X30 Ballast makeover, most for surfing.

[CantRepeat]

Hey all,

I've been doing a lot of changes to my X30 in an effort to build a better surf wake. I believe a lot of the sub task might come in handy for other purposes but will post them here as they all impact the surf wake.


What I've done or will be doing to the boat.

Move the batteries to starboard - I surf port (see this thread (http://www.mastercraft.com/teamtalk/showthread.php?t=40382).)
Add a second through hull water source, I'll post that here.
Wire up a 4th pump - Switch, relay, breaker, pump mount (the right way? well the MC way)
Custom 1400 surf sac design filled with two pumps. - purchased through wakemaker.com


I hope you can use this information for your future projects.



I added a 4th ballast pump to fill the larger surf sac and also added one of these manifolds (http://www.wakemakers.com/fly-high-distribution-flow-manifold.html) from wakemakers so I could use the starboard side pump to help fill the surf sack.


This is my parts list.


Jabsco Wakeboard Ballast Puppy Reversible Pump - From WakeMakers (http://www.wakemakers.com/jabsco-ballast-puppy-wakeboard-pump.html)
Carling Toggle Switch - LT-2561-601-012 Wesgrade (http://www.wesgarde.com/branches.shtml#)
VF28-35F14-Z05 Marine Relay - Onlinecomponents.com (http://www.onlinecomponents.com/te-connectivity-p-b-brand_vf28-35f14-z05.html?p=37762528)
Bussmann 20 Amp. CB174B-20 - Mouser (http://www.mouser.com/ProductDetail/Cooper-Bussmann/CB174B-20/?qs=GM6gGTqOQCvOYBEVGczEeqkIuplteh20RwnjZpMKR20%3D )
Delphi relay socket - Mouser (http://www.mouser.com/ProductDetail/Delphi-Connection-Systems/12110539/?qs=sGAEpiMZZMtL3B7sVozNt0kLW93kUkRv)
Delphi connectors and seals 12/20, 16/14 - All from Performance Connection Systems
5 cavity Delphi 12110540 (http://www.mouser.com/ProductDetail/Delphi-Connection-Systems/12110540/?qs=sGAEpiMZZMt9f4L4Rxsd6uu6P%252bxY9m3y) Metri-pack 280 secondary TPA lock Mouser
Homemade breaker panel 3/16th stainless steal TIG welded ends.

If you are going to use the Delphi Metri pack sockets you're also going to need the Delphi crimping tool (http://www.pcsconnectors.com/8913440.aspx) . They are pricey but well worth the investment if you use the system.

All of these components are the same ones the factory installed in the boat. Some I purchased from MC Rambo Marine others from outside vendors. The Carling switch is the one MC uses. Wesgrade has them and they are $5.85 for one but you they have a $50 min order. You can get them from Lex at Rambo for $20. If I ever had to make a system from the ground up I'd just buy the $50 bucks worth.


In this post I'll outline the wiring of the dash switch, the two relays, the circuit breaker and the new pump.


Here is the dissected wiring schematic. The numbers indicate the wire gage. Also, on the switch the red wire is connected to both the top and bottom poles.

http://mikesell.net/images/boat/ballast/ball0.jpg

After I finally received all the correct parts I assembled the panel. I drill a 1/2 hole from panel to panel to pass the wires through. If you are doing this from scratch I'd make up just one large panel and in the future I might just redo this one.

http://mikesell.net/images/boat/ballast/ball1.jpg

Here is what the MC panel and my panel, for the 4th pump, look like once connected and wired.

http://mikesell.net/images/boat/ballast/ball2.jpg

Then just reinstall the panel to the back of the seat in the port locker.

http://mikesell.net/images/boat/ballast/ball3.jpg


Hopefully someone can use this info on their project.

[CantRepeat]

I was going to layup a glass block for the 4th pump but then saw a better way. I made a SS mount and then just attached to the hull tie down points behind the back wall cover. Super easy spot to get to.

http://mikesell.net/images/boat/ballast/ball4.jpg

[CantRepeat]

So I figured I post a good how-to on through hull ballast pick ups.

