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MoMo Mike
04-14-2012, 02:25 PM
So here she is. Not a very good picture of her sitting in the garage. It's Been raining quite a bit here lately, and I want to stay dry while I begin to tinker. I Had to take off tower to get inside my garage, but she fits nicely. I picked her up from PO in central CA. I am the third owner and she has 311 hours. I have been doing quite a bit of reading and searching on this forum. It is amazing how much some of you know. I really enjoyed Maristar-Man's chronicles and the What work did you do today Threads. I have multiple questions and would like to know if I should put them all in this thread ala Maristar-Man or if they should be in seperate threads each with its own searchable name? Thanks in advance to any and all who have already or are about the help me out. Thanks Mike N.

SkiDog
04-14-2012, 02:59 PM
So here she is. Not a very good picture of her sitting in the garage. It's Been raining quite a bit here lately, and I want to stay dry while I begin to tinker. I Had to take off tower to get inside my garage, but she fits nicely. I picked her up from PO in central CA. I am the third owner and she has 311 hours. I have been doing quite a bit of reading and searching on this forum. It is amazing how much some of you know. I really enjoyed Maristar-Man's chronicles and the What work did you do today Threads. I have multiple questions and would like to know if I should put them all in this thread ala Maristar-Man or if they should be in seperate threads each with its own searchable name? Thanks in advance to any and all who have already or are about the help me out. Thanks Mike N.

Start your OWN thread. Hell, its YOUR boat you should have your OWN thread!:D Welcome!

-V-
04-14-2012, 03:45 PM
again, welcome to TT.

not picking on you but where is your spare tire?
And how tall is your garage at the opening?

Jim@BAWS
04-14-2012, 03:56 PM
again, welcome to TT.

not picking on you but where is your spare tire?
And how tall is your garage at the opening?

Spare is an option and not standard on any of the trailers...

-V-
04-14-2012, 04:04 PM
Spare is an option and not standard on any of the trailers...

seeing that it is not brand new, i thought maybe a PO would have put one on that bracket in the pic.........It should be standard as well. Peace of mind for most.

MoMo Mike
04-16-2012, 01:09 AM
again, welcome to TT.

not picking on you but where is your spare tire?
And how tall is your garage at the opening?

V: It did not come with one. I plan on getting one just as you said for the peace of mind it provides. Until then only short trips. Garage opening is just under seven feet. With the tower folded down she is about 8' 6".

MoMo Mike
04-16-2012, 01:38 AM
I think I will Post my questions in this thread and see what happens.

https://picasaweb.google.com/103964622756417533720/BoatPictures#5731293827011645186

mtajpa
04-16-2012, 01:59 AM
Great looking Maristar. You'll love it. Post up plenty of pictures.:)

curtish
04-16-2012, 02:00 AM
Where are you in Norcal?

MoMo Mike
04-16-2012, 02:01 AM
OK here is question #1. What do you think Caused this? PO said it was like that when he got it. He did not have any details. Only Port side is affected. I had the boat "checked out" by a boat mechanic before purchase and he had nothing bad to say about the boat except for a bad water distribution pump which was changed.

The engine compartment divider/partition/what ever you call it. Is a little warped. What is it made of and where can I get the raw materials to make a new one?

I hooked the boat up to water supply the other day and warmed her up to change the oil. Temp got up to just under 160. water was coming out of both sides of exhaust and there was not appreciable temp difference between the manifolds. How hot should they get? Mine were pretty warm.

MoMo Mike
04-16-2012, 02:02 AM
West Sacramento.

MoMo Mike
04-16-2012, 02:03 AM
Great looking Maristar. You'll love it. Post up plenty of pictures.:)

Thanks I will. I have a bunch more coming

mtajpa
04-16-2012, 02:07 AM
Mine came with the same thing it is possibly from PO having a fat sac in the locker putting pressure against the divider and causing it to rest against the manifold. Or it just got real hot. Manifolds get pretty warm especially in the summer. Your motor should run right at 160 if it ever gets to 180 while your running start looking. First place to check would be the screen in the trans cooler. It can get clogged with weeds and stuff including left over pieces from a failed impeller.

MoMo Mike
04-16-2012, 02:17 AM
So It looks like i have the dreaded LTR belt alignment issues. In reading through other threads and with a few PMs I think I am on the right track to getting this figured out. Thanks Jeff D.
My first clue was that the belt looked a little beat up. Then I started wondering why the mechanic I paid to look things over for me did not replace it.
Upon further inspection, of my own, i noticed the belt alignment issue between the alternator and the other two pulleys.

