PDA

View Full Version : X2 with 7.4 motor


mcwaketx
10-15-2013, 10:30 PM
Would it be completely nuts to get an X2 with this engine choice? To me, the 5.7 just doesn't do it with a full boat and ballast, plus I like 50mph when I need to get places fast. I know most will say the 5.7 is sufficient for this little 20 footer but I wouldn't want one without the 6.0 or 6.2 at the least. Since I'm spending the extra money on a bigger motor, considering saying 'to hell with it' and just going with the biggest. Assuming the the incremental $22k for the 7.4 is not a problem and that it must only be an X2 (garage friendly boat), please voice what the pitfalls of this could be? Is it going to have a much worse GPH fuel burn than the other motors and would be be any less reliable over time? Are they known to break easier? Is it too much weight/power for this little hull and will it drive/handle funny? Thank you kindly.

lashburn1
10-15-2013, 10:48 PM
One just popped up for sale here in So Cal at the local MC dealer
Dealer said owner wants diff color.... Lol $$$$

mikeg205
10-15-2013, 10:51 PM
If you can afford it and aren't bothered by the up charge? why not. :) - more horsepower isn't a bad thing.

bcd
10-15-2013, 10:51 PM
I doubt you would get anywhere near your money out of it on resale. Then again, I think the 6.0 upgrade is way too much money.
I'm a little confused, you are ok spending 22k on the motor upgrade, but then are concerned about GPH fuel burn. Plus you want to drive 50 mph. My 5.7L sucks the gas down just cruising at 35 mph.

mcLove
10-15-2013, 10:57 PM
If you can spend that much money why not get a bigger boat and rent a boat garage?

mcwaketx
10-15-2013, 11:04 PM
Have my heart set on an X2, its perfect for my slip and garage at the house and I dont need to winterize the boat if it lives in my climate controlled garage at the house.
Money is not the question here, and I dont mind the upcharge one bit, as long as I know up front what it is, hence my question on the incremental fuel burn of a 5.7 versus a 7.4
Just dont like any surprises, hence the questions :) What would the gph be on the 7.4 for a mixture of cruise/wakeboard? Is it something crazy like 8gph versus 2gph? Also are there any known mechanical issues with the 7.4 that people have been complaining about?

scott023
10-16-2013, 12:16 AM
I really don't think your fuel burn will be an issue with a motor that big in a boat that small. I imagine that the difference would be negligible, the motor will hardly have to work to move it around.

dpolen
10-16-2013, 07:22 AM
FWIW...I have the 5.7 in my X2...coming from my old Maristar with a base engine...the X2 drives like a Porsche compared to the Maristar. I don't think the bigger motor is really necessary, buy yourself some more accessories like a custom cover and a ridiculous stereo instead.

Good luck! It's a great boat, you can't go wrong!

FourFourty
10-16-2013, 07:36 AM
I don't think the 7.4l is going to burn much more fuel than a 5.7l. They will be very close.

That being said, if you are worried about fuel consumption, go with the 6.2l. Being as it is a genIV SBC, It is the most fuel efficient of them all.

Also, the 6.2l would get you 50MPH pretty easy in an X2.

As for any other comments or info that I have on the 7.4l, should you decided that you wanna go crazy-

1-The sound of the 7.4l is unlike any of the other engines. It is intoxicating. They run a fairly aggressive cam in it, so it really rumbles at idle. It has a really deep "blub blub blub" sound, and you will feel the shake through the whole boat. This "shake" is not the annoying type shake that you get from a crappy running engine. It is the type you would get from an old muscle car. I fell in love the first time I fired it up on the water..... It sort of just slowly rocks the boat a little bit. I am thinking that you will really feel it in a little X2.

2-Because of the long duration of the big cam in this engine, the cranking times are a little longer than the other engines. (2-3 seconds, rather than 1 second)

3-Do your friends like their arms? On a scale of 1-10, how much do you think they want to keep their arms attached to their bodies?


4-I totaled the fuel usage for the year in my 13 XStar. It was 6.87GPH for the year. I would say that my use breaks down something like- 50% Surfing with 3500lbs ballast, 20% Wakeboarding with 1500lbs ballast, and 30% Cruising empty.

