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wesgardner
11-28-2005, 08:48 AM
Hey All,

I built a heater utilizing a bilge blower and a heater core from ebay (pics soon). Initially I “T”d the raw water intake line with a 1 ¼” x ¾” pvc “T” (for the return side) and used one of the block drains for the supply side. The heater got warm but not hot (engine temp. is 160).

Couple of questions and observations – the block drain on the other side of the engine supplies my shower and gets REALLY hot so I think this might be as good a location as any? The return side however, may not be ideal as I did NOT use the “Y” adapter from skiDIM (my thinking was there’d be enough suction anyway…) has anyone done a similar install with similar results and then bought the “Y” fitting? The boat’s up on the hard for the winter so I can’t do anymore testing…

Wes

Workin' 4 Toys
11-28-2005, 09:42 AM
Hey All,

I built a heater utilizing a bilge blower and a heater core from ebay (pics soon). Initially I “T”d the raw water intake line with a 1 ¼” x ¾” pvc “T” (for the return side) and used one of the block drains for the supply side. The heater got warm but not hot (engine temp. is 160).

Couple of questions and observations – the block drain on the other side of the engine supplies my shower and gets REALLY hot so I think this might be as good a location as any? The return side however, may not be ideal as I did NOT use the “Y” adapter from skiDIM (my thinking was there’d be enough suction anyway…) has anyone done a similar install with similar results and then bought the “Y” fitting? The boat’s up on the hard for the winter so I can’t do anymore testing…

Wes
I am sorry, there is either some conflicting info here, or I simply do not understand what you are looking for.
You did this already and want to know if it is correct? Or you have not done it and want input?

Leroy
11-28-2005, 10:29 AM
I've been working on similar porject and would like to see what you did. Was looking at the 4" blower, dryer tubing, and then have bid on several heater cores on ebay, but have not won one yet. I have bought the y adapter.


I'm worried about enough heat transfer from the core, what core did you use? Also should check the temperature of the core, and temps going in and out.
Would be easier to just buy one from HeaterCraft, but I like building things like this. Have the parts for my shower for next spring.

wesgardner
11-28-2005, 10:34 AM
Sorry for the mis-understanding...

I built the heater box and intially hooked it up via the "T" fitting for the return and the block drain for the supply and got warm air, not hot...

The question is two-fold - does the skiDIM "Y" fitting make that much difference?....i.e. - am I getting adequate water flow with my current arrangement?

Two - My assumption is the water at the block drain is the same temp as the water at the water pump (once up to operating temp.) ? IS this correct? or should I find another place to tap for supply?

I understand folks were hooking their heaters up to the water pump but that's not the case here...maybe it should be?

Wes

wesgardner
11-28-2005, 10:41 AM
Leroy,

I just did a "Buy it Now" on ebay - the core is for some sort of Ford van - 2x6x8...$17....my blower is a Rule bilge blower 4", my flex pipe is alu. flex pipe from Home Depot. I built my case from wood-epoxy because that's what I know and love (and I had the materials on hand) the core is "suspended" in urthethane foam...seems J.C. Whitney has heaters much cheaper....I like to build stuff too otherwise I'm not certain it is worth it...oh yeah, my on/off is Access 1. (no high/med/low)

Can't do anymore tests till spring...

Wes

phecksel
11-28-2005, 11:31 AM
Leroy,

I just did a "Buy it Now" on ebay - the core is for some sort of Ford van - 2x6x8...$17....my blower is a Rule bilge blower 4", my flex pipe is alu. flex pipe from Home Depot. I built my case from wood-epoxy because that's what I know and love (and I had the materials on hand) the core is "suspended" in urthethane foam...seems J.C. Whitney has heaters much cheaper....I like to build stuff too otherwise I'm not certain it is worth it...oh yeah, my on/off is Access 1. (no high/med/low)

Can't do anymore tests till spring...

Wes
Heater cores are mucho cheap at your local auto parts store. didn't save much from ebay. Your design is probably better built then the commercial units

beef
11-28-2005, 12:35 PM
Wes,

The recommended location for the supply side is on top of the block, opposite where the temp sender is. I've installed the HeaterCraft - first with the return at the water pump, and later installed the Y fitting. The Y does improve heat at idle, but both configs supplied plenty of heat while at speed.

wesgardner
11-28-2005, 01:08 PM
Hey beef,

I have a temp sender in the front of my block just under the t-stat housing and there's a plugged hole in the water pump just below where the large diameter hose attaches at the top...this is an older motor and I'm a bit nervous about trying to remove a plug? 454 big block...lemme see if I have a pic...dunno whether you can see from this pic, the temp sender is connected to a sorta dark puple wire that's running down and to the right (spiral coiled) and the plugged tap can't really be seen but it's below where the large hose on the left side of the T-stat housing is...just don't know enough about the direction of flow to know if this plugged hole is worth investigating...any 454 experts wanna take a stab?


Wes

beef
11-28-2005, 01:37 PM
I'm not exactly sure of the potential locations on the 454, since I've got the 350. Here's a link (http://www.wakeworld.com/articles/2002/heater.asp) to the article I referred to when originally installing my heater. The HeaterCraft install kit even contains a T fitting to install the supply line in the same place as the temp sender, if necessary. I didn't have to use that, since I had the same plug available as in the picture in the above link. I suspect that the plug in the water pump you are referring to is where I originally had my return line (before installing the Y in the raw water intake). hth

Bob

AirJunky
11-28-2005, 02:41 PM
I installed the Y several months after installing the heater line in the engine water pump. Heat at low speed/RPM increased dramatically. The fact that we had adequate heat at idle made it possible to not use a shower at all. Anything you would use your shower for, warming your head, hands or feet after a run, was easily done using the heater's hot tube & a towel.

wesgardner
11-29-2005, 08:34 AM
Hey Air Junk,

We use the shower to fill wet suits before the "big plunge"...what I am trying to determine is do I need the "Y" adapter - i.e. is it's venturi effect that much more significant in producing flow thru the heater core than what I have? I thought that maybe someone had done an install similar to mine and discovered that there was a better way....I wished I had taken more time before I hauled my boat for the year but cold weather was on the way...

Wes

jimmer2880
11-29-2005, 05:05 PM
I used my heater for approx 3 years before getting the "Y" adapter. It made a HUGE difference at idle & significant difference at speed, in fact, the heat coming out of the tubes is so hot that I can't hold the "hot tube" between my feet anymore.

How much air flow do you get with the bilge blower? I'd be interested to see how it compares to the double-squirrel cage type that heatercraft uses.

Holtrodj
11-29-2005, 10:06 PM
Wes, Could you post a picture of your heater unit? I'm very interested in what it looks like. I'm thinking of trying to do something similar. I was thinking about using multiple blowers so I could turn some on/off at different times.

wesgardner
11-30-2005, 09:32 AM
Hey All,

Yeah, I will..I need to get them off my daughter's dig...the bilge blower seems to move a fair amount of air...230 cfm sticks in my mind it's the 4" diameter by Rule

With the multi-blower set-up, you may need some sort of one-way flapper valves or something or you'll pull cool air back thru the system? Dunno...


Wes

Holtrodj
11-30-2005, 10:22 PM
My thought is the two blowers would be in-line between the Core box and the vent. They would suck hot air from the core and blow it towards the vent. Does that make more sense?

I guess I don't understand the flipper door concept?

AirJunky
12-01-2005, 12:00 AM
Hey Air Junk,

We use the shower to fill wet suits before the "big plunge"...what I am trying to determine is do I need the "Y" adapter - i.e. is it's venturi effect that much more significant in producing flow thru the heater core than what I have?
Wes
I hear ya on the warming the wet suits with the shower. I gave up long wetsuits in favor of a descent drysuit though. Staying dry really helps stay warm.
Anyway, the Y adapter is to slow the rate of flow of the hot water thru the core. By doing this, it keeps hot water in the core at lower engine RPMs.
I installed the Y 4 yrs ago & the result has been that I get heat at idle speeds.

jimmer2880
12-01-2005, 06:52 AM
I hear ya on the warming the wet suits with the shower. I gave up long wetsuits in favor of a descent drysuit though. Staying dry really helps stay warm.
Anyway, the Y adapter is to slow the rate of flow of the hot water thru the core. By doing this, it keeps hot water in the core at lower engine RPMs.
I installed the Y 4 yrs ago & the result has been that I get heat at idle speeds.

I have to argue with you AirJunky..... I believe the Y adapter is to speed up (hence, increase volume) of hot water through the core. The slower the volume, the more temp the water will loose and the cooler the outputted air will be. This is assuming that we have a never-ending supply of hot water (which we do). My air is definately hotter with the Y adapter, so it must have increased flow.

wesgardner
12-01-2005, 08:36 AM
Seems to be some disagreement as to the amount of water flow...maybe the reduction in size somhow increases the venturi/suction effect? As long as it works...I posted up some pics of my wood heater...hey it works, don't laugh...

