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View Full Version : Kicker KM6500.2 in Stock Cans


mlawler34
05-03-2012, 10:25 AM
Alright guys, I know everyone's recommendation for new speakers is wetsounds or exile or something of the sort. However, I actually like the look of the 8 speakers already on my tower. (yes its probably not as loud as two Rev8's).

So here is the question, will the Kicker KM6500.2 perform well in the stock 2004 MC Cans that came with the 6.5" Clarions with 1.5" tweeter??? (outside 4 cans) My concern is that with the tweeter attached to the cans and it not being completely closed behind the speaker because of the tweeter extension, that they will not perform as well in a stock can. I was thinking i would dynomat the inside to reduce the resonance and that might help the performance. But looking for other more skilled and knowledgeable opinions.

As far as the tweeters go i was thinking taking them out, putting in some of that speaker box fill and then covering with a machined piece of sheet metal to enclose it.

zamboniman
05-03-2012, 11:02 AM
don't over think this.. your primary concern for sealing them up at this point is water intrusion

mlawler34
05-04-2012, 10:25 AM
You are probably right. Just want to be sure before I spend any money.

Any other thoughts on this??? Definitely appreciate all the help i can get.

cwarndahl
05-04-2012, 10:34 AM
i put the 6500 in as my in boat speakers a few weeks ago. the get loud, but i would question the throw to the wakeboarder behind the boat to be honest. probably sound great for swimming behind the boat. but the get loud and they are priced right. worst case give them a try.

mlawler34
05-04-2012, 12:20 PM
i put the 6500 in as my in boat speakers a few weeks ago. the get loud, but i would question the throw to the wakeboarder behind the boat to be honest. probably sound great for swimming behind the boat. but the get loud and they are priced right. worst case give them a try.

Thanks for the input. If they don't throw great sound to the rider that's fine, they will be better off than the cracked clarions.

mlawler34
05-04-2012, 12:23 PM
Anyone know how the stock 2004 speakers were wired up? I am assuming they were run in parallel from the amp. Which is how i believe the each pair of the KM6500.2 are to be wired up with approx 150-200RMS. The less wiring, especially within the tower, i have to do the better i will feel doing this myself.

02ProstarSammyD
05-16-2012, 04:09 PM
i put the 6500 in as my in boat speakers a few weeks ago. the get loud, but i would question the throw to the wakeboarder behind the boat to be honest. probably sound great for swimming behind the boat. but the get loud and they are priced right. worst case give them a try.

You have issues then. I have them in mine and they are clear and loud at 70 off. I have mine hooked up to a clarion apx490 which is a cheap amp and they sound fantastic. Don't undersell these speakers. They aren't wetsounds but they def get the job done well for listening while riding

cwarndahl
05-18-2012, 10:42 PM
I have 4 of them hooked to my clarion 4050, realativly small amp, don't get me wrong I just wouldn't think they could throw that far. I bought the kicker km60 tower speakers and have a mbquart amp behind them and they are rockin behind the boat.

02ProstarSammyD
05-20-2012, 03:43 PM
no clue what a clarion 4050 puts out. Googled it and came up with donuts. I have a 720 watt amp on mine and they crank. You can hear them loud and clear at 65' like you are in the boat. I get more complaints about them being too loud over not loud enough. Either way no chance a pair of km60's outperforms the 6500.2's at riding distance. I'll get a video of them at 80+' on memorial day and we can bury your doubts

AZX9
05-22-2012, 11:47 PM
I have the silver cans on my 2003 with the separate tweeter. Also the same 4 speakers in the boat (X9). I would like to replace them with better more powerful 6.5's. I've done some looking for separates but really have not come up with a good option that will remain 2 way separates so i don't have holes or old disconnected tweeters left in place. Any ideas on brands and models that would work. I want to stay in a continuous RMS range that will work good with the two amps I have. One is 50W x 4 CRMS and the other is 90W x 2 CRMS. Currently the four channel amp is hooked to all eight speakers. the two channel amp is bridged to the 10inch free air sub. I believe the eight speakers are wired in parallel so two speakers per channel. Both amps have the gain turned down to keep the speakers from distorting from too much power.

02ProstarSammyD
05-23-2012, 08:51 AM
^I'd upgrade the amp and look at hcld's. PS: I'm jealous as hell at how clean your x9 is

cwarndahl
05-23-2012, 09:32 AM
hey sammy
not doubting your word, I'm suprised, i could have saved a few bucks. the amp puts out 60 at 4 and 130 bridged, i have it bridged right now. i would like to see the video though!

AZX9
05-23-2012, 10:00 AM
^I'd upgrade the amp and look at hcld's. PS: I'm jealous as hell at how clean your x9 is

That's why I bought it. Otherwise I would have looked at a v drive. What are hcld's?

02ProstarSammyD
05-23-2012, 11:22 AM
sorry I was so reading a WW thread and TT thread at the same time and mentally checked out. you're going to need more power than what you have to get good sound out of the 6500.2's. I may be speaking out of term here but the 6.5's are going to be worthless if you mix the hcld (kickers) with normal speakers. I've never seen anyone do 2 kicker 6500.2 setups (8 cans) but I would just take 4 off, run 4, upgrade the amp, and be done. Once you sold the other setup you'd probably be slightly ahead on $$$

Rossterman
01-02-2013, 08:20 PM
I just Added the 6500.2s to replace weather damaged arc audio lightenings. Used the 4 stock lightening cans and everything fit perfect. Running a arc audio 5150xxk amp (125rms per channel @ 2 ohms) and they are amazing for the price. I can stand 100' behind the boat and they sound like you are right there. Probably not as good as wetsounds but for $275 they make a pretty great upgrade!

MLA
01-02-2013, 10:34 PM
I just Added the 6500.2s to replace weather damaged arc audio lightenings. Used the 4 stock lightening cans and everything fit perfect. Running a arc audio 5150xxk amp (125rms per channel @ 2 ohms) and they are amazing for the price. I can stand 100' behind the boat and they sound like you are right there. Probably not as good as wetsounds but for $275 they make a pretty great upgrade!

If you really want to wake them up, swap your amp for the Kicker IX500.4 full-range Class-D. In 2 chnl mode, it will deliver 250W rms to each "side". We routinely run a pair of these amps to the 6-Pack (KM6500.2 with the extra mids) for a total of 1000W rms to the tower

02ProstarSammyD
01-14-2013, 07:59 PM
I just Added the 6500.2s to replace weather damaged arc audio lightenings. Used the 4 stock lightening cans and everything fit perfect. Running a arc audio 5150xxk amp (125rms per channel @ 2 ohms) and they are amazing for the price. I can stand 100' behind the boat and they sound like you are right there. Probably not as good as wetsounds but for $275 they make a pretty great upgrade!
Reply With Quote

guessing you got the hifisound deal? Yea my blast 100' back if not more. I get plenty of compliments/complaints depending on who you ask. Had a guy in our cove trade us beer last 4th of july for running tunes for the day. He was atleast 150' across the cove and could hear it perfect

dvsone79
01-15-2013, 01:42 PM
I'm looking to do something similar to this with my 6.5" tower speakers/cans. I found a pair of Kicker KM6500s for $230 on a reputable site. But, they aren't the 6500.2s. The 6500.2s are $399. Anyone know the difference between the two?

KM6500s: http://www.sonicelectronix.com/item_21914_Kicker-KM6500-10KM6500.html
KM6500.2s: http://www.sonicelectronix.com/item_21913_Kicker-KM6500.2-10KM6500.2.html

Both are spec'd the same as far as I can tell, 100w RMS, 200w peak, etc. Except the 6500.2s come with what appear to be 2" horn tweeters. Are those worth $170 per pair? Am I going to hear a big difference between the two?

02ProstarSammyD
01-15-2013, 01:48 PM
The 6500's are not hlcd's. They are midrange speakers. The 6500.2 are a complete system. The 6500's are not regular speakers. They are meant to be added onto a 6500.2 package to get more midrange in the 6 pack format. The 6500.2's are good for 100'+ behind the boat. The difference is amazing. With my old polks in the tower couldn't hear chit riding. With the 6500's its like listening to the music in the boat.

And the deal to be had is
http://www.hifisoundconnection.com/Shop/Control/Product/fp/vpid/8252700/vpcsid/0/SFV/30046

293+free shipping for the hcld's. I got them for like 270 from them and they were at my door in a few days. They are kicker refurbs so no worries on quality.

dvsone79
01-15-2013, 04:35 PM
Thanks, Sammy! Next question, do the HLCDs need separate mounting/wiring? Right now I've got the 6.5" tower speakers running off of channels 1 & 2 on a 4 channel amp. 3 & 4 are bridged to my sub.

MLA
01-15-2013, 05:07 PM
Thanks, Sammy! Next question, do the HLCDs need separate mounting/wiring? Right now I've got the 6.5" tower speakers running off of channels 1 & 2 on a 4 channel amp. 3 & 4 are bridged to my sub.

D,

The Kicker KM6500.2 tower setup is designed to have each 6.5 mid wired in parallel with each horn. When wired in parallel, a horn and a mid is a 4 ohm load, so this will determine your amps output to the speakers. What amp do you have? 150W @ 4 ohm is a minimum for me, and 200-250 is where i like them to be. Since they are a 4 ohm load, they are ideal to run bridged on a 4 chnl amp.

02ProstarSammyD
01-16-2013, 09:20 AM
The Kicker KM6500.2 tower setup is designed to have each 6.5 mid wired in parallel with each horn. When wired in parallel, a horn and a mid is a 4 ohm load, so this will determine your amps output to the speakers. What amp do you have? 150W @ 4 ohm is a minimum for me, and 200-250 is where i like them to be. Since they are a 4 ohm load, they are ideal to run bridged on a 4 chnl amp.

I run mine in the upper range and they scream. Amp setup is key on these and you'll want to play with your settings and get the right power to them. Remember a bad amp setup will make any speaker sound like chit.

dvsone79
01-25-2013, 01:50 PM
Ok, I pulled the trigger on the 6500.2s. I'm planning to install the two midrange speakers in my existing speaker cans. What about the horn tweeters? What's the best way to mount those?

MLA
01-25-2013, 03:23 PM
Ok, I pulled the trigger on the 6500.2s. I'm planning to install the two midrange speakers in my existing speaker cans. What about the horn tweeters? What's the best way to mount those?

In two pods of their own. I would suggest mounting the two horns on the upper most/inboard position, then flank them with the mids.

Sorry, not a MC tower

http://i181.photobucket.com/albums/x101/chpthril/0217121145.jpg

dvsone79
01-25-2013, 05:14 PM
OK, thanks MLA. I appreciate your patience with my newbie questions! I love TT. People are always willing to help and inform. Cheers, brother!

MLA
01-25-2013, 05:19 PM
No problem, dv, post up any further questions you have.

bsloop
01-26-2013, 11:34 AM
MLA, why not place the horns mid or outboard?
The highs are most directional so why not angle them for a wider spread instead of both firing straight back?
Most listening riding is done in the flats. While coved, we are usually looking for better dispersment and it might not blast the highs directly over people standing on the deck?

I run two WS485 but often wish I had a 3some for better side to side. (or maybe I should just add more :headbang:)

EarmarkMarine
01-26-2013, 01:29 PM
bsloop,
I'm not sure there is a blanket prescription for approaching tower speaker placement on every tower in respect to so many product variations.
At first glance I might want to place the more directional horn tweeters to the outside for a wider dispersion pattern. But there are many other dynamics that may be conflicting to listen for. For example:
A horizntal array inherently has good vertical dispersion but very poor horizontal dispersion. Most of this is due to what is called 'comb filter effect'. Do a search and read about it on the net because you know if it's on the net then it has to be true. Right? Off-axis wavelengths (certain frequencies = certain wavelengths) coming from separate speakers when the speakers are a given distance apart will be out of phase. This creates erratic peaks and valleys in the tower system amplitude response and at various listening positions. And this is why many tower packages tend to beam down the middle with a pronounced high frequency roll-off outside the wake. The more speakers in the horizontal array, especially with a component set, the larger the problem.
So here is where you can be d*** if you do and d*** if you don't. Per the layout, you really do not know until you trial and error with a little midrange/treble material whether the range played by the upper end of the midbass driver or lower end of the tweeter driver will be most affected. Rotating placement and changing the spacing can make a difference.
In your case, a pair of Rev8s oriented and aimed to the far outside should do wonders. But then with Pro485s, you are not vacating the middle either.

David

MLA
01-26-2013, 01:46 PM
On towers with a arching tower bar, placing the horns inboard gets them as high as possible and as far aft as possible. The main objective here is to limit the amount of horn that radiates down into the boat while the boat is under way, music cranked with rider in tow. If you can see in the pic I posted, the flare of the horn is oval, so it disperses more horizontal then a traditional round horn. This also reduces the the amount that radiates down into the boat, but also aids in the off-axis, out in the flats projection. Also, if the tower has some arch to it, this also adds a little angle to their projection. Now, if the tower bar is straight across, then the above is all out the window :D Also, having a tower setup running in stereo is not typically a huge priority, especially when the main goal is for wake-boarding. Beyond the sun pad, stereo begins to fade. Even at surf range, stereo is not really heard because the rider is off the rear corner of the boat, so most of what he hears is from one chnl.

I would say that there is no "wrong" way to arrange this setup. Due to how they are wired, its simple to swap the position of the mids and horns by just pulling them from the pods.

EarmarkMarine
01-26-2013, 02:12 PM
bsloop,
MLA mentioned something that is very applicable and is worth adding to your situation if you added a pair of Rev8s on swivel collars to the very outside and aimed for wider dispersion outside the wake. I would run that set in summed mono so that you hear all the program material to the far outside extremes versus just left or just right.

David

bsloop
01-27-2013, 12:43 PM
I agree phase canceling can be an issue but the potential gains of spreading the horns can be benificial. As mentioned trial and error are sometimes the final determinators.

I did see the tower was curved but doubt the couple inches would significantly affect cockpit volume levels. I am aware of Kicker's attempt to spread the sound horizontal while reduce cockpit volume levels and theoretically energy wasted to open air above. Having that horizonal spread should allow the mounting at a greater angle or further apart to allow great coverage.
I was not as concerned with "Stereo" sound as simply getting sound directed to the flats where most calm riding, thus rider listening occurs.

A wide dispersion may not be ideal while boating in a populated area where the extra sound may be irritating to neighbors. Listening to tunes is one thing, losing the ability to play them completely or making close enemies can be a greater concern.

A slightly lower volume directly behind the boat is of less concern since there is seldom someone back there plus as mentioned, the extra blasting of swim platform while floating can be a turn off or cause to turn down the system as a whole.

Agreed, the chosen set up is not necessarily wrong, but may not be optimal depending on desired results. Just asking if all options had been considered or experienced.

EarmarkMarine
01-27-2013, 01:14 PM
Many other options. Probably the best sounding option behind the boat is a vertical (over the tower & under the tower) four-speaker (identical) configuration with L & R tight clusters spread apart as far as possible. Swivel collars could be used to fan out the pattern for a) wider dispersion, and b) lower comb filtering. From a cosmetic standpoint though, an over/under is a hard sell.

David

02ProstarSammyD
01-28-2013, 07:14 AM
I hooked mine up parked it with my cans loose and had a friend move them in boat while I was at rope length until they sounded best. Honestly I couldn't tell much of a difference so left them straight. My horns are inside for one simpler reason though......


In a dd I didn't want the horns right in the walkways so I put them over the doghouse. If you've never stood up in front of these things blasting you'll understand later.