More Ski Advice

[hokiecharlie]

I just read the tschultz80 thread about high-end skis, and saw what great advice he got from everyone. I'd like to get similar advice as to whether I would benefit from a new ski, and, if so, which models would be good options.

I have just started trying to ski the course. I did a one-day clinic the other day, and, in my first and only day on the course I was only able to get 4 balls at 28/15 off. Couldn't quite get to the 3 and 5 balls. But, the instructor said I have the ability and technique, I just just need more actual time in the course. I too have limited access to courses and ski mostly open water at 15 off, 28-32, although I hope to do more course skiing in the future. I am using a three year old o'brien siege. From what I've read here it sounds like I should either save my money until I get better on what I've got, possibly consider a D3 X5 or maybe something in between.

It also sounds like when I do get a ew ski, I should get at least a 68 as I am 5'8" and about 175-185 depending on how much I'm working out and eating and which scale I use. I've been using front and rear boot bindings, but saw where someone recommended a rear toe plate for a beginner like myself. What is the thinking behind that?

I would appreciate the same candid thoughts provided to tschultz. Thanks.

[88 PS190]

I would stick with your siege. Its perhaps not a competition ski, but its a performance ski that I doubt is holding you back.

I would focus more on implementing the tips that you recieved in your clinic, and perhaps get to a ski school again soon.

If you really want a new ski, that's one thing. Doubt you need it.

[hokiecharlie]

I would stick with your siege. Its perhaps not a competition ski, but its a performance ski that I doubt is holding you back.

I would focus more on implementing the tips that you recieved in your clinic, and perhaps get to a ski school again soon.

If you really want a new ski, that's one thing. Doubt you need it.
Thanks. That's kind of what I was thinking. Just wanted to make sure that even at this stage the Siege wasn't slowing progress.

[BX3]

I agree with 88 ps190 the speed you are going a more agressive ski will not perform as well as your current ski and may create more problems than you would want. I think "run what you brung" until you are advancing to shorter lines at quicker speeds. 34mpg-36mpg.

Good luck.

Timing is everything.

[88 PS190]

You never can really say the ski is what slows people this early, normally at this stage a ski like the seige or a F3 will help the skier improve.

Typically until you are really working in the course its technique instead of equipment. I would check your measurement from the tail to the front binding and set that to factory specs if it isn't already.

For RTP. It has some advantages for beginners, mainly you see people go to dual bindings and get pulled onto their rear foot. When you are pulled flat onto your rear foot and stand on your heal you'll have the tip way up in the air in the turn and then you'll be riding the tail.

When you go to dual bindings you need to work to have your weight balance forwards.

Good saying for this is that try as you might you cannot force the tip of your ski under when riding flat. It just gets more and more surface. So don't be afraid of getting your weight onto the front foot. Just remember to keep your shoulders proud your chest up and your waist firm and it'll all go well.

[kpickett]

Consider the Obrien Synchro. It's a great ski - a widebody, so it works really well at slower speeds, but it's fast and it rips turns. It will take you from 15 off at 28 mph to 28 off at 34. One of the Big Dog skiers takes it into 41 off.

[Cottonwood]

I would agree regarding the O'Brien Synchro. I've been to a couple of Big Dawg events and saw the ski in action (made me second guess my $1000 ski when I got my butt kicked by a $300 "rec-ski".) The biggest problem you'll encounter w/ the Seige or any other "high-end" ski is your speed (or lack of). These skis were designed to ski 34-36mph. When skiing at slower speeds, the ski will stall in the turns. The skis require speed to enable lift just as an airplane wing does. The Synchro can be skied successfully at slower speeds and as I've witnessed, can be skied shortline as well. From what I remember about the Seige it was not a very forgiving ski. The O'Brien will allow you enhance your skills with a more user-friendly platform.

[hokiecharlie]

I would agree regarding the O'Brien Synchro. I've been to a couple of Big Dawg events and saw the ski in action (made me second guess my $1000 ski when I got my butt kicked by a $300 "rec-ski".) The biggest problem you'll encounter w/ the Seige or any other "high-end" ski is your speed (or lack of). These skis were designed to ski 34-36mph. When skiing at slower speeds, the ski will stall in the turns. The skis require speed to enable lift just as an airplane wing does. The Synchro can be skied successfully at slower speeds and as I've witnessed, can be skied shortline as well. From what I remember about the Seige it was not a very forgiving ski. The O'Brien will allow you enhance your skills with a more user-friendly platform.
Thanks for the advice. It makes since although it's not as appealing psychologically to go "backwards" in terms of the ski, I guess I need to accept reality. What do you think about size, rear boot versus toe-plate?

[ski_king]

A couple of year ago, I upgraded my ski to a Obrien Mapple and at the same time bought my daughters a Syncro.

The Syncro is a great ski and I wouldn't consider it going backwards. It skis great, but is also very forgiving.

As far as size goes, depends on your size 66 or 69 in. I use my daughters 63, which is too short for me, but still skis as well as the Mapple for me.

Rear plate vs toe plate? Depends on preference again. Most on here will say rear plate. I like Toe Plate. Chris Perish uses a rear toe plate, so it can't be all that bad.

[hokiecharlie]

A couple of year ago, I upgraded my ski to a Obrien Mapple and at the same time bought my daughters a Syncro.

The Syncro is a great ski and I wouldn't consider it going backwards. It skis great, but is also very forgiving.

As far as size goes, depends on your size 66 or 69 in. I use my daughters 63, which is too short for me, but still skis as well as the Mapple for me.

Rear plate vs toe plate? Depends on preference again. Most on here will say rear plate. I like Toe Plate. Chris Perish uses a rear toe plate, so it can't be all that bad.
I'm typically between 175-185. Given size and slowwer speeds, sounds like 69 would be better.

[Cottonwood]

Because of the sheer volume of the ski, I would try the shorter version to begin with. Call H2osmosis. They have a demo plan so you can try differenet sizes. A 69" Synchro would be for skiers in the 225 range I would think.

[pilot02]

I just read the tschultz80 thread about high-end skis, and saw what great advice he got from everyone. I'd like to get similar advice as to whether I would benefit from a new ski, and, if so, which models would be good options.

I have just started trying to ski the course. I did a one-day clinic the other day, and, in my first and only day on the course I was only able to get 4 balls at 28/15 off. Couldn't quite get to the 3 and 5 balls. But, the instructor said I have the ability and technique, I just just need more actual time in the course. I too have limited access to courses and ski mostly open water at 15 off, 28-32, although I hope to do more course skiing in the future. I am using a three year old o'brien siege. From what I've read here it sounds like I should either save my money until I get better on what I've got, possibly consider a D3 X5 or maybe something in between.

It also sounds like when I do get a ew ski, I should get at least a 68 as I am 5'8" and about 175-185 depending on how much I'm working out and eating and which scale I use. I've been using front and rear boot bindings, but saw where someone recommended a rear toe plate for a beginner like myself. What is the thinking behind that?

I would appreciate the same candid thoughts provided to tschultz. Thanks.

Unless I'm still toasted from MM III, I don't see a mention of the size of your current siege. If your 175-185 I'd think a 67 - 68" would be fine. Shorter than that and the speed (28 is too slow). Personally, I'd pick up the speed to 29 or 30, totally ignore the gates and concentrate on form in your turns and your pull through the wakes. The rest will come in time. I'm on a 70" phantom now and although I really like the ski, I was able to ski each pass up to my personal best of 3@32off @36mph and have only been able to get the same 3@32off but at 34 with the phantom. Skis do make a difference, but when you're just learning, it's more about form and not developing bad habits than it is about having a top end ski.
Several years back, there was an instance where a now former pro skier took someone's old run of the mill ski at a tournament as a practical joke and having never skied on that particular ski ran 35 and 38off back to back passes in the tournament. He didn't win at that event but did prove that equipment isn't always everything.

[hokiecharlie]

Unless I'm still toasted from MM III, I don't see a mention of the size of your current siege. If your 175-185 I'd think a 67 - 68" would be fine. Shorter than that and the speed (28 is too slow). Personally, I'd pick up the speed to 29 or 30, totally ignore the gates and concentrate on form in your turns and your pull through the wakes. The rest will come in time. I'm on a 70" phantom now and although I really like the ski, I was able to ski each pass up to my personal best of 3@32off @36mph and have only been able to get the same 3@32off but at 34 with the phantom. Skis do make a difference, but when you're just learning, it's more about form and not developing bad habits than it is about having a top end ski.
Several years back, there was an instance where a now former pro skier took someone's old run of the mill ski at a tournament as a practical joke and having never skied on that particular ski ran 35 and 38off back to back passes in the tournament. He didn't win at that event but did prove that equipment is always everything.
The Siege is a 67. I called Obrien and they said I was right in between the 66 and 69. They said given that I was already using a 67 and a somewhat experienced skiier they thought the 66 would be better. I totally understand that the ski is only a part of the equation, but, on the other hand, the Synchro sounds like a better fit than the Siege right now.

[kpickett]

Hey Charlie,

As I said earlier, I think the 69 would work for you, because it does for my buddy who is 180 and working on 15 off at 32. But, I also think the 66 would be fine, especially if you think you'll be upping your speed pretty soon.

I think Kyle Tate - the big dog skier who takes the synchro into 41 off - is around 175 and on a 63 inch Synchro! So, the 66 should be great. Let us know how it goes.

[pilot02]

The Siege is a 67. I called Obrien and they said I was right in between the 66 and 69. They said given that I was already using a 67 and a somewhat experienced skiier they thought the 66 would be better. I totally understand that the ski is only a part of the equation, but, on the other hand, the Synchro sounds like a better fit than the Siege right now.

Before you go changing skis (and wasting money at this point in my humble opinion), I'd highly suggest that you either ski with someone that is a really good skier and KNOWS how to teach or go to a ski school where you can both get instruction on form and also demo different equipment under controlled conditions. With what I'm hearing, I'm betting fin settings and form will get you where you want to be without having to "take a step back." If you don't have access to the aforementioned, get someone to videotape you on several passes and then compare your form to some of the literature out there or submit it to some of the members on the board that are "in the know" or even to me. PM me if you'd like to talk further.

[kpickett]

While I don't actually disagree that instruction can be most valuable at this stage of the game, I do think that having the right ski for your ability (and most especially, your speed) can sure help a lot. The wider shaped skis, like the Synchro and the F1X, can really help when you're working the course at a slower speed.

That said - this is a hobby for all of us non-pros, and getting a new ski can be part of the fun. Sometimes, having the new toy makes us want to get out there and ski even more. There's nothing wrong with wanting a new ski.

[hokiecharlie]

While I don't actually disagree that instruction can be most valuable at this stage of the game, I do think that having the right ski for your ability (and most especially, your speed) can sure help a lot. The wider shaped skis, like the Synchro and the F1X, can really help when you're working the course at a slower speed.

That said - this is a hobby for all of us non-pros, and getting a new ski can be part of the fun. Sometimes, having the new toy makes us want to get out there and ski even more. There's nothing wrong with wanting a new ski.
I'm even more confused now. I called H20smosis. They said neither size Synchro would work and that I should get a F1X or Triumph instead.

[pilot02]

PM at ya....

[kpickett]

I'll never be the skier that the guys at H2Osmosis are. I can only talk from my experience and the experiences of my friends. I rode the F1X and I didn't like it nearly as much as the Synchro. As I said, my 185 pound friend loves his 69 Synchro. If you can try a couple skis, that would be best. I bought an F1X to try, didn't like it, and I sold it for the same as I bought it. No loss there. I think it would be the same with the Synchro.