Keep in mind that my XStar weighs 60% more than an X2. I would expect that you would see an average GPH of 4-5 with either a 5.7l or a 7.4l. If you went with a 6.2l, I would expect you would see 3-4gph. My average in my X25 w/6.2l was 4.67 GPH in 2011, and 4.41 in 2012, And the X25 takes a lot more to push than an X2 as well. (a lot more wetted surface with the deep-v)

I knew it would be handy to have a fuel card for the boat :D
It allows me to spit out this useless information with just a few clicks at the fleetmatics website.

DHPRO
10-16-2013, 07:38 AM
You can NEVER have too much horsepower

bturner2
10-16-2013, 07:44 AM
50 mph is pretty much an unnatural act for a wake boat without brut force which is what you'll be doing with that engine/hull combination. These boats are designed (as most vehicles are) with a sweet spot based on a power package and intended usage. The 5.7 is that design point for this boat and intended usage, at least that's what I've been told by my dealer. Will the larger power package work in the X2? Absolutely. Will you see the incremental performance based on cost? Absolutely not. From a gas perspective if you're willing to put up $20K for the engine option gas should be the least of your worries. Sort of like buying a ZL1 Camaro then worrying about the price of premium gas.

If you're OK with this and don't plan to ever recover your investment in the boat based on that engine option, go for it. Just don't complain about resale when you go to sell it. You're pretty much going to be ordering a red car with a green interior from a resale perspective. Even if it's a Corvette getting somebody to pay for your option choice is going to be difficult. But hey we're in America and you can buy whatever you want and if it makes you happy and worth it to you that's all that should count.

wheeler
10-16-2013, 08:18 AM
the right prop will get you close to 50mph without spending all of that money, but hole shot will suffer a bit. I have 2 props, one that burns the crap out of gas and is strictly hole shot/surfing/stump pulling and one that will get you from one end of the lake and back without spending a hunnit!

willyt
10-16-2013, 08:42 AM
talk to mattscraft, mattscraft 2 (his x25) can hit 45 mph with the 6.2. the X2, being a smaller boat, weighing much less, and less wetted surface area would probably have no problems hitting 50 mph with the 6.2.

that being said, these hulls are not designed for those kinds of speeds, i think one member on here has a blown 5.7 and can hit speeds of over 50 mph in an older ski boat, at which point i remember him saying the ride becomes scary.

If you really have your heart set on an X2, I would go 6.2.

P.S. I'm not even sure they would put a 7.4 in an X2 for safety reasons.

P.P.S. i dont even like going faster than 25 with my boat

Indyxc
10-16-2013, 10:06 AM
FWIW...I have the 5.7 in my X2...coming from my old Maristar with a base engine...the X2 drives like a Porsche compared to the Maristar. I don't think the bigger motor is really necessary, buy yourself some more accessories like a custom cover and a ridiculous stereo instead.

Good luck! It's a great boat, you can't go wrong!

X2 drives like a Porsche? Lol, you need to drive some other vdrive boat. The only bad thing about the x2 is it handles like a barge.

scott023
10-16-2013, 10:09 AM
You can NEVER have too much horsepower

That's exactly right.

Tommy1005
10-16-2013, 10:11 AM
the other additional cost is in maintenance for the 7.4.....I've heard even oil changes are 2-3 times the cost of what it would be with the 6.2. I'm putting the 6.2 in my X30 and hoping for 45+, thinking if an X25 can hit 45, an X30 should be able to as well.

Build a boat says you can put the 7.4 in it, so Mastercraft doesn't have a problem with selling it to you that way. My other problem is the 7.4 requires premium, not that the cost is the issue, but there's only one gas station on my lake that has premium and it's a 20 minute boat ride to get to it from our house.

H2ORidr
10-16-2013, 10:12 AM
There is no replacement for displacement!

Mastercraftdave
10-16-2013, 10:32 AM
Build a boat says you can put the 7.4 in it, so Mastercraft doesn't have a problem with selling it to you that way. My other problem is the 7.4 requires premium, not that the cost is the issue, but there's only one gas station on my lake that has premium and it's a 20 minute boat ride to get to it from our house.

I have the 6.2 in my X45 and it requires premium gas and the top speed on my boat is 44 with the high alltitude prop. I wouldnt run a boat motor without premium but that just me.

FourFourty
10-16-2013, 10:55 AM
the other additional cost is in maintenance for the 7.4.....I've heard even oil changes are 2-3 times the cost of what it would be with the 6.2. I'm putting the 6.2 in my X30 and hoping for 45+, thinking if an X25 can hit 45, an X30 should be able to as well.

Build a boat says you can put the 7.4 in it, so Mastercraft doesn't have a problem with selling it to you that way. My other problem is the 7.4 requires premium, not that the cost is the issue, but there's only one gas station on my lake that has premium and it's a 20 minute boat ride to get to it from our house.

Maintenance costs are exactly the same on the 7.4l. Same filters, same trans oil, same engine oil, same everything. The only difference is the 7.4l takes 1/2 quarts more oil..... So that's, what, $4.00-$8.00 a year?

Also, the 7.4l does not require premium fuel. It is calibrated for 87 octane.


Mastercraftdave- Im pretty sure the 6.2 is calibrated for 87 as well. Not 100% sure on that, but I am pretty sure Ilmore tunes all of their engines for 87 octane, unlike the bigger indmar and PCM engines. that is one of their major benefits compared to them. I am, however, 100% sure the 7.4l is set up for 87.

bturner2
10-16-2013, 11:19 AM
X2 drives like a Porsche? Lol, you need to drive some other vdrive boat. The only bad thing about the x2 is it handles like a barge.

Barge is a little harsh. I prefer school bus......

lashburn1
10-16-2013, 12:11 PM
there current specs Show 5.7 6.0 and 6.2 all requiring 87 Octane..
No need for upgraded Fuel as the engine won't react to it...

scott023
10-16-2013, 12:31 PM
the other additional cost is in maintenance for the 7.4.....I've heard even oil changes are 2-3 times the cost of what it would be with the 6.2. I'm putting the 6.2 in my X30 and hoping for 45+, thinking if an X25 can hit 45, an X30 should be able to as well.

Build a boat says you can put the 7.4 in it, so Mastercraft doesn't have a problem with selling it to you that way. My other problem is the 7.4 requires premium, not that the cost is the issue, but there's only one gas station on my lake that has premium and it's a 20 minute boat ride to get to it from our house.

You're buying a tug boat, who cases how fast it goes? I don't understand the speed discussion when it comes to these boats.

scott023
10-16-2013, 12:34 PM
Maintenance costs are exactly the same on the 7.4l. Same filters, same trans oil, same engine oil, same everything. The only difference is the 7.4l takes 1/2 quarts more oil..... So that's, what, $4.00-$8.00 a year?

Also, the 7.4l does not require premium fuel. It is calibrated for 87 octane.


Mastercraftdave- Im pretty sure the 6.2 is calibrated for 87 as well. Not 100% sure on that, but I am pretty sure Ilmore tunes all of their engines for 87 octane, unlike the bigger indmar and PCM engines. that is one of their major benefits compared to them. I am, however, 100% sure the 7.4l is set up for 87.

Agreed, when I was looking at ordering a new boat I researched the fuel requirements. All are set up for 87 octane. If you're putting premium in, you're wasting your dough.

rgardjr1
10-16-2013, 12:51 PM
there current specs Show 5.7 6.0 and 6.2 all requiring 87 Octane..
No need for upgraded Fuel as the engine won't react to it...

A little surprised that the 6.2 doesn't have dual maps, but maybe Ilmore engineers are able to get enough performance out of 87 that they didn't see a need. I've read on other forums that the other manufacturers do have dual maps for engines requiring 92 octane.

rgardjr1
10-16-2013, 12:58 PM
One just popped up for sale here in So Cal at the local MC dealer
Dealer said owner wants diff color.... Lol $$$$

http://californiaskier.com/2013-mastercraft-x-2-for-sale-7-4l-520-hp/

No money shot though ...

Thrall
10-16-2013, 01:04 PM
Fuel burn should not be a big deal since the 454 won't be working hard at all in normal duty.
I agree it would be a bad@ss boat!
But I'll echo some of the others here saying that if you have no problem dropping around $100k on a X2 spend a few bucks to increase the slip/ garage and get a bigger boat.

