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Chris P
03-03-2011, 09:03 AM
I have been lurking here for a while in anticipation of my first direct drive boat purchase. I have been looking at both MC and Malibu. I have not looked at CC because I frankly don't care for them.

I have come across a 2002 PS197 that looks to be very nice with 120 hours. The current owner states that compression checks out on all cylinders and the boat looks very clean and well maintained. Being that we are in the midwest, there is not an opportunity to water test the boat.

The questions I have are as follows. What should the compression be in each cylinder for this boat? It has the LTR in it. Also, what should I look for as potential problems? I know to look at the running gear, be sure the impeller and oil has been changed regularly, but outside of looking at the running gear, checking the bilge for signs of oil leakage, and checking the marriage between the heads and block and the marriage between the exhaust manifold and heads, what else can I visually inspect to assist in determination that the boat is in good working order?

I plan on taking it to a MC dealer for inspection if I decide to make a contingent offer. What scares me is his asking price. It seems very low for a boat of that year and usage.

Thanks in advance for your opinions.

CantRepeat
03-03-2011, 09:07 AM
Check out the FAQ on boat buying.

http://mastercraft.com/teamtalk/showpost.php?p=257514&postcount=47

TNH2oSkier
03-03-2011, 09:34 AM
Dont forget to check the trailer out as well, brakes, tires, etc.

blakehardesty
03-03-2011, 09:52 AM
It its the guy from craigslist that says he will only deal through ebay I would cut ties. I bet the boat is stored in texas or somethhing. I saw it too. As a matter of fact I posted it in the craigslist section on this site. He e-mailed me back too and I didnt like what he had to tell me. For instance, why would I need it shipped when he posted 1 hour from me.

east tx skier
03-03-2011, 10:00 AM
Assuming it's not a scam (based on blakehardesty's post), also consider that unless this 197 is a tournament team boat, it will not be the same hull as was produced from the 2002 TT boats and production 197s going forward. The 2002 did not have a hook and had the "foiled" rudder found on the Pro Stars from 1998--2002. Top end will be a little higher (good if you're a footer), but those rudders are known to be a little tough in turns and, without the hook in the hull, the wake will be a bit different.

blakehardesty
03-03-2011, 10:09 AM
Im not saying 100% it is a scam but it is this one http://southbend.craigslist.org/boa/2242516744.html i would bet the farm it is.

Chris P
03-03-2011, 10:10 AM
It its the guy from craigslist that says he will only deal through ebay I would cut ties. I bet the boat is stored in texas or somethhing. I saw it too. As a matter of fact I posted it in the craigslist section on this site. He e-mailed me back too and I didnt like what he had to tell me. For instance, why would I need it shipped when he posted 1 hour from me.

We may be talking about the same guy and I have the same impression. I'm only 3 hours away from the posted location but I have reservations about his comments.

Chris P
03-03-2011, 10:11 AM
Check out the FAQ on boat buying.

http://mastercraft.com/teamtalk/showpost.php?p=257514&postcount=47

Great information there and I have looked at that extensively.

CantRepeat
03-03-2011, 10:41 AM
Im not saying 100% it is a scam but it is this one http://southbend.craigslist.org/boa/2242516744.html i would bet the farm it is.

If it's too good to be true then it probably is. I would think something is not right...

2002 Mastercraft Prostar 197 only 120 hours - $8900


Wow, I mean 120h on a 2002 for less then 10k is just crazy.

east tx skier
03-03-2011, 10:56 AM
Im not saying 100% it is a scam but it is this one http://southbend.craigslist.org/boa/2242516744.html i would bet the farm it is.

I wouldn't take that bet. The price versus hours screams scam.

Double D
03-03-2011, 11:01 AM
I have been lurking here for a while in anticipation of my first direct drive boat purchase. I have been looking at both MC and Malibu. I have not looked at CC because I frankly don't care for them.

I have come across a 2002 PS197 that looks to be very nice with 120 hours. The current owner states that compression checks out on all cylinders and the boat looks very clean and well maintained. Being that we are in the midwest, there is not an opportunity to water test the boat.

The questions I have are as follows. What should the compression be in each cylinder for this boat? It has the LTR in it. Also, what should I look for as potential problems? I know to look at the running gear, be sure the impeller and oil has been changed regularly, but outside of looking at the running gear, checking the bilge for signs of oil leakage, and checking the marriage between the heads and block and the marriage between the exhaust manifold and heads, what else can I visually inspect to assist in determination that the boat is in good working order?

I plan on taking it to a MC dealer for inspection if I decide to make a contingent offer. What scares me is his asking price. It seems very low for a boat of that year and usage.

Thanks in advance for your opinions.

If its the 02 197 for $8,900, its a scam. He wont tell me where the boat is and here is his response to me.

Hi, the 2002 Mastercraft Prostar 197 is still for sale. My price is $8,900. The boat is in immaculate condition and have never been involved in a collision. All the electrical and mechanical parts are working properly. It has only 120 hours of runtime. The cylinders have even compression. The trailer is included. The buyer gets insured shipping and 15 days free of charge return policy and inspection period. For safety reasons i will only deal through eBay. Let me know if you are interested.

2RLAKE
03-03-2011, 11:09 AM
scam scam scam

92 190 PS
03-03-2011, 11:28 AM
Google search the email address in the posting. It's bogus. He's posted the boat in SD and NJ as well. Usually if you google search the email addresses in this kind of crap you'll get a lot of hits on folks who have already been down the path. The old saying if it sounds too good to be true then it's probably not true always plays out on craigslist and other similar sites.