1. Location:

Finding a good location for the through hull ballast pick up. You'll need to locate the pick up and the best way to do that is by measuring from a hard point of reference on the bottom of your boat. I would suggest using either the current engine water pick up or the through hull for your prop shaft. Both of these points are easy to find both inside and outside of the boat. When laying out the location keep in mind that you will need to clear any obstructions inside the boat as well. With this in mind I suggest you move far enough away from the center line that you will clear the motor and transmission.

Once you have this location on the bottom of the boat tape it off with masking tape. Now inside the boat you'll need to locate the same spot and mask it off as well. The tape keeps the gel coat and fiberglass from splintering too much.

http://www.mikesell.net/images/boat/ballast/th.jpg

Once you have it tape off get your shut off valve and check to make sure the location you have selected has enough room to clear the valve. Keep in mind that you will need to thread it onto the through hull so you'll need room to rotate the valve as well as operate the valve once install.


2. Drilling:

Once all the taping and clearance checking is done you'll need to start your drilling. Hold your hole saw up to the location you have pick on the bottom of the boat and then trace the outside of hole saw onto the tape.

http://www.mikesell.net/images/boat/ballast/th2.jpg


The purpose of drawing the outline is so you can drill a pilot hole. DO NOT DRILL YOUR HOLE WITHOUT DOING A PILOT HOLE. Drill the pilot hole first using just a single small bit. Remove the bit from your drill and screw it back into the hole. With the drill bit back in the hole get back in the boat and double check that the location is still good and has the needed clearance for the shut off valve.

Here is a case in point:

http://www.mikesell.net/images/boat/ballast/th2b.jpg

The solid yellow dot represents the first pilot hole. I drilled the pilot hole and check for clearance in the boat. I found that I was too close to the oil pan and that I needed to move to the starboard side more. The issue is, if I would have used the hole saw with out first using a pilot hole I would have not been able to change the through hull location with a costly repair. Sure I'd have shown my sack by just winging it but I'd be looking at a costly repair. But since I only used a pilot bit I can move the pilot bit over(red dot) and recheck the clearance. By using a very small pilot bit I can move the final through location any where with in range of the size of the hole saw(the yellow ring). In my case that was about a half an inch. The final through hole is the red ring and the first pilot hole will be inside of it and not cause an issue.

Now that I have check the clearance I can complete the drilling with the hole saw.

http://www.mikesell.net/images/boat/ballast/th3.jpg

You'll need to take a round file and chamfer the edges of both the top and bottom of the hole at a 45 degree angle. This will keep the gel coat and the fiber glass from cracking/splintering. Once you have completed this remove the tape and clean the area with some mineral spirits.

Also note in the photo above there was a little open space between hull and inner lamination. Note sure why it was like that but I filled it with 3M 4000 marine adhesive sealant and let it dry for night. In the morning I ran my hole saw back through it. You may or may not run into this.

3. Through Hull install:

The only thing left to do is install your through hull and connect your check valve. I used a 1 inch brass mushroom through hull I purchased from wakemakers. I also used 3M 4000 marine adhesive.

http://www.wakemakers.com/bronze-mushroom-thru-hull-intake.html

Coast guard requires metal check valves on any fitting below the water line.

http://www.mikesell.net/images/boat/ballast/th5.jpg

Nothing left to do but enjoy your ballast system.

Good luck and please ask any questions or offer suggestions.

[CantRepeat]

And then something about sacks here?

[CantRepeat]

I got the surf step completed today.

I used some PT 5/1-4 board from Home Depot. Since this an experiment I didn't want to commit to teak yet.


Custom brackets, they are 6 inches shorter then factory.

http://www.mikesell.net/images/boat/swimbracket.jpg


The platform is a full foot shorter in the center and 6 inches shorter on the sides and is just 50 inches wide.

[nickespi]

Looking good! Can't wait to see it's surf wake.

[CantRepeat]

I've been doing some reading and watching videos and I've been seeing a lot of talk about swim steps messing up surf wakes.

I think I'm going to make a custom step that will only be as wide as the two mounting points and maybe 1 to 1.5 feet long. It's going to just be big enough to load up surfers.

I ordered some 3/16 x 3 inch stainless steel for the brackets. I need to get my hands on some teak now.

