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puzlparts
11-19-2005, 10:44 PM
Hi all,
Am shopping for a new tow vehicle for my MC X-9. Because of work and family needs, need to get an SUV. Am considering a Chev Tahoe or a Dodge Durango. Boat/trailer wt is about 4100lbs. Any suggestions?

bigmac
11-19-2005, 11:22 PM
Hi all,
Am shopping for a new tow vehicle for my MC X-9. Because of work and family needs, need to get an SUV. Am considering a Chev Tahoe or a Dodge Durango. Boat/trailer wt is about 4100lbs. Any suggestions?

I don't know about the Durango. Assuming you're talking about 4WD, a Tahoe would work fine as a tow vehicle, but make sure you get the towing package because you'll definitely want the oil tranny cooler and stiffer rear suspension and 7 lead connector. I'd also recommend the 4.10 rear end.

jmac197
11-20-2005, 12:07 AM
I pull my '02 197 with an '05 Durango. I love the room! The third seat is actually comfortable for adults. It tows really well, brakes well, handles the trailer well...well I do wish I got the Hemi. The 4.7 struggles a bit on the hills.

We go on several day/overnight trips with our 2 kids and their friends each summer and travel for hockey about every weekend durin gthe season. The roominess really comes in handy at the end of the trip when they start getting on each other's nerves.

Knock on wood we haven't had any problems. The fit and finish is very good, although they did over do it with the plastics.

h2oskier
11-20-2005, 03:39 AM
I would say go with the Chevy or even consider a GMC. The Dodge, if you were to go with a Hemi, would not be good on MPG.

mckay4
11-20-2005, 08:15 AM
I pull my 05 X-Star with an 05 Durango hemi, no problem with power and as far as gas mileage, 12mpg pulling that heavy thing and close to 17mpg back and forth to work. What milleage does the Tahoe get pulling a boat?

ski_king
11-20-2005, 08:21 AM
If you don't need the 3rd row of seats, give a good look at a crew cab pickup. I would go with a bench 40/60 seat up front so you can still haul 6 when needed.
If you need the 3rd row, I am partial to the Expidition or maybe even the Explorer.

Tom023
11-20-2005, 08:36 AM
I would check out the Toyota Sequoia, but I am biased. May not have the highest power rating and all the different powertrain options, but it will pull your X9 just fine, as is the overall quality and long-term durability.

Jim
11-20-2005, 09:50 AM
Hi all,
Am shopping for a new tow vehicle for my MC X-9. Because of work and family needs, need to get an SUV. Am considering a Chev Tahoe or a Dodge Durango. Boat/trailer wt is about 4100lbs. Any suggestions?


If you go with a GM product, get nothing less than the 5.3 ltr. and 3.73's in the rear. Anything less, you'll probably be disappointed.

Leroy
11-20-2005, 10:24 AM
I'm with you Tom, I can't think of a reason to buy anything else!



I would check out the Toyota Sequoia, but I am biased. May not have the highest power rating and all the different powertrain options, but it will pull your X9 just fine, as is the overall quality and long-term durability.

bigmac
11-20-2005, 10:37 AM
I would say go with the Chevy or even consider a GMC.

:confused:

Chevy Tahoe is the exact same vehicle as a GMC Yukon with a slight change in sheet metal styling and a slight rearrangement of option packages.

bigmac
11-20-2005, 10:42 AM
If you go with a GM product, get nothing less than the 5.3 ltr. and 3.73's in the rear. Anything less, you'll probably be disappointed.

In 4WD model Tahoe/Yukon, 3.73 rear end is apparently no longer available. Choices are either 3.42 or 4.10.

twieder
11-20-2005, 04:20 PM
I currently pull a 2000 x-star with an 02 durango and it does great. Our lease is up next month and we're going to an 06 GMC Serria 1/2 ton 4x4 with 4.10 gears and the 5.3 engine. Test drove one and dealer let me bring home and hook up to the boat. Pulled it about 25 miles back to dealer and it did great.We're getting the crew cab with bucket seats though as it's my wife,me and one kid (16) and hes got his own ride.

Cloaked
11-20-2005, 04:49 PM
Hi all,
Am shopping for a new tow vehicle for my MC X-9. Because of work and family needs, need to get an SUV. Am considering a Chev Tahoe or a Dodge Durango. Boat/trailer wt is about 4100lbs. Any suggestions?
Go heavier duty, go diesel, and full 4 (or 5) doors with a GMC... :D

All said and done, go heavier duty as to what you have described here... You can thank me later... ;)

I am running a 3.73 :1 gear in a 2500 HD diesel machine. Works like a champ... :cool:

SteveO
11-20-2005, 05:27 PM
I pull my 209 with a 2005 V8 4 Runner (2 wheel drive). It pulls the boat without any problems and gets about 11-12 when towing. Most of my other driving is highway and the last 3 tanks averaged 21.8

Workin' 4 Toys
11-20-2005, 05:30 PM
Chev Tahoe
Consider it, and only it, compared to your other consideration.

sten76
11-20-2005, 05:52 PM
I use a 1995 Chevy Tahoe to pull our 209 and it works great. She pulls like a champ.

dwe
11-20-2005, 11:18 PM
My mom has an '01 tahoe that we pull a 6,000 lb trailer from Orlando to Atlanta (base motor, rear end). and it does great. My dad has a tundra v8 which is the same as a sequia, which has made the trip a few times as well. The tahoe is a better tow vehicle. Both have 100k miles, and both very reliable (tundra had o2 sensors replaced, and rear drum brakes are a pain).

Sten76--I just sold my caprice and am looking at getting a '95-97 tahoe/yukon 4x4. I've got a couple questions for you:
-What kind of mileage are you getting? The '95 is rated at 12/15, and the '97 15/19(vortec).
-how do you like the pre-vortec motor?
-I've been told to watch out for weak transmissions; any experiences?
-anything to look out for, or advice?

Thanks!
David

Workin' 4 Toys
11-20-2005, 11:49 PM
My mom has an '01 tahoe that we pull a 6,000 lb trailer from Orlando to Atlanta (base motor, rear end). and it does great. My dad has a tundra v8 which is the same as a sequia, which has made the trip a few times as well. The tahoe is a better tow vehicle. Both have 100k miles, and both very reliable (tundra had o2 sensors replaced, and rear drum brakes are a pain).

Sten76--I just sold my caprice and am looking at getting a '95-97 tahoe/yukon 4x4. I've got a couple questions for you:
-What kind of mileage are you getting? The '95 is rated at 12/15, and the '97 15/19(vortec).
-how do you like the pre-vortec motor?
-I've been told to watch out for weak transmissions; any experiences?
-anything to look out for, or advice?

Thanks!
David
FUEL PUMP!!! Find out if the one you are buying has ever had it replaced. If not or if it is unknown, put one in it ASAP. They give no notice of failure, and when they go, they go fast. Its worth the $100.00 and do it yourself than the $700.00 parts, labor and with a tow later.
I don't think those trucks are any more prone to tranny failure than anything else on the road. Give it a good test drive, make sure the trans doesn't slip, and the fluid isn't burnt. Other than that, great trucks, should get a few hundred thousand out of it.
Just my 2 cents.

Hoff1
11-21-2005, 08:00 AM
I pull with an Grand Cherokee with the 4.7 V8. From my standpoint, I was something that has just enough power to not struggle, but will get 20+ mpg without towing on the highway. The towing is such a small portion of my vehicles usage. This Jeep has been a good fit. Iíve averaged as high as 22 mpg highway. Towing is probably around 12 Ė 14 depending on the terrain. Itís setup for a 6500 lb tow limit and has the 7 pin connector.

Ric
11-21-2005, 10:04 AM
My mom has an '01 tahoe that we pull a 6,000 lb trailer from Orlando to Atlanta (base motor, rear end). and it does great. My dad has a tundra v8 which is the same as a sequia, which has made the trip a few times as well. The tahoe is a better tow vehicle. Both have 100k miles, and both very reliable (tundra had o2 sensors replaced, and rear drum brakes are a pain).

Sten76--I just sold my caprice and am looking at getting a '95-97 tahoe/yukon 4x4. I've got a couple questions for you:
-What kind of mileage are you getting? The '95 is rated at 12/15, and the '97 15/19(vortec).
-how do you like the pre-vortec motor?
-I've been told to watch out for weak transmissions; any experiences?
-anything to look out for, or advice?

Thanks!
David
95-97 GM 4x4's EAT front brake pads, so be ready for that(about 20k miles was brake pad life on the front!)
also, The vortec in 96 was quite a change from 95, you will love that motor and it'll run a long long time for you.
I think 96 was when GM went to all s/s exhaust system but I'm not sure??
One flaw they had was a cheapo little fitting on top of the intake for a coolant line. it was junk metal and of course broke and leaked coolant just outside of warranty! The thing is about $10 at the dealer and if you replace it now, you won't have to extract the broken threaded part from the manifold later :mad:
Nice trucks for sure!

Diesel
11-21-2005, 10:17 AM
Since I sold my Duramax I tow the 209 with my wife's Yukon. It tows just fine power and handling wise but I am adding a set of airbags in lieu of the rear springs this winter to help with the squat. Keep it in 3rd gear and you will be very happy and your transmission will thank you.

http://img359.imageshack.us/img359/5176/dsc00923r1ww.jpg

JDK
11-21-2005, 10:20 AM
FUEL PUMP!!! Find out if the one you are buying has ever had it replaced. If not or if it is unknown, put one in it ASAP. They give no notice of failure, and when they go, they go fast. Its worth the $100.00 and do it yourself than the $700.00 parts, labor and with a tow later.


You're right, but I don't think you'll be doing it yourself for $100. Don't they cost like $400+ and don't you need to remove the tank to get at it?

JDK
11-21-2005, 10:28 AM
I am adding a set of airbags in lieu of the rear springs this winter to help with the squat.

Looks to me like you have a lot of tongue weight there (check with a scale). Maybe try sliding the boat back a few inches on the trailer and see what happens to the squat.
I don't think you should need to boost the springs in a Yukon to tow a 209 safely.

btw; nice set-up you have there! (the truck AND the boat)

Diesel
11-21-2005, 10:31 AM
You're right, but I don't think you'll be doing it yourself for $100. Don't they cost like $400+ and don't you need to remove the tank to get at it?

My wholesale cost on the AC Delco unit is $269.29.............retail $399.99 this includes the sending unit and all. You used to be able to just buy the pump itself for around $100 and splice it into the sending unit. No reputable aftermarket MFGs sell just the pump anymore, stating it is an emission issue, bla, bla, bla............Yes the tank has to come out and it really is not that bad............takes a few hours, max. There is no pattern. I have seen brand new units go at 5k and others last well over 100k. My wife's Yukon is on its second fuel pump at 86k. Keep your tank full and filters clean and it will help prolong the inevitable...........

bigmac
11-21-2005, 10:33 AM
Since I sold my Duramax I tow the 209 with my wife's Yukon. It tows just fine power and handling wise but I am adding a set of airbags in lieu of the rear springs this winter to help with the squat. Keep it in 3rd gear and you will be very happy and your transmission will thank you.

http://img359.imageshack.us/img359/5176/dsc00923r1ww.jpg

That vintage Yukon should have a tow-haul mode switch on the end of the shifter. That will change all the shift points to accomodate the towed weight, and will keep the tranny in out of overdrive under almost all circumstances. Keeping the transmission in 3rd gear while towing is unnecessary.

Diesel
11-21-2005, 10:37 AM
Looks to me like you have a lot of tongue weight there (check with a scale). Maybe try sliding the boat back a few inches on the trailer and see what happens to the squat.
I don't think you should need to boost the springs in a Yukon to tow a 209 safely.

btw; nice set-up you have there! (the truck AND the boat)

Thanks for the props........

The tounge weight is perfect at 410lbs. The springs are simply too soft at a spring rate of 289in/lbs. BTW there are many different GVW configurations for the Yukon. Her's happnes to be on the lighter side at 6600#. Just made the cut for the IRS section 179 deprciation deduction!

east tx skier
11-21-2005, 10:43 AM
First thing I did to my expedition after the transmission cooler was stiffer shocks in the rear. Made a ton of difference and didn't noticeably change the ride when I wasn't towing.

Diesel
11-21-2005, 10:52 AM
That vintage Yukon should have a tow-haul mode switch on the end of the shifter. That will change all the shift points to accomodate the towed weight, and will keep the tranny in out of overdrive under almost all circumstances. Keeping the transmission in 3rd gear while towing is unnecessary.

Dealer tell you this as well. :)

The tow hall button prolongs solenoid engagement which helps to get the load moving and prolongs lock up, it does not somehow magically change the ratios. The internal hard parts and frictions in the 4L60E have not changed since its introduction in 92 and are still just as vulnerable inspite of the T/H programming. Busy shifting will create heat, breakdown fluids, and wear linings, its a fact. I can put my wife's Yukon in 3rd T/H engaged and the converter will never unlock and it will have plenty of power. In 4th T/H engaged it is constantly locking and unlocking the converter and often times dropping into 3rd to crest hills. At 0.7 overdrive locked the 5.3 does not have the power to keep the weight moving, it has to use the mechanical advantage of the converter and then 3rd. Any time the converter is unlocked or a downshift occurs heat is generated and the life of your trany is shortened.

To keep a happy transmission change fluids/filter every year and tow in 3rd T/H engaged. Gas is cheper than parts............at least right now :D

JDK
11-21-2005, 11:15 AM
I can put my wife's Yukon in 3rd T/H engaged and the converter will never unlock and it will have plenty of power.

IMO, the first time most people do this, they see their tach shoot to 3000 or 3200 rpm and they think they are being hard on their engine (when in fact the opposite is true), so they do whatever they can to keep the rpm's down.
I don't think most people realize how hard all this shifting (especially the converter locking and unlocking) is on the trans.

Ric
11-21-2005, 11:16 AM
Diesel, after reading that I actually feel better about NOT knowing what the hell goes on in my transmission :eek: .
I maybe asking for trouble, but I haven't had a GM truck transmission problem since my 82 4x4 rolled about 120k miles (I believe that was the so-called "metric 700R" transmission which sucked entirely??)
I've run about 6 GM trucks since those days to over 100k each without transmission service or repair and I chuckle at the BG guy on the tv commercials while he's song-&-dancing some snake oil.

Very Nice combo with the Tahoe and the 209!!

Dealer tell you this as well. :)

The tow hall button prolongs solenoid engagement which helps to get the load moving and prolongs lock up, it does not somehow magically change the ratios. The internal hard parts and frictions in the 4L60E have not changed since its introduction in 92 and are still just as vulnerable inspite of the T/H programming. Busy shifting will create heat, breakdown fluids, and wear linings, its a fact. I can put my wife's Yukon in 3rd T/H engaged and the converter will never unlock and it will have plenty of power. In 4th T/H engaged it is constantly locking and unlocking the converter and often times dropping into 3rd to crest hills. At 0.7 overdrive locked the 5.3 does not have the power to keep the weight moving, it has to use the mechanical advantage of the converter and then 3rd. Any time the converter is unlocked or a downshift occurs heat is generated and the life of your trany is shortened.

To keep a happy transmission change fluids/filter every year and tow in 3rd T/H engaged. Gas is cheper than parts............at least right now :D

jraben8
11-21-2005, 11:44 AM
First thing I did to my expedition after the transmission cooler was stiffer shocks in the rear. Made a ton of difference and didn't noticeably change the ride when I wasn't towing.

ETS,

Which shocks did you change to on the rear of your Expy? I'm thinking of going with Bilsteins on mine but wanted to know if anyone has gone a different route.

bigmac
11-21-2005, 11:49 AM
Dealer tell you this as well. :)

The tow hall button prolongs solenoid engagement which helps to get the load moving and prolongs lock up, it does not somehow magically change the ratios. The internal hard parts and frictions in the 4L60E have not changed since its introduction in 92 and are still just as vulnerable inspite of the T/H programming. Busy shifting will create heat, breakdown fluids, and wear linings, its a fact. I can put my wife's Yukon in 3rd T/H engaged and the converter will never unlock and it will have plenty of power. In 4th T/H engaged it is constantly locking and unlocking the converter and often times dropping into 3rd to crest hills. At 0.7 overdrive locked the 5.3 does not have the power to keep the weight moving, it has to use the mechanical advantage of the converter and then 3rd. Any time the converter is unlocked or a downshift occurs heat is generated and the life of your trany is shortened.

To keep a happy transmission change fluids/filter every year and tow in 3rd T/H engaged. Gas is cheper than parts............at least right now :D

I actually had a chance to experiment with this very issue hauling about 6000 pounds of trailer and horses to Wisconsin behind my 6 liter Denali. It has a tranny temperature gauge. Third gear vs Drive with or without T/H = no difference in indicated tranny temps.

Granted, it's not a 5.3 liter and it was highway driving. However, in previous 5.3 liters I've owned, including my wife's Yukon and my son's current Silverado hauling snowmobiles back from Wyoming and around Minnesota, I've found that it's rare that it will be constantly locking and unlocking in Drive with T/H engaged. It's how that truck has been used for towing for over 120,000 miles. He had to put in a new locking differential about 15,000 miles ago, but the tranny is going strong.

All anecdotal, I know. And I don't disagree with the theory of your argument, it's just that it varies a little from my own experience with 7 different Tahoe's/Yukon/Silverados since they started putting Tow/Haul mode switches in.

east tx skier
11-21-2005, 11:56 AM
ETS,

Which shocks did you change to on the rear of your Expy? I'm thinking of going with Bilsteins on mine but wanted to know if anyone has gone a different route.

On Lee's advice, which may still be on the board somewhere, I went with the second least expensive shocks Sears had to offer. Not the Rancho, but the cheaper ones. I told them that I wanted them to be a little stiffer than stock, but not too stiff. Worked out perfectly. My one trip to the lake on the OEM springs was like being on the lake. That truck bounced all over the place.

Diesel
11-21-2005, 12:23 PM
I actually had a chance to experiment with this very issue hauling about 6000 pounds of trailer and horses to Wisconsin behind my 6 liter Denali. It has a tranny temperature gauge. Third gear vs Drive with or without T/H = no difference in indicated tranny temps.

Granted, it's not a 5.3 liter and it was highway driving. However, in previous 5.3 liters I've owned, including my wife's Yukon and my son's current Silverado hauling snowmobiles back from Wyoming and around Minnesota, I've found that it's rare that it will be constantly locking and unlocking in Drive with T/H engaged. It's how that truck has been used for towing for over 120,000 miles. He had to put in a new locking differential about 15,000 miles ago, but the tranny is going strong.

All anecdotal, I know. And I don't disagree with the theory of your argument, it's just that it varies a little from my own experience with 7 different Tahoe's/Yukon/Silverados since they started putting Tow/Haul mode switches in.

If it works for you keep on keepin on........ :)

I cringe every time the converter unlocks on my wife's truck or it has to down shift into 3rd (at least the few times I have tried to town in D). Most people do not have any clue when the converter is locked or unlocked so do not realize what is really happening. A lot depends upon terrain and speed. I can hold the load in 4th locked with my wife's truck at speeds under 70mph with moderate hills. At 70+ the transmission is all over the place with it in D. I usually run 75-80mph in 3rd with the converter locked. This is usually around 3200rpm which puts the engine closer to its torque curve. I average around 12mpg with the 5.3.

FWIW I had two Duramax trucks that both had factory tranny temp gauges and neither would show temps above 200. I tapped an aftermarket tranny temp gauge into both trucks and you would be amazed at how inaccurate that gauge really is. Same goes for the factory engine temp gauge. It's like they both went to 185 and never moved regardless of actual temp shown by my aftermarket gauges.

I think towing in D could be safe given the right conditions. I also know towing my MC to and from our lake requires 3rd for my given set of conditions. If the converter stays locked and the transmission does not downshift given your conditions towing in 4th should be just fine.

Most people do not know what to look for to determine if the converter is busy. It is easy to tell when the transmission downshifts but few pay attention. This is why I always recommend most people tow in 3rd, it's the safest gear. IMHO if over the course of an average trip your converter unlocks more than a dozen times you are in the wrong gear. If it has to down shift more than 6 times you are definitely in the wrong gear.

tyler_jim
11-21-2005, 12:34 PM
I have the same boat with a double axle MC trailer. Towing it is a Toyota Sequioa. Nice vehicle! Expensive to buy, but Limited version comes fully loaded.
Compared it with a Suburban (always my dream truck), but local dealer, Toyota reputation, etc, interupted the dream.
We are very happy with our Sequioa.

Ric
11-21-2005, 12:37 PM
anyone here have the full size tundra?

I've always liked toyotas but never owned one...

drove next to a tundra on the parkway last week and the rear half of the bedside was waving or flexing as the truck hit bumps.... Was something wrong with this guy's truck or is this expected on the Tundra??

tyler_jim
11-21-2005, 12:38 PM
I have the X9 boat with a double axle MC trailer. Towing it is a Toyota Sequoia. Nice vehicle! Expensive to buy, but Limited version comes fully loaded.
Compared it with a Suburban (always my dream truck), but local dealer, Toyota reputation, etc, interupted the dream.
We are very happy with our Sequioa.

captain planet
11-21-2005, 12:55 PM
For what its worth, I have a few friends in the boating industry and I have been told that anyone that has been in the business for very long owns a GM to do the towing.

Last year I was getting a new tow vehicle and was contemplating between a Chevy and a Ford. I was told to get a Chevy. I never considered a Dodge because of questionable trannys.

So go with the GM. However, you may want to consider getting a Surburban/Yukon XL over a Tahoe or Yukon and here are the reasons. The mileage is the same, you get a third row of seats, and the biggest reason is the added wheel base. The Surburban is a little longer which makes towing a breeze.

maristarman
11-21-2005, 01:39 PM
For what its worth, I have a few friends in the boating industry and I have been told that anyone that has been in the business for very long owns a GM to do the towing.

Last year I was getting a new tow vehicle and was contemplating between a Chevy and a Ford. I was told to get a Chevy. I never considered a Dodge because of questionable trannys.

So go with the GM. However, you may want to consider getting a Surburban/Yukon XL over a Tahoe or Yukon and here are the reasons. The mileage is the same, you get a third row of seats, and the biggest reason is the added wheel base. The Surburban is a little longer which makes towing a breeze.

When we got our boat we had a 3 year old suburban and a brand new F-150 Supercrew with the big V8.

At different times, I asked 3 different people at the boat dealership which one they thought would be better for towing the boat.

All 3 said Suburban without even batting an eye.

I was skeptical (mainly because the truck was mine, and color matched the boat) so we tried towing it with the 'Crew and then with the wife's Suburban.

I gotta confess the suburban handled it effortlessly. Not so much for the truck.

Rockman
11-21-2005, 01:39 PM
Alright,

All this talkin about trannies has made me sweat a bit :eek:

We have the 02 2500HD with the 6.0 liter gas.

We use the T/H mode only when approaching a steep incline, etc.

We tow in D with no T/H mode on ever.

We have not had any problems with the tranny (knock on wood) yet. The truck runs as good as it does when we first got it and that was 104k miles ago. We have never had any tranny work done including fluid changes.

Anything I should be aware of or need to look for?

We have a family member who works for GM that we take the truck to for general maintenance and it is checked over any time we bring it in so I am confident that if anything was wrong, we would have been notified.

Ric
11-21-2005, 01:41 PM
Alright,

All this talkin about trannies has made me sweat a bit :eek:

We have the 02 2500HD with the 6.0 liter gas.

We use the T/H mode only when approaching a steep incline, etc.

We tow in D with no T/H mode on ever.

We have not had any problems with the tranny (knock on wood) yet. The truck runs as good as it does when we first got it and that was 104k miles ago. We have never had any tranny work done including fluid changes.

Anything I should be aware of or need to look for?

We have a family member who works for GM that we take the truck to for general maintenance and it is checked over any time we bring it in so I am confident that if anything was wrong, we would have been notified.
Rock is that the allison transmission, or the same as my 1500HD 6.0 runs??

JDK
11-21-2005, 02:29 PM
I'm thinking of going with Bilsteins on mine but wanted to know if anyone has gone a different route.

Don't mean to butt in on your question here, but shocks and the springs are two different kettles of fish.
If you are wanting to reduce rear end 'squat' as we were referring to earlier in this thread, springs are what's needed and shocks don't help here.....they don't do anything for towing capacity.
If you are unhappy with your ride and handling while towing, shocks are what you are after.

Diesel
11-21-2005, 03:06 PM
Rock is that the allison transmission, or the same as my 1500HD 6.0 runs??

Not the ally only the 6.6 and 8.1 have the ally. The 1500HD and 2500HD 6.0s have the 4L80E transmissions. The Denali and Escalade trucks have the 6.0 with a HD version of the 4L60E.

4L80E was designed more for heavy towing as compared to the 4L60E. Since the 6.0 has more power the combo will proably not hunt as much. I would just pay attention to your down shifts and converter lock up.

FWIW I was able to tow my 209 with my father-in-laws denali in 4th gear on the interstate. It performed quite well and only unlocked the converter a hand full of times and never once dropped down a gear. Once we were in the Ozarks I dropped it down into 3rd for the rest of the trip.

east tx skier
11-21-2005, 03:29 PM
Don't mean to butt in on your question here, but shocks and the springs are two different kettles of fish.
If you are wanting to reduce rear end 'squat' as we were referring to earlier in this thread, springs are what's needed and shocks don't help here.....they don't do anything for towing capacity.
If you are unhappy with your ride and handling while towing, shocks are what you are after.

I know I wasn't quoted, but if my response mentioned springs, I mispoke. I added shocks because my rear end was bouncing, i.e., the ride needed improvement.

bigmac
11-21-2005, 03:51 PM
Not the ally only the 6.6 and 8.1 have the ally. The 1500HD and 2500HD 6.0s have the 4L80E transmissions. The Denali and Escalade trucks have the 6.0 with a HD version of the 4L60E.

4L80E was designed more for heavy towing as compared to the 4L60E. Since the 6.0 has more power the combo will proably not hunt as much. I would just pay attention to your down shifts and converter lock up.

FWIW I was able to tow my 209 with my father-in-laws denali in 4th gear on the interstate. It performed quite well and only unlocked the converter a hand full of times and never once dropped down a gear. Once we were in the Ozarks I dropped it down into 3rd for the rest of the trip.

This is really interesting stuff, Diesel. I appreciate your expertise. I do know torque converter lockup when I feel it (assuming I'm paying attention to it), and it hasn't been something I've noticed in my Denali pickup hauling relatively heavy stuff, but I'm going to rethink the entire 3rd gear concept.

While I've never had a transmission problem in a GM truck, I confess that my son's 99 Silverado with 120,000 miles currently on it is the only truck we've ever kept longer than 50,000 miles.

Workin' 4 Toys
11-21-2005, 03:52 PM
You're right, but I don't think you'll be doing it yourself for $100. Don't they cost like $400+ and don't you need to remove the tank to get at it?
They should be between the 90-120 range(carter or the like) at a local parts shop unless you go A/C delco then a few bucks more. Maybe 200-300.

jraben8
11-21-2005, 03:56 PM
Don't mean to butt in on your question here, but shocks and the springs are two different kettles of fish.
If you are wanting to reduce rear end 'squat' as we were referring to earlier in this thread, springs are what's needed and shocks don't help here.....they don't do anything for towing capacity.
If you are unhappy with your ride and handling while towing, shocks are what you are after.


I'm just trying to remove some of the bounce. There is no noticable squat at all with my SS behind it.

Now on the other hand, my 4-Runner before the Expy needed and got springs because we were on the axle 1/2 of the way to the lake with a '87 ProStar...

Workin' 4 Toys
11-21-2005, 04:05 PM
I'm just trying to remove some of the bounce. There is no noticable squat at all with my SS behind it.

Now on the other hand, my 4-Runner before the Expy needed and got springs because we were on the axle 1/2 of the way to the lake with a '87 ProStar...
Bilstein shocks. Number 1 in my book.

RobertT
11-21-2005, 08:27 PM
Didn't even read everything...but another useless bit of info from a owner with blinders on.....

First, I own (either personally or through business) GM, Chevy (same thing), and ford.

The Ford diesel is a fine truck. My die hard diesel guys love them, and I like driving them. If they were quit and could turn around in a football field, I would own one. I owned a ford and a chevy diesel as personal vehicles...and probably will not again. Its overkill for boat hauling. We use them to pull 10k plus equipment daily.

I had two Dodge trucks in the last 10 years. Both sucked completely. Both got exactly 10.9mph on the overhead gauge, and both dropped trannies. They all went through tires every 35k miles and brakes about as fast. On the plus side, they were the best looking and had the finest interior that I have ever seen.

I drove a Ford Expedition for a few years. VERY nice to drive, but not a particularly great mechanical vehicle. It had a lot of minor issues like windows that quit working, etc. It also went through tires and brakes.

I then bought a Suburban and a Tahoe....

I hate the interiors in both, Ford is much better and Dodge beat them both all to heck.

However, the GM products are at a level of mechanical superiority so far above my experience level with anything else on the market that I cannot fathom buying anything else.

I pull weekly with my Suburban. I usually buy a new truck every few years...but I just cant think of a reason to get rid of mine. I am waiting for 07 to do so.

I have 100K on my Suburban this week. I have never had a brake job (but had it checked every oil change), I have never had any work done to it other than oil changes. Never..anything. This week I get my 100k service. It will be a ton of money, but I am getting it serviced by the book and forcing them to perform a brake job rather it needs it or not.

I pull a few pieces of equipment over 10k, I pull a travel trailer all over the country, I use it like it was intended and have NEVER had it complain even once.

I have ZERO brand loyalty. If I perceived that Ford had a better product next week we would sell our GM products in a heartbeat.

Having that said, my personal experience was that Dodge mechanically was not good. Ford was in the middle, and GM makes a workhorse that is perfect except for being a little on the non sexy side. Again, the interiors are not perfect by any measure.

I get 15mpg with my Suburban with roof racks full of kayaks going 80mph.

I get 12mpg pulling 7k pounds.

For what its worth.

dwe
11-27-2005, 12:16 AM
Well, I bought a better tow vehicle to replace the caprice. I got a '98 GMC Yukon w/ 126k miles. The drivetrain seems in good shape, and the body and interior are pretty nice as well. I plan to replace all the fluids, and go through the rest of the truck over Christmas. I'm also going to look into replacing the fuel pump, and shocks as well.

On the fuel pump, what causes them to fail? Is it aggravated by running low fuel and the pump sucking air? Is their a big difference betweent the carter and delco pump/sender? My fuel guage needle has a slight vibration to it; and suggestions as to cause?

Any recomendation on shocks? (Rancho, KYB, Bilstein, etc?)

Thanks!

6ballsisall
11-27-2005, 11:18 PM
I pull with an Grand Cherokee with the 4.7 V8. From my standpoint, I was something that has just enough power to not struggle, but will get 20+ mpg without towing on the highway. The towing is such a small portion of my vehicles usage. This Jeep has been a good fit. Iíve averaged as high as 22 mpg highway. Towing is probably around 12 Ė 14 depending on the terrain. Itís setup for a 6500 lb tow limit and has the 7 pin connector.

Hoff man you gotta teach me how you get that mileage with your GC. We took my wifes 04 GC with V8 down to Gatlinburg last week. I set the cruise at 69 (2000 rpms) and literally babied it down there and got 19.5 hand calculated. How do you break 20mpg? BTW, here's has 26k miles on it.

Hoff1
11-28-2005, 07:55 AM
The mileage to seems to decrease as the outside air temperature decreases. Combustion efficiency decreases with air temperature. Your mileage is very similar to what Iím getting currently. During August though, I was getting around 20-22 on the highway. This past weekend, I got about 16 highway because of high winds and high speeds.

Diesel
11-28-2005, 09:53 AM
Well, I bought a better tow vehicle to replace the caprice. I got a '98 GMC Yukon w/ 126k miles. The drive train seems in good shape, and the body and interior are pretty nice as well. I plan to replace all the fluids, and go through the rest of the truck over Christmas. I'm also going to look into replacing the fuel pump, and shocks as well.

On the fuel pump, what causes them to fail? Is it aggravated by running low fuel and the pump sucking air? Is their a big difference between the carter and delco pump/sender? My fuel gauge needle has a slight vibration to it; and suggestions as to cause?

Any recommendation on shocks? (Rancho, KYB, Bilstein, etc?)

Thanks!

Don't replace the fuel pump until it goes. It's such a crap shoot that the new one might not last 10k and the one you are running might last another 100k. There is no difference between the AC and Carter. Both are mfg by Federal Mogul and come out of the same plant. Keeping more than a 1/4 tank will help prolong the life of the pump by keeping it cool as well as positive pressure on the diaphragm. Sending unit is probably causing the needle variations.

I like RS99000 series shocks for full size trucks. Bilstein are very good but just do not offer enough damping for my ride tastes. Plus the Rancho's have a lifetime warranty and are adjustable.

Workin' 4 Toys
11-28-2005, 10:12 AM
Bilstein shocks I'd put on a 98 GMC 4Dr 4x4:

Front B46-2040
Rear B46-2179

If you want other than stock performance, they have:
5100 series
5150 series
&
7100 series