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ski_king
08-05-2004, 03:28 PM
I have been told that Mastercraft has dropped its only closed bow, the ProStar 190.

Is this true?

It would'nt suprise me to much as the 197 is so sweet!

VTJC
08-05-2004, 03:53 PM
I hope not otherwise my next boat will have to be a different make. Jamie

TTAdmin
08-05-2004, 03:58 PM
No this is not true....Where did you hear this...? You just don't as many of the new one's anymore because everyone wants the open bow. Regardless, they are still in production.

chris.willman
08-05-2004, 03:58 PM
I tend to agree. Even though I have not driven a 197, I find it hard to believe that it could hang with my 190.

Somebody argue with me, cause me wife would sure love to have the extra room.

G-man
08-05-2004, 03:58 PM
I've heard the same thing. In their defense I'll say around here the marketability for a closed bow is limited to serious slalom skiers on private lakes. I guess the best part is now the big three make great open bows with awsome wakes.

east tx skier
08-05-2004, 04:08 PM
From everything I've heard, the 190 and 197, from the skier's perspective, are the same. I could see myself going closed bow on my next boat. So, just for me, keep producing those 190s. :D

ski_king
08-05-2004, 04:13 PM
Thanks TTAdmin and others.

I was told this by someone who was out boat shopping a couple of weekends ago. He hit dealers from all the brands.

He was leaning towards the SN and was using this as one of the reasons. I gotta get him straightened out before he makes a big mistake!

stevo137
08-05-2004, 07:00 PM
I can't imagine MC not offering a closed bow. I have nothing against open bow's, I just like the closed bow. We are only a family of four, but if I had more than two kids, the open bow would be the way that I would go. It would be nice to see the next anniversary edition with a closed bow option. After all, that's what started it all for MC. Can you imagine the early S&S's without that beautiful bow scoop!
I'm not sure if any of the majors besides MC are even offering closed bows at this point.
TT Admin, it's good to see your replies ( I almost said "response") to the post's. Nothing like hearing it from "The horse's mouth"!

bradamerry
08-05-2004, 07:28 PM
The 197 is my dream boat, but if I bought a new boat next week, it would be a 190!! As far as the room, one of my cousins said I needed an openbow boat. I told him he needed a boat!!

stevo137
08-05-2004, 07:33 PM
Brad, :uglyhamme , get a boat, I love it!

bradamerry
08-05-2004, 09:25 PM
I could let him ride in front of the windshield. :eek3: On my 190!!

SD190EVO
08-05-2004, 09:57 PM
There were 35th aniv boats that were closed bow. In fact, I am pretty certain number 1 of 35 was a closed bow.

stevo137
08-06-2004, 08:27 AM
That is good to know. I wasn't aware of that. it would be nice to see a pic of one.

east tx skier
08-06-2004, 10:16 AM
There was definitely a 35th Anniversary 190. It's pictured in the Water Ski Mag boat buyer's guide for '03 (and it's sweet looking). Somebody asked about other "majors" that offer closed bows. The only one I can think of is the SN 196. I don't think M'bu has one any more. I'm pretty sure the newer Supra comps are all open now as well.

Keep making that 190, MC! Definitely amazing boats! :cool:

SD190EVO
08-06-2004, 12:08 PM
Here is one...

east tx skier
08-06-2004, 02:48 PM
They need a drooling emoticon. Nice ride!

bradamerry
08-06-2004, 03:28 PM
I changed my mind, that is my dream boat!! :banana:

mgurley
08-09-2004, 08:12 AM
Holy Sh!t! Sweet boat! :headbang:

bks
09-07-2004, 12:04 AM
I'm new to MC boats and looking for a used 190. A guy down the street is selling a 1998 190 with a 305 V8. Any info on this boat?

erkoehler
09-07-2004, 12:25 AM
In regards to other closed bow boats, ski nautique and malibu both have the option available. The SN is the 196 model and the malibu is the standard Sportster, and I believe it is also an option on the Response. Moomba does NOT have a closed bow boat.

bradamerry
09-07-2004, 08:24 AM
bks, I would think the 305 V8 would be under powered? I'm surprised they come with a 305!

