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Hrkdrivr
06-06-2009, 12:12 AM
I just got a really cool DeWalt air compressor and got a set of tools to go with it: impact wrench; air ratchet; die grinder...woohoo!!! :D

I shopped carefully to make sure the compressor could supply the air for the tools I bought; it's capable of 5.4 CFM @ 90 psi and it's a 200psi unit w/a 15 gallon tank. The tools all called for 4.0 CFM or less.

Well, excited as could be, I rigged up the hose and the impact wrench and attacked one of my Excursion's front wheel lugs...and I had to break the nut free w/the 4-way and then use the impact wrench...grrrrr :mad: It wasn't an air-supply problem, the wrench was banging away for a long time without the pump kicking on; it just didn't seem to have the grunt to turn the nuts.

Is it OK to set the compressor regulator to it's maximum regulated pressure (~165 psi for this compressor) and let the tool regulate on it's own or is there a safe maximum pressure for the tool? Is more better?

I set the regulator to about 100 psi since I wasn't sure. There was no documentation w/the tools that would tell me if there was a maximum safe input pressure. It was a combo set, so I'm sure I they aren't the best tools in the shed, but I thought they would at least break a nut, so to speak. I do know the max torque for the wrench was 260 ft-lbs.

I returned the tool set for a full refund (Home Depot is awesome) and started shopping for a higher-torque wrench, but then wondered how much torque is enough for lug nuts. 300? 550? 650?

Is this a torque problem (therefore a wrench issue) or a psi problem (crank the regulator up)?

Mag_Red
06-06-2009, 12:53 AM
Your owners manual should tell you the correct torque for the lug nuts.......I would say they should be around 100- 120 fp. I beat they were overtightened by some grease monkey

Hrkdrivr
06-06-2009, 01:02 AM
Mag...you're probably right...I'll check the manual...duh.

Yep...owner's manual says 150 - 165 ft-lbs.

blackcreek
06-06-2009, 07:34 AM
Are you using the quick connect couplers? If you are using the cheap ones that came with the kit upgrade to the good high flow ones. High flow shown on the top, I bought mine at Napa.
http://i277.photobucket.com/albums/kk54/SteveU_/FamilyPhotos0506635.jpg
I would try that first and see if it gives your impact a little more mojo. The tools you get in those kits are really cheap, upgrade to a decent impact like Ingersoll rand and get one in the 400 to 500 ft/lb range. I have an Ingersoll rand 2135 rated at 700 ft/lbs reverse torque. Very light and powerful, worth every penny. I just put new springs and axles on my 10 year old trailer for my fishing boat and that impact would bust open a rusted bolt with ease.

bigmac
06-06-2009, 09:28 AM
You can buy cheap air tools and expensive air tools, and the difference in reliabliity and longevity is significant. For most home users, a cheap air tool is totally adequate, but one exception to that might be impact wrenches. The cheaper ones simply do no perform as well as the more expensive ones. Ingersol Rand makes great air tools. I have a 244A. It will still work fine with a 5.4 CFM compressor and will go about 300 ft-lb working torque, but it's about $200, too.

x-10ron
06-06-2009, 10:20 AM
air hose size can play a major roll , at my shop we run 3/8 hose, see if your hose is a 1/4, if it is, I would go buy a 3/8 and retest the compressor. I run my air tools at 125 psi with no problem.
It's also pay to have a good impact also, IR would be my choice over the husky/cheap stuff.

JimN
06-06-2009, 10:56 AM
I just got a really cool DeWalt air compressor and got a set of tools to go with it: impact wrench; air ratchet; die grinder...woohoo!!! :D

I shopped carefully to make sure the compressor could supply the air for the tools I bought; it's capable of 5.4 CFM @ 90 psi and it's a 200psi unit w/a 15 gallon tank. The tools all called for 4.0 CFM or less.

Well, excited as could be, I rigged up the hose and the impact wrench and attacked one of my Excursion's front wheel lugs...and I had to break the nut free w/the 4-way and then use the impact wrench...grrrrr :mad: It wasn't an air-supply problem, the wrench was banging away for a long time without the pump kicking on; it just didn't seem to have the grunt to turn the nuts.

Is it OK to set the compressor regulator to it's maximum regulated pressure (~165 psi for this compressor) and let the tool regulate on it's own or is there a safe maximum pressure for the tool? Is more better?

I set the regulator to about 100 psi since I wasn't sure. There was no documentation w/the tools that would tell me if there was a maximum safe input pressure. It was a combo set, so I'm sure I they aren't the best tools in the shed, but I thought they would at least break a nut, so to speak. I do know the max torque for the wrench was 260 ft-lbs.

I returned the tool set for a full refund (Home Depot is awesome) and started shopping for a higher-torque wrench, but then wondered how much torque is enough for lug nuts. 300? 550? 650?

