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memphis23
09-04-2012, 12:55 PM
Ok Marine Stereo covered in a plastic cover and silicone on the crack at the hinge of the cover. what should my expectations be for waterproof ability?

I have a Prostar 190 and this is my second stereo (same model by the way) a sony DSX-MS60 Stereo w/Ipod tray. It did rain on Saturday while we were at the lake and the boat was not covered. The next day I try play the stereo and nothing is working. Are these Marine grade stereos not capable of getting rained on in the dash in a plastic radio cover.

NOT only that the Roswell amp (http://www.westmarine.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/ProductDisplay?productId=775078&catalogId=10001&langId=-1&storeId=11151&storeNum=50157&subdeptNum=50197&classNum=50199#.UEYx1SIlS9I) is fried as well. Now the amp is almost impossible to believe because it is mounted under the dash completely covered.

When I take both of these back is there any other brands that can actually stand up to water resistance. My lowrance gps is uncovered and sits out in all of the elements never having any trouble what so ever.

thanks

Traxx822
09-04-2012, 04:28 PM
Ok Marine Stereo covered in a plastic cover and silicone on the crack at the hinge of the cover. what should my expectations be for waterproof ability?

I have a Prostar 190 and this is my second stereo (same model by the way) a sony DSX-MS60 Stereo w/Ipod tray. It did rain on Saturday while we were at the lake and the boat was not covered. The next day I try play the stereo and nothing is working. Are these Marine grade stereos not capable of getting rained on in the dash in a plastic radio cover.

NOT only that the Roswell amp (http://www.westmarine.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/ProductDisplay?productId=775078&catalogId=10001&langId=-1&storeId=11151&storeNum=50157&subdeptNum=50197&classNum=50199#.UEYx1SIlS9I) is fried as well. Now the amp is almost impossible to believe because it is mounted under the dash completely covered.

When I take both of these back is there any other brands that can actually stand up to water resistance. My lowrance gps is uncovered and sits out in all of the elements never having any trouble what so ever.

thanks

In my opinion. For One cover your boat. second the radio is marine so you say so it should take a splash. probably not a rain session. On the roswell amp, its cheaper amp so you probably fried it. Buy a good amp to replace it. good luck. Talking to a pro at the electronics store helps.

memphis23
09-04-2012, 08:02 PM
looking at fusion on both the amp and the head unit any thoughts? (http://www.westmarine.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/ProductDisplay?productId=961795&catalogId=10001&langId=-1&storeId=11151&storeNum=50157&subdeptNum=50197&classNum=50200#.UEaXLEQ_cb0) and (http://www.westmarine.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/ProductDisplay?productId=998832&catalogId=10001&langId=-1&storeId=11151&storeNum=50157&subdeptNum=50197&classNum=50198#.UEaXY0Q_cb0)

tell me what you think

Traxx822
09-04-2012, 08:33 PM
What speakers and sub are you running?

CruisinGA
09-04-2012, 09:18 PM
I had an Alpine car head unit in my FJ40 land cruiser for several years. It held up for 3-4 years of rain, sun, and powerwashing the dash.

I would expect at least that much from a Marine head unit.

memphis23
09-05-2012, 10:23 AM
Traxx882 here are the tower speakers (http://www.westmarine.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/ProductDisplay?productId=775070&catalogId=10001&langId=-1&storeId=11151&storeNum=50157&subdeptNum=50197&classNum=50199#.UEddvCIlS9I) Here is the sub (http://www.waketowerpro.com/index.cfm?p=products&main_cat=Boat%20Audio&sub_cat=Subwoofers&productid=30&Details) and here are the 4 boat speakers (http://www.academy.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/Product_10151_10051_19704_-1?Ntt=sony+speakers&Ntk=All) here is what I am thinking of going to on the Head Unit (http://www.westmarine.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/ProductDisplay?productId=998832&catalogId=10001&langId=-1&storeId=11151&storeNum=50157&subdeptNum=50197&classNum=50198#.UEde1SIlS9J) and I was thinking of putting in a 5 channel fusion amp as well(http://www.westmarine.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/ProductDisplay?productId=961795&catalogId=10001&langId=-1&storeId=11151&storeNum=50157&subdeptNum=50197&classNum=50200#.UEdgziIlS9I). I really don't feel like becoming an expert on Audio installations. At this point I am mostly concerned about water resistance. this is my second go around with the same two components and both times they were exposed to very little water (not anywhere close to a good spraying at the car wash). The amp almost started a fire when it blew.
Cruisin: I hope I can get something like that Alpine and I am hoping the Fusion is the way to go? Thoughts?

