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kalamalka
11-15-2013, 01:57 PM
Here are a few pics. Nautique reps saying that it will surf like the 2014 210, and have a killer wakeboard wake.

starting price $108,000

http://www.planetnautique.com/vb3/showthread.php?27850-The-G21-is-Here!

Ironhorse
11-15-2013, 02:00 PM
Great looking boat!!

kalamalka
11-15-2013, 02:02 PM
sorry, $110,000. Rumor is that the 110k doesn't include NSS??

98 Saleen Cobra
11-15-2013, 02:31 PM
Is it just me or does that boat seem to have a insane amount of freeboard?!

JRW160
11-15-2013, 03:15 PM
That thing looks awesome

willyt
11-15-2013, 03:20 PM
I'd like to get under that thing....







i'd also like to look at the underside of the hull... looks much different than a G23 as there appears to be some lifting strakes on the bow whereas the G23 doesnt have those.

Jerseydave
11-15-2013, 04:21 PM
Wow, heavy 21 footer......5200 lbs. Plus 2850 lb max factory ballast = 8050 lbs! (not counting fuel and passengers) No wonder the wake is big/steep.

Looks sweet though.

aquaman
11-15-2013, 04:28 PM
Wow, heavy 21 footer......5200 lbs. Plus 2850 lb max factory ballast = 8050 lbs! (not counting fuel and passengers) No wonder the wake is big/steep.

Looks sweet though.

agreed .......that thing is a brick......wake looks nice.

i like the additional freeboard.

Aric'sX15
11-15-2013, 04:33 PM
Like it about 10000x better than the g23.

Eagle
11-15-2013, 04:43 PM
At 21'6" length and 102" width, it's the same basic dimensions as the X-25. It's a lot heavier though, 5200 lbs vs 4570. Surprisingly, the draft is only 25" vs. 28" for the X-25.

I'd love to ride behind that wake.

FourFourty
11-15-2013, 04:45 PM
Like it about 10000x better than the g23.

Am I missing something? I really like it, but it looks like it is just a mini G23 to me. Wakes look great, but the wakeboard wake looks really wide, and not as steep, compared to the G23. Might just be the angle though. I am a fan of the g23, so I am not surprised that I like this boat.

nickespi
11-15-2013, 04:49 PM
Not too sure, but the interior looks insanely cheap. Maybe it's just the color combos or because I'm spoiled having had my interior done by Viper.

AlbertaSurfer
11-15-2013, 05:37 PM
Not too sure, but the interior looks insanely cheap. Maybe it's just the color combos or because I'm spoiled having had my interior done by Viper.

I really like that NauTEAK flooring SeaDek does for them. It's an option, you can still get removable carpet. I like the colors on the seats, and all the detail, but to each their own for sure. I prefer Nautiques overall, but that doesn't mean I'm not happy with my old Star, I love it. The finish of the Nautiques appeals to me more.

scott023
11-15-2013, 05:53 PM
I really like that NauTEAK flooring SeaDek does for them. It's an option, you can still get removable carpet. I like the colors on the seats, and all the detail, but to each their own for sure. I prefer Nautiques overall, but that doesn't mean I'm not happy with my old Star, I love it. The finish of the Nautiques appeals to me more.

Funny, i was just thinking that I really dislike the look of that material. Makes it look cheap, IMO.

The rest of the boat looks good though.

MattsCraft
11-15-2013, 06:49 PM
Not a fan - Interior looks Robo Boxed to me and small.

MC interior for me anyway is lush an inviting with the curves etc.

Don't get the graphics either, for me feels like WWII military, not saying anything bad about WWII vets:D My dad was one, proud of him and everyone that serves, but I think MC boats have better lines, heck yeah, I own one, lol.

The flooring is pretty cool though, I would be curious to spend a day on one to see how they perform.

Eagle
11-15-2013, 07:00 PM
Here's the introduction video from Nautique http://www.planetnautique.com/CorrectCraftManuals/G21/LV.mp4 (http://http://www.planetnautique.com/CorrectCraftManuals/G21/LV.mp4)

CantRepeat
11-15-2013, 07:00 PM
Is it just me or does that boat seem to have a insane amount of freeboard?!


Seems a lot of the newer nauty girl G's are going that way.

Nice looking boat for sure.

TOO-TALL
11-15-2013, 07:39 PM
That thing is sweet!!!

CantRepeat
11-15-2013, 08:17 PM
WOW!!!

Is that an automatic fire extinguisher system/bottle in the engine compartment?

Did coast guard change the rules on that?

Tristarboarder
11-15-2013, 11:37 PM
Just my opinion, probably most don't agree, but I think it is UGLY as h%LL. Purple, with red accents and faux brown? No bueno. I know they are great machines, great watercraft, but too futuristic with the chiseled lines. Give me a '14 X2 instead.....or a x25

AlbertaSurfer
11-16-2013, 01:10 AM
There's two boats pictured. The purple one has the black/white interior and the red one has the red/black/white interior. The brown flooring is SeaDek and meant to look like teak. It has a wood grain pattern on it, it looks pretty cool. I'm not saying you have to like the boat, but there is a reason that Nautique boats are on par pricing wise with MC. They've been in the game a long time and put out a quality product. For the same reason everyone hates the G series look, I'd never buy a pickle fork MC. 6 in one, half doz the other...

Tristarboarder
11-16-2013, 01:35 AM
Oh yes, now I see they are two different interiors.. My bad. I know Seadek well, I have it on my boat. The faux (imitation) wood look is cool for sure. I know SAN is the real deal, probably THE top tier boat company, but my point was, while most drool over that $110k boat, my opinion was, just my opinion, that it is ugly. I drive a gen2 xstar, traditional bow. The subtle differences between the pickle fork MC vs the flat bow of the SAN are minuscule. My opinion was the X2 looks "cleaner", less industrial. That's all, no hard feelings on a Mastercraft site.

AlbertaSurfer
11-16-2013, 02:07 AM
None at all, you're welcome to your opinion. I really wasn't directing the comments at you TriStar, I was just making a statement because I don't think Nautique gets enough credit in this MC crowd. I have a 205v Star and I love it for it's versatility. Honestly, I'm not that big a fan of the G's either, if I had $100k to blow, I'd get a SAN 210. That said, I like the X-30 as well. My problem with these boats is I'd need a slalom tug around too, where my 205v Star slaloms okay. As I get older and don't have any kids, wakeboarding is going out the window. Falls hurt more these days, making my use of a full wakeboard boat kinda pointless. When I was wakeboarding every day it was behind a Moomba Boomerang, a Nautique 200 and a Banshee. This was back in 94-00, so we had sandbags, Rubbermaid tubs, steel etc to weigh the boats down. We never had wakes like this, so I'm not sure I need it these days.

swatguy
11-16-2013, 08:38 AM
Really like it as well.


110k base for a 21ft boat!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! 2 more years and we will be seeing 200k for 24ft'rs. Insane.

aquaman
11-16-2013, 08:57 AM
Really like it as well.


110k base for a 21ft boat!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! 2 more years and we will be seeing 200k for 24ft'rs. Insane.

Built in InFlation my friend........due to the de-valuing of the dollar by the fed. resrv.

The cost of Everything goes UP......the value of your bank account and your buying power goes DOWN.

scott023
11-16-2013, 09:48 AM
Really like it as well.


110k base for a 21ft boat!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! 2 more years and we will be seeing 200k for 24ft'rs. Insane.

That'd be why I'm stickong with what I have. Prices are nuts.

Traxx822
11-16-2013, 09:49 AM
I'm with Tristar, I think it looks like garbage. The interior throws me off big time. So square, so flat nothing special I can see.

The exterior of these rival boats looks awful. More and more free board and weight and no thought to design. Just tug around 8k#'s and that will make a wake. Yeah, no s#I*

No analogue gauges either. Not impressed one little bit.

Black tower, weird 6x9 speakers. JUNK

scott023
11-16-2013, 09:56 AM
I'm sure its an amazing boat, but that whole interior set up is heinous, IMO. Too square, flat, chunky. Doesn't look inviting to me.

Burbon66
11-16-2013, 10:16 AM
I got to see a G23 up the river the other weekend, and this looks just the same, or maybe I am not looking close enough, anyway way too much going on with the interior for my liking, and at what point did they think a massive mounting block either side to attach the tower to was an excellent idea?

tkemperdc
11-16-2013, 10:32 AM
I have a friend that loves nautique, I just cannot wrap my head around the looks. I did not like them online, but thought maybe seeing one in person, nope. I will say I have not wakeboarded or surfed behind one. I'll stick with my MasterCrafts.

Everyone likes something different, so, I understand some will love some will not. Chalk me up for the not.

tkemperdc
11-16-2013, 10:35 AM
I'm sure its an amazing boat, but that whole interior set up is heinous, IMO. Too square, flat, chunky. Doesn't look inviting to me.

Was also my exact thought on the interior.

barefoot
11-16-2013, 10:44 AM
I think I'm missing something...I think it's ugly as h%ll too. I feel like I'm looking at a boat from the '80's with some recent updates. The steering wheel looks like it's straight off a Camaro. Everything looks 2-D. There's no lines…it's box-y...it looks like a floating brick.

It reminds me of that fat women who wears costume jewelry. She thinks she looks good, and, well, you can put make-up on a pig, but it still is what it is.

Is that too harsh? I'd surf behind it any chance I'd get. Stylistically, there is nothing I like about it.



Just my opinion, probably most don't agree, but I think it is UGLY as h%LL. Purple, with red accents and faux brown? No bueno. I know they are great machines, great watercraft, but too futuristic with the chiseled lines. Give me a '14 X2 instead.....or a x25

scott023
11-16-2013, 12:14 PM
I think I'm missing something...I think it's ugly as h%ll too. I feel like I'm looking at a boat from the '80's with some recent updates. The steering wheel looks like it's straight off a Camaro. Everything looks 2-D. There's no lines…it's box-y...it looks like a floating brick.

It reminds me of that fat women who wears costume jewelry. She thinks she looks good, and, well, you can put make-up on a pig, but it still is what it is.

Is that too harsh? I'd surf behind it any chance I'd get. Stylistically, there is nothing I like about it.

I don't think its harsh. Everyone sees things differently. I agree with you. Wake may be amazing, but it had to look good too, in order to be the complete package.

bcd
11-16-2013, 12:53 PM
Calling it JUNK is a little harsh. I agree the looks aren't the best, and the purple doesn't help in my opinion. I must be warming up to the looks a little because I think it does look better than the G23 first did. None of their 2014 boats look anywhere as good as their 2013's.

Nautique boats are not junk, and I think calling it that on Teamtalk makes all MC owners look bad. The boat just got released, so you obviously have no information on the boat other than how it looks.

Traxx822
11-16-2013, 01:12 PM
When I said junk I meant it looks like junk. Descriptively about the appearance at that. I thought I was clear enough on what I thought was junk.

soacj
11-16-2013, 01:30 PM
I grew up with a Correct Craft, but the current Nautique design language just does not click with me. The Mastercraft "look", exterior and interior, is so much cleaner and sleeker in my opinion.

That being said, Nautique quality is certainly not in doubt.

Speaking of "Correct Craft", when did they dump the old name?

pap
11-16-2013, 03:41 PM
That thing looks sweet. "starting price" 108,000 however with options it sounds ouchy!

Cloaked
11-16-2013, 04:01 PM
good looking machine all around

.

Mastercraft13
11-16-2013, 05:46 PM
That thing looks sweet. "starting price" 108,000 however with options it sounds ouchy!

Yeah, the MSRP for a 21 foot boat does seem out of the ballpark. BUT some will pay this with out a doubt!

If someone had that cash you could in theory buy a wake and a slalom boat and have the best of both worlds for the cash spent.

snork
11-16-2013, 07:17 PM
I wouldn't kick it off my hitch
sometimes its not how it looks but how it performs

501s
11-16-2013, 07:32 PM
It's kinda funny when people with 20 year old boats who aren't in the market for a $100k+ boat say that these G's "look like junk". I like them, maybe not as much as a MC but a lot more than a tige!

