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waterlogged882
06-26-2013, 04:34 PM
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Kweisner
06-26-2013, 05:27 PM
Thanks again for all of the time spent helping me out. I think I have everything I need on the way for this. Last question can I run a cranking battery as my start and a deep cycle for the house battery?

That is precisely what you should do! Also, consider this option as well--add a permanently mounted battery charger/maintainer on the house battery. I did so because at the end of the day my run back to the ramp is very short and doesn't provide enough time on the alternator to fully recharge the house batt. Once home, I just plug in to top off and then maintain a charge. I don't have the same worry for the start battery because it gets very little use and therefore needs little charge. Plus with the key in the ON position, both batteries are joined in parallel so the fully charged house batt is contributing during starting (I use the automatic relay method originally suggested by Diesel on this thread).

SILENTxNOISE
06-27-2013, 01:21 AM
Questions:

Will the factory terminal ends directly from the motor (currently connected to the start battery posts) have to be cut off to add a smaller connection to connect the positive to the Blue Sea switch and the negative to the ground bus?? I haven't located an illustration showing what needs to be done here.

Also, does the ground bus need to have the motor negative ran to it and then grounded to a different location (ex. run another ground from the bus back to the motor)? The illustrations are showing the motor negative connected to the ground bus, then the ground bus grounded to who knows where.

I'm not sure why this is confusing if these illustrations are so "simple".

bturner2
06-27-2013, 07:34 AM
Does this mean you are willing to help this guy or just be condescending? :confused:

Didn't mean to hurt feelings, ruffle feathers or shatter dreams. Was just waiting for the opposing posts on batteries to start up again. Sort of like the RTP versus MCX posts.

There are a ton of really good posts on batteries and installations here. The search engine on this site actually works really well (I really mean that, no sarcasm intended). A search on Battery Installation came back with quite a few good reference posts like these.......

On Optima Batteries and are they any good.....

http://www.mastercraft.com/teamtalk/showthread.php?t=32875&highlight=battery+installation

Optima batteries - which one and what type to go with.....

http://www.mastercraft.com/teamtalk/showthread.php?t=46928&highlight=battery+installation

My dual battery installation thread.....

http://www.mastercraft.com/teamtalk/showthread.php?t=29889&highlight=battery+installation

Thralls battery installation thread (a lot of good information in here)....

http://www.mastercraft.com/teamtalk/showthread.php?t=33981&highlight=battery+installation

Thread on grounding. JimN explains in detail about grounding and references site that provides great detail on the subject....

http://www.mastercraft.com/teamtalk/showthread.php?t=31078&highlight=battery+installation

This is just on the first two pages. Hope these help a bit more than my original post.....

LTRGUY261
06-27-2013, 12:40 PM
Thanks for all the advice Cloaked and Bturner2, I really appreciate it.

SILENTxNOISE
06-27-2013, 02:54 PM
Ok, I guess I could ask this more simply..

Is it required to run NEW pos and neg cables from the motor to the blue sea switch and ground bus?

bturner2
06-28-2013, 06:57 AM
If your amperage draw or cable run isn't changing then there should be no need to swap anything out. I didn't install new but I did end up cutting the ends off, adjusted cable lengths and soldered new ends on to clean up the existing sloppy installation. I also purchased new marine grade cable and made all the cables to connect the battery grounds and connections to the bus bars and battery/switch/isolator connections.

Making the cables and installing new cable connectors is really pretty easy with a torch and some solder. The only ones that made me nervous were the ones I had to do in the boat. For those I covered all the surrounding areas with wet towels to protect against any chance of getting something too hot with the torch.

As far as installing a switch to the solution..... I like having the switch. I don't get out to my boat everyday and it sits on a Shorestation at my brother in laws house about 20 miles away. As part of our departure routine we always turn off the power. That way I'm sure nothing was left on and it also provides a little more theft security (one more thing for someone to figure out before driving off with the boat).

SILENTxNOISE
06-28-2013, 03:19 PM
Thanks, bturner2! I was thinking of making my own cables as well, but from a quick google search, the crimper for a 2ga wire was like $60! But soldering is a great idea too and is pretty easy..

I think I have a handle on how I'm going to do this now! Thanks for the help!

bturner2
06-28-2013, 05:59 PM
When I did mine I twisted the exposed wire then tinned the wire. I then heated the new cable end and put a good amount of solder in it. With the cable end still hot I placed the tinned cable in the cable end while the solder was still molten. I was careful to ensure I measured the stripped portion for the wire so that it got good penetration into the cable end. After it cooled I used heat shrink tubing to finish the connection. I thought they turned out real good and are not going to come apart. There's a ton of opinions on crimping versus solder but from my perspective I can't see how you can get a much better connection if you follow the procedure I did.

I'm on my fifth season with this set up and is rock solid. It's easy to take apart and reinstall and you don't have to worry about anything coming apart.

SILENTxNOISE
07-04-2013, 12:33 PM
Edit: Nevermind.. I just piggy-backed the neg terminals and didn't use the common bus at all.

Thanks for all the great info!!

One other question.. What size do you recommend for the common bus bar for the ground?

I have a 150amp 1/4inch stud bar but it seem like its way too small for this application...

Suggestions?

bturner2
07-05-2013, 10:06 AM
You're past me on this one but I tend to error on the side that bigger is better when it comes to power and grounding.

Traxx822
07-05-2013, 10:08 AM
Hey just wanted to say thanks to the guys in this thread that helped me with my head unit wiring issue. The noise is gone. Everything sounds perfect. No matter what battery I have it set to.

LTRGUY261
07-08-2013, 11:06 AM
I also wanted to say thanks to the folks on this thread. Between here and the other forum I frequent I was able to wire in the second battery and BW Isolator relay. I additionally wired in a fuse panel from the second battery to move some of my accessories to. Lastly wired in an amp and got some wires up into my tower (a Skylon Swoop, this was not easy) and mounted our tower speakers. So thanks again to everyone for their inputs, write ups, and advice, it was all very helpful.

Dweibel
09-24-2013, 11:04 AM
I have a 2010 boat, just added a stereo setup with about an extra 1000 watts and just started having battery issues running hte stereo over 15 minutes with the boat off. Was thinking of replacing one battery with a higher powered one? Anybody have thoughts or suggestions, or should I just get two new regular batteries, as they are 3 years / 300 hours old

bturner2
09-24-2013, 11:53 AM
I like to match the batteries. I've had good luck with Optima Blue tops however there is a lot of conversation on their performance/reliability on this board. Neither of which I've had the slightest issue with (just completing my fifth season and still look to be going strong).

Many opt to stick with conventional lead/acid batteries and go big. If you do decide to go AGM be aware of the charging requirements which will most likely mean having to replace the charger you may have inherited from Grandpa with an advanced and somewhat expensive new charger..... :D

On lead/acid I've heard most people recommending Interstate. On AGM I've heard Deka and Odyessey come up quite a bit.

MLA
09-24-2013, 02:29 PM
I have a 2010 boat, just added a stereo setup with about an extra 1000 watts and just started having battery issues running hte stereo over 15 minutes with the boat off. Was thinking of replacing one battery with a higher powered one? Anybody have thoughts or suggestions, or should I just get two new regular batteries, as they are 3 years / 300 hours old

I would have them tested. After three years, you are on borrowed time IMO. Next, if you have a 2 batteries and both are going dead after playing the stereo at anchor, then you need to look into how the battery system is configured. If you dont have a dual battery setup, I would suggest doing one. This would allow you to isolate a battery for restarting the engine after playing the stereo at anchor.

Timdog145
11-03-2013, 05:57 PM
I have been reading a lot on this thread about how to wire a second battery and I have figured out how I want to wire it. Does anyone have a suggestion on how to secure as second battery in the bow of an 89 Prostar 190?

JimN
11-03-2013, 06:02 PM
I have been reading a lot on this thread about how to wire a second battery and I have figured out how I want to wire it. Does anyone have a suggestion on how to secure as second battery in the bow of an 89 Prostar 190?

Yeah- don't put it in the bow. You want the cabling to the first battery and alternator to be as short as possible and placing it in the bow doesn't allow that to happen.

waterlogged882
11-03-2013, 06:16 PM
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Timdog145
11-03-2013, 08:24 PM
JimN: Where would you recommend mounting battery 2? battery 1 is under the spotter's seat so the bow is the closest place to it, and as far as I can tell it is the only place I can get it to fit. under the back seat is not an option on the '89.
And Cloaked: pardon my ignorance because I am a brand new Mastercraft owner. Can I screw into the floor into the bow anywhere? What material is the deck made of under the carpet? The bow storage area is the only place I can find to fit the battery, and it would be somewhat easier to wire in and isolator because of its proximity to the original battery under the spotter's seat. Did you make it so the whole battery box is removable so you dont have to lift the battery out of the box?

waterlogged882
11-03-2013, 08:34 PM
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Timdog145
11-03-2013, 10:30 PM
Cloaked,
Thanks for all of the great info. I certainly understand the concept of screwing into the flat floor area vs the sloped hull area of the bow. I just wasn't familiar with the construction of the flat floor area and how it would be affected by screwing into it. And you answered my question on the battery box. I know now that when it comes to removing the battery for replacement/ winterizing I would be able to slide the box out in order to remove the battery and it wouldnt be permanently fixed to the floor.
Great info on a source for the cables as well.
My most significant concern was being able to screw into the flat (non-hull) floor area.
As I said, I am a brand new first time owner and you can expect to see a lot of questions from me all over Team Talk.

Thanks again for your help.
Tim

imyourmaster
11-19-2013, 12:37 PM
Can anyone shed light on a dual battery setup in a 2008 X2? I have two batteries which are not paralleled from what I can tell. One battery has cables marked "house" connected to it and the second battery has cables marked "starter" connected to it. These cables run to a 3 way blue sea battery selector switch (off/on/combine). When in the "on" position both batteries are live but isolated. So...why does my stereo stop playing if I disconnect the "starter" battery? This does not make sense to me...what am I missing?

Thanks!

Quinten
11-19-2013, 01:41 PM
Can anyone shed light on a dual battery setup in a 2008 X2? I have two batteries which are not paralleled from what I can tell. One battery has cables marked "house" connected to it and the second battery has cables marked "starter" connected to it. These cables run to a 3 way blue sea battery selector switch (off/on/combine). When in the "on" position both batteries are live but isolated. So...why does my stereo stop playing if I disconnect the "house" battery? This does not make sense to me...what am I missing?

Thanks!

From what I know about is that the house battery is for stereo and accesoirs etc. And the starter is for starting the engine so if you play to long on the stereo. Than you are abble to start the boat again.

imyourmaster
11-19-2013, 03:09 PM
Sorry guys...I had to edit my original post. I had originally asked why my stereo would stop playing when I disconnect the "house" battery. What I meant to say was when I disconnect the "starter" battery.

Quinten
11-21-2013, 03:07 AM
Sorry guys...I had to edit my original post. I had originally asked why my stereo would stop playing when I disconnect the "house" battery. What I meant to say was when I disconnect the "starter" battery.

Sorry can't help with that. Would to know the answer to.
Never tryed its with a 2012 x2.

Kweisner
11-21-2013, 06:35 AM
Sorry guys...I had to edit my original post. I had originally asked why my stereo would stop playing when I disconnect the "house" battery. What I meant to say was when I disconnect the "starter" battery.

Could it be that one of the 12v trigger leads is commected to the starter batt circuit? IOW, house batt is providing the consumptive power for the head unt and amplifiers, but the on/off trigger is tied out to the other batt and when disconnected, there's no trigger voltage.

imyourmaster
11-27-2013, 07:52 AM
Thanks for your reply! It made me think about the possibility...However, my 12v trigger lead runs directly from the head unit to the amplifiers. For whatever reason may be, the head unit loses power when I disconnect either of the house or starter battery. I will talk to the guys at Blue Sea today. It could be that the connections on the back of the battery selector switch are wrong.

mgs96ps
11-27-2013, 01:01 PM
Sorry to tread jack...but could someone point me to a post that I was reading a couple weeks ago about best battery tender/ battery charger for winter? Thought I would ask here instead of start new post.

_fng_
02-23-2014, 07:55 PM
So last weekend I added the blue seas add a battery system with a starting and deep cell battery. Today we were sitting listening for music for approx 1.5 hrs and when I tried to start the boat it took 3-4 turns to get it to turn over. I would have thought the relay would have transitioned to the starting battery automatically without need for a few turns. Does this mean I did not install it correctly? Any trouble-shooting advice before I call blue seas tomorrow?

fyi, I used 2 gauge wire for all set up and 100 amp fuse for relay (as described in the instructions), i only have a sub and head unit powering 4 speakers. As soon as I started the boat, pp was reading 13.2V and 11.7V with engine off.

Thanks for any help.

MLA
02-23-2014, 08:00 PM
Does this mean I did not install it correctly? Any trouble-shooting advice before I call blue seas tomorrow

I think so. Sounds like some of the house loads are still wired to the cranking battery. With the switch alone, your house loads should be isolated from the cranking. The ACR is mainly there to allow the house banks to receive a charge when the engine is running.

waterlogged882
02-23-2014, 08:02 PM
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_fng_
02-23-2014, 08:19 PM
Forgive my ignorance but for "house loads" (top Left connection as shown on pdf below), all I have hooked up to the perko switch is my sub amp. What should be set up to the house loads connection? My single battery set up was 2awg from the engine ground and to the starter. Should there be more to the "house loads" connection other than the sub amp?

side note, both batteries read 12.7x on volt meter with engine off (without putting on trickle charger).

Thanks a lot for helping me out!

http://assets.bluesea.com/files/resources/instructions/990310020.pdf

waterlogged882
02-23-2014, 08:30 PM
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_fng_
02-23-2014, 08:47 PM
Your boat hesitated a few turns before it fully engaged?? correct?

Correct

The hesitation may have been a combined bank (a sink or drop of unequal charge or banks). So if you have the Perko switch wired as a closed circuit while the engine is off, you are pulling from both banks and the load may have been the culprit until the banks were closer to an equal state.

Any way to determine if the circuit is closed? For the next question, yes it is wired exactly per the diagram (house load being sub amp)

Do you have your system wired like the diagram?

Yes


A buddy who used to do car stereo installations looked over my set up and said it looked good but he admitted he hadn't seen this system before.

Thanks!

waterlogged882
02-23-2014, 08:51 PM
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_fng_
02-23-2014, 08:53 PM
Do you have your system wired like the diagram? Isolator wired to the ignition switch correctly? The isolator should be on the same ignition switch terminal as the purple wire IIRC.

Sitting still, the isolator should fail open, isolating the batteries. When you crank, the ignition switch commands the start battery ("start" position terminal) to engage the starter. The isolator then fails closed (as the switch returns to the 'on' position) and combines the banks for charging while underway. When the ignition is off or accessory position (purple wire on the igniton is where the isolator wire should be), the isolator is open with isolation. Back to full circle, all loads should be on the house battery, leaving the start battery for the obvious.

At the batteries, I have nothing other than the engine power, engine ground, and sub amp power/ground. Should I do something with the ignition switch wiring? Side note, I rewired PP power to ignition switch to help with voltage drop from PP.

_fng_
02-23-2014, 08:54 PM
The isolator switch has a green light on it. It should blink when the switch is failed closed. It should be a steady green when failed open.

.

As it was "optional" I did not install this part of the diagram. Eureka??

waterlogged882
02-23-2014, 09:03 PM
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_fng_
02-23-2014, 09:15 PM
Makes more sense now, knowing you have manual switching. Thus the ignition switch wiring has no bearing since you switch manually with the Perko. PP needs power from somewhere. :) I wired my PP to the tachometer, but ultimately, that comes through the ignition switch. The isolator does what you tell it to do with a manual turn. I hope I am reading this correctly as you describe.

My reference to the isolator switch is a moot point. You are the isolator with no purple wire.. :D

No big deal other than automation and convenience. What truly was optional was the Perko switch. I'd have installed the isolator and left off the Perko. You are manually controlling the banks but I am not certain how you are closing the loop during operation for charging both banks.

PP was set up to tach originally but voltage dropped too much (1.5v) with key on, PP customer service recommended rewiring purple wire from tach to ignition switch and run another ground wire directly from negative battery terminal.

No, I'm not manually controlling the banks. The perko switch that I have has only "on" and "off" not like the 1/2/off I've seen. Since, I do not manually switch from battery 1 or 2 then a 16awg to ignition switch is next move? I can do that!

waterlogged882
02-23-2014, 09:18 PM
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MLA
02-23-2014, 09:24 PM
Forgive my ignorance but for "house loads" (top Left connection as shown on pdf below), all I have hooked up to the perko switch is my sub amp. What should be set up to the house loads connection? My single battery set up was 2awg from the engine ground and to the starter. Should there be more to the "house loads" connection other than the sub amp?

side note, both batteries read 12.7x on volt meter with engine off (without putting on trickle charger).

Thanks a lot for helping me out!

http://assets.bluesea.com/files/resources/instructions/990310020.pdf

A "house load" is anything you want to run when the engine is off and have it draw off the newly installed "house bank"

Your head-unit should also be connected house bank. Odd are, its drawing off the cranking as it originally was.

MLA
02-23-2014, 09:30 PM
At the batteries, I have nothing other than the engine power, engine ground, and sub amp power/ground. Should I do something with the ignition switch wiring? Side note, I rewired PP power to ignition switch to help with voltage drop from PP.

The only cables connected directly to the battery B+ posts are the cables going to the #1b and #2b posts and the auto bilge.

Nothing needs to be done to the key switch when installing the add-a-battery

_fng_
02-23-2014, 09:30 PM
A "house load" is anything you want to run when the engine is off and have it draw off the newly installed "house bank"

Your head-unit should also be connected house bank. Odd are, its drawing off the cranking as it originally was.

Thanks for the help guys! If I could buy you guys a beer, I would!

MLA
02-23-2014, 09:33 PM
As it was "optional" I did not install this part of the diagram. Eureka??

You do need to wire up the SI terminal. I dont think thats your issue.

_fng_
02-23-2014, 09:36 PM
You do need to wire up the SI terminal. I dont think thats your issue.

Do you mean do not need to wire SI terminal? In your previous post you say that I don't need to mess with ignition switch. Do you think the head unit connected to cranking battery could draw enough load to cause a hesitation in starting?

My next step will be running a SI to the ignition to see if it reduces the hesitation when starting...other than that, I may take it somewhere.

Here is what mine looks like.

MLA
02-23-2014, 09:47 PM
You do need to wire up the SI terminal. I dont think thats your issue.

Sorry, need to make an edit here! I left out NOT

You DO NOT need to wire the SI terminal. its getting late, my eyes are tired and im watching the race that should have already been run 8p

kblanch09
03-10-2014, 11:38 AM
Does the isolated relay allow you to always be able to start the engine even if the aux battery is dead?

Kweisner
03-10-2014, 04:24 PM
^ If you are referring to the original setup posted by Diesel on page 1, then yes, that is the basic premise. If you read back in this thread you will see there are those folks that say once you join the drained AUX/house battery with the starter battery, there is a chance that the starter batt will be drained by the house batt. Technically this is true.

Practically speaking, the period of time between when the batteries are coupled and the starter is engaged is going to be less than a second or two, so I don't know if this is a legit concern. I have the isolator setup, and so far, I've never had a starting issue and I enjoy not worrying about switch positions, my memory, etc.

chooverton
04-04-2014, 05:59 PM
I am finally going to install the SR200 i have had sitting in the garage for 6 months this weekend. Quick question, i have searched all over and couldn't find an answer, although i bet it is here. What Gauge wire do i need for the non-battery connections? Would some 12 GA primary wire work for both the ignition and ground wire (small terminals). I am using 0 gauge for the battery cable. May be be overkill but i got a deal on it. Thanks

waterlogged882
04-04-2014, 06:53 PM
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wilsonck
06-22-2014, 02:40 PM
I have a 2002 Prostar 209 and I have the blue Seas 9001e switch( 4 position OFF, 1, 2 or 1+2) that I wanted to install. My problem seems to be around the current positive pole of the single battery that was there.

I took the amp connections off the starter battery and moved to the house battery. I then had a positive cable from each battery to the switch and a ground cable between the negative posts on each battery. The only thing remaining was to move something from the start battery to the 1+2 post on the switch.

There are 2 cables remaining from the original setup on the positive post of my battery. One cable goes to the starter and has the regular battery post connector on it and the other one looks to go to the fuse box/ignition under the dash.

Are both of these cables supposed to go to common post? If so, then it appears that I need to cut off the regular battery post connector to put on a ring connector(I don't particularly want to do this)

waterlogged882
06-22-2014, 05:13 PM
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wilsonck
06-22-2014, 07:55 PM
well, in answer to your question, I had the cables connected to the switch, but not to the + post on the batteries yet. I was just laying things out to understand it all and when I got to what needed to go to the 1+2 or the common connection, that is where I started looking at the 2 cables left on the battery and figured that the one that goes to the starter had to go to the common post.... and I didn't want to cut any ends off.

I have read through the thread and looked at a bunch of schematics. But for some reason, the last step isn't clicking yet.

waterlogged882
06-22-2014, 08:03 PM
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waterlogged882
06-22-2014, 08:17 PM
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waterlogged882
06-22-2014, 08:24 PM
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wilsonck
06-22-2014, 09:38 PM
My last step, is what you show with the "hot from Terminal to starter" cable above. I will need to cut the battery post end off the existing wire and put on one of the O-ring connectors to connect it to the switch.

With the kit that I bought, I don't have the isolation switch(black box) that you show.

Thanks for the info. I think I need to read the thread again to see if I will use this switch or do it a different way.

Kweisner
06-23-2014, 09:49 AM
I think you can now see the benefit of the KISS principle. An isolation switch as the original poster stated is really all you need. The bank switch only makes it more complicated and expensive. Were I to do it again, I'd not mess with the bank switch.

Well said. I did the original install and it's been completely "no-touch" foolproof. Never have to think about it (unless of course at some point the relay fails, in which case the ONLY downside is the house/stereo battery doesn't get charged by the alternator). Cheaper too.

paintpollz
11-08-2014, 12:35 PM
OK I need the dual batt setup. I just bought a 197 with 1500w of amps and one battery, trouble waiting to happen. What I've gotten from this thread:

-use the BW isolator. KISS. there will be other people driving this boat, I do not want to have to go thru battery tutorials with them.

-you should use two of the same batteries, although it would be nice to have a deep cycle as the house battery.

-there will be unavoidable strain on the alternator while charging the two batteries when the boat is running. boo hoo.

Question:

-Do I need to rewire the stereo switch to the house batt so that the amps & stereo turn on when flipping the stereo switch, and all pull from the house batt? Otherwise, if I just connect the amps to the house batt, won't the stereo still draw from the starting batt when the key is in the off position?

-When running a dual battery setup in this manner, is it wise to replace the alternator ever so often as preventative maintenance insurance? No one wants to get stranded........

Thanks

CantRepeat
11-08-2014, 01:05 PM
Keep everything wired as you currently have it. Add the second battery and put the starter and only the starter on it. Your current battery becomes your house battery and the new one becomes your starter battery.

Find out what your current alternator amp rating is. You may need to upgrade that and you might want to upgrade your alternator to battery wire as well.

With the correct amp rated alternator you should not need to replace it as a preventive maintenance measure.

paintpollz
11-08-2014, 01:44 PM
Keep everything wired as you currently have it. Add the second battery and put the starter and only the starter on it. Your current battery becomes your house battery and the new one becomes your starter battery.

Find out what your current alternator amp rating is. You may need to upgrade that and you might want to upgrade your alternator to battery wire as well.

With the correct amp rated alternator you should not need to replace it as a preventive maintenance measure.

Excellent explanation. Thank you:)

paintpollz
11-08-2014, 04:03 PM
Question on the isolator, I'm just trying to get the science down. Say I had one of these installed, and someone left the stereo on all night, and the main/house battery completely drains. Theoretically, there wouldn't be any power in the main/house battery to close the isolator and connect the two batteries for charge. So this is the primary reason why we connect the starter to the second battery? Once the engine fires, power draws from the second battery to the main/house battery, closes the isolator, and then the alternator starts charging both batts, correct?

JimN
11-08-2014, 04:21 PM
OK I need the dual batt setup. I just bought a 197 with 1500w of amps and one battery, trouble waiting to happen. What I've gotten from this thread:

-use the BW isolator. KISS. there will be other people driving this boat, I do not want to have to go thru battery tutorials with them.

-you should use two of the same batteries, although it would be nice to have a deep cycle as the house battery.

-there will be unavoidable strain on the alternator while charging the two batteries when the boat is running. boo hoo.

Question:

-Do I need to rewire the stereo switch to the house batt so that the amps & stereo turn on when flipping the stereo switch, and all pull from the house batt? Otherwise, if I just connect the amps to the house batt, won't the stereo still draw from the starting batt when the key is in the off position?

-When running a dual battery setup in this manner, is it wise to replace the alternator ever so often as preventative maintenance insurance? No one wants to get stranded........

Thanks

Do you define 'house battery', as "the one used for the boat's electronics and engine"? You want a cranking battery for the engine, if the engine's electronics will be sharing the battery used for cranking and if you want to use deep cycle for the audio, that's fine, but you WILL need a heavy duty alternator if you expect your batteries to recharge and be able to supply all of the other electronics with the proper voltage and current. If you were to use a separate battery for cranking and ONLY for cranking, a deep cycle would work, but if you expect to run the battery voltage down below 10VDC, you're not using them according to their design. 'Deep cycle' doesn't mean "deplete them so they're stone dead".

How loudly do you play the stereo, do you crank it while the engine is off, at idle, or at/near WOT and what other accessories would be used at a given time? Those will determine the demands on the batteries and charging system. The charging system must be designed for "worst case" scenarios if it's expected to survive and operate correctly.

Why would you "replace the alternator every so often as preventative maintenance insurance", rather than just design the system correctly in the first place?

If you use a heavy duty alternator, you'll need to use a heavier charging wire, too.

List the stereo equipment by brand and model, too.

Kweisner
11-08-2014, 08:04 PM
When you turn the key, both batteries are joined by the isolator relay so which one is drained is not a factor. Essentially they become one battery at that moment so the "good" battery energizes the relay unless I am mistaken.

As for the alternator, I do not know enough about electrical engineering to be an authority. That said, the point of the isolator is to protect the starting battery and therefore it should typically remain at full charge capacity. Assuming the house/accessory battery were completely drained, when joined you'd really only be charging the depleted battery off the alternator (plus a little to top off the starting battery). I have been using the classic dual battery setup as originally described by Diesel in this thread and have never had any kind of issue getting started, charging and operating the stereo/amps/accessories while floating.

CantRepeat
11-09-2014, 07:11 AM
I wouldn't use an isolator. I'd suggest a VSR.

https://www.bluesea.com/products/7610/SI-ACR_Automatic_Charging_Relay_-_12_24V_DC_120A

paintpollz
11-09-2014, 08:52 AM
Do you define 'house battery', as "the one used for the boat's electronics and engine"? You want a cranking battery for the engine, if the engine's electronics will be sharing the battery used for cranking and if you want to use deep cycle for the audio, that's fine, but you WILL need a heavy duty alternator if you expect your batteries to recharge and be able to supply all of the other electronics with the proper voltage and current. If you were to use a separate battery for cranking and ONLY for cranking, a deep cycle would work, but if you expect to run the battery voltage down below 10VDC, you're not using them according to their design. 'Deep cycle' doesn't mean "deplete them so they're stone dead".

Yes that is my definition of a hous/aux batt. The idea is not to deplete them, I was just throwing out a what if scenario

How loudly do you play the stereo, do you crank it while the engine is off, at idle, or at/near WOT and what other accessories would be used at a given time? Those will determine the demands on the batteries and charging system. The charging system must be designed for "worst case" scenarios if it's expected to survive and operate correctly.

Correct, I'm aware that I will need a new alternator

Why would you "replace the alternator every so often as preventative maintenance insurance", rather than just design the system correctly in the first place?

If you use a heavy duty alternator, you'll need to use a heavier charging wire, too.

List the stereo equipment by brand and model, too.

My understanding of charging systems is limited. Now that I know that I can purchase a high output alternator designed for a system like this, I will go that route.

CantRepeat
11-09-2014, 09:47 AM
Yes that is my definition of a hous/aux batt. The idea is not to deplete them, I was just throwing out a what if scenario



Correct, I'm aware that I will need a new alternator



My understanding of charging systems is limited. Now that I know that I can purchase a high output alternator designed for a system like this, I will go that route.

http://www.onallcylinders.com/2012/10/17/how-to-choose-an-alternator/

paintpollz
11-09-2014, 09:59 AM
http://www.onallcylinders.com/2012/10/17/how-to-choose-an-alternator/

Yup, read that article, thanks Tim. Now in the hunt for the product # for an HO alt to fit this motor. I'll likely install the alt and then have an automotive shop around me upgrade the big 3.

JimN
11-09-2014, 11:00 AM
Yes that is my definition of a hous/aux batt. The idea is not to deplete them, I was just throwing out a what if scenario



Correct, I'm aware that I will need a new alternator

My understanding of charging systems is limited. Now that I know that I can purchase a high output alternator designed for a system like this, I will go that route.

In the '90s and into the early 2000s, people who competed in IASCA and other car stereo "sound off" competitions were running a lot more power than your boat, often in small imported cars. The OEM alternators were often good for 65A, maybe. Your boat's alternator is probably good for 75A and in general operation, there's about 20% of safety margin, so figure that it's using about 50A-60A on a regular basis. What the competitors or installers would do is fabricate a bracket and mount a second alternator, completely isolated from the one that runs the car. This way, the starting batter is never affected by the audio system and vice versa. In this configuration, you shouldn't have any problem charging the audio system's batteries- at 12V (used for system design purposes because it's a real-world number), 95A works out to 1140 Watts. Now, this isn't likely to support that load for long, but it does give a ballpark for estimating what you'll need for recharging the batteries for the audio system. At 14.4 VDC, which is the typically-stated full charging voltage in a car or boat and this is not going to be seen at idle unless an alternator is "under-pulleyed", meaning that the alternator's pulley is smaller than normal, causing it to spin faster than it would if the larger pulley was on it. You would need to find the max RPM for the alternator, in order to avoid damage at/near WOT.

The trick- finding space for a second alternator in a boat. On a V-drive, it should be easier than in a mid-engine model.

CheeseSteak1
12-13-2014, 11:30 AM
Anyone have any thoughts or reviews of the Blue Sea Systems Add-a-Battery Kit?

waterlogged882
12-13-2014, 12:03 PM
Anyone have any thoughts or reviews of the Blue Sea Systems Add-a-Battery Kit?

This kit and the cumulative parts have been discussed http://www.mastercraft.com/teamtalk/showpost.php?p=1058206&postcount=305

Look at other posts where the entire kit is not necessary and read a few more threads. http://www.mastercraft.com/teamtalk/showpost.php?p=1058221&postcount=307

It is easy and all of that kit is not needed for battery isolation.

go to post number one and follow those recommendations and call it a day, KISS and economical - all you need is an isolator and two batteries, cable, fuses, and the correct schematic. everything is in this thread

Buy one of these for each battery. http://www.amazon.com/NOCO-G1100-Battery-Charger-Maintainer/dp/B004LX3AXQ

i'd also recommend an upgraded alternator if yours is less than ~100 amps

good luck on the install.

CheeseSteak1
12-14-2014, 01:41 AM
This kit and the cumulative parts have been discussed http://www.mastercraft.com/teamtalk/showpost.php?p=1058206&postcount=305

Look at other posts where the entire kit is not necessary and read a few more threads. http://www.mastercraft.com/teamtalk/showpost.php?p=1058221&postcount=307

It is easy and all of that kit is not needed for battery isolation.

go to post number one and follow those recommendations and call it a day, KISS and economical - all you need is an isolator and two batteries, cable, fuses, and the correct schematic. everything is in this thread

Buy one of these for each battery. http://www.amazon.com/NOCO-G1100-Battery-Charger-Maintainer/dp/B004LX3AXQ

i'd also recommend an upgraded alternator if yours is less than ~100 amps

good luck on the install.


Thanks! I'll go with Diesel's method with a switch at the dash to control the relay.

waterlogged882
12-14-2014, 09:32 AM
Thanks! I'll go with Diesel's method with a switch at the dash to control the relay.

Your ignition switch will do just that - accessory position will separate the batteries and on/run will combine them (through the relay) for charging (so a higher capacity alternator output for two batteries is recommended).

Don't let me persuade you into something you do or do not want but from my experience, I like to keep it simple.

Don't forget the fuses on each hot lead for each battery, etc- there is more to the complete install than meets the eye (extra cable, etc) I like http://www.genuinedealz.com/ for cables and block fuses

CheeseSteak1
12-14-2014, 09:57 AM
Your ignition switch will do just that - accessory position will separate the batteries and on/run will combine them (through the relay) for charging (so a higher capacity alternator output is recommended).

Don't let me persuade you into something you do or do not want but from my experience, I like to keep it simple.

Don't forget the fuses on each hot lead for each battery, etc- there is more to the complete install than meets the eye (extra cable, etc) I like http://www.genuinedealz.com/ for cables and block fuses

I actually sat down and read this entire thread last night and decided to do just the relay (Kiss). Any idea what happened to Diesel's diagrams? Nothing is showing up on my end. Also, the Brog relay isn't manufactured anymore, so should I use the equivalent Stinger relay? Didn't know if it needs to be marine grade. Thanks for all the links.

waterlogged882
12-14-2014, 01:10 PM
I actually sat down and read this entire thread last night and decided to do just the relay (Kiss). Any idea what happened to Diesel's diagrams? Nothing is showing up on my end. Also, the Brog relay isn't manufactured anymore, so should I use the equivalent Stinger relay? Didn't know if it needs to be marine grade. Thanks for all the links.
This thread since Diesel posted has been through two server crashes or upgrades that I know of and someone failed to transfer the photo files or lost the pictures by not transferring them along with the rest of the upgrade. It's gone.

The relay has been re-identified with a cross reference (I think it is here in this thread somewhere) but certainly can be cross-referenced easily enough OR you can use the isolation switch that Blue Seas makes without the Perko switch. I think they are too expensive but who am I? Certainly not a smart paralegal to know it all.

That Stinger isolator will serve the same purpose at half the price.

The diagram that Blue Seas has on their site is just as good for all practical purposes.

MLA
12-14-2014, 03:02 PM
Continuous-duty solenoids only, are my least favorite means to allow 2 banks to receive a charge when the engine is running, mainly because you have no means to use the house bank for emergency starting. Thats why I like some form of a dual-bank switch.

If one is going to go the solenoid only route, I prefer to have it controlled via the key switch rather than manual. Way to easy to forget, and end up with a dead house bank early in the day.

The one huge advantage of an ASR/VSR like the BS 7610 has over just a solenoid, is that the ASR/VSR is controlled by voltage and load, where as when the solenoid is closed, both banks are effected by each others draws. Its either open or closed vie the key switch or manually by the captain.

waterlogged882
12-14-2014, 04:26 PM
..... Any idea what happened to Diesel's diagrams? I have a PDF of the thread (up to Feb 2009) that I found on the internet. It has the pictures and diagram (prior to the mismanaged files). Send me your email in a PM and I'll shoot it over to you. The file is too large for the allowable size of attachment to the thread. :rolleyes: :rolleyes:

bturner2
12-15-2014, 08:14 AM
If you really want simple the Blue Seas solution is just that. All the parts are marine rated and they provide detailed instructions. This along with a complete rewire of my existing "custom professional" audio system the PO had done was one of the first projects I took after purchasing my 07 X2. I did a post on my installation on this site.

From a cost perspective when it comes to wiring in a boat your best money is always best spent doing it right the first time. Buy marine rated wiring and components or expect to be stranded at the dock or worse yet on the water somewhere. My Blue Seas installation with marine rated wiring and components from Genuine Dealz is going on 6 seasons without a hitch.

Good luck with your project.

CantRepeat
12-15-2014, 08:31 AM
Anyone have any thoughts or reviews of the Blue Sea Systems Add-a-Battery Kit?

If you really want simple the Blue Seas solution is just that. All the parts are marine rated and they provide detailed instructions. This along with a complete rewire of my existing "custom professional" audio system the PO had done was one of the first projects I took after purchasing my 07 X2. I did a post on my installation on this site.

From a cost perspective when it comes to wiring in a boat your best money is always best spent doing it right the first time. Buy marine rated wiring and components or expect to be stranded at the dock or worse yet on the water somewhere. My Blue Seas installation with marine rated wiring and components from Genuine Dealz is going on 6 seasons without a hitch.

Good luck with your project.

I installed a Blue Seas VSR and new switch in my 06 X30 and it has worked very well. I would assume it would work just as well in a vehicle install.

paintpollz
12-15-2014, 01:58 PM
Anyone have any thoughts or reviews of the Blue Sea Systems Add-a-Battery Kit?

I installed a Blue Seas VSR and new switch in my 06 X30 and it has worked very well. I would assume it would work just as well in a vehicle install.

A certified marine electronics tech is installing mine as we speak. Tim mentioned having a dedicated starting battery, and then house battery for the rest of the electronics. I've taken this route with a few adjustments. I'm having the starting circuit, nav lights, and blower wired to what my tech has called the "critical systems battery," and then the rest of the electronics wired to the house battery. This was a suggestion by the tech, and I think it makes sense.....

The reasoning behind this is if for whatever reason the house battery (which should be a deep cycle batt) is completely drained, potentially ruining the battery, you would still be able to operate the blower, and nav lights for a safe start-up and trip home (nav lights if of course it was dark out).

This essentially makes the system idiot proof, for the most part. I'm not going to be the only one operating this machine, so I wanted to set up the electronics in the safest way possible.

CantRepeat
12-15-2014, 02:06 PM
A certified marine electronics tech is installing mine as we speak. Tim mentioned having a dedicated starting battery, and then house battery for the rest of the electronics. I've taken this route with a few adjustments. I'm having the starting circuit, nav lights, and blower wired to what my tech has called the "critical systems battery," and then the rest of the electronics wired to the house battery. This was a suggestion by the tech, and I think it makes sense.....

The reasoning behind this is if for whatever reason the house battery (which should be a deep cycle batt) is completely drained, potentially ruining the battery, you would still be able to operate the blower, and nav lights for a safe start-up and trip home (nav lights if of course it was dark out).

This essentially makes the system idiot proof, for the most part. I'm not going to be the only one operating this machine, so I wanted to set up the electronics in the safest way possible.

Sounds like you've got a great plan going. I would, and will be doing, putting your bilge pump(s) auto wire run straight to one of your batteries so they have the ability to pump out water regardless of your battery switch's current position.

paintpollz
12-15-2014, 02:28 PM
Sounds like you've got a great plan going. I would, and will be doing, putting your bilge pump(s) auto wire run straight to one of your batteries so they have the ability to pump out water regardless of your battery switch's current position.

Yes, I left that part out, but is a part of the installation. The boat will be wet docked, so if the seal goes and it starts to take in water, the bilge pump is auto-on. Damn boat lifts are crazy money:mad:

Rockman
02-06-2015, 09:42 AM
I am in the process of getting all the pieces to do a second battery setup on our 94 190.

I pm'd Cloak a few times as I am following his setup and had a few questions..but he has not been on the board her in a while.

What battery types should I be using for the house and starting batteries?

Should both be deep cycles, neither one deep cycles or 1 + 1?

Also which guage wires for the positive and negative should I be using?


I am relocating the starting battery from the back of the boat that was next to the gas tank to under the passenger seat in the front and the second battery will right there as well.

Appreciate the feed back!

02ProstarSammyD
02-06-2015, 09:55 AM
1. I use a deep cycle for my amps etc and a starting battery for main
2. I matched my factory sizing for wiring which was a #2 I believe

Rockman
02-06-2015, 09:56 AM
1. I use a deep cycle for my amps etc and a starting battery for main
2. I matched my factory sizing for wiring which was a #2 I believe

Awesome. Thank you!

CantRepeat
02-07-2015, 07:53 AM
You might look at Sodar's prostart dual battery post too.

I also have a couple of diagrams in this thread.

http://www.mastercraft.com/teamtalk/showthread.php?t=61783

CheeseSteak1
03-19-2015, 01:09 AM
Just picked up 2 new Deka batteries today and I'm tossing my perko switch for a Stinger SPG32 200 amp relay. I attached Diesel's original wiring diagram for this project and I want to know if I need to fuse the positive lines going to the relay. If so, how big? Thanks

CantRepeat
03-19-2015, 07:00 AM
I can't even read that. lol

CheeseSteak1
03-19-2015, 08:15 AM
If you want to read the diagram explanation go to the first page of this thread. The wiring diagram is no longer there. That is why I posted the pic.

Kweisner
03-19-2015, 08:26 AM
Just picked up 2 new Deka batteries today and I'm tossing my perko switch for a Stinger SPG32 200 amp relay. I attached Diesel's original wiring diagram for this project and I want to know if I need to fuse the positive lines going to the relay. If so, how big? Thanks

I wired mine up exactly per Diesel's original spec and did not fuse mine--but that's not necessarily the "right" answer so I am curious as well.

The pos leg from my starting battery to the relay already had an inline circuit breaker and my assumption is that this breaker will function normally when both batteries are connected by the relay. IOW, the breaker really sees just a single battery at that point.

Had this setup for three years now and no issues. . .perhaps I'm just lucky since this thinking has NO basis in electrical engineering or circuit design. Curious to hear what others have to say.

waterlogged882
03-19-2015, 04:30 PM
Curious to hear what others have to say.I prefer a fuse on each hot connection.

Adding this picture for reference in the future for others.

BOM for the dual setup as far as wiring from genuinedealz dot com. with a few extras for my stash. 91-94 Prostar 190

.

76S&S
10-23-2015, 02:40 PM
I just received this in my email; looks like a simple and convenient package

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vPhD7fgYq3w&feature=youtu.be&utm_source=Marine+Parts+Source&utm_campaign=c56f3237f2-MPS_Blue_Seas_7649_Add_a_Battery_Kit_10_22_2015&utm_medium=email&utm_term=0_c92d83e134-c56f3237f2-211164429

derek1800
04-24-2016, 10:00 PM
Has anyone used the "Add A Battery" kit in the above youtube video?

I have a 2006 X2 and am looking to add a second battery. How are people mounting and enclosing the second batter in an x2?

CantRepeat
04-25-2016, 06:31 AM
I used the add a battery kit.

http://www.mastercraft.com/teamtalk/showthread.php?t=61783

bozzy
07-17-2016, 04:56 PM
Resurrecting this old thread with a question...

On all my boats the first thing I ever did was always upgrade to make sure I had lots of power. Here's my question...

My new 2016 X30, has two batteries (I assume identical group 24's) with a 3 position switch; OFF, ON, & COMBINED.... I am a little confused on this particular arrangement.

The way it was explained to me is that you run on the one battery for everything; starting the boat, as well as engine-off stereo/lighting. If you kill battery one, then you can switch to COMBINED to start the boat as well as recharge the batteries... So, unless I'm understanding this arrangement wrong, the "house" battery is also the "starting" battery and the second battery is only for emergencies...

So I guess this is fine, BUT, is the stock group 24 going to give me enough engine-off stereo and lighting time? Normally I run two 6v's rigged together for my engine-off needs and my switch was; ONE, TWO, ONE&TWO, and OFF.

Thought's on this arrangement? I've never had a setup like this...

MLA
07-17-2016, 05:35 PM
Bozzy,

Sounds like you got a poor explanation.

If wired correctly, engine loads draw off one battery and non engine loads, such as audio and lighting, will draw off the house battery. You should never run down the main cranking while at anchor, again, presuming the system is wired right. IF the main cranking is ever weak, rotate the switch to combine gives you help from the house battery to fire the engine. With engine running, both batteries receive a charge from the alternator.

Is a single group-24 enough Ah? That depends on the expected loads and how long you want to play while at anchor.

Thoughts? I like the passive/manual dual circuit switch and VSR setup when applicable. Simple and effective because you dont have to babysit the switch between running and anchoring. However, if a large Ah house bank is needed, you may exceed the effectiveness of the ACR. In this case, the traditional 1/2/BOTH/OFF switch might be best.

bozzy
07-17-2016, 07:13 PM
Bozzy,

Sounds like you got a poor explanation.

If wired correctly, engine loads draw off one battery and non engine loads, such as audio and lighting, will draw off the house battery. You should never run down the main cranking while at anchor, again, presuming the system is wired right. IF the main cranking is ever weak, rotate the switch to combine gives you help from the house battery to fire the engine. With engine running, both batteries receive a charge from the alternator.

Is a single group-24 enough Ah? That depends on the expected loads and how long you want to play while at anchor.

Thoughts? I like the passive/manual dual circuit switch and VSR setup when applicable. Simple and effective because you dont have to babysit the switch between running and anchoring. However, if a large Ah house bank is needed, you may exceed the effectiveness of the ACR. In this case, the traditional 1/2/BOTH/OFF switch might be best.

Are you saying that the stereo, lighting, etc. is all wired into the second battery, and the first battery is isolated to just starting the boat? If this is the case, then the only way to charge battery 2 would be to run the switch on "combined" correct?

Sorry if I'm misunderstanding...

MLA
07-17-2016, 07:22 PM
Are you saying that the stereo, lighting, etc. is all wired into the second battery, and the first battery is isolated to just starting the boat

Should be, if wired right.

If this is the case, then the only way to charge battery 2 would be to run the switch on "combined" correct?

Nope, thats where the VSR comes in.

waterlogged882
07-17-2016, 07:24 PM
... If this is the case, then the only way to charge battery 2 would be to run the switch on "combined" correct?

Sorry if I'm misunderstanding...The ignition-position isolator (VSR) controls the charging of the two batteries. Has nothing to do with the combined position on the dummy switch.

When the ignition switch is in the run position the isolator (VSR) fails closed, charging (or combining) both batteries. When it is in the ignition accessory position it fails open and separates the two batteries. Your start battery should be for start only. Simple as that. The other accessories run off of the auxiliary battery. Simple as that. Don't over think it. The combine position on the dummy switch is a manual control over-ride of the ignition switch commands to use both batteries for starting if that be the need....or it will also cut power to the entire system while in storage or layup.

Who gave you the information on that c0ck-eyed approach you described?

.

T-Rex
07-17-2016, 08:26 PM
Do yourself a favor and get the BlueSea Isolator/Combiner https://www.bluesea.com/products/7610/SI-ACR_Automatic_Charging_Relay_-_12_24V_DC_120A Starter to one battery, stereo/etc to the other battery. No worries.

bozzy
07-17-2016, 10:37 PM
The ignition-position isolator (VSR) controls the charging of the two batteries. Has nothing to do with the combined position on the dummy switch.

When the ignition switch is in the run position the isolator (VSR) fails closed, charging (or combining) both batteries. When it is in the ignition accessory position it fails open and separates the two batteries. Your start battery should be for start only. Simple as that. The other accessories run off of the auxiliary battery. Simple as that. Don't over think it. The combine position on the dummy switch is a manual control over-ride of the ignition switch commands to use both batteries for starting if that be the need....or it will also cut power to the entire system while in storage or layup.

Who gave you the information on that c0ck-eyed approach you described?

.

OK, thank you. Clear as mud now...

waterlogged882
07-17-2016, 10:43 PM
OK, thank you. Clear as mud now...So who told you that mess??? :D :D

Seriously I hope this makes it clear. It's really an easy setup. I have a dual setup on another boat and used the Blue Seas components. Had I to do it again, I'd follow Diesel's suggestion in the first post of his thread as the original poster. No real need to the big red switch.

bozzy
07-17-2016, 10:48 PM
So who told you that mess??? :D :D

Seriously I hope this makes it clear. It's really an easy setup.

Sales guy told me this, but in all fairness I could have misunderstood him...

The way you explained it makes perfect sense and this sounds like a better system then what I had on my last boat. No more constantly flipping the battery switch now...

Question, assuming the stock batteries are dual group 24's is there any merit in upgrading the house/auxiliary battery? If I'm running all the LED lights and the stereo, with the engine off, how many hours of use could I roughly expect?

waterlogged882
07-17-2016, 10:59 PM
Sales guy told me this, but in all fairness I could have misunderstood him...

The way you explained it makes perfect sense and this sounds like a better system then what I had on my last boat. No more constantly flipping the battery switch now...

Question, assuming the stock batteries are dual group 24's is there any merit in upgrading the house/auxiliary battery? If I'm running all the LED lights and the stereo, with the engine off, how many hours of use could I roughly expect?I thing the group 24 battery bank is sufficient. What I would recommend is upgrading the alternator. Your stock alternator probably rated for 53 amps output. Now that you have added or enlarged the battery bank, the alt. has to work a little harder to keep up. Eventually the alt. will give out a little sooner due to the overtime work. I upgraded my 53 amp to a 105 amp and increased the size of the wire from the alt to the solenoid to a larger AWG wire to carry the added output from the new alt. The wire that is / was there (OEM) was calculated to carry the smaller load. I have had a new alt. from DB Electrical for three years now, going strong.

The only time I use the dummy switch on mine is during layup or garage time from day to day. You should not have to manually turn it back and forth during the day's time of use. Let the isolator and the ignition switch wiring take care of that for you.

I'd say you should be able to get close to 4 hours from the auxiliary battery with that draw on it and in this case, some here have gone to a deep cycle for the auxiliary (still group 24). Your mileage may vary. LEDs have brought a new dimension (less power draw) to the lighting industry. Amplifiers make a difference too.

I was just messing with you with my persistent question. :D

Patrick Hardy
07-17-2016, 11:22 PM
On a side note of Diesel's approach, if any one is looking to do his style / type of dual battery setup, I have a new / never used 200 Amp relay / battery isolator (PAC-200 Model), I am looking to sell. If anyone is interested, send my a PM. I never got around to doing the Dual battery setup.

waterlogged882
07-17-2016, 11:28 PM
On a side note of Diesel's approach, if any one is looking to do his style / type of dual battery setup, I have a new / never used 200 Amp relay / battery isolator (PAC-200 Model), I am looking to sell. If anyone is interested, send my a PM. I never got around to doing the Dual battery setup.That is really all one needs for the purpose of using the dual setup. The rest is bling...

bozzy
07-17-2016, 11:56 PM
I thing the group 24 battery bank is sufficient. What I would recommend is upgrading the alternator. Your stock alternator probably rated for 53 amps output. Now that you have added or enlarged the battery bank, the alt. has to work a little harder to keep up. Eventually the alt. will give out a little sooner due to the overtime work. I upgraded my 53 amp to a 105 amp and increased the size of the wire from the alt to the solenoid to a larger AWG wire to carry the added output from the new alt. The wire that is / was there (OEM) was calculated to carry the smaller load. I have had a new alt. from DB Electrical for three years now, going strong.

The only time I use the dummy switch on mine is during layup or garage time from day to day. You should not have to manually turn it back and forth during the day's time of use. Let the isolator and the ignition switch wiring take care of that for you.

I'd say you should be able to get close to 4 hours from the auxiliary battery with that draw on it and in this case, some here have gone to a deep cycle for the auxiliary (still group 24). Your mileage may vary. LEDs have brought a new dimension (less power draw) to the lighting industry. Amplifiers make a difference too.

I was just messing with you with my persistent question. :D

OK, thank you for the further insight....

My boat came from the factory with dual sets of tower speakers, speaker LED rings, and underwater LED lighting. Do you think the MC factory put a better alternator in, and maybe better batteries? Would this be common practice for MC given all the extra factory options? It seems odd that I would have to upgrade my alt. and batts to efficiently run their factory options, especially given the boats price tag...

Thoughts?

waterlogged882
07-18-2016, 12:06 AM
OK, thank you for the further insight....

My boat came from the factory with dual sets of tower speakers, speaker LED rings, and underwater LED lighting. Do you think the MC factory put a better alternator in, and maybe better batteries? Would this be common practice for MC given all the extra factory options? It seems odd that I would have to upgrade my alt. and batts to efficiently run their factory options, especially given the boats price tag...

Thoughts?I think in terms of mostly old school. I'd say MC put in an adequate system for your needs.

Enjoy the summer....

Wicker68
07-18-2016, 10:09 AM
OK, thank you for the further insight....

My boat came from the factory with dual sets of tower speakers, speaker LED rings, and underwater LED lighting. Do you think the MC factory put a better alternator in, and maybe better batteries? Would this be common practice for MC given all the extra factory options? It seems odd that I would have to upgrade my alt. and batts to efficiently run their factory options, especially given the boats price tag...

Thoughts?

To give you some perspective, I just recently upgraded my system from a 2 battery (Group 24s) to a 3 battery (2-31s and a 24) and put a 4 position Perko switch. I use the single 24 for when I'm actually underway and driving around. When I hit the sandbar I switch to my Group 31s bank to power my stereo. I have 800W and 600W JL amps powering 6 M880s and 1 10" sub and I've played it for 4+ hours with no issue. I did buy a Promariner onboard charger for the Group 31 bank and just plug the boat in when I get home.

Check PepBoys right now for a good deal on batteries. They're running 25% the Optima Blue Tops.

Table Rocker
07-01-2017, 02:28 PM
To those installing or making modifications to their battery setups. Read this thread and learn about what you are doing. Sketch out your plans on paper and make sure you follow them.

A friend sent me this pic yesterday. He got it from his friend on Lake Lanier who had just installed a dual battery setup on his two year old boat. He finished the installation and went to the house. His neighbor took this pic soon after. The boat, dock and two Jet-Skis were a total loss.

jamis0n
07-11-2017, 10:52 AM
So I've read all 37 pages of this thread and understand all the tradeoffs.

I'm planning to implement the dual battery setup using the Blue Sea Add a Battery kit, providing me with a master ON/OFF/EMERGENCY switch and an automatic charging relay (only connects the batteries when a charging voltage is detected). Schematic below.

Blue seas switch+ACR: https://www.bluesea.com/products/7650/Add-A-Battery_Kit_-_120A

My question is if I need to purchase a brand new starter <=> battery cable, as the 2 gauge cable I have now is just long enough to get into my battery compartment. If it needs to reach the switch (mounted on the passenger compartment wall), I'll need another 3 feet of cable.

Is it reasonable or foolish to try and extend a cable of that gauge that carries that much current? Is it safe with the right clamps+solder+insulation OR am I better off just buying a longer cable entirely?

http://forums.iboats.com/filedata/fetch?id=7078820&d=1400722685

CantRepeat
07-11-2017, 11:27 AM
I would up that 30 amp to a 50 and increase the 10g wire to 6g.

I would not extend any wire with in the system, but rather buy complete lengths.

How I did mine.

http://www.mastercraft.com/teamtalk/showthread.php?t=61783

As far as not purchasing two new batteries, that is also something I would not do.

jamis0n
07-11-2017, 12:41 PM
Sorry, ignore the wire gauge sizes. I grabbed that from Blue Sea systems simply to illustrate the wiring connections.

waterlogged882
07-11-2017, 04:01 PM
So I've read all 37 pages of this thread and .............foolish to try and extend a cable Look at genuinedealz dot com. Order the correct single length(s) and get them to crimp and put heat shrink on all ends. You'll need to measure the ring terminal sizes to tell them what to connect. Also you'll need fuse blocks and fuses for each hot/ battery. I like the terminal mount fuse blocks. While you're there, toss in a new ground cable. Use all tinned wire on the cables.

Lay out your configuration and get the correct lengths plus a little for error, placement changes, and other human factors. Don't forget the bend radius length for the cables turning up under the battery box cover then back over to the terminal post. That can run 12" easy.

If you are shopping at an auto place, you'll likely not get tinned wire strands. genuinedealz.com

Plan ahead..you'll need more than what that diagram represents. Smaller gauge wire for odds and ends, on/off, ignition accessory, etc. .....in addition; di-electric grease, in-line fuse junctions and fuses, shrink type ring terminal connectors, heat gun, ratchet/gear driven crimper, and a good stripping tool. Cheap crimpers are not good and good crimpers are not cheap.

I laid this in a rebuild a few years ago....your mileage may vary.


$0.02
.

bturner2
07-11-2017, 05:20 PM
^^^^^ now that's some good advise. The Blue seas system has been tested and engineered to work correctly. Yes there are a ton of ways to do this cheaper (as eluded to in this very detailed thread) buying pieces and parts from various sources but for the money (and safety) the Blue Seas solution is by far the safest and easiest to install.

Also agree with Repeat's recommendation on cable sizing and the breaker. When it comes to current carrying capability bigger is always better when it comes to cable.

As far as making your own cables goes.... I made all mine myself but have done this before, used a torch, know how to solder large cables, know how to use shrink wrap and the bought the correct lugs (purchased from Genuine Dealz). Can't stress enough that if you don't know what you're doing, don't try this as your first electrical experiment. The current being carried by these cables will hurt somebody or flame your boat (only your boat if you're lucky).

While this is a great technically accurate thread I don't know if I agree with the with the content in the context of the DIY'er. A lot assumes that the person doing the installation actually knows what's he's doing and won't make substitutions along the way (or just screw something up). Once again my recommendation would be to spent a couple buck more and just buy the pre-engineered solution, custom cables from Genuine Dealz and call it a day.

But other than being the guys that's boat is not burning, hey what do I know......

MLA
07-11-2017, 06:02 PM
Ill add this. Mount the ACR right next to the switch (like pictured above) but wire the ACR to the boat side of the switch, rather then direct as in that schematic. Keep those two cables short and you can skip those 2 fuses/breakers.

Do not extend battery cables. if the existing main battery cable will not reach where the switch needs/can go, replace it cable.

CantRepeat
07-12-2017, 09:09 AM
My method for putting lugs on large battery cables is to use a hydro crimper.

http://m7.i.pbase.com/g9/84/622984/3/152728197.wMk7hSjJ.jpg

Then put the lug in a bench vise and use a map torch to heat the lug until you can melt the solder to the cable as it sucks it into the lug and on the cable.

Let it cool and then slide your heat shrink onto the lug and use a heat gun.

jamis0n
07-12-2017, 04:54 PM
Appreciate all the advice!

Question: Should the 2AWG cable from the battery to the starter actually be fused? Wouldnt you need a massive fuse to handle the draw of a starter motor?

If not, the existing cable running from the starter to the battery can stay intact (and will always be connected) while everything else will be wired up through the switch and fused itself.

(And obviously the boat starter came this way from the dealer)

Just curious if the enormous (but short lived) current draw from starting the engine should go through the blue seas switch or not.

waterlogged882
07-12-2017, 07:41 PM
Appreciate all the advice!

Question: Should the 2AWG cable from the battery to the starter actually be fused? Wouldnt you need a massive fuse to handle the draw of a starter motor? Read back again.... A fuse block on the battery post....and a 150 amp fuse. That's the ticket.

If not, the existing cable running from the starter to the battery can stay intact (and will always be connected) while everything else will be wired up through the switch and fused itself.

(And obviously the boat starter came this way from the dealer)

Just curious if the enormous (but short lived) current draw from starting the engine should go through the blue seas switch or not. By default of configuration, the draw will follow the circuit....right through the switch (in the on position) or stops at the off position.

If you follow the diagram that you researched, it will be the correct configuration including the add-on comment by MLA. Tried and tested by me... :D :D

Don't ask the guy who wired the system in the picture above. Tried but not tested... :D

Nice crimping tool Tim.... That's what I'm talking about....

.

jamis0n
07-13-2017, 12:15 AM
Got it! Ok I got a little carried away and customized that diagram to my exact setup.

Any feedback would be appreciated.

Few minor questions:

1. The stereo circuit is using 1/0 AWG to continuously support 2+ amplifiers. I left the core circuit with the 2 AWG that the starter is using already. Thoughts?
2. Is 250A enough fusing for the starter side? Is the starter motor gonna spike to pull more than that?

I prefer this design from a safety perspective as each battery terminal effectively has its fuse built in. Just wondering about the starter draw.

Thanks!

My custom diagram:
http://i.imgur.com/LMWdSrn.jpg

MLA
07-13-2017, 06:45 AM
Amps need a ground trunk/branch setup same as the amp B+

Id run the ballast pumps as well as the rest of the house loads, on the house bank side. Thats just me.

ACR is closer to the switch, but still wired to the battery side as in still connected to the batteries when the switch is off. You want it on the boat or load side (amps and engine) of the switch.

CantRepeat
07-13-2017, 06:49 AM
Why would you wire anything else to the starter battery, IE the ballast pumps? That kind of defeats the purpose of an isolated starter battery.

Keith2230
07-13-2017, 08:51 AM
I too would wire the ballast to the house battery. The hatch motor is critical and low/infrequent power draw so it makes sense to me to leave it on the starting battery if you want but a case could easily be made to put it on the house as well...really your preference there.

Your ground distribution to the amps is fine but perhaps a little uncommon. Usually you see both positive and negative wires run to the battery for each amp or both sides go through a distribution block. Distribution blocks can be cleaner wiring, easier to wire and allow adding another amp with less electrical work. With only two amps it's almost as easy to run both straight to the battery as it is to do distribution blocks. If you see the possibility of a 3rd amp or if your house battery connection is getting a bit crazy with all the other stuff, running distribution on both would be a good idea.

2 gauge to the starter and block are a good idea but the leg to the alternator is way overkill. Most of these boats have alternators that put out less than 100 amps and with such a short run I'd consider 4 gauge to be overbuilt and 6 gauge to be correctly sized if it's under 8 feet long. It certainly won't hurt to go with thicker wire if you don't mind the cost but it's not going to get you anything in performance.

BTW nice diagram!

CantRepeat
07-13-2017, 09:38 AM
I think if you are going to run multiple amps then you run a dedicated ground from the battery to a distribution block that is just for the amps. Do not wire them to the house/helm distro block. Likewise for power. JimN has referenced having the same length power and ground leads for amps.

I agree with Keith on the 6 gauge for the alternator and like I did put a 100 amp breaker on that wire between the alt and the house battery.

jamis0n
07-13-2017, 11:02 AM
Great advice! I cant thank you all enough!

If I can summarize:
- Ground the amps in the same way they are powered (or at least run each amp ground lead all the way to the battery)
- Consider if ballast/hatch pumps are "critical" enough to run on the starter circuit.
- Consider wiring the ACR to the load side instead of the battery side.
- 4 gauge is plenty from alternator to starter.


Questions:
- @MLA - Why is wiring the ACR to the load side preferred?
- @CantRepeat - Your amp grounding advice makes sense, but are you suggesting that the amp positive leads be wired directly to the battery too, not through the switch?
I don't like that solution because it means I can't ever completely cut power to the stereo (overnight or for storage) without disconnecting the battery.
- It sounds like a mere 100amp fuse is enough to withstand the current of the engine starting. Really?

CantRepeat
07-13-2017, 11:16 AM
The amp remote on wire is what turns the amps on. They will not draw power if wired to the battery. I've had mine wired that way and it's how they come from the factory. I guess you wouldn't hurt anything wiring them to the switch.

You don't fuse the cable coming from the battery to the starter.

My alt wire runs to the house battery and has a 100 amp breaker on it. If you run your alt wire to the back of the starter your just using the main cable that runs from the battery to get it to a battery. I rather leave out that connection and just run it straight to the house battery, with a breaker.

Neither of my batteries have breakers or fuses running on the hot side to the switch or the ACR.

I have a 60 AMP maxi fuse on the power running to my amps distro box and it is near the house battery. I didn't include this in my wiring diagram because it is for the stereo system and really doesn't impact how you wire 2 batteries, the ACR or the switch.

Likewise, I'm a little gun shy when mounting a bunch or wiring to a carpeted location. Lots of people do it with out issue but I put all of my electrical on king starboard.

jamis0n
07-13-2017, 11:30 AM
You don't fuse the cable coming from the battery to the starter.


In my diagram everything is fused for the starter battery (including the starter). Are you saying the starter is the only exception and should run directly to the battery? I'm getting conflicting opinions on this from when I asked it previously. @waterlogged882 had replied to me "Read back again.... A fuse block on the battery post....and a 150 amp fuse. That's the ticket."


My alt wire runs to the house battery and has a 100 amp breaker on it. If you run your alt wire to the back of the starter your just using the main cable that runs from the battery to get it to a battery. I rather leave out that connection and just run it straight to the house battery, with a breaker.


My alternator came wired this way (to the starter) and its easy to upgrade that short run to 2 or 4 gauge. I prefer to leave it like this.


Likewise, I'm a little gun shy when mounting a bunch or wiring to a carpeted location. Lots of people do it with out issue but I put all of my electrical on king starboard.

I like this idea too - Trying to figure out how to cleanly mount a board against the inside of the walkthrough.

Again I appreciate all the advice! Just trying to get it right before I go set it up this weekend.

Measure twice, cut once :D

Keith2230
07-13-2017, 11:32 AM
I too would like to know the reasoning for connecting the ACR to the load side. The Blue Sea diagram clearly shows direct battery connections (same thing as wiring to the battery side). I'm pretty sure this is how my 2006 is wired from the factory.

Really I can't think of any good reason to wire the ballast system through the starting battery. It's high current draw and an ancillary system.

No reason to run extra wire to get the alternator to the battery. To the starter is a very short run, cleaner and provides plenty of capacity.

The Blue Sea switch installation diagram shows to wire the house load through the switch and I'd wire the amps this way as well. I like this because switch off means everything is isolated (except for possibly the ACR if the voltage is high enough) and you can have peace of mind even malfunctioning stereo equipment won't be draining your battery.

jamis0n
07-13-2017, 11:45 AM
Agree on the ballast pumps being moved to the house side (but will leave hatch as it is required to access engine). DONE

Also agree on the clean wiring of alternator =(short)=> starter =(long)=> "battery". DONE

Only outstanding questions:

Whether the 2AWG starter cable (and thus the alternator too) be wired through the switch or directly to the battery (conflicting opinions), as well as whether or not it should be fused (300A is the max for the blue seas terminal fuses)?

Whether the ACR should be wired to the load side or the battery side (or does it really matter)?

Updated diagram:


http://i.imgur.com/S55PEMl.jpg

CantRepeat
07-13-2017, 12:16 PM
There are a million ways to skin this cat. In the end, it's whatever let's you sleep at night.

I know of no MC that came with a fused starter cable to the battery so I don't believe there is a need for this.

The alt doesn't out out enough juice to need 2 or even 4 awg wire. It doesn't have the draw the starter motor does when trying to start the engine. It's overkill but again, if that's what gets you to sleep at night then use it.

MLA
07-13-2017, 12:30 PM
@MLA - Why is wiring the ACR to the load side preferred?

The ACR has a small parasitic draw. So wired to the battery side of the switch, you have some draw when in storage. Wired on the boat side of the switch, when the switch is off, the ACR is isolated from the batteries same as the rest of the loads.

CantRepeat
07-13-2017, 12:45 PM
I thought we got confrimation from bluesea that the ACR had no draw like that. I've had no issues.

MLA
07-13-2017, 01:14 PM
The last i knew, BlueSea acknowledged a slight draw. Personally, I halve always wired my installs as I describe, so its always been a non-issue by design.

Now, if the OP or anyon else takes it to the next level and adds in a dual bank charger, then you must have the ACR on the boat side. Otherwise, the charger voltage closes the ACR and combines the banks during shore charging.

CantRepeat
07-13-2017, 01:29 PM
Odd, i have a promarine dual and my ACR is on the battery side and again no issues. But you do present a question I had not considered.

I wonder what impact the ACR has on the chargers ability to monitor the batteries individually?

jamis0n
07-13-2017, 01:44 PM
I know of no MC that came with a fused starter cable to the battery so I don't believe there is a need for this.


Totally agree with that, but then again were talking about upgrades that obviously didnt come with the boat in the first place :D
Curious what @ waterlogged882 thinks, as he suggested fusing with 150A.
Hypothetically, if money was no issue, I dont see a drawback to adding a fuse between the starter and the battery as long as it is large enough. Agreed?


The alt doesn't out out enough juice to need 2 or even 4 awg wire. It doesn't have the draw the starter motor does when trying to start the engine. It's overkill but again, if that's what gets you to sleep at night then use it.
This one isnt about me sleeping at night but the fact that I'll have some extra 2AWG from upgrading the battery->starter line, so using 2AWG is easy. Completely understand that 6AWG is enough to handle the ~100A output of the alternator if I were buying all brand new cable.


@ML - WRT the ACR wiring, if it does have a slight parasitic draw then I'm very inclined to move it to the load side so it can be completely disconnected from the power source when the switch is off. Fortunately this is something thats easy to swap from one to the other with the exact same length of cable.

MLA
07-13-2017, 02:22 PM
Odd, i have a promarine dual and my ACR is on the battery side and again no issues. But you do present a question I had not considered.

I wonder what impact the ACR has on the chargers ability to monitor the batteries individually?

Once we go to a dual bank setup of this type, we clearly have a dedicated house and dedicated cranking bank. More often, its going to be the house bank thats low, and needs the most charging. With a multi-stage smart charger that can evaluate each bank individually and charge/condition accordingly, having the ACR combine both banks, reduces the overall effectiveness of the charger.

Next time the charger has been on for awhile, I bet you will find the green light on the ACR illuminated indicating the banks are combined as they do with the alternator charging.

Keith2230
07-13-2017, 03:29 PM
Moving the ACR to help the dual bank charger look at each battery individually makes sense. Now that I think of it mine is factory wired to the battery side because the ACR light is on when the batteries are on the dual bank charger. I'll concede load side of the switch is the better choice.

Fuses at the battery are a good safety measure in case there's a short it would pop the fuse instead of having the battery go up in flames. Alternators can pull a ton of amps which is why you don't normally see fuses in the circuit. I'd be worried about a 150 amp popping but would think a 250 or 300 amp fuse would probably be okay. I too have yet to see a fuse from the factory. Usually everything but the starter is fused.

jamis0n
07-13-2017, 03:38 PM
Fuses at the battery are a good safety measure in case there's a short it would pop the fuse instead of having the battery go up in flames. Alternators can pull a ton of amps which is why you don't normally see fuses in the circuit. I'd be worried about a 150 amp popping but would think a 250 or 300 amp fuse would probably be okay. I too have yet to see a fuse from the factory. Usually everything but the starter is fused.

I agree. I'm going with the starter through the blue seas switch and a 300A fused battery terminal (starter) + 200A fused house terminal. I'd be surprised if a 300A fuse blows when trying to start the engine, but if it does, I can always carry a spare fuse and/or remove the terminal fuse and attach the lead directly to the battery in an emergency.

Having each positive battery terminal fused seems like a no brainer to me and definitely will help me sleep at night without having boat on fire nightmares ;)

Keith2230
07-13-2017, 04:04 PM
Cool. Take some pictures and let us know how it turns out!

CantRepeat
07-13-2017, 09:33 PM
I think there is a **** ton of overkill going on here now.

I'm at the lake and drinking cheap beer and it might look different in the morning but gezz, 150, 250 and 300 amp fuses or breakes are just insane. Your talking about melting wires and burning down your boats. The idea of fuses is to let them burn before you burn down your boat.

I think there needs to be a reset here.

CantRepeat
07-13-2017, 09:35 PM
If you blow a 300 amp fuse you've fooked up like nobody's business.

Table Rocker
07-13-2017, 09:48 PM
If you blow a 300 amp fuse you've fooked up like nobody's business.
I was in agreement with you, until I Googled and found this:

http://www.hotrod.com/articles/because-theres-more-to-a-starter-than-you-realize/


PM: On a workbench, a starter will draw 80 to 90 amps. However, during actual start-up of an engine, a starter will draw 250 to 350 amps.

MLA
07-13-2017, 09:58 PM
I was in agreement with you, until I Googled and found this:

http://www.hotrod.com/articles/because-theres-more-to-a-starter-than-you-realize/

Im not sure what you mean, can you elaborate? Yes, a V8 starter can easily peak above 300A and then settles down a little as the engine gains momentum. Most breakers and fuses are not instantaneous, meaning you can have more current passing then the rating, prior to tripping.

we dont see fuses and breakers starter cables on boats or cars.

Table Rocker
07-13-2017, 10:10 PM
Im not sure what you mean, can you elaborate? Yes, a V8 starter can easily peak above 300A and then settles down a little as the engine gains momentum. Most breakers and fuses are not instantaneous, meaning you can have more current passing then the rating, prior to tripping.

we dont see fuses and breakers starter cables on boats or cars.I was just surprised by the amp draw of a starter being in the ballpark of that 300 amp fuse.

MLA
07-13-2017, 10:14 PM
I was just surprised by the amp draw of a starter being in the ballpark of that 300 amp fuse.

yep, thats normal peak.

fstaslp
07-31-2017, 04:02 PM
I have one question. I have installed the Blue seas ACR and I have the Relay grounded. I see that others have the other wire outputs hooked up that are next to the ground. What are these and do I need them?

MLA
07-31-2017, 04:27 PM
The ACR instructions can go into detail about the remote light and SI circuit, but in short, they are typically not needed.

waterlogged882
07-31-2017, 04:59 PM
I have one question. I have installed the Blue seas ACR and I have the Relay grounded. I see that others have the other wire outputs hooked up that are next to the ground. What are these and do I need them? thank you

golf tee is the key

hairman2112
07-31-2017, 05:32 PM
What is the golf tee for?

MLA
07-31-2017, 05:51 PM
The purple goes to the run post on the ignition. When it is on run, the relay fails closed and both batteries get a charge. When the ignition switch goes to off or accessory, it fails open, only components drawing from the accessory battery from what you have wired to it (should be most everything), leaving your start battery isolated and fully charged.

For anyone following along, an AUTO Combining Relay like the Bluesea 7610 ACR, does this automatically, without the need of a 12V trigger from the ignition switch RUN terminal. Keep it simple.

Im hoping that purple is connected to the CRANK terminal so to engage the starter-isolation mode.

DisguisedRope
08-01-2017, 03:38 PM
What is the golf tee for?

Every time he posts that picture someone asks that question. I've yet to see an answer though haha.

waterlogged882
08-01-2017, 03:58 PM
Every time he posts that picture someone asks that question. I've yet to see an answer though haha.

Reading is a wonderful thing....haha

==> Tee <== (http://www.mastercraft.com/teamtalk/showpost.php?p=1352743&postcount=9)

DisguisedRope
08-01-2017, 04:23 PM
Reading is a wonderful thing....haha

==> Tee <== (http://www.mastercraft.com/teamtalk/showpost.php?p=1352743&postcount=9)

Sorry, missed that one.

waterlogged882
08-01-2017, 04:26 PM
Sorry, missed that one.

It's all good.. :D :D

There you have it....

TyTanium
08-01-2017, 06:11 PM
Having each positive battery terminal fused seems like a no brainer to me and definitely will help me sleep at night without having boat on fire nightmares ;)

By having that large of a fuse at the battery positive terminal, the only thing your really protecting the wire from is a dead short.....which is highly unlikely. Remember....downstream, each accessory is fused so if there's a fault with that accessory, that fuse blows and the accessory is isolated (without losing the entire electrical system).

If your trying to protect the entire system from drawing too many amps during normal operation:
If you have too many accessories on the system and draw more amps than the alternator can supply, the alternator just won't be able to keep the battery charged and system voltage could drop. (still no fire though).

If you have a fault in the alternator causing it to supply too much current, it will blow the fuse (or fuse link) on the alternator output wire thereby isolating the alternator. (assuming it has a fuse).

If your trying to protect the starter wire during starting, that's different. I would look at the starter wire size and length and make sure it has enough amp capacity. If it doesn't, replace it with one that does. Don't rely on the fuse to protect the wire.

165541