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Jim@BAWS
11-12-2008, 07:54 AM
I am going to the factory tommorow. I am going to ask the powers to be about finding a way to get member approval before they post on here. Other websites that some of us frequent require this. Why cannot it not be done here. I know that it is an extra step for moderators and admin but I think that it has gotten to the point where it is needed. I know participation is down around here and I am sure that is one of the reasons.

Add your input. I know that there is a time and place for things but it is not needed here.

Jim@BAWS

JohnE
11-12-2008, 08:14 AM
Jim,

I think that discussing that with them is a great idea. Participation is definitely down here for a number of reasons. Bigmac spelled out what can be done to prevent the spammers....

Moderator2
11-12-2008, 08:23 AM
Any dialogue with headquarters will help.
I know the moderators have requested this, but you probably have a bit more pull with the powers that be.

Thanks Jim!

bigmac
11-12-2008, 08:30 AM
It's pretty easy to changes the settings to require that every new member be approved before being able to post anything. Currently, the only people that that have that power to change that setting is one of the three admins:

TeamMC (http://www.mastercraft.com/teamtalk/member.php?u=3567)Last Activity: 01-05-2007 08:31 AM
TMC (http://www.mastercraft.com/teamtalk/member.php?u=1077)Last Activity: 10-02-2008 03:03 PM
TTAdmin (http://www.mastercraft.com/teamtalk/member.php?u=1)Last Activity: 11-06-2008 10:10 AM

Likewise, currently, these are the only people that have to power to moderate new members, and ban them if necessary.

Note that there hasn't been an admin on here for almost a week. I'm skeptical that this discussion forum has any kind of priority at MasterCraft and it's probably only a matter of time before they can it altogether. I'm sympathetic - running busy boards like this can be a PITA. But...if you're going to do it as part of a customer relations program, you should do it well or it becomes a customer-relations liability rather than an asset, and I think we've already passed into that realm. One solution is for MasterCraft to just give it up altogether and let such a forum be owned and run privately, like almost all of the other boating forums. The other solution is to give the moderators the power to approve members before posting, and to ban miscreants.

Moderator4
11-12-2008, 08:35 AM
There are ways to prevent this spamming. This is beyond the moderator level of control. I know of web forums that are able to prevent it from happening. I think the powers that be should look into this. I know of a Team Talk member that is web forum saavy and has operated and setup web forums since they basically started, and he could be consulted on this. He owns and operates several web forums and knows the ways to avoid this spamming issue all together the way he sets it up on the admin side.

Moderator4
11-12-2008, 08:38 AM
It's pretty easy to changes the settings to require that every new member be approved before being able to post anything. Currently, the only people that that have that power to change that setting is one of the three admins:

TeamMC (http://www.mastercraft.com/teamtalk/member.php?u=3567)Last Activity: 01-05-2007 08:31 AM
TMC (http://www.mastercraft.com/teamtalk/member.php?u=1077)Last Activity: 10-02-2008 03:03 PM
TTAdmin (http://www.mastercraft.com/teamtalk/member.php?u=1)Last Activity: 11-06-2008 10:10 AM

Note that there hasn't been an admin on here for almost a week. I'm skeptical that this discussion forum has any kind of priority at MasterCraft and it's probably only a matter of time before they can it altogether. I'm sympathetic - running busy boards like this can be a PITA. But...if you're going to do it as part of a customer relations program, you should do it well or it becomes a customer-relations liability rather than an asset, and I think we've already passed into that realm. One solution is for MasterCraft to just give it up altogether and let such a forum be owned and run privately, like almost all of the other boating forums. The other solution is to give the moderators the power to approve members before posting, and to ban miscreants.

This is what I was hinting at. I know a Team Talk member that is very experienced in setting up and properly maintaining web forums so they run in a very smooth manner. I know his sites have no spamming problems at all. This can be done. If the powers at be are interested in this idea, I can get them in touch with him.

bigmac
11-12-2008, 08:42 AM
There are ways to prevent this spamming. I know of web forums that are able to prevent it from happening. I think the powers that be should look into this. I know of a Team Talk member that is web forum saavy and has operated and setup web forums since they basically started, and he could be consulted on this.There are tools that are helpful in preventing spam, but it's a continually escalating battle - new admin spam tools -> new spam tools -> new admin spam tools etc etc. There are no built-in, add-on, or plug-in tools that will completely eliminate spammers, other than a human actually sitting down and reviewing each new member application, and even that will occasionally let one slip through.