H20skeefreek
09-07-2004, 08:45 AM
In regards to other closed bow boats, ski nautique and malibu both have the option available. The SN is the 196 model and the malibu is the standard Sportster, and I believe it is also an option on the Response. Moomba does NOT have a closed bow boat.


both the sportster and response are definatly available in closed bow. the 'bu dealer has been trying to sell me one for 4 years now.

captkidd
09-07-2004, 10:40 AM
BKS, my guess is that the boat must be a SportStar 19 (I think that's what they were called). All other MC's come with at least a 350 V8. The SportStars were basically a stripped down version of a previous hull design, and were sold as an "entry level" boat. However, compared to many other boats they were actually quite nice; you'd never think of it as being "stripped down" unless you looked at it beside another MC. Also, from what I've heard they had great ski wakes and even with the 305 were pretty strong boats, probably due to being lighter in weight.

bks
09-07-2004, 10:50 AM
I agree the 305 doesn't make much sense, and I haven't been able to find any references on the net mentioning a 305. Any idea where to find a 1998 sales brochure or 1998 PS 190 owners manual?

JimN
09-07-2004, 11:09 AM
The 5.0L was offered for a few years and worked fine, but for the people who want their arms yanked out, it's a bit under powered. At 260 HP it's a good replacement for those who liked the 351 but not the carb troubles. It's also good for trick and smaller skiers who don't need a lot of top end, just a good pull.

bradamerry
09-07-2004, 11:22 AM
I believe you should max a boat out on power, it's better to have and not need, then to need a not have. And resale is going to suck on that boat with that 305 :twocents:

JimN
09-07-2004, 11:25 AM
I don't think it should be underpowered either, but as an entry level dedicated ski boat with a lot of people coming from outboards and sterndrives, it's a lot better. Not like going from a used $7500 I/O to a new Prostar at $35000(at that time).

H20skeefreek
09-07-2004, 11:25 AM
I believe you should max a boat out on power, it's better to have and not need, then to need a not have. And resale is going to suck on that boat with that 305 :twocents:

but if the 305 had 260hp, it still beats your and my boats brad. I say "if the price is right"...... :headbang:

Just checked NADA. AVG. retail is 13,820, i'd take a 1998 MC for 13K

east tx skier
09-07-2004, 11:28 AM
Brad, I think the best argument against it is resale value. We spotted a competing brand the other day that had a 5.0 L, and that was my thought - probably pull you just fine, but selling it, if you had to, would be tough. My :twocents:

bradamerry
09-07-2004, 11:32 AM
The newer boats need more horses than the older ones. I would put my 245hp. Up against the 310hp for 2004 everyday. You can't hold on to mine at half throttle, trying to get up on one.

ski_king
09-07-2004, 11:45 AM
I agree, the older and lighter boats can do with 250 hp what the newer and heavier 300+hp boats can.

My old 82, 2200 lb., 240hp can keep up or even out accelerate the newer 300+hp boats that my friends have.

I would love to see what 300+ hp would do in my boat.

bks
09-07-2004, 11:47 AM
Thanks for all the info. I'm going to keep looking.

east tx skier
09-07-2004, 11:59 AM
Why is that? At 2,690 lbs., my father-in-law's 205 with 308 horsepower only outweighs my 205 (2,550 lbs) by 140 lbs.

bradamerry
09-07-2004, 12:08 PM
I don't know why? But the new boats need more horses to make them do what the older boats do with 245hp. The newer boats aren't running alot faster speeds and nobody buys a tourney boat for speed. The footers are looking for speed, but the BEST slalom skiers only need 36 mph. Maybe hull shapes have alot to do with it. I know the newer boats ride better than mine, but don't pull any better.

east tx skier
09-07-2004, 12:28 PM
The way I understand it, extra horsepower and gear reduction are suited for competitive skiers on private lakes. Someone with a short setup will benefit from a boat that can reach speed as quickly as possible. Gear reduction and a well matched prop will help with the hole shot as well with a strong pull through the course. I presume these things help when you have a skier that's pulling hard, to keep that skier from pulling the boat off line.

So, I guess what I'm saying is that for skiing, it's less about top speeds than it is about reaching and maintaining speed, and holding your track.

Most of my experience has been behind two boats --- my 93 PS 205 (285 hp) and my father in law's 98 PS 205 (308 hp). The pulls are very different. I don't know if I prefer one over the other. I would categorize mine as a smoother hole shot. His has more bite. In either case, I'm up before the wake gets there. I've never run his boat through a course, but it would probably do fine getting up to speed. My boat can hit whatever speed you like well before reaching the 55m gates. Both boats at (1:1) will feel the pull of a skier, but its nothing that cannot be compensated for.

In the end, I don't know if I'm convinced that the newer boats need all that extra power, but the fact is that they have it, and I don't here anyone complaining about it, anymore than you or I would complain about our sub-300 hp boats. They do the job just fine for what we're using them for.

MasterCrafting
09-07-2004, 10:47 PM
So So True