Is this a torque problem (therefore a wrench issue) or a psi problem (crank the regulator up)?

Impact wrenches need volume and pressure, which means that a 5.4 CFM compresser won't do much with that. It's more an issue of the compresser and hose than the wrench. Also, as posted, 1/4" is less than what's needed for high torque work and long runs make this even more important- use 3/8" fittings and keep the hose as short as possible.

Lug nuts are usually supposed to be tightened to about 110# on aluminum and if you tighten them to much more than that, you'll not only deform the rim but if they aren't tightened evenly, the rim will actually no longer be flat. An impact wrench is fime for removing the lug nuts but unless you have torque adapters, you don't want to tighten them with it- use a torque wrench.

JohnE
06-06-2009, 11:10 AM
I also have an IR impact wrench. Got tired of the cheaper one not breaking things free. Also have the torque adapters for tightening.

I was told by mymc the correct torque for the aluminum trailer wheels is 100#. Over or under tightening is bad. There were a few threads here about trailers losing wheels while on the road a while ago.

JDK
06-06-2009, 01:17 PM
unless you have torque adapters, you don't want to tighten them with it- use a torque wrench.

Very good advice right there.

Hrkdrivr
06-07-2009, 12:57 AM
Thanks for all the answers guys!!

Are you using the quick connect couplers? If you are using the cheap ones that came with the kit upgrade to the good high flow ones. High flow shown on the top, I bought mine at Napa...The tools you get in those kits are really cheap, upgrade to a decent impact like Ingersoll rand and get one in the 400 to 500 ft/lb range.

I am using quick connect couplers, but not high flow ones; I didn't even know they existed so I'll check them out. And you're right (I should have known better), those bundled kits are cheap for a reason, kinda like off-brand boats, eh?

You can buy cheap air tools and expensive air tools, and the difference in reliabliity and longevity is significant. For most home users, a cheap air tool is totally adequate, but one exception to that might be impact wrenches. The cheaper ones simply do no perform as well as the more expensive ones. Ingersol Rand makes great air tools. I have a 244A. It will still work fine with a 5.4 CFM compressor and will go about 300 ft-lb working torque, but it's about $200, too.

True as well; I'm looking at IR 244As online now. It looks like a good compromise between price and capability. On a side note, there are an incredible number of impact wrenches on the market so shopping is kind of a pain. Oh, and those impact-rated sockets are kinda spendy!

air hose size can play a major roll , at my shop we run 3/8 hose, see if your hose is a 1/4, if it is, I would go buy a 3/8 and retest the compressor. I run my air tools at 125 psi with no problem.

I have 3/8 hose so that's good. You say you run your tools at 125 w/no problem; do you know if I could set the regulator up to 165 without hurting the tool or causing a safety problem?

...keep the hose as short as possible. An impact wrench is fine for removing the lug nuts but unless you have torque adapters, you don't want to tighten them with it- use a torque wrench.

I hadn't thought about keeping the hose short, though it makes sense in order to keep pressure loss due to hose-wall flex to a minimum. I've never heard of torque adapters either; I'll look into them, but I plan to remove wheels w/the impact wrench and then tighten them w/a torque wrench.

There were a few threads here about trailers losing wheels while on the road a while ago.

Yep, scary stuff. The owner's manual for the trailer says you're supposed to do three passes of increasing torques to mount the wheel, 45-, 70- and then 90-ft-lbs.

x-10ron
06-08-2009, 08:41 AM
125psi to 135psi would be my limit, with a good impact and decent compressor, you should have no problem busting those lug nuts free.

stuartmcnair
06-08-2009, 11:27 AM
don't know if you checked this or not...my impact driver has an adjustment knob on it where you can set how much power it has...make sure that if you have that adjuster that it is set correctly.

Hrkdrivr
06-08-2009, 01:02 PM
I used all the different settings, but I think the guys who mouted the wheels just put them on too tightly and the 250 ft-lbs of torque the wrench had wasn't enough, although it should have been.

In any case, I returned the set and am shopping for a stronger wrench.

Hrkdrivr
06-08-2009, 01:10 PM
On FleaBay I found the IR 244A for about $186.00 w/free shipping and an IR 2132G for about $120 w/free shipping. Both sellers have large stores and tons of good feedback so I'm pretty confident in buying from either one, plus they both tell me the manufacturer's warranty is good on tools they sell. Links below:

http://cgi.ebay.com/BRAND-NEW-INGERSOLL-RAND-1-2-AIR-IMPACT-WRENCH-2132G_W0QQitemZ250440122730QQcmdZViewItemQQptZLH_D efaultDomain_0?hash=item3a4f65016a&_trksid=p3911.c0.m14&_trkparms=65%3A1%7C66%3A2%7C39%3A1%7C240%3A1318%7C 301%3A0%7C293%3A5%7C294%3A50#ebayphotohosting

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=390032623201&ssPageName=ADME:X:RTQ:US:1123

At first blush, the 2132G seems to be a better deal (less expensive and more capable), but the price difference makes me wonder if I'm missing something, because you don't get something for nothing...