Moderator4
11-12-2008, 08:48 AM
There are tools that are helpful in preventing spam, but it's a continually escalating battle - new admin spam tools -> new spam tools -> new admin spam tools etc etc. There are no built-in, add-on, or plug-in tools that will completely eliminate spammers, other than a human actually sitting down and reviewing each new member application, and even that will occasionally let one slip through.

There are methods at the admin level to dealing with this.

bigmac
11-12-2008, 09:01 AM
There are methods at the admin level to dealing with this.

Yes. Activating the setting that requires that every new member be approved by an Admin or a moderator before they can post anything. And the Admin can grant moderators the power to do this (without affecting any other site settings).

If you want to review built-in or plug-in spam tools, go over to http://www.vbulletin.org/forum/portal.php or to http://www.theadminzone.com/ and browse around. Search on "spam".

SkiDog
11-12-2008, 09:43 AM
This forum is an asset to Mastercraft and NOT a liability. Please make sure the powers at be are aware of this . Imagine how many phone call, e-mails, and other forms of correspondence MasterCraft would get inundated with if this forum were not here. So, I'm sure in the long run, that this forum saves MC a LOT of time & money.

macattack
11-12-2008, 10:03 AM
Jim: Not sure how fast someone could put out a survey, but no doubt you would receive a high percentage of Team Talk members agreeing this site is the greatest thing since slice bread. I guess MC already knows how many members use it, etc; if not, may want to provide them w/some membership data...just some thoughts, mac

Sodar
11-12-2008, 10:36 AM
Hopefully you have more pull than I. I have emailed back and forth with Jason and Phil regarding the issue and I get the same response each time, "let the IT department handle it" and "IT is working on it." I have offered a few times to approve new members, but Jason feels that this is not necessary. I agree with BigMac, that TeamTalk is on it's last leg. The only time MC Corporate logs on is to post an advertisement like Fan Fare, Zane's trip to Guantanamo, etc.

As for the spam, let our IT guys deal with it. They know that it exists
and are trying to figure out how they are getting in. We do have an
approval process in place already and they are getting in around that.
So let them hammer it out.

Thanks.

Jason

JohnE
11-12-2008, 11:03 AM
This forum is an asset to Mastercraft and NOT a liability. Please make sure the powers at be are aware of this . Imagine how many phone call, e-mails, and other forms of correspondence MasterCraft would get inundated with if this forum were not here. So, I'm sure in the long run, that this forum saves MC a LOT of time & money.

Jim: Not sure how fast someone could put out a survey, but no doubt you would receive a high percentage of Team Talk members agreeing this site is the greatest thing since slice bread. I guess MC already knows how many members use it, etc; if not, may want to provide them w/some membership data...just some thoughts, mac

Excellent thoughts here^^^^^^^^^

Jim, you might want to let them know that this site is directly responsible for my purchasing of 2 new MC's and one slightly used in the past 3 years. It's not just for impeller and oil questions, and b!tching......

Sodar
11-12-2008, 11:18 AM
Ha Ha! Another spam thread. Hopefully you get somewhere, Jim. It does not look like our own moderator have gotten anywhere! :rolleyes:

RexDog1
11-12-2008, 11:25 AM
This forum is an asset to Mastercraft and NOT a liability. Please make sure the powers at be are aware of this . Imagine how many phone call, e-mails, and other forms of correspondence MasterCraft would get inundated with if this forum were not here. So, I'm sure in the long run, that this forum saves MC a LOT of time & money.

I could have not said it better……………………..:D

tomo6188
11-12-2008, 11:49 AM
This forum is an asset to Mastercraft and NOT a liability. Please make sure the powers at be are aware of this . Imagine how many phone call, e-mails, and other forms of correspondence MasterCraft would get inundated with if this forum were not here. So, I'm sure in the long run, that this forum saves MC a LOT of time & money.

I agree too!!! This is a good place to get easy help. Many people on here are informative about certain things. This is a good board and really helps MC not to get as tech phone calls.

Jim@BAWS
11-12-2008, 11:58 AM
I will let the FORUM know what happened when I return Sat or Sunday

Wish me luck !!!

