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LisaJ
07-23-2013, 01:05 PM
Okay - you said I had to post a video or it didn't happen.

I dumped the people out of the boat and asked my driver to speed up to ~27 to 28 mph and it helped the wake problem tremendously. My rope however didn't have loops to let me shorten it. I'm rope shopping this week.

I'm a little reluctant to post my "beginners" video because it's going to be like watching paint dry for ya'll. But I watched the drills over and over and tried to apply. As I watched my own video's I'm not certain I'm liking what I see going on as I try to bend my knee and ankle. Something doesn't feel right. I'll let you watch and see what you think. I did test the coast and then lean and power through the wake and decided I'm not quiet confident enough yet. I took off like a dang rocket!!!! I'll try again this coming weekend.

http://youtu.be/uo7CioI9_jk

Let the games begin......

André
07-23-2013, 01:35 PM
1 At 6.34 Dont ski so close to peoples dock!!! It s dangerous and peoples are gonna hate you for it.

2 You seem to be in great shape for taking long rides like those !

3 Best thing in the world you can do is going to Cobles!

4 I ll be affraid of leaning through that wake too! You gonna love skiing a Prostar!

5 Keep it up.Main thing you need for now is time on water.

6 Hips ALWAYS in front of the shoulders!

Have fun!

davidstan
07-23-2013, 02:23 PM
#6 for sure. My last fall was head plant due to just that. Did the front door dive.

mikeg205
07-23-2013, 03:10 PM
Ski it up... Lisa - nice job - more water time - will make it easier... keep it fun - more time in the water will build your confidence and comfort.

Small cuts from just outside the wake back and forth and then go wider... I am starting to get the feel for hard cuts thru wake on edge... still have to work on form - but my shoulders are in a better position than almost all my last season skiing...

I still have lot's to do... "ski it up!" Keep getting out when you can... and no skiing near docks... the injury thread does not need any more entries.

not the best video - camera person a bit jittery.

http://youtu.be/ZIIlSPD8_dY

I have lot's more to learn and lot's of practice ahead of me as well...

LisaJ
07-23-2013, 03:20 PM
Why didn't I think of that...not cutting out SO wide each time. I would be plenty confident to stay on my edge thru the wake if I wasn't coming from so far and with so much speed. Thanks for the feed back. And yes, I realize the cove I ski in is very narrow. I wasn't as close as the video appears. I go there to try to find good water.

TxsRiverRat
07-23-2013, 03:41 PM
it seems to me based on what i saw that you really are scared of the wake... it also seems that you are tail riding it pretty bad.

the width is not your issue, that will help you in the long run in a slalom course. The reason you're getting so much speed is that well.. lets pretend you were in a slalom course... it's what we'd calling pulling @ the buoy... The 'work' is supposed to be done behind the boat, from 'white water to white water...' that way when you cross the 2nd wake, you've broken free of the boat.

If you can put more weight on the front of the ski, this puts more of it in the water, slowing the pass down... riding the tail will not allow you to get those sweet turns... putting more weight on the front of the ski will also help get your hips forward... try squeezing your butt cheeks together.

youtube is blocked here at work, so i had to look at your vid on my cell, i cant tell - are you LFF or RFF?

mikeg205
07-23-2013, 03:50 PM
Why didn't I think of that...not cutting out SO wide each time. I would be plenty confident to stay on my edge thru the wake if I wasn't coming from so far and with so much speed. Thanks for the feed back. And yes, I realize the cove I ski in is very narrow. I wasn't as close as the video appears. I go there to try to find good water.

when you get a few of these you back off a bit... ;)...lol... and ski lessons help a lot plus the coaching here is awesome...

LisaJ
07-23-2013, 03:54 PM
LFF just like on wakeboard. Do you think that's why my ski bounces (porpoises on me sometimes). I think what I was doing in the video was bending my knee/ankle but not distributing my weight to my front foot. I was very aware that when I started out my front left leg was straight and rigid and I remembered "the stance" in the video drill and was trying to mimic it. And I understand what you saying the work is behind to boat and I should be broke free by the time I cross the second wake.

My next question is, I really use the small triangle area in front of the handle (I stick my ski inside of it when I pull up to hold my ski steady). When I get a new rope, it probably will not have that. Should I put the rope on the left or right side of my ski and will it make it difficult to get up?

LisaJ
07-23-2013, 03:57 PM
when you get a few of these you back off a bit... ;)...lol... and ski lessons help a lot plus the coaching here is awesome...

Every time I see this picture...it shakes me up...I would for sure end up dizzy again!!! LOL

TxsRiverRat
07-23-2013, 04:06 PM
LFF just like on wakeboard. Do you think that's why my ski bounces (porpoises on me sometimes).

Should I put the rope on the left or right side of my ski and will it make it difficult to get up?

When the ski bounces, it's because you are 'short pulling' AKA not pulling across both wakes. Hold the pull longer, it will save you from more OTF wipeouts...

On the get up, I am RFF and the rope is on the left side of the ski. I think LFF would still be the same.

On your drills, do them on land between ski days... On he water, practice pulling out wide and leaning against the boat.... just hold that pull to get a feel for it.... knees bent, wrms straight, hips up...

Double D
07-23-2013, 04:09 PM
it seems to me based on what i saw that you really are scared of the wake... it also seems that you are tail riding it pretty bad.

the width is not your issue, that will help you in the long run in a slalom course. The reason you're getting so much speed is that well.. lets pretend you were in a slalom course... it's what we'd calling pulling @ the buoy... The 'work' is supposed to be done behind the boat, from 'white water to white water...' that way when you cross the 2nd wake, you've broken free of the boat.

If you can put more weight on the front of the ski, this puts more of it in the water, slowing the pass down... riding the tail will not allow you to get those sweet turns... putting more weight on the front of the ski will also help get your hips forward... try squeezing your butt cheeks together.

youtube is blocked here at work, so i had to look at your vid on my cell, i cant tell - are you LFF or RFF?

LFF just like on wakeboard. Do you think that's why my ski bounces (porpoises on me sometimes). I think what I was doing in the video was bending my knee/ankle but not distributing my weight to my front foot. I was very aware that when I started out my front left leg was straight and rigid and I remembered "the stance" in the video drill and was trying to mimic it. And I understand what you saying the work is behind to boat and I should be broke free by the time I cross the second wake.

My next question is, I really use the small triangle area in front of the handle (I stick my ski inside of it when I pull up to hold my ski steady). When I get a new rope, it probably will not have that. Should I put the rope on the left or right side of my ski and will it make it difficult to get up?

I am in no way going to be able to add to this conversation but I agree with Rat, and the one thing I noticed right off the bat, was that the weight was all on the back of the ski and the front was sticking way up (tail riding). Not sure what to tell you to do.

Great progress and keep it up!

mikeg205
07-23-2013, 04:19 PM
When the ski bounces, it's because you are 'short pulling' AKA not pulling across both wakes. Hold the pull longer, it will save you from more OTF wipeouts...

On the get up, I am RFF and the rope is on the left side of the ski. I think LFF would still be the same.

On your drills, do them on land between ski days... On he water, practice pulling out wide and leaning against the boat.... just hold that pull to get a feel for it.... knees bent, wrms straight, hips up...

On deep water start LFF - rope on right... always should be opposite of what is forward...allows for a squared off start... :)

TxsRiverRat
07-23-2013, 04:22 PM
Being LFF... When you cross the wake from left to right (port to starboard)... Try looking at the center pylon until you cross both wakes... that will help ALOT... helps keep shoulders pointed at boat, knees pointed at shore... it should feel twisted, like you're trying to pop your lower back...

LisaJ
07-23-2013, 04:26 PM
Being LFF... When you cross the wake from left to right (port to starboard)... Try looking at the center pylon until you cross both wakes... that will help ALOT... helps keep shoulders pointed at boat, knees pointed at shore... it should feel twisted, like you're trying to pop your lower back...

Thanks...I knew that I didn't need to look at the wake but I didn't really know where to look but the shoreline or tree tops...anything but that wake. LOL I'll try that Friday evening.

mikeg205
07-23-2013, 04:31 PM
Thanks...I knew that I didn't need to look at the wake but I didn't really know where to look but the shoreline or tree tops...anything but that wake. LOL I'll try that Friday evening.

face your fears... only then free you will be...... skywalker...
......Yoda!

TxsRiverRat
07-23-2013, 04:34 PM
Thanks...I knew that I didn't need to look at the wake but I didn't really know where to look but the shoreline or tree tops...anything but that wake. LOL I'll try that Friday evening.

Actually, what u do not want to do is look at where you want to go... example... if you are on a slalom course and you're looking ahead to the next buoy, you'll ski TO the buoy, when you really need to ski 15-20 ahead of it so the ski finishes @ the buoy...

looking at the pylon "magically" makes u wider and earlier through the off side.

JMLVMI
07-23-2013, 04:39 PM
Being LFF... When you cross the wake from left to right (port to starboard)... Try looking at the center pylon until you cross both wakes... that will help ALOT... helps keep shoulders pointed at boat, knees pointed at shore... it should feel twisted, like you're trying to pop your lower back...

I had my best turns doing this today...and my lower back is feeling it! We went out this morning, 7-10mph winds right through the course (thinking we need to relocate). I actually have some video I can share as well, just need to run it through iMovie for effect :D

Phntmski
07-23-2013, 05:00 PM
I'm thinking soft knees, eyes either on the pylon, the horizon or across the bow of the boat. Anywhere but down or locked on the buoy (when you get to that point). Might try to bring the handle down closer to your waste. You're doing great!! Ski it up!! Have fun!!!!!! Confidence and ability will come with time on the water. You can tweak it as you go. :D

bcd
07-23-2013, 05:54 PM
To elaborate on the riding the tail. The water should be breaking around the front of your front binding. On your video, most of the time, you are on your tail so much that your front binding/foot is completely out of the water.

TxsRiverRat
07-23-2013, 06:07 PM
To elaborate on the riding the tail. The water should be breaking around the front of your front binding. On your video, most of the time, you are on your tail so much that your front binding/foot is completely out of the water.

Thats cause she's used to burying the front edge of her wakeboard and catapulting face 1st into the drink



:D:eek3::eek3::eek3::banana::banana:

Double D
07-23-2013, 06:14 PM
Thats cause she's used to burying the front edge of her wakeboard and catapulting face 1st into the drink



:D:eek3::eek3::eek3::banana::banana:

:uglyhamme:uglyhamme

Sorry for laughing, but that was funny. Just sayin...

Patrick
07-24-2013, 07:30 AM
Nice skiing!

A few thoughts

As already mentioned you're definitely back on the ski and working with a straight front leg a lot. That's ok and pretty common; just keep working on moving your weight forward on the ski and getting comfortable/confident. You'll feel like you have almost all your weight on your front foot and that's ok. Everything feels exaggerated back there so what feels like almost all your weight is probably about right.

In terms of the straight front leg, try this. Stand up in your slalom stance, weight mostly on your back foot, and a straight front leg. Now think about bending your front knee. You have a bent knee now but do you still feel like most of your weight is on the back foot? Now get back in the original stance, and instead of thinking about bending your front knee, think about bending your front ankle. Your knee automatically bends and your weight has to shift more forward.

In order to 'glide' properly you want to be free of the boat and that means going about the same speed or even slightly faster. You don't want a lot of slack on the line, but you want to be free from the pull of the boat. (mentioning b/c you commented like you felt you were ahead of the boat, which isn't necessarily bad, but can be some times :) ) But notice on some of your pullouts, as soon as you stood up out of your lean you started getting pulled back in by the boat.

Ski porpoising - I'm not really an expert here but I'd guess it's at least somewhat related being so heavy on the back foot combined with the slower speed so it's sinking a bit. Maybe related to the size too? While you're at Coble's don't be afraid to ask about your ski, they can get it set up or provide recommendations if you want to try something else. You're right to question it though that's an indication that something is off.

Wake crossings - As mentioned this is something to build up over time. Start just barely outside the wake so you don't feel as fast. Over time build up a little wider & wider, eventually you want to do it from as wide as you are on pullouts (or wider). It sounds weird now but eventually crossing the wake faster in the strong position will feel a lot easier than trying to plow through it.

Your comment said 65' rope, is that a wakeboard(spectra) rope? Normally a slalom rope would be 75' (long line), or 60' (15 off). If you're using a spectra line you might think about getting a slalom rope/handle since you actually do want a little bit of stretch there. If you do get one, ski at the 60'/15 off (red) section.

You're looking pretty good so just keep at it and don't get discouraged. Improvements take a lot of time so just enjoy the journey :)

Get some gloves!

LisaJ
07-24-2013, 08:02 AM
:uglyhamme:uglyhamme

Sorry for laughing, but that was funny. Just sayin...

Ya'll are EXACTLY right!!!!! One doesn't easily forgot a bad face plant...just saying....

LisaJ
07-24-2013, 08:08 AM
Nice skiing!

A few thoughts

As already mentioned you're definitely back on the ski and working with a straight front leg a lot. That's ok and pretty common; just keep working on moving your weight forward on the ski and getting comfortable/confident. You'll feel like you have almost all your weight on your front foot and that's ok. Everything feels exaggerated back there so what feels like almost all your weight is probably about right.

In terms of the straight front leg, try this. Stand up in your slalom stance, weight mostly on your back foot, and a straight front leg. Now think about bending your front knee. You have a bent knee now but do you still feel like most of your weight is on the back foot? Now get back in the original stance, and instead of thinking about bending your front knee, think about bending your front ankle. Your knee automatically bends and your weight has to shift more forward.

In order to 'glide' properly you want to be free of the boat and that means going about the same speed or even slightly faster. You don't want a lot of slack on the line, but you want to be free from the pull of the boat. (mentioning b/c you commented like you felt you were ahead of the boat, which isn't necessarily bad, but can be some times :) ) But notice on some of your pullouts, as soon as you stood up out of your lean you started getting pulled back in by the boat.

Ski porpoising - I'm not really an expert here but I'd guess it's at least somewhat related being so heavy on the back foot combined with the slower speed so it's sinking a bit. Maybe related to the size too? While you're at Coble's don't be afraid to ask about your ski, they can get it set up or provide recommendations if you want to try something else. You're right to question it though that's an indication that something is off.

Wake crossings - As mentioned this is something to build up over time. Start just barely outside the wake so you don't feel as fast. Over time build up a little wider & wider, eventually you want to do it from as wide as you are on pullouts (or wider). It sounds weird now but eventually crossing the wake faster in the strong position will feel a lot easier than trying to plow through it.

Your comment said 65' rope, is that a wakeboard(spectra) rope? Normally a slalom rope would be 75' (long line), or 60' (15 off). If you're using a spectra line you might think about getting a slalom rope/handle since you actually do want a little bit of stretch there. If you do get one, ski at the 60'/15 off (red) section.

You're looking pretty good so just keep at it and don't get discouraged. Improvements take a lot of time so just enjoy the journey :)

Get some gloves!

Patrick---thank you so much for taking the time to critique. It's a lot to digest and I appreciate the way your descriptions so that I can feel what you're talking about. I can't wait to get back on the water this weekend to try again. I've gotten completely obsessed with it!

mikeg205
07-24-2013, 08:17 AM
Hi LIsa I got one of these - 40x zoom - so the observer can shoot your ski and you can see exactly what your doing.. I got mine on ebay for $99.

JMLVMI
07-24-2013, 10:52 AM
I'm looking at getting one of these for taping my skiing: http://theskidoc.com/ski-doc-camera-mount.htm along with a cheap camera or iPhone tripod mount adapter. No observer needed :)

d2jp
07-24-2013, 12:02 PM
IMO, you can wakeboard easier in a little chop. As I've gotten older (52) a little chop is OK on a ski but not nearly as much fun as smooth water. It seems less tiring and easier to link turns, etc. on a nice, calm water run. I guess what I'm trying to say is that the conditions can also impact how you feel and maybe how much progess you can make quickly.

I can't speak for everyone here, but I can't stand it when the driver doesn't hold a straight line. Again, it doesn't bother me so much on a wakeboard, but on my ski even a little deviation by the driver makes me crazy (unless of course, they have to change direction for safety). Have your driver pick a point and hold a straight line to it - signal when he needs to turn - and then have make a run down the opposite way. Anyway, this is the way my wife and I drive for each other.

I hope to get to Coble next June as a Father's Day gift:)

TxsRiverRat
07-24-2013, 12:20 PM
I'm looking at getting one of these for taping my skiing: http://theskidoc.com/ski-doc-camera-mount.htm along with a cheap camera or iPhone tripod mount adapter. No observer needed :)

I'll be curious to see a video of it... I know my old school pylon mount made it look like the skier was being shot by a laser (which was the rope)

JMLVMI
07-24-2013, 12:49 PM
I'll be curious to see a video of it... I know my old school pylon mount made it look like the skier was being shot by a laser (which was the rope)

Ask and you shall receive...the guy at Ball of Spray did a comparison w/ the Ski-Doc and the Wakeye mounts:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dWhoJRnN06w

mikeg205
07-24-2013, 01:24 PM
Put on my markers for where rope needs to be for 15 and 22 off... :) - now to get on water... both sides of course... "Ski it up!"

mikeg205
07-24-2013, 01:29 PM
Ask and you shall receive...the guy at Ball of Spray did a comparison w/ the Ski-Doc and the Wakeye mounts:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dWhoJRnN06w

Well that was useful - ;) - review says you be the judge of which mount is better... ;)

cbryan70
07-24-2013, 01:31 PM
Ask and you shall receive...the guy at Ball of Spray did a comparison w/ the Ski-Doc and the Wakeye mounts:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dWhoJRnN06w

I would need to mount that camera on a skylon to get over my spray from the boat :rant:

JMLVMI
07-24-2013, 01:40 PM
Well that was useful - ;) - review says you be the judge of which mount is better... ;)

Yea he didn't really say...but the ski-doc is $59 and the Wakeye is ~$250. That sealed it for me.

I would need to mount that camera on a skylon to get over my spray from the boat :rant:

Yea I was on a '92 Ski Brendella getting filmed yesterday and you can't see any of my turns due to the spray. Hopefully my '00 195 is better (higher freeboard-newer hull).

JMLVMI
07-24-2013, 01:41 PM
Put on my markers for where rope needs to be for 15 and 22 off... :) - now to get on water... both sides of course... "Ski it up!"

I like that idea for free skiing! Nice work.

TxsRiverRat
07-24-2013, 01:55 PM
Put on my markers for where rope needs to be for 15 and 22 off... :) - now to get on water... both sides of course... "Ski it up!"

LMAO Mike... See the shadow on your gunwhale? I've seen someone run 35' at that narrow angle ;)

mikeg205
07-24-2013, 02:01 PM
LMAO Mike... See the shadow on your gunwhale? I've seen someone run 35' at that narrow angle ;)

Really? 35' off? - those marks are standing straight up - my goal is to get a nice rhythm on my trip to Canada and then head to Liquid Edge and run the course... and see how I suck at turning buoys...lol

TxsRiverRat
07-24-2013, 02:01 PM
Ask and you shall receive...the guy at Ball of Spray did a comparison w/ the Ski-Doc and the Wakeye mounts:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dWhoJRnN06w

dang, thats ALOT better than my pylon mount device...

mikeg205
07-24-2013, 02:02 PM
I like that idea for free skiing! Nice work.

Thanks - not my idea... idea was from Gordon Rathbun video... :)

TxsRiverRat
07-24-2013, 02:51 PM
Really? 35' off?

No kidding - the guy was crazy (and awesome skier)! A men's 5 national competitor here in north texas... helluva character and a decent coach!

mikeg205
07-24-2013, 03:03 PM
No kidding - the guy was crazy (and awesome skier)! A men's 5 national competitor here in north texas... helluva character and a decent coach!

awesome... would love to see that video - he had to be way low to make them turns...

TxsRiverRat
07-24-2013, 04:01 PM
if only it existed.... lol

88 PS190
07-25-2013, 10:50 PM
Well that was useful - ;) - review says you be the judge of which mount is better... ;)

I have one of the black ones from the UK.

http://www.e-z-cam.com/

you can give it a try aug 10.