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bobx1
09-30-2009, 11:25 PM
Whenever I have "Stabil"ized my power equipment in the past, I ran the engine after treating the tank with Stabil.

Last year, I had the dealer winterize my boat and after I picked it up, I noticed that he did not treat the fuel system. I called and they apoligized and said they simply forgot so I asked them that since it had been winterized, I was not keen on putting the hoses and plugs back in and starting the engine at which time they claimed that it was not necessary to run the engine with a treated tank. When I cranked it up for the season this year, there were no problems or issues at all - cranked great and ran great all season.

I am ready to winterize this year (myself) and was wondering if I you guys think it is OK not to crank the engine and run treated fuel through it. I run in fresh water 100% of the time so do not own an inboard flusher. I can go buy one but do not see the need to spend time on the road getting it if it is not necessary.

Thanks in advance for your replies.

russlars
09-30-2009, 11:37 PM
Everything I have ever read has recommended running your engine after adding stabilizer to your tank to make sure that if fully circulates through your fuel system. I would think that the most important place to have the stabilizer would be in the fuel lines/injectors, etc. so that the fuel doesn't varnish and cause problems. I usually add Stabil to my tank on the last trip out of the season.

Miss Rita
09-30-2009, 11:40 PM
If you put Stabil in the tank, but don't start the engine, then the gas in the lines/carb/injectors isn't treated. That nullifies half the reason why you would put stabilizer in the gas to start with.

I would find a way to start it with treated fuel so that the entire system is protected.

Next year, if you think ahead (which I rarely do) you should put some Stabil in the tank before your last run to the lake.

TMCNo1
09-30-2009, 11:59 PM
I always add the Stabil to a full tank prior to the suspected last trip to the lake and then on the way home, I add a bit more to treat the added gas used that day when I fill the tank w/ super unleaded on the way home. That way there is no doubt that the whole system has treated gas in it and is protected after running that day. If we go again, so what, I just add more to the tank to compensate for the new fuel added. It isn't hurting anything and is just like running it the first time out in the spring.

bobx1
10-01-2009, 12:16 AM
Thanks for the replies and that is what I figured as I have always ran in through the fuel system on every other boat I have owned (including this one) along with my jet ski, party barge, generator, etc..

Unfortunately, I did not think my last trip would truly be my last.

Thanks again!

gibbons
10-01-2009, 12:38 AM
I don't use Stabil any more after finding red gummy stuff (Stabil was the only red stuff I added to the fuel system) in the float bowls on my Chevelle's carb after sitting for just a few months. YMMV... Google it...

JimN
10-01-2009, 03:29 AM
If your gas doesn't have ethanol, it's less of a problem. Also, as long as the gas isn't exposed to air, it won't turn to varnish but it just gets old. Since you didn't have any issues, you're fine but to be sure, I would add something to stabilize the fuel this year.

mayo93prostar
10-01-2009, 08:02 AM
Yes, you need to run the gas with Stabil into the carb to protect the fuel in the lines and the carb (or injectors). The dealer sounds like an idiot for telling you otherwise.

JimN
10-01-2009, 09:34 AM
Yes, you need to run the gas with Stabil into the carb to protect the fuel in the lines and the carb (or injectors). The dealer sounds like an idiot for telling you otherwise.

He has an '07, so it has no carb but if the dealer charged for winterization and said "they forgot", either they're new to winterizing boats, they had a new guy do this one, are using this excuse because they couldn't handle the number of boats that came in or they don't care.

I would have made them do it right.

bobx1
10-01-2009, 12:16 PM
He has an '07, so it has no carb but if the dealer charged for winterization and said "they forgot", either they're new to winterizing boats, they had a new guy do this one, are using this excuse because they couldn't handle the number of boats that came in or they don't care.

I would have made them do it right.

Yes Jim, it is an 07. I had picked it up, put it in storage and was sticking the invoice in my service folder and took a look - did not list "treat fuel system". Called them up and asked so the girl that answers the phone said she would call me back. When she called back, she said they forgot but the "tech" said since I did not have a carb, not too worry (just pour Stabil in tank and forget about it). They would have done it over for free if I pressed the issue but did not feel like hauling it back.

Their advice seemed strange because I have always ran engines after stabilizing (but most had carbs) - but who am I to question a highly trained mechanic?? End result, it worked fine with no issues all season but I am going to be on the safe side and run the engine.

Jim@BAWS
10-01-2009, 12:28 PM
Whenever I have "Stabil"ized my power equipment in the past, I ran the engine after treating the tank with Stabil.