Jim@BAWS

TMCNo1
11-12-2008, 12:09 PM
Even though a approval process for new members could put into place and then others blocked, there are 100's of spammers who have already joined the site who have never posted a thread and are just waiting to post, those spammers will need to be hand picked out of the members list one by one, banned and deleted by someone.:twocents:

TMCNo1
11-12-2008, 12:10 PM
I will let the FORUM know what happened when I return Sat or Sunday

Wish me luck !!!

Jim@BAWS

Thank you Jim!

Roonie's
11-12-2008, 12:16 PM
Even though a approval process for new members could put into place and then others blocked, there are 100's of spammers who have already joined the site who have never posted a thread and are just waiting to post, those spammers will need to be hand picked out of the members list one by one, banned and deleted by someone.:twocents:

Have to start somewhere..... These spam threads with full on porn pics included in the thread hurts MC and their image. I would think they would want to do something about it as they do own this site and maintain it. Promoting family activities and boating as a family sport as well as providing helpful information and then opening a full porn spread by an innocent click of the mouse is a bit much. Children do come here..... not mine, now.


I wish you luck.

flipper
11-12-2008, 12:27 PM
Give 'em he!! Jim!!!!




I'm going to miss the good deals that spam brought here though.

Maristar210
11-12-2008, 12:39 PM
Have to start somewhere..... These spam threads with full on porn pics included in the thread hurts MC and their image. I would think they would want to do something about it as they do own this site and maintain it. Promoting family activities and boating as a family sport as well as providing helpful information and then opening a full porn spread by an innocent click of the mouse is a bit much. Children do come here..... not mine, now.


I wish you luck.

Same here with my 11 year old. He is no longer allowed to view TMC because of this very reason. I could tell you why but that would get my blood boiling again and we don't want that. :mad:

cmw
11-12-2008, 12:42 PM
Jim, thanks for going to bat for us. This site is very important to me. For those that have young ones visiting the site , I understand their concern. For me, I just skip over the spam. It is obvious what it is. I bought an older boat and could not possibly complete this project without the members help. I do not post much, but I am out here everyday finding answers to questions or getting ideas. Most of the time, I learn about things I need to do to the boat that I did not know existed. Many times it is good for a much needed laugh. It pains me to here someone say this site is on it's last leg, especially since I just found it. I see many new members out there. Lets not get discouraged. This site is needed!

Signed,
Future NEW MC owner!

Roonie's
11-12-2008, 01:40 PM
It pains me to here someone say this site is on it's last leg, especially since I just found it. I see many new members out there. Lets not get discouraged. This site is needed!

Signed,
Future NEW MC owner!

I know this site will be around for awhile.... I don't think anyone meant to infer that it is on its last leg so to speak. Everyone is just frustrated and a bit dismayed with the company's lack of spam regulation on a family friendly site. Most of the regulars have been here awhile and will stick around. It is always slow around winter here. Also as previously stated this site is a very valuable tool to MC and its customers.

FYI... I lurked on this site a whole year prior to joining as I was considering a MC boat over the other brands. This site with all its helpful info really swayed me.

cmw
11-12-2008, 02:07 PM
I know this site will be around for awhile.... I don't think anyone meant to infer that it is on its last leg so to speak. Everyone is just frustrated and a bit dismayed with the company's lack of spam regulation on a family friendly site. Most of the regulars have been here awhile and will stick around. It is always slow around winter here. Also as previously stated this site is a very valuable tool to MC and its customers.

FYI... I lurked on this site a whole year prior to joining as I was considering a MC boat over the other brands. This site with all its helpful info really swayed me.

Whew! I understand completely.

Gonzo
11-12-2008, 02:18 PM
Sales drives the company, thanks for the help!

coz
11-12-2008, 02:28 PM
I am going to the factory tommorow. I am going to ask the powers to be about finding a way to get member approval before they post on here. Other websites that some of us frequent require this. Why cannot it not be done here. I know that it is an extra step for moderators and admin but I think that it has gotten to the point where it is needed. I know participation is down around here and I am sure that is one of the reasons.

Add your input. I know that there is a time and place for things but it is not needed here.

Jim@BAWS

How many dealers do we have on here that are actually contributing members? BAWS & Chicago MC? I think it's definetly a great idea to have a dealer who also is member here talk with the suits and say look this is an asset to MC and from what you've seen lately it's a disgraceful shame some of the stuff that's being posted here, like the one that was just posted as I type this :mad:

I didn't buy my boat because of this site but it sure is a great resource for info and a fun place to shoot the S :D

Gonzo
11-12-2008, 02:34 PM
I didn't buy my boat because of this site but it sure is a great resource for info and a fun place to shoot the S :D


But would you buy another knowing how much help you will have with the decision/tweaking that goes along with a new boat.