I may own a MC but the G's are leading the industry in many ways. They make amazing wakes and waves and cost the most. Their styling may not be for everyone but their wakes and waves are.

And their seating options, storage while still having 2800lbs of ballast and NSS are nothing to scoff at.

Eagle
11-16-2013, 07:56 PM
I'm with 501s on this. If MC came out with an X-25 with 2800 lbs of factory ballast, a G-level wake, and an NSS type surf system, I'd upgrade from my 2011 X-25 in a minute. IMHO, while MC has more style, CC is leading the way in capability now. The G 21 looks good to me in the water; too stubby for my eyes while on the trailer.

scott023
11-16-2013, 08:20 PM
I'm with 501s on this. If MC came out with an X-25 with 2800 lbs of factory ballast, a G-level wake, and an NSS type surf system, I'd upgrade from my 2011 X-25 in a minute. IMHO, while MC has more style, CC is leading the way in capability now. The G 21 looks good to me in the water; too stubby for my eyes while on the trailer.

I hear what you're saying, but if MC came out with a boat with similar numbers, I'd bet dime to donuts that the styling would be heads and trails better than the G. I'm not slagging the G, I wouldn't kick it off my hitch either. But that interior just didn't do it for me.

Its like preferring brunettes over blondes. To each their own. :D

Traxx822
11-16-2013, 10:38 PM
It's kinda funny when people with 20 year old boats who aren't in the market for a $100k+ boat say that these G's "look like junk". I like them, maybe not as much as a MC but a lot more than a Tige.

Some people just aren't afraid to call it like it is. Some people own 20year old boats for a reason. Its a fact my 20 year old boat is in better condition and value than most. It's also a fact that I could afford the payments for two of these. It's by choice a guy like me isn't in the market for a $100k boat. Im too young, saving $ to buy a home with cash, just got married so take your pick. This goes for a lot of other guys on here too. It doesn't make our opinions any less valid.

The interior is flat. shoulder pads thin, very squared off and unexciting. It looks cheaply done.

Do I need to go buy a $100k boat to make you feel like I own a worthy boat to be in this club of ability to judge?




Sent from my HTC One using Tapatalk

AlbertaSurfer
11-16-2013, 10:41 PM
These G21's will sell, that much is for sure. MasterCraft owners opinion of them aren't going to hurt sales. Heck, if Epic can sell that hideous floating LED speaker, there's obviously a target market for every brand.

Ugly or sharp, it's all in the eye of the prospective buyer. There's no right or wrong answer. Personally I like it, obviously other's don't, but it is undoubtedly in the same class as anything in the MC lineup. Nautique will survive without all the MasterCraft owners selling their boats to buy a G series.

AlbertaSurfer
11-16-2013, 10:50 PM
Some people just aren't afraid to call it like it is. Some people own 20year old boats for a reason. Its a fact my 20 year old boat is in better condition and value than most. It's also a fact that I could afford the payments for two of these. It's by choice a guy like me isn't in the market for a $100k boat. Im too young, saving $ to buy a home with cash, just got married so take your pick. This goes for a lot of other guys on here too. It doesn't make our opinions any less valid.

The interior is flat. shoulder pads thin, very squared off and unexciting. It looks cheaply done.

Do I need to go buy a $100k boat to make you feel like I own a worthy boat to be in this club of ability to judge?


Sent from my HTC One using Tapatalk


I agree, bud. In Edmonton, there's like 16 weekends in the summer, max. I bought my boat cash, and it gets me out on the water. Not saying that everyone who owns $100K boats are stuck making payments, but it's not what I can justify spending money on. I've literally travelled the world, have a very aggressive mortgage to pay our house off in 12 years and am looking for lake property. Making payments on a boat in a province that's frozen 8 months a year doesn't make sense for me.

Eagle
11-16-2013, 11:16 PM
I hear what you're saying, but if MC came out with a boat with similar numbers, I'd bet dime to donuts that the styling would be heads and trails better than the G. I'm not slagging the G, I wouldn't kick it off my hitch either. But that interior just didn't do it for me.

Its like preferring brunettes over blondes. To each their own. :D
The X-25 and G 21 are the same length (21'6") and width (102"). The G is 600+ lbs heavier and 3" less draft.

Aric'sX15
11-17-2013, 01:33 AM
One thing I do hate is when the financial talk comes up. Who cares what you can afford or have.

scott023
11-17-2013, 01:45 AM
The X-25 and G 21 are the same length (21'6") and width (102"). The G is 600+ lbs heavier and 3" less draft.

Has WAY less ballast though. And many say the wake isn't as good. That's ask I was referring to.

scott023
11-17-2013, 01:47 AM
One thing I do hate is when the financial talk comes up. Who cares what you can afford or have.

I think he was more referring the fact that most guys with older boats aren't usually in the market for a new wakeboard boat. They're usually skiers, so this type of boat isn't their thing to begin with.

501s
11-17-2013, 02:20 AM
Ya, Scott is on the right track. I in no way meant your opinion was less valid because you own a 20 year old boat, so I didn't word my comment right and if that's how you took it, sorry. This is a MC forum for everyone who enjoys a MC. Most guys with a 20 year old boat aren't concerned with the latest and greatest, and all the newest bling and gadgets and that's what these boats are.

But saying it "looks like junk" seemed like a little too much. I've seen the G series boats in pictures and in person and they are the real deal. Different styling than MC, sure, but still very refined. But looks aside, it's what happens behind these boats that matters for a lot of people. And this is what the G series does better than most of the other boats out there whether you want to admit it or not. To get any of the MC's to makes wakes that size you have to use all of your storage up for PnP ballast. And we have surf tabs.... yay. I love my X-30 and have no plans to get a new boat but if I was looking brand new its hard to look past the G series.

AlbertaSurfer
11-17-2013, 02:24 AM
I think he was more referring the fact that most guys with older boats aren't usually in the market for a new wakeboard boat. They're usually skiers, so this type of boat isn't their thing to begin with.

I'll bite on this...

I don't agree at all. I've been a skier since 5, wakeboarder since 13. 90% of my wakeboarding was done behind a '92 Nautique and a "94 Moomba Boomerang. Both Direct Drive of course. Before that, we had my Dad's old Canaventure with a 115hp Outboard. Of the kids I grew up with, 2 went on to ride for Hyperlite. Not at the level of Parks or Rusty of course, but they were on the flow teams and getting travel and comp entries paid, plus gear. We all live in Alberta, and both of them were from Calgary. They did some of the best wakeboarding I've ever seen behind these old inboards, and even behind an old Banshee outboard weighed down with sandbags and a DeWalt radio for a stereo.

Today, there seems to be a lot of people justifying their purchase for two reasons.
1: They ,"need", the wake
2: They feel the need to justify to the '95ish Prostar owners why owning a single purpose boat makes more sense.

Before anyone gets offended, this statement is not in the least typical, and isn't directed at anyone in particular, but rather an observation. Everyone's needs are different, that much is a fact. Financial availability aside, people view the ownership of a boat differently. Some people have a Corvette they drive 2 months a year, and some have an XStar that sits in the garage. If owning a $120K boat warms your heart, then fill your boots. But trying to justify you need that boat more that someone's $20K boat is the exact same thing as explaining why your Corvette gets you to work faster and more efficiently that your neighbors Hyundai.

Traxx822
11-17-2013, 02:49 AM
Nice Alberta. I couldn't have said it that well.

Sent from my HTC One using Tapatalk

jafo9
11-17-2013, 06:03 AM
sadly, a large number of these high end boats are status symbols and expensive tube pullers. we are in the minority to actually care about what the boat really does. having said that, my skill level will never surpass the capabilities of my boat. if i were in the market, i'd choose the soft plush lines/interior of the MC over the harsh angles in the G.

bturner2
11-17-2013, 07:41 AM
Hmmm interesting thread. Here's my take on it. First this is an exchange of ideas, no one should be personally attacking anyone and I don't think they are. Second let's try not be the PC, easily offended types. I'll definitely leave the board if I hear someone say they're being bullied. We all have strong opinions and lets all deal with that.

As to the $100K boats..... I've tried to buy a new MC 3 times and for the life of me just couldn't pull the trigger not because I couldn't make it work finically but because I always found a boat a couple years old that fit my needs for close to half what the new boat was going to cost. Myself and the rest of us that pick up those used boats all down the used boat food chain are what make it possible for many of those new boats to be sold. The boat I have now was actually a part of a deal that was falling apart because the buyer wasn't willing to accept the trade in offer from the dealer. I offered the guy a grand more, he sold me the boat and the guy bought a new boat that day.

On the SN. A few years back their quality was crap for what you were paying. Don't believe me ask a honest dealer and they'll admit it. As of the last boat show I went to in the spring this was far from the case. Their seats are different and appear to use a much higher density foam which might account for the thinner look but the boat I looked at and sat in was well built and comfortable. The styling was mostly a love/hate thing with my wife being firmly in the hate side of that statement. Her take was they all look like shoe boxes and she definitely didn't like the Sea Deck floors. Her opinion was so strong that I'll never have to worry about buying one unless it was something I was going to flip.

I think we all get used to a certain brand or style weather it's a car, boat, home or whatever. Every time I get back in the market I try to keep an open mind but my comfort level with the MCs always pulls be back into the fold. While I think this latest SN is a solid boat for me the layout and styling would preclude me from considering it regardless how it performed. Cash aside at the end of the day you have to be able to look at it on the lift and be happy with your purchase.

madcityskier
11-17-2013, 08:22 AM
Nice Alberta. I couldn't have said it that well.

Sent from my HTC One using Tapatalk

Couldn't this have been avoided if instead of "junk" you said "flaming bag of crap"? It would also imply that you are on a topic some of us here are very familiar with.

I have said before, and will say again:
The old tri-hull Glastron was a very functional boat, that people stopped buying because they were ugly. A hull layout that seems to be making a comeback.

It's like kids in high school where the hair is always cycling short-long-short-long every few years. I'm sure these designs will be around for a while, and then everyone will be going closed bow to be different than every other manufacturer. All that being said, my 85, my brothers' 93 SnS190 and 04 197TT have always drawn comments anywhere they go. Nordicron's SAN210 does the same. To me those boats all look much better than the G's and the new Star.

Of course that's just my opinion, I could be wrong.

Aric'sX15
11-17-2013, 09:05 AM
Well either way, it saddens me to that mc is far behind nautique. The xstar is the only boat mc makes that holds a candle to the g line. You can argue x25 or (insert x boat here) and they dont compare with the performance of the g line out of the factory.

Looks and interior is another story though! !!! Lol. I think I like the g21 better than the others is because its not as large as the others

FourFourty
11-17-2013, 09:56 AM
Today, there seems to be a lot of people justifying their purchase for two reasons.
1: They ,"need", the wake
2: They feel the need to justify to the '95ish Prostar owners why owning a single purpose boat makes more sense.

But trying to justify you need that boat more that someone's $20K boat is the exact same thing as explaining why your Corvette gets you to work faster and more efficiently that your neighbors Hyundai.

I think I get what you are trying to say. But that is a bad example to prove it.

If the "single purpose" of these "single purpose boats" was cruising from one end of the lake, to the other, with 4 people on board......... Then yes, the Hyundai/corvette analogy would be a good way to show your point.

If we were to use a good car example to try to prove your point, it would be- Trying to explain why a 2012 C6 Z06 is a better car to take to the local road course than your neighbors 1990 Z24.

That would be a fair comparison, and it adds a lot of clarity to an argument against your point. Sure, the Z24 is going to get you around the track, and you will have fun doing so. However, it would be completely wrong to think that you would 1)Learn to be as good of a racecar driver in it. 2)Have as much fun. 3)Be driving a car that does the job as well as the new vette. 4) Enjoy the capabilities of the vehicle you are driving, with the job at hand.


