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View Full Version : 2012 x30 gas in bilge


BlakeEatmon
05-26-2013, 10:34 PM
Just picked up my from some minor service work (belt, raw water impeller, service) Upon filling up the gas tank at the gas station before putting it in the water, I smelled gas almost immediately. Figured it may be excess fumes and proceeded to put it in the water and roll on. When i was underway, the fumes were overcoming me. Turned on the bilge pump manually and a mixture of gas and water came out, mostly gas. I shut it down and put it on the lift. Any ideas? I'm at a loss. Been scared to keep running the boat due to risk of fire or explosion. #weekend ruined

JimN
05-26-2013, 10:53 PM
Just picked up my from some minor service work (belt, raw water impeller, service) Upon filling up the gas tank at the gas station before putting it in the water, I smelled gas almost immediately. Figured it may be excess fumes and proceeded to put it in the water and roll on. When i was underway, the fumes were overcoming me. Turned on the bilge pump manually and a mixture of gas and water came out, mostly gas. I shut it down and put it on the lift. Any ideas? I'm at a loss. Been scared to keep running the boat due to risk of fire or explosion. #weekend ruined

What was done to the boat when it was serviced?

CantRepeat
05-27-2013, 07:49 AM
I wouldn't start that boat until I was sure there wasn't a fuel leak and there is no gas or vapors in the bilge.

Open up the engine hatch and see how much liquid is in the bottom of the boat. The gas tank is under the rear seats and you can see where the two fuel inlet lines run into the tank. You should be able to see if they are leaking.

bturner2
05-27-2013, 07:56 AM
As one who has personally survived a boat fire on the Detroit River let me be the first to tell you to not start or take that boat out again before completely removing all the gas from the bilge, vent the bilge and verify the source of the leak has been resolved. If your bilge pump is pumping gas you have a sizeable leak. That pump is not rated to pump gas and will burn up and can become a source of ignition for a fire.

If you're going to fix this yourself....

A.) You better have a good understanding of what you're doing.

B.) Be prepared for the possibility of a fire.

I would have rags and a couple fire extinguishers ready just in case. I would also get the boat off the lift and back on the trailer. Dealing with a fire while on the lift would be more difficult than on shore. Don't run it, get it towed back in and winch back on the trailer.

Jim's first question is very good as it is very possible that whatever was serviced caused the leak. I would start at the filler neck inspecting all the fitting, hoses and clamps going to/from the tank. This is something I do at the end of the season anyway and quickly check in the beginning of the season. Next visually check all the tank fittings then check the tank gasket and torque on the Allen screws holding the fuel pump assembly to the tank. When you're satisfied that everything looks good there you can consider starting the boat to see if there are any leaks while idling. The last test would be back on the water under power but only after some serious testing and verification while on shore.

Take if from someone that been on a boat that was on fire, you don't want to be in that situation.

Jerseydave
05-27-2013, 08:54 AM
All great advise above, don't start it and get it back on the trailer. If you don't see any source of a fuel leak yourself you should take it back to the place that serviced it.

Did they replace your in-tank gas filter? If so they may have left something loose or the fuel line is not seated properly at the top of the gas tank.

pap
05-27-2013, 11:01 AM
I'm shocked that you even thought of starting up the engine with the smell of gas. A huge explosion is possible with the gas fumes contained within the engine compartment and bilge area in that circumstance.

Under NO circumstances take this boat out until all the gas has been removed properly and the problem found and NO scent of gas is able to be detected.

Gas coming out the bilge pump....(!!)..Wow you got lucky.

JDC
05-27-2013, 11:26 AM
#weekend ruinedYou ARE lucky it was just a weekend ruined and not your boat ruined, or worse.
Get that leak fixed before running it on the water again. We don't want to read about you in the papers.

bcd
05-27-2013, 04:08 PM
On a side note, why was the belt replaced? FYI, mine was throwing belt dust everywhere. They told me that there was a bad batch of belts and replaced the belt. The new one's doing it too. If that's the case, make sure they change your air filter. Mine got so plugged that the engine was losing power. I'm taking it to the dealer tomorrow to hopefully get the real issue resolved.

BlakeEatmon
05-28-2013, 07:59 AM
Thanks guys. Yes i am lucky. I had no idea until the bilge started shooting gas.

Problem found. 3 screws are missing out of the fuel sending unit. Boat had gas in the bottom from one end to the other. Pulled the mid plug, rear plug and flooded it with a water hose trying to flush out all of the gas and clean out the bilge pumps with some fresh water. Got most of the gas out but still some in the bottom of the v. Also just in front of the sending unit there is a large molded hole about the size of a can of soup. It is full of gas and that won't go away? Any idea what that hole is?

Traxx822
05-28-2013, 08:02 AM
Its your reserve tank now :cool:

CantRepeat
05-28-2013, 08:10 AM
Thanks guys. Yes i am lucky. I had no idea until the bilge started shooting gas.

Problem found. 3 screws are missing out of the fuel sending unit. Boat had gas in the bottom from one end to the other. Pulled the mid plug, rear plug and flooded it with a water hose trying to flush out all of the gas and clean out the bilge pumps with some fresh water. Got most of the gas out but still some in the bottom of the v. Also just in front of the sending unit there is a large molded hole about the size of a can of soup. It is full of gas and that won't go away? Any idea what that hole is?

Who did the service on this boat?? They left screws out of the fuel pump sending unit? There needs to be a mechanic FIRED!!

JimN
05-28-2013, 08:27 AM
Who did the service on this boat?? They left screws out of the fuel pump sending unit? There needs to be a mechanic FIRED!!

Was it serviced by a dealer? If so, they need to be biatch-slapped into reality. This is a serious safety problem.

Can you post some photos of this?

CantRepeat
05-28-2013, 08:31 AM
Was it serviced by a dealer? If so, they need to be biatch-slapped into reality. This is a serious safety problem.

Can you post some photos of this?


Jim, correct me if I'm wrong but aren't the filters on the bottom of these fuel pump units lifetime? IE don't need to be change as a regular service item?

What would they be doing inside the tank for normal service? I don't get it.

Traxx822
05-28-2013, 08:42 AM
Boat Explosion over memorial day (http://landing.newsinc.com/shared/video.html?freewheel=90119&sitesection=theblaze&VID=24846503) <<< click link to watch video

THIS COULD HAVE BEEN YOU DUDE!!!!

Geromy
05-28-2013, 09:31 AM
Had a very similar issue this weekend. Filled the boat full and stopped by boat store to pick up o-ring for gas cap and noticed fluid leaking out of center drain. Sure enough it was gas and started to freak. Long story short, the pump bolts were loose. Tightened the bolts, filled the boat full of soap and water, and drained. It would be a good idea to check if you do smell a strong gas odor, just to be safe.

JimN
05-28-2013, 09:36 AM
Jim, correct me if I'm wrong but aren't the filters on the bottom of these fuel pump units lifetime? IE don't need to be change as a regular service item?

What would they be doing inside the tank for normal service? I don't get it.

Lifetime? No. Not at all. If enough non-gas stuff gets into the tank, they need to be changed. That includes water. Also, the fact that you asked this last question means you need to read about the fuel pump issues that are caused by water and ethanol in the gas and running out of gas. These pumps need to be immersed in gas when they're operating because the gas cools the pump. Don't run out- it may work for a while after, but not for long- this applies to cars & trucks, too.

If you make sure to keep crap out of the gas, the filter will last for quite a while but since there's no way to do this (even gas stations can't guarantee clean gas), the filter needs to be changed occasionally. It's possible that the pump or filter needed to be replaced, but the person doing the work forgot to finish, was called away and the boat was released to the customer by someone who didn't bother to make sure it was done, maybe the customer caused them to rush the job or maybe it was done by someone other than the dealer and they didn't bother to tell the dealer about it.

76S&S
05-28-2013, 09:47 AM
Thanks guys. Yes i am lucky. I had no idea until the bilge started shooting gas.

Problem found. 3 screws are missing out of the fuel sending unit. Boat had gas in the bottom from one end to the other. Pulled the mid plug, rear plug and flooded it with a water hose trying to flush out all of the gas and clean out the bilge pumps with some fresh water. Got most of the gas out but still some in the bottom of the v. Also just in front of the sending unit there is a large molded hole about the size of a can of soup. It is full of gas and that won't go away? Any idea what that hole is?

I don't know what the hole is, but if you can get the hose to it and fill it with water, it will flush the gas out.

JimN
05-28-2013, 09:59 AM
I don't know what the hole is, but if you can get the hose to it and fill it with water, it will flush the gas out.

I think I would hold off on using water near the gas tank until I was sure it's well-sealed.

CantRepeat
05-28-2013, 10:29 AM
Lifetime? No. Not at all. If enough non-gas stuff gets into the tank, they need to be changed. That includes water. Also, the fact that you asked this last question means you need to read about the fuel pump issues that are caused by water and ethanol in the gas and running out of gas. These pumps need to be immersed in gas when they're operating because the gas cools the pump. Don't run out- it may work for a while after, but not for long- this applies to cars & trucks, too.

If you make sure to keep crap out of the gas, the filter will last for quite a while but since there's no way to do this (even gas stations can't guarantee clean gas), the filter needs to be changed occasionally. It's possible that the pump or filter needed to be replaced, but the person doing the work forgot to finish, was called away and the boat was released to the customer by someone who didn't bother to make sure it was done, maybe the customer caused them to rush the job or maybe it was done by someone other than the dealer and they didn't bother to tell the dealer about it.

I'm well aware of the fuel pump issue and low gas. I know all in tank pumps are cooled by the gas around them. I very aware of what ethanol does to the gas, the hoses and the rest of the fuel system. I don't need to read about it again. You made an extremely poor assumption about my knowledge.

When I said lifetime, I meant in the aspect unless something clogs them up they will filter for a long, long time. In fact, it's to the point that I'm sure there are lots of boats running these pumps and filter canisters that have never been changed. I've never read where they were a regular scheduled maintenance item. When you say if "enough" crap passes through them they need to change. Indeed they do but it's not something you schedule. More so on a boat that is less then 2 years old so if he wasn't having fuel issues then there surely is no need to replace it.

JimN
05-28-2013, 10:48 AM
I'm well aware of the fuel pump issue and low gas. I know all in tank pumps are cooled by the gas around them. I very aware of what ethanol does to the gas, the hoses and the rest of the fuel system. I don't need to read about it again. You made an extremely poor assumption about my knowledge.

When I said lifetime, I meant in the aspect unless something clogs them up they will filter for a long, long time. In fact, it's to the point that I'm sure there are lots of boats running these pumps and filter canisters that have never been changed. I've never read where they were a regular scheduled maintenance item. When you say if "enough" crap passes through them they need to change. Indeed they do but it's not something you schedule. More so on a boat that is less then 2 years old so if he wasn't having fuel issues then there surely is no need to replace it.

Fortunately, the fuel lines were required to be able to withstand a lot more than bad gas and water- the line itself is Teflon and should never need replacement unless it's damaged by a screw, cut or something like that. It has at least one layer of fiberglass mesh and another of stainless braid, with the orange flame-proof cover.

The problem with not changing it in regular maintenance is that there's a fine line between "running great" and not running at all, WRT the filter element becoming clogged because the minimum particle size that's passable is very small. I don't know what the dealer techs are being taught, but it's the dealer's responsibility to teach the boat buyers what will be required if their new (or even used) boat is to be expected to operate as designed. If they're just taking peoples' money, patting the boat on the azz and wishing well, they should do something else for a living.

The sad fact is, people rarely, if ever, read more than a few pages of their owner's manual. If they see a few things they already know, they toss it aside and come to the conclusion that it was written for noobs and that it doesn't apply to them. I would hope there's a lot of info that can make a long-time boat owner say "I didn't know that" in any manual that comes with a boat or other product of this price. If boat owners don't read the section for regularly scheduled maintenance and at least attempt to come close to meeting it, they're asking for trouble. When the in-tank pump was introduced, the filter was supposed to be changed after 100 hours. We could probably count on three fingers to see the number of filters that were replaced by boat owners in that time.

BlakeEatmon
05-28-2013, 12:25 PM
Picture attached. 2 screws missing. What is that large hole beside the sending unit? It is full of fuel too. Hate to flush it out. Looks like some kind of vent for the fuel tank.
Dealer didn't have any service work to do pertaining to fuel sending unit. Very strange because it wasnt that way when I dropped it off to my knowledge. (not that I opened it up and looked for that) but there was no gas in the bilge when I left it with them.

pap
05-28-2013, 12:40 PM
Wait a minute, you're saying the dealer is claiming that these two bolts just happened to fall off while in his shop and they had nothing to do with it??!

JimN
05-28-2013, 04:44 PM
Picture attached. 2 screws missing. What is that large hole beside the sending unit? It is full of fuel too. Hate to flush it out. Looks like some kind of vent for the fuel tank.
Dealer didn't have any service work to do pertaining to fuel sending unit. Very strange because it wasnt that way when I dropped it off to my knowledge. (not that I opened it up and looked for that) but there was no gas in the bilge when I left it with them.

There's no vent for the tank that would be exposed to the open air in the bilge- that would be as much of an explosion hazard as what you already have.

We all know that nobody is going to accept the blame for the two screws and you really can't prove they were there when you took it in, so it'll be best to just buy a couple and put them in, yourself.

Use paper towels to soak up whatever is in the hole, leave them outside on concrete and let them dry before throwing them in the garbage. The gas came from what sloshed out of the tank, through the gap at the sender.

Table Rocker
05-28-2013, 05:31 PM
You can also see a discoloration around where the missing screws once were. They were there when the boat left the factory.

CantRepeat
05-28-2013, 05:36 PM
You may even want to order and replace the gasket too.

Jerseydave
05-28-2013, 07:47 PM
The company that makes you gas tank probably sells the same tank to other boat builders, perhaps that hole is to allow the tank to fit other models of boats (maybe space for a pylon?)
So does it look like there are any fresh wrench marks on the remaining bolts? I don't think the filter is under that sending unit, so maybe they didn't remove it for any reason.

I'd use rags/paper towels like JimN said or one of these: 95732