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BTV
04-06-2011, 10:42 AM
2009 X15 with factory JL audio setup, JL 6600 running 4 speakers in boat and one sub, JL 4500 running 4 tower speakers.

What is the model of the in boat speakers, M770CCS or M770TCS? Are the tower speakers the same model as in boat speakers?

What is the model of the sub, M10W5 or M10IB5?

Thinking of adding another pair of JL in boat speakers below rear seat and using the JL6600 to run the three pairs of in boat speakers at 75 watts X 6. Adding another JL sub below observer seat and using JL4500 to run the two subs at 250 watts X 2. Adding Wetsounds syn 4 to run tower speakers at 200 watts X 4. If I don't like JL tower speakers with more power then I will go with Wetsounds Pro 80 and MB8 combo. WS 420 eq to control it all.

How do you think this setup would sound? I am not very savvy on all the stereo stuff. Any help and suggestions greatly appreciated.

CantRepeat
04-06-2011, 10:51 AM
TCS Tower Component Speaker

CCS Cockpit Coxial Speaker

http://marine.jlaudio.com/products_components.php?prod_id=429

BTV
04-06-2011, 11:30 AM
Thanks. I had looked at that page and didn't see it. Is the sub as simple of an explanation?

Thrall
04-06-2011, 11:31 AM
That would work fine, except you could feed the cockpit speakers more power if you wanted to.
Before adding 2 more cockpit speakers try bridging ch 3/4 and 5/6 to your 2 rear cockpit speakers. I did that with my M6600 amp and they are considerably louder. The JL speakers in our boats will handle 150W+ of clean power easily.
The tower speakers as is are a little underpowered. I've got over 150W ea going to 4 JL towers and I think they are loud enough. But for sure some big HLCD speakres will project better. A syn4 will be more than enough for the towers.
Don't know anything about those subs.

craig3972
04-06-2011, 11:35 AM
[QUOTE=BTV;743596]
What is the model of the sub, M10W5 or M10IB5?

QUOTE]

IB stands for "infinite baffe" the M10W5 is for sealed or ported boxes.

I switched out the OEM M10IB5 for a M10W5 and put it in an enclosure with 350watts to it and produces good bass.

BTV
04-06-2011, 12:14 PM
Great thanks. Should I consider one sub in enclosure versus two free air to get better sound?

craig3972
04-06-2011, 12:29 PM
Great thanks. Should I consider one sub in enclosure versus two free air to get better sound?

I am not a big fan of the free air subs - not a crisp bass hit and not as deep bass as an enclosure will produce.

the best solution is to run 2 subs in an enclosure (or 1 sub each in 2 separate enclosures). Wire them in paralell for a 2ohm load on your sub amp. this will give you great quality sound and output.

If you are new to this and want a great sounding stereo, the cheapest way toi build a high output stereo is to take it to a quality install guy - preferrably someone who specializes in boats. It will cost a lot more in the beggining but you will avoid making a lot of mistakes that will cost you later to fix. I am the posterboy for doing this. :)

EarmarkMarine
04-06-2011, 12:42 PM
BTV,
The factory sub is definitely an 'IB' infinite baffle. The tower speakers are a 'T' and the coaming/cockpit speakers are a 'C'.
The 6600 running six in-boat coaxials/components is perfect and the 4500 running two 4-ohm subs is perfect.
However, the Syn4 running four 4-ohm speakers will only produce 4x125 watts where as the Syn2 running two speakers in parallel per channel for a net 2-ohm load will be 2x350 or 175 watts to each of four speakers.
Its easiest to run two identical IB woofers. Infinite baffle can perform well if properly executed which you don't generally find and certainly not by the factory. You can use more preamp gain, woofer speaker wire upgrade, re-tuning of crossover, power wire upgrade and a serious mounting baffle reinforcement upgrade to get the most from your subs.

David
Earmark Marine
Dallas Texas

Thrall
04-06-2011, 01:04 PM
Didn't realize the 200Wx4 was 2ohm load. Yeah, get the Syn 2 like David says.

BTV
04-06-2011, 04:03 PM
Thanks for the help. It seems I know just enough to be dangerous.

David - I have patterned this after the X55 you showed in a previous post. I noticed you ended up putting bullets in the factory cans. What was the reason for this?

Want to be sure you are recommending adding another M10IB5 and not two of another type of sub.

