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milkmania
11-21-2005, 09:03 AM
GM Announces Plans To Close Facilities, Slash 30,000 Jobs



POSTED: 7:22 am CST November 21, 2005
UPDATED: 7:53 am CST November 21, 2005
DETROIT -- General Motors CEO Rick Wagoner says the automaker will close nine North American assembly, stamping and powertrain facilities and cut the work force by 30,000 employees. A statement from the world's largest automaker earlier said Wagoner would address "significant actions" affecting the money-losing North American operations.

GM said the plants that will close are in Oklahoma City, Lansing, Mich., Spring Hill, Tenn., Doraville, Ga., and Ontario, Canada. Wagoner said last month that the automaker would announce plant closures by the end of the year in order to better match U.S. demand.

GM has been losing market share to rivals. Last week, Wagoner told employees that GM had no plans to file for bankruptcy despite continuing losses in the North American division. GM shares last week traded at the lowest level in 18 years.

Workin' 4 Toys
11-21-2005, 09:11 AM
Milk,

How did the saying go years ago, "When GM goes..............."
Is it time to be scared yet?

milkmania
11-21-2005, 09:18 AM
Milk,

How did the saying go years ago, "When GM goes..............."
Is it time to be scared yet?

yes, it is a frightening time:(

I guesst hey weren't talking about North American rocks in that ad campaign:rolleyes:

Leroy
11-21-2005, 09:31 AM
This is a sad day for many GM employees. From another article looks like their cuts are similar to the market share loss.

bigmac
11-21-2005, 09:58 AM
This is a sad day for many GM employees. From another article looks like their cuts are similar to the market share loss.

Very illustrative graph. Things can only look bleaker than it illustrates now that gas prices are so much higher.

milkmania
11-21-2005, 11:44 AM
here's another version of the same story....

GM to Cut 30,000 Jobs, Close 9 Plants


By DEE-ANN DURBIN


DETROIT - General Motors Corp. will eliminate 30,000 jobs and close nine North American assembly, stamping and powertrain plants by 2008 as part of an effort to get production in line with demand and position the world's biggest automaker to start making money again after absorbing nearly $4 billion in losses so far this year.



The announcement Monday by Rick Wagoner, GM's chairman and CEO, represents 5,000 more job cuts than the 25,000 that the automaker had previously indicated it planned to cut.



The 30,000 job cuts represents about 9 percent of GM's global work force of about 325,000 people.



"The decisions we are announcing today were very difficult to reach because of their impact on our employees and the communities where we live and work," Wagoner told employees. "But these actions are necessary for GM to get its costs in line with our major global competitors. In short, they are an essential part of our plan to return our North American operations to profitability as soon as possible."



The plan will cut the number of vehicles GM is able to build in North America by about 1 million a year by the end of 2008.



GM said the assembly plants that will close are in Oklahoma City, Lansing, Mich., Spring Hill, Tenn., Doraville, Ga., and Ontario, Canada. A shift also will be removed at a plant in Moraine, Ohio.



An engine facility in Flint, Mich., will close, along with a separate powertrain facility in Ontario and metal centers in Lansing and Pittsburgh.



Wagoner said GM also will close three service and parts operations facilities. They are in Ypsilanti, Mich., and Portland, Ore. One other site will to be announced later.



GM said the plan is to achieve $7 billion in cost reductions on a running rate basis by the end of 2006 _ $1 billion above its previously indicated target.



The company said it would take a "significant" restructuring charge in conjunction with the changes and any related early retirement program. Details of those charges would be released later, GM said.



Any early retirement program would require an agreement with its unions, which GM said it hopes to reach soon.



GM shares rose 12 cents to $24.17 in morning trading on the New York Stock Exchange. Its shares traded below $21 last week at an 18-year low.



Wagoner said last month the automaker would announce plant closures by the end of this year to get its capacity in line with U.S. demand. GM plants currently run at 85 percent of their capacity, lower than North American plants run by its Asian rivals. The plant closings aren't expected to be final until GM's current contract with the United Auto Workers expires in 2007.



GM has been crippled by high labor, pension, health care and materials costs as well as by sagging demand for sport utility vehicles, its longtime cash cows, and by bloated plant capacity. Its market share has been eroded by competition from Asian automakers led by Toyota Motor Corp. GM lost nearly $4 billion in the first nine months of the year.