Wes

KHall
12-22-2005, 07:39 PM
Hi Wes,

I had the same issue with a heater install.
I supplied from the top of block, your location is fine also.

The key is the return. I tried at the block water pump and had no heat at idle, only at higher rpm's.

Moved it to the exhaust manifold drain and have tons of flow, too much now I can barely heat up the motor. The heater feels great at idle. I plan on fixing the warm up by adding a ball valve and balancing the flow. Also may just tap in the return before the raw water pump and restrict the flow, for faster warm up.

Looks like your after the raw water pump so your seeing the head pressure from only the across the block pump. I am after the raw water pump also, but where the pressure has dropped to closer to atmosphere, right before the riser crest.

Hope this helps and you’ll let me feel the heat this spring!

Keene

wesgardner
12-27-2005, 08:33 AM
Hey Keene,

You're on....

Hope you had a great Christmas


Wes

Leroy
01-16-2006, 10:35 PM
I'm trying to make the install simplier, but may just go with the Y return since I've already bought it.


Has anyone tried a T near the thermostat and a return T at the other end of the hose. Your core would be running in parallel with the hot water out of the thermostat.

Comments, can anyone understand, I think I'm not explaining very well.

wesgardner
01-17-2006, 09:52 AM
Hey Leroy,

Wouldn't the water just favor the path of least resistance and NOT move thru the heater at all (or not very much?)...seems you need some sort of pressure differential across the heater in either the "suck" side or the "blow" side? I'm not explaining it very well either...a question I had/have is how much water flow is actually needed? It seems some folks believe the skiDIM "Y" actually REDUCES the water flow by virtue of a small restricting hole - I'm unclear as to why....as long as you had water moving thru the core, I would think you'd get heat...can someone perhpas clarify or is this part of the black magic that ski/wake boat owners must endure.

I just "T"d my raw water intake line with a 1 1/4" x 5/8" plastic "T" - I didn't have much time to explore before winterizing but my recall is I didn't get HOT water just warm. So is this due to not enough water flowing thru my system? My "hot" tap is on the side of the block....perhaps I need the skiDIM "Y" to provide enough venturi effect (pressure diff.) to move water thru my system (that seems to argue for more, not less water and seems to negate the concept of the restricting feature built into the "Y")...

Oh no...I'm rambling...


Wes

Wes

Leroy
01-17-2006, 10:10 AM
Wes;

You are right and water is like electricity and will divide according to the ratio of resistance through the different paths. I'm hoping that is there is ~1 foot of hose between the T's and say the core is equivalent to 10 feet then you will get 1/10th the flow through the heater. If there is 10 gallons per minute at idle then there will be ~1 gal per minute flow through the heater core. Seems like enough, guess I'll have to try. IF not will just use the Y adapter.

I want to use the block tap for the shower.

Thanks for your inputs!

Jorski
01-17-2006, 10:44 AM
It seems some folks believe the skiDIM "Y" actually REDUCES the water flow by virtue of a small restricting hole - I'm unclear as to why....as long as you had water moving thru the core, I would think you'd get heat...can someone perhpas clarify or is this part of the black magic that ski/wake boat owners must endure.



It is really simple. The raw water pump, pumps a high volume of cold water all of the time. (When the engine is too hot, the thermostat lets the water flow through the cooling passages. When the engine is too cold, the thermostat shuts and the water by-passes the cooling passages and goes out the exhaust)

The larger diameter side of the "Y" pipe is attached to the the main line of the raw water intake. The smaller pipe in the "Y" pulls hot water from the hot engine block through the heater core and into the raw water line intake. It accomplishes this due to the siphon effect of the cold raw water passing by the smaller hole in the "Y".

To be clear: the small hole limits the amount of the siphon effect. When the air blows through the heater core it takes heat from the hot water. The greater the volume of hot water that passes through the heater core, the more heat that can be removed from it. I hope that clarifies the situation.

wesgardner
01-17-2006, 12:51 PM
So seemingly:

If I purchase and install the skiDIM "Y" in my raw water line and tap my block for hot water, I'll get sumptuous amounts of hot air out of my heater, garranteed...

Jorski
01-18-2006, 12:44 PM
So seemingly:

If I purchase and install the skiDIM "Y" in my raw water line and tap my block for hot water, I'll get sumptuous amounts of hot air out of my heater, garranteed...


Affirmative.

KHall
01-18-2006, 06:47 PM
The Y is clean and simple way to do it.

Or return tee in before the raw-water pump and restrict the flow with a ball valve in the circuit.