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87MCProstar
06-05-2011, 02:52 PM
Hey guys,
quick question. having a little bit of an issue here again with the boat starting. went to the lake today and she started right up with a slow sounding starter. Let her idle for about 4-5 minutes to get up to temp, turned off sat for about a min then started her again. again with a slow crank. took the boat for a quick ride around lake to make sure alternator was charging the battery, cruising speed she was holding just under 13v at full throttle she was over 13v. To me shows the alternator is working just fine. got back to the dock, hooked her up, turned her off. sat for a minute, tried to start again turn over was supper slow like it was a dead battery. but the battery is brand new just bought it and charged it Friday. Any ideas other than the starter???

FrankSchwab
06-05-2011, 03:19 PM
Put a voltmeter directly on the battery; you can buy a $10 one at Radio Shack or Home Depot or Harbor Freight; they're all plenty accurate.

Running down the lake you should see around 14.4 V on the battery. If you don't get this, then the battery isn't getting charged well. You say it's a new battery, so I'd immediately suspect the charging system. If the battery was defective (say, a shorted cell) you wouldn't get 14.4 either.

After shutting down, you'll probably see something around 13.6, but this is going to change as it sits. After a couple of hours, the battery should be sitting at around 12.6 V (at 70 deg F, perhaps a few tenths higher if it's warmer).

I'm guessing that you're going to see that the battery voltage is a bit low after sitting; this suggests that it isn't getting fully charged. Put it on a charger, let it get to full charge, then take it off and let it sit for a few hours. If you get good voltage, then this pretty much confirms bad charging in the boat. If you don't, then it's likely the battery.

/frank

JimN
06-05-2011, 03:28 PM
Hey guys,
quick question. having a little bit of an issue here again with the boat starting. went to the lake today and she started right up with a slow sounding starter. Let her idle for about 4-5 minutes to get up to temp, turned off sat for about a min then started her again. again with a slow crank. took the boat for a quick ride around lake to make sure alternator was charging the battery, cruising speed she was holding just under 13v at full throttle she was over 13v. To me shows the alternator is working just fine. got back to the dock, hooked her up, turned her off. sat for a minute, tried to start again turn over was supper slow like it was a dead battery. but the battery is brand new just bought it and charged it Friday. Any ideas other than the starter???

Clean the battery ends land terminals. If the cable ends have been replaced with the kind that have two bolts, get rid of the cables- those ends are only supposed to be temporary.

If you have had to crank for an extremely long time, meaning more than 10 seconds, make sure the solenoid and the relay next to the main breaker are OK.

87MCProstar
06-05-2011, 04:24 PM
okay thanks guys. i'll look later

87MCProstar
06-05-2011, 06:18 PM
Went back to lake this pm, boat started up again, with a slow crank. While on alt is showing 13.9v battery is showing 14.7v. Didn't have second pair of hands to test while cranking, since my volt meter has the needle ends not the clamps. Ran for a few minutes turned off sat for a few started the second time, but not the third. Volts @ battery went down to 13v. Motor will barely turn over. Then on 5th time trying to turn over, there is just clicking sound, but battery is still showing 12.4v. Starter related is gettin 12.3v on battery side and when trying to start its getting 10v. After all this battery is showing 12.3v. What's going on?

j.mccreight@hotmail.com
06-05-2011, 06:35 PM
Sounds like voltage drop, probably have corrosion inside the battery cables, are the cables warm to the touch if so I would replace the battery cables...

johnlanguab
06-05-2011, 07:34 PM
I second, I think you need to replace the battery cables.

lakeview190
06-05-2011, 07:37 PM
Had the same slow crank issue a few years ago on my 87 190(really slow), it was the starter. I replaced it with a pemanent magnet starter from Discount Inboard Marine and it made a huge difference. I was amazed at how fast it turned the engine over. Best money I ever spent. Hope you get it worked out.
J

87MCProstar
06-05-2011, 07:47 PM
Thanks guys. Charging battery @ home now will test that theory later. And the positive cable is shown wear, dark exposed wire with a replacement end. So ill pick up a new cable and see what happens before I get a new starter, fven the huge price difference. And ruling one thing out at a time. . Negative cable is much cleaner than pos, so I think that one is okay.

