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JMann
07-10-2011, 12:30 AM
I just tried to start my 1991 PS 190 with the 240hp indmar engine. It has been sitting for 6 months and now has a gas leak from near the carb. Here is the problem.

In the picture the silver tube will slide right to left about a 1/4" and will spin. It only leaks when I am turning it over. It leaks from where the tube is going into either end. When I pushed the tube to the right gas leaks from the left (at the arrow) and when I push it to the left gas leaks from the right (at the arrow).

How do I fix the gas leak so I can get back out on the water ASAP?

JLeuck64
07-10-2011, 01:20 AM
That tube has o-rings on each end to seal it. Going to need to, at least, partially disassemble the Carb to replace them. But since you will need an overhaul gasket set... might as well overhaul the Carb.

woobiedmd
07-10-2011, 07:51 AM
I agree. Just went through this with the same carb. You have to take off the front bowl to replace the o rings which means you will trash that gasket. Might as well replace as many gaskets as possible.

east tx skier
07-10-2011, 11:59 AM
When you put it all back together, don't over torque the fuel line connection to the carb or it will leak, too.

JMann
07-10-2011, 12:45 PM
Can I leave the carb on the engine remove the front bowl replace those seals and re assemble without removing the carb? Or do I need to remove the carb from the engine? Are the seals something I can buy at NAPA and replace just the seals or should I order the whole "renew" kit. I can get a marine renew kit at JEGS for about $40. Or should I buy it at Skidim?
Thanks in advance for your help.
So the tube should slide a little and spin?

TNPIG
07-10-2011, 02:04 PM
When you put it all back together, don't over torque the fuel line connection to the carb or it will leak, too.

East Tx Skier, If you look above where his left index finger appears to be, I have a little bit of fuel leaking from the other end of that line which I'm guessing goes to the fuel pump. Is this what you're talking about leaking if overtorqued? Think I can just loosen it up some on both ends and re-tighten a bit? Skidim has the whole line for like 15 bucks.

j.mccreight@hotmail.com
07-10-2011, 02:48 PM
Can I leave the carb on the engine remove the front bowl replace those seals and re assemble without removing the carb? Or do I need to remove the carb from the engine? Are the seals something I can buy at NAPA and replace just the seals or should I order the whole "renew" kit. I can get a marine renew kit at JEGS for about $40. Or should I buy it at Skidim?
Thanks in advance for your help.
So the tube should slide a little and spin?

You "could" leave carburetor mounted to change the o-rings but you will spill fuel all over the engine, automotive kits will not have the same gaskets as a marine kit, but you might be able to get by with an automotive kit and scavenge the gaskets you need. I tried using a automotive kit last year and got lucky with the part I needed. I would remove the rear bowl and work that way so you don't have to worry about the fuel line, apply a little vaseline to the new o-rings will make assembly easier...

j.mccreight@hotmail.com
07-10-2011, 02:50 PM
East Tx Skier, If you look above where his left index finger appears to be, I have a little bit of fuel leaking from the other end of that line which I'm guessing goes to the fuel pump. Is this what you're talking about leaking if overtorqued? Think I can just loosen it up some on both ends and re-tighten a bit? Skidim has the whole line for like 15 bucks.

Yes it is real easy to overtorque the fuel line where it enters the carburetor. If yours is leaking try loosening the line up and snug it back down, if it still leaks then replace the hard line and snug down...

JMann
07-10-2011, 05:47 PM
Can I buy any rebuild kit for a holley 4160 marine carb? We have a local marine speed shop I will call tomorrow to see if they have a rebuild kit and what it cost to do. How much should I expect to pay to have it rebuilt? I can't find a carb rebuild kit on skidim, do they have they them, if not where should I buy it from?
I may try to do it myself if it's to expensive I have a friend that can help. How long does it usually take?

east tx skier
07-10-2011, 06:00 PM
East Tx Skier, If you look above where his left index finger appears to be, I have a little bit of fuel leaking from the other end of that line which I'm guessing goes to the fuel pump. Is this what you're talking about leaking if overtorqued? Think I can just loosen it up some on both ends and re-tighten a bit? Skidim has the whole line for like 15 bucks.