Any ideas?

x-10ron
06-08-2009, 02:29 PM
2132g has 600ft lb torque in reverse, vs 500 ft lb on the 244, i would get the 2132g. It's a harder hitting more powerful impact.

RexDog1
06-08-2009, 05:07 PM
What I have learned over the years (the hard way):( I never use air tools to remove (brake free) nuts, I do it with hand tools, so I know how much force I am putting on the nut to remove it?? Just a habit I have gotten into

JMHO:rolleyes:

uncleboo
06-20-2009, 02:35 AM
I agree that it is probably the size of the air hose that is your limitation on taking off the lug nuts. Even if the grease monkey torqued the lugs way too tight, any decent impact wrench should take them off. I originally used a 1\4 hose and it didn't cut it. Initially, I thought my air tools weren't tough enough, however I went with a 3\8 and all the tools work like they are supposed too.

skihard111
06-20-2009, 12:02 PM
The compressor is fine but not for long extended running air tools. You will notice torque falling off as the 5.4 cfm pump runs. The proper compressor for continuous run air tools like a wrench would be around 60gal with about 10cfm rating at 90psi. So use that compressor with a GOOD wrench.....and it will perform well, just not continuous. Just understand that there is a slight limitation. These tools like having a big tank to work from.

Hrkdrivr
06-22-2009, 04:12 PM
I've been shopping the IR 244A like bigmac uses as well as the 2132G, but I'm not sure I like the composite shell on the 2132G even though it has more torque. Seems like it might be easy to break if you drop it

I've even started looking higher-up at the TiMax wrenches but I doubt I need the top-end wrench for just rotating tires and other odd jobs.

Hrkdrivr
06-22-2009, 04:15 PM
What I have learned over the years (the hard way):( I never use air tools to remove (brake free) nuts, I do it with hand tools, so I know how much force I am putting on the nut to remove it?? Just a habit I have gotten into

JMHO:rolleyes:

RexDog1, what lesson did you learn the hard way using air tools to remove nuts? Have you broken some? :confused:

silverblueBP
06-22-2009, 04:48 PM
I have the older version of this one http://www.thetoolwarehouse.net/p-1664-ingersoll-rand-2130.aspx, I've only had to use a breaker bar once when a tire dealer used a 1" impact to tighten up my truck tire. I've had it now for 13 years.

RexDog1
06-22-2009, 05:07 PM
RexDog1, what lesson did you learn the hard way using air tools to remove nuts? Have you broken some? :confused:

Yes I have broke some bolts with a air tool (impact wrench)

I may be deferent because I restore cars and deal with a lot of rust, but I have turned a wheel stud at the knurl on the boat trailer while using an air tool, now I just hit the lug nuts on the boat trailer with a homemade 50/50 mix brake fluid and transmission fluid before I remove the tires with a hand tool, everybody is deferent, I spend about 35 hours a week working on my cars and I can’t remember the last time I used a impact wrench, like I said everybody is deferent and there are lower setting you can put them on to help you from braking bolts, but I just take my time and use hand tools ……. I wish you well……:cool:……… have a nice week!!!!:D

x-10ron
06-22-2009, 11:29 PM
I've been shopping the IR 244A like bigmac uses as well as the 2132G, but I'm not sure I like the composite shell on the 2132G even though it has more torque. Seems like it might be easy to break if you drop it

I've even started looking higher-up at the TiMax wrenches but I doubt I need the top-end wrench for just rotating tires and other odd jobs.

the new composite bodies are really tuff, i can't tell you how many times my composite ir has fallen off the lift/car, i have accidently even ran it over with a truck once. they hit harder, weigh less and are alot quieter than the old heavy metal cased impacts. My composite IR has a 1000 ft/lb in reverse and is over 6 years old and gets abused everday.

Hrkdrivr
06-23-2009, 03:37 PM
the new composite bodies are really tuff, i can't tell you how many times my composite ir has fallen off the lift/car, i have accidently even ran it over with a truck once. they hit harder, weigh less and are alot quieter than the old heavy metal cased impacts. My composite IR has a 1000 ft/lb in reverse and is over 6 years old and gets abused everday.

That's good to know, thanks x-10. It also changes my shopping focus a little.

I now have a cool set of impact sockets so I need to get the wrench; I kinda got the cart before the horse. The set came with 3/8" and 1/2" drive sockets in both metric and SAE, with deep well and normal sockets of each. Got it on FleaBay for about $150.00. IR SK34C86 :cool: