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View Full Version : Help with my son's wake-2-wake jump


GoneBoatN
09-28-2012, 08:49 PM
A video of my son's wakeboard jump is at https://vimeo.com/50405248. Previously I posted a video of my own jump but we will be headed out again this weekend. So I figured I would ask for a little advice on behalf of my son. He actually gets some pretty good pop but I think his form is a bit off. To me he seems to have his upper body too far forward. The video is mostly of a single jump repeated with some video effects to help with the anlysis. There is a separate clip of what often happens to him which I feel he is being pulled out the front due to this having his upper body too far forward. I think this also results in his not being on edge as much as he could be if his upper body was a bit more leaned back against the rope. Also the rope would be loaded more when he hits the wake if he were to correct this. Also I think you will see that his edging is to agressive to start - I think I see him backing off almost immediately after he starts his turn because of this.

Anyways, enough about what I think. Tell me your advice and I will forward to my son.

Thanks in advance!

sprite
09-28-2012, 09:05 PM
look pretty good, he could defiantly pop more with his legs. start lower coming at the wake and extend fully when you jump. also if you wait longer to pop off the wake you get more of the effect of the wake throwing you in the air. i wait till i feel like i wont get any pop from the wake to fully extend , this helps dramatically. also a "progressive cut" helps, get as far out as you can then slowly increase your speed so you are edging your hardest right before the wake

mikeg205
09-28-2012, 09:46 PM
go to a ski school if you can...my son learned a bunch in one lesson... it's worth the money.. even if you have to travel...you will also find out if the equipment is set up right.

tdjaster
09-29-2012, 05:35 PM
I've taught ski lessons for several years. First, overall form looks pretty good but there's really just two adjustments that are needed.

#1. Continue the cut entirely through the wake; he's coming off edge right as he approaches the wake (common mistake, it's a natural reflex sometimes to ease off because of the speed gained). You can tell what I'm talking about by watching the height of spray as he approaches the wake; it peaks about 8 feet from the ramp.

#1b. Cut harder. A great drill that I encourage is to cut away from the boat on the opposite side of the wake. Start right at the wake and make the cut away, building speed and tension as you get farther away. Release, coast back in toward the boat, repeat. This drill creates good technique and habits.

#2. He definitely needs more pop off the wake. In the video, he's basically just hopping over the wake with whatever the wake gives him. When you reach the top of the wake and begin to release, you need to extend legs to create the pop. Think of it as if you were standing flat footed and jumped for a rebound or to spike a volleyball.

Hope that helps! Keep riding and post some videos of his improvement.

GoneBoatN
10-04-2012, 11:11 AM
My son improved a bit when we were out last weekend.

https://vimeo.com/50734597

Me, I still need to work on it...

tdjaster
10-04-2012, 12:15 PM
What a difference a week makes! Technique has definitely improved. This may sound strange but the best cut and flight actually happened on the very last jump at 3:55 into the video, even though he dropped the handle.

Now, the next steps to consider:
#1. Don't become a one-wake wonder. Add in grabs, work on riding switch, hit some 180s, work the toeside jumps as well. Surprisingly, the easiest 180 to learn is the TS 180 (where you ride away landing switch). It doesn't take much, just a little TS pop and opening the hips mid-air. My wife landed it on her 2nd or 3rd ever attempt.

#2. The landing/rideaway. I learned this one from Pat McElhinney who is a longtime pro and teaches lesson near me. He talked a lot about considering your path from shoreline to shoreline. Right now, the cut and jump is looking strong but as soon as he lands, he stops all momentum (and it actually even starts at the very end of the flight). Upon landing, continue the arc of the original pre-wake cut now moving away from the boat. What I got into the habit of doing is picking a point on the opposite shoreline before I ever started the cut. I then make my path through the cut, flight, landing, and finish the cut away from the boat toward my target point. This makes for a great flow for an entire run.

Keep working at it! Looking great!

GoneBoatN
10-04-2012, 01:05 PM
What a difference a week makes! Technique has definitely improved. This may sound strange but the best cut and flight actually happened on the very last jump at 3:55 into the video, even though he dropped the handle.

Now, the next steps to consider:
#1. Don't become a one-wake wonder. Add in grabs, work on riding switch, hit some 180s, work the toeside jumps as well. Surprisingly, the easiest 180 to learn is the TS 180 (where you ride away landing switch). It doesn't take much, just a little TS pop and opening the hips mid-air. My wife landed it on her 2nd or 3rd ever attempt.

#2. The landing/rideaway. I learned this one from Pat McElhinney who is a longtime pro and teaches lesson near me. He talked a lot about considering your path from shoreline to shoreline. Right now, the cut and jump is looking strong but as soon as he lands, he stops all momentum (and it actually even starts at the very end of the flight). Upon landing, continue the arc of the original pre-wake cut now moving away from the boat. What I got into the habit of doing is picking a point on the opposite shoreline before I ever started the cut. I then make my path through the cut, flight, landing, and finish the cut away from the boat toward my target point. This makes for a great flow for an entire run.

Keep working at it! Looking great!

I keep trying to convince him to ride switch but he does not seem to want to listen to that. I've also tried to convince him to start some toe-side jumps on the way back even if just a small jump to start with; he started that but just a bit and then stopped. He seen someone doing some Ollie 180's and liked the way the guy was boarding - perhaps I'll be able to convince him to start there. He's been concentrating on the heel-side to get more height to do some good grabs.

Myself, I ride switch a fair bit by doing surface 180's. I want to move onto Ollie 180's and then doing 180's across one wake. I've definitely notice the tendency to unwind while jumping (one wake) toe side so I think that will be my first 180 attempt - I'll need to make sure to use the knees for a soft landing so I don't bite it on the landing. :)

I agree on #2 as well. I tend to exaggerate the run out as well. Funny: some parts of the Delta are pretty narrow. I change to switch on the run out one time and was not paying attention. I ended up face planting in the reeds. :eek: But I had my helmet on. I was way too close to the rocks along the banks. Will never do that again.

76S&S
10-04-2012, 02:47 PM
Slow the boat down (low to mid teens) and let him do some surface 180's behind the boat. Once he is comfortable with those (and riding switch) then it's time to do some one wake 180's, running a bit slower than normal. He can also do ollie 180's behind the boat to get the feel, again a little slower than normal boat speed.

Also, the sooner he starts working on toe-side the better. Just small one wake jumps to start.

GoneBoatN
10-04-2012, 05:36 PM
I think I will start emailing some of this to him. You parents know the routine with a teenage son - Dad does not know xhit. :D The only thing I find more boring than coming back toe side (myself) not doing much of anything, is watching someone else do it!

bsloop
11-13-2012, 09:50 PM
The only thing I find more boring than coming back toe side (myself) not doing much of anything, is watching someone else do it!

The "typewriter". Not only boring to watch but using the same muscles tires quicker.

Agree slow down. Work on surface 180's either sliding the board or hop switching. This will then lead to surface 360's.
If he is too concerned with "going big" to show off, work on it on a week night with no one else out.

GoneBoatN
11-13-2012, 10:33 PM
The "typewriter". Not only boring to watch but using the same muscles tires quicker.

Agree slow down. Work on surface 180's either sliding the board or hop switching. This will then lead to surface 360's.
If he is too concerned with "going big" to show off, work on it on a week night with no one else out.

Last few times out he did not even get in the water - "it's too cold". He has a wet suit! :mad: Freaking teenager. I would have killed for a boat and to be wakeboarding when I was his age.

GoneBoatN
11-13-2012, 10:37 PM
The "typewriter". Not only boring to watch but using the same muscles tires quicker.

Agree slow down. Work on surface 180's either sliding the board or hop switching. This will then lead to surface 360's.
If he is too concerned with "going big" to show off, work on it on a week night with no one else out.

He has a pretty good Ollie - good height. I try to convince him to try a 180, suggesting a slower speed - no go. Then he turns around and says he would like to go to a wakeboard camp. I hesitant to kick the $ when he will not get behind our boat and practice. He'll have to kick in some of his funds to show me he is serious enough about it.

bsloop
11-13-2012, 11:18 PM
I turned 40 this year and will admit to feeling less cold water motivation than 3 years ago. Up til the past two, we always did a Thanksgiving run.
Water temp is 43 and I winterized last weekend, the earliest in the 8 yrs I have owned the boat.

You sound decently grounded vs people that are putting their kids into multiple high $$$ sport camps.
When I was actually trying to progress (vs worring about how much work I would lose if I landed wrong), I had my biggest gains when we had a 4-5 man crew that was focused on progressive riding. We rode every Thursday night and Sunday afternoon took video of each other. Reviewed it once a week and watched a set of instructional DVD's.
If he wants to improve over the winter, some gymnastics centers may have a wake board session time to practice flips on a tramp and into the foam pit. One of the guys was an aspiring amature and worked on it a winter or two.
Maybe spring for a day instruction when the pro's come to around for a local/regional promotional event.

GoneBoatN
11-14-2012, 02:26 AM
I've turned 52, just started wakeboarding and this is my second season. I also just took up snowboarding last season after 36 years of snow skiing. LoL.

I'm going to go out Thanksgiving just to say I did it. I will most likely be wearing my 7MM wet suit I use for scuba diving - I'll hardly need a PFD with all that floatation.

He already goes to a jumping place and can do front and back flips. His friend has a trampoline. My daughter is getting a trampoline for her 12th birthday. We have both The Book and Detention 2012 instructional DVDs. We have some local pros that offer lessons. I'll most likely spring for some lessons but I want to see him at least start attempting to ride switch first.

Well, I just keep leading him to water and see if he starts drinking...