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leadstrader
02-14-2011, 09:12 AM
1 Alpine Cda 9886m Marine Cd Player
1 Alpine Mc 20 Marine Remote
1 Jl Audio Mhd 900/5 Marine Amp
2 Jl Audio M650ccx Marine Spks
1 Jl Audio M770ccx Marine Spks
1 Jl Audio M101b5 Marine Sub
1 Blue Top Gel Cell Battery
1 Marine 3 Way Battery Switch

Yellow X9
02-14-2011, 09:24 AM
lookin good so far

CantRepeat
02-14-2011, 09:26 AM
I can vouch for the 9886 and the MC20. Had that head unit in my old boat and I have 2 MC20 remotes in my new boat. Both are great products.

So you are going to run 2 sets IE 4 650s, 1 set of 770s and 1 101 for a total of 7 speakers on a single amp?

If that is what you are saying then no I would not do that. You'll be amazed at just how well the JL stuff sounds if you power it correctly. I say this because my boat came set up with 7 speakers on just 1 amp. While it sounded ok from the factory, but just adding an amp for the tower speakers and giving each cabin speaker its own power supply it sounds 100 times better.

And if you are going to run tower speakers, which it looks like you are, you might want to either get a Wetsound 420 or go with the Alpine 118M. The 420 has seperate volume for the tower and the 118 has two volume zones so you can have different volume in the boat and tower.

leadstrader
02-14-2011, 09:47 AM
Thanks Tim,
it was my understanding the MHD 900/5 amp had 5 channels and the 5th was for the sub.. and the other 4 channels could handle two speakers each.

if this is wrong please let me know... and if you would suggest another amp what woudl it be?

spending three grand to get this all installed, is that a good or fair price?

thanks again

CantRepeat
02-14-2011, 10:09 AM
I could be wrong but looking at the numbers the amp does 75w RMS and the 650s are 70w RMS 150 peak. If you run all 4 650s off of two channels they'll get 75/2 = 37.5w. This is why I believe my stereo didn't sound all that great. Once I gave each speaker it's own power source it came to life.

I would think you'd be better off with say:

M600/6 and a mono sub amp say a M600/1 or a MHD750/1. Turn the gain down on the sub amp because they have a lot of power.

When you say 3k install I assume that includes all the gear which doesn't seem to expensive.

What boat is this setup going in? You might want to take a look at Sodar's install thread. It's a good read and might save you some bucks.

http://www.mastercraft.com/teamtalk/showthread.php?t=28992

I'm no stereo guru but there are a few vendor/installers here so hopefully they can give you better info.

leadstrader
02-14-2011, 12:45 PM
prostar 197

3k includes everything. will update with pictures after wednesday!

CantRepeat
02-14-2011, 12:47 PM
prostar 197

3k includes everything. will update with pictures after wednesday!

Then for sure look at Sodar's install.

CantRepeat
02-14-2011, 04:22 PM
Then for sure look at Sodar's install.

Oh and make sure you get some photos of the install as well. Lots of DIYers here who love to look at installs.

TallRedRider
02-14-2011, 06:27 PM
Then for sure look at Sodar's install.

I just saw that for the first time. Excellent craftsmanship!

EarmarkMarine
02-14-2011, 09:08 PM
leadstrader,
That is all fantastic gear but there are a few issues.
The JL Audio HD900/5 is specifically biased for a 4-ohm load on all highpass channels. So while it puts out 100 x 4 into a 4-ohm load it only puts out 75 x 4 into a 2-ohm load. And, just two of the highpass channels used on a lower impedance will rebias all four highpass channels. This is in contrast to the lowpass portion of the HD900/5 and all other HD models which are strictly regulated and deliver their full rated power into a broad impedance load (any load from 1.5 to 4-ohms). Because the HD600/4 has separate front and rear power supplies, channels 1&2 operate independently of 3&4. Unregulared amplifiers behave differently in various applications. Not many know all the ins and outs.
There are better choices within the JL Audio line-up for your particular situation.
Email me if you like. I'd like to know more details about your boat and I may have other suggestions. But again, I'm totally on board with the JL Audio product.