Last year, I had the dealer winterize my boat and after I picked it up, I noticed that he did not treat the fuel system. I called and they apoligized and said they simply forgot so I asked them that since it had been winterized, I was not keen on putting the hoses and plugs back in and starting the engine at which time they claimed that it was not necessary to run the engine with a treated tank. When I cranked it up for the season this year, there were no problems or issues at all - cranked great and ran great all season.

I am ready to winterize this year (myself) and was wondering if I you guys think it is OK not to crank the engine and run treated fuel through it. I run in fresh water 100% of the time so do not own an inboard flusher. I can go buy one but do not see the need to spend time on the road getting it if it is not necessary.

Thanks in advance for your replies.


Where in the SE are you? I am not a fan of STABIL. We use K-100 and now there new product SENTRY Gasoline products. Combines better w/ fuel especially w/ Ethanol added
Check it out. We have had great results w/ the product

Your last fill up of the season should be SUPER UNLEADED. Todays fuels do DEGRADE
So get a HIGH OCTANE, add your additive what ever it is. Run it into the system then
put her away.

Jim@BAWS

helton333
10-01-2009, 12:30 PM
owners manual on my prostar says to run the engine.

88 PS190
10-01-2009, 12:34 PM
I fuel using cans, so towards the end of the season I wait for the tank to hit my 5 gallon mark(fueled from empty at the pump stopping every 5 and drew a line with a sharpie), treat the fuel in the tank. Drive it in.

I would definately try to run it in, but you don't want to rewinterize. To do this I would add excess stabil to the tank, pull the input hose, and buy a few bottles of RV antifreeze, and pour it into the input, then have someone wife/kid start it while you pour antifreeze into the hose, that will protect your raw water pump etc.

flipper
10-01-2009, 01:16 PM
It's best to run it and have the treatment in the fuel system, not just in the tank.

mayo93prostar
10-01-2009, 02:07 PM
Now that the subject is brought up and Jim noted an alternative fuel additive, the question I have is the new blue marine stabil product better than the old red stuff? maybe we could get a mod to put up a poll of what fuel additive do you use at the end of the season; stabil red, stabil marine blue, k-100, other, none. Do we still need to include an UMP option on every poll?

flipper
10-01-2009, 02:12 PM
Now that the subject is brought up and Jim noted an alternative fuel additive, the question I have is the new blue marine stabil product better than the old red stuff? maybe we could get a mod to put up a poll of what fuel additive do you use at the end of the season; stabil red, stabil marine blue, k-100, other, none. Do we still need to include an UMP option on every poll?

You can start your own poll and yes, all polls must have an UMP option

bobx1
10-01-2009, 03:23 PM
Where in the SE are you?
Jim@BAWS

Louisiana.

Will also look into the other products you recommended. Heading to West Marine in the next couple of days to get my inboard flusher and see if they have those products.

Thanks Jim for the advice!

bigmac
10-01-2009, 04:20 PM
Snake oil. PT Barnum would be proud of these companies.

Anti-oxidant properties of gasoline stabilizers may be of some benefit for gasoline being stored for more than three months, but they really don't help with octane loss, and I am inclined to think that the whole anti-gum, anti-varnish business is just hype, especially in fuel injected engines. As to ethanol, fuel additives will do NOTHING to help you with any ethanol problems, real OR imagined.

Throw in some Sta-Bil, or Sea Foam, or K-100, or whatever will help you sleep at night while your boat is out sitting in the garage waiting for spring. I doubt that it makes any difference what you use, and probably doesn't matter if you use anything. OTOH, it probably won't hurt anything, so.....

russlars
10-01-2009, 04:48 PM
Where in the SE are you? I am not a fan of STABIL. We use K-100 and now there new product SENTRY Gasoline products. Combines better w/ fuel especially w/ Ethanol added
Check it out. We have had great results w/ the product

Your last fill up of the season should be SUPER UNLEADED. Todays fuels do DEGRADE
So get a HIGH OCTANE, add your additive what ever it is. Run it into the system then
put her away.

Jim@BAWS
Jim, here is a question for you. I have been able to purchase non-ethanol gasoline for my boat at the Indian Reservation. However, it is only available in 87 octane. So for winterization purposes would you put that in to avoid the ethanol or would you still recommend the 93 octane which I can only get with ethanol? Of course I will put fuel stabilizer in either way.

Hollywood
10-01-2009, 04:51 PM
the question I have is the new blue marine stabil product better than the old red stuff?

The blue stuff is the ethanol treatment, I would think it treats both ethanol and winter layup.

http://www.psndealer.com/powersportsdlr/images/ec0419/57-1109.jpg

Personally, I'm leaning towards bigmac in the fact that Stabil isn't really necessary. Besides, my boat only sits 4 months anyway. I found a really old bottle of the red Stabil in my mother's garage last year. It was all gummed up!

FrankSchwab
10-01-2009, 05:13 PM
I just don't worry about it much... of course, I'm in a dry, moderate (for winter, anyway) climate so it may not matter as much.

I park at the end of the year (when the temperature drops below 90) with as close to empty on the fuel gauge as possible, and drain the block. Of course, before the last run I change the oil/filter so the engine sits with nice clean oil all winter.

In the spring, I fill up with 20 or 30 gallons of nice, fresh gas, and go. No worries about octane loss or old gas; the only gas that will be appreciably old is the cup or so in the fuel lines, filter, pump, and fuel rail. There just can't be that much "gum and varnish" in a cup of gas. I haven't had any fuel problems in the 5 years I've been doing this.

/frank

russlars
10-01-2009, 05:20 PM
I park at the end of the year (when the temperature drops below 90)


If we followed your routine we would probably only ski 3-4 days per year.:rolleyes: Rough life you got there! Why not just ski year round?

FrankSchwab
10-01-2009, 08:50 PM
But the water gets soooo cold in the winter! In January, it's down into the 50's; we couldn't possibly ski in water that cold.

/frank

kkkeating
10-01-2009, 10:04 PM
I’m not sure if not having Stabil in the fuel lines is really an issue. If the fuel did degrade, which can't be much, the amount of fuel in the lines would be probably be used within the first five minutes of usage at the start of the season. I bet most people on this forum are probably a lot more thorough on the maintenance and upkeep on their boats than most of the boating public. Our boat is kept at a local marina with covered slips and I’m amazed at how many people(actually most people) drive into their slip in September, park the boat, throw on a cover, don’t show up again until May, and the boat starts right up and works fine. These people do not check their boats, which is in the water for seven months! I would think that if Stabil was really required all these boats would not start up at all, or if they did start, would sputter and cough until the tank was empty and filled up with new fuel. Usually these boats start up with no problem.

As for me, I use Stabil starting in October and keep using it until summer. I would also run the engine to ensure the Stabil is in the fuel in the lines, but heck, I’m a Mastercraft owner and we all know it’s only the best for our boats!

88 PS190
10-01-2009, 11:25 PM
But the water gets soooo cold in the winter! In January, it's down into the 50's; we couldn't possibly ski in water that cold.

/frank

ha ha aren't you familiar with the air temp + water temp = certain value rules?

In 50 degree water I'd ski in trunks if the air was 75 and it was sunny. Maybe a wetsuit top.

Sledge
10-01-2009, 11:46 PM
I use the Marine Sta-bil at every fill up. I also use it in all of my lawn and yard equipment and have had zero fuel related issues.

The instructions give two different mix ratios. One for use at each fill up and another for storage. I would definitely recommend running it through the fuel system before storage if possible.

flya750
10-02-2009, 12:39 AM
Stabil and fog

FrankSchwab
10-02-2009, 03:18 AM
Well, that pretty much sounds like January. We're all in the house huddled together for warmth in those conditions.

Rules? We don't need no stinkin' rules.

/frank


ha ha aren't you familiar with the air temp + water temp = certain value rules?

In 50 degree water I'd ski in trunks if the air was 75 and it was sunny. Maybe a wetsuit top.

bobx1
10-02-2009, 01:27 PM
In the spring, I fill up with 20 or 30 gallons of nice, fresh gas, and go. No worries about octane loss or old gas; the only gas that will be appreciably old is the cup or so in the fuel lines, filter, pump, and fuel rail. There just can't be that much "gum and varnish" in a cup of gas. I haven't had any fuel problems in the 5 years I've been doing this.

/frank

That is basically what the Tech told me and that is what happened this year when they forgot to treat the system. Everyhing worked great all summer. I am still going to treat and run it but others are claming that it may not be necessary. Also, I have two friends with nice inboards (1 MC and 1 SAN) and both laugh when I mention treating the fuel system. Since I live in Louisiana, I probably don't need to worry about draining the block either....

Oh well, it has been an interesting discussion.

canadianskier
10-02-2009, 10:52 PM
Do all the used car dealers put stabil in there used cars sitting on the lot for over a year? they start up and run ok, just a thought.

TMCNo1
10-02-2009, 11:06 PM
Do all the used car dealers put stabil in there used cars sitting on the lot for over a year? they start up and run ok, just a thought.