Traxx822
09-06-2012, 08:12 AM
I'm not trying to beat what you have set up down I just want to play devils advocate for a minute. Everything you listed up there .. with the exception of the head unit which I feel is overpriced ... is low end with close to high end prices. Your amp will not power all those speakers. You have 6 speakers and 1 sub on a 5 channel amp. Thats impossible. (correct me if its not a 5 channel)

I suggest this setup.

Tower speakers: http://www.h2osportswarehouse.com/ProductDetails.asp?ProductCode=BT-FIBSSP65JL-TI
249.99

Cockpit speakers: http://www.jlaudio.com/mx650-ccx-sg-wh-marine-audio-mx-series-speaker-systems-91938
199.99 / pair

Subwoofer: http://www.onlinecarstereo.com/CarAudio/p_28934_JL_Audio_FS110-W5-SG-TB.aspx
449.99

Amps: For the tower & sub: http://www.jlaudio.com/m500-3-marine-audio-m-series-amplifiers-98277
439.95

Amps for cockpit http://www.jlaudio.com/m400-4-marine-audio-m-series-amplifiers-98271
419.95

Headunit: http://pacificstereo.com/alpine-ida-x100m.html?utm_source=google-products&utm_medium=cse&utm_campaign=google-products&gdftrk=gdfV2644_a_7c759_a_7c9104_a_7ciDA_d_X100M&gclid=CNesj7n0oLICFeY7MgodLRoANw
359.95


Your setup cost - 1882.99
My setup cost - 2319.77

I wouldn't spend almost 2k on second rate companies when its only 500 more you have smaller amps that can be submerged in water and still work. You can find better prices from non JL audio dealers but then the warranty's will not be through JL it will be with whoever you bought it from. JL audio is picky on their dealers and strict on their must purchase from authorized dealer policies. But there are cheaper prices out there for off the truck stuff but it seems you're not starving for the extra $500. Take the plunge and buy a stereo you will actually enjoy and will be there for 5 years and sound the same as new.

I'm not brand specific. I love memphis marine tower speakers but they are 2 for $1200. The tower speakers I suggested have JL MX speakers. So you could just buy 6 of those and sell the pods on ebay for $100 a pair and save even more money.

Remember these speakers come in white and titanium black.

I have 1 JL 10" the infinite baffle subwoofer mounted in the side of the walkthru. looks factory installed. So you don't need a box. You can buy the infinite baffle sub for about $150 less than the one I suggested.

I hope this helped you.

memphis23
09-06-2012, 10:18 PM
I am stuck with west marine on the head unit and the amp because of return-ability. So here are my choices for amps and head units which would you do?

Head units: http://www.westmarine.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/SiteSearchView?PopularCat=No&Ne=2000000&beginIndex=0&langId=-1&storeId=11151&page=CategoryDisplayLevel1&N=377+710+2050198&Ns=Most+Popular|0&catalogId=10001&omniTag=Category%3aStereo+Head+Units&viewTaskName=SiteSearchView&icid=HD_Electronics_StereoHeadUnits

Amps: www.westmarine.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/SiteSearchView?PopularCat=No&Ne=2000000&beginIndex=0&langId=-1&storeId=11151&page=CategoryDisplayLevel1&N=377+710+2050198&Ns=Most+Popular|0&catalogId=10001&omniTag=Category%3aStereo+Head+Units&viewTaskName=SiteSearchView&icid=HD_Electronics_StereoHeadUnits

I believe the installer put 1 channel for the sub and 2 for the tower speakers and bridged the last 2 for the in boat speakers not for sure though?


thanks for your input

memphis23
09-06-2012, 10:23 PM
for some reason it will not let me post the link for the amps at west marine so if you dont mind just type in amps on west marine and those are the ones i get to choose from thanks

catamount
09-06-2012, 10:24 PM
I have given up on stereos with any sort of opening for a CD or SD card. I'm going completely "waterproof" now.

This is what I will be installing next week, maybe West Marine carries something like it?

http://www.shopepal.com/p-16338-jensen-ms30-amfmusb-compact-waterproof-stereo.aspx?utm_source=GoogleShopping&utm_medium=compshop&utm_campaign=cse&CAWELAID=1310034909&cagpspn=pla

pbgbottle
09-06-2012, 10:30 PM
Have you checked the deck thoroughly Fuses , etc.
I just had my boat swamped and sank all alpine car audio and cheap amps. Submerged for 3 hours all dried out and are working, speakers ,amps ,deck ,sub , tweets. All work fine. But they did blow the fuse. I find it. Hard to believe your deck got fried by Being splashed .
My decks in my landcruiser also got rained on multiple times and kept on working. Haha.

JimN
09-06-2012, 10:38 PM
I am stuck with west marine on the head unit and the amp because of return-ability. So here are my choices for amps and head units which would you do?

Head units: http://www.westmarine.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/SiteSearchView?PopularCat=No&Ne=2000000&beginIndex=0&langId=-1&storeId=11151&page=CategoryDisplayLevel1&N=377+710+2050198&Ns=Most+Popular|0&catalogId=10001&omniTag=Category%3aStereo+Head+Units&viewTaskName=SiteSearchView&icid=HD_Electronics_StereoHeadUnits

Amps: www.westmarine.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/SiteSearchView?PopularCat=No&Ne=2000000&beginIndex=0&langId=-1&storeId=11151&page=CategoryDisplayLevel1&N=377+710+2050198&Ns=Most+Popular|0&catalogId=10001&omniTag=Category%3aStereo+Head+Units&viewTaskName=SiteSearchView&icid=HD_Electronics_StereoHeadUnits

I believe the installer put 1 channel for the sub and 2 for the tower speakers and bridged the last 2 for the in boat speakers not for sure though?


thanks for your input

This-
http://www.westmarine.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/ProductDisplay?productId=246259&catalogId=10001&langId=-1&storeId=11151&storeNum=50157&subdeptNum=50197&classNum=50198#.UEldqyLkqSo

As long as the face is snapped shut, water won't get in unless the boat sinks and even then, only the connections outside of the unit itself will get wet.

JimN
09-06-2012, 10:42 PM
I'm not trying to beat what you have set up down I just want to play devils advocate for a minute. Everything you listed up there .. with the exception of the head unit which I feel is overpriced ... is low end with close to high end prices. Your amp will not power all those speakers. You have 6 speakers and 1 sub on a 5 channel amp. Thats impossible. (correct me if its not a 5 channel)

I suggest this setup.

