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Medicine Laker
05-01-2005, 11:19 PM
I live in the north and like to get my boat in for some early season skiing. I have been warned previously about the possibility of having the water freeze in the engine block and and it cracking. How cold does it really need to get before this is a concern? Just because it gets down to 32 for an hour overnight should not be a problem, but where is the line?

Leroy
05-01-2005, 11:30 PM
No one can answer for sure, keep in mind the temperature also varies by probably +/- 3 or 4 degrees depending on where the boat is located.


I would play it safe, if you make a mistake it is at least $5k mistake. It's easy to drain the water out and not more than a 10 minute job.

Bongo
05-02-2005, 12:24 AM
How cold does it really need to get before this is a concern? Just because it gets down to 32 for an hour overnight should not be a problem, but where is the line?

Yea, I've thought about this question a few times. My rationale: If the boat is on the water, the lake will act as a 'heat island' and not get as cold as the air over land. However, it'll also be at the low point, so offset some by the cooler air gravitating toward the low spot. When temps dip slightly below freezing - especially if was a (reasonably) warm day - I have no concerns. Beyond that, I've occasionally taken my chances.

If you are concerned, you may want to try a small light bulb. An incandescent light bulb is basically an electric heater that emits a small bit of light energy. Placing a well-protected light (i.e. shop light, or similar) under the engine will certainly keep it warm enough on most spring nights in most locations. Notice the wiggle words, such that I didn't give a definitive answer? ;-)

Bongo

JEREMY79
05-02-2005, 12:30 AM
Dont forget that metal temp (block is metal) is typically 10-15 degrees colder than the air. I know this because of painting metal. Stupid stuff that stays in my head.

erkoehler
05-02-2005, 12:55 AM
I wouldn't take the chance. Either drain the block, or pull the boat out of the lake and store it indoors.

To me, the 15 minutes it may take to do either of those things is not worth the 5k in possible damage.

AirJunky
05-02-2005, 01:06 AM
These inboards are a lot easier to drain than an outboard or I/O. With petcocks on the side of your block, a pair of hoses connecting the exhaust manifolds, and a couple of radiator flush Ts in your heater & shower hoses, bump start the motor once & the water in the motor is gone in less than 3 minutes.
I have been keeping my 205 outside for 5 years & I live less than an hour from the Canadian border. Never had a problem..... knock on wood. :toast:

Tom Jones
05-04-2005, 07:27 AM
I agree, you have to remember also that the motor box has insulation around it and if the boat has been run the day before the temp. drops it will be fine even if it gets quite a bit below freezing. Just for piece if mind I do put a trouble light inside the motor box occassinally when it gets more than a couple of degrees below freezing. I do this if the boat has not been run that day.

wiltok
05-04-2005, 11:03 AM
I have been told (and this makes sense) that if the boat is stored on a lift over the water - you will be less affected by the cold. The heat is released from the lake and keeps tempuratures warmer around the boat (unless of course the water is frozen :). The warmer the water the better - obviously in the fall it would be like having a huge heater under the boat. However, the effect still exists in the winter. Just my opinion though - don't sue me if you get your block cracked!!

east tx skier
05-04-2005, 11:07 AM
Regardless of where you store it, I'd say that draining it and spining the motor with the kill switch removed for a second will be your best bet. If you don't, to an extent depending on where it's stored, you're rolling the dice.

sizzler
05-04-2005, 11:10 AM
[QUOTE=Tom Jones]I agree, you have to remember also that the motor box has insulation around it and if the boat has been run the day before the temp. drops it will be fine even if it gets quite a bit below freezing. Just for piece if mind I do put a trouble light inside the motor box occassinally when it gets more than a couple of degrees below freezing. I do this if the boat has not been run that day.[/QUOTE

tom jones.....does this happen a lot???