TTAdmin
11-12-2008, 02:54 PM
I am going to the factory tommorow. I am going to ask the powers to be about finding a way to get member approval before they post on here. Other websites that some of us frequent require this. Why cannot it not be done here. I know that it is an extra step for moderators and admin but I think that it has gotten to the point where it is needed. I know participation is down around here and I am sure that is one of the reasons.

Add your input. I know that there is a time and place for things but it is not needed here.

Jim@BAWS
I personally called Jim and will meet with him when he arrives on campus for FanFare to discuss this issue.

We have taken this spam issue very seriously and we have deployed counter-measures to prevent/block this trash. We have had some success, but we still get spammed. I consulted again with the original creator of Team Talk to discuss another prevent option. Today in fact, we implemented that measure at the registration point to block new spammers- and, hopefully this will stop more new spam going forward.

We don’t necessarily visit Team Talk everyday – heck, we’re busy building boats. Although, many people in our company are casual users and may visit to check-in or learn more on a certain thread – and thanks to you all, there is a lot of great information that we can learn from. Regardless, the role of the Moderators is to watch the site every day (and hour) to referee, regulate and arbitrate the site for us. It’s their role to monitor this forum for us – and get this, these guys are volunteers. They do a great job - so, please go easy on them.

Now is the time to set-up a teleconference for all Moderators to discuss this spam issue, as well as address other questions, opportunities, etc. I am proposing next Monday – November 17th at 9pm (EST) for all Mods to call-in. I will be sending private messages to those Mods concerning the details.

Thanks for being patient with us and please continue to enjoy Team Talk.

Phil Walker
TTAdmin

Jim@BAWS
11-12-2008, 05:22 PM
I spoke w/ TTADMIN today. MC already was in the process of getting control of the
SPAM situation ASAP. I will take part in the teleconference on Mon. No Jim@BAWS is not
nor will be a moderator. I know that breaks all of your hearts.

We all have reasons to come here. Originally as a owner...still am of course and now as a dealer, one of the few!!! All of us will keep you informed! Glad I was able to put a gentle
nudge to move it foward.

Jim@BAWS

BriEOD
11-12-2008, 06:11 PM
I spoke w/ TTADMIN today. MC already was in the process of getting control of the
SPAM situation ASAP. I will take part in the teleconference on Mon. No Jim@BAWS is not
nor will be a moderator. I know that breaks all of your hearts.



I think you and Chuck should take over as full time admin/moderators! Now that would be a hoot~!:D

atlfootr
11-12-2008, 06:28 PM
Activating the setting that requires that every new member be approved by an Admin or a moderator before they can post.
And the Admin can grant moderators the power to do this (without affecting any other site settings).

Now we're talking :rolleyes:

ProTour X9
11-12-2008, 06:31 PM
Not sure if anyone can read my avatar.........

42081

TMCNo1
11-12-2008, 08:52 PM
Even though a approval process for new members could put into place and then others blocked, there are 100's of spammers who have already joined the site who have never posted a thread and are just waiting to post, those spammers will need to be hand picked out of the members list one by one, banned and deleted by someone.:twocents:


As I said, here's one that just posted, http://www.mastercraft.com/teamtalk/showthread.php?t=27559, they joined Monday, the 10th and here it is Wednesday the 12th and they posted a spam thread!
We will probably still get some spam threads till the spam members are weeded out of the members list!

east tx skier
11-12-2008, 10:20 PM
Hopefully you have more pull than I. I have emailed back and forth with Jason and Phil regarding the issue and I get the same response each time, "let the IT department handle it" and "IT is working on it." I have offered a few times to approve new members, but Jason feels that this is not necessary. I agree with BigMac, that TeamTalk is on it's last leg. The only time MC Corporate logs on is to post an advertisement like Fan Fare, Zane's trip to Guantanamo, etc.

For quite a while they had admin approval of new members required. At some point, they removed that and this is the result. I guess they just got tired of approving new members. Weeding out the spammers can be exhausting, especially with a forum of this size, but it goes with the territory and it's a shame to see this place deteriorate under such a menace.