CantRepeat
03-03-2011, 11:48 AM
Google search the email address in the posting. It's bogus. He's posted the boat in SD and NJ as well. Usually if you google search the email addresses in this kind of crap you'll get a lot of hits on folks who have already been down the path. The old saying if it sounds too good to me true then it's probably not true always plays out on craigslist and other similar sites.

Great detective work!!

CantRepeat
03-03-2011, 11:52 AM
Post was removed!!

blakehardesty
03-03-2011, 12:07 PM
Post was removed!!

I flagged it.

Chris P
03-03-2011, 01:13 PM
Thanks for the detective work, guys. Really appreciate it.

Chris P
03-04-2011, 10:23 AM
Any thoughts on http://grandrapids.craigslist.org/boa/2241914440.html

east tx skier
03-04-2011, 10:27 AM
Nice looking boat.

blakehardesty
03-04-2011, 10:51 AM
nice, nice. I like it alot.

Chris P
03-04-2011, 11:05 AM
What do you all think on price? I like the boat as well but am getting feed back that the wake on the PS190 is much better.

I ask because I have found a 1995 PS190 in excellent shape with 520 hours on it that my wife and I are going to look at. I've been thinking that I may not really need the open bow. With the pontoon, we can simply take both boats out and use the toon as a staging area for those who want to ski. I would also be curious to see what you all think a 95 PS190 is worth assuming excellent condition. NADA says $8,860 on the 190 which I assume is no trailer and it says $11,280.00 on the 205 SD which I also assume is no trailer.

peason
03-05-2011, 01:21 PM
The price on the 205 may be slightly high, but if its in great condition it may be a good value. having the open bow is nice - especially if you ever need to sell the boat. I would seriously consider the 205 -great boat which is good for all water sports.

Chris P
03-23-2011, 01:58 PM
So, the boat search continues. I have continued to look at MC as well as Malibu. I don't much care for other manufacturer's offerings in my price range.

Today I received a call from our local MC dealer with whom I have made several visits and discussed several boats. It looks like they have a 1994 PS 205 in very good condition that they are selling on consignment. They are giving me the first right of refusal. I don't have any pictures but will be looking at it this weekend. I don't have the hours yet either however I'm told less then 500. They are talking about $16k, which I think is high for that boat but I'm still going to look at it and discuss it with the wife, aka "CFO".

If I understand correctly, the hull on the 1994 PS 205 is the same as the 190 of that year, just longer. If that's the case, would the wake characteristics be the same as the 190 or should I expect a little bit of a harder wake? Also, am I correct in thinking that the PS 190 was one of the better slalom wakes out there?

sand2snow22
03-23-2011, 02:10 PM
Here is a comp. for you

http://portland.craigslist.org/wsc/boa/2279084499.html

Chris P
03-23-2011, 02:11 PM
Thanks. I was thinking around $14 might be more like it.

JohnE
03-23-2011, 02:12 PM
Hull on 205 is not identical but close as are the wakes is my understanding.

A 94 205 is very desirable and if it is in very good condition, it will bring the $16K as spring is here. If you don't buy it someone else will. My thoughts are that I'd prefer to pay more for a boat that has no issues than one that could become a money pit. If said boat is pristine, I'd be inclined to buy it.

sand2snow22
03-23-2011, 02:14 PM
^^ True, true. John, you ever get a cup holder? I have an extra black one if you want me to ship it to you.........?

JohnE
03-23-2011, 02:19 PM
^^ True, true. John, you ever get a cup holder? I have an extra black one if you want me to ship it to you.........?

I'd like that Bryan. I broke one when my friends kid was on the motor box and accidentally stepped on a soda can in the cupholder.

PM at ya.

east tx skier
03-23-2011, 02:22 PM
So, the boat search continues. I have continued to look at MC as well as Malibu. I don't much care for other manufacturer's offerings in my price range.

Today I received a call from our local MC dealer with whom I have made several visits and discussed several boats. It looks like they have a 1994 PS 205 in very good condition that they are selling on consignment. They are giving me the first right of refusal. I don't have any pictures but will be looking at it this weekend. I don't have the hours yet either however I'm told less then 500. They are talking about $16k, which I think is high for that boat but I'm still going to look at it and discuss it with the wife, aka "CFO".

If I understand correctly, the hull on the 1994 PS 205 is the same as the 190 of that year, just longer. If that's the case, would the wake characteristics be the same as the 190 or should I expect a little bit of a harder wake? Also, am I correct in thinking that the PS 190 was one of the better slalom wakes out there?

Wakes are very close to the 190 of that era. I consider this to be among the best open bow ski boats MC ever made. Had I wanted an open bow, I'd still have my 1993 205. $16K might be a little high, but I have seen them go for more, even without the fuel injection, when they are in top notch condition. :)

Chris P
03-23-2011, 02:25 PM
Thanks for the words, guys. The dealer says it's in great condition. I'll let you all know when I see it. Right now, it's between this boat and a really nice Malibu Response LX that I've been looking at. The 205 may be better for us financially though. The Response LX is a 2002 with 450 hours and he's asking $18k but has flexibility on the price. I'm sure the CFO will chime in on this and assist in the decision making.

JohnE
03-23-2011, 02:26 PM
Isn't a consignment boat necessarily going to be a bit higher? Typical cut is 10%?

I wouldn't sweat the extra money if boat is in very good shape and available.

JohnE
03-23-2011, 02:27 PM
I don't know much about the malibu. But you won't go wrong with the 205

Bouyhead
03-23-2011, 02:28 PM
JohnE is spot on, the 205 is very desirable and it SCREAMS re-sale value. Here's a good read about the 205.65231

sand2snow22
03-23-2011, 02:30 PM
I don't know much about the malibu. But you won't go wrong with the 205

It's crazy that a boat 8 years older is in the same price ballpark as a 2002 Malibu.....It says a lot, especially since the BU owner is still willing to drop his shorts ;) Now I just have to figure out what it says? :o

east tx skier
03-23-2011, 02:37 PM
If it looks like this, buy it. :)

Ski-me
03-23-2011, 02:38 PM
Chris,
I have the 94' 205 and really do love it! We've had it for about 3 years and it really has been a great purchase. For the $16k it should be in great shape. I would also expect it to have the LT1 engine in it (a bit more horsepower than the stock).

When I compare the 205 to the 197, I was surprisingly dissapointed in the amount of room up front. Although the lines are nice on the 197, there just isn't as much room up there if you have kids.

The wake on the 205 is great as well. I'm no pro skier but it certainly works great for our family. Just last summer while skiing, I had a 2003 MC 190 come up to us and asked why our wake "seemed" flatter than theirs. I told them theoretically, their boat should be definitley better than mine. They asked if I would ski behind thier boat to compare to my old, 205. Well, my conclusion, definitely a nice wake and maybe a "little" better than mine....but not $12k better!

Drove away feeling great about our purchase.

The 205 is very versatile.....good luck on it!

Other hopeful options:
Heater
Perfect Pass
Hot Shower (not as important in my mind though)
double axle trailer

All these would help justify the higher price.

Chris P
03-23-2011, 02:39 PM
JohnE is spot on, the 205 is very desirable and it SCREAMS re-sale value. Here's a good read about the 205.65231

This is a good read. Thanks.

Chris P
03-23-2011, 02:39 PM
If it looks like this, buy it. :)

Close.....black with the blue stripe. There is one just like this of the same year on our lake.

east tx skier
03-23-2011, 02:41 PM
Chris,
Well, my conclusion, definitely a nice wake and maybe a "little" better than mine....but not $12k better!



I had the exact same thought once when the price differential was about $15K between those two models. :)

Ski-me
03-23-2011, 02:42 PM
This is a good read. Thanks.


That write-up was SO valuable for me.....

Chris P
03-23-2011, 02:43 PM
Chris,
I have the 94' 205 and really do love it! We've had it for about 3 years and it really has been a great purchase. For the $16k it should be in great shape. I would also expect it to have the LT1 engine in it (a bit more horsepower than the stock).

When I compare the 205 to the 197, I was surprisingly dissapointed in the amount of room up front. Although the lines are nice on the 197, there just isn't as much room up there if you have kids.

The wake on the 205 is great as well. I'm no pro skier but it certainly works great for our family. Just last summer while skiing, I had a 2003 MC 190 come up to us and asked why our wake "seemed" flatter than theirs. I told them theoretically, their boat should be definitley better than mine. They asked if I would ski behind thier boat to compare to my old, 205. Well, my conclusion, definitely a nice wake and maybe a "little" better than mine....but not $12k better!

Drove away feeling great about our purchase.

The 205 is very versatile.....good luck on it!

Other hopeful options:
Heater
Perfect Pass
Hot Shower (not as important in my mind though)
double axle trailer

All these would help justify the higher price.

Great information. Thanks. I would love to have a heater and perfect pass. The shower would be nice however not entirely necessary. A tandem axle trailer would also be nice but the ramp is within 1/4 mile and the boat will spend little time on the trailer. I agree that they would directly affect the price.

Bouyhead
03-23-2011, 02:53 PM
It's crazy that a boat 8 years older is in the same price ballpark as a 2002 Malibu.....It says a lot, especially since the BU owner is still willing to drop his shorts ;) Now I just have to figure out what it says? :o

I don't know much about the malibu. But you won't go wrong with the 205

I have alot of experiance with BU's. They run them at the club where I ski. Iv'e been doing all the maintenance and most repairs since 2003. From a skiers perspective there fun to drive and awesome to ski behind. As far as constuction and quality are concerned they are garbage. Go on the BU forum and search HDS box replacement,It's pretty sad the way they construct a boat.

Long Live My 96' PS 190!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Ski-me
03-23-2011, 02:55 PM
I have alot of experiance with BU's. They run them at the club where I ski. Iv'e been doing all the maintenance and most repairs since 2003. From a skiers perspective there fun to drive and awesome to ski behind. As far as constuction and quality are concerned they are garbage. Go on the BU forum and search HDS box replacement,It's pretty sad the way they construct a boat.

Long Live My 96' PS 190!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Did you see any difference in quality from the LX (older one) vs. a LXi Response version? Say 2004+ or so? They "seem" better but don't know.

Chris P
03-23-2011, 03:02 PM
I have alot of experiance with BU's. They run them at the club where I ski. Iv'e been doing all the maintenance and most repairs since 2003. From a skiers perspective there fun to drive and awesome to ski behind. As far as constuction and quality are concerned they are garbage. Go on the BU forum and search HDS box replacement,It's pretty sad the way they construct a boat.

Long Live My 96' PS 190!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Thanks. This is good to know. I have spent some time on the Bu forum and have seen exactly what you refer to here. So here's a question for you. Which would you prefer to ski behind and why?

Bouyhead
03-23-2011, 03:06 PM
Did you see any difference in quality from the LX (older one) vs. a LXi Response version? Say 2004+ or so? They "seem" better but don't know.

Not really,my buddie has a 99' Response with the HDS construction & the clubs new 2010 LXi last year still had it. IIRC 10+ years ago they were competitivly priced and that was the big draw for some people.

Bouyhead
03-23-2011, 03:25 PM
Thanks. This is good to know. I have spent some time on the Bu forum and have seen exactly what you refer to here. So here's a question for you. Which would you prefer to ski behind and why?

I ski @ 34MPH and just started running 32' off about half the time last year. I really don't feel a difference between the two. But at slower speeds the BU is hard to beat.

Chris P
03-23-2011, 03:37 PM
I ski @ 34MPH and just started running 32' off about half the time last year. I really don't feel a difference between the two. But at slower speeds the BU is hard to beat.

I hear that a lot. I have not skied in.....22 years or so. It's going to take some time to learn again. You have a hell of a point though regarding the HDS issue on the BU. I can't understand why they would continue to manufacture boats with an inferior component like that for so many years. It's crazy.

Chris P
03-23-2011, 04:03 PM
I have spent some quality time with the used boat purchasing guide here and have another question. Specifically related to the 1994 PS 205, are there any known issues with that boat that I should be on the look out for beyond what is mentioned in the guide? TIA.

east tx skier
03-23-2011, 05:13 PM
Not that I know of. Those TBI engines are pretty bullet proof as are the transmissions. The LT-1 is a great upgrade, but not an absolute necessity. Trailers are solid in that era, too. Just look for normal wear and tear and make sure it has been well maintained. Don't do the deal without a nice, long test drive.

sand2snow22
03-23-2011, 05:27 PM
Eastie, you going to let him get away with saying the BU is hard to beat at slower speeds? :)

DooSPX
03-23-2011, 05:49 PM
I love my closed bow 91 190, if I ever would need an open bow, I would buy a 94 with the LT1 over a newer prostar 197. Also, FYI, 91-94 same hulls on the 190's and 92-94 205's same hulls just a few different engine options

Chris P
03-23-2011, 07:38 PM
Don't do the deal without a nice, long test drive.


This is one of the most important things to me in a boat buy is the test drive. I was able to negotiate my pontoon buy down considerably based on what I discovered in the test drive. This is great advise.

Chris P
03-23-2011, 07:39 PM
Just want to say thanks to all you guys for being so forthcoming with information and opinions. I really appreciate it. It makes the buy easier and more fun. Considering I grew with with I/O and outboards, the inboard thing is totally new to me.

TNH2oSkier
03-23-2011, 10:02 PM
Lots of good info on here, and some really biased brand based info also. Look at the all of the boats with an open mind, there are some bad years on all the big three's productions. If your talking 205's the 99 interior is really bad. The responses were not shoe box hull/deck mating till after 98 iirc, and the sport by cc has crappy guages in 2000 and 2001.

My small bit of advise is look for a well cared for used boat, that a family is outgrowing, you want one that has been used often, but not abused. Sitting unused is a maintenance nightmare for someone.

Whats really important? Wake, bow room, or something else? If you havent skied in 22 years, any of the dd wakes are going to be great.

Just thought I'd throw in my rant, and try and get things back to an even slant. :)

Chris P
03-23-2011, 10:08 PM
Lots of good info on here, and some really biased brand based info also. Look at the all of the boats with an open mind, there are some bad years on all the big three's productions. If your talking 205's the 99 interior is really bad. The responses were not shoe box hull/deck mating till after 98 iirc, and the sport by cc has crappy guages in 2000 and 2001.

My small bit of advise is look for a well cared for used boat, that a family is outgrowing, you want one that has been used often, but not abused. Sitting unused is a maintenance nightmare for someone.

Whats really important? Wake, bow room, or something else? If you havent skied in 22 years, any of the dd wakes are going to be great.

Just thought I'd throw in my rant, and try and get things back to an even slant. :)

Thanks. i appreciate it. Order of importance outside of how well the boat was maintained are wake, then bow room. Obviously this is assuming that all mechanical and electrical components of the boat are in good working order.

east tx skier
03-23-2011, 11:42 PM
Lots of good info on here, and some really biased brand based info also. Look at the all of the boats with an open mind, there are some bad years on all the big three's productions. If your talking 205's the 99 interior is really bad. The responses were not shoe box hull/deck mating till after 98 iirc, and the sport by cc has crappy guages in 2000 and 2001.

My small bit of advise is look for a well cared for used boat, that a family is outgrowing, you want one that has been used often, but not abused. Sitting unused is a maintenance nightmare for someone.

Whats really important? Wake, bow room, or something else? If you havent skied in 22 years, any of the dd wakes are going to be great.

Just thought I'd throw in my rant, and try and get things back to an even slant. :)

Good points here. It's the teleflex digital gauges that were so problematic in that era of CC. CC offered a replacement program for the 2000--2002 model years. So many chose to upgrade the teleflex digital speedos an tach with Faria analog gauges. Pretty easy to spot if you're looking at that era of CC.

east tx skier
03-23-2011, 11:45 PM
Eastie, you going to let him get away with saying the BU is hard to beat at slower speeds? :)

I have skied a 96, 97, 02, and 08 responses. They have nice wakes at low speeds, but I wouldn't trade my 98 ski for one.

JohnE
03-24-2011, 10:53 AM
I love my closed bow 91 190, if I ever would need an open bow, I would buy a 94 with the LT1 over a newer prostar 197. Also, FYI, 91-94 same hulls on the 190's and 92-94 205's same hulls just a few different engine options

I believe the 96 205 hull was the same as the prior years. That just the 190 was new for that year. Not positive, someone else might confirm.

east tx skier
03-24-2011, 10:59 AM
I believe the 96 205 hull was the same as the prior years. That just the 190 was new for that year. Not positive, someone else might confirm.

Confirmed.

1st Gen. 205 92--95.
2nd Gen. 205 96--2000.

Deck changed on the second gen. in 99 or 2000, but the hull was the same.

JohnE
03-24-2011, 11:51 AM
Confirmed.

1st Gen. 205 92--95.
2nd Gen. 205 96--2000.

Deck changed on the second gen. in 99 or 2000, but the hull was the same.

Thanks Doug, I had a typo I guess tho. I said 96 but they ran until 95

east tx skier
03-24-2011, 12:12 PM
Thanks Doug, I had a typo I guess tho. I said 96 but they ran until 95

Looks like I misread it, too. I thought you were right. :)

chico
03-24-2011, 07:53 PM
Chris I also have a 94 205,I love it It does everything I need,Have you ever driven a bu?just feel the difference when you hit some waves,they wave back at you,hard to beat MC quality.

Chris P
03-24-2011, 09:19 PM
Chris I also have a 94 205,I love it It does everything I need,Have you ever driven a bu?just feel the difference when you hit some waves,they wave back at you,hard to beat MC quality.

Only driven one direct drive boat.....it was an early 80's stars and stripes. I have never been behind the wheel of a malibu.

east tx skier
03-24-2011, 10:05 PM
For what it's worth, the waves hit the early nineties 205s pretty good. Had plenty of filling rattling rides in some rough water in ours.

Chris P
03-25-2011, 06:12 AM
Fortunately, I can always come back and grab the toon if the lake gets busy.

Chris P
03-25-2011, 03:36 PM
Well, I received some pictures from the seller of the '94 PS205 I mentioned several posts back. The boat looks very clean even though the pictures are not the greatest. It's in indoor storage here locally (20 miles from home) and I'm going to check it out tomorrow. This is a one owner boat that the local MC dealer sold originally and has maintained and stored it since purchased new. It has 220 hours on it, single axle trailer, perfect pass, and a cover. From the pictures, it looks like it may have sat in the water because you can see some lake scum on it. That worries me a bit however I'll know more when I see it. From the pictures, it appears as though the vinyl is in very good condition but again, seeing it first hand will tell the tale.

I'll report back when I see the thing. I'm not doing anything in terms of offers yet because I'm not willing to do so without a water test. I just can't bring myself to make a commitment like that without a real world run down. I would be worried about the low hours if it was a private seller who claims all maintenance was done. Considering this dealer has a solid reputation, I have no reason to disbelieve their claims that they have done all maintenance and there are no issues with the boat mechanically.

Any words of wisdom from the crew other than take another read through the used boat buying guide (which I printed out and highlighted some key things that I may overlook having never owned a DD boat)?

Ski-me
03-25-2011, 04:59 PM
What engine does it have? The LT1 says "corvette" on it so it's pretty obvious.

Mine also had low hours (3 years ago at about 200 hrs) so I'm guessing it sat around most it's life too. I've had to put a little bit into it but nothing really out of the ordinary. New plugs, wire, impellar, etc.

Watch the temp gauge to be sure it goes up to the proper temp (around 165 to 170) and be sure it doesn't fluctuate too much. If it get's too hot it may start sputtering around. The LT1 engine has been known to be tempermental if it's gotten too hot (warped heads) but how to identify, I don't know. Take your time and go for a long test drive.

Keep in mind, you can't really "steer" the boat in reverse (Direct Drives)....so be ready. It's nothing like an I/O and takes a little getting use to.

Good luck and keep us posted.

east tx skier
03-25-2011, 05:11 PM
Well, I received some pictures from the seller of the '94 PS205 I mentioned several posts back. The boat looks very clean even though the pictures are not the greatest. It's in indoor storage here locally (20 miles from home) and I'm going to check it out tomorrow. This is a one owner boat that the local MC dealer sold originally and has maintained and stored it since purchased new. It has 220 hours on it, single axle trailer, perfect pass, and a cover. From the pictures, it looks like it may have sat in the water because you can see some lake scum on it. That worries me a bit however I'll know more when I see it. From the pictures, it appears as though the vinyl is in very good condition but again, seeing it first hand will tell the tale.

I'll report back when I see the thing. I'm not doing anything in terms of offers yet because I'm not willing to do so without a water test. I just can't bring myself to make a commitment like that without a real world run down. I would be worried about the low hours if it was a private seller who claims all maintenance was done. Considering this dealer has a solid reputation, I have no reason to disbelieve their claims that they have done all maintenance and there are no issues with the boat mechanically.

Any words of wisdom from the crew other than take another read through the used boat buying guide (which I printed out and highlighted some key things that I may overlook having never owned a DD boat)?

Let's see the pictures!

sand2snow22
03-25-2011, 05:14 PM
Someone please correct me if I'm wrong, but lake scum is pretty easy to clean off and the least of your worries. You can still quiz, quiz, quiz the seller why he never cleaned it......Ask for price break to get the boat detailed....

Chris P
03-25-2011, 06:15 PM
Someone please correct me if I'm wrong, but lake scum is pretty easy to clean off and the least of your worries. You can still quiz, quiz, quiz the seller why he never cleaned it......Ask for price break to get the boat detailed....

This is from a dealer who sold the boat originally and has maintained and stored it since the original sale. They will detail if I buy. That has been discussed. In fact, they're going to do so soon. I've been talking with the dealer about a boat for a while and the salesman I'm dealing with mentioned it to me about 6 weeks ago. It's become a reality and he is giving me first right of refusal before telling other salesmen that the boat is available.

Chris P
03-25-2011, 06:16 PM
What engine does it have? The LT1 says "corvette" on it so it's pretty obvious.

Mine also had low hours (3 years ago at about 200 hrs) so I'm guessing it sat around most it's life too. I've had to put a little bit into it but nothing really out of the ordinary. New plugs, wire, impellar, etc.

Watch the temp gauge to be sure it goes up to the proper temp (around 165 to 170) and be sure it doesn't fluctuate too much. If it get's too hot it may start sputtering around. The LT1 engine has been known to be tempermental if it's gotten too hot (warped heads) but how to identify, I don't know. Take your time and go for a long test drive.

Keep in mind, you can't really "steer" the boat in reverse (Direct Drives)....so be ready. It's nothing like an I/O and takes a little getting use to.

Good luck and keep us posted.

Thanks. This is good advice. I don't believe that it has the LT-1 engine. I saw no insignia on the pictures. The pictures are not the greatest. I'll try to post them. Have never done so before.

Chris P
03-25-2011, 06:19 PM
Here are a the pics that I received. Like I said, they're not the greatest pics, but give you the idea.

Sodar
03-25-2011, 06:29 PM
That hull will clean right up with some hull cleaner. If that is the only issue, don't let it scare you off.

SDProstar
03-25-2011, 11:20 PM
Wow. Looks nice from those photos.

sand2snow22
03-25-2011, 11:31 PM
Left drivers seat looks concerning. Might just be a leaf though?

Chris P
03-26-2011, 12:53 AM
Left drivers seat looks concerning. Might just be a leaf though?

That's what I was thinking. I'm really looking forward to seeing it tomorrow.

Bouyhead
03-26-2011, 06:52 AM
This is a good thread. Potential MC owner doing his homework, and has his eye on a real sweet boat! Looking foward to some detailed pics.

Chris P
03-26-2011, 07:08 AM
I agree. This is a good thread. I really have to do my home work. This is going to be a 10 year purchase for us and it's the first toy I've been able to buy since our little girl came into the world (sold motorcycles and snowmobiles shortly after marriage.....big mistake btw) so it's essential for me to do this correctly the first time. I'll try to get some good pics today while I'm there looking at the boat. I'm going to go through it as best I can with hopes of getting yet more stellar advise from the knowledge base here.

bturner2
03-26-2011, 09:15 AM
Love the colors. As Sodar stated don't worry about the scum, it'll come right off and at this point could actually help you in getting a better price. I love it when sellers don't take the time to clean up their stuff before selling. A lot of times this will indicate that the seller has lost interest and sees the boat more of annoyance than a prized possession and will have less attachment to it. It's also great that the boat has been stored inside. It's been my experience that even when a boat is shrink wrapped the winter and UV will take a toll on a boat left outside.

bturner2
03-26-2011, 09:40 AM
Couple other quick thoughts..... Make sure you take notes on everything you see that might need repaired or replaced due to wear (tires, torn upholstery, frayed bow strap etc). If they don't have a receipt for the maintenance items include items like spark plugs, wires, impeller etc as items to be replaced. Once you've looked at the boat unless you're sure this is a killer deal or THE boat for you try not the close the deal. When get home research how much all this is going to cost you to fix/replace. At that point you'll have a good idea what might be a fair price and data that you can produce to justify your offer. I've used this method to negotiate the purchase of a couple of my boats and it's worked quite well.

Also get a clear understanding as to what's included with the boat. The last boat I purchased still had the PO's wife's high end double fixed boot slalom ski, comp vest and her wakeboard in the boat along with CDs, dock lines and a bunch of other personal stuff. Sometimes this can add value to the purchase but in this case it was just a simple mistake.

Once I got the boat home (after a 12 hour drive) I called the PO to let him know what I'd found. He was upset that he'd left all his wife's gear in the boat and we quickly arranged for him to pay the shipping to send the items he wanted back.

Chris P
03-26-2011, 09:43 AM
Thanks, bturner2. I'm happy to see that it was stored inside as well. I will be seeing the boat this afternoon and will take some pictures of my own. Depending on what I see, I may put a deposit on it to hold until I get a chance for a watertest.

I

The8Ball
03-26-2011, 09:52 AM
Note... that is not the original tach in this boat. It is thereby not the original hour meter either! ... make sure the hours are accounted for correctly! ... I see older boats all the time with low hours... on the REPLACED tach... where is the original tach, original hour meter? Gotta watch out for that.

Ski-me
03-26-2011, 10:56 AM
Note... that is not the original tach in this boat. It is thereby not the original hour meter either! ... make sure the hours are accounted for correctly! ... I see older boats all the time with low hours... on the REPLACED tach... where is the original tach, original hour meter? Gotta watch out for that.

It looks like the same tach in my 94'.....what's the difference?

Chris P
03-26-2011, 11:05 AM
One of the guys on the lake here has a 1995 and the tach looks just like what ski-me posted.

Footin
03-26-2011, 12:15 PM
Identical to my boat. I love mine.

east tx skier
03-26-2011, 02:18 PM
Looks good!

Chris P
03-26-2011, 02:47 PM
Footin....Exactly like that.

I just got back from looking at the boat. It's in really good shape. The boat was hoist kept. However it was in a canal area that fills up with leaves, etc. and I think that's why there's some water stains. Going in an out of the area stains the boat up.

The spots in the pictures on the seats are bird crap. Should clean up ok. Boat has 318 hours on it and appears to be in really good condition. I still think they want to much for it. The brokerage deal is not yet established between the current owner of the boat and the dealer. The current owner has put a deposit down on a new boat and the dealer hopes to get the brokerage agreement in place this week.

There is one tiny tear in the vinyl on the rear seat. It's about half the size of a pencil eraser. Otherwise the vinyl is soft to the touch and really looks good albeit a bit dirty. It's stored in a heated facility (over 55* F) but it is dusty in there and the boat is equally dusty. The current owner is paying for the inspection by the dealer.

Gelcoat looks pretty good. A few scratches in the transom, to be expected, and some marks on the rub rail, also to be expected. Otherwise, the boat is in really nice condition for its age. The dealer would accept a contingent deposit based on a water test which is something that I'm considering. However, my wife thinks that $16k is too much to spend on a boat. I can see $16k being a bit much for this boat however not for a boat in general.

She has no clue on the value of these boats and I can't figure out how to convince her what we would be getting for the money. Any words of wisdom here, regardless of the boat purchased, is welcome.

Bouyhead
03-26-2011, 03:01 PM
Take your wife shopping and show her a brand spanking new 197, then show her the MSRP. If this 205 is totaly unmolested & original it's not that far out of the ballpark. It's also got one of the best slalom wakes as far as the older open bows go. Are you mechaniclly inclined to do compression check etc. I know the dealer probably already offered but for the money you might be spending a marine survey would be money well spent.

sand2snow22
03-26-2011, 04:05 PM
That vinyl repair should be easy and I'm sure you can find a mobile person in your area......

Ski-me
03-26-2011, 08:05 PM
Just let your wife buy the boat.....that's what I did!

I was on a bike trip in Moab and our boat was an ebay one so I didn't have access to a computer. My wife was the one who actually bought the boat and out-bid everyone. I didn't find out if we got the boat until the end of the day (and bike ride). Pretty sweet actually.....she had a part in the purchase so that was cool.

Chris P
03-26-2011, 08:40 PM
That is good advice, ski-me.......but......if I let her do it we'd have a bayliner. She's kind of cheap that way.

bturner2
03-27-2011, 10:40 AM
The approach I would take would be be on the resale and investment angle of buying a MastercCraft.

The main difference on these boats from other boats is resale. On your typical I/O you can pretty much expect to lose you a$$ on resale. The boat you purchased for $15K this year will be worth $10K in two years. The last three MasterCrafts I've had and sold only lost a fraction of what I paid for them over the course of 4 or 5 years. My last long term boat was a 95 200VRS that I bought for $18K in 98. I sold it in one week for $15K in 2007 and had put 400 hours on it. I probably could have more out of it had I not been in a hurry to close the deal on the new boat.

If you take your time and get the right boat you won't do bad if/when you decide to sell it. The problem with buying a boat from a dealer of broker is that you're paying a middle man a grand or two for hooking the deal up. Unless he needs the boat gone to make the money on the new boat you can expect to pay quite a bit more than what you would if you bought it directly from the owner. Also buying a boat at this time of year is probably the most expensive time to buy. There are going to be deals out there so don't feel like you have to take something you think is overpriced.

TX.X-30 fan
03-27-2011, 10:50 AM
That is good advice, ski-me.......but......if I let her do it we'd have a bayliner. She's kind of cheap that way.




So your saying your wife tends to settle for less..........:D

bturner2
03-27-2011, 10:57 AM
So your saying your wife tends to settle for less..........:D

That's what I like about TX. Always insightful......

03 35th Anniversary
03-27-2011, 11:01 AM
That's what I like about TX. Always insightful......

I thought it was just him being an A$$Hole??? :D

TX.X-30 fan
03-27-2011, 11:16 AM
That's what I like about TX. Always insightful......




Its a fine line..........:D

scott023
03-27-2011, 11:17 AM
I thought it was just him being an A$$Hole??? :D

You're right. That's how he rolls...

TX.X-30 fan
03-27-2011, 11:34 AM
You're right. That's how he rolls...




Obviously the people from the great state of Michigan know "insightful" when they see it.

Chris P
03-27-2011, 02:21 PM
So your saying your wife tends to settle for less..........:D

Funny however no.....just saying she simply doesn't understand the value in something like this. Honestly could go buy an old POS Moomba and she would think it was great because it was cheap.

I do appreciate the smart a$$ in you, TX.....reminds me of myself a bit.

TX.X-30 fan
03-27-2011, 03:14 PM
All in fun no ill intent, good luck with the boat hunt. Took my wife to see a used one at the dealer and she hated it but saw an all black new one in the lot still in shrink wrap. And that was the end.

Chris P
03-27-2011, 05:39 PM
No ill interpreted from your statements. Super funny honestly.

I too took my wife to the dealer.....she crapper her pants when she saw some of the new boats....then crapped them again when she saw the pricing.

Chris P
04-14-2011, 09:55 PM
Well, I have purchased a boat. Some of you here may not like it but, I purchased a 1997 Malibu Sunsetter LX. The boat is in fantastic shape and the price was right. The gel coat showed what I would assume to be typical signs of wear for a 14 yr old boat. I will be rubbing and polishing this weekend and based on the test I did, it's going to look fantastic.

I really appreciate all the comments and helpful information here from all of you that participated in this thread. Your insight has been helpful.

captain planet
04-14-2011, 10:06 PM
Obviously the people from the great state of Michigan know "insightful" when they see it.

Seriously?.....:rolleyes:

Justjoe
04-14-2011, 10:09 PM
Uh, yeah? Hmmmmph.

captain planet
04-14-2011, 10:48 PM
Well, I have purchased a boat. Some of you here may not like it but, I purchased a 1997 Malibu Sunsetter LX. The boat is in fantastic shape and the price was right. The gel coat showed what I would assume to be typical signs of wear for a 14 yr old boat. I will be rubbing and polishing this weekend and based on the test I did, it's going to look fantastic.

I really appreciate all the comments and helpful information here from all of you that participated in this thread. Your insight has been helpful.

Ugh, I'm so sorry. Good luck. :)

skierdan
04-14-2011, 10:55 PM
Someone point him to the thread with those nice pics of how a Mastercraft is built compared to the "others"

No offense to your purchase Chris, if it works for you and your family than that is all that counts. enjoy.

Ski-me
04-15-2011, 12:44 PM
Hey, at least you got a ski boat! Congrats and hope it keeps the family on the water more often now. That's the purpose for sure. You'll probably get a little jabbin' but it's all in fun as we do love our MC's around here........Maybe next go around you'll consider a MC!

Is that the open bow model with no walk-thru??

east tx skier
04-15-2011, 02:13 PM
Well, I have purchased a boat. Some of you here may not like it but, I purchased a 1997 Malibu Sunsetter LX. The boat is in fantastic shape and the price was right. The gel coat showed what I would assume to be typical signs of wear for a 14 yr old boat. I will be rubbing and polishing this weekend and based on the test I did, it's going to look fantastic.

I really appreciate all the comments and helpful information here from all of you that participated in this thread. Your insight has been helpful.

Congrats on your purchase. Enjoy your new boat!

Chris P
04-16-2011, 11:22 PM
Ski-me and East Tx Skier,

Thanks for your support. I understand that most on this site would obviously like to bash the competition, etc. however my goal was to purchase a good quality boat with space for a growing family without breaking the bank. I think I have accomplished the goal. And for those of you who wish to give me a hard time about it that's fine.....at least I don't own a bayliner and had enough interest to do the research, ask questions, participate in this forum, and ultimately purchase one of the "big 3" inboard water sports boat maker's products.

Our boat is in fantastic shape, has a ton of interior space, and is a joy compared to the I/O and OB background both my wife and I have. As we rediscover our love for water sports, we will eventually upgrade. However, we are pleased with the purchase and certainly appreciate the insight offered in this thread by Team Talk Members.

Thanks again to all Team Talk Members who have participate in the thread. Have a great season.

Happy boating, skiing, boarding, and surfing!

PS....I'll likely still follow the Team Talk site simply because I love inboard boats and in my mind, MC and Malibu are at the top of their game and the information in the respective forums is beneficial regardless of what boat you own.

sand2snow22
04-16-2011, 11:48 PM
Chris, congrats on the boat. I'm sure you already know about themalibucrew.com? Good site. I'm on there as well.

Chris P
04-17-2011, 09:08 AM
Chris, congrats on the boat. I'm sure you already know about themalibucrew.com? Good site. I'm on there as well.

Thanks! I've been a member there for a while. Look me up there. Name is "inlandlaker" on that site.

CantRepeat
04-17-2011, 09:16 AM
Well, I have purchased a boat. Some of you here may not like it but, I purchased a 1997 Malibu Sunsetter LX. The boat is in fantastic shape and the price was right. The gel coat showed what I would assume to be typical signs of wear for a 14 yr old boat. I will be rubbing and polishing this weekend and based on the test I did, it's going to look fantastic.

I really appreciate all the comments and helpful information here from all of you that participated in this thread. Your insight has been helpful.

Congrats!

The bottom line is, that boats are just a vehicle to fun with friends and family. If you get that out your boat then you made the right choice. Enjoy it brother!

Footin
04-17-2011, 10:52 AM
I think it's great you bought a boat for you and your family to enjoy, I don't care what the name on the side is....have fun, that's whats important.

JohnE
04-17-2011, 11:17 AM
Chris congrats on the boat. I'll never sit here and tell you that MC is the only choice. Sounds like you bought a good boat at a good price. You and your family and friends will have tons of good times on it I'm sure. Check back in from time to time.

Ryan
04-17-2011, 09:37 PM
Those SS Lx's are good boats - rear storage behind the rear seatback, and a wake that was surprisingly lower and softer than my expectations were based on the hull shape. Congrats Chris.

Chris P
04-17-2011, 09:49 PM
Thanks, guys. I'll certainly be checking back on this site periodically. The are some great resources here.

"I think it's great you bought a boat for you and your family to enjoy, I don't care what the name on the side is....have fun, that's whats important."

This is very true by the way.

Ski-me
04-18-2011, 12:31 PM
Ah, I found a similar one to yours. Looks like you have a lot of room up front and the rear seat has some ski storage too! Also looks to be pretty roomy.

This is a 96' being sold at our local MC dealer.....pretty decent shape actually.

http://www.swperformancemarine.com/2011_website_037.htm

Chris P
04-18-2011, 12:46 PM
Ah, I found a similar one to yours. Looks like you have a lot of room up front and the rear seat has some ski storage too! Also looks to be pretty roomy.

This is a 96' being sold at our local MC dealer.....pretty decent shape actually.

http://www.swperformancemarine.com/2011_website_037.htm

That is very similar to mine. It is surprisingly roomy. I took a very close look at a nice 1995 PS205 and this has a touch more room than the 205.