Tower speakers: http://www.h2osportswarehouse.com/ProductDetails.asp?ProductCode=BT-FIBSSP65JL-TI
249.99

Cockpit speakers: http://www.jlaudio.com/mx650-ccx-sg-wh-marine-audio-mx-series-speaker-systems-91938
199.99 / pair

Subwoofer: http://www.onlinecarstereo.com/CarAudio/p_28934_JL_Audio_FS110-W5-SG-TB.aspx
449.99

Amps: For the tower & sub: http://www.jlaudio.com/m500-3-marine-audio-m-series-amplifiers-98277
439.95

Amps for cockpit http://www.jlaudio.com/m400-4-marine-audio-m-series-amplifiers-98271
419.95

Headunit: http://pacificstereo.com/alpine-ida-x100m.html?utm_source=google-products&utm_medium=cse&utm_campaign=google-products&gdftrk=gdfV2644_a_7c759_a_7c9104_a_7ciDA_d_X100M&gclid=CNesj7n0oLICFeY7MgodLRoANw
359.95


Your setup cost - 1882.99
My setup cost - 2319.77

I wouldn't spend almost 2k on second rate companies when its only 500 more you have smaller amps that can be submerged in water and still work. You can find better prices from non JL audio dealers but then the warranty's will not be through JL it will be with whoever you bought it from. JL audio is picky on their dealers and strict on their must purchase from authorized dealer policies. But there are cheaper prices out there for off the truck stuff but it seems you're not starving for the extra $500. Take the plunge and buy a stereo you will actually enjoy and will be there for 5 years and sound the same as new.

I'm not brand specific. I love memphis marine tower speakers but they are 2 for $1200. The tower speakers I suggested have JL MX speakers. So you could just buy 6 of those and sell the pods on ebay for $100 a pair and save even more money.

Remember these speakers come in white and titanium black.

I have 1 JL 10" the infinite baffle subwoofer mounted in the side of the walkthru. looks factory installed. So you don't need a box. You can buy the infinite baffle sub for about $150 less than the one I suggested.

I hope this helped you.

There's absolutely nothing wrong with that Fusion amp- I installed one and it has plenty of balls. Their amps and head units are marine-specific, not car audio with some crap smeared on the circuit boards and re-labeled 'Marine'. You might want to go and check out these head units and amps before dumping on them.

memphis23
09-06-2012, 10:52 PM
Cata I guess you have had problems as well???? This is crazy for me I have a jeep that never is covered and the head unit is fine so this is absolutely taken me back. Let me know how your decision goes and I will let you know this outcome for me goes. thanks for your reply

memphis23
09-06-2012, 10:57 PM
JimN the fusion IP-700 is the same IPX5 rating as the series 200 so I am hoping the head unit is ok. thanks for your input

memphis23
09-06-2012, 11:02 PM
PBGbottle I had the very fun experience of being under the front of the closed bow(so cramped a sardeen would feel like they had been set free) and replaced the fuses then pop bomb and smoke and I thought oh sh_t I can not move at all and the thing is going to catch fire. Not fun and definitely something I don't want to do again

Traxx822
09-07-2012, 12:04 PM
There's absolutely nothing wrong with that Fusion amp- I installed one and it has plenty of balls. Their amps and head units are marine-specific, not car audio with some crap smeared on the circuit boards and re-labeled 'Marine'. You might want to go and check out these head units and amps before dumping on them.

I'm sorry to say but JL audios amps are much better than any Fusion or 4 stacked together. Clean power is what makes your music.


I believe the installer put 1 channel for the sub and 2 for the tower speakers and bridged the last 2 for the in boat speakers not for sure though?


thanks for your input

I didn't know amps existed that could do that. Usually you can't bridge 2 of the 4 channels to run 4 speakers @ 2ohms and 2 speakers @ 4 ohms and 1 sub @4ohms. It doesn't work that way. Also doesn;t allow for fade and balance control. At least it may power it and seem like it does but it doesn't. Probably why you fried it.

I'd recommend running all at 4 ohms. At least one 4 channel with at least 400 watts RMS (not peak) And one 3 channel amp with at least 300 watts RMS and you should be good. With better speakers than those Sony's. If you go with the sony's I would let the head unit power them.

As far as head units go. I don't all really believe in them. I just like the one I have. But they are all comparable in my opinion. With the right care or case it should last no matter what. Your last one was probably a fluke.