In the mean time I went a bought a new belt and noticed that it has six grooves and the one on my boat has five. Indemar 725026 (Supposed to have six). It would appear that some smart person removed one of the grooves on the belt to make it work.

The last picture is supposed to show the alignment issue with the water pump pulley being to close to the engine or front of the boat whichever you prefer.

As of now I am following Jeff D's lead and have the replacement pulley ordered. I will get it swapped out and get a belt that fits. Hopefully that will end this issue for me.

MoMo Mike
04-16-2012, 02:18 AM
Mine came with the same thing it is possibly from PO having a fat sac in the locker putting pressure against the divider and causing it to rest against the manifold. Or it just got real hot. Manifolds get pretty warm especially in the summer. Your motor should run right at 160 if it ever gets to 180 while your running start looking. First place to check would be the screen in the trans cooler. It can get clogged with weeds and stuff including left over pieces from a failed impeller.

How much space should there be between the manifold and the divider?

MoMo Mike
04-16-2012, 02:29 AM
You guessed it PO did not get the recall work done on the alternator either. In first looking around the inside of my engine compartment I found a large bolt, a smaller nut and a lock washer. I was reading Maristar-Mans Adventures at the time and was inspired to go find where these extra part were from.

The Alternator was the source of the washer and smaller nut. Further searches would educate me on the need of a stronger support for the alternator and the wonders of sheered off bolts enjoyed by others.

I have the upgraded bracket coming from a dealer in Sac. I think it cost about $27 with shipping. My question for you all is do I need a new alternator????
I think mine is original. I have in the mean time snugged a washer and nut back onto the empty bolt.

MoMo Mike
04-16-2012, 02:55 AM
PO had a pretty nice stereo installed. Looks and sounds nice. I don't know anything about stereo equipment. With my possible need to get a new alternator, I began to wonder about the stereo system and its charging needs.
Stereo consists of: 2 amps, an EQ, 2 subs (12 in), 6 in boat speakers (5 in round?), 4 speaker on tower (6x9?)
Let me know what you guys think about needing a new alternator, and if so, I need recommendations. Keep in mind I have no metal Fab capabilities other than a little grinding. So bolt on, or close to it, would be best.
Last question: I am confused on whether or not an alternator is supposed to recharge the batteries while the engine is running. I have searched this and get more confused the more I read. If the alt does recharge the batteries will all the batteries in my set up be charged equally or some more than others? How does the charge get there? Back through Pos lead at starter then follows Pos all the way around? :confused:
Thanks.

Sorry if diagram is confusing. Three batteries. One isolated for start up and two aux for the stereo and everything else. I Think :confused:

-V-
04-16-2012, 09:04 AM
do you have one or two batteries? Drawing looks like two but pic shows one.

I have the same issue with my sideboards in the engine compartment, it is on my list of things to get done but it is not very high on the list.

As far as your alt. pull the positive cable off the battery while it is running. measure the voltage coming our of your alt. turn some things on while it is running and measure again. if the voltage drop is high then change it out.

How are you running it while it is on the trailer? I do not use the fake a lake thing they sell. I use a 5-gallon bucket, that-a-way I can see if it is not taking in water or if it doesn't have enough water. I even tried (before) hooking the water hose up straight to the intake on the impeller but the impeller would make a loud whine if i wasn't at least about 800rpm and it would crinkle it at high rpm's.

milkmania
04-16-2012, 09:16 AM
Sorry if diagram is confusing. Three batteries. One isolated for start up and two aux for the stereo and everything else. I Think :confused:

do you have one or two batteries? Drawing looks like two but pic shows one.




need more coffee :D

-V-
04-16-2012, 09:30 AM
need more coffee :D

three batteries? holy cow. so what is in the diagram then if those are not batteries?

mikeg205
04-16-2012, 09:34 AM
what area of the boat is the the #1 pic port side floor?. Slight seepage looks like PO got used some permatex copper gasket sealant. http://www.skidim.com/prodinfo.asp?number=OSC992-G is a link to the gasekt. Would also check impeller and thermostat...see if it was ever changed.

mtajpa
04-16-2012, 11:31 AM
"Last question: I am confused on whether or not an alternator is supposed to recharge the batteries while the engine is running. I have searched this and get more confused the more I read. If the alt does recharge the batteries will all the batteries in my set up be charged equally or some more than others? How does the charge get there? Back through Pos lead at starter then follows Pos all the way around? "

Yes your alternator will charge the batteries, however the alternator is rated in amps if your combined load (stereo full blast at idle) is greater than the alternator output then your batteries will not be charged. The alternator output voltage at the battery should be appx. 13.3 when running. If its not above the static battery voltage then the alt will not be charging. Put a voltmeter on your batteries while the boat is running no need to disconnect anything.

When the engine is running the battery isolator (just a coil and contact) will be energized and closed connecting your stereo batteries to your engine battery allowing the alt. to charge all three batteries. When the key is off the the isolator (contact) should be open. This should allow only the 2 stereo batteries to power the stereo to avoid draining the starting battery. Extremely low charged batteries should be charged with a charger not just by running.

As far as the broken ear on the alternator well it won,t get any better. If you have to replace it because of this then you should up grade the alt. including the charging lead from the Alternator. Big Fender washer and a nut might get you by.

MoMo Mike
04-16-2012, 11:52 AM
do you have one or two batteries? Drawing looks like two but pic shows one.

I have the same issue with my sideboards in the engine compartment, it is on my list of things to get done but it is not very high on the list.

As far as your alt. pull the positive cable off the battery while it is running. measure the voltage coming our of your alt. turn some things on while it is running and measure again. if the voltage drop is high then change it out.

How are you running it while it is on the trailer? I do not use the fake a lake thing they sell. I use a 5-gallon bucket, that-a-way I can see if it is not taking in water or if it doesn't have enough water. I even tried (before) hooking the water hose up straight to the intake on the impeller but the impeller would make a loud whine if i wasn't at least about 800rpm and it would crinkle it at high rpm's.

I spliced a hose connection into the raw water intake hose. Only cost me a few bucks and I dont have to deal with the bucket.
Sounds like I need to get myself a volt meter, and more importantly learn how to use it. :o
I forgot to mention that the dash volt meter shows really high output. The gauge is pegged. Not sure if this is the gauge being whacky or if the output is really high. Thoughts?

MoMo Mike
04-16-2012, 12:05 PM
what area of the boat is the the #1 pic port side floor?. Slight seepage looks like PO got used some permatex copper gasket sealant. http://www.skidim.com/prodinfo.asp?number=OSC992-G is a link to the gasekt. Would also check impeller and thermostat...see if it was ever changed.

mgorczak1: if you are talking about the picture of the exhaust riser yes that is on the port side. The stuff that looks like seepage is melted carpet I think. I will hold onto that link just in case though. Thanks.
Yeah I checked the impeller. -V- helped me figure out how to get the raw water pump off. Everything checked out OK. :D
Next I need to figure out where the thermostat is and how to get to it. :confused:

mikeg205
04-16-2012, 12:21 PM
Dang, melted carpet? You can find your thermostat -- its where the hoses from your exhaust manifold meet - right about water pump. Melted carpet? that would freak me out... The outside part of my exhaust manifold and riser get's hot but I can still always touch them...

MoMo Mike
04-16-2012, 12:27 PM
Yes your alternator will charge the batteries, however the alternator is rated in amps if your combined load (stereo full blast at idle) is greater than the alternator output then your batteries will not be charged. The alternator output voltage at the battery should be appx. 13.3 when running. If its not above the static battery voltage then the alt will not be charging. Put a voltmeter on your batteries while the boat is running no need to disconnect anything.

When the engine is running the battery isolator (just a coil and contact) will be energized and closed connecting your stereo batteries to your engine battery allowing the alt. to charge all three batteries. When the key is off the the isolator (contact) should be open. This should allow only the 2 stereo batteries to power the stereo to avoid draining the starting battery. Extremely low charged batteries should be charged with a charger not just by running.

As far as the broken ear on the alternator well it won,t get any better. If you have to replace it because of this then you should up grade the alt. including the charging lead from the Alternator. Big Fender washer and a nut might get you by.

Electricity is something that I have never really wrapped my head around. Even simple wiring makes me uncomfortable. So thanks for your explanation.
So can you elaborate on where/how to put volt meter on batteries. Is it as simple as red to red and black to black? If so then how do I measure alt output?

When it comes to charging my batteries I have been putting a charger on the one isolated battery to charge it. Then I charge one of the two aux batteries with the thought that they will both see the charge because they are connected. Is that right? :confused:
I hate feeling like an idiot.

Jeff d
04-16-2012, 12:33 PM
That alternator looks even raunchier than mine did right before it started to fail. My ear was broken off like that too. Voltage started fluctuating a lot between 12-13. I ended up going to a cheap 105 amp alternator before it failed completely. The install was mildly difficult. I had to clearance the bracket with a grinder and add supplemental, larger wire to carry the extra current.

All of the information is in here:
http://www.mastercraft.com/teamtalk/showthread.php?t=42422&highlight=alternator

MoMo Mike
04-16-2012, 12:35 PM
Dang, melted carpet? You can find your thermostat -- its where the hoses from your exhaust manifold meet - right about water pump. Melted carpet? that would freak me out... The outside part of my exhaust manifold and riser get's hot but I can still always touch them...

I hear ya man. It makes me nervous. I have visions of family fun ruined by boat on fire. Insert women and children screaming and there I am looking like a moron. :shocked:
If I remember right, there is a cover in that area with four bolts on the top. Two hoses come into this area from each side right?
So just take off those bolts, open her up and there's the thermostat? Am I looking for anything specific? I have never seen a bad or failing thermostat so I am not sure what to look for.

mtajpa
04-16-2012, 12:38 PM
Place the voltmeter leads 1 on Positive side (RED) and 1 to negative (Black) be sure to set the voltmeter for volts not ohms. You voltage you will be reading will be the static voltage. should be around 12.8 volts. Start the boat at idle and you should see the voltage increase to around 13.3. max output of the alt would be around 14.4 volts.

Yes from your drawing the two stereo batteries will charge as they are in parallel all the time. Start battery will be isolated from the stereo batt when key is off.

Jeff d
04-16-2012, 12:39 PM
BTW that alternator, in addition to being nasty and likely to fail, is only 51 amps. So, not really up to the task of running a bunch of extra audio equipment or charging 3 depleted batteries.

Also, you likely won't be able to have your existing alternator rebuilt for a reasonable price due to the physical damage. I'd grab one of the two that I listed in that thread and add an extra 10 gauge wire from the charging post to the + post on the starter solenoid.

Depending on your needs you may want to consider going to just a single deep cycle and a cranking battery. Unless you want to sit there and let your stereo blast for hours the second deep cycle isn't really necessary.

MoMo Mike
04-16-2012, 12:48 PM
That alternator looks even raunchier than mine did right before it started to fail. My ear was broken off like that too. Voltage started fluctuating a lot between 12-13. I ended up going to a cheap 105 amp alternator before it failed completely. The install was mildly difficult. I had to clearance the bracket with a grinder and add supplemental, larger wire to carry the extra current.

All of the information is in here:
http://www.mastercraft.com/teamtalk/showthread.php?t=42422&highlight=alternator

Jeff: I would love to see some pictures of your alternator install including where on the bracket you had to grind/Modify. I am assuming you are talking about the bracket that attaches to the water pump on one end and the upper alternator support on the other. Is that right?
Also the wiring freaks me out a bit. I have read posts about the 3 vs 1 wire attachment and troubles others have been having. Heck I am copying your belt alignment fix, I might as well copy your alternator too. :D

Jeff d
04-16-2012, 01:00 PM
Also the wiring freaks me out a bit. I have read posts about the 3 vs 1 wire attachment and troubles others have been having.

I didn't do a 3 to 1 wire change. It's a 3 wire externally regulated to a 3 wire internally regulated change. The small gauge factory ground wire goes unused with the new internally regulated alternator. The ignition switch activated power wire does get used though (i.e. my new alternator is not self energizing).

If you got the externally regulated 90 amp Leese-Neville one it would probably be plug and play with the exception of needing to beef up the charging wire.

I'll have to take some pictures.

MoMo Mike
04-16-2012, 01:09 PM
The only down side to the 90 amp Leese-Neville is the price tag. Had a dealer quote me $275 for the 70 amp. Don't want to know how much the 90 would be. Your $70 option is sounding a lot better.
So why change from 3 batteries to 2? Just because its overkill and it would make the system more simple/less expensive to maintain?
Thanks.

Jeff d
04-16-2012, 01:31 PM
The only down side to the 90 amp Leese-Neville is the price tag. Had a dealer quote me $275 for the 70 amp. Don't want to know how much the 90 would be.

You can get it for $200 here:
http://www.spidermarine.com/ShowItem/105186%20New%20Motorola,%20Leece%20Neville%2012v%2 090%20Amp%20Alternator.aspx


Your $70 option is sounding a lot better.
Yeah, I'm happy with it now that it's done. There were a lot of other things I was working on at the time that may have made the alternator project seem more frustrating/difficult. Now, when I recount the project it doesn't sound that bad.


So why change from 3 batteries to 2? Just because its overkill and it would make the system more simple/less expensive to maintain?
Yes, if you don't need the extra runtime it's not worth having money tied up in a third battery. By comparison I have a moderately "bumpin' sys'em" (900 watts RMS) in my boat and I still just have a single dual purpose battery. I'd like dual batteries simply for redundancy but I have sufficient runtime for my needs with just one battery. Assuming everything is setup correctly by the previous owner you could just leave it as is until one of the deep cycle batteries fail.

MoMo Mike
04-17-2012, 01:34 AM
I want to repost one of my questions that was not answered already and thank you all for your help and replies so far.
So the engine compartment divider that is melted and warped in my boat. What are they made of? Has anyone rebuilt theirs? Where would I find the materials?

MoMo Mike
04-17-2012, 01:45 AM
So here are a few pictures of corrosion that I have found in and around my engine compartment. Should I be concerned? What can I do to control/prevent/retard this process? Also some of my many battery cables appear to be affected primarily where there is a break in the sheath at the end of each cable. Is there a sealant or something that can be used here?

mtajpa
04-17-2012, 01:59 AM
I want to repost one of my questions that was not answered already and thank you all for your help and replies so far.
So the engine compartment divider that is melted and warped in my boat. What are they made of? Has anyone rebuilt theirs? Where would I find the materials?

Not sure what the material is called but it is not easy to find and comes in large sheets I believe. If you find some let me know I need the exact same piece.

mtajpa
04-17-2012, 02:02 AM
Clean with a brush and coat with wd40 try to keep the engine compartment dry as possible. Don't close the hatch when you store it leave it open a couple of inches to let moisture evaporate.

scharette
04-17-2012, 08:26 AM
i think the plastic is HDPE
http://www.usplastic.com/catalog/item.aspx?itemid=23869&catid=705

mikeg205
04-17-2012, 09:36 AM
+1 on the corrosion cleanup and WD 40. I also put on some ospho on some surfaces to make sure I got all the rust off. http://www.jamestowndistributors.com/userportal/show_product.do?pid=557&engine=adwords!6456&keyword=ospho

any left over rust that is just beginning will react with above product - then you can paint or coat with oil or wd-40.

Regarding the sheeting I have read others hear using Star Board... http://www.jamestowndistributors.com/userportal/search.do?freeText=star%20board&resultPref=all&page=GRID&history=h3wzmdsj%7Cother%7CresultPref~all%5Epage~G RID%5EfreeText~marine+board%5EprodPage~15%5Euser_a tt_name0~UserType%5Euser_att_value0~NewUser

MoMo Mike
05-04-2012, 02:41 AM
So I have been busy trying to get the engine compartment issues solved. Here are a few picture updates. I ordered the Alt Bracket from a local dealer. He did not like the part number at first, but with a little looking around he figured out that it was the right one. Here is a picture of the part with part number and then an installed picture.

MoMo Mike
05-04-2012, 02:55 AM
Next I tried to solve my Belt Alignment issues Using Jeff D's post on the subject as my guide. I ordered the same pulley from the site he posted and it came within a few days. I noticed immediately when trying to install it that the center hole was to small to fit. It was pretty easy to drill out. Next I noticed that my alignment issues were now WORSE. Way worse. There was probably a 5/16" discrepancy between the water pump pulley and the others. You can see from the second photo that the "nose" on this new pulley will place it closer to the engine, and I needed my pulley to go the other way. It was at this point that i remembered Jeff D's Problem was opposite mine in that his belt was riding to close to the engine and mine to far away.:eek3: Now what do I do?

MoMo Mike
05-04-2012, 03:07 AM
Well at first i tried to fabricate a spacer of some sort. After failing miserably, the thought occurred to me that there has to be a spacer designer for this application. A quick google search and $7 later the part was on the way. It is a set of three spacers of differing thickness that can be combined to achieve 5/16" of spacing. How convenient!!! A quick trip to Lowes for longer bolts and new lock washers followed shortly. She bolted together without any fuss at all. Next I stopped at Auto Zone and got a belt that was shorter by an inch to compensate for the smaller pulley diameter. In hind site the $7 spacer set is probably all I needed to fix my alignment issue. Now that it is over, I am glad I followed Jeff D's example because i much prefer the new pulley with its shouldered design, and lets face it, tinkering is fun.
Thanks Jeff D!!

MoMo Mike
05-04-2012, 03:19 AM
Well the next order of business was a trip to the lake for our first ride. Everything went great. No Issues at all:). Well that is not entirely true. My shaft packing was leaking like crazy. Don't worry new packing is on the way.
List of outstanding issues:
Gauge work: volt meter and gas gauge are not working properly.
Replace shaft packing
Recover Trailer bunks
Restore Gel Coat

Thanks to everyone for all your help so far.

Jeff d
05-04-2012, 12:01 PM
Not sure what's different between our setups but my pulleys looked just like the two you have there and the new one bolted right up and solved my alignment issues in like 5 mins. Good find on the spacers. Oddly the spacers would have only made mine worse as i needed a deeper "dish" pulley. Maybe in addition to LTRs having one of a few different water pump pulleys there are also different crank pulleys in the mix.