trying to get exposure any way they can.

To me, if it was beneficial for MC to stay in the Pro Tour I think they could have. I would have rather see someone like centurion do wake surfing as I think they are boats set up for this.

I'm not the biggest fan of supra and I probably never will be. It gives me a bad taste when these companies outside of the big three start building boats and demand a 100K price tag with no history and terrible resale. I just don't see how its possible. MC/CC/Malibu have great reputation of t building high end towboats with great resale.

I have Owned 2 Malibu's and was able to barley lose any money on them after 5+ years of ownership and the same goes with my X45.

Having owned a 08 Moomba from new and having sat in all the new Supras, let's just agree to disagree. I love my X30 but an SE for the same price is not some "rip off", it's a very difficult decision actually. I really really liked the new Supras and think they deserve the price tag. Plus I appreciate their support of the tours. Now tige is another story.

swatguy
02-20-2015, 01:09 PM
I don't hate I just think they are desperate to get buyers to run both. BY no means are they the best wake boat or the best surf boat but they are trying to get exposure any way they can.

To me, if it was beneficial for MC to stay in the Pro Tour I think they could have. I would have rather see someone like centurion do wake surfing as I think they are boats set up for this.

I'm not the biggest fan of supra and I probably never will be. It gives me a bad taste when these companies outside of the big three start building boats and demand a 100K price tag with no history and terrible resale. I just don't see how its possible. MC/CC/Malibu have great reputation of t building high end towboats with great resale.

I have Owned 2 Malibu's and was able to barley lose any money on them after 5+ years of ownership and the same goes with my X45.


So it's ok for Masterctaft to use pulling the Pro Tour as their sales pitch but not Supra ? That makes sense. Supra isn't grabbing at straws here. They'be been making quality boats for some time. Their resale holds just as any other boat. You pay less up front so they are worth less down the road. Simple. Late 80's Early 90's Sunsports are one of the best budget wakeboats on the market with rock solid bomb proof construction. The Supra Launch Direct drive was probably one of the best direct drive wakeboarding boats ever built. They've redesigned their entire line and are now pulling two events ...,..gunning for a top three status which will no doubt boost sales. Will they get there????? I'll sit back and watch and wait and see. They have pulled Worlds as well as the Gravity Games. Their Supra Comp TS6m pulled many of slalom champions back in the day. Another Supra boat withstanding the test of time in construction. They are far from a crap boat. I personally see this as a huge step. People will always want what the pros ride behind no matter what..... MC had that stamped on all their boats even when the X Games didn't exist for 4 years. MC doesn't need the tour to sell or help boost their boats. Their quality is legendary. Supra in essence does need that little boost the tour will give them if they want to break through.


As someone who visits on average at least 3 PWT stops a season, since at least 2002, MC couldn't get the tour turned around on this tail end and make it profitable for them so they dumped it. No harm in that. They did a lot of great things for the tour. Hats off for Supra taking a stab at it and bringing some much needed change to the tour and get some style and vibe back in it. Having 2 daughters and being personal friends with 2 MC sponsor'd ,pro women riders , I couldn't have been more upset about dropping women form the tour. Curious to see how it shakes out now with Supra. I for one will be hoping for some change. I just hope it's better than the other "change" we've all had to experience the last 6 yrs :D

MC25
02-20-2015, 01:34 PM
After our x15 was in the shop for over 6 months and being split in half, and re gel coated, how can mc charge what they do for boats that are "top tier quality"?It goes both ways for all manufacturers. Supra makes a dang good boat these days, and always have. Have they been on par with mc and nautique? I won't say malibu because of the nightmares my buddy has had with surfgate on his 14 lsv, but maybe not. I think the "big three manufacturers" is no longer who it used to be.


As long as we can all agree tige still sucks haha

_fng_
02-20-2015, 01:55 PM
A

Did you ever demo the Moomba? Thoughts?

CantRepeat
02-20-2015, 02:06 PM
Did I stumble into wakeworld or the supra forums today?

Scotty C
02-20-2015, 02:15 PM
Did I stumble into wakeworld or the supra forums today?
BAHAHAHAHAHAHA! :p That's good stuff

bobx1
02-20-2015, 02:23 PM
The strength of the Koolaid is directly proportional to the price of the boat.

In other words (for all my friends up north with frozen brains), when you plop down $100-$150K for a boat then you have no choice but to love it.

swatguy
02-22-2015, 11:23 PM
Little different angle. Didn't look so huge and deep from the original photo.......... Man this thing looks like a beast from this angle. Warrants the triple maybe.......

123068

lashburn1
02-23-2015, 12:28 AM
Little different angle. Didn't look so huge and deep from the original photo.......... Man this thing looks like a beast from this angle. Warrants the triple maybe.......

123068

We saw it on ground level at the Boat show.
Very Big, roomy.
They are quite nice inside , look to be well Built.

The nicest quality at the show was the G series and X series.
Different styles of nice , but both are well built

scott023
02-23-2015, 10:22 AM
Little different angle. Didn't look so huge and deep from the original photo.......... Man this thing looks like a beast from this angle. Warrants the triple maybe.......

123068

I've heard good things about them. That decal kit is heinous though, I'd rip the Supra decal right off if I bought it.