The automaker could be facing a strike at Delphi Corp., its biggest parts supplier, which filed for bankruptcy protection last month. GM spun off Delphi in 1999 and could be liable for billions in pension costs for Delphi retirees.



GM also is under investigation by the U.S. Securities and Exchange Commission for accounting errors.



Last week, after the automaker's shares fell to their lowest level since 1987, Wagoner sent an e-mail to employees saying the company has a turnaround strategy in place and has no plans to file for bankruptcy.



GM is not the only U.S. automaker faced with the need to cut costs.



Last week, Ford Motor Co. told employees it plans to eliminate about 4,000 white-collar jobs in North America early next year as part of a restructuring plan. Ford said the cuts will be made in part through attrition and elimination of some agency and contract positions.



The plans were outlined Friday in an e-mail to employees from Mark Fields, president for the Americas.



The cuts will be in addition to 2,750 North American salaried jobs that Ford earlier said it wanted to cut by the end of 2005. Ford started the year with about 35,000 salaried workers in North America.



Dearborn-based Ford reported a third-quarter loss of $284 million, including a loss of $1.2 billion before taxes in North America.



On the Net:



General Motors Corp.: http://www.gm.com

Dan K
11-21-2005, 12:11 PM
We cannot keep exporting our dollars and expect to maintain our current American lifestyle.

Before I get flamed here let me explain a bit.

Today GM spends 6.2 billion a year providing healthcare to employees, their families and retirees. This is about $1800 on every car sold. Toyota has younger workforce in the US and virtually no retirees are supported. Their cost per vehicle for healthcare globally is $300. If GM does not pay for this healthcare who will ? It will ultimately be the burden of the taxpayers.

Ryan
11-21-2005, 12:19 PM
GM Announces Plans To Close Facilities, Slash 30,000 Jobs
POSTED: 7:22 am CST November 21, 2005
UPDATED: 7:53 am CST November 21, 2005
DETROIT -- General Motors CEO Rick Wagoner says the automaker will close nine North American assembly, stamping and powertrain facilities and cut the work force by 30,000 employees. ...


Happy Thanksgiving, have a merry Christmas and a happy friggin' New Year GM. Nice timing.

[And this is from a capitalistic Republican]

Ryan
11-21-2005, 12:21 PM
This is a sad day for many GM employees. From another article looks like their cuts are similar to the market share loss.

I'd love to see YTD '05 on there. I bet Chrysler bumped up a bit.

Leroy, do you know if that's market share by unit volume or $?

Ric
11-21-2005, 12:35 PM
maybe dealers need a paycut?

Whoa, got my flamesuit on !!!!!

Leroy
11-21-2005, 12:47 PM
I'm pretty sure units. Here is the site, some more info in it.

http://www.detnews.com/2005/autosinsider/0501/06/A01-50668.htm

I'm not sure how long we can maintain the trade inbalance with China. But it is not healthy.

I'd love to see YTD '05 on there. I bet Chrysler bumped up a bit.

Leroy, do you know if that's market share by unit volume or $?

Workin' 4 Toys
11-21-2005, 01:21 PM
Caught my attention in your post:

The plant closings aren't expected to be final until GM's current contract with the United Auto Workers expires in 2007.

Do I smell a pay cut across the board?

Ryan
11-21-2005, 01:27 PM
I'm not sure how long we can maintain the trade inbalance with China. But it is not healthy.

You're not kidding.
Once they got their highway system up and running it was all over - like the US in the 50's interstate/international trade, transportation of goods for export and location-specific production efficiencies have them on a roll that will not slow for decades. Chery cars are coming in Jan 2007.



I'm curious, if you were going to be fired on Nov 21 or Dec 21, which would you prefer? And if you had to fire employees, which date would you rather send them packing?

Workin' 4 Toys
11-21-2005, 01:27 PM
Here is something I have heard from an insider of a company that sent a few jobs overseas. The company packed up and shipped 90% of its manufacturing overseas. 10% stayed to help in a slump. Well, after about a year, they have felt the reprocussions. The product they are shipping in has a large portion that no longer meets the expectations of the buyers. So what was the answer, the big wigs set it up so they do about 50/50 here and there to make it LOOK like it was not a huge mistake. I am sure they did not get the ROI they were expecting. So in the end, a few more jobs were cut because of the overall decrease in demand.
A vicious circle.