Phil, vbulletin is fairly sophisticated software (if expense is any indication). I played around with a forum for a bit using phpbb and the spam was horrible. But I set it to admin screening and they spammers never got to post. They updated the software and the spammers never even got to the point of getting registered, i.e., I never got emails from the fakes. I can't imagine that vbulletin hasn't got this solved at that level.

Good luck.

bigmac
11-13-2008, 07:35 AM
Phil, vbulletin is fairly sophisticated software (if expense is any indication).The vBulletin software is $180 to buy the license, then $40/year after that, which includes online support. Of course, that doesn't include the cost of server space...that does represent an additional cost of $50-$100 per year for about 1500 gigabytes.

Sodar
11-13-2008, 09:47 AM
No spam overnight... perhaps TTAdmins fix worked?

TMCNo1
11-13-2008, 10:04 AM
No spam overnight... perhaps TTAdmins fix worked?

It's good to see, so far, but, we will probably still get some spam threads till the spam members that joined earlier are weeded out of the members list prior to yesterday!

TMCNo1
11-13-2008, 09:50 PM
This one may need banning, they've been lurking,

>Rachelew http://www.mastercraft.com/teamtalk/mc2009/images/statusicon/user_offline.gif
Last Activity: Today 09:28 PM


TT Newbie


>About Rachelew
Location USA
Gender test
Team MasterCraft Member Rac
Boat Owned Rachelew
Occupation USA
Interests Rachelew

Jim@BAWS
11-18-2008, 07:56 AM
Get ready for some great new added spam protection here in TMC. Was priviledeged to
be part of a meeting yeaterday that was over an hour where many great new ideas where discussed. Many will be implemented real soon. In the mean time new SPAM protection has been added. Please be patient. Also please invite some long time members back to the site along with new ones. I think that everyone on the site will be notified via some
electronic media contact.

Jim@BAWS

Gonzo
11-18-2008, 08:55 AM
Sounds good Jim, and I know we complain a lot but truth be told considering they did it manually the Mods have done a pretty good job staying on top of it.

starman205
11-18-2008, 10:37 AM
Jim,

Thanks for your concern and effort. It will be a pleasure to continue to use this site. :)

Sodar
11-18-2008, 10:52 AM
Glad to hear it went well!

Sodar
11-18-2008, 10:53 AM
I also partook in the meeting last night and have high hopes for this board in the future. It really sounds like MasterCraft is very interested in improving and bettering the site for the good of all who use it. I am very hopeful of good things to come.

mcdoon
11-18-2008, 11:28 AM
Sounds like we're getting priority treatment finally!

Thanks Jim@BAWS and everyone else who hammered this one home.

Let's get this thing re-launched and let the good times roll again!

Moderator4
11-18-2008, 04:08 PM
As a participant, the teleconference was productive and hopefully we will have a more involved approach to honing the forum to the needs of the users, and not to those that have a less than admirable intent of use here. TT Admin has brought us to the round table to not only toss around some ideas but to implement a plan that will allow for less clutter and more of a positive path forward for the good of the forum community. The board will be cleaned up a bit in order to be able to manage business at hand, streamline the server load, as well as refine the useful intent and purpose of the forum. Spammers are done here in just a matter of a very short time.

Thanks for your patience. :cool:

Jim@BAWS
11-18-2008, 05:11 PM
Thanks to the "SUPER HEROS" In the teleconference they only used there "MASKED" names
Even Zorro and Batman where there...All except Tom Scott. whoops he is more like "SPIDERMAN"

Really I did not know who I was talking with on the other side. There names where held in secret to protect in innocent. Maybe I should become a moderator...nah no time for that I have to get back to being a SUPER BOAT SALES GUY HA HA HA

Get ready for some great upgrades !!!!

Jim@BAWS

Riddler
11-18-2008, 09:58 PM
Thanks to the "SUPER HEROS" In the teleconference they only used there "MASKED" names
Even Zorro and Batman where there...All except Tom Scott. whoops he is more like "SPIDERMAN"

Really I did not know who I was talking with on the other side. There names where held in secret to protect in innocent. Maybe I should become a moderator...nah no time for that I have to get back to being a SUPER BOAT SALES GUY HA HA HA

Get ready for some great upgrades !!!!

Jim@BAWS

WHAT???
No one thought to invite me?
We could have had such fun together!