87MCProstar
06-07-2011, 08:41 AM
Well looks like it was the starter. swapped out battery cable for new one, battery was fully charged, boat started on first turn ran great, charged great. shut off started slow the second time. voltage stayed the same after second shut off. when for the third time and nothing again. battery still showed 12+ volts, which leads me to believe the charging system is working.

So next question is do I rebuild current starter or is the permanent magnent from Ski Dim worth the 200 bucks?

03geetee
06-07-2011, 09:03 AM
http://www.marinepartssource.com/newdetails.asp?mfgno=70200&pnumber=AR70200&mfg=ARCO%20AUTO%20&%20MARINE&desc=STARTER-%20FORD%20SB%20CW/ROT

Here ya go!

JTR

87MCProstar
06-07-2011, 09:10 AM
Perfect! Thanks JTR

03geetee
06-07-2011, 09:17 AM
Let me know how you like it, I keep putting ordering mine off but am going to this week. If you get yours first report back how things are doing, I have similar issues with mine.

JTR

87MCProstar
06-07-2011, 09:19 AM
JTR, I just noticed on that part it say CW rotation. Isn't Left Hand rotation counter clockwise?

Philscbx
06-07-2011, 11:25 AM
Regardless what you purchase, starter rebuild kits are real easy to do yourself.
Pop in new bushings, strap sand down the armature, new brushes, good lube, and new solenoid, & starter drive.
Probably $40 - 60.

In a couple hours, a new starter.
A local starter rebuilder can do it quickly while you go get coffee is the easier option.

They could also check alternator to make sure it's putting out enough amps.
Volts can fake you out with little amps to recover full charging duty.
Starter just took 600 amps to crank it over.

Good Luck

87MCProstar
06-07-2011, 01:08 PM
Why would a local dealer tell someone that the Arco starter (skidim and other online businesses) are junk replacements? Is it since we'd be using other sources to buy the equipment other than dealer?

TRBenj
06-08-2011, 10:27 AM
Why would a local dealer tell someone that the Arco starter (skidim and other online businesses) are junk replacements? Is it since we'd be using other sources to buy the equipment other than dealer?
Pretty much, yup.

For Fords, CCW = reverse rotation starter. CW = standard rotation starter.

The rotation description describes the rotation of the starter (not the engine) as viewed from the rear of the boat (when installed)... on a direct drive, of course.

Will we see you at some point this weekend, Tim?

87MCProstar
06-10-2011, 11:06 PM
Thanks Tim for that info, ended up bringing start to a guy out in Canton to have it rebuilt. Supporting local business!

Much better now with the new starter, but now we are noticing that the throttle has to be right in the perfect spot or it won't fire. Would that be the neutral safety switch, the throttle cable, or the ignition key?

I love how it is always something :-/

And Tim yes, I'll be swinging by Sunday as soon as I get out of my swim meet! I'm sort of glad the BFN isn't completely finished, as I won't feel so bad droolling all over it.

TRBenj
06-13-2011, 11:55 AM
Tim, glad you could make it out yesterday!

If you have to jiggle the throttle a little to get the starter to engage thats the NSS thats fighting you. You may need to make a very fine adjustment to the shift cable going to your transmission. Try that and see if it helps.

87MCProstar
06-13-2011, 12:49 PM
Tim,
Thats what I thought, I'll adjust and see.

I was happy I made it to, those were a bunch of great guys! I just wish I was able to be there all weekend. But the ride in the Orange Crush and Joe's boat definately made up for it. We have to try and improve our once a year outting average though.

03geetee
06-14-2011, 09:17 PM
Highfive for marine parts source!!! Ordered my starter online yesterday at 330pm and got home today and without charging any shipping cost with UPS ground the starter was on my doorstep!

Now that is awesome! I will report how it does the weekend of the 4th.

JTR

Apatski S&S 77
06-15-2011, 01:42 AM
In my experience if you have not changed the starter bushing at the drive end of the starter that may be the cheapest fix and costs very little to try. I changed mine every couple of years for a no issue starting season. Best wishes and great skiing!!!

03geetee
06-15-2011, 08:58 AM
In my experience if you have not changed the starter bushing at the drive end of the starter that may be the cheapest fix and costs very little to try. I changed mine every couple of years for a no issue starting season. Best wishes and great skiing!!!

Well in inherited a boat with a 26 year old starter that I am not sure what was done or not done too. So for a little over a bill and some faster starts I think this was pretty cost effective.

Thanks for the tip though!

JTR