Ryan
11-21-2005, 01:29 PM
Caught my attention in your post:

The plant closings aren't expected to be final until GM's current contract with the United Auto Workers expires in 2007.

Do I smell a pay cut across the board?

I'm glad you posted, I missed that detail.
Announcing mass closure is one way to initiate a wage negotiation.

maristarman
11-21-2005, 01:34 PM
We cannot keep exporting our dollars and expect to maintain our current American lifestyle.

Before I get flamed here let me explain a bit.

Today GM spends 6.2 billion a year providing healthcare to employees, their families and retirees. This is about $1800 on every car sold. Toyota has younger workforce in the US and virtually no retirees are supported. Their cost per vehicle for healthcare globally is $300. If GM does not pay for this healthcare who will ? It will ultimately be the burden of the taxpayers.

What makes it even worse, is GM is paying salary and benefits to thousands of employees who don't actually do any work.

I read this article about a month ago and couldn't believe it. Its no wonder GM has financial problems.

http://www.forbes.com/business/global/2005/1017/036A.html

milkmania
11-21-2005, 04:56 PM
What makes it even worse, is GM is paying salary and benefits to thousands of employees who don't actually do any work.

I read this article about a month ago and couldn't believe it. Its no wonder GM has financial problems.

http://www.forbes.com/business/global/2005/1017/036A.html

incredible!

thanks for the link

captain planet
11-21-2005, 05:16 PM
I have to premise this by saying that I won't own a foreign vehicle, but the big three need to start producing vehicles that people want to buy. I love my Surburban, but the gas mileage is a real turn-off. It isn't rocket science to make these vehicles get better gas mileage, it's better engineering. Let's put this into perspective, if we can put a man on the moon, we can make an SUV get 25-30 miles per gallon! It's just too bad the oil companies won't let that happen.

Anyone driven the hybrid Silverado? I have heard they are selling them in California. What is the towing capacity of these trucks? What is the MPG of these trucks?

Blair
11-21-2005, 06:53 PM
all i have to say is that the general public has done this to themselfs... yes gm may not make the same type of vehicles that toyota or honda does and they may be a bit more expensive but id deffinatly pay that to keep a few more jobs from going overseas... this is the start of a very viscious cycle that is not going to end good for any one... im just glad we already bought our boat... if people soon wont be able to buy cars how long is it before the boat market takes a major hit...

i actually really dont feel like getting into this right now but i cant not say anything... ive seen this coming for over a year now but no one ever belived me because of my age... im just gonna get as much money saved up as i possibly can and wait untill the bottom falls out and buy a house for pennys on the dollar...

How does that song go "It's the end of the world as we know it..."


Have a nice night.

(oh and i am fully prepared to get flamed harshly for this post)

Workin' 4 Toys
11-21-2005, 08:13 PM
Is this where all the import owners gather around the bon fire and do a "mission accomplished" dance.:mad:

Cloaked
11-21-2005, 08:20 PM
And the UAW said the sky would NEVER fall...

Workin' 4 Toys
11-21-2005, 08:22 PM
What happened to the huge boost the employee pricing gave? What vehicle lines specifically are getting hit?

lakes Rick
11-21-2005, 10:19 PM
I get you back finally round eye.... Banzai.....

ski36short
11-21-2005, 11:28 PM
I have to premise this by saying that I won't own a foreign vehicle, but the big three need to start producing vehicles that people want to buy. I love my Surburban, but the gas mileage is a real turn-off. It isn't rocket science to make these vehicles get better gas mileage, it's better engineering. Let's put this into perspective, if we can put a man on the moon, we can make an SUV get 25-30 miles per gallon! It's just too bad the oil companies won't let that happen.

Anyone driven the hybrid Silverado? I have heard they are selling them in California. What is the towing capacity of these trucks? What is the MPG of these trucks?

OK captain as an engineer at GM Powertrain I can't let this one go. Let's review a few basic facts here. 1). GM SUVs and trucks are the most fuel efficient in their respective classes whether it's by EPA testing or by anecdotal evidence and I think discussions here support that. The 07s are even better with the cylinder deactivation feature. 2). Basic physics require alot of force to propel full sized trucks down the road. 3). Some engineering solutions (read: DIESEL) are subject to market conditions, public perception (however accurate or inaccurate they may be), environmental restrictions, and cost issues. Putting a men on the moon didn't have to deal with any of that. I think diesel is the right solution to fuel economy but due to the reasons stated (moreso than the oil companies, who may very well be behind legislation that makes diesel tough) it may never happen.

So to answer your question about the Silverado hybrid, I haven't driven one. It's a "mild" hybrid, meaning it only has a starter-generator that shuts the engine off at idle like a golf cart. No savings on the highway, just in the city. They have 5.3l engines so towing capacity shouldn't be any different. I think the full hybrid SUVs are slated for 2008.

Oh and I love my Tahoe too. I don't think 18 mpg is that bad given it's size and capability. But maybe that's because I don't have to drive it daily.

Stepping down from my soapbox once again. No offense meant...

BriEOD
11-22-2005, 07:35 AM
I get you back finally round eye.... Banzai.....
LMAO!!

I really feel for those 30K people. That's a lot of jobs!!

stevo137
11-22-2005, 08:36 AM
The Honda Civic gets the 2006 Motor Trend car of the year award. :confused:

Workin' 4 Toys
11-22-2005, 09:03 AM
The Honda Civic gets the 2006 Motor Trend car of the year award. :confused:
No more subscriptions from me. Not that is has anything to do with honda being the high bidder there;) . There isn't anything I can't find on the net, those goof balls print there.

Workin' 4 Toys
11-22-2005, 09:04 AM
OK captain as an engineer at GM Powertrain I can't let this one go.
Ski,
You are an engine/tranny engineer for GM?

ski36short
11-22-2005, 09:44 AM
Engine - Northstar.

Workin' 4 Toys
11-22-2005, 09:49 AM
Engine - Northstar.
Didn't cadillac have some issues with those "dropping cylinders" engines a few years ago?
Are these new"technology" engines designed with electronic valves?

Ric
11-22-2005, 10:11 AM
The Honda Civic gets the 2006 Motor Trend car of the year award. :confused:
Two words: Gas Prices...............

Ric
11-22-2005, 10:24 AM
all i have to say is that the general public has done this to themselfs... yes gm may not make the same type of vehicles that toyota or honda does and they may be a bit more expensive but id deffinatly pay that to keep a few more jobs from going overseas... this is the start of a very viscious cycle that is not going to end good for any one... im just glad we already bought our boat... if people soon wont be able to buy cars how long is it before the boat market takes a major hit...

i actually really dont feel like getting into this right now but i cant not say anything... ive seen this coming for over a year now but no one ever belived me because of my age... im just gonna get as much money saved up as i possibly can and wait untill the bottom falls out and buy a house for pennys on the dollar...

How does that song go "It's the end of the world as we know it..."


Have a nice night.

(oh and i am fully prepared to get flamed harshly for this post)
FLAME YOU! Shame on all Americans for wanting quality goods at low prices! Shame on WalMart, Hyundai, and ..whoever makes all the weedeaters and kiddie gocarts in China Now! Shame on You too! 8p

I'm plaigerizing here, but it was one of the best things I ever read outta limbaugh.... We need to export liberalism. If we sent every acronym overseas for foreign competition to work under, we'd have a level playing field and American ingenuity would win out every time :rant:
UAW, EPA, IRS, EEOC, LULAC, NAACP, PETA, I'm sure you guys can name some more of them.

phecksel
11-22-2005, 11:42 AM
FLAME YOU! Shame on all Americans for wanting quality goods at low prices! Shame on WalMart, Hyundai, and ..whoever makes all the weedeaters and kiddie gocarts in China Now! Shame on You too! 8p

I'm plaigerizing here, but it was one of the best things I ever read outta limbaugh.... We need to export liberalism. If we sent every acronym overseas for foreign competition to work under, we'd have a level playing field and American ingenuity would win out every time :rant:
UAW, EPA, IRS, EEOC, LULAC, NAACP, PETA, I'm sure you guys can name some more of them.
Maybe we should send our excessively over paid CEO's overseas where they will make millions less. And what genius can support raises and huge severance packages to the same Delphi management that ran them into the ground in the first place?

Also being in Automotive, wonder where the next shoe is going to drop. The entire country seems to be doing well, except for autos. In the past, that was a precursor for the rest of the US having issues. Hasn't happened (yet?) as the the rest of the country is doing better. I heard some news this morning that makes me think my resume needs to be getting updated. Hate the thought of leaving the area, but may not have a choice :(

Dan K
11-22-2005, 12:04 PM
LMAO!!

I really feel for those 30K people. That's a lot of jobs!!

That's 30K GM jobs, the fallout in the supplier base and related jobs will be a large multiple of this.

Between GM and Ford the cuts have got to have an affect on the overall economy, maybe jobs created by reconstruction from the multiple natural disaters will have a nuetralizing affect.

Ric
11-22-2005, 12:25 PM
That's 30K GM jobs, the fallout in the supplier base and related jobs will be a large multiple of this.

Between GM and Ford the cuts have got to have an affect on the overall economy, maybe jobs created by reconstruction from the multiple natural disaters will have a nuetralizing affect.
I smell a "Roger & Me II" heading our way.

captain planet
11-22-2005, 12:34 PM
Ski, I wasn't trying to point a finger at GM but rather to ALL SUV makers. These vehicles could get better fuel mileage, it's just that nobody is forcing them to do so. So now we are delt the hand we are holding and the consumer has spoken, we want better gas mileage and the SUV is not in this equation. ALL automakers SUV sales are suffering and those automakers that are so dependant on these vehicles are suffering, i.e. GM and Ford. Hey, I said it before, I love my Surburban I just wish it got 20+ miles per gallon.

As for a comment I read on this thread about foreign made goods and shame on us for wanting quality at a better price. All I can say is I do my part to buy goods made in the USA. When I work on my vehicles, I always buy the parts that are made here regardless of how much more they cost. It just makes sense.

MYMC
11-22-2005, 01:13 PM
0% financing? Massive rebates? Employee pricing? You are killing your own business. You are literally borrowing against tomorrows sales for today and (to add insult to injury) de-valuing yesterdays sales in the process! The real damage to the brand will come when people try to get out of these vehicles. It doesn’t take a Wharton School of Business grad to figure out where this eventually leads. Three months ago a close friend went to buy an H2, I went with. The dealer wouldn't budge on MSRP and was selling year old used vehicles for the same prices (about) as new ones. The GM of the store actually looked at my buddy and me when he passed on the deal and said "well if you don't buy it won’t be here the end of the week, and they aren't getting any cheaper." My friend ended up buying a VW Touareg and loves it...oh BTW since the Hurricanes the Hummer dealer has some amazing discounts, and the truck we drove is still sitting on the front row!

Add to this mix of poor product planning and poor management the fact that the housing market is slowing (rapidly in some places) and riskier loans are becoming more and more “fashionable” and the General is fit for a fall. GMAC won’t be able to stop it and may lead the charge if they are not careful.

My Mom said it; “there is no free lunch, sooner or later somebody pays…every time”.

ski36short
11-22-2005, 01:30 PM
Captain - First things first - what's up with the "really bad bimini" on the 30th boat?!? Is there a pic I've missed?

As far as SUV gas mileage, several diesels have been or are being developed by various companies. There isn't enough market (which has to be huge for an engine) to justify production, esp. since diesel fuel prices aren't falling so quickly. I think most of us here would go for it but we're not the "general public". We use our trucks like trucks and would accept the perceived "trade offs" for diesel mileage, if I may speak for everyone here.

For some reason hybrids have been anointed as the fuel efficiency solution (by treehuggers) and I've already gone on that rant here so I won't again :) FWIW the new Tahoe is rated at 20+ mpg (although it may only be 20.3!) and the hybrids are projected to be in the upper 20s I think.

ski36short
11-22-2005, 01:32 PM
I heard some news this morning that makes me think my resume needs to be getting updated. Hate the thought of leaving the area, but may not have a choice :(

I hear ya Phil. I don't want to leave either but that might be a good idea at some point, probably sooner than I care to admit. I can't think of a job I'd rather have but can I afford to stick around in the land of flat or declining real estate values and climbing taxes??

ski36short
11-22-2005, 01:43 PM
Didn't cadillac have some issues with those "dropping cylinders" engines a few years ago?
Are these new"technology" engines designed with electronic valves?

I've only been around here a couple years so I'm not 100% up on Northstar history. I'm sure the old timers would know. No electronic valves though, just DOHC, 32 valves, and variable valve timing on the rear wheel drive applications. The supercharged version has been my nemesis most of the summer - until I get to drive one. Then I get even! :)

No one has fully electronic (camless) valve actuation in production yet.

rodltg2
11-22-2005, 01:45 PM
so is this a good time to buy a new tahoe?

jmyers
11-22-2005, 01:46 PM
so is this a good time to buy a new tahoe?
Well, it sure isn't time to sell or trade one!! I am holding off on a new truck for a while!!! :(

rodltg2
11-22-2005, 01:48 PM
there is no way ill be ablet o sell my dodge hemi now. so may need to hold off anyway.

Ric
11-22-2005, 01:57 PM
I think someone said this earlier, but what are the odds that GM actually lays off this many people in the next 2 years?
I dont know, so I'm not being fesicious(sp?)
Hell, if we couldnt get rid of Chrylser in the 80's, GM aint going anywhere.
My truck should be ready to trade by the 08model year, will the IC engine be gone by then? Will it be a chinese GM truck? Hybrid only?
nahhh, I bet they still make something that'll tow my MC wherever I want to go but the media will have a circus with this for awhile and it aint helping the stock price!
Is this merely saber rattling to send a message to the unions?

PendO
11-22-2005, 01:58 PM
What happened to the huge boost the employee pricing gave? What vehicle lines specifically are getting hit?


I think the boost was to the consumer ... you don't see the foreign companies undercutting one another in order to clear inventory, in the end that's all the incentives really are ... IMO.

PendO
11-22-2005, 02:00 PM
0% financing? Massive rebates? Employee pricing? You are killing your own business. You are literally borrowing against tomorrows sales for today and (to add insult to injury) de-valuing yesterdays sales in the process! The real damage to the brand will come when people try to get out of these vehicles.

Couldn't agree more.

captain planet
11-22-2005, 02:17 PM
Captain - First things first - what's up with the "really bad bimini" on the 30th boat?!? Is there a pic I've missed?

For some reason hybrids have been anointed as the fuel efficiency solution (by treehuggers) and I've already gone on that rant here so I won't again :) FWIW the new Tahoe is rated at 20+ mpg (although it may only be 20.3!) and the hybrids are projected to be in the upper 20s I think.


For the people that know me, I tried to do the good thing and have a local boat cover shop make my bimini instead of giving my money to some big company. :( I have paid for that mistake. It is just a really bad sewing job that I should have taken back more than once. The frame is fine it is the lack of tightness that is the problem. It flaps in the breeze and blows up like a balloon when at speed. It doesn't matter how tight you pull the straps, it needs resewn. If I didn't need it for my twins to get out of the sun I would have taken it back and demanded it be fixed right.

As for the pics, I have not yet tried to upload any of my boat. I will try when I get one or two put in electronic form.

That Tahoe that gets 20+, is that probably 2WD right? I can't think of a more useless vehicle than a 2WD SUV, you might as well have a minivan.

jraben8
11-22-2005, 02:54 PM
I remember seeing that the 2wd was to get about 21.5 and the 4wd around 20.3 but I'm not quoting anyone.

phecksel
11-28-2005, 11:59 AM
Positive point of the massive price slashing, if I manage to keep my job, my 3 yr SUV lease ought to have a real cheap buy it now price :) Forget residual value, and contract buy price, they'll be happy to get anything over wholesale auction value.

Bad part about the economy, the property immediately next door is sort of for sale. It's a friggin probate mess, property is virtually unbuildable, house needs to be torn down, and it would be foolish for me to take on any debt!

Workin' 4 Toys
11-28-2005, 12:06 PM
I saw pics of the '07 Tahoes and Yukons. I like....:)

BrianM
11-28-2005, 01:18 PM
I saw pics of the '07 Tahoes and Yukons. I like....:)

Have seen some spy photos of the '07 trucks as well and it looks like they are going to look very similar to the Tahoe & Yukons (big surprise). they look really nice and the displacement on demand is going to be great for the mileage. I have an '03 but will be ready for a new '08 so the redesign is coming just in time for me. The Tundra is going to have a major redesign for '08 and from all reports it is going to be a bigger and badder truck. If it lhas similar lines to the concept truck it is going to get a serious look from me as well. Can't wait

bigmac
11-28-2005, 01:24 PM
Positive point of the massive price slashing, if I manage to keep my job, my 3 yr SUV lease ought to have a real cheap buy it now price :) Forget residual value, and contract buy price, they'll be happy to get anything over wholesale auction value.



Have you ever done that...negotiated with the leasing company for a downward deviation from the end-of-lease gauranteed purchase price? In the past, leasing companies haven't been very enthusiastic about that IMHO, but if you have some tips, I'd appreciate hearing them...