Tell me this- Would your friends still prefer to ride behind an old DD, instead of a new G21? Would they feel that they could still accomplish just as much, and continue to advance their abilities just as fast?

I understand why a lot of guys would be perfectly happy with their older boats. For some, it is a love affair. For others, the upgrade is not worth it to them. They are happy enough with what they have, and have more important things to spend their money on. And then, for some..... they just plain prefer the styling and simplicity of the older boats.

Sure, not all people are the same. That being said, I am a blue blooded, American, male. You better believe that power, performance, style, and gadgets are fun for me. Being on my boat is my favorite thing in this world. I spend a lot of money on it, and other activities take the back burner. I skimp on the less important things. And you are saying that there is absolutely no point to that?? Except maybe, that it gives me a warm and fuzzy feeling to own a new wakeboat? Sure, when we are just cruising, or floating, a 1990 glastron is going to do the job just as well. But when it comes down to business, yes, I want the latest and greatest. What is wrong with that? Human nature....

FourFourty
11-17-2013, 10:09 AM
Well either way, it saddens me to that mc is far behind nautique. The xstar is the only boat mc makes that holds a candle to the g line. You can argue x25 or (insert x boat here) and they dont compare with the performance of the g line out of the factory.

Looks and interior is another story though! !!! Lol. I think I like the g21 better than the others is because its not as large as the others


The one thing you need to consider is the price factor though..... The base price on the X25 is 30k less than the G21. That is a huge amount of $$$. And the wakeboard wake on the X25 is right up there with the best.

I do agree with your point, for sure. But the G21 base price is the same as an XStar.

AlbertaSurfer
11-17-2013, 10:51 AM
Tell me this- Would your friends still prefer to ride behind an old DD, instead of a new G21? Would they feel that they could still accomplish just as much, and continue to advance their abilities just as fast?

Of course they wouldn't prefer the older DD. The point I was trying to make is these guys did some of the best wakeboarding I've ever been a part of behind these old boats. The skill level they were at then, was enough to get them noticed. The ability to go a little higher or further with a better shaped wake may have made things easier, but doesn't change the fact they were throwing whirly's off a tiny little wake. We rode every day, and their skill was developed before any of us had the chance to ride behind the new SAN, which was also a DD back then too.

I'm glad you love your boat, and yeah man, you deserve it. But at the same time, you don't seem to be the type scoffing at people with 20 year old boats.

I suppose it's likely just the area I live in, because I see it all the time. In Alberta, it's easy for someone to make above average income with all the oilfield in the area. As a result, the lakes I frequent are chock full of $100k boats, the racks loaded down with gear, pulling either a tube or a surfer still on the rope. I'm not in the least saying this is typical of everyone with a new boat, but we've all seen it. They don't need an XStar to tow their kid around who can't cross the wakes yet. They're more than welcome to own it, but don't look down on mine when you see it at the lake.

501s
11-17-2013, 10:58 AM
Let's be clear, "Base prices" and what you actually pay out the door are 2 very different numbers.

Region, history with the dealer and negotiation ability all come into play.

And if you use the boats for what they are designed for on a daily basis, than things like sub floor ballast of 2800lbs and NSS are big selling features. If you don't or you ski, they probably seem a bit unnecessary.

madcityskier
11-17-2013, 11:17 AM
The analogy I would make (and this is not for everyone, but for many, if you're taking offense your defensive so I probably do mean you) is that I have a 14' john boat that I need to tow so I bought a Peterbuilt. Face it, most of the people with these boats aren't capable of using them for what they are designed to do. When I wakeboard behind something with 3K in ballast, I crash a ton. If I'm boat shopping I wouldn't pay huge money for something I am in no way qualified for. I do know that if you plan to grow into it it's not a waste, but most people will never use these beyond the potential of an older 205 anyway.

mikeg205
11-17-2013, 11:19 AM
Couldn't this have been avoided if instead of "junk" you said "flaming bag of crap"? It would also imply that you are on a topic some of us here are very familiar with.



Thank's Mad for taking the opinion up a notch.. lol...


$100K plus is a lot of $$$ anyway you slice it. Not sure I like the high free board Nautique and Tige. However, they are doing some catchy things...

I am in agreement with keeping it not - personal. But this forum sometimes needs to fire up a good controversy... :D

That being said - the market will shake out which ones are junk. Classic lines, reliability, restorability(new word) will rule in the end. There's a light blue and orange yellow and light blue and white Tige Rz4 skulk the waters of our Illinois river - I doubt we'll seem them 10 years from now... I know I will still be skiing behind my '95... ;) "when I'm 64! boom boom"

FourFourty
11-17-2013, 11:35 AM
Of course they wouldn't prefer the older DD. The point I was trying to make is these guys did some of the best wakeboarding I've ever been a part of behind these old boats. The skill level they were at then, was enough to get them noticed. The ability to go a little higher or further with a better shaped wake may have made things easier, but doesn't change the fact they were throwing whirly's off a tiny little wake. We rode every day, and their skill was developed before any of us had the chance to ride behind the new SAN, which was also a DD back then too.

I'm glad you love your boat, and yeah man, you deserve it. But at the same time, you don't seem to be the type scoffing at people with 20 year old boats.

I suppose it's likely just the area I live in, because I see it all the time. In Alberta, it's easy for someone to make above average income with all the oilfield in the area. As a result, the lakes I frequent are chock full of $100k boats, the racks loaded down with gear, pulling either a tube or a surfer still on the rope. I'm not in the least saying this is typical of everyone with a new boat, but we've all seen it. They don't need an XStar to tow their kid around who can't cross the wakes yet. They're more than welcome to own it, but don't look down on mine when you see it at the lake.

I can't disagree with any of that!! :toast:

501s
11-17-2013, 11:49 AM
We have about 3 x G23's on our lake, and I have NEVER once seen a wakeboarder behind one. Surfers and tubers, yes, but not a single wakeboarder in 2 years. I've been tempted to wave one down and ask for a pull :)

As for older boats, I think it's way better to have a 25 year old boat and put 100 hours a season enjoying it than the guy with a new 100k boat that is just for show. I started riding on a 76 Reinell Tri-hull and while the wake was tiny we had more fun on that boat than most out there and nothing has changed between that and a 2013 MC. We bought the boats to use and that's what we do.

scott023
11-17-2013, 11:49 AM
Well either way, it saddens me to that mc is far behind nautique. The xstar is the only boat mc makes that holds a candle to the g line. You can argue x25 or (insert x boat here) and they dont compare with the performance of the g line out of the factory.

Looks and interior is another story though! !!! Lol. I think I like the g21 better than the others is because its not as large as the others

The 46 sure as heck holds a candle.

scott023
11-17-2013, 11:53 AM
We have about 3 x G23's on our lake, and I have NEVER once seen a wakeboarder behind one. Surfers and tubers, yes, but not a single wakeboarder in 2 years. I've been tempted to wave one down and ask for a pull :)

As for older boats, I think it's way better to have a 25 year old boat and put 100 hours a season enjoying it than the guy with a new 100k boat that is just for show. I started riding on a 76 Reinell Tri-hull and while the wake was tiny we had more fun on that boat than most out there and nothing has changed between that and a 2013 MC. We bought the boats to use and that's what we do.

Lmbo. That's all I've ever seen behind the G's. Never a wakeboarder, only once a surfer. Those are some expensive tubing machines. ;)

JohnE
11-17-2013, 11:55 AM
The analogy I would make (and this is not for everyone, but for many, if you're taking offense your defensive so I probably do mean you) is that I have a 14' john boat that I need to tow so I bought a Peterbuilt. Face it, most of the people with these boats aren't capable of using them for what they are designed to do. When I wakeboard behind something with 3K in ballast, I crash a ton. If I'm boat shopping I wouldn't pay huge money for something I am in no way qualified for. I do know that if you plan to grow into it it's not a waste, but most people will never use these beyond the potential of an older 205 anyway.

This is an interesting perspective. I never felt any of my boats were a badge for how well or poorly I can ski. If I decide to buy the new Prostar (Yea, I'm kind of digging it and I miss my X14) does that mean I should be embarrassed as I'm struggling with 22 off? I should keep my '97 because I'm not skilled enough to justify the new Prostar? I'm not taking offense but I don't quite get the logic. Heck, I've kicked around the idea of getting an X25 SS so I can cruise the waters of Cape Cod, and I can barely do a wake to wake and don't surf real well. But, I like nice boats. Even when I just walk by it in my garage in the winter it makes me feel good. I realize I can do the same with the old (no offense anyone) Maristar 240. My point would be that nobody here on this forum (or just about anywhere) needs a new boat to improve their watersports performance. Many of us may 'need' one for a variety of reasons. And really, unless you are making a living with said boat, none of us need a boat. We all just want one and all of our wants will vary.

scott023
11-17-2013, 12:00 PM
This is an interesting perspective. I never felt any of my boats were a badge for how well or poorly I can ski. If I decide to buy the new Prostar (Yea, I'm kind of digging it and I miss my X14) does that mean I should be embarrassed as I'm struggling with 22 off? I should keep my '97 because I'm not skilled enough to justify the new Prostar? I'm not taking offense but I don't quite get the logic. Heck, I've kicked around the idea of getting an X25 SS so I can cruise the waters of Cape Cod, and I can barely do a wake to wake and don't surf real well. But, I like nice boats. Even when I just walk by it in my garage in the winter it makes me feel good. I realize I can do the same with the old (no offense anyone) Maristar 240. My point would be that nobody here on this forum (or just about anywhere) needs a new boat to improve their watersports performance. Many of us may 'need' one for a variety of reasons. And really, unless you are making a living with said boat, none of us need a boat. We all just want one and all of our wants will vary.

I can't ride my boat to its potential either. That doesn't matter to me... Its all we need and more. We bought the boat hoping to never have to upgrade it, no matter how good we or the kids got. I think that's a better pan than losing money upgrading boats every few years.

JohnE
11-17-2013, 12:04 PM
I can't ride my boat to its potential either. That doesn't matter to me... Its all we need and more. We bought the boat hoping to never have to upgrade it, no matter how good we or the kids got. I think that's a better pan than losing money upgrading boats every few years.

I agree. But if you decide to upgrade I won't fault you for it. (And may buy that sweet 45 too);)

scott023
11-17-2013, 12:05 PM
I agree. But if you decide to upgrade I won't fault you for it. (And may buy that sweet 45 too);)

:D
The price of these boats has gotten insane. I can't see being able to justify the price to myself, let alone my wife. ;)

Nick911
11-17-2013, 12:25 PM
Let's be clear, "Base prices" and what you actually pay out the door are 2 very different numbers.

Region, history with the dealer and negotiation ability all come into play.

And if you use the boats for what they are designed for on a daily basis, than things like sub floor ballast of 2800lbs and NSS are big selling features. If you don't or you ski, they probably seem a bit unnecessary.

2.8K of sub floor and NSS, those are features IMO that can help one look beyond the ugliness of the boat. And the extra $20K.

mikeg205
11-17-2013, 12:46 PM
:D
The price of these boats has gotten insane. I can't see being able to justify the price to myself, let alone my wife. ;)

I have the original sales paper work on my 1995 PS 205 $23,999 and $1500 for trailer and dealer in Clear Lake IA through in a full tank of gas... with inflation combo would be $39,945.00

Add $10K for cool tech upgrades... The 21 footers should top out at about $80 - which is about right where a friend boat a 2013 Wakesetter up in northern Wi - that was not anywhere near list. Like 501 says....

I still like the sleek lines on the classic style - I have skied 43' off @ 36mph - but not thru a course ;) - can't do a wake to wake either... but sure do have fun on water... :)

aquaman
11-17-2013, 01:11 PM
Boat prices are just like Pro-sports ticket prices.......with insane inflation based on nothing other than what the market will bear.