JimN
09-07-2012, 02:56 PM
I'm sorry to say but JL audios amps are much better than any Fusion or 4 stacked together. Clean power is what makes your music.

I'd recommend running all at 4 ohms. At least one 4 channel with at least 400 watts RMS (not peak) And one 3 channel amp with at least 300 watts RMS and you should be good. With better speakers than those Sony's. If you go with the sony's I would let the head unit power them.

As far as head units go. I don't all really believe in them. I just like the one I have. But they are all comparable in my opinion. With the right care or case it should last no matter what. Your last one was probably a fluke.

You don't need to apologize, but the Fusion amp is a good one- I have worked with home/pro/car audio for over 30 years and it's not just me thinking a power booster is the same as a power amp. I like JL and have spoken with one of the tech people since '88. I like their method for setting levels on amps without having needing to use a ton of test equipment- makes it much easier for the consumer and keeps them from seeing as many "defective" returns. Doing it really "right" needs test equipment, but it's better than listening for distortion and thinking it's clean & correctly adjusted.

Re: his last amp- I wonder if it was set for stereo or bridge mode and not wired that way.

memphis23
09-07-2012, 04:28 PM
JimN: The guys that put the stereo do quite a few tower installs and stereos here in Texas so I feel pretty confident it was wired correctly. My issue was with how sensitive both the Sony and the Roswell amp are to water. The sony is in the water cover with silicone around the edges to keep water out and The amp is mounted under the front hull area behind the dash no water other than condensation could have been getting on the amp and within 3 weeks it had corrosion on all of the places where the wires attach?

I looked at both the fusion head unit and amp today live and in person and it is head and shoulders above what I had before just by looking at all of the rubber seals to waterproof the head unit impressed me.

Traxx822
09-07-2012, 05:07 PM
JimN: The guys that put the stereo do quite a few tower installs and stereos here in Texas so I feel pretty confident it was wired correctly. My issue was with how sensitive both the Sony and the Roswell amp are to water. The sony is in the water cover with silicone around the edges to keep water out and The amp is mounted under the front hull area behind the dash no water other than condensation could have been getting on the amp and within 3 weeks it had corrosion on all of the places where the wires attach?

I looked at both the fusion head unit and amp today live and in person and it is head and shoulders above what I had before just by looking at all of the rubber seals to waterproof the head unit impressed me.

The company who wired it up was most certainly not the people you want to go back to. You seriously cannot not run stereo out of 2 channels and mono out another and etc etc. 2 channels bridges mono for 4 speakers off one lead. That doesn't sound pro at all.

JimN
09-07-2012, 05:28 PM
JimN: The guys that put the stereo do quite a few tower installs and stereos here in Texas so I feel pretty confident it was wired correctly. My issue was with how sensitive both the Sony and the Roswell amp are to water. The sony is in the water cover with silicone around the edges to keep water out and The amp is mounted under the front hull area behind the dash no water other than condensation could have been getting on the amp and within 3 weeks it had corrosion on all of the places where the wires attach?

I looked at both the fusion head unit and amp today live and in person and it is head and shoulders above what I had before just by looking at all of the rubber seals to waterproof the head unit impressed me.

Did anyone open either and look for the damage? That's what I would do. In a boat, I would either go really cheap, to avoid a big expense when it cacks or go the other way, getting something that doesn't allow water to get inside in the first place. I have seen all kinds of head units last for a month or 25 years and it's not up to the price- some of the oldest ones that still worked were dirt cheap. I would try to put any electronics where there's a steady supply of fresh air moving- if the air can't move, the amp(s) will run hot and that's another fast track toward failure. It's a huge conundrum- seal it completely and it runs too hot or leave it open and it gets wet.

JimN
09-07-2012, 05:31 PM
The company who wired it up was most certainly not the people you want to go back to. You seriously cannot not run stereo out of 2 channels and mono out another and etc etc. 2 channels bridges mono for 4 speakers off one lead. That doesn't sound pro at all.