"ITS NOT UNUSUAL"

sorry couldnt resist

phecksel
05-04-2005, 11:13 AM
I have been told (and this makes sense) that if the boat is stored on a lift over the water - you will be less affected by the cold. The heat is released from the lake and keeps tempuratures warmer around the boat (unless of course the water is frozen :). The warmer the water the better - obviously in the fall it would be like having a huge heater under the boat. However, the effect still exists in the winter. Just my opinion though - don't sue me if you get your block cracked!!
possibly ture, but you can't go wrong by draining the block

phecksel
05-04-2005, 11:16 AM
Dont forget that metal temp (block is metal) is typically 10-15 degrees colder than the air. I know this because of painting metal. Stupid stuff that stays in my head.
I respectfully disagree. It's absolutely impossible for metal to become colder then the steady state outside air temperature. Metal can lag behind in increasing or decreasing temperature, because of the mass and the rate of heat transfer.

VTJC
05-04-2005, 10:57 PM
I also face the same issues in the spring and fall. I found this solution on another forum, http://www.wakesiderides.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=12059 . I am going to setup my shower and heater this way. How I just need to figure out how to drain the raw water pump easily. At a minimum drain the block, itís the most expensive part. Jamie

Leroy
05-04-2005, 11:08 PM
Be aware electrical solutions are liable to have spark and BOOM. Power surges, outages, etc. I've never seen it, but guy that installed my lift said it happens quite a bit.


He also said dropping the boat in the water overnight is pretty good solution as water should be pretty warm compared to freezing air.

sfitzgerald351
05-04-2005, 11:12 PM
Quick disconnects are awesome.... That was a nice explanation.

sfitzgerald351
05-04-2005, 11:20 PM
Be aware electrical solutions are liable to have spark and BOOM. Power surges, outages, etc. I've never seen it, but guy that installed my lift said it happens quite a bit.


They make engine compartment heaters that are spark proof. A little pricey, but better than going BOOM! See it here (http://www.westmarine.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/ProductDisplay?storeId=10001&langId=-1&catalogId=10001&classNum=543&subdeptNum=379&storeNum=12&productId=72980)

Leroy
05-05-2005, 12:22 AM
Pretty neat, never saw this before, but pretty pricey! Just hope Sizzler realizes his drop light probably isn't BOOM proof!

JDK
05-05-2005, 12:41 AM
These things work awesome. 200 watts (and all of the heat goes into the engine), it takes 5 seconds to stick it on or take it off your oil pan, sealed to prevent shorts...... and it's 32 bucks.
http://www.jcwhitney.com/autoparts/Product/showCustom-0/Pr-p_Product.CATENTRY_ID:2000836/c-10101/Nty-1/p-2000836/Ntx-mode+matchallpartial/N-10101/tf-Browse/s-10101/Ntk-AllTextSearchGroup?Ntt=magnetic%20heater

erkoehler
05-05-2005, 06:14 AM
The price is much more appealling!

jimmer2880
05-05-2005, 07:24 AM
These things work awesome. 200 watts (and all of the heat goes into the engine), it takes 5 seconds to stick it on or take it off your oil pan, sealed to prevent shorts...... and it's 32 bucks.
http://www.jcwhitney.com/autoparts/Product/showCustom-0/Pr-p_Product.CATENTRY_ID:2000836/c-10101/Nty-1/p-2000836/Ntx-mode+matchallpartial/N-10101/tf-Browse/s-10101/Ntk-AllTextSearchGroup?Ntt=magnetic%20heater

I use these on my diesel tractors. They are great. I'll also add that they are sold at Tractor Supply type stores.

Tom Jones
05-05-2005, 08:09 AM
Well, As you can see I live in an igloo and it rarely gets above freezing here, but in reality I do regularly deal with drops below freezing in the early spring and late fall. I have left my boat out on the marine railway in the fall when the temp. drops to -8C ( that's into the teens for the U.S. guys). My experience has been that unless it stays below freezing for several days in a row, without warming up in the day-time, you need not be concerned. But, like I say, I do drop the trouble light in the engine box on a rare occassion if I'm feeling skidish the nights that it gets really cold and I want a good night sleep. Right now it is dropping to
-3C at nights and I am not worrying about it. F--- it's cold up here this year!
P.S. glad someone finally made a comment about my name!

sizzler
05-05-2005, 08:17 AM
tom.....thx....it was wasted on 95% of this board tho'........i bet you're asked to a lot of karaoke contests eh????? :uglyhamme

east tx skier
05-05-2005, 11:16 AM
[N]ow I just need to figure out how to drain the raw water pump easily. At a minimum drain the block, itís the most expensive part. Jamie

On the older boats, if you remove the kill switch and spin the engine a few times, it will spit the water out of the pump housing. Will that not work on the newer boats?

jimmer2880
05-05-2005, 01:52 PM
I'm going out to buy some hose quick dis-connects today for my heater. Great idea. Thanks for posting it.

boxercentral@verizon.net
04-20-2013, 08:54 PM
Ok - here's the deal... you need to know the difference between the ambient temp and the temp in the engine compartment. Mine is a difference of 6 degrees. So I'm good to 26 degrees, but that's pushing the fold. I just got my boat back from spring maint and today and it is supposed to dip to 24 degrees tonight (4/20 - ***?). To make up the other 2 degree's I use an old electric blanket. I know everyone is whacked about the spark factor, but if you put the control switchbox in a ziplock outside of the engine compartment the risk of spark is so very small you should be good. The temp in the engine compartment w/the blanket makes a 5 - 8 degree diff from the ambient -so with the standard 6, the min temp where this would be effective would be at 21 degree's. At, or below that, winterize. This happens every so often to me after I de-winterize when the boat is still on the trailor so I'm hoping this continues to be a good method.

mikeg205
04-20-2013, 08:56 PM
Some have hung light in their dog house... but you need about 24 hours at 24 degrees iirc to worry about it...

d2jp
04-20-2013, 11:41 PM
Wait a minute, we jumped from 5-5-2005 to 4-20-13?

Holy Timewarp Batman!

Mastercraft13
04-21-2013, 12:11 AM
Just got mine today and of course a low of 28 tonight. Dog house was still a little warm from running it today, but I drained the block and manifolds. I just came in from from weeding through the hoses and didn't have the light of the patience to figure out the heater and shower lines. Should be ok but worst case I covered the big ticket portion. Where the hell is spring this year guys?

thatsmrmastercraft
04-21-2013, 12:39 AM
Just got mine today and of course a low of 28 tonight. Dog house was still a little warm from running it today, but I drained the block and manifolds. I just came in from from weeding through the hoses and didn't have the light of the patience to figure out the heater and shower lines. Should be ok but worst case I covered the big ticket portion. Where the hell is spring this year guys?

It's not in Minnesota. :rant:

88 PS190
04-22-2013, 11:21 PM
Some have hung light in their dog house... but you need about 24 hours at 24 degrees iirc to worry about it...

Bear in mind that while wind temp doesn't lower metal temperature, it does speed temperature loss.

This is the fact that "wind chill" will never reduce the temps of surfaces below ambient, it will just get them to ambient FAST.

Where this is important; if it is windy and below freezing, that wind will increase the probability of a hard freeze in the engine. A bulb can warm the compartment, so long as there isn't a bunch of air flow, so the bulb making heat in an insulated engine box, with the tarp on securely then that is better than untarped.

If you park it in a lean to or a garage, or even behind a row of trees blocking the wind, that will be better.

My favorite are magnetic block heaters, gets the heat where you need it (the block) not just randomly in the bilge.

east tx skier
04-23-2013, 10:00 AM
Wait a minute, we jumped from 5-5-2005 to 4-20-13?

Holy Timewarp Batman!

Did erkoehler ever pull the trigger on that 95? Where is Sodarski when we need him. ;)