[V-man]

I have designed a custom platform for 07 X45. Mastercraft of AZ has the design and can make one for you to match your boat.

[CantRepeat]

I have designed a custom platform for 07 X45. Mastercraft of AZ has the design and can make one for you to match your boat.

Thanks for the offer Vman, but I do pretty much all my own work. I don't have much else to do with my time.

I would like to see some photos of your platform if you don't mind.

[V-man]

I took my swim deck off and laid it upside down on a sheath of 3/4 in plywood. I traced the V notch on the plywood and cut it to fit just outside the brackets. I Attached the prototype to the brackets and took the boat out for a demo. Worked great. Then, I brought the demo deck to Mastercraft and they had their glass guy make a mold and in about a week I had a new surf deck.

[Brian B]

^ Thats sick! What boat do you have? Donavon is the man!

[Brian B]

Say you're surfing port side, are you running starboard ballast? My X10 seems to have a slightly better wave with ballast on non surf side as well......

[CantRepeat]

Hey Brain, how much difference are you seeing in your wave if you fill the starboard side while surfing port?

Vman, what is the length of the platform from that center point to the back of your boat? Are you using standard mounting brackets on the new platform?

I never thought about making it like a V. I was going to pretty much just make it as wide as the brackets on the boat and only about a 1 or 1 and half long.

[Brian B]

Hey Brain, how much difference are you seeing in your wave if you fill the starboard side while surfing port?




Its kind of hard to tell. I added 540lb sac to the port locker before looking into the difference. Next trip out I will try both. Do you guys generally run forward ballast for surfing?

[CantRepeat]

Its kind of hard to tell. I added 540lb sac to the port locker before looking into the difference. Next trip out I will try both. Do you guys generally run forward ballast for surfing?

I run a 450 sac in the walk way. It cleans the lip up a lot.

Next time out I'm gonna try filling the starboard side while surfing port to see if the added weight makes for some growth in the wave.

[V-man]

Brian. I only fill starboard side after burning off as much weight in fuel.
Cant. I can get you the exact measurements next time I take the boat out. Donovan at MC AZ has the prototype and can also get you the numbers. But, I think the X30 may be a little different in shape at the transom. You are on the right track with your thought process. And it's really not the length that's an issue. Cutting down the sides to get the deck out of the wake stream is what you are looking for. Use the brackets as a guide. Cut the sides as close to the brackets as you can stand, then flare the deck toward the center line as it goes back. My goal was to still have a comfortable platform with a nice look.

[ShamrockIV]

i want to see some pics of the ballast bags!!

[ShamrockIV]

hey vman how much weight are u running?? thats a sweet wave!!

[CantRepeat]

i want to see some pics of the ballast bags!!

Me too. Jason at Wakemaker.com is trying to iron out some production issue with Fly High about my custom bag. Its an extremely custom design with a crap load of different measurements at all points. It is turning out to be a very difficult bag to build. I'm probably going to need to make some changes in but we'll see.

Being the awesome guy that he is, Jason has sent out a loaner bag for now. This means I'll at least get to finish up some plumbing and get to surf this next weekend.

I ran out of argon so I didn't ge the second swim step bracket completed so I'm going to do that today as well.

[ShamrockIV]

intersting idea brian. i will have to try it out this weekend

[CantRepeat]

Added the photos and junk about the custom surf step in post #5.

I'll be testing this set up on Sat so hopefully have some feedback and lame video to show.

[ShamrockIV]

i am very intersted in your results with the smaller platform. keep us posted!

i got 2 400lb bags last night. gonna plumb them in tonight!!

[CantRepeat]

i am very intersted in your results with the smaller platform. keep us posted!

i got 2 400lb bags last night. gonna plumb them in tonight!!

That's awesome.

I've got a loaner coming in tomorrow from Jason (great guy to deal with) and I reinstalled my 680lb sac for the weekend. The loaner is a 1000lb sac but I'll only have about 800lb in it on the port side of the boat. I have a 750 or 450 in the walkway and the new step. Hopefully this will give me a good idea what the final custom sac will do. I also plan to mess with filling the starboard side hard tank and see where that leads.

[CantRepeat]

Here is the video of the wave with factory step and the wave with the custom step. It's clear to see there is a big difference in the size, shape and performance of the wave.

You Tube Vid of wave. (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HtdZoTb6GS0)


Make sure you watch in HD 720, the text is easier to read.

[peettee79]

Nice...good work, ide love to have a crack at that wave. Im working on the step mod as we speak, gonna raise it a touch and glass the underside for a frictionless smoothe surface, trim the corners and maybe hook up hyraulics so i can raise and lower.
Also gotta moove them darn batteries.

[GregS]

Great post....keep us posted.

[CantRepeat]

My custom sac has finally shipped!!! It will be here tomorrow. For whatever reason production issues and my crazy design made this a 5 month wait!

[CantRepeat]

The new surf sac is here, 1400 lbs of goodness!

http://www.mikesell.net/images/sac.jpg

[CantRepeat]

Went Sat and Sunday this weekend and did some reverse video.

This video shows the wave with 3 people in the boat and 1750 lbs of ballast, factory hard tank and the new custom bag from wakemakers. As you can see, the new custom platform is completely out of the water except for small corner of it. I'll trim that down this weekend.

I'm not sure there is anything else I can do to make the wave better for surfing, but I'll keep trying.

Reverse Vid (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tcRYs9VQ89c) Watch it in 720 DPI

[jason@wakemakers.com]

Nice work on the upgrades, it's great to see pics of the whole process, and the video of the wake looks nice!

[CantRepeat]

I finally got around to installing my fold down swim step brackets this week. While using the smaller swim step was great it was pretty tiny and when we were done surfing it was just too small for recreation. In the end I hope that I can drill a second set of holes so I can angle the step up and not affect the wave. This way I can have a full size step that wont be an issue for surfing.

On my 06 the old holes didn't line up with the new brackets so I had to take the boat and have them filled. The two holes left open are for the tie down brackets.

Masking tape over the area to prevent scratching.

http://www.mikesell.net/images/boat/step1.jpg

I made jig to keep the drill bit straight and level while drilling. I used a transfer punch to mark the holes and my drill press to drill them straight.

http://www.mikesell.net/images/boat/step2.jpg

There is a thick piece of stainless steel molded into the back of the boat. I drilled through the gel and fiber until I hit the metal then switch to a carbide drill bit and some WD40.

http://www.mikesell.net/images/boat/step3.jpg

Then to a 3/4 inch bit to chamfer the holes a bit to prevent the gel coat from cracking.

http://www.mikesell.net/images/boat/step4.jpg

Test fit the bracket with 5/16 SS bolts, I used nylock nuts on the final install.

http://www.mikesell.net/images/boat/step5.jpg

You can only have 5 img files in a post so onward!

[CantRepeat]

Tape off and bracket installed with 3M 5200 marine sealant.

http://www.mikesell.net/images/boat/step6.jpg

One side done, on to the other.

http://www.mikesell.net/images/boat/step7.jpg

Both brackets installed.

http://www.mikesell.net/images/boat/step8.jpg

When installing the swim step onto the brackets the instructions say to make sure the measurements are the same at the front of the mount and the rear. I guess this is done to prevent binding while folding the step down.

http://www.mikesell.net/images/boat/step9.jpg

Here's the money shot! Now with the step pulled all the way back I can get a good angle for surfing. I haven't drill the holes for the up position yet. I want to fix it in the right angle and test it before I do so.

http://www.mikesell.net/images/boat/step10.jpg

The purpose of this is to have a full size swim step that doesn't affect the surf wave. We will see if this works when the weather warms up.

[jason@wakemakers.com]

Awesome idea Tim, I'm excited to see how it works out on the water.

[pmikler]

CantRepeat- I have an upgrade to my x5 in the way of an 06 x30 making its way to Florida from Arkansas and was curious if your tilted up swim step did the trick. Thanks in advance.

[mseller]

CantRepeat- How did this work out for you? I assume you have a pin you lock in place for both positions?

[Brian B]

Yeah, I'd love to hear your results!

[CantRepeat]

So my feedback about the full size swim step on while tilted up is this.


Don't waste your time. IT was a big failure and didn't work. In fact the wave is worse with it tilted up then with it being just flat. I'm sorry it took me so long to provide feedback but I was still testing it and hoping I could make it work.

Looks like I'll be talking to Vman about who made his custom step.

[ShamrockIV]

is the surf tab worth the extra money? thanks

[wtrjock]

Those fold down brackets look great! Where do you pick those up?

[CantRepeat]

Those fold down brackets look great! Where do you pick those up?

They are made by and sold by http://www.ojprops.com/ you'll need to call them and ask.

[CantRepeat]

is the surf tab worth the extra money? thanks

I've never used them but from what I've read they are not worth the $1500. :(

[jason@wakemakers.com]

is the surf tab worth the extra money? thanks

I know you didn't ask me, but save your time and money, trim tabs won't increase the displacement of the hull, so the impact on the wake is minimal.

[CantRepeat]

Posted this in the wrong thread yesterday while I was at the lake.

It's my new custom swim step. I cut it out of a 3x5x.75 6061 sheet of aluminum. Had it out for testing yesterday and now just need to top it off with some seadec.

[jason@wakemakers.com]

Looks great Tim, was it out of the way?

[CantRepeat]

Looks great Tim, was it out of the way?

Hey Jason,

It is completely out of the water at surf speed. I've got the best of both worlds now, a big swim step for loading and unloading and it doesn't mess of the wave!

[ttu]

looks great. since i thread jacked the wtb x30 thread with my question, i will throw it over here.

i have a pair of extra brackets if got from mc x15 who lost his boat in hurricane sandy, i am planning on making a surf platform. do you think plywood would be okay for my trial and if it works make one out of teak.

thanks.

[CantRepeat]

looks great. since i thread jacked the wtb x30 thread with my question, i will throw it over here.

i have a pair of extra brackets if got from mc x15 who lost his boat in hurricane sandy, i am planning on making a surf platform. do you think plywood would be okay for my trial and if it works make one out of teak.

thanks.

Sure you can. I did the same thing but with 1x5 pressure treated wood. Just be careful of splinters and you should be fine.

[rgardjr1]

Sure you can. I did the same thing but with 1x5 pressure treated wood. Just be careful of splinters and you should be fine.

What is the most important factor in the surf platform-size (narrower so weighted edge of platform doesn't cut into wave) or raising the entire platform higher out of the water? Looking at making a surf platform before the summer and was wondering what your feelings are.

[CantRepeat]

What is the most important factor in the surf platform-size (narrower so weighted edge of platform doesn't cut into wave) or raising the entire platform higher out of the water? Looking at making a surf platform before the summer and was wondering what your feelings are.

The purpose of altering the platform is to keep it from messing up the water coming off the surf side of the boat. If doing that by raising up the platform I think you would have to raise so high it would be kind of funny looking.

I went with making the platform as large as possible without it touching the water while at surf speed. This meant narrowing it as well as shortening it up a bit. I tested a few different sizes to make sure I had it as large as possible but made sure it was out of the water while surfing.

By far this was the most important part of getting a clean wave off of the boat. With the platform in the water I was getting that double lip you see on a lot of boats. It also impacted the over push of the wave.

[rgardjr1]

The purpose of altering the platform is to keep it from messing up the water coming off the surf side of the boat. If doing that by raising up the platform I think you would have to raise so high it would be kind of funny looking.

I went with making the platform as large as possible without it touching the water while at surf speed. This meant narrowing it as well as shortening it up a bit. I tested a few different sizes to make sure I had it as large as possible but made sure it was out of the water while surfing.

By far this was the most important part of getting a clean wave off of the boat. With the platform in the water I was getting that double lip you see on a lot of boats. It also impacted the over push of the wave.


I picked up a second teak platform last week that I plan on resizing to help with the surf wake. The width of the platform ended up being about 6" less (3" on each side) on the transom side of the platform than the platform that came on my boat. I've got some brackets coming and I have to add a support piece to the bottom for my FAE, but it will at least get me going in the right direction.

[ttu]

hopefully this can been seen okay. went up to my storage yesterday and removed the teak platform and outlined it on butcher paper. also while up at the lake went by the marina that carries supra and Moomba. I was able to get a good look at their new surf specified platform.

here is the outline of the platform and where the lines to the inside are going to by the surf platform I am planning on building.

