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bdunkel1
11-14-2013, 10:45 AM
Does anybody have any of the facts related to the poor vinyl in early 200 boats? What was the final problem determined to be and when was it corrected..

JohnE
11-14-2013, 11:14 AM
Not very specific details, but the vinyl quality from the vinyl manufacturers went downhill due to regulations prohibiting something in the manufacturing. Coupled with this MC supposedly stitched too close together which increased the problem. Someone will be along with more info.

captain planet
11-14-2013, 02:22 PM
The vinyl went downhill in 1999 through approximately 2004. The reason is because the EPA decided that the emissions from the vinyl producers was excessive and so they changed the regulations on emissions. The manner in which this was done was a hasty and the manufacturers didn't have time to reformulate properly and thus the quality of the vinyl was poor. You will find this to be the case across the marine industry. The distance between stitches is a new one on me, but I could see where the more holes you put in an inferior product the more rapidly it is going to fail.

helton333
11-14-2013, 02:39 PM
I have a 2003 and have had no issues whatsoever after fully expecting to have major issues after finding out about it. Not so much as a stitch out. I may just be lucky but am thinking I have different vinyl in my 2003 (manufactured late 2002) than the ones going bad. I would certainly state not every boat from this time will go bad.

Mark rsa2au
11-14-2013, 03:05 PM
I am not so sure it was as wide spread as some think. My 99 Sea Ray had perfect vinyl when I sold it for my X5. My mates Malibu is a 2002 and while it has never seen the inside of a garage or fancy vinyl conditioners it is still great apart from nicks etc from people.

When i was looking to buy, I also looked at a centurion and a tige from the same era (budget) and neither had vinyl issues. My 2001 X5 on the other hand is torn on EVERY stitch now.

Must be that some manufacturers coped better with the change in vinyl.

neil.anderson63
11-14-2013, 05:36 PM
Our 2002 has pretty thin vinyl compared the the 2005 and 2007 models we've had.

bigmac
11-15-2013, 12:20 AM
I believe that MasterCraft boats of that vintage are more commonly represented in the Bad Vinyl category.

JimN
11-15-2013, 07:42 AM
I am not so sure it was as wide spread as some think. My 99 Sea Ray had perfect vinyl when I sold it for my X5. My mates Malibu is a 2002 and while it has never seen the inside of a garage or fancy vinyl conditioners it is still great apart from nicks etc from people.

When i was looking to buy, I also looked at a centurion and a tige from the same era (budget) and neither had vinyl issues. My 2001 X5 on the other hand is torn on EVERY stitch now.

Must be that some manufacturers coped better with the change in vinyl.

'99 wasn't in the time window for the problems- the EPA mandates didn't start until after that time, although the short-term President at MC, who came from the automotive industry, did cut a bunch of corners and costs that made the '99 MCs less than they should have been. Some manufacturers used crap materials (Bayliner) and if a manufacturer didn't have problems with their material, the better quality stuff was either already in stock or they got lucky with their choice. However, some of what was used in MC boats wasn't made for cushions and backrests- it was made for bolsters and coaming pads, which don't experience the same stretching forces. The backing on this stuff isn't the same as what's used for cushions, which is like T-shirt material and stretches in all directions. Also, the outer surface of the vinyl needs to be strong enough to resist having the thread pull through like a cheese slicer, but not so hard that it cracks when bent. The pitch of the stitching (stitches per inch) is important, too- too fine and the vinyl at the seam will fail easily and too wide, it looks like crap and will pull apart.

Cloaked
11-28-2013, 06:32 AM
interesting thread

jaked7138
12-19-2013, 02:09 AM
i have an 04 and my corner seat has come almost completely undone and it is just in the seams but the rest of my upholstery is still pristine. still it could look a little bit better i dont love the look of it but i cant afford to buy a 100,000 dollar boat to get the upholstry and accesories that i want.

Burbon66
12-19-2013, 12:47 PM
Very interesting. The stitching on our 2002 was badly damaged when I got the boat, I think more due to the fact the thread was breaking down from UV damage, the vinyl looks good, but there is some sun damage to the top of a couple of the seats. Is this sun damage attributed to this batch of bad quality material you are mentioning?

JimN
12-19-2013, 07:39 PM
Very interesting. The stitching on our 2002 was badly damaged when I got the boat, I think more due to the fact the thread was breaking down from UV damage, the vinyl looks good, but there is some sun damage to the top of a couple of the seats. Is this sun damage attributed to this batch of bad quality material you are mentioning?

Could be from Sunlight, could be from bleach- that beats the crap out of lost thread. Also, which corner? If it's the corner where people step out of the boat or they kneel on that cushion, that's another big cause of stitching going bad.

Burbon66
12-23-2013, 04:13 PM
Could be from Sunlight, could be from bleach- that beats the crap out of lost thread. Also, which corner? If it's the corner where people step out of the boat or they kneel on that cushion, that's another big cause of stitching going bad.


Most of the stitching problems were on the engine cover (mid mount) and the bum of the back seat, the sun damage to the vinyl seams to be contained to the top of the seats up the front, near the base of the windscreen.