Correct. Get the correct torque specs for that fitting and do not exceed them. You can just back it of and retighten.

east tx skier
07-10-2011, 06:01 PM
Can I buy any rebuild kit for a holley 4160 marine carb? We have a local marine speed shop I will call tomorrow to see if they have a rebuild kit and what it cost to do. How much should I expect to pay to have it rebuilt? I can't find a carb rebuild kit on skidim, do they have they them, if not where should I buy it from?
I may try to do it myself if it's to expensive I have a friend that can help. How long does it usually take?

They used to have them. Years ago, I paid 175 plus the kit. I imagine the labor has gone up since then.

heath124
07-10-2011, 06:11 PM
You can get a universal holley rebuild kit from auto zone or advanced auto for $30 and it will have everything you need.

JMann
07-10-2011, 07:08 PM
I have been doing a lot of searches on here today. It sounds like the rebuild is pretty easy if you follow the directions. I couldn't find any directions on here from someone else doing it (similar to the ei upgrade step by step) Is there one, or can you send me a link with some detailed instructions?
I think I will try to do it myself this week. how long should it take 3 or 4 hours once it's off the boat?

TLR67
07-10-2011, 07:17 PM
looks like I will be rebuilding mine this week as well as getting a new fuel Pump... I found this site that is pretty good and detailed... Great tips for the 4160..

http://www.fordmuscle.com/archives/1999/12/holley/index.php#mid

j.mccreight@hotmail.com
07-10-2011, 08:03 PM
You can get a universal holley rebuild kit from auto zone or advanced auto for $30 and it will have everything you need.

The automotive rebuild kit does not have everything that a marine Holley 4160 needs

j.mccreight@hotmail.com
07-10-2011, 08:07 PM
The Holley Renew kit you need is Holley part number 703-47
Summitracing has them in stock for $37 http://www.summitracing.com/parts/HLY-703-47/

j.mccreight@hotmail.com
07-10-2011, 08:16 PM
Here is Holley's rebuild sheet link, sorry don't know how to add a pdf


http://www.holley.com/data/Products/Technical/199R9808.pdf
http://www.holley.com/data/Products/Technical/199R10013.pdf

j.mccreight@hotmail.com
07-10-2011, 08:23 PM
east tx skier could you add these two links for the holley rebuild to your FAQ's

east tx skier
07-10-2011, 09:20 PM
Will do.

10char.

heath124
07-10-2011, 11:11 PM
The automotive rebuild kit does not have everything that a marine Holley 4160 needs

His last statement said "How do I fix this gas leak to get back on the water ASAP" and yes it does have everything he needs to do that. Which is 2 small O-rings

JMann
07-10-2011, 11:38 PM
ASAP is relative. I know it's going to be a week or so, I want to do it correct. I think last night I was excited to get on the water. I have a 2 year old and 4 month old and today was the first day I was going to take the whole family out on the water. That didn't happen. Now I need to get it fixed correct so I can get them on the water sometime this summer. I am going to buy the rebuild kit and give it a shot. I am pretty mechanically inclined and have a friend that has done car carbs before that will help. Hopefully I can be on the water soon.
I will post how my rebuild goes and let you all know

JMann
07-11-2011, 12:11 AM
The Holley Renew kit you need is Holley part number 703-47
Summitracing has them in stock for $37 http://www.summitracing.com/parts/HLY-703-47/

Thanks for the kit. That is the same one I thought I needed from my research. It is nice to hvae confirmation that I was on the right track. I am going to call my local shop and see if they have one. if not i will order it tomorrow.

heath124
07-11-2011, 07:34 AM
Sorry for the confusion. I guess everyones ASAP is different from mine. If you ever see it in my post the wife and kids are sitting in the truck waiting on me to fix the boat or Im stuck in the middle of the lake needing info. I was under the impression you were trying to go to the water right then and your day was done over 2 O-rings.