We will continue to get less boat for more money, and place higher salaries into the hands of pro-Jocks that will either wind up in jail or re-hab.

The public can control this problem by not paying the crazy prices.......but i doubt they will. :confused:

scott023
11-17-2013, 02:28 PM
2.8K of sub floor and NSS, those are features IMO that can help one look beyond the ugliness of the boat. And the extra $20K.

Maybe 5k for ease of use, but for 20k I've could but a lot of fat sacs. ;)

Nick911
11-17-2013, 04:17 PM
From what I can tell by the pics the X25 seems to have a much bigger seating area for the same length boat.

JohnE
11-17-2013, 05:15 PM
Some days I just want to go buy a brand new overpriced boat. With 100 features I don't need or even know how to use. With a stock wake so large it impedes me from both boarding and skiing. (Lets face it I'm not real good at either).. But I'm going to spend 15 weekends a year on it with on average of 10 people per day. Going to spend countless hours recounting the laughs/ falls/ tricks/ faceplants/ even tubing of the prior season. Laugh my *** off, enjoy life completely, and then when all is done I will check in here and get ridiculed. Thanks gang.

scott023
11-17-2013, 05:19 PM
Some days I just want to go buy a brand new overpriced boat. With 100 features I don't need or even know how to use. With a stock wake so large it impedes me from both boarding and skiing. (Lets face it I'm not real good at either).. But I'm going to spend 15 weekends a year on it with on average of 10 people per day. Going to spend countless hours recounting the laughs/ falls/ tricks/ faceplants/ even tubing of the prior season. Laugh my *** off, enjoy life completely, and then when all is done I will check in here and get ridiculed. Thanks gang.

As long a you're all laughing. :D:D:D

madcityskier
11-17-2013, 05:27 PM
I notice you're not buying for a wake you can't use but for space and comfort. God bless and more power to you. You're definitely doing it right. If you buy it because it has the best wake (which you are incapable of using, with no plan to attempt to improve) I may not understand, but if you're having a good time on the water, in a safe manner I will definitely not be laughing.
Though if you hit the be at on the dock at 10 mph while trying to back the trailer in, I may chuckle a bit.

nickespi
11-17-2013, 05:40 PM
I wouldn't kick it off my hitch
sometimes its not how it looks but how it performs

This could be applied to many situations in life...

scott023
11-17-2013, 06:54 PM
This could be applied to many situations in life...

I see what you're inferring there.;)

JRW160
11-17-2013, 06:57 PM
I saw on the n3boatworks page that they are running a 2:1 reduction transmission and a 17" prop on the g21. With that setup, the base engine might actually get it out of the hole.

Bouyhead
11-17-2013, 07:32 PM
Does anyone know why they are running two expansion tanks on what appears to be a closed cooling system?

103165

lashburn1
11-17-2013, 09:23 PM
Lmbo. That's all I've ever seen behind the G's. Never a wakeboarder, only once a surfer. Those are some expensive tubing machines. ;)

Lol
....please don't be offended , but you will 100% see me pulling a TUBE with any one or all 3 of my daughters behind my new X30
.... You may see us Surf , and hopefully without a Rope...
...you will almost never see us WakeBoard, yet we will bring them in case anyone want s to try...

We could have bought a Colbalt Boat, and have had equal quality suppose...
But both my wife and I love the look and feel AND quality of MC boats...

We further , did not identify with the Boat models in Sports Jackets, and Evening gowns sipping wine and looking off into distance...

Nope we just wanted a Bad A$$ boat that our family and friends could enjoy together...

We will still wave at WakeBoarders as we tube by though...

We are ALL lucky to be on the water after-all...

mikeg205
11-17-2013, 09:37 PM
Lol
....please don't be offended , but you will 100% see me pulling a TUBE with any one or all 3 of my daughters behind my new X30
.... You may see us Surf , and hopefully without a Rope...
...you will almost never see us WakeBoard, yet we will bring them in case anyone want s to try...

We could have bought a Colbalt Boat, and have had equal quality suppose...
But both my wife and I love the look and feel AND quality of MC boats...

We further , did not identify with the Boat models in Sports Jackets, and Evening gowns sipping wine and looking off into distance...

Nope we just wanted a Bad A$$ boat that our family and friends could enjoy together...

We will still wave at WakeBoarders as we tube by though...

We are ALL lucky to be on the water after-all...

Well said!

scott023
11-17-2013, 09:38 PM
Lol
....please don't be offended , but you will 100% see me pulling a TUBE with any one or all 3 of my daughters behind my new X30
.... You may see us Surf , and hopefully without a Rope...
...you will almost never see us WakeBoard, yet we will bring them in case anyone want s to try...

We could have bought a Colbalt Boat, and have had equal quality suppose...
But both my wife and I love the look and feel AND quality of MC boats...

We further , did not identify with the Boat models in Sports Jackets, and Evening gowns sipping wine and looking off into distance...

Nope we just wanted a Bad A$$ boat that our family and friends could enjoy together...

We will still wave at WakeBoarders as we tube by though...

We are ALL lucky to be on the water after-all...

You're absolutely right. We are all lucky to be on the water.

I was just responding to the statement that people don't use their boats for intended purposes. Seems weird to pay 130k for a boat to use exclusively for tubing.

lashburn1
11-17-2013, 09:44 PM
You're absolutely right. We are all lucky to be on the water.

I was just responding to the statement that people don't use their boats for intended purposes. Seems weird to pay 130k for a boat to use exclusively for tubing.

Indeed....unless you are REALLY a good tuber...
Haha
Thanks Scott :D
:friday::toast:

scott023
11-17-2013, 09:54 PM
Indeed....unless you are REALLY a good tuber...
Haha
Thanks Scott :D
:friday::toast:

:uglyhamme

I'm sure there's some mad skill tubers out there.

snork
11-17-2013, 09:59 PM
This could be applied to many situations in life...

Let me clarify a little more but I think you got the picture
brand A has buck teeth and a smoken hot body and brand B is big as a pig with no teeth :D

scott023
11-17-2013, 10:22 PM
Let me clarify a little more but I think you got the picture
brand A has buck teeth and a smoken hot body and brand B is big as a pig with no teeth :D

I was picking up what you were putting down.

mikeg205
11-17-2013, 10:28 PM
You're absolutely right. We are all lucky to be on the water.

I was just responding to the statement that people don't use their boats for intended purposes. Seems weird to pay 130k for a boat to use exclusively for tubing.

Unless you have the means to just have your favorite brand regardless of cost. :D - I would love a 2014 Prostar - but I would still break at he hips.. ;) :D:D

scott023
11-17-2013, 10:38 PM
Unless you have the means to just have your favorite brand regardless of cost. :D - I would love a 2014 Prostar - but I would still break at he hips.. ;) :D:D

Oh, don't sell yourself short Mike.

mikeg205
11-17-2013, 10:48 PM
Oh, don't sell yourself short Mike.

Like...

scott023
11-17-2013, 10:51 PM
:d:d:d

mcLove
11-18-2013, 12:36 AM
Reading this i have noticed a lot of hate on the g series and the look. though i agree it isn't the sleekest, i think we can all agree it isn't as bad as the tige asr

76S&S
11-18-2013, 09:13 AM
Boat looks nice to me; I saw a great looking G23 this summer and really like it as well.

Not that it matters though, I don't see myself ever dropping 100k+ on a new boat, regardless of brand.

Eagle
11-18-2013, 01:50 PM
Has WAY less ballast though. And many say the wake isn't as good. That's ask I was referring to.
Exactly -- the G 21 and X-25 have the same length and width, but the G 21 has 2800 lbs of factory ballast (vs, what for the X-25, 800 or so?), and it has NSS as an option.

In terms of the wake, every wakeboarder that I know who's ridden behind a G 23 says it's the best wake they've ever ridden. A few of them are regular members of my X-25 crew, and have ridden every top end wake boat (X-Star (new and previous), VLX, SAN 210, X-25, X-30, etc etc etc). The early reports are that the G 21 is similar, with a little more kick on the lip.

I love my X-25 wake, no doubt. No complaints there whatsoever. But if I had the option for 2800 lbs of below-floor ballast and NSS-type surf system on an X-25, I'd upgrade right away. Otherwise, I'll keep my 2011 X-25 for a number of years more.

jbkriss
11-18-2013, 02:32 PM
I'm semi- in the market and was leaning toward an X25 but was waiting to see the specs on the G21 before getting serious. While I like the looks of the X series more than the G series, what's most important to me is the wake, ease of dialing it in, and where I can store the boat. Both the X25 and G21 have great wakes and are pretty similar in size. The early comments on planet nautique is that the G21 is still about the same height as a G23 which means it would be too tall for my 8' garage. If that turns out to be the case, it just seems puzzling for CC to put out a 21.5' G when they already have the [2014] 210.

jradasaurus
11-18-2013, 11:12 PM
Sorry to be blunt, but the interior of this boat is incredibly ugly. Also the freeboard on these G series is insane.

Aric'sX15
11-19-2013, 10:10 AM
Reading this i have noticed a lot of hate on the g series and the look. though i agree it isn't the sleekest, i think we can all agree it isn't as bad as the tige asr

I would agree, but the asr is a g23 clone. Lol

Also, we need wake pictures of a 25 with 2800lbs of ballast to compare!

jdl xstar
11-19-2013, 12:16 PM
Regarding the use of Seadek everywhere... I know from experience that seadek can stain easily so having it lined in the entire interior is questionable. I loved being able to remove the carpet in previous MC's so not having that option plus the fact that the seadek would be exposed to constant wear is something to consider. I know it would feel great but give it a few months use and it will not look like it does in the pictures.

FourFourty
11-19-2013, 12:27 PM
My buddy's G23 is very prone to smelling like foot cheese with the sea-deck also. He has to scrub the floor with a color safe bleach chemical every couple weeks.

It probably wouldn't be nearly as bad if the boat didn't sit under a canopy all the time. It doesn't get much sun exposure. Still a PITA though.

With carpet, you just unsnap once in a while, and lay it on the dock on a sunny day.

captain planet
11-19-2013, 12:36 PM
Well either way, it saddens me to that mc is far behind nautique. The xstar is the only boat mc makes that holds a candle to the g line. You can argue x25 or (insert x boat here) and they dont compare with the performance of the g line out of the factory.

Looks and interior is another story though! !!! Lol. I think I like the g21 better than the others is because its not as large as the others

......I really would like this thread to die, There is too much interest in the #2 comp boat company on this board in my opinion, that thing looks like a Nissan Cube on the water, the interior does not look comfortable at all (albeit looks and feel are two different things), and the construction is subpar compared to MC. So other than looks and wake, which I will point out are subjective opinions I fail to see how MC 'far behind' ski-antique.

willyt
11-19-2013, 12:42 PM
and the construction is subpar compared to MC.

Coming from a self-admitted background of ignorance on how they differ - how to they differ?

(honest question)

FourFourty
11-19-2013, 02:48 PM
Coming from a self-admitted background of ignorance on how they differ - how to they differ?

(honest question)

They don't IMO...... I don't think MC build quality is any better than Nautique. They are both exceptional.

And I am also not afraid to admit that MC is behind in surf functionality right now. (and ballast capacity).

They will catch up soon. I have faith. :D

moleson10
11-19-2013, 02:52 PM
Looks like a very effective wake making machine. Still the Pontiac Aztec of boats stylewise.

scott023
11-19-2013, 03:02 PM
My buddy's G23 is very prone to smelling like foot cheese with the sea-deck also. He has to scrub the floor with a color safe bleach chemical every couple weeks.

It probably wouldn't be nearly as bad if the boat didn't sit under a canopy all the time. It doesn't get much sun exposure. Still a PITA though.

With carpet, you just unsnap once in a while, and lay it on the dock on a sunny day.

That does sounds like a real PITA.

ttu
11-19-2013, 03:05 PM
Looks like a very effective wake making machine. Still the Pontiac Aztec of boats stylewise.

that is the best i have seen to describe the g-series!:D:D

hondaprlud
11-19-2013, 03:30 PM
......I really would like this thread to die, There is too much interest in the #2 comp boat company on this board in my opinion, that thing looks like a Nissan Cube on the water, the interior does not look comfortable at all (albeit looks and feel are two different things), and the construction is subpar compared to MC. So other than looks and wake, which I will point out are subjective opinions I fail to see how MC 'far behind' ski-antique.

IDK, I'm kind of diggin' this thread :D

Aric'sX15
11-19-2013, 03:36 PM
......I really would like this thread to die, There is too much interest in the #2 comp boat company on this board in my opinion, that thing looks like a Nissan Cube on the water, the interior does not look comfortable at all (albeit looks and feel are two different things), and the construction is subpar compared to MC. So other than looks and wake, which I will point out are subjective opinions I fail to see how MC 'far behind' ski-antique.

There is no difference in build quality.
So heres why people think we are elitists. When other companies come out with better products than what our company has to offer, we instantly shoot it down and its insta-crap. I think mc should come on to this board more often and get a clue every once in a while. There is no opinions on how mc is behind cc and malibu. Its fact. No surf system in our line up is swaying away a lot of potential customers.

Ending this thread would be stupid! You have no intrest in wake boats anyway, so move on...

captain planet
11-19-2013, 04:31 PM
There is no difference in build quality.
So heres why people think we are elitists. When other companies come out with better products than what our company has to offer, we instantly shoot it down and its insta-crap. I think mc should come on to this board more often and get a clue every once in a while. There is no opinions on how mc is behind cc and malibu. Its fact. No surf system in our line up is swaying away a lot of potential customers.

Ending this thread would be stupid! You have no intrest in wake boats anyway, so move on...

Ah, but I really didn't say it was crap. I didn't use those words, they were suggested by you that is what I said. What I said were subjective opinions (ugly, looks uncomfortable). What you said was that MC was far behind ski antique, which they aren't. What I'm confirming are the way in which the two companies build their boats. I know how MC does it. I know how ski antique does it but am confirming before I spoil it. I'll give you this, cc towers are not domestic.

Wake and looks are subjective, construction is not. I will say this, if MC wasn't around I would own a ski antique. They are #2 with respect to quality of build of "the big three" with malibu a far distant #3. They are so far back I don't know how there is a consideration of a top 3, it is really a top 2.

As for my interest in wake boats, some day when I've decided to give up, I'll take up surfing....and when that day comes these boats will be at a price where I may actually be able to buy one of them. :o

GT500 MC
11-19-2013, 07:20 PM
You can always tell when ole-man winter is here......everybody gets a little awnry.....

Traxx822
11-19-2013, 07:40 PM
You can always tell when ole-man winter is here......everybody gets a little awnry.....

And old man winter better wake up with a furry this year.

Sent from my HTC One using Tapatalk

snork
11-19-2013, 08:03 PM
Um, MC are hand laid fiberglass and Nautique is chopper gun sprayed glass particle so MC is way superior in construction just for starters but I'll have to admit while the G series are not the best look'n boat with comfy ergonomics the G23/21 wake is #1 with stock ballast and I spend hours over minutes behind the boat opposed to slum'n in the boat
I'll never say anything bad about the 04-11 XStar its the best look'n and comfy boat with a wakeboard wake nearly identical to the G23 when properly weighted with the PWT sacks

AlbertaSurfer
11-19-2013, 08:26 PM
Regarding the use of Seadek everywhere... I know from experience that seadek can stain easily so having it lined in the entire interior is questionable. I loved being able to remove the carpet in previous MC's so not having that option plus the fact that the seadek would be exposed to constant wear is something to consider. I know it would feel great but give it a few months use and it will not look like it does in the pictures.

These are available with a removable carpet as well, the SeaDek is an option.


Obviously on a MasterCraft forum, love for the Nautiques will be hard to come by, but these boats are in now way any less than MC's offerings. In many areas they're better. Looks are irrelevant. Chevy owners hate the look of Dodges, Nissan owners dislike the Toyotas... Who cares. Is the G ugly? Maybe. Is the pickefork stupid? Yeah. Does either matter? No. Unless you're getting sick of your X2 banging holes in the back of your truck of course, then it does matter...

Aric'sX15
11-19-2013, 08:32 PM
Um, MC are hand laid fiberglass and Nautique is chopper gun sprayed glass particle so MC is way superior in construction just for starters but I'll have to admit while the G series are not the best look'n boat with comfy ergonomics the G23/21 wake is #1 with stock ballast and I spend hours over minutes behind the boat opposed to slum'n in the boat
I'll never say anything bad about the 04-11 XStar its the best look'n and comfy boat with a wakeboard wake nearly identical to the G23 when properly weighted with the PWT sacks

i don't think MC is hand laid anymore

scott023
11-19-2013, 08:40 PM
These are available with a removable carpet as well, the SeaDek is an option.


Obviously on a MasterCraft forum, love for the Nautiques will be hard to come by, but these boats are in now way any less than MC's offerings. In many areas they're better. Looks are irrelevant. Chevy owners hate the look of Dodges, Nissan owners dislike the Toyotas... Who cares. Is the G ugly? Maybe. Is the pickefork stupid? Yeah. Does either matter? No. Unless you're getting sick of your X2 banging holes in the back of your truck of course, then it does matter...

Looks aren't irrelevant. And your opinion on the pickle fork... Opening up the bow for more people and leg room isn't stupid if you've got a crew to make comfortable. I fail to see a reason to insult other peoples boats when you obviously don't have any real experience with the pickle fork.

cbryan70
11-19-2013, 08:45 PM
Wonder why mc does not use this. http://www.vectechnology.com/index.cfm. stronger and more precise than hand or chopper glass

aquaman
11-19-2013, 08:53 PM
Um, MC are hand laid fiberglass and Nautique is chopper gun sprayed glass particle so MC is way superior in construction just for starters but I'll have to admit while the G series are not the best look'n boat with comfy ergonomics the G23/21 wake is #1 with stock ballast and I spend hours over minutes behind the boat opposed to slum'n in the boat
I'll never say anything bad about the 04-11 XStar its the best look'n and comfy boat with a wakeboard wake nearly identical to the G23 when properly weighted with the PWT sacks

And the problem with chopper sprayed fiberglass is What ?? weight ??

So what MC might be handlaid glass...so they save weight + costs in glass.......So that you the owner only have to add more ballast. DUH

The CC are structurally heavier built, which in my book is superior to a "light weight" wake boat which has less glass in the hull to save costs.

FourFourty
11-19-2013, 09:27 PM
The CC are structurally heavier built, which in my book is superior to a "light weight" wake boat which has less glass in the hull to save costs.

I have seen the stringer and hull structures, at the factory, for all of the big three. The one thing I can say without a doubt, is that MC's are the heaviest built of the three. Have you seen the stringer structure in an MC??

And as for the comments of handlaid vs chopper gun..... MC hand lays first, and then installs all the aluminum backer plates (another thing CC does not do), and then sprays the chopper gun layers over the entire hull and deck structures.

Does it need to be that comprehensive? No. Essentially they are overbuilt by a large margin. CC isn't quite as comprehensive with their hull and stringer structures, but they don't need to be. Their hulls are plenty strong. I don't feel that they are behind at all, in quality of construction.

That being said, CC's are certainly not "structurally heavier built".

AlbertaSurfer
11-19-2013, 09:38 PM
Looks aren't irrelevant. And your opinion on the pickle fork... Opening up the bow for more people and leg room isn't stupid if you've got a crew to make comfortable. I fail to see a reason to insult other peoples boats when you obviously don't have any real experience with the pickle fork.

I'm pretty sure your opinion of the G Series boats falls under, "Insulting others peoples boats"

The picklefork doesn't open up the bow, The G has the same bow shape without the forks. They're aesthetic, and I'm not a fan. If people are a fan, they're welcome to own them, as a couple buddies do. And I rib them for it too, it's all in good fun. Does the fork make the boat suck? nope, and that's my point. Does a MasterCraft owners opinion of the look of the G series make them suck? nope, and that's also my point, and it's the exact same point.

I'm not a MasterCraft fanboy, that much is evident. I am however a consumer. My experience with consumers is that many people fall in love with a brand and aren't willing to give others the benefit of the doubt, they cast judgement too quick. For what it's worth, I like the G Series, sure, but I wouldn't buy one either. I like the classic SAN 230. That's my pick, then the X-30.

I fail to see how, "experience with the picklefork" would make me not see the design as silly. It is however interesting that you own a boat with the forks, and are harshing me for judgement while you have been vocal about not liking the appearance of the G Series.

scott023
11-19-2013, 10:31 PM
I'm pretty sure your opinion of the G Series boats falls under, "Insulting others peoples boats"

The picklefork doesn't open up the bow, The G has the same bow shape without the forks. They're aesthetic, and I'm not a fan. If people are a fan, they're welcome to own them, as a couple buddies do. And I rib them for it too, it's all in good fun. Does the fork make the boat suck? nope, and that's my point. Does a MasterCraft owners opinion of the look of the G series make them suck? nope, and that's also my point, and it's the exact same point.

I'm not a MasterCraft fanboy, that much is evident. I am however a consumer. My experience with consumers is that many people fall in love with a brand and aren't willing to give others the benefit of the doubt, they cast judgement too quick. For what it's worth, I like the G Series, sure, but I wouldn't buy one either. I like the classic SAN 230. That's my pick, then the X-30.

I fail to see how, "experience with the picklefork" would make me not see the design as silly. It is however interesting that you own a boat with the forks, and are harshing me for judgement while you have be vocal about not liking the appearance of the G Series.

I said that I didn't like the look of the interior. I've also said that I know they are great boats with great wakes. I haven't criticized the boats in general, only said my opinion. I didn't come our and say anything was"stupid" about the boats.

I think appearance is a huge part of toy purchasing. I looked at the 23 at Wizard this summer with an open mind. I was put off with the limited color choices, price and interior discomfort. The boat drove well, and both surf and wakeboard wakes were great. But I didn't see big enough improvement in either the G or the 46 to make me consider buying a new boat. I've got nothing against Nautique boats, they make great boats, no two ways about it.

Oh, thought you should know that the G bow may have the same shape, but it isn't a big as my 45s bow. I couldn't stretch out in it like I can I'm my boat. ;)

scott023
11-19-2013, 10:35 PM
And the problem with chopper sprayed fiberglass is What ?? weight ??

So what MC might be handlaid glass...so they save weight + costs in glass.......So that you the owner only have to add more ballast. DUH

The CC are structurally heavier built, which in my book is superior to a "light weight" wake boat which has less glass in the hull to save costs.

Answer me this, because I really don't know. Is MC saving costs by adding the labor intensive steel of hand laying the glass? Are they using less glass but making them this way?

scott023
11-19-2013, 10:43 PM
I'm pretty sure your opinion of the G Series boats falls under, "Insulting others peoples boats"

The picklefork doesn't open up the bow, The G has the same bow shape without the forks. They're aesthetic, and I'm not a fan. If people are a fan, they're welcome to own them, as a couple buddies do. And I rib them for it too, it's all in good fun. Does the fork make the boat suck? nope, and that's my point. Does a MasterCraft owners opinion of the look of the G series make them suck? nope, and that's also my point, and it's the exact same point.

I'm not a MasterCraft fanboy, that much is evident. I am however a consumer. My experience with consumers is that many people fall in love with a brand and aren't willing to give others the benefit of the doubt, they cast judgement too quick. For what it's worth, I like the G Series, sure, but I wouldn't buy one either. I like the classic SAN 230. That's my pick, then the X-30.

I fail to see how, "experience with the picklefork" would make me not see the design as silly. It is however interesting that you own a boat with the forks, and are harshing me for judgement while you have been vocal about not liking the appearance of the G Series.


Oh yeah, my point on the experience with the pickles... I have spent plenty of days in friends 15s and 30s. I notice the bow doesn't get used a heck of a lot (buy the families that own them, or my family), but when those same people are on our boat, they are in the bow constantly, and they comment non stop about how roomy it is, how they can stretch out in it. I know I can't stretch out in any boats now like I can in the 45s.

The only boat I'm really not "open to" are Malibus. I think they are truly over rated boats that too many people buy for cool factor, and aren't getting the bang for their buck that they think they are. There are a lot of nice looking BUs out there though.

AlbertaSurfer
11-19-2013, 10:50 PM
I said that I didn't like the look of the interior. I've also said that I know they are great boats with great wakes. I haven't criticized the boats in general, only said my opinion. I didn't come our and say anything was"stupid" about the boats.

I think appearance is a huge part of toy purchasing. I looked at the 23 at Wizard this summer with an open mind. I was put off with the limited color choices, price and interior discomfort. The boat drove well, and both surf and wakeboard wakes were great. But I didn't see big enough improvement in either the G or the 46 to make me consider buying a new boat. I've got nothing against Nautique boats, they make great boats, no two ways about it.

Oh, thought you should know that the G bow may have the same shape, but it isn't a big as my 45s bow. I couldn't stretch out in it like I can I'm my boat. ;)

Yep, me too.

The OP posted the new G21, so I've been stating my opinion of it, which includes liking it more than the current MC's. Seems fair to me. The appearance of the X line with the forks is the reason I wouldn't buy anything other than an older X1 or X30. Just my own personal preference.

Either way, if someone told me the interior of my boat was "heinous", I would consider that insulting.

scott023
11-19-2013, 10:55 PM
Yep, me too.

The OP posted the new G21, so I've been stating my opinion of it, which includes liking it more than the current MC's. Seems fair to me. The appearance of the X line with the forks is the reason I wouldn't buy anything other than an older X1 or X30. Just my own personal preference.

Either way, if someone told me the interior of my boat was "heinous", I would consider that insulting.

Point taken. I guess I wasn't thinking that there were G21 owners on this forum that I would be insulting.:D I'll try to choose my words more carefully going forward.

Aric'sX15
11-19-2013, 10:57 PM
Yep, me too.

The OP posted the new G21, so I've been stating my opinion of it, which includes liking it more than the current MC's. Seems fair to me. The appearance of the X line with the forks is the reason I wouldn't buy anything other than an older X1 or X30. Just my own personal preference.

Either way, if someone told me the interior of my boat was "heinous", I would consider that insulting.

well, you don't own a g boat so we don't have to worry about you getting insulted.

mikeg205
11-19-2013, 10:57 PM
This is an awesome thread. I am sure MC is proud of their brand loyalty. :)

Traxx822
11-19-2013, 11:02 PM
Here is some fuel. The G21 is utter Garbage. :cool:

And the pickle fork is only functional on the new prostar. Oh and makes it look a ton better :eek:

Sent from my HTC One using Tapatalk

AlbertaSurfer
11-19-2013, 11:03 PM
Haha, dang... just when the trolling was getting good.

I bought a G25, G23 and ordered a G21 8 mins ago... all points made are now validated.

Wheeee!

scott023
11-19-2013, 11:03 PM
:uglyhamme

Aric'sX15
11-19-2013, 11:04 PM
i love trolling on this forum! I've been actively trolling since i sold my boat in march! lol

Traxx822
11-19-2013, 11:08 PM
Just kidding, how is this thread doing tonight?

Oh about the same I see. Good to hear the number one topic on the MC forum right now is a Naughty

Sent from my HTC One using Tapatalk

mikeg205
11-19-2013, 11:09 PM
Just kidding, how is this thread doing tonight?

Oh about the same I see. Good to hear the number one topic on the MC forum right now is a Naughty

Sent from my HTC One using Tapatalk

Love it... even from boring Omaha, NE

Traxx822
11-19-2013, 11:10 PM
i love trolling on this forum! I've been actively trolling since i sold my boat in march! lol

Buying anything new?

Sent from my HTC One using Tapatalk

AlbertaSurfer
11-19-2013, 11:14 PM
I'ma sell Aric one of these G series boats I seem to have kicking around after those hasty purchases a few mins ago.

Anyone looking for entertainment of the non boat kind, The Edmonton Oilers are handily winning a hockey game for the first time this season... so that's.. fun?

mikeg205
11-19-2013, 11:16 PM
Funny this type of discussion usually hits later in the season... the 2013 season withdrawal came early this year.. ;)

Traxx822
11-19-2013, 11:19 PM
Your in withdrawal because you sulk all winter.

Me thinks you need to go sledding or something.

Sent from my HTC One using Tapatalk

mikeg205
11-19-2013, 11:21 PM
Your in withdrawal because you sulk all winter.

Me thinks you need to go sledding or something.

Sent from my HTC One using Tapatalk

Nah- training of next season already - took my 4 weeks off - on the bike in the basement already... :) -

scott023
11-19-2013, 11:23 PM
I'ma sell Aric one of these G series boats I seem to have kicking around after those hasty purchases a few mins ago.

Anyone looking for entertainment of the non boat kind, The Edmonton Oilers are handily winning a hockey game for the first time this season... so that's.. fun?

They must be playing the Oil Kings? ;):D

Traxx822
11-19-2013, 11:26 PM
Nah- training of next season already - took my 4 weeks off - on the bike in the basement already... :) -

Bike????? :confused:

Nerd. :eek:

Sent from my HTC One using Tapatalk

AlbertaSurfer
11-19-2013, 11:27 PM
They must be playing the Oil Kings? ;):D

Blue Jackets, and they should be glad because the Oil Kings would beat them. For sure.

mikeg205
11-19-2013, 11:28 PM
yeah that's me.. ;)

Aric'sX15
11-19-2013, 11:31 PM
Buying anything new?

Sent from my HTC One using Tapatalk

its hard when your buddy has the exact boat you wanna buy, and lives about 5 miles from my house. lol. and i just gave my dad my truck, so its not looking good. would love to have my ol 205v back. now THAT was a game changer! lol.

Tristarboarder
11-19-2013, 11:41 PM
I love this thread, its just keeps on keepin' on! The original xstar/x2/x1/205.....a true game changer and original....

AlbertaSurfer
11-19-2013, 11:44 PM
I love this thread, its just keeps on keepin' on! The original xstar/x2/x1/205.....a true game changer and original....

I have one, and change the game every time I go to the lake. Maybe I'll put that new Indmar Raptor engine in it and leave the game behind!

CC2MC
11-19-2013, 11:55 PM
Answer me this, because I really don't know. Is MC saving costs by adding the labor intensive steel of hand laying the glass? Are they using less glass but making them this way?

Being a former CC lamination engineer, I can say that I feel that CC boats are overbuilt, bc they have several people that have been with the company for 20 or more years that have the old school way of thinking. It is difficult to change a way of thinking with some individuals there. I tried to get them away from the chopper gun thing but was unsuccessful. I was able to make some pretty significant leaps in the way their small parts are manufactured with the LRTM process.

As far as the hand laid fiberglass mat in MC goes, it makes for a more consistent glass to resin ratio, compared with the chopper gun. This in turn makes for potentially stronger hulls and enables you to have more control over the laminating process. There should be a better idea of the amount of resin and an exact amount of glass that goes into every boat, helping you save money. The glass mat can get cut into kits on the CNC machine.

CC has some of the best chopper gun operators I have seen, but no matter how good you are, it is still very difficult to have near perfect uniform thickness throughout. They weigh every boat and hull and they are all pretty close, but do vary from boat to boat. I would really like to go through the MC facility again and pay a little more attention to how they laminate everything. It has been 2 or 3 years since I last visited. About time to go back again.

scott023
11-20-2013, 12:14 AM
Blue Jackets, and they should be glad because the Oil Kings would beat them. For sure.

They need a complete management changeover, IMO. Can't be that bad for this long...

scott023
11-20-2013, 12:17 AM
Being a former CC lamination engineer, I can say that I feel that CC boats are overbuilt, bc they have several people that have been with the company for 20 or more years that have the old school way of thinking. It is difficult to change a way of thinking with some individuals there. I tried to get them away from the chopper gun thing but was unsuccessful. I was able to make some pretty significant leaps in the way their small parts are manufactured with the LRTM process.

As far as the hand laid fiberglass mat in MC goes, it makes for a more consistent glass to resin ratio, compared with the chopper gun. This in turn makes for potentially stronger hulls and enables you to have more control over the laminating process. There should be a better idea of the amount of resin and an exact amount of glass that goes into every boat, helping you save money. The glass mat can get cut into kits on the CNC machine.

CC has some of the best chopper gun operators I have seen, but no matter how good you are, it is still very difficult to have near perfect uniform thickness throughout. They weigh every boat and hull and they are all pretty close, but do vary from boat to boat. I would really like to go through the MC facility again and pay a little more attention to how they laminate everything. It has been 2 or 3 years since I last visited. About time to go back again.

That's great info, thanks for sharing. I really had no idea what the difference was. So is one way superior to the other?

AlbertaSurfer
11-20-2013, 12:22 AM
They need a complete management changeover, IMO. Can't be that bad for this long...

It's a complete mess that the trainwreck was caused by Lowe, Howsen and MacTavish, they moved out MacT and Howsen, fixed the problem, then brought back in Lowe, Howsen and MacTavish. Oilers are a joke. I've become an Oil Kings fan the past few years because they're exciting, games are fun, they win, and they're better than the Rebels! ;)

scott023
11-20-2013, 12:35 AM
It's a complete mess that the trainwreck was caused by Lowe, Howsen and MacTavish, they moved out MacT and Howsen, fixed the problem, then brought back in Lowe, Howsen and MacTavish. Oilers are a joke. I've become an Oil Kings fan the past few years because they're exciting, games are fun, they win, and they're better than the Rebels! ;)

I haven't been following the W at all, but I know the Oil Kings have been solid. At least Edmonton has one team worth watching. :D

AlbertaSurfer
11-20-2013, 12:42 AM
Yeah, I follow the WHL because our NHL offering is an embarrassment. Plus, $28 for club seats vs $245, it's an easy sell for an exciting team.

scott023
11-20-2013, 12:57 AM
Yeah, I follow the WHL because our NHL offering is an embarrassment. Plus, $28 for club seats vs $245, it's an easy sell for an exciting team.

Can't beat that value. And players playing for pride and their future, not a paycheck.

snork
11-20-2013, 08:38 AM
That's great info, thanks for sharing. I really had no idea what the difference was. So is one way superior to the other?

If you put a fairly bright light under the deck you'll see light penetrating through around the corner areas of some Nautiques, like CC2MC its extremely difficult to get even thickness and in my experience the corners are the most difficult to achieve proper penetration with a chopper gun
Its been a couple years sense I did the light test perhaps Nautique has perfected this inadequacies

scott023
11-20-2013, 09:32 AM
If you put a fairly bright light under the deck you'll see light penetrating through around the corner areas of some Nautiques, like CC2MC its extremely difficult to get even thickness and in my experience the corners are the most difficult to achieve proper penetration with a chopper gun
Its been a couple years sense I did the light test perhaps Nautique has perfected this inadequacies

That's very interesting. I'm learning new things.

aquaman
11-20-2013, 09:34 AM
If you put a fairly bright light under the deck you'll see light penetrating through around the corner areas of some Nautiques, like CC2MC its extremely difficult to get even thickness and in my experience the corners are the most difficult to achieve proper penetration with a chopper gun
Its been a couple years sense I did the light test perhaps Nautique has perfected this inadequacies

Agreed there is a technical advantage to the hand lay-up fiberglass vs spray chopped, but for ski boats i dont think its really a significant advantage, but just a difference ?

I have owned 3 Correct Crafts and overall they do have a superior build from the standpoint of longevity and reliability than any boat in their class. (unless you count Grady Whites)

Style has not been one of their strong points, but they do deliver what they are built to do without question. :rolleyes:

scott023
11-20-2013, 09:35 AM
Agreed there is a technical advantage to the hand lay-up fiberglass vs spray chopped, but for ski boats i dont think its really a significant advantage, but just a difference ?

I have owned 3 Correct Crafts and overall they do have a superior build from the standpoint of longevity and reliability than any boat in their class. (unless you count Grady Whites)

Style has not been one of their strong points, but they do deliver what they are built to do without question. :rolleyes:

That's including MC?

CC2MC
11-20-2013, 09:38 AM
That's great info, thanks for sharing. I really had no idea what the difference was. So is one way superior to the other?

I like the idea of glass mat in the hulls for quality control and consistency, however I was trying to take it up to another level and at least start the SN 196, with the vacuum bagging process. You basically lay all the precut glass into the gel coated hull/deck, seal it with a giant plastic bag and suck the resin through. I eventually wanted to modify the process to make it a little more fool proof but the process actually uses more glass to get the necessary thickness needed but less resin. It makes for a much stronger product in the end. It certainly has its drawbacks too. You only have one shot to get that resin all the way through or else that boat is trashed. It is a much cleaner process and it is a very low voc process. If you have ever been in a lamination facility, there is quite a distinct odor from the resin, which is not good to breath, not to mention the little bits of fiberglass floating around. Anyway, I could go further about this. Feel free to pm me if you are just curious and wat to know more.

cbryan70
11-20-2013, 09:52 AM
What do you think about the vec process? http://www.vectechnology.com/index.cfm

CC2MC
11-20-2013, 09:53 AM
If you put a fairly bright light under the deck you'll see light penetrating through around the corner areas of some Nautiques, like CC2MC its extremely difficult to get even thickness and in my experience the corners are the most difficult to achieve proper penetration with a chopper gun
Its been a couple years sense I did the light test perhaps Nautique has perfected this inadequacies

I actually addressed this too. They make a fiberglass rope to put in corners to help prevent the lack of glass in corners. When rolling the glass some tend to press down too hard to remove air bubbles in the corners which makes that area thinner. I got them to add some glass from the chopper gun roll as one long piece and putting it in the corners. I am not sure if they are still keeping with this practice though as it adds another step. I would not be overly concerned with the strength of the CC product.

Another point about MC is, IIRC I thought I remembered seeing a barrier coat on theirs. I may be wrong on that but that is usually sprayed after the gel oat to help prevent print through. It is usually a darker color which would help with the light test. Don't hold me to that though.

My sea doo boat I used to have had the same issue with the light test, but consider what all those boats are made to do and they hold up pretty well. They too are made with a different process.

What do you think about the vec process? http://www.vectechnology.com/index.cfm

Very cool process! I have not seen that one yet but been out of the industry a few years. That is basically what I wanted to get CC to, but that system is a bit more sophisticated. It certainly helps with the foolproof end of things. The thing that turns people off about this new tech is not the process itself but the initial investment needed to make this work, which is what I had a hard time getting past. This process would eventually pay for itself over the long run.

aquaman
11-20-2013, 10:01 AM
That's including MC?

Yes it does.

But, you can judge for yourself. Just notice older CC's and MC's in gerneral.

From my experience the Correct Crafts stand the test of time and weather, better.


I do love my MC Barefoot 200.......but it's a unique and special boat, even for MasterCraft. :)

WakeRider107
11-20-2013, 11:13 AM
Theres so much garbage in this thread, I don't even know where to start

aquaman
11-20-2013, 11:30 AM
Theres so much garbage in this thread, I don't even know where to start

You could start by telling us about the Quality build of your Supra ? :rolleyes:

tkemperdc
11-20-2013, 11:33 AM
Theres so much garbage in this thread, I don't even know where to start

Well if you are the same wakerider107 on planet nautique, I am sure you are offended. You do realize you are on a MasterCraft forum? I would guess, as a group those on a brand forum maybe slightly slanted to the brand?

My opinion is I don't like the look of the G series, interior, exterior, it may run along fine, great wake and by the pic sure. I would rather have a new generation Star. But I prefer the look, interior, fit and finish of a MasterCraft.

I spend alternating time on a SV211. But my preference is my MC. To each their own.

Tom

scott023
11-20-2013, 11:33 AM
Yes it does.

But, you can judge for yourself. Just notice older CC's and MC's in gerneral.

From my experience the Correct Crafts stand the test of time and weather, better.


I do love my MC Barefoot 200.......but it's a unique and special boat, even for MasterCraft. :)

I don't know a lot about the older MC's, but I will say I see a heck of lot of nice ones on here.

Aric'sX15
11-20-2013, 11:35 AM
You could start by telling us about the Quality build of your Supra ? :rolleyes:

Bahaha you beat me to it

tkemperdc
11-20-2013, 11:37 AM
You could start by telling us about the Quality build of your Supra ? :rolleyes:

:D HAHA.

willyt
11-20-2013, 11:50 AM
when does the ice melt again?

ttu
11-20-2013, 11:54 AM
when does the ice melt again?

months! can't get here fast enough!:rolleyes:

soacj
11-20-2013, 12:09 PM
Yes it does.

But, you can judge for yourself. Just notice older CC's and MC's in gerneral.

From my experience the Correct Crafts stand the test of time and weather, better.




Having seen plenty of (wooden stringer) Nautiques (up to early '90's models) with terminal amounts of spider-webbed gelcoat, I'd challenge that statement.

captain planet
11-20-2013, 12:16 PM
i don't think MC is hand laid anymore

Yes it is hand laid.

captain planet
11-20-2013, 12:19 PM
And the problem with chopper sprayed fiberglass is What ?? weight ??

So what MC might be handlaid glass...so they save weight + costs in glass.......So that you the owner only have to add more ballast. DUH

The CC are structurally heavier built, which in my book is superior to a "light weight" wake boat which has less glass in the hull to save costs.

No, strength is the problem. It isn't as strong because there is more resin vs. fabric.

captain planet
11-20-2013, 12:32 PM
Agreed there is a technical advantage to the hand lay-up fiberglass vs spray chopped, but for ski boats i dont think its really a significant advantage, but just a difference ?

I have owned 3 Correct Crafts and overall they do have a superior build from the standpoint of longevity and reliability than any boat in their class. (unless you count Grady Whites)

Style has not been one of their strong points, but they do deliver what they are built to do without question. :rolleyes:

It is interesting that you bring them up. I found a Boating article from 1999 or 2000 that mentions them and MC. I'll go into the crawlspace tonight and see if I can find it and scan it for you all to read.

captain planet
11-20-2013, 12:34 PM
I actually addressed this too. They make a fiberglass rope to put in corners to help prevent the lack of glass in corners. When rolling the glass some tend to press down too hard to remove air bubbles in the corners which makes that area thinner. I got them to add some glass from the chopper gun roll as one long piece and putting it in the corners. I am not sure if they are still keeping with this practice though as it adds another step. I would not be overly concerned with the strength of the CC product.

Another point about MC is, IIRC I thought I remembered seeing a barrier coat on theirs. I may be wrong on that but that is usually sprayed after the gel oat to help prevent print through. It is usually a darker color which would help with the light test. Don't hold me to that though.

My sea doo boat I used to have had the same issue with the light test, but consider what all those boats are made to do and they hold up pretty well. They too are made with a different process.



Very cool process! I have not seen that one yet but been out of the industry a few years. That is basically what I wanted to get CC to, but that system is a bit more sophisticated. It certainly helps with the foolproof end of things. The thing that turns people off about this new tech is not the process itself but the initial investment needed to make this work, which is what I had a hard time getting past. This process would eventually pay for itself over the long run.

You are correct, it is there.

aquaman
11-20-2013, 12:40 PM
Having seen plenty of (wooden stringer) Nautiques (up to early '90's models) with terminal amounts of spider-webbed gelcoat, I'd challenge that statement.

gel coats can fail on all boats without influencing the structural intergrity of the fiberglass.

a good example is gel coat blisters on boats that are moored.

please tell what is a "terminal" amount of gel coat spider cracks ?

FourFourty
11-20-2013, 12:44 PM
gel coats can fail on all boats without influencing the structural intergrity of the fiberglass.

a good example is gel coat blisters on boats that are moored.

please tell what is a "terminal" amount of gel coat spider cracks ?


I was under the impression that the whole point of gelcoat was to protect the integrity of the fiberglass.

Fiberglass does degrade with constant exposure to water, oxygen, and other contaminants....... So, bad gel, does influence structural integrity over time.

aquaman
11-20-2013, 12:54 PM
I was under the impression that the whole point of gelcoat was to protect the integrity of the fiberglass.

Fiberglass does degrade with constant exposure to water, oxygen, and other contaminants....... So, bad gel, does influence structural integrity over time.

I dont think gel coat is required for fiberglass to maintain structural intergity.
There are many instances of industrial fiberglass that has no gel coat.

Maybe there is someone reading this that can explain the purpose of gel coat, other than to provide a Glitter Boat. :)

captain planet
11-20-2013, 01:17 PM
I dont think gel coat is required for fiberglass to maintain structural intergity.
There are many instances of industrial fiberglass that has no gel coat.

Maybe there is someone reading this that can explain the purpose of gel coat, other than to provide a Glitter Boat. :)

I can tell you it isn't for protection from water. We have several water treatment towers that are made of fiberglass that don't have any gel coat on them that constantly have running water going through them.

Traxx822
11-20-2013, 01:27 PM
My and I'm sure most if your surfboards are made of foam wrapped in fiberglass and resin. With nothing on top. They don't deteriorate and have direct contact with water and oxygen

Sent from my HTC One using Tapatalk

JRW160
11-20-2013, 02:17 PM
These are available with a removable carpet as well, the SeaDek is an option.
I'm pretty sure I read seadek is the only option now. I can't find where I saw that now, but I think they said that the vast majority of the g23 and g25 orders were seadek, so they just removed the carpet option altogether.

Traxx822
11-20-2013, 02:34 PM
I called SeaDek about the smell issue people are talking about. They said they had only ever recieced two complaints about smell and it was from people with animals.

As far as cleaning. My swim pad has had green algea growing on it and all it took was some TAC and it came right off and looked brand new.

Sent from my HTC One using Tapatalk

Traxx822
11-20-2013, 02:34 PM
Then I ordered the Mylar template material so I could order my SeaDek replacement flooring.

Sent from my HTC One using Tapatalk

soacj
11-20-2013, 04:26 PM
gel coats can fail on all boats without influencing the structural intergrity of the fiberglass.

a good example is gel coat blisters on boats that are moored.

please tell what is a "terminal" amount of gel coat spider cracks ?

Fair enough. I was responding to your statement that "Correct Crafts stand the test of time and weather, better". I don't see where you specified cosmetic vs. structural issues in your comments.

I was way too conservative when I described the cracks on two of the boats I'm referring to as spider webbing--they had gel cracks which looked like a dry lake bed. You could almost flake gel off. I've yet to see a Mastercraft which had gel coat cracks which even remotely approached those boats.

mlawler34
11-20-2013, 04:44 PM
G21 or X25... Both attracting ladies for the swimsuit thread....

FourFourty
11-20-2013, 04:55 PM
I dont think gel coat is required for fiberglass to maintain structural intergity.
There are many instances of industrial fiberglass that has no gel coat.

Maybe there is someone reading this that can explain the purpose of gel coat, other than to provide a Glitter Boat. :)

I can tell you it isn't for protection from water. We have several water treatment towers that are made of fiberglass that don't have any gel coat on them that constantly have running water going through them.

My and I'm sure most if your surfboards are made of foam wrapped in fiberglass and resin. With nothing on top. They don't deteriorate and have direct contact with water and oxygen

Sent from my HTC One using Tapatalk

From Wiki..... "Many marine craft and aircraft are manufactured using composite materials with an outer layer of gelcoat, typically 0.5 mm to 0.8 mm (0.02 in to 0.03 in) thick. Gelcoats are designed to be durable, providing resistance to ultraviolet degradation and hydrolysis."


And a good read on how contact with water WILL hurt your fiberglass. http://nhml.com/hydrolysis-of-fiberglass.cfm

As far as the tank, and surfboard examples..... The surfboards have an outer layer to seal them. Most commonly clear polyurethane. And every fiberglass tank, that I have ever seen, has a specialized coating over the fiberglass/resin.

Aric'sX15
11-20-2013, 07:16 PM
would like to see the x25 with 3k!

kgrove
11-20-2013, 08:03 PM
would like to see the x25 with 3k!

I wouldn't. I'm worried about my knees with the current factory ballast. Any more and I may as well set aside money for knee replacement surgeries now.

Aric'sX15
11-20-2013, 08:07 PM
well to be compared to a g, would be nice to see some equal comparison.

501s
11-21-2013, 03:13 AM
I have never seen pics of the X-25 wake with 4 or 5k in weight like Xstars and G23's. I'd like too.

Aric'sX15
11-21-2013, 10:04 AM
Looks like I should go demo one and bring all my sacs! Lol

ironj32
11-21-2013, 11:46 AM
I don't have any pics of a loaded up X25, but I can share some wake pics of a G23.

I've talked with a few of the guys who rode the G21 down at it's release at OWC, and it sounds like the wake on a G21 is slightly bigger and steeper than the G23 with just STOCK ballast, however the wake of a slammed G23 is bigger than a slammed G21.

Anyone have any wake pics of a slammed X25, XStar or X46?

scott023
11-21-2013, 12:11 PM
I'm assuming those pics are with factory ballast only?

Aric'sX15
11-21-2013, 12:18 PM
That is unbelievable. That wake is FAT!!!!!

Aric'sX15
11-21-2013, 12:19 PM
Didn't you have a 230 also? You should post up the comparison that you posted on ww.

ironj32
11-21-2013, 12:22 PM
Didn't you have a 230 also? You should post up the comparison that you posted on ww.

We had a 230 for a few summers. Here is how a slammed 230 stacks up against a stock G23.

bobx1
11-21-2013, 12:49 PM
I called SeaDek about the smell issue people are talking about.....

Did you use the specific term "foot cheese"? :D

Aric'sX15
11-21-2013, 05:57 PM
Good lord that is massive!!! Thanks for the comparison!

snork
11-21-2013, 08:04 PM
You literally surf the slammed G23 wake 70' back

Nick911
11-21-2013, 08:44 PM
http://img.tapatalk.com/d/13/11/22/rera2u9u.jpg

Here's my X25 with stock plus 8 or 9 people. Don't mind my poor form. I'm 5'11 for reference.

Aric'sX15
11-21-2013, 08:46 PM
That's pretty large also!

Nick911
11-21-2013, 08:48 PM
I've never went more than stock for Wakeboaring. 9 people probably an extra 1500 lbs max. It would be sick with 3000 lbs or more.

Tristarboarder
11-21-2013, 10:40 PM
This last Summer I went to a professional wake tournament, and ran into some guys at a local booth promoting their (my alum) school and their collegiate wakeboard team. I was talking with them, asking where they ride etc, and what tow boat they used. They said the school was sponsored with a '13 Xstar, but they had access to a '13 G23. They said hands down the SAN was such a better wakeboat, and that the wake was superior to the star. I thought it was an interesting opinion. Those pics above, it is hard to argue. I said before, and I'll say it again...the wake of the G is super sweet, but damn its ugly...still, that wake is money

scott023
11-22-2013, 12:41 AM
That's pretty large also!

That's what she said.

CumberlandXstar
11-22-2013, 01:50 PM
This last Summer I went to a professional wake tournament, and ran into some guys at a local booth promoting their (my alum) school and their collegiate wakeboard team. I was talking with them, asking where they ride etc, and what tow boat they used. They said the school was sponsored with a '13 Xstar, but they had access to a '13 G23. They said hands down the SAN was such a better wakeboat, and that the wake was superior to the star. I thought it was an interesting opinion. Those pics above, it is hard to argue. I said before, and I'll say it again...the wake of the G is super sweet, but damn its ugly...still, that wake is money

Did you go to Tennessee? I was the club president back in 2005 - 2007.

Tristarboarder
11-22-2013, 01:52 PM
Naw, less cool.......Central Washington University

Aric'sX15
11-22-2013, 02:21 PM
Hey im the North Texas wake team prez! Haha

WakeRider107
01-21-2014, 02:16 PM
You could start by telling us about the Quality build of your Supra ? :rolleyes:

It's a piece of crap! I almost lemon-lawed it.
Which is exactly why I bought a new 230 a year and a half ago. Guess I should update my profile.
And yes I found it neccessary to revive an old thread to respond to that.

aquaman
01-21-2014, 02:27 PM
It's a piece of crap! I almost lemon-lawed it.
Which is exactly why I bought a new 230 a year and a half ago. Guess I should update my profile.
And yes I found it neccessary to revive an old thread to respond to that.


Good for you.

And thanks for the update ! :)

FourFourty
01-22-2014, 08:07 AM
Here's my X25 with stock plus 8 or 9 people. Don't mind my poor form. I'm 5'11 for reference.

That is tiny!!!, And you must be doing 32 MPH to have an X25 wake that clean. Don't add any weight to that thing, in fact, fill the ballast bags with helium and maybe you can wakeboard under 30 MPH.


Oops, thought I was on WW. :D



Back to serious-

IronJ- Do you have plans to ride the G21 soon? I would be interested in your comparison to the stock wake on the G23. I am familiar with the G23 wake, and want the opinion of someone who really shreds these wakes...... Also, you seem to have mostly unbiased opinions on the subject of wakes.

WakeRider107
01-22-2014, 08:40 AM
IronJ- Do you have plans to ride the G21 soon? I would be interested in your comparison to the stock wake on the G23. I am familiar with the G23 wake, and want the opinion of someone who really shreds these wakes...... Also, you seem to have mostly unbiased opinions on the subject of wakes.

I'm sure ironj will chime in soon enough, but I can give you my opinion after driving and riding behind both.

Stock vs stock, I prefer the G21.
Reason being is the G21 has a lip similar to the 210/230.
Both stock wakes are similar in height and transition length, but the peak of the G21 gives a really nice boot straight up, which is my preference since I came from the steep supra wakes and now a 230.
Both G wakes are about equally wide also.

Now since no one has loaded a G21 besides the pros, we'll have to wait and see how that boat handles extra weight. The general consensous from the nautique pros is that the G23 is bigger when slammed, which makes sense.

Aric'sX15
01-22-2014, 10:23 AM
I'm sure ironj will chime in soon enough, but I can give you my opinion after driving and riding behind both.

Stock vs stock, I prefer the G21.
Reason being is the G21 has a lip similar to the 210/230.
Both stock wakes are similar in height and transition length, but the peak of the G21 gives a really nice boot straight up, which is my preference since I came from the steep supra wakes and now a 230.
Both G wakes are about equally wide also.

Now since no one has loaded a G21 besides the pros, we'll have to wait and see how that boat handles extra weight. The general consensous from the nautique pros is that the G23 is bigger when slammed, which makes sense.

When did g21s hit the show room?

ttu
01-22-2014, 10:29 AM
When did g21s hit the show room?


Buxton Marine has one in stock for sale.

kodiak
01-22-2014, 10:40 AM
I just looked at one here in Salt Lake and was really impressed with it. Wife is giving me a little push back at spending over 115k on a new boat but this would be the boat I get if I buy new.

WakeRider107
01-22-2014, 10:49 AM
When did g21s hit the show room?

Depends on the dealership and when their boat show is.
Some have had one for a few weeks.

CC2MC
01-22-2014, 11:12 AM
I saw the G21 last weekend and sat in it remembering some of the comments about it being uncomfortable. I didn't have any problem with it. The seats seemed to sit up a little straight, but it didn't keep me from getting into a comfy position. Maybe my opinion would change if on the water, and maybe that is what it will take. Either way, I did not see it being something I could not live with, if I were buying that boat, which I am not. I found out when the in water boat show is at our lake, which is at the end of April, so I look forward to taking a spin in the new G.

BTW, I think it is funny when people talk about the Lam Schedule of the CC boats, considering I used to be the FRP engineer for them. Granted, most of the lam schedule was predetermined before I got there, but I was the one that made the CAD drawings for all the lam schedules. Do they use a chopper gun? Yes, but they also use hand laid glass mat. Both manufacturers have been building boats for a long time and know what they are doing. I can assure you that they both build very high quality boats, no matter the road they take to get there.

Aric'sX15
01-22-2014, 11:15 AM
Buxton Marine has one in stock for sale.

I know what I'm doing today. Lol

ttu
01-22-2014, 12:00 PM
I know what I'm doing today. Lol

what, going to texas mastercraft to check out the new generation 2 surf tabs!:D:D

Aric'sX15
01-22-2014, 12:03 PM
what, going to texas mastercraft to check out the new generation 2 surf tabs!:D:D

I went there last weekend, I didnt see any gen2 yet! I wanna see the g21 in person! Lol.

AlbertaSurfer
01-22-2014, 12:53 PM
BTW, I think it is funny when people talk about the Lam Schedule of the CC boats, considering I used to be the FRP engineer for them. Granted, most of the lam schedule was predetermined before I got there, but I was the one that made the CAD drawings for all the lam schedules. Do they use a chopper gun? Yes, but they also use hand laid glass mat. Both manufacturers have been building boats for a long time and know what they are doing. I can assure you that they both build very high quality boats, no matter the road they take to get there.


That ought to get things fired up on a chilly January afternoon! Heeeeere we go!

I agree with you CC2MC, by the way.

WakeRider107
01-22-2014, 01:35 PM
BTW, I think it is funny when people talk about the Lam Schedule of the CC boats, considering I used to be the FRP engineer for them. Granted, most of the lam schedule was predetermined before I got there, but I was the one that made the CAD drawings for all the lam schedules. Do they use a chopper gun? Yes, but they also use hand laid glass mat. Both manufacturers have been building boats for a long time and know what they are doing. I can assure you that they both build very high quality boats, no matter the road they take to get there.

I definitely agree about the quality of both.
But some people argue that Nautiques fiberglass isn't thick enough and can be weak, and some say MC is too thick. In your experience, is there really any difference between the two as far as thickness goes? Is one theoretically better?

tmacx2
01-22-2014, 03:20 PM
I saw the G21 last weekend. I thought it looked better in person than the pics I have seen. As someone said the seating is more square but comfortable. The 2 rear storage compartments are cavernous. The boat show price was 111k. They were also offering 20 year financing. What a deal!

Tommy1005
01-23-2014, 12:16 PM
I loved the G21 until I tried to sit in the rear corner seats......the tower is basically where your arm should rest on the side of the boat and it just felt small sitting next to the G23.

CC2MC
01-23-2014, 02:41 PM
I definitely agree about the quality of both.
But some people argue that Nautiques fiberglass isn't thick enough and can be weak, and some say MC is too thick. In your experience, is there really any difference between the two as far as thickness goes? Is one theoretically better?

Well, I can't say that I have physically cut into a MC before to measure thickness. I can look at my boat and guesstimate the thickness, but that is not the best way to go about it. I have cut into plenty of CC boats to do flex tests and trying out different fiberglass combinations. If you want to see thick fiberglass, look at a Ranger bass boat deck next time you get the chance. I am not sure why theirs is as thick as it is, but I think it is close to 5/8"-3/4" thick. That is normal for a hull bottom or keel, but not a deck. Thickness creates strength, although if you get the thickness by adding too much resin and not enough glass, it will make a much weaker boat. Is one better than the other? It all depends on what part of the boat it is and the intended use of that part and how it is built. It is really hard to say all boats this size need to have at least this thickness, bc there are different types of glass used and bulkheads that may intersect to help create stiffness and strength. There are just too many different variables.