No, and neither do the new car/truck, farm equipment, construction equipment, lawnmower, etc., etc., dealers who have them sitting with less than 5 gallons of gas in them for 18 months either.:rolleyes: But, then again they do have a warranty to be honored if there is a problem.

JimN
10-02-2009, 11:10 PM
One question about that is, does that gas have ethanol in it? It may but the fuel system is still sealed from the outside world unless the gas cap is opened and left open. Even then, the tank won't expand and contract the way a plastic one does.

Thrall
10-03-2009, 02:16 AM
Maybe it's snake oil (Stabil, Seafoam, etc), but I've seen several sleds lean burn down a cyl with old non stabilized gas in them, had to clean carbs with varnished up gas in them to get the implement to run, including some of my own stuff when I was a kid and didn't know about stabil (if it was even around then!).
Haven't had any old fuel issues in the last 15 years though with anything from my chainsaw to my boat since I've run Stabil or Seafoam in the tanks or completely drained and ran dry the fuel system before layup.
This summer, I ran the boat the first time on 8 month old gas (seafoamed 3/4 tank, 'cause I was too lazy to pump it out last fall) and it ran fine, but my new boat had 4 month old gas not stabil'd and ran like crap when I lake tested it until I topped it off with 1/2 tank of new gas.
I'll keep using the stuff, especially on fuel injected engines that I can't drain the tank and run them dry.

bigmac
10-03-2009, 02:51 AM
I'll keep using the stuff, especially on fuel injected engines that I can't drain the tank and run them dry.

I don't think there's any downside to using the stuff.

TX.X-30 fan
10-03-2009, 07:54 PM
I don't think there's any downside to using the stuff.




Is everyone from Minnesota so ?????????????

bigmac
10-04-2009, 10:47 AM
Is everyone from Minnesota so ?????????????Most people in Minnesota don't think that there's any downside to using the stuff either.

JimN
10-04-2009, 11:49 AM
I don't see any reason MC/Indmar would tell it's service techs to stabilize the gas if they wanted to see massive engine failures. If they told us to do it and it led to failures, they couldn't very well deny coverage or liability. Also, Briggs & Stratton has a reservoir for StaBil on them. I see no reason for this and haven't seen any evidence that StaBil is now a major investor in B&S.

How many problems here can be attributed to using fuel stabilizer? I can't think of any. FWIW, I use it and my lawn mower & snow blowers start on one pull, I haven't done any repairs to any of them other than belts or hoses that wore through and some of them are 20 years old. I use Sea Foam, too and it seems to work.

Jeff Lyman
10-04-2009, 12:19 PM
For what its worth a few years ago my step dad used stabil in his old mint Chris Craft with twins. First time out in the spring one engine quite then the other started to sputter. He made it back on one engine. After close investigation found both fuel systems clogged up and even had to pull the tanks and drain them, rebuild 2 carbs change filters etc. As an engineer and after fuel test he determined the fuel additive was the cause!

I have never used anyhing even with my MC with the lousy 4010 carb. Our summer\winter toys sit for 6 months at a time with out issue. Save your dollars!

bigmac
10-04-2009, 12:36 PM
I don't see any reason MC/Indmar would tell it's service techs to stabilize the gas if they wanted to see massive engine failures. If they told us to do it and it led to failures, they couldn't very well deny coverage or liability. Also, Briggs & Stratton has a reservoir for StaBil on them. I see no reason for this and haven't seen any evidence that StaBil is now a major investor in B&S.

How many problems here can be attributed to using fuel stabilizer? I can't think of any. FWIW, I use it and my lawn mower & snow blowers start on one pull, I haven't done any repairs to any of them other than belts or hoses that wore through and some of them are 20 years old. I use Sea Foam, too and it seems to work.


I gotta work on smiley usage.

Yeah, see, I agree with your premise. There is probably no downside to using fuel stabilizers. I might even use some myself this year when I store my boat, if I think of it.

TX.X-30 fan
10-04-2009, 05:26 PM
Most people in Minnesota don't think that there's any downside to using the stuff either.



Most is rather vague, I will assume a simple majority. :D

thatsmrmastercraft
10-04-2009, 10:56 PM
Most is rather vague, I will assume a simple majority. :D

Apparently "most" people here in MN voted for Al Franken too. Vague dosen't even begin to explain that.

TX.X-30 fan
10-04-2009, 11:08 PM
Apparently "most" people here in MN voted for Al Franken too. Vague dosen't even begin to explain that.



:D I understand the reluctance to show your jubilance at that eventual outcome.

TMCNo1
10-04-2009, 11:21 PM
It's all so simple, just consider Stabil, Viagra for your gasoline, it helps keep it performing at it's best!:rolleyes: