Trailer breaks lockup with no boat

[prostar205]

The breaks on my 2002 MC trailer totally locked up when braking downhill while I was pulling the trailer without the boat. Is this normal for the brakes to lock up while braking down hill? The trailer is a tandem axle with disc brakes for an 2002 X30.

Any advice would be great.

Thanks,

Tom

[jrbrown]

Do you have surge brakes?

If the surge brake mechanism (Trailer tongue) is made by Aero, then pull the rear attachment pin that holds the black painted dampner (miniature shock absorber). The dampner will hang below the Aero by its forward attachment point. Now grab the dampner and move it up and down. If there is resistance the full length of travel in and out then the dampner is okay. If there are dead spots (moves without resistance then the dampner is bad and needs to be replaced.

My theory is that if the boat is on the trailer then the brake don't easily lock up, but without the boat and without the dampner then the slightest movement forward unimpeded by the dampner will lock up the wheels.

S,
J.R.

[prostar205]

Thanks J.R. for the advice.

Yes, it is a surge brake trailer. I will check to see if it is made by AERO. Does the word AERO show up somewhere on the brake's master cylinder?

[Jerseydave]

I've had some surge-brake trailers do that. I believe it's because the trailer brakes still try to activate and without the weight of the boat, the tires tend to "lock-up". Not sure if there's anything you can do about it.

[Mag_Red]

I've had some surge-brake trailers do that. I believe it's because the trailer brakes still try to activate and without the weight of the boat, the tires tend to "lock-up". Not sure if there's anything you can do about it.
Here's what I did.......cut the wire at the harness that controls the back-up lights. (this is what activates the selonoid that closes the brake lines so you can back-up the trailer) I wired a switch in the cab that I can send power to the reverse light position on the harness. So now, when the trailer is empty, I can send power to the selonoid, it closes, and the brakes on the trailer will not operate. Works like a charm. The only thing you need to remember is to turn off the switch when you load your boat and you need to flip it when you put your truck into reverse.Picture (http://www.tmcowners.com/teamtalk/attachment.php?attachmentid=4182)

[prostar205]

Mag_Red -

I was thinking of the same thing. That is a great idea. I'll check it out tonight.

Tom

[jrbrown]

Here's a good place to start: http://www.titandist.com/

[prostar205]

Mag Red -

So you cut the reverse wire on the truck side that goes into the trailer wiring harness connector located on the truck's bumper? You then wired a powered switch that when activated, sends 12V to the reverse pin on the trailer connector and thus de-activates the trailer brakes. Do your truck's reverse lights go on when to flip the switch in the cab of the truck?

[RobertT]

I was told to do this...

Unplug the harness, and turn it 180 degrees. This will result in one of the connections being unplugged. Then...turn on your headlights.

I know that it works for when you only have a 4 plug harness and you need to back it up (prevents the brakes from locking up), and since I have always done it and it has never failed I see no reason not to believe it.

Try that before you start any hard stuff....the entire process takes about ten seconds and works on every vehicle.

[Mag_Red]

Mag Red -

So you cut the reverse wire on the truck side that goes into the trailer wiring harness connector located on the truck's bumper? You then wired a powered switch that when activated, sends 12V to the reverse pin on the trailer connector and thus de-activates the trailer brakes. Do your truck's reverse lights go on when to flip the switch in the cab of the truck?Not when the truck is in drive.......only the trailer's reverse lights are lit.

[TTAdmin]

RobertT's suggestion is right on. Turn the 5 pin harness 180 degrees and leave one of the 5 pins open on each side. Turn your car lights on and you're set. It makes the trailer think that the car is in reverse and will release your breaks. Here is a shot at a diagram (ABCDE-one side of the 5 pin connection; 12345 other side):

Typical:
ABCDE
|||||
12345

Switched:
_ABCDE
_||||
12345

I hope that makes sense...

[Mag_Red]

RobertT's suggestion is right on. Turn the 5 pin harness 180 degrees and leave one of the 5 pins open on each side. Turn your car lights on and you're set. It makes the trailer think that the car is in reverse and will release your breaks. Here is a shot at a diagram (ABCDE-one side of the 5 pin connection; 12345 other side):

Typical:
ABCDE
|||||
12345

Switched:
_ABCDE
_||||
12345

I hope that makes sense...That works also.......I just got tired of getting out and reversing the harness all the time.

[prostar205]

RobertT -

Thank you. I will be doing that this weekend. I rarely driver the trailer without the boat but we are going to a lake where I have to put the boat in the water and then driver the truck/trailer about 20 miles to the condo we are staying at while my wife drives the boat across the lake to the condo. I just did not want to deal with the brakes locking up while I was driving those 20 miles.

Thanks again for the hint.

[Mag_Red]

RobertT -

Thank you. I will be doing that this weekend. I rarely driver the trailer without the boat but we are going to a lake where I have to put the boat in the water and then driver the truck/trailer about 20 miles to the condo we are staying at while my wife drives the boat across the lake to the condo. I just did not want to deal with the brakes locking up while I was driving those 20 miles.

Thanks again for the hint.Hell.....I had problems driving 10 feet with mine. I never would have made 20 miles.

[prostar205]

I tried the flip of the trailier connector and it worked great. Thanks for the tip. It will definately come in handy this weekend.

[RobertT]

I just don't get why that is not more known. I know of SEVERAL people that have almost had accidents, and certainly problems backing up their trailers...one would think that every dealer would know this and tell every client about it.

Why wouldn't it be in the trailer manual?

Liability issues I suppose. Yes, that must be it.

Anyway, no problem on the advice, I actually got to be the helper in lieu of the helpee...yaaa hooo.

[Workin' 4 Toys]

The breaks on my 2002 MC trailer totally locked up when braking downhill while I was pulling the trailer without the boat. Is this normal for the brakes to lock up while braking down hill? The trailer is a tandem axle with disc brakes for an 2002 X30.

Any advice would be great.

Thanks,

Tom
What did you do to resolve this?

[prostar205]

W4T -

Look up at my last post - I just flipped the connectors as someone had suggested and turned on my lights to apply 12V to the reverse circuit, thus releasing the breaks.

[Workin' 4 Toys]

The solution to trailer brake locking up is to plug the harness in backwards :eek: ? Everyone that owns a hydraulic brake trailer knows this....... I must be a complete idiot... :o

[prostar205]

I was in your position a month ago. I had no idea the trailer would hop excessively when not loaded.

The more high tech things MasterCraft puts on their boats, the more these things breakdown. What ever happened to mechanical fuel pumps, no ECMs and regular old surge breaks with the mechanical lockout pin??????

[Workin' 4 Toys]

I was in your position a month ago. I had no idea the trailer would hop excessively when not loaded.

The more high tech things MasterCraft puts on their boats, the more these things breakdown. What ever happened to mechanical fuel pumps, no ECMs and regular old surge breaks with the mechanical lockout pin??????
Mine locks up loaded or not. 2003 single axle, right side only locked up, left side seems fine when I test using my hands pushing and pulling the nose of the trailer. Right side even locks and stays locked when testing with my hands let alone 3K on it.

[whitedog]

Take the tire and brake caliper off. It sound like you either have something stuck under the brake pad (rock of other road junk) or a stuck caliper.

[Workin' 4 Toys]

Take the tire and brake caliper off. It sound like you either have something stuck under the brake pad (rock of other road junk) or a stuck caliper.
AFTER they locked up, I decided to disassemble the brake. I removed the caliper squeezing it to release it from the rotor. I noticed the pads were very thin. ( I just so happened to order a set of new pads I put in the boat because of the squeeking I heard in previous weeks), thought it might have been the squeekers, but it went away so it wasn't so I was going to change them in a few weeks when I had time. strictly for my own piece of mind) I reasssembled the brake with new pads. guide pins were clean and spotless, and came out with a slight push. Tested again, still locked up with a manual push on the tongue. Disassembled again, and removed the guides just to see if were the guides hanging up. No luck, stilll locked up. I put the old pads back in and tested again with out the guides and still locked up. Please help!!!

[jkski]

Had the same problems you are describing with my 2002 MC trailer. After about 2 years of trial and error working with my dealer, we finally figured out that it was the size of the orafice that feeds the fluid into the line. Basically, from my crude understanding of it, I had too much pressure going back through the lines when the brakes were engaged, which really wasn't noticable when the boat was on the trailer, but take it off and I'd get my trailer to jump a foot off the ground without hitting a bump. By changing out the orafice size, and I believe you need to go to a smaller one, you reduce the amount of fluid being pushed through the lines, therefore the brakes don't react as hard. Once we changed this, my problems went away. From what I know some time in late 02 production, they changed that part to coorect the issue, so if you have one prior to that, check it out.
Hope this helps.

[Workin' 4 Toys]

Had the same problems you are describing with my 2002 MC trailer. After about 2 years of trial and error working with my dealer, we finally figured out that it was the size of the orafice that feeds the fluid into the line. Basically, from my crude understanding of it, I had too much pressure going back through the lines when the brakes were engaged, which really wasn't noticable when the boat was on the trailer, but take it off and I'd get my trailer to jump a foot off the ground without hitting a bump. By changing out the orafice size, and I believe you need to go to a smaller one, you reduce the amount of fluid being pushed through the lines, therefore the brakes don't react as hard. Once we changed this, my problems went away. From what I know some time in late 02 production, they changed that part to coorect the issue, so if you have one prior to that, check it out.
Hope this helps.

Mine is locked up now. With no pressure at the tongue. Push it once and pull it back, it is still locked. I see what you are describing, it is different than my issue. Only one side of mine locks, and stays there until you apply a liberal amount of pressure manually to the caliper.

I JUST WANT TO KNOW, is it a master, caliper, lines, design issue. I don't care, I just want to fix it and forget about it. I don't want to do this every year or even every other year. Or even ever if I can do without again.

[jkski]

Gotcha,
Well, I did have one side that locked up during my trials and tribulations and it ended up being the master cylinder on that side. The dealer replaced it and I was good to go.

[Workin' 4 Toys]

Gotcha,
Well, I did have one side that locked up during my trials and tribulations and it ended up being the master cylinder on that side. The dealer replaced it and I was good to go.

I think there is only one master and it is inside the tongue.

Oh, and don't forget it is only one side that is locking up. (Sofar! :eek: )

[jkski]

That's why I don't work on my own stuff. All I know is that I smoked it and just kept on pulling, it eventually freed up a little and I was able to get it to the dealer, where they replaced the master and all was good.

[Workin' 4 Toys]

That's why I don't work on my own stuff. All I know is that I smoked it and just kept on pulling, it eventually freed up a little and I was able to get it to the dealer, where they replaced the master and all was good.
Believe me, if I can figure it out myself, I am that much farther ahead. Dealers of any sort are not the solution for every problem. This is one issue that should be easy to figure out. I have never owned a hyd. trailer before, therefore I don't understand why one side would lock and not the other. And to get it to a dealer I would have to have it picked up and towed in.

[Holtrodj]

W4T - How did you end up fixing your problem? I'm having the same issue on my hydrolic trailer..

[Workin' 4 Toys]

W4T - How did you end up fixing your problem? I'm having the same issue on my hydrolic trailer..
Replaced BOTH calipers with the new design. Supposedly there is a dealer around that is replacing them at no cost. I bought mine from a MC dealer. $200. You should also replace the pads because yours will be worn down at an angle.

[Holtrodj]

Hmmm, interesting. My breaks are drums so I don't think its calipers. I guess I'll see what I can do to free them up and get it to the dealer.

Thanks anyway.