I have a lease on an SUV that is up in July - I woudln't mind keeping the vehicle, especially if I can get them lower.

Ryan
11-29-2005, 09:22 AM
T Scott, I hope you don't work for Merck.

MERCK TO CUT 7,000 JOBS
Restructuring Designed to Save $4 Billion
November 28, 2005
QwikFIND ID: AAR17E
By Rich Thomaselli
NEW YORK (AdAge.com) -- Embattled pharmaceutical company Merck, still reeling from pulling Vioxx from the market last year and facing patent expiration on its best-selling cholesterol drug Zocor in 2006, said this morning it will cut 7,000 jobs in the next three years.


Photo: AP
Merck intends to eliminate 11% of its work force by 2008.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Related Story:
MERCK PULLS $2.5 BILLION DRUG VIOXX OFF MARKET
$78 Million Advertising Account Is With DDB, FCB

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Shut or sell plants
Merck’s plan will eliminate 11% of its work force by the end of 2008. The company also plans to close or sell five of its 31 manufacturing plants in the hopes of saving up to $4 billion.

The Whitehouse Station, N.J.-based drug maker was forced to pull one of its biggest-selling drugs last year when it was found that anti-arthritis prescription medication Vioxx caused an inordinate amount of heart attacks in patients.

Merck’s stock traded as high as $47 a share on Aug. 23, 2004. Five weeks later, the company announced that it was recalling Vioxx and its shares tumbled to as low as $25.74. The stock closed at $30.98 on Nov. 25.

Liability lawsuits
Merck won a key court case in September in a suit brought by a former Vioxx user, but the company still faces thousands of liability lawsuits around the country.

The company, which employs 63,000 people worldwide, said restructuring costs are expected to be from $350 million to $400 million in 2005 and $800 million to $1 billion in 2006. The restructuring is expected to result in pretax savings of $3.5 billion to $4 billion from 2006 through 2010.

Workin' 4 Toys
11-29-2005, 09:31 AM
Have seen some spy photos of the '07 trucks as well and it looks like they are going to look very similar to the Tahoe & Yukons (big surprise). they look really nice and the displacement on demand is going to be great for the mileage. I have an '03 but will be ready for a new '08 so the redesign is coming just in time for me. The Tundra is going to have a major redesign for '08 and from all reports it is going to be a bigger and badder truck. If it lhas similar lines to the concept truck it is going to get a serious look from me as well. Can't wait
They said the '07 GM SUV will be the most fuel efficient in "it's" class. Now I don't know what that means exactly, because what is in its class?

Workin' 4 Toys
11-29-2005, 09:35 AM
I think the boost was to the consumer ... you don't see the foreign companies undercutting one another in order to clear inventory, in the end that's all the incentives really are ... IMO.
Right, now they just tell you they are going to pay for the maintenance for the first three years.

MYMC
11-29-2005, 10:04 AM
About sums it all up... http://moneycentral.msn.com/content/P134541.asp#msnhp

Ryan
12-01-2005, 12:34 PM
SUMMER DISCOUNTS HURT WINTER AUTO SALES
Analysts See 15% November Sales Drop for GM, Ford
November 30, 2005
QwikFIND ID: AAR18L
By Jean Halliday
DETROIT (AdAge.com) -- Summer employee-discount sales will continue to pain domestic automakers as they start announcing November sales tomorrow.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------


November drop
John Casesa, auto analyst at Merrill Lynch, predicts that both General Motors Corp. and Ford Motor Co. will see November vehicle sales drop by 15% compared to November 2004, the aftereffects of summer deals that siphoned off sales that would otherwise have occurred later in the year or even in early 2006.

Major Asian nameplates will continue to increase sales at Detroit’s expense. Mr. Casesa projected a low-double-digit percentage jump for Toyota Motor Sales USA in November-over-November sales, and predicted that American Honda Motor Co. and Nissan North America will report small gains.

Edmunds.com, an independent auto information Web site, forecast that GM, Ford and Chrysler Group would tally a combined November market share of 56.1%, slightly off from 56.3% in November 2004, but better than last month’s record low of 52.3%.

Slow start
Car and truck sales got off to a slow start in November, but were offset by promotions later in the month from Detroit, said Jesse Toprak, executive director-industry analysis at Edmunds.com. He expects large sport utilities and truck segments to recover significantly in December due to those incentives, lower gas prices and seasonal demand for four-wheel-drive vehicles.

Todd Turner, president of consultant CarConcepts, said most automakers are in better shape now than a year ago since the summer deals generally cleared out 2005 models.

GM's Red Tag Sale
Still, automakers are dashing to 2005’s finish line hoping to juice their annual numbers by advertising end-of-the-year sales. GM’s “Red Tag Sale,” announced earlier this month after sluggish early November results, is essentially a year-end clearance, said Mr. Turner. If the Red Tag push doesn’t work, GM may be under pressure to cut production this quarter, said Mr. Casesa. [italics added]

DaimlerChrysler’s Mercedes-Benz USA’s “Winter Event” offers special lease deals through Jan. 3 on select 2006 C-Class, E-Class, M-Class and R-Class models, according to its Web site, mbusa.com. Mr. Turner said he’s surprised there are already deals on the all-new R-Class sport wagon because the model was only launched a few months ago. Although Mercedes-Benz had planned for a relatively low sales tally for R-Class, “I don’t think it launched as well as they hoped it would,” he added.

Honda is heavily advertising its “Happy Honda Days,” offering special lease deals on certain 2006-models, including the Ridgeline pickup, Accord car line and Pilot sport utility. Independent RPA, Santa Monica, handles.

Workin' 4 Toys
12-01-2005, 10:54 PM
Maybe the '07 Camaro SS will help boost sales. I'll be in line for a test drive. We shall see...

Otherwise I may have to test out the '07 Vette. In Red or Silver, not sure yet.;)

Workin' 4 Toys
12-13-2005, 10:36 PM
Looks like Ford is following along........:mad:

Leroy
12-13-2005, 10:44 PM
W4T's; They have shadowed each other throughout history so their moves always look alike.

Better try and buy the vette! GM will be happier with that decision!
If you read around you hear about the fully featured compact car for $3k from China that is just around the corner. That will be a train wreck.

milkmania
12-13-2005, 10:47 PM
W4T's; They have shadowed each other throughout history so their moves always look alike.

Better try and buy the vette! GM will be happier with that decision!
If you read around you hear about the fully featured compact car for $3k from China that is just around the corner. That will be a train wreck.

and we at TeamTalk all know how that turned out:rolleyes:

http://www.tmcowners.com/teamtalk/showthread.php?t=5661

Workin' 4 Toys
12-14-2005, 11:46 AM
Please tell me you have seen these. There are alot of them around. And yes, they can have street legal license plates, and can be fully insured.
http://www.gemcar.com/asp/subpage_vehicles.asp

Ric
12-14-2005, 01:18 PM
Flipped by a show on speed channel the other day where a detroit news guy and a speed channel guy were sitting with one of the heads of GM talking regarding layoffs, plant closings and renegotions with UAW.

I think we're seeing a vast and painful correction in the US auto making industry.
How long can we pay these higher wages to people who want to work less? (this question was most likely asked 30 years ago fellas)
Productivity is important to competition. The GM guy's points were valid when you look at what they pay a worker compared to what the national average is and then factor in the benefit packages etc that come with being an old company.
Big mean US automakers are going to start getting lean and mean in order to stay alive. It's not completely the union's fault but which came first, the union or the lights out manufacturing process?
Wanna keep your jobs here? Start being more valuable to the company maybe?
I'm often misunderstood, so I'm ready for the flaming.

Tom023
12-14-2005, 01:27 PM
There are many issues contributing to the decline of the U.S. auto industry, the union pay structure just being one of them, but a valid point. Other factors include desireability of product, which includes quality, innovation, freshness, etc., the dealer body to some extent, corporate and management philosopy and culture, just to name a few. With an estimated 1 in 7 jobs tied to the industry in some way, I hope to see a resurgence as a result of the tough restructing plans being put in place.

bigmac
12-17-2005, 12:01 PM
Ah...not to worry. General Motors has figured it out and they'll be back in the game in no time.

CNN article... (http://www.cnn.com/2005/AUTOS/funonwheels/12/12/chevy_cool/index.html)

Apparently it's not about engineering, or gas mileage, or reliability...it's about design and styling.

Ryan
01-27-2006, 02:56 PM
GM REPORTS $8.6 BILLION LOSS FOR 2005
North America Continues to Drag Down Automaker's Results
http://adage.com/news.cms?newsId=47633