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View Full Version : PS 197 Single Axle Brake Overhual


erervin
11-25-2012, 03:06 PM
I bought my boat in July and used it through the rest of the summer trailering it without brakes. The PO had cut the flexible brakes lines allowing water to enter the closed system.
I'm wanting to overhaul the brakes this winter and get these working again for safety reasons.

Today I removed the cap on the tongue and found water and rusted residue in the reservoir. I disconnected the brakes lines, removed and cleaned the liquid and residue from the reservoir, and filled with clean brake fluid. I then pumped the cylinder back and forth in an effort to purge the lines, however I believe they're plugged.

Next question is where do I go from here? It has disc brakes but I'm afraid that they're toast as well. Am I looking at installing an entirely new brake system? Does anyone have the part numbers and suggestions moving forward? Thanks.

jgraham37128
11-25-2012, 03:17 PM
There should be a brake line fitting somewhere close to the swing tongue. Remove it completely and pump up the master cylinder. If it doesn't squirt out when you pump it, then you know where problem is. I would replace the whole unit if this is where the clog is. If it does squirt out then I would remove it at the disk brake area and try again, see if it still squirts out until you find where it's not working properly.

Hope this helps.

mikeg205
11-25-2012, 04:07 PM
Start here...

www.pacifictrailers.com

https://caltrailerworks.com/online/home.php

Send me your email, I have a parts manual...

What year is your boat?

erervin
11-25-2012, 04:18 PM
The boat is a 2005.

er_ervin@yahoo.com

Thanks!

mikeg205
11-25-2012, 04:24 PM
The boat is a 2005.

er_ervin@yahoo.com

Thanks!

sent 3 files...between the 3 files plus the links you should be good to go. there's fewthreads here that walk thru trailer brake rebuilds.

The only thing I don't recognize is the actuator...I think you may have to change actuators...MC swtiched actuator vendors and I believe the one shown is not available but I could be wrong. Most of us have the UFP brand which I sent you.

Kyle
11-25-2012, 04:32 PM
Water and brake systems is a bad mixture.

The cap that you removed for the master cylinder needs to be very clean in there. The valve inside the master cylinder and the rubber o rings will not last if you try to use it.


Here is what I would do.

Order a new master cylinder ~$60 or so. Take the coupler apart now only if you can remember how to reassemble it. If that is a problem then order a new cylinder and wait to take the coupler apart and just to the install the same day as the disassemble.



Next there should be a rubber flex line. You say that it is not connected. (I wonder if the reverse lock out solenoid quit working and the PO could not back up the trailer.... Just an idea so check the solenoid when the coupler is apart) Take compressed air and run it through the rubber hose that connects to the calipers. Remove the brake line on the calipers before blowing compressed air.

Then reconnect the line and bleed the master cylinder.

Then connect the lines at the calipers. Start by bleeding the caliper furthest from the master cylinder. Loosen the bleeder valve on the furthest caliper and attach a rubber hose to the bleeder valve that runs to a corona beer bottle (clear container) and make sure the rubber hose is under some fluid in the clear bottle (bottle can not start out empty) and start pumping the lever under the toungue of the trailer making for sure that it does not go dry. Eventually the fluid will flow out of the caliper and you can take notice on the flushing of the caliper. If it is super rusty then you may want to replace the calipers but you may get lucky and be able to use them. Just flush the crap out of them. Once you flush the furthest caliper, tighten the bleeder valve and flush the next caliper that is the furthest from the master cylinder or if you have a single axle trailer just do the other side. Flush the crap out of that side.


After bleeding and flushing I would try the system out.

If you replace the master cylinder your out $60 or so and the maybe replacment of the reverse lock out solenoid $20 or so. There is a good chance that you will only have to spend $100 or so. If the calipers are ruined then I'm sure that you will be out another $150 or so.

erervin
11-25-2012, 05:55 PM
Great help guys, thanks. I went out and disconnected the flex hose behind the master cylinder and manually activated the actuator... nothing. I think the entire actuator is bad so I'm leaning towards replacing it with a UFP A-60 shown here.

https://caltrailerworks.com/online/product.php?productid=873&cat=6&page=1

Not sure if this will slide into the existing outer member housing or if I'll need to purchase a UFP-specific housing (weld-on) and weld it to the existing swing-away portion of the tongue.

https://caltrailerworks.com/online/product.php?productid=879&cat=6&page=1

I pulled all the brake lines and blew low-pressure compressed air through them. The line connecting one caliper to the other was clean and free. However the long run from the hitch to the first caliper was blocked. Going to have to replace that 14' run.

Once I get that all installed, then I'll test the calipers to see if they're still functioning.

petermegan
11-25-2012, 06:46 PM
Water and brake systems is a bad mixture.

The cap that you removed for the master cylinder needs to be very clean in there. The valve inside the master cylinder and the rubber o rings will not last if you try to use it.


Here is what I would do.

Order a new master cylinder ~$60 or so. Take the coupler apart now only if you can remember how to reassemble it. If that is a problem then order a new cylinder and wait to take the coupler apart and just to the install the same day as the disassemble.



Next there should be a rubber flex line. You say that it is not connected. (I wonder if the reverse lock out solenoid quit working and the PO could not back up the trailer.... Just an idea so check the solenoid when the coupler is apart) Take compressed air and run it through the rubber hose that connects to the calipers. Remove the brake line on the calipers before blowing compressed air.

Then reconnect the line and bleed the master cylinder.

Then connect the lines at the calipers. Start by bleeding the caliper furthest from the master cylinder. Loosen the bleeder valve on the furthest caliper and attach a rubber hose to the bleeder valve that runs to a corona beer bottle (clear container) and make sure the rubber hose is under some fluid in the clear bottle (bottle can not start out empty) and start pumping the lever under the toungue of the trailer making for sure that it does not go dry. Eventually the fluid will flow out of the caliper and you can take notice on the flushing of the caliper. If it is super rusty then you may want to replace the calipers but you may get lucky and be able to use them. Just flush the crap out of them. Once you flush the furthest caliper, tighten the bleeder valve and flush the next caliper that is the furthest from the master cylinder or if you have a single axle trailer just do the other side. Flush the crap out of that side.


After bleeding and flushing I would try the system out.

If you replace the master cylinder your out $60 or so and the maybe replacment of the reverse lock out solenoid $20 or so. There is a good chance that you will only have to spend $100 or so. If the calipers are ruined then I'm sure that you will be out another $150 or so.

*2 Just watch out for crap in those lines.

Skyskiguy
11-26-2012, 01:03 AM
You have a Reliable brand actuator (anyone else see the irony in their choice of names?). You won't find any parts for it. Your best bet is to cut the Reliable tongue assembly away from the hinge mechanism and weld in a UFP housing and install a new UFP inner member. Be sure you get the correct inner member for your axle/disc set-up. I'll be tackling the same project on my '06 tandem/disc MC trailer this winter.

mikeg205
11-26-2012, 07:53 AM
You have a Reliable brand actuator (anyone else see the irony in their choice of names?). You won't find any parts for it. Your best bet is to cut the Reliable tongue assembly away from the hinge mechanism and weld in a UFP housing and install a new UFP inner member. Be sure you get the correct inner member for your axle/disc set-up. I'll be tackling the same project on my '06 tandem/disc MC trailer this winter.

Thanks Skyskiguy...that's what I thought but I could not remember brand x. :D

erervin
11-26-2012, 08:25 AM
Thanks Skyskiguy, this is the conclusion that I had come to. I'm going to order the new actuator and housing and have a local weld shop fab the connection.

Does anyone know what calipers are needed for this setup? Thinking I should just bite the bullet and replace them while I'm at it.

mikeg205
11-26-2012, 08:34 AM
Think that's a great idea erervin. I have drum brakes on my 1995...rebuilt 50% of actuator, new flexible lines, new backing plates.

bturner2
11-26-2012, 09:05 AM
I saw this on the California trailer site. Not sure if this is the same pivot mounting that MC uses but it might be a better option as you would have to reuse any of the plates. If it doesn't match up all you would need to have done would be to cut off the main tube bracket and weld on the new one.

http://caltrailerworks.com/online/product.php?productid=16156&cat=156&page=1

mikeg205
11-26-2012, 11:21 AM
I saw this on the California trailer site. Not sure if this is the same pivot mounting that MC uses but it might be a better option as you would have to reuse any of the plates. If it doesn't match up all you would need to have done would be to cut off the main tube bracket and weld on the new one.

http://caltrailerworks.com/online/product.php?productid=16156&cat=156&page=1

That's the one on my wish list... :)

Ski-me
11-26-2012, 12:19 PM
That's the one on my wish list... :)

This is the one I'm doing right now. Just finished up welding on the folding tongue last Wednesday before leaving for Thanksgiving. Turned out great, with the exception of it was not welded on perpendicular to the trailer. Off by a few degrees and looks like it's sagging in the middle (slightly). I'm going to bring it back tomorrow morning and have them cut it off and re-weld.

Can't wait for that conversation......:rolleyes:

Overall though, very beefy and nice. The trailer company that welded it on was also impressed. All they had done in the past was the bolt on Fulton type.

I also got a new actuator, calipers, pads, rotors and bearings. Re-doing everything.

I plan on doing a write up in a few days once I get the tongue issue straightened out.

bturner2
11-26-2012, 12:44 PM
I'd like to know if this is the one that MasterCraft uses and if I could bolt it straight up to my 07 MC trailer when the time comes. Based on the posts I've seen it would appear that this is not going to an "if" but a "when" situation.

I also find it hard to believe that Reliable manufactured their own brake components for the actuator. The design and the housing sure but the master cylinder and the shock? Really? Wouldn't you try and pick something up on the open market that was already available to save cost? While the calipers for boat trailers are (I believe) manufactured for trailers I've read that a lot of times the actual pads are automotive.

Ski-me
11-26-2012, 01:53 PM
I'd like to know if this is the one that MasterCraft uses and if I could bolt it straight up to my 07 MC trailer when the time comes. Based on the posts I've seen it would appear that this is not going to an "if" but a "when" situation.

I also find it hard to believe that Reliable manufactured their own brake components for the actuator. The design and the housing sure but the master cylinder and the shock? Really? Wouldn't you try and pick something up on the open market that was already available to save cost? While the calipers for boat trailers are (I believe) manufactured for trailers I've read that a lot of times the actual pads are automotive.

On the manual that came with my DB-35 UFP calipers, it says at the the bottom that if needed, replacement pads can be found at any local autoparts store for a 1997-2000 Kia Sephia.

bturner2
11-26-2012, 06:08 PM
Now all we need is a master cylinder and shock and we can rebuild the actuator....

mikeg205
11-26-2012, 06:16 PM
Now all we need is a master cylinder and shock and we can rebuild the actuator....

I got a shock and cylinder from Pacifictrailer.com... can you post some pictures?

Skyskiguy
11-26-2012, 08:52 PM
[QUOTE=bturner2;892291]I saw this on the California trailer site. Not sure if this is the same pivot mounting that MC uses but it might be a better option as you would have to reuse any of the plates. If it doesn't match up all you would need to have done would be to cut off the main tube bracket and weld on the new one.

http://caltrailerworks.com/online/product.php?productid=16156&cat=156&page=1[/

Apparently, the bolt pattern of the UFP hinge is not the same as the Reliable, that's why the easiest fix seems to be to cut the Reliable actuator away from the hinge assembly and weld in a UFP outer member (this way you only have to take the actuator section to your local trailer shop to be painted). Alternatively, as stated above, cut away the entire thing, including hinge assembly, and weld on the UFP assembly from caltrailerworks (then drag the entire boat down to the shop to get the new parts painted). Also, I think the one from caltrailerworks is longer which could potentially cause a problem if your safety cables aren't long enough - or maybe they will fabricate it to what ever length you need to match your original?
Again, be sure to get the correct inner member for your particular set-up.

Ski-me
11-26-2012, 10:43 PM
[QUOTE=bturner2;892291]I saw this on the California trailer site. Not sure if this is the same pivot mounting that MC uses but it might be a better option as you would have to reuse any of the plates. If it doesn't match up all you would need to have done would be to cut off the main tube bracket and weld on the new one.

http://caltrailerworks.com/online/product.php?productid=16156&cat=156&page=1[/

Apparently, the bolt pattern of the UFP hinge is not the same as the Reliable, that's why the easiest fix seems to be to cut the Reliable actuator away from the hinge assembly and weld in a UFP outer member (this way you only have to take the actuator section to your local trailer shop to be painted). Alternatively, as stated above, cut away the entire thing, including hinge assembly, and weld on the UFP assembly from caltrailerworks (then drag the entire boat down to the shop to get the new parts painted). Also, I think the one from caltrailerworks is longer which could potentially cause a problem if your safety cables aren't long enough - or maybe they will fabricate it to what ever length you need to match your original?
Again, be sure to get the correct inner member for your particular set-up.

Yes, they will custom make it any length you want for the same price. I chose 20" from center of ball to hitch pivot point.

erervin
01-03-2013, 08:28 AM
An update on the brake overhaul on my trailer. I just put in an order for the items listed below from CalTrailer. If I'm going to replace the actuator and the calipers, I might as well go ahead and replace the lines to ensure there's no corrosion material left to foul up the brakes in the future. I'm going to turn the rotors. As soon as these parts come in I'm going to have my local weld shop fab the new housing to the existing hinge-piece.

Something else I decided to do while I'm working on the trailer is to replace the trailer pads located on the fenders. One had fallen off and the others were cracking badly. I decided to replace them with what Sk8solomon had done, all-brite aluminum diamond plate. I took the old pads in and they're cutting them using a flowjet. Material and labor is going to run me about $150. I intend to pop-rivit them to the fenders rather than glue them on.

I'll be posting pictures during the installation.

UFP A60 ACTUATOR / INNER MEMBER DISC ON ONE AXLE(34043)
UFP ACTUATOR HOUSING / OUTER MEMBER RAW LONG (34066)
BRAKE LINE KIT / ONE AXLE BRAKES
KODIAK 225 CALIPERS / PADS

erervin
01-19-2013, 04:40 PM
Well today I was able to install the Kodiak 225 calipers, new brake hoses, and run and bend the new steel brake lines. I do not have the actuator housing back from the weld shop to finish up, but it's getting closer.

erervin
04-12-2013, 09:01 AM
Finally was able to finish the brake overhaul last night. I received the new outer housing and had a weld shop fabricate this old swing points to the housing. I put a fresh coat of paint on it and while it was drying I secured the new brake lines to the frame with rubber line fasteners. Everything fit together as if it were a new Reliable replacement. Filled chamber with DOT3 fluid and going to let gravity do its thing over the weekend. Will finish bleeding the lines Sunday night and my plan is to take it out Monday evening for the 2013 maiden voyage.

Spent about $600 total on the trailer over winter; including new diamond plate skid pads, brake job, new bunks and carpet. Put a fresh coat of wax on the boat and trailer and ready to go.