[XStar08]

What about a plattform which ends at each side can be 'folded' upwards/out of the way when in surf mode, like winglets...

[romerorrr@yahoo.com]

If you have a teak swim-step you can lay a 2x6 on top of the bracket and then mount three pieces together. It does a great job of keeping your original swim step, but lifts it out of the water for wave shaping.

I guess if you have a fiberglass swimstep I would imagine you could find some material to make that happen,,,


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

[CantRepeat]

If you have a teak swim-step you can lay a 2x6 on top of the bracket and then mount three pieces together. It does a great job of keeping your original swim step, but lifts it out of the water for wave shaping.

I guess if you have a fiberglass swimstep I would imagine you could find some material to make that happen,,,


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

As far leaned over as my boat is while surfing I would think the would have to be raise about 6 or 8 inches to keep it out of the water. That just doesn't sound like a good option for me.

[LittleFuss]

Got any pictures of the updated wake?

[CantRepeat]

Got any pictures of the updated wake?

No, sorry. It's been rather slow start to the weather here. I've only been out once these year and I didn't have the surf sac back in the boat yet. It was mostly a check ride after de-winterizing.

[CantRepeat]

What about a plattform which ends at each side can be 'folded' upwards/out of the way when in surf mode, like winglets...

That's a nice idea. I wonder about a detachable end could be stored in the boat while surfing.

[rgardjr1]

hopefully this can been seen okay. went up to my storage yesterday and removed the teak platform and outlined it on butcher paper. also while up at the lake went by the marina that carries supra and Moomba. I was able to get a good look at their new surf specified platform.

here is the outline of the platform and where the lines to the inside are going to by the surf platform I am planning on building.

Well I did my best impression of Tommy Nation today and cut up the extra teak swim platform that I picked up. It was already about 6" narrower than the one on my boat so I just tried to take as much material as I could off the outside corners. I didn't want to have to buy any more teak so I reused the outside support pieces and that somewhat dictated the finished size. I'll try to remember to take a picture of the cut down platform sitting on top of the old one when I get it up to the lake. The bottom view shows how far I brought the outside support piece over into the supports for the brackets. The last shows how much material I cut off. Now I just need to oil it up and get it on the boat.

[CantRepeat]

Looks really nice. You surely have some prior wood working skills.

I was thinking more of something that could be removed and then put back on. My fear is when I got to sell the boat and not having a full size platform.

Let us know how it works out for you.

[rgardjr1]

Looks really nice. You surely have some prior wood working skills.

I was thinking more of something that could be removed and then put back on. My fear is when I got to sell the boat and not having a full size platform.

Let us know how it works out for you.

This project requires pretty basic wood working skills-I think anybody that owns the tools could knock it out pretty easily. I used a cordless circular saw, router with a straight cutting bit and round over bit, cordless drill, hammer, palm sander and putty knife. The hardest part was getting the outside support pieces off. They were glued on or the oil finish had them stuck on pretty good. I used a stiff putty knife and hammer to free them up. Once I cleaned the pieces up with the palm sander I could trace my lay out onto the platform. Rough cut the outline with the circular saw and glued and screwed the outside support piece in it's new location. I used the router to clean up the edges using the bottom outside support piece as the template. Then rounded over the edge. We'll see if it does anything once I get it on the boat and load up the sacks. If not I'll have an extra swim platform that I can alternate every year.

[CantRepeat]

Hopefully it works out well for you and does not disturb the wake that much.

[rgardjr1]

Hopefully it works out well for you and does not disturb the wake that much.

Keep your fingers crossed for me. I know it will disturb it less than my other platform-hopefully it will be noticeable.

[rgardjr1]

I'll try to remember to take a picture of the cut down platform sitting on top of the old one when I get it up to lake.

Here's what it looks like compared to the old one:
95941




Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[CantRepeat]

Looks great!! Hopefully it's enough off that it doesn't interfere with the surf wake.

[ttu]

Here's what it looks like compared to the old one:
95941




Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

make sure you post pictures of the surf wake!!

thinking about doing the same.

[Quinten]

Here's what it looks like compared to the old one:
95941




Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Looks good, hopefuly it will work :)
Oh and give that other platform a lick of oil ;)