JMann
07-13-2011, 07:03 PM
So I picked up the renew kit this morning for $38. I am going to try to get this complete this weekend and get back on the water. Any tricks or tips for rebuilding the carb? This will be my first one.

j.mccreight@hotmail.com
07-13-2011, 07:10 PM
Just be sure to clean everything good and pay attention holleys are pretty straight forward

Lakeview
07-13-2011, 09:00 PM
the transfer tube o rings are an easy fix and can be had from Summit or Jeg's,$2.99 for two,I also am in the process of replacing the front bowl gasket and metering block gasket with the newer blue material.on my '90 indmar prostar.The ethanol gas ate completely through the cork gasket in the past four years! Check your float adjustment while you have the carb apart.I also recommend buying a pack of nylon washers for the bowl bolts,pack of 10 is available from Jeg's.Good luck:)

JMann
07-24-2011, 05:51 PM
I just got the carb off and have a friend that has rebuilt carb before that is going to help me this week. I am changing the oil now and while getting to the drain hose I noticed the red battery cable that runs through the bilge has a crack in it and rust on it.

After further investigation it is the throttle cable, which wraps up the back up over the exhaust and to the carb and PP. I guess I will be calling SkiDim in the am to order one.

thatsmrmastercraft
07-24-2011, 09:02 PM
I just got the carb off and have a friend that has rebuilt carb before that is going to help me this week. I am changing the oil now and while getting to the drain hose I noticed the red battery cable that runs through the bilge has a crack in it and rust on it.

After further investigation it is the throttle cable, which wraps up the back up over the exhaust and to the carb and PP. I guess I will be calling SkiDim in the am to order one.

Nice to find that before it seized up.

JMann
07-25-2011, 01:00 AM
Nice to find that before it seized up.

How hard is it to replace? Looks pretty straight forward. Any advice or hints would be appreciated.

JMann
08-12-2011, 07:25 PM
Finally got the carb rebuilt but haven't bolted it on. With kids, wedding and birthdays I haven't had chance. Hopefully I will get to it Saturday and see how I did. The guy that helped me said it should bolt on and run like a champ.

I called skidim about the control cable that is showing wear and they said I need to get the length. Anyone know what length U Flex control cable I need for my 1991 PS 190? I don't want to have to pull it out until I have the new one in hand.

JMann
08-13-2011, 06:02 PM
So I just finished installing the carb. When I was getting the fuel line in I pushed down on these and now they move as if on a spring. Before the rebuild they seemed locked open and wouldn't move if pushed on now I can push them closed. I took the carb back off and looked for something to be broken but everything seemed fine. Does anyone know should these open and close with your finger or should they locked open? The boat started in the drive way and run as good as ever. What do you guys think?
PS you guys were right the carb rebuild was pretty easy, thanks for all your help so far.

Cloaked
08-13-2011, 06:08 PM
So I just finished installing the carb. When I was getting the fuel line in I pushed down on these and now they move as if on a spring. Before the rebuild they seemed locked open and wouldn't move if pushed on now I can push them closed. I took the carb back off and looked for something to be broken but everything seemed fine. Does anyone know should these open and close with your finger or should they locked open? The boat started in the drive way and run as good as ever. What do you guys think?
PS you guys were right the carb rebuild was pretty easy, thanks for all your help so far.
Choke plate. It is operated by the electric choke that is attached to the carb. It has a specific setting that allows the choke to work in the manner intended. .

From their site of technical documents showing the correct settings and responses.

http://holley.com/data/Products/Technical/199R9808.pdf


.

woobiedmd
08-13-2011, 06:14 PM
. Cloaked is correct. That thing is the choke plate and is fully closed for a cold start. The round black thing on the side of the carb is the electric choke(spring). After you start the engine, the choke(spring) heats up by 12V and gradually opens the choke. If you want to see it operate., turn the key to on with a cold engine and watch it gradually open as the electric choke heats up, has nothing to do with the temp of the engine.

JMann
08-13-2011, 06:17 PM
Thanks but that doesn't tell me what I need to know. I have the choke hooked up and didn't adjust it. I am wondering if those butterflies should seem locked open or if they should move as if on a spring. I am wonder if when I was pushing on it to get the fuel line in (which I didn't realize I was doing and shouldn't have done) I striped something inside the choke and now I need to replace that. I am hoping someone can walk out to there and see if they move freely or not.

Cloaked
08-13-2011, 06:22 PM
It will move with a push of a fingertip. It's not hurt. However You need to have the choke setting adjusted properly for the choke to do it's thing. Read the link I posted.

JMann
08-13-2011, 06:25 PM
. Cloaked is correct. That thing is the choke plate and is fully closed for a cold start. The round black thing on the side of the carb is the electric choke(spring). After you start the engine, the choke(spring) heats up by 12V and gradually opens the choke. If you want to see it operate., turn the key to on with a cold engine and watch it gradually open as the electric choke heats up, has nothing to do with the temp of the engine.

So it shouldn't have been stuck open, should it seem to move freely as if on a spring? It was open when I took it off the boat and never moved. I will let it cool and go back out and look at it. It should be closed when I go back to look when it's cold?

JMann
08-13-2011, 06:29 PM
It will move with a push of a fingertip. It's not hurt. However You need to have the choke setting adjusted properly for the choke to do it's thing. Read the link I posted.

Thanks. I have read through the holley pdf you sent. I am hoping it's going to be OK. I didn't move the choke adjustment during the rebuild (it was a limited rebuild only what was necessary) I am hoping it was just gummed up with some residue and now is moving correctly.

When the boat is warmed up and I am driving around should they be fully open or closed?

Thanks for all your help and the quick reply.

Cloaked
08-13-2011, 09:06 PM
Thanks. I have read through the holley pdf you sent. I am hoping it's going to be OK. I didn't move the choke adjustment during the rebuild (it was a limited rebuild only what was necessary) I am hoping it was just gummed up with some residue and now is moving correctly.

When the boat is warmed up and I am driving around should they be fully open or closed?

Thanks for all your help and the quick reply.Your choke plate should be open under normal operating temperature. A rebuild can affect the choke position if indeed a gasket was leaking, etc.

Patience. The 4160 is a decent carb once you mess with it a bit.

JMann
08-28-2011, 04:41 PM
Thanks everyone for all the advice and help. Rebuilding the carb wasn't that hard at all. I took the boat out today and it ran like a champ.
Wanted to let you everything worked out. I haven't done the control cable let. I need to figure out what length and order it.

thatsmrmastercraft
08-28-2011, 11:19 PM
Thanks everyone for all the advice and help. Rebuilding the carb wasn't that hard at all. I took the boat out today and it ran like a champ.
Wanted to let you everything worked out. I haven't done the control cable let. I need to figure out what length and order it.

Great to hear the rebuild went well. It's especially rewarding when it all works like it is supposed to. Job well done:toast:

JMann
09-29-2011, 02:34 PM
To follow up and hopefully get some advice. Unfortunately this is only the 2nd time on the boat since I did the rebuild and have a couple of questions.
The boat seemed to run a little rough and idle high. It ran fine and pulled strong just seemed a little rougher than in the past. Here are a couple things I did besides the carb.

1) I replaced the spark plugs with Autolite 24's. I took in the old plugs which where NGK and the guy at Napa said they compared to an autolite 23 which is a cooler running plug. I went with the 24 on the recommendation from here.

2) I took out all the foam in the engine box because it was falling off. could this make it seem to run rough?

3) The idle is at 750rpm and in the past it was 680rpm.

What do you guys think? Should go back to the old plugs and see if that slows the idle and smoothes it out a little or leave the plugs and adjust the idle on the carb?

Any advice would be great.

j.mccreight@hotmail.com
09-29-2011, 03:00 PM
changing plugs should not have changed your idle speed, maybe you got a plug wire or two crossed when you tuned it up. that would cause both of your concerns. if your wires arent crossed then you need to figure out whats causing the roughness and adjust your idle warmed up and in neutral. if it ran fine before you messed with it then it runs bad, logic would seem to dictate it has to do with something you messed with...

JMann
09-29-2011, 03:25 PM
I agree it probably has to do with something I messed with. I could have crossed my #6 and #7 spark plug wires when I changed the plugs. Is this the correct firing order?

j.mccreight@hotmail.com
09-29-2011, 08:24 PM
Yes, thats the correct firing order.

thatsmrmastercraft
09-30-2011, 10:22 AM
If you do indeed have your wires crossed and experienced a good backfire through the carb, it may have taken out your power valve (been there). If so, you will be running full rich - won't take long to figure out if that's the case.

JMann
09-30-2011, 11:59 AM
I don't think I have the wire backwards. I was talking to a friend and he said you would have known if they were switched, e.i. no power and backfiring. I ran pretty well just seemed a little rough. I think I just need to dial in the carb a little better.

rjracin240
09-30-2011, 12:53 PM
Correct. Get the correct torque specs for that fitting and do not exceed them. You can just back it of and retighten.

Yes it is real easy to overtorque the fuel line where it enters the carburetor. If yours is leaking try loosening the line up and snug it back down, if it still leaks then replace the hard line and snug down...

The other area you want to insure the correct torques is applied is to the bolts for the fuel bowls back and front. In the PCM Manual for this engine as found on this site it quotes a TQ of 10 inch pounds let me repeat so there is no mistake 10 inch pounds not foot pounds!!! My suggestion is to step TQ it meaning that you take it to 5 inch pounds stabilize torque meaning that you go around once you have torqued the nuts and verify that they dont turn anymore. Then take it up to final torque, and once again insure the TQ is stabilized. The socket is a 5/16" for these bolts, and insure they have the seal on them.

Regarding your question about how to replace the o-rings on the fuel tube, yes you can do this work with carb installed in place. If done while in place and you go from secondary side you dont even have to worry about torqueing the fuel inlet line. My suggestion is removing the back float bowl, depending on the year of your carb there might be 3/32 clutch head screws holding the gasket in place with a plate. A smaller flat tip should work removing and reinstalling the screws. Yes fuel will leak from the bowl when breaking it loose from carb, place a rag or some other form of absorbent material under the bowl when GENTLY removing it.

Hope this helps and get you back out on the water.

In my haste to help out a fellow boater did not realize the thread started out almost a couple of months ago when I wrote my reply

JMann
04-19-2012, 03:08 PM
In order to avoid starting another thread I am going to continue this one. I have deteremined from talking to friends that know carbs and motors the reason it was running rough last season was that it was probably adjusted over the years to run smoother as the seals detiorated. I think I only have to tune the carb up and it will smooth everything out.
Does anyone have a step by step guide for dumbies to tuning the 4160 carb they could post or e-mail? Pictures would help so I know I am twisting the correct screws. It runs now and I don't want to make it worse by starting to turn the wrong adjusts, etc.

j.mccreight@hotmail.com
04-19-2012, 03:53 PM
The proper way to tune a carburetor is with a vacuum gauge hooked to to read full manifold vacuum, yes you can use pcv port with an adapter. The 2 small screws on the near the front and on the side of carburetor is the mixture screws. First turn screws all the way in then back them out 1.5 turns then you can adjust these 2 screws evenly in or out to achieve the maximum vacuum. All this is done with engine running, warmed up and in neutral, then finally verify idle speed is within specs.

Here is a nice rebuild walkthrough
http://www.fordmuscle.com/archives/1999/12/holley/index.php

j.mccreight@hotmail.com
04-19-2012, 08:00 PM
A pic of mixture screw
and a holley video of using the gauge, some info is not applicable to your carburator.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BZy2YiKF3Mg&feature=relmfu
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UPGLUsW5ZeE&feature=relmfu

JMann
04-20-2012, 03:25 PM
Thanks for the replies. It sounds pretty simple. I will give it a shot probably should be done in the water and not in the drive way?

glgisler
04-20-2012, 03:40 PM
Skidim does have the 4160 Holley carb kit. It is Rn0120-1, at least for the Holley on the 351. for $50. You can also buy gaskets for the metering block and fuel bowl separately from http://www.holley.com/0-80319-1.asp, and maybe also from Skidim. Holley also has the complete carburetor and a kit, but I didn't check the price.

j.mccreight@hotmail.com
04-20-2012, 03:49 PM
Thanks for the replies. It sounds pretty simple. I will give it a shot probably should be done in the water and not in the drive way?

Yes, I would do it on the water as it will be running for awhile...