David
Earmark Marine

Thrall
02-14-2011, 09:32 PM
75W to 2 speakers is not enough power to correctly power the speakers you have. If you're putting this much money and effort into your system you need another amp (assuming you meant 2 PAIRS of 6.5's and 1 PAIR of 7.7's). Either take the 900/5 amp and use it for the sub and 4 cockpit speakers and get another 150W/ch 2 channel amp for the tower speakers (7.7's), or get an inexpensive amp like a JL M2150 (75Wx2ch) and use it for the front cockpit speakers and run the rest 1:1 off of the big amp.
Option 2 may limit how you can fade music from the cockpit to the tower or front to rear, depending on the pre amp outs on your head unit without splitting the pre amp outs to multiple locations.
IMO better to at least have your system set up to run another amp, big enough distribution block to add another load to it.
Check out the picture. The dist blocks on the right are for the 3 amps in my boat. + is fused, no in-line fuses with this setup. - is the non fused block.
The set on the left is for all other boat functions (engine cranking, dash power, ballast).
Don't short change yourself here if you ever intend on upgrading or adding more amps.

CantRepeat
02-14-2011, 09:53 PM
Did I say I love this board today? If not, love the people here.

I swear, really... no BS no crap talk just good advice in an extremely friendly place.

Dig it!

craig3972
02-14-2011, 10:37 PM
I can vouch for the 9886 and the MC20. Had that head unit in my old boat and I have 2 MC20 remotes in my new boat. Both are great products.

sorry for the hijack - but I was interested in the performance of the Alpine MC1 http://www.alpine-usa.com/product/view/mc1/ with the head unit mounted in the glove box, does the head unit respond without delay when commands are input into the remote and vice versa? Does the subwoofer control work well?

CantRepeat
02-14-2011, 11:22 PM
sorry for the hijack - but I was interested in the performance of the Alpine MC1 http://www.alpine-usa.com/product/view/mc1/ with the head unit mounted in the glove box, does the head unit respond without delay when commands are input into the remote and vice versa? Does the subwoofer control work well?

Sub works well.

The MC1 and MC20 are radio so there is some delay in them. I found it best to just hold button until the display changes. That's normally about a second or two. No big deal really.

EarmarkMarine
02-14-2011, 11:54 PM
Back to the OP and I wish that I had mentioned this before. Depending on the system and individual speaker locations, you may have to gain down two channels running the 7.7s to come into balance with the 6.5s. In that case, which is common, your actual power could be 37.5 watts effectively to each of the six fullrange speakers. As stated above that's not enough for what this quality of speaker deserves.
But its premature to make an alternate suggestion until knowing more about the boat and intended locations. And I'm a little curious as to why the dissimilar speaker sizes. If the 7.7 gets a disadvantaged or remote location then that's a good call. On the other hand if the dominant speaker gets the location with the best positional advantage then it may not be the best way to go. I definitely would avoid placing a 7.7 and 6.5 on the same channel. Perhaps a six channel amplifier with three independent stereo gains would be the ticket for a particular boat and for level matching according to its unique speaker location challenges.
Really need more info to do a good application-driven system design.

David
Earmark Marine

BNIROOSTER
02-15-2011, 08:28 AM
sorry for the hijack - but I was interested in the performance of the Alpine MC1 http://www.alpine-usa.com/product/view/mc1/ with the head unit mounted in the glove box, does the head unit respond without delay when commands are input into the remote and vice versa? Does the subwoofer control work well?

I have this unit also and there is a slight delay due to it being an RF signal, once you get used to it it is only a minor inconvienience.

BNIROOSTER
02-15-2011, 08:39 AM
75W to 2 speakers is not enough power to correctly power the speakers you have. If you're putting this much money and effort into your system you need another amp (assuming you meant 2 PAIRS of 6.5's and 1 PAIR of 7.7's). Either take the 900/5 amp and use it for the sub and 4 cockpit speakers and get another 150W/ch 2 channel amp for the tower speakers (7.7's), or get an inexpensive amp like a JL M2150 (75Wx2ch) and use it for the front cockpit speakers and run the rest 1:1 off of the big amp.
Option 2 may limit how you can fade music from the cockpit to the tower or front to rear, depending on the pre amp outs on your head unit without splitting the pre amp outs to multiple locations.
IMO better to at least have your system set up to run another amp, big enough distribution block to add another load to it.
Check out the picture. The dist blocks on the right are for the 3 amps in my boat. + is fused, no in-line fuses with this setup. - is the non fused block.
The set on the left is for all other boat functions (engine cranking, dash power, ballast).
Don't short change yourself here if you ever intend on upgrading or adding more amps.


I agree with previous posts regarding fade control, if you only have one pre amp out on your head unit then you will benefit from the wet sounds ws420 eq. It has a single input and a tower, in boat and sub output. Only drawback to it is that the sub gain is linked to the inboat volume control so if you lower the volume of the inboat spkrs it lower the sub also... Krypt Audio makes the identical eq for half the price, but I cant comment on the quality as Im using the ws420.

Thrall
02-15-2011, 11:21 AM
Back to the OP and I wish that I had mentioned this before. Depending on the system and individual speaker locations, you may have to gain down two channels running the 7.7s to come into balance with the 6.5s. In that case, which is common, your actual power could be 37.5 watts effectively to each of the six fullrange speakers. As stated above that's not enough for what this quality of speaker deserves.
But its premature to make an alternate suggestion until knowing more about the boat and intended locations. And I'm a little curious as to why the dissimilar speaker sizes. If the 7.7 gets a disadvantaged or remote location then that's a good call. On the other hand if the dominant speaker gets the location with the best positional advantage then it may not be the best way to go. I definitely would avoid placing a 7.7 and 6.5 on the same channel. Perhaps a six channel amplifier with three independent stereo gains would be the ticket for a particular boat and for level matching according to its unique speaker location challenges.
Really need more info to do a good application-driven system design.

David
Earmark Marine

I was presuming the 7.7's were going on the tower, so not competing with the 6.5's volume wise, and not sharing a gain control witht he smaller spkrs as well, as the 4 - 6.5's would run off ch 1-2 and the 2 7.7's would get their own channel each 3&4.
Yes it would be advantageous to be able to control the gain separately on the front and rear cockpit speakers as well.
If you're already spending $3k on a system, I think spending an extra $300-400 for another amp and hardware up front will give you a much better sounding system.

EarmarkMarine
02-15-2011, 11:37 AM
Thrall,
Right. Either way, 75 watts per each 7.7 might be good in the boat but will come up seriously short on the tower. Plus, its wasteful to use an amplifier (as great of a multichannel amplifier as you could have in a vehicle) for an application that minimizes its output. Boats need all the power that they can get.

David
Earmark Marine

Thrall
02-15-2011, 11:46 AM
I agree with previous posts regarding fade control, if you only have one pre amp out on your head unit then you will benefit from the wet sounds ws420 eq. It has a single input and a tower, in boat and sub output. Only drawback to it is that the sub gain is linked to the inboat volume control so if you lower the volume of the inboat spkrs it lower the sub also... Krypt Audio makes the identical eq for half the price, but I cant comment on the quality as Im using the ws420.

I checked, the 9886 has 3 sets of pre-outs, probably front, rear and no fade.
If you want the sub to thump regardless of whether you're fading to the cockpit or tower (again assuming the 2 bigger spkrs are on the tower), run hte 3rd set of pre outs to the sub channel(s). Run the front pre-outs to ch 1&2 if the cockpit spkrs are sharing 2 channels only, or split them once and run to all 4 channels feeding the cockpit spkrs. Then run t he rear pre-outs to the tower channels or tower amp.
My setup actually has 1 pr or pre-outs split 3x into 6 channels, 2 ch front cockpit, 4 ch bridged to 2 rear cockpit. I know that should require a line driver to boost the signal voltage since it is split up so many times, but to me it sounds fine, so splitting once would be fine as well.

leadstrader
02-15-2011, 01:44 PM
There is no tower being used on my boat... I have an open bow which the 6.5 will be and then the 7.7 in the mid part of boat and then another 6.5 in the back of the boat.

www.soundwavesmi.com is the company doing the install

great information...

leadstrader
02-15-2011, 01:47 PM
see the picture

leadstrader
02-15-2011, 01:50 PM
you can see my boat here http://www.mastercraft.com/teamtalk/album.php?albumid=398

thanks to everyone

CantRepeat
02-15-2011, 02:40 PM
Great looking boat!

leadstrader
02-15-2011, 03:02 PM
Thanks... I having the stereo installed tomorrow so a bit concerned I dont know what IM doing after reading all of the posts here...

leadstrader
02-15-2011, 03:02 PM
I love the prostar 197

CantRepeat
02-15-2011, 03:13 PM
Thanks... I having the stereo installed tomorrow so a bit concerned I dont know what IM doing after reading all of the posts here...


Well the good news is you have all this information before you purchased and installed. It's not to late to change it.

Thrall
02-15-2011, 05:09 PM
If they're all cockpit speakers then that's a little different ballgame.
I'd run the 4 rear speakers off of the 900/5 amp and get another small amp for the cockpit speakers.
If you're sticking with just the one amp, run the bow spkrs off of the head unit and keep the 4 rears on the amp.

BNIROOSTER
02-15-2011, 05:12 PM
I checked, the 9886 has 3 sets of pre-outs, probably front, rear and no fade.
If you want the sub to thump regardless of whether you're fading to the cockpit or tower (again assuming the 2 bigger spkrs are on the tower), run hte 3rd set of pre outs to the sub channel(s). Run the front pre-outs to ch 1&2 if the cockpit spkrs are sharing 2 channels only, or split them once and run to all 4 channels feeding the cockpit spkrs. Then run t he rear pre-outs to the tower channels or tower amp.
My setup actually has 1 pr or pre-outs split 3x into 6 channels, 2 ch front cockpit, 4 ch bridged to 2 rear cockpit. I know that should require a line driver to boost the signal voltage since it is split up so many times, but to me it sounds fine, so splitting once would be fine as well.

The 9886M has the three outputs but they are front, rear, and sub. It does have the fade control and a 4v output.

BNIROOSTER
02-15-2011, 05:23 PM
If they're all cockpit speakers then that's a little different ballgame.
I'd run the 4 rear speakers off of the 900/5 amp and get another small amp for the cockpit speakers.
If you're sticking with just the one amp, run the bow spkrs off of the head unit and keep the 4 rears on the amp.

I concur, the head unit will run the front two just fine.....unless you are like me and need much, much more volume! BTW I have the same head unit paired with the MC10 and MC1 with just slightly more power to my speakers!!! Also, the 9886M has a seperate gain control built in.

Alpine 9886M
MC10 AT THE DRIVER
MC1 AT THE SWIM PLATFORM
WS-420 Eq
2 MTX JH 2400W SUB AMPS
3 ROCKFORD FOSGATE T-600 AMPS
4 WETSOUNDS XS-650 INBOAT SPKRS
4 KRYPT AUDIO 6.5" HLCD ON THE TOWER
2 KRYPT AUDIO 8" HLCD ON THE TOWER
2 12" ALPINE COMPETITION SUBS IN THE BACK
2 10" ALPINE COMPETITION SUBS IN THE DOGHOUSE
2 10" ALPINE COMPETITION SUBS AT THE DRIVERS FEET AND UNDER THE OBSERVERS SEAT
2 4 FARAD RF CAPS...JUST FOR A LITTLE HELP

CantRepeat
02-15-2011, 05:45 PM
I concur, the head unit will run the front two just fine.....unless you are like me and need much, much more volume! BTW I have the same head unit paired with the MC10 and MC1 with just slightly more power to my speakers!!! Also, the 9886M has a seperate gain control built in.

Alpine 9886M
MC10 AT THE DRIVER
MC1 AT THE SWIM PLATFORM
WS-420 Eq
2 MTX JH 2400W SUB AMPS
3 ROCKFORD FOSGATE T-600 AMPS
4 WETSOUNDS XS-650 INBOAT SPKRS
4 KRYPT AUDIO 6.5" HLCD ON THE TOWER
2 KRYPT AUDIO 8" HLCD ON THE TOWER
2 12" ALPINE COMPETITION SUBS IN THE BACK
2 10" ALPINE COMPETITION SUBS IN THE DOGHOUSE
2 10" ALPINE COMPETITION SUBS AT THE DRIVERS FEET AND UNDER THE OBSERVERS SEAT
2 4 FARAD RF CAPS...JUST FOR A LITTLE HELP

You should make a quick 2 minute video of your boat and the stereo layout. I think people get a better idea of what they would want by seeing setups in other boats.

I'd love to see your tower speaker set up.

Thrall
02-15-2011, 07:53 PM
The 9886M has the three outputs but they are front, rear, and sub. It does have the fade control and a 4v output.

4V output is nice!
So is the sub output able to be faded out?
When I set mine up I was going to use the sub outs for the sub, but wanted to be able to fade from in-boat to tower (without a WS420 or similar). Hooking it up like that, when I'd fade to primarily tower speakers I didn't like the sub still booming with the cockpit speakers turned down and only the tower speakers cranked up. Ended up running the sub off of the pass thru outputs on my amp powering the cockpit speakers so it would fade along with the erst of the cockpit spkrs.

Thrall
02-15-2011, 07:59 PM
leadstrader,
Don't know what your installer is planning for an amp rack or what you're working with for location or room, but it's good to mount amps "standing off" of insulating surfaces that could cause them to run hotter, like carpet. Just an idea, here's a pic of my amps installed. I used 3/4" aluminum tubing to mount the amps to the wall. Allows airflow around the backside of the amps and makes a good place to hide wiring. I added plastic furniture caps to the ends of the tubing as well to make it look more finished.

BNIROOSTER
02-16-2011, 05:36 AM
4V output is nice!
So is the sub output able to be faded out?
When I set mine up I was going to use the sub outs for the sub, but wanted to be able to fade from in-boat to tower (without a WS420 or similar). Hooking it up like that, when I'd fade to primarily tower speakers I didn't like the sub still booming with the cockpit speakers turned down and only the tower speakers cranked up. Ended up running the sub off of the pass thru outputs on my amp powering the cockpit speakers so it would fade along with the erst of the cockpit spkrs.

With the alpine 9886m it has a sub gain that can be faded out as long as you dont have the gains on the amp set too high and a fade front to rear. Before I got my WS-20 I used the fade on the alpine to fade the tower and the inboat spkrs.

BNIROOSTER
02-16-2011, 05:37 AM
You should make a quick 2 minute video of your boat and the stereo layout. I think people get a better idea of what they would want by seeing setups in other boats.

I'd love to see your tower speaker set up.

I will make one soon! I have a pic of the tower set up on my profile.

leadstrader
02-16-2011, 06:44 AM
Morning Thrall,
In your opinion if I went with what I listed originally, would I have a decent system? would you consider it average?

Thanks again, im pumped to get the install going this morning... installer will be at my house in 3hours and 18 minutes from now!

Will take a bunch of pictures and video of install and post.

Have a great day everyone!

leadstrader
02-16-2011, 06:45 AM
oh, forgot... Great idea on the aluminum I will pick some up at Lowes on my way home.

leadstrader
02-16-2011, 07:08 AM
how do you post a picture in the thread?

leadstrader
02-16-2011, 07:14 AM
Here is my sweet baby! Took tower down and stored for now... Cant wait to get her back in the water!

Shooter McKevin
02-16-2011, 12:49 PM
Did I say I love this board today? If not, love the people here.

I swear, really... no BS no crap talk just good advice in an extremely friendly place.

Dig it!

Good post CantRepeat!

The audiophiles avoided your mushy post, but some of us out here feel ya. This thread is a good example of the board we have. When you consider that the OP is listed as a guest and didn't give any sort of intro or background, it's pretty amazing how he got some great advice about his exact hardware from knowledgeable people with nothing to gain except the satisfaction of sharing the knowledge that they have earned the hard way with someone who can benefit from it.

It helps that he spoke the right language (model #'s)

leadstrader,
Sweet boat. You're obviously not a guest. Do you know why your post's say that your are?

leadstrader
02-16-2011, 01:35 PM
Things are getting installed now...

Ski-me
02-16-2011, 02:37 PM
Looks like a lot of fun toys!

Although I don't have near the money in my old 205, I do have the same head unit and love it. Originally had the Clarion one but it was too confusing and hard to go from the suburban's Alpine to the Clarion. Now, I'm going from Alpine to Alpine....much better!

Good luck on the install!

craig3972
02-16-2011, 05:38 PM
looks like a lotta stuff there on my wish list :)

leadstrader
02-17-2011, 10:39 AM
here are a few pictures... I know they are not great but almost done...

leadstrader
02-17-2011, 02:10 PM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vMQS3SR8-8I

No sub and no 7.7 all that going in today.

leadstrader
02-18-2011, 08:34 AM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EOJGsleIwvo
Alpine CDA 9886M Head unit
Alpine MC 20 Remote
JL Audio MHD 900/5 Marine Amp
2 Pair JL Audio M650CCX Speakers
1 Pair JL Audio M770CCS Speakers
1 JL Audio M101B5 Sub
Blue Top Gel Cell Battery
Marine 3 way Battery Switch
Custom Speaker Side Panels

Shooter McKevin
02-18-2011, 11:29 AM
The soundtrack sure did a 180 from part 1 to part 2!

jconover
04-13-2011, 11:16 AM
Question - what is the source of those distribution blocks? I haven't found those referenced anywhere...

75W to 2 speakers is not enough power to correctly power the speakers you have. If you're putting this much money and effort into your system you need another amp (assuming you meant 2 PAIRS of 6.5's and 1 PAIR of 7.7's). Either take the 900/5 amp and use it for the sub and 4 cockpit speakers and get another 150W/ch 2 channel amp for the tower speakers (7.7's), or get an inexpensive amp like a JL M2150 (75Wx2ch) and use it for the front cockpit speakers and run the rest 1:1 off of the big amp.
Option 2 may limit how you can fade music from the cockpit to the tower or front to rear, depending on the pre amp outs on your head unit without splitting the pre amp outs to multiple locations.
IMO better to at least have your system set up to run another amp, big enough distribution block to add another load to it.
Check out the picture. The dist blocks on the right are for the 3 amps in my boat. + is fused, no in-line fuses with this setup. - is the non fused block.
The set on the left is for all other boat functions (engine cranking, dash power, ballast).
Don't short change yourself here if you ever intend on upgrading or adding more amps.