Talked to wetsounds - They recommend the 3some with a syn 6 over Pro 80 and MB8 pairs.
Thoughts?

Like Craig said - I want to be sure I get the correct amp so if I do change tower speakers I don't have to replace an amp.

Anyone know if wetsounds is having any kind of a spring sale like they did last year?

EarmarkMarine
04-06-2011, 06:11 PM
BTV,
We changed the JLs out for Bullet HollowPoint 770s because the boat owner wanted more output and projection than the JLs can provide. The HP 770 HLCDs are a drop-in with the factory MC pods. Keep in mind that the JL Audio 7.7s sound absolutely fantastic once they are properly powered (best in-boat speaker you can have) but as tower speakers they are limited beyond a surf speaker. On the X-55 we were trying to work with and use the factory amplifiers so we kept it symmetrical with the G series. If doing the same and going from scratch on the tower I would much rather use the JL Audio HD750/1 to run four of the same speakers.
Yes, I was recommending that you try two IB woofers thereby using the one you have already. We recently did a Crownline with a single IB JL 10-inch woofer. The factory baffle surface under the helm was like 1 1/8th inch thick and the sub sounded just like a sealed 'acoustic suspension' sub. It hammered. Of course, if you placed a sealed sub in a 5/16-inch thick box it wouldn't perform. Up to a point there is no technical reason that an IB woofer can't perform like an AS woofer. Alot of it is in the execution. If you want something that will ultimately play a little louder you can go with two sealed 10s and sandwich the fiberglass wall of a seating console between the driver and a stout enclosure. It would look exactly the same from the outside and JL Audio makes an AS marine counterpart. But,
to do the enclosures you need freedom from interior heater hoses and other obstructions.
If I had a MC tower with the four factory speaker mounting pads then I would go with either two pair Pro80s for maximum volume and projection or the Pro80/MB-8 combo for a very loud but warmer texture. Its just a matter of priorities in your personal objectives. Keep in mind that the current WetSounds demo boat has the Pro80/MB-8 combo.
There is no present Spring sale but there are packages available. If you have more technical or pricing questions don't hesitate to give us a shout.

David
www.earmarkmarine.com

BTV
04-06-2011, 06:28 PM
Thanks David, I'll be in touch tomorrow

stewvette
04-06-2011, 07:53 PM
David, I've heard you talk about adding a baffle to IB subs does this seem to help the IB subs? Do you have any pics or an explanation of what they look like and how you make them?

Yellow X9
04-06-2011, 08:29 PM
Great thanks. Should I consider one sub in enclosure versus two free air to get better sound?

Enclosure, is the way togo.

EarmarkMarine
04-06-2011, 09:11 PM
stewvette,
Typically an IB subwoofer is mounted into a 1/4-inch or 5/16-inch thick fiberglass wall as part of a bench seat console or coaming and the wall has a great deal of surface area. This baffle (mounting surface) may not be entirely inflexible. As a result some of the woofer's energy is transmitted through the baffle and lost. We build a round ring or split ring or larger panel that mounts to the interior of the baffle surface and behind the woofer for structural reinforcement. The added rigidity makes an audible difference. We use fiberglass resin coated 3/4-inch thick birch. Sometimes we paint it white or wrap it in marine grade carpet to match its surroundings when its visible. Keep in mind that a woofer is a jackhammer with a fair amount of mass and inertia changing its direction 200 times a second. An extremely rigid baffle is important.
There is a long laundry list of ways to defeat the effectiveness of an IB woofer. I've covered just a few of those in the prior post but there are many more that do not necessarily pertain to a MC. Again, many have never heard a good sounding IB so they think its not possible. But, often they were not hearing the IB limitations. Instead they heard poor execution and don't understand the acoustic dynamics at work. I have heard great sounding IB woofers when done correctly. Will a small sealed enclosed sub play a bit louder and handle a bit more power? Usually. Again, it may depend on the execution of either.


David
Earmark Marine

DJ 50
04-07-2011, 05:31 AM
BTV,
There is no present Spring sale but there are packages available. If you have more technical or pricing questions don't hesitate to give us a shout.

David
www.earmarkmarine.com

Do you know of any plans for a spring/summer sale?

EarmarkMarine
04-07-2011, 08:27 AM
DJ50,
Yes, there are specials. For specific sale and pricing type questions it would be good to contact us.
www.earmarkmarine.com

David
Earmark Marine