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jconover
08-09-2010, 09:59 PM
Recently added a PerfectPass Stargazer to my boat (mechanical model with servo). PPSG turns on when i flip the key to on -- dash module beeps and initializes, servo initializes, system ready to go.

Turn the key to the crank position, and there is a voltage drop across the whole system. PPSG dash module reboots (beep) and the whole thing re-initializes. This is highly inconvenient, as it is generally necessary for me to give the boat a bit of gas right after turning the key. When the dash module resets, it re-initializes the servo motor. Moving the throttle during the initialization really dorks things up.

Any PP owners out there had challenges like this? Any suggestions?

My boat is wired factory, as follows:
Negative ground from battery to front of block near alternator (cleaned this up)
Positive from battery to starter motor on 00 marine cable (new)
Positive from starter motor to terminal strip on 10 gauge marine wire.
Positive (charge) from alternator to terminal strip on 10 gauge wire.
Dash power from terminal strip to dash via factory harness (two feeds)

PP is wired in to dash wiring. Positive comes off of keyswitch "on" terminal.
Negative is tied in to dash wiring via T-Tap.

I am considering running a clean ground from the battery directly to the PPSG and/or to the whole dash. Any other suggestions on how to clean up this annoying problem.

Side note: The battery is brand new 1000CCA, tests good at the battery shop under load.
Side note 2: The radio suffers a similar reboot. It is wired basically the same way, but on the accessory pole of the keyswitch.

east tx skier
08-09-2010, 10:18 PM
Try wiring the power on your Perfect Pass directly to the battery.

jconover
08-09-2010, 10:26 PM
Thanks east TX - if I do that, won't it run my battery down when the boat isn't running? I suppose it is a good method for troubleshooting. I was wondering what a more viable long-term fix might be.

André
08-10-2010, 06:25 AM
Thanks east TX - if I do that, won't it run my battery down when the boat isn't running? I suppose it is a good method for troubleshooting. I was wondering what a more viable long-term fix might be.

You need to install a relay to power the PP.
Do a search on waterski forum(Nicholl.s).There's a schematic somewhere posted by Thomas Wayne...

east tx skier
08-10-2010, 10:06 AM
You need to install a relay to power the PP.
Do a search on waterski forum(Nicholl.s).There's a schematic somewhere posted by Thomas Wayne...

Sorry, yes, do what Andre says. I was posting while child raising last night.

jconover
08-10-2010, 12:14 PM
Found this
http://ballofspray.com/vanillaforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=1118

Skipper
08-10-2010, 07:43 PM
Somebody help me out with this schematic:

I am tracking that a new wire must be run from the battery to the terminal marked "87".

I think a wire is supposed to be run from the terminal marked "30" to the back of the PP display where there is currently a purple wire. This wire will replace the purple wire. What happens to the other end of the purple wire?

Now for the black and purple wire that goes to the PP logic module. Does the black wire get disconnected from the tach and then a new wire runs from terminal "86" to the ground on the tach? And what is the deal with that purple wire?

I am so confused.:confused:

Skipper
08-22-2010, 02:16 PM
.....................................

jconover
08-23-2010, 11:45 PM
This circuit simply switches power from terminal 87 to terminal 30 when 12 V is applied to terminal 85.

Yes, a clean 12V needs to be pulled from a battery to terminal 87.
You wire terminal 30 to the PP purple wire. The old purple wire can simply be "nutted" off - it was the 12V power supply from the PP harness.

You wire terminal 86 to ground. It doesn't have to be ground on the tach. If you chose to wire to ground on the tach, don't remove the wire that is already there (you'd be removing the ground, which is what you are trying to steal). He is basically just using the ground on the tach as a convenient place to steal a ground. I ran mine to a clean ground run from the battery.

The remaining wire is a new clean run to the ignition switch, and applies 12V to the "switch" in the relay whenever the key is in the ACC, RUN, or START positions.

For the logic module, you're doing more of the same. You are breaking the 12V feed to the logic module, and providing a new power source from terminal 30. So you'd clip the purple wire, cap off the end that doesn't go to the logic module, and run an additional lead from terminal 30 to the purple wire that feeds into the logic module.

jconover
08-23-2010, 11:48 PM
Update on my issues - I was trying to avoid adding a second battery to my boat, which is what this circuit will require. Adding the relay will not stop the starter motor from drawing down the battery voltage, assuming everything else is the same. I am going to try this circuit with a single battery first, but I am not expecting any better results than I already have.

I finished cleaning up the ground on my existing battery - replaced the crimped-on 2 ga connector with a clean bolt-on battery terminal connector, and ran a clean 10ga ground from the battery negative screwpost to the dash (I tied it to the existing ground behind the dash, Y'ing in the 2 PP ground wires at the same time to ensure I had the best possible ground for the PP). Net results: No better behavior - the PP still resets every time i start the engine, as does my radio.

I will try this circuit next weekend - i have the relay in hand.

JLeuck64
08-24-2010, 12:59 PM
I found a luv/hate relationship with PP in my boat over the years from exactly the same symptoms you are experiencing...

Crank the engine PP beeps and resets...

Turn on too many accessories, PP beeps at you and resets...

Gauges act funny and are inaccurate...

I disconnected PP this summer and have never been HAPPIER! Taught myself to use the boat's tachometer to drive, just like PP used to. Gauges work normally now too!

jconover
08-24-2010, 03:12 PM
Agreed. bought the PP so that less skilled drivers didn't have to think about it. If it were just me-- I've been driving tach based for years.

Skipper
08-24-2010, 03:41 PM
I rely on the PP to get my speed through the course within standard tolerances. It is so much easier for the driver to use PP so they need only concentrate on keeping the boat straight. I don't have any accessories like a stereo or anything else for that matter, so it is not an issue. But I do turn the boat on and off a lot and waiting for the PP to reset is a little annoying.

jconover
08-24-2010, 05:10 PM
Indeed - my problem is consistent whether i've got the radio on or not - i just noted that since the radio is clearly sufferring from the same voltage draw-down as the PP head end.

I talked to Vince @ SKIDIM today and he had a very insightful thought which I am going to dig into - he suggested that my overheating coil and my PP reset are related to a common ground issue. Now, I've been through my boat, top to bottom, checking all the wiring, resistances, etc, and I know the wiring is good. however, one thing I didn't check into was whether or not any of the gauges could be causing a ground fault. Unfortunately, the best way to start testing this is to completely unwire the gauges on my dash and then see if the system behaves any better. But I think I'm going to go "down that rathole" and see if I can't permanently eliminate this problem.

jconover
06-30-2011, 11:00 AM
In rewiring my boat this winter, I solved my problem - but I wanted to share the solution with everyone. I now believe my install was user-error. I wired the PP 12V to the A terminal of my keyswitch (A=accessory) one would assume this would have power whenever the boat is in any position other than "off".. that is not the case. The A terminal drops to zero volts when you turn the keyswitch to the "start" position. Moved power to the "I" terminal (I=ignition, the purple wire), and of course now the PP works just fine. That said, I did install the relay and power the perfectpass off of the second battery I installed over the winter.

Oh well, can't get them all right, all the time.

JLeuck64
06-30-2011, 11:53 AM
I am proud of you!

jconover
06-30-2011, 01:30 PM
Aw shucks :-)