I love my X2 but if I was going to throw a lot more cash at my boating experience it would be going into a bigger boat.
Flip side again...... Why not have the fastest X2 around if you have the means? It's your money and some people look at me weird for having a 450hp daily driver for my wife too. Disclaimer it cost about 1/5 of a new big block X2.

FourFourty
10-16-2013, 01:49 PM
Disclaimer it cost about 1/5 of a new big block X2.

A big block X2 would be very VERY difficult to acquire :D

lashburn1
10-16-2013, 01:52 PM
wants $80k

lashburn1
10-16-2013, 01:58 PM
Fuel burn should not be a big deal since the 454 won't be working hard at all in normal duty.
I agree it would be a bad@ss boat!
But I'll echo some of the others here saying that if you have no problem dropping around $100k on a X2 spend a few bucks to increase the slip/ garage and get a bigger boat.

I love my X2 but if I was going to throw a lot more cash at my boating experience it would be going into a bigger boat.
Flip side again...... Why not have the fastest X2 around if you have the means? It's your money and some people look at me weird for having a 450hp daily driver for my wife too. Disclaimer it cost about 1/5 of a new big block X2.

Flip side again...... Why not have the fastest X2 around if you have the means?
LOL - I remember BOATING MAG doing an article in the Mid 80s on a guy who dumped GIANT Diesels in his 42' Trawler so his wife and kids could have a 30 Knot boat...
The Owner Loved being able to throw the Hammers down on demand and blow past the Local Sport Fishers of the Day....
Now THAT is throwing cash around ... But is Wife and Kids loved it.

Tommy1005
10-16-2013, 02:15 PM
Maintenance costs are exactly the same on the 7.4l. Same filters, same trans oil, same engine oil, same everything. The only difference is the 7.4l takes 1/2 quarts more oil..... So that's, what, $4.00-$8.00 a year?

Also, the 7.4l does not require premium fuel. It is calibrated for 87 octane.


Mastercraftdave- Im pretty sure the 6.2 is calibrated for 87 as well. Not 100% sure on that, but I am pretty sure Ilmore tunes all of their engines for 87 octane, unlike the bigger indmar and PCM engines. that is one of their major benefits compared to them. I am, however, 100% sure the 7.4l is set up for 87.

You are right about the 87 octane.....I always just assumed the big motor would require premium. As far as maintanence goes, I was just repeating what I was told by my dealer.

rtw_travel
10-16-2013, 02:33 PM
I wouldn't want to own an X2 with a 454... but I'd sure want a ride in one.

One of my favourite videos (no longer available) was from BAWS when they were selling a vintage190 with a 454. "It sure don't get much faster than that out of the hole" was Jim's comment, may he rest in peace. And he was right - that boat took off faster than anything I've ever seen, and sounded amazing while doing it.

Sure, you don't need a 7.4. But if we were all sensible, we'd be buying older towboats with no fancy gadgets.

GT500 MC
10-16-2013, 03:03 PM
As for any other comments or info that I have on the 7.4l, should you decided that you wanna go crazy-

1-The sound of the 7.4l is unlike any of the other engines. It is intoxicating. They run a fairly aggressive cam in it, so it really rumbles at idle. It has a really deep "blub blub blub" sound, and you will feel the shake through the whole boat. This "shake" is not the annoying type shake that you get from a crappy running engine. It is the type you would get from an old muscle car. I fell in love the first time I fired it up on the water..... It sort of just slowly rocks the boat a little bit. I am thinking that you will really feel it in a little X2.


I wouldn't overthink it too much after reading the above response. If you have the coin, and you like a little more hp than the guy next to you, this is a no-brainer. Re-sale? You'll get some of the upcharge back if you take care of it. Remember, you take none of this with you when you leave.....

scott023
10-16-2013, 03:03 PM
You are right about the 87 octane.....I always just assumed the big motor would require premium. As far as maintanence goes, I was just repeating what I was told by my dealer.

No offense, but their off their ticket if they think the maintenance cost is going to be major. A wee bit extra oil is the only added cost.

Mastercraftdave
10-16-2013, 03:11 PM
Mastercraftdave- Im pretty sure the 6.2 is calibrated for 87 as well. Not 100% sure on that, but I am pretty sure Ilmore tunes all of their engines for 87 octane, unlike the bigger indmar and PCM engines. that is one of their major benefits compared to them. I am, however, 100% sure the 7.4l is set up for 87.

I should fix my statement, it isnít required but it is recommended for best performance according to their website and and owners manual, 87 is the required minimum. I have to run premium in the Seadoo so there is no point in running two different types of gas IMO and premium gas is better for the engine in the long haul. On a 7.4 Iím sure the 87 is fine for the engine but It sure wouldnít hurt to run premium at least I would with that bad boy.

MattsCraft
10-16-2013, 05:48 PM
Out of the latest Ilmor MV8 manual. And yes, I can get 45.5 MPH in my X25-6.2 with 6 to 8 people in the boat.

FourFourty
10-16-2013, 08:17 PM
I should fix my statement, it isnít required but it is recommended for best performance according to their website and and owners manual, 87 is the required minimum. I have to run premium in the Seadoo so there is no point in running two different types of gas IMO and premium gas is better for the engine in the long haul. On a 7.4 Iím sure the 87 is fine for the engine but It sure wouldnít hurt to run premium at least I would with that bad boy.

You are definitely right, and it certainly doesn't hurt. I was just pointing out that they are calibrated for an 87 minimum. I run premium in everything....

KahunaCraft
10-16-2013, 08:39 PM
Still would like to see/hear a video of a 7.4 at idle and a flyby.

mcLove
10-16-2013, 08:44 PM
If you are still looking there is a used 2013 x2 7.4 liter at California Skier in California. Not sure if that is to far for you though?

scottsx2
10-16-2013, 08:45 PM
I run premium in mine all the time, can't hurt it.... If you want a 7.4 go for it but I have no issues with my 5.7 getting on plane with lots of weight in it. Auto launch helps alot though

imyourmaster
10-16-2013, 09:33 PM
I'm a huge fan of huge horsepower motors...but I prefer them in muscle cars, not wake board boats. If you want horsepower in a boat, buy a go-fast. No matter what anyone tells you... the general rule is: more horsepower = burning more fuel. Also, with the bigger motor producing more sound, you should keep a HEALTHY budget aside to upgrade your sound system...that is if you like to listen to your favorite tunes while running your toy. Lastly, if you are buying a wakeboard boat to actually wake board and wake surf behind, you don't need that much power since 22mph should pretty much do it for the purpose of an X-2. But again...it all depends on what YOU like! Have fun!

mikeg205
10-16-2013, 09:34 PM
Still would like to see/hear a video of a 7.4 at idle and a flyby.

Tower this is ghost rider - requesting a fly by... not a good idea mav... ;)

JMLVMI
10-16-2013, 09:46 PM
Tower this is ghost rider - requesting a fly by... not a good idea mav... ;)

"I want some butts!" http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AS9j_-mqSWc

Agreed with most guys here...it's your money and you'll have a very rare boat, but it won't give you incrementally better performance, should use more gas, and will cost a ton. I'd do some work to the 5.7 or 6.2 before putting the 7.4 in. Just my 2c

imyourmaster
10-16-2013, 09:57 PM
What's next??? A V10 or V12 in a wakeboard boat? Why waste $$$ on a wakeboard boat then? Rather strap into a cockpit and be the throttle man...Welcome Poker Run!!! You can always push the envelope with anything in life, but it's not necessarily a great idea...or it might be the greatest one. In the end you should make a decision based on what your head tells you...not other people's opinions.

scott023
10-17-2013, 01:10 AM
I'm a huge fan of huge horsepower motors...but I prefer them in muscle cars, not wake board boats. If you want horsepower in a boat, buy a go-fast. No matter what anyone tells you... the general rule is: more horsepower = burning more fuel. Also, with the bigger motor producing more sound, you should keep a HEALTHY budget aside to upgrade your sound system...that is if you like to listen to your favorite tunes while running your toy. Lastly, if you are buying a wakeboard boat to actually wake board and wake surf behind, you don't need that much power since 22mph should pretty much do it for the purpose of an X-2. But again...it all depends on what YOU like! Have fun!

Not true at all. More power doesn't mean more fuel consumption. The less work a motor has to do, the less fuel you'll burn. My 45 with the 8.1 gets better gph than a 45 with the LY6 in it under similar driving conditions.

FourFourty
10-17-2013, 07:37 AM
Echo what Scott said.....

And I also don't think the noise argument holds water. These are all small block chevy engines, and their displacement doesn't make much difference on how loud they are. The tone is different, but the actual loudness isn't.



I'm a huge fan of huge horsepower motors...but I prefer them in muscle cars, not wake board boats. If you want horsepower in a boat, buy a go-fast. No matter what anyone tells you... the general rule is: more horsepower = burning more fuel. Also, with the bigger motor producing more sound, you should keep a HEALTHY budget aside to upgrade your sound system...that is if you like to listen to your favorite tunes while running your toy. Lastly, if you are buying a wakeboard boat to actually wake board and wake surf behind, you don't need that much power since 22mph should pretty much do it for the purpose of an X-2. But again...it all depends on what YOU like! Have fun!

snork
10-17-2013, 07:59 AM
I want

bturner2
10-17-2013, 08:03 AM
I've seen it go both ways. Too small a engine that has to work too hard that burns a lot of fuel to get the boat on plane and too large a engine that has a basic fuel consumption model that will use more fuel. I think with today's highly regulated fuel systems the later is going to be much less noticeable but still will be a factor.

I know the Malibu response they were using for the jump tournament last summer had the 6.2L in it and was a real screamer. I got to drive the boat and it was a monster. While I never put gas in it the dealer did and told me the fuel consumption was noticeably more even for skiing. He also said that unless the boat was going to be used as this one was for tournaments he would never recommend the option.

Again if you have an extra $20K to throw at a engine option that will add nearly a quarter of the price more to the standard boat price should you be concerned about fuel consumption?

Hammer
10-17-2013, 08:29 AM
I want

Now that is awesome! Yes! Want!

imyourmaster
10-17-2013, 08:43 AM
Not true at all. More power doesn't mean more fuel consumption. The less work a motor has to do, the less fuel you'll burn. My 45 with the 8.1 gets better gph than a 45 with the LY6 in it under similar driving conditions.

Scott...all things kept equal, if you put a 350 CI small block next to a 454 CI big block and run them at any RPM, I can assure you the 454 will get to the bottom of the barrel first, hands down.

FourFourty
10-17-2013, 09:01 AM
Scott...all things kept equal, if you put a 350 CI small block next to a 454 CI big block and run them at any RPM, I can assure you the 454 will get to the bottom of the barrel first, hands down.


The Ilmore 7.4 is not a big block :D


Not that it makes a big difference for your point. haha

ttu
10-17-2013, 09:05 AM
wonder why the poster of this thread has never come back on and replied on anything.

me personally overkill in a x2. now a x30 or x46, maybe!:D:D

scott023
10-17-2013, 11:25 AM
Scott...all things kept equal, if you put a 350 CI small block next to a 454 CI big block and run them at any RPM, I can assure you the 454 will get to the bottom of the barrel first, hands down.

So if they're both pushing the same amount of water (our application here), will the 350 not have to work harder at higher RPM? Will that not increase fuel comsumption?

Throw 3000# of ballast in a 5K boat. Put 6 people in each vessel, one with the 6.0 and one with the 8.1 (yes, old motors). My big block runs at 1700rpm, the small block 6L runs at 2050rpm. Which burns more fuel? I know the answer, as I've done the side by side comparison. The LY6 (6L) burns more than 2GPH more. Same altitude, same lake, same weather and water conditions. Same load.

1redTA
10-17-2013, 02:36 PM
maybe someone here has access to Ilmore's BSFC on these engines at various loads I did a quick search but just found the 5stroke concept engine

Indyxc
10-17-2013, 04:20 PM
1RedTa has it correct.

To really figure out which engine is more "efficient" we would need to know the power output required to drive the boat, and then compared the BSFC at engine speed for that required power level. You would also have to ideally prop each engine different to run at that engines most efficency BSFC.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Brake_specific_fuel_consumption