Maybe they'll do the swap free, as an installation warranty thing. I have seen switches that were moved accidentally, too. Still doesn't excuse a shop from letting a system go out the door with improper loads and configuration.

Traxx822
09-07-2012, 05:56 PM
Maybe they'll do the swap free, as an installation warranty thing. I have seen switches that were moved accidentally, too. Still doesn't excuse a shop from letting a system go out the door with improper loads and configuration.

I mean if he is using such under powers cockpits just let the head unit power them and get a small amp for the sub and tower speakers ... and then you're done

Agreed JimN; Maybe a switch issue and Memphis may be describing it wrong but the math adds up the way he described as about the only possible way you could run it with what he had. That shop let him leave with a nest of blatant disregard for a typical configuration. Beyond amateur hour it was premeditated crap work. This installer Memphis used sounds like they are a hack/scab. 4 speakers on one bridged lead is ridiculous.

Memphis: Can you just get them to warranty a credit and get different stuff? Or warranty parts and go somewhere else. Maybe sell them on ebay and start over dude. Unless you can get the configure to work and they replace it with the amps you need you know.?

JimN
09-07-2012, 06:02 PM
I mean if he is using such under powers cockpits just let the head unit power them and get a small amp for the sub and tower speakers ... and then you're done

Agreed JimN; Maybe a switch issue and Memphis may be describing it wrong but the math adds up the way he described as about the only possible way you could run it with what he had. That shop let him leave with a nest of blatant disregard for a typical configuration. Beyond amateur hour it was premeditated crap work. This installer Memphis used sounds like they are a hack/scab. 4 speakers on one bridged lead is ridiculous.

Memphis: Can you just get them to warranty a credit and get different stuff? Or warranty parts and go somewhere else. Maybe sell them on ebay and start over dude. Unless you can get the configure to work and they replace it with the amps you need you know.?

Maybe they got all creative and did a series/parallel thing.

Did you ever see Cat3 telephone cable used for a low power 4 channel car stereo? I used to see that fairly often when I first started doing car audio. Ground the speakers to the body, use one wire for each positive and don't worry about the speaker ground at the dash- it was common with the chassis ground anyway, so it wasn't something they worried about.

Traxx822
09-07-2012, 08:42 PM
Still only come out with 2 channels + sub right? Even though its stereo. I did a parallel on a couple amps to boost RMS on some old power acoustic garbo amps when I was a teen.

And I have heard of the low voltage wire being used. Never knew anyone who did it that way but I have come across it like ***? the first time I saw it when upgradeing a 3rd gen TA in high school.

JimN
09-07-2012, 09:08 PM
Still only come out with 2 channels + sub right? Even though its stereo. I did a parallel on a couple amps to boost RMS on some old power acoustic garbo amps when I was a teen.

And I have heard of the low voltage wire being used. Never knew anyone who did it that way but I have come across it like ***? the first time I saw it when upgradeing a 3rd gen TA in high school.

Speaking of Firebird variations, I had one come into the shop I managed and he wanted some upgrades. I opened the hood and stopped, then called the guy into the bay to discuss what I had seen. Someone had run a 4ga power cable from the battery cable clamp to the rear of the car for the amps. The problem is that they stripped about 1" of insulation from the end, loosened the bolt on the replacement clamp that was on the cable, spread the lead apart to make room and jammed the bare copper between the tabs where the bolt passed through. Then, they ran it along the outside of the standing seam of the fender, where the hood closes, mashing it under its edge. As it got to the hinge, it passed over the top of the fender's seam and the hinge pushed the cable down whenever the hood was closed. From there, it dropped down along the edge of the passenger side door and they lifted the kick panel so the cable could bend around the raw edge of the doubled steel, to be hidden by the kick panel and carpet as it traveled back to the amps. The amazing thing about this car is that it never burst into flames, due to the lack of any kind of fuse or breaker on the cable near the battery.