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View Full Version : Help me sell my bro an MC


JBaker
07-24-2007, 03:27 PM
My little brother is about ready to buy his first new boat (currently owns a mid ‘90s American Skier.) He had been debating between the Tige 24Ve and an X-45, but lately he is damn near sold on the Tige. I tell him how much I love my MC (and he does too) but he is not easily convinced as he is one of those guys who researches to no end before making even a minor purchase.

He will use the boat pretty much exclusively for wakeboarding and partying (with around 6-10 people.) Can you guys give me some ammo to throw at him? I have no on-water experience with a Tige but he is just in love with this TAPS system. I would really like to add another MC to the family so please HELP!

03 35th Anniversary
07-24-2007, 03:35 PM
Tell your bro to have the Tige Dealer and The MasterCraft Dealer meet at the same lake at the sametime. This away he can ride behind both of them drive and see them both sitting in the water next to each other. The MC can easliy sell its self at that point. He will beable to see the differences plain as day, and better quailty when he starts digging around in the 2 of them.

djhuff
07-24-2007, 03:37 PM
^Good point, then tell him to go and look at some 2-3 yr old Tige boats, then some 2-3 old MCs. See which one holds up better.

KnoxX2
07-24-2007, 03:43 PM
Also resale value will play a factor. MC will hold up better.

What is the TAPS system?

03 35th Anniversary
07-24-2007, 03:44 PM
Remember.........When you buy a skiboat you get what you pay for.

You buy the cheapest you get the cheapest...........(Tige, Moomba,Centerion, ect....)

BrianM
07-24-2007, 03:44 PM
then tell him to go and look at some 2-3 yr old Tige boats, then some 2-3 old MCs. See which one holds up better.
This is about the smartest thing anyone can do when researching boats. go look at some used ones. 2-3 years old and 8-10 years old. Then look at the depreciation on each of those compaed to new and decide which one you want to own.

dmayer84
07-24-2007, 03:44 PM
I think it is similar to the wedge on the bu's

endl
07-24-2007, 03:48 PM
I had to go read about the TAPS real quick.....Just a trim tab right? X-45's have the same tab just not called anything fancy. If you put the two boat side by side there is no comparison. MC weighs 700 lbs more, he will love the room the front end has. Ladder is nice for getting in and out on trailer or in the water. Tige only has bow area removable carpet. 45 comes out completely. I dont believe the tige has a ballast system and uses the plate to compensate. We love our 45......

dmayer84
07-24-2007, 03:54 PM
The one thing I dislike the most about Tiges is the dash. It is all black and I feel that it just comes up too high and restricts visibility.

fintek9
07-24-2007, 03:59 PM
Wasn't it Tiges that is affiliated with Four Winns or something like that?
If that don't do it, you got a baseball bat don't ya!
beat it in to him:rolleyes:

ttu
07-24-2007, 04:01 PM
i looked at both the x2 and the new tige zr2 and went thru them very well.

my end result was the mastercraft was very much better built and the attnention to detail was the difference between night and day.

needless to say i just bought the x2 and could not be happier.

erkoehler
07-24-2007, 04:05 PM
Where is he located? If he is local to Chicago, I'd be happy to take him out on an x-45 any day and show him why MC is the boat to buy.

mdthacker
07-24-2007, 04:08 PM
Just thinking out loud, if he really is the type of person to research a topic well, do you really have anything to worry about? There are just so many ways where a MC will shine above the Tiges...

captain planet
07-24-2007, 04:16 PM
WOW, two of these in one day....OK here goes.

I'll give you a hit list for him to compare MC to tige.

First have him take a look at the finer details in quality. You can do dips hanging from the windshield frame of a MC. Tell him to try that on a tige. The seat base of the driver seat in a tige is simply screwed into the penske board on the floor of a tige. Their hinged seats have no shocks, their ski pylons in the V-drive are lag bolted into the floor, they don't use backing plates on their hardware, they use a fiberboard floor, and their v-drive transmissions are LOUD. Tell him to look at the underside of the deck and how things are put together in a tige and then look at an MC.

If you compare their wakeboarding boats to the X-series boats they don't have standard stereo, they don't have standard cruise control, they only have 34 oz. vinyl, and their 24 foot boat has a lower capacity than the X-45.

Not the best written post I have ever made as I was bouncing between programs to get all of that, but there is a start for you.

ProTour X9
07-24-2007, 04:24 PM
WOW, two of these in one day....OK here goes.

I'll give you a hit list for him to compare MC to tige.

First have him take a look at the finer details in quality. You can do dips hanging from the windshield frame of a MC. Tell him to try that on a tige. The seat base of the driver seat in a tige is simply screwed into the penske board on the floor of a tige. Their hinged seats have no shocks, their ski pylons in the V-drive are lag bolted into the floor, they don't use backing plates on their hardware, they use a fiberboard floor, and their v-drive transmissions are LOUD. Tell him to look at the underside of the deck and how things are put together in a tige and then look at an MC.

If you compare their wakeboarding boats to the X-series boats they don't have standard stereo, they don't have standard cruise control, they only have 34 oz. vinyl, and their 24 foot boat has a lower capacity than the X-45.

Not the best written post I have ever made as I was bouncing between programs to get all of that, but there is a start for you.


I thought it was very well written.

endl
07-24-2007, 04:30 PM
WOW, two of these in one day....OK here goes.

I'll give you a hit list for him to compare MC to tige.

First have him take a look at the finer details in quality. You can do dips hanging from the windshield frame of a MC. Tell him to try that on a tige. The seat base of the driver seat in a tige is simply screwed into the penske board on the floor of a tige. Their hinged seats have no shocks, their ski pylons in the V-drive are lag bolted into the floor, they don't use backing plates on their hardware, they use a fiberboard floor, and their v-drive transmissions are LOUD. Tell him to look at the underside of the deck and how things are put together in a tige and then look at an MC.

If you compare their wakeboarding boats to the X-series boats they don't have standard stereo, they don't have standard cruise control, they only have 34 oz. vinyl, and their 24 foot boat has a lower capacity than the X-45.

Not the best written post I have ever made as I was bouncing between programs to get all of that, but there is a start for you.
Yeah! what he said.....

03 35th Anniversary
07-24-2007, 04:31 PM
WOW, two of these in one day....OK here goes.

I'll give you a hit list for him to compare MC to tige.

First have him take a look at the finer details in quality. You can do dips hanging from the windshield frame of a MC. Tell him to try that on a tige. The seat base of the driver seat in a tige is simply screwed into the penske board on the floor of a tige. Their hinged seats have no shocks, their ski pylons in the V-drive are lag bolted into the floor, they don't use backing plates on their hardware, they use a fiberboard floor, and their v-drive transmissions are LOUD. Tell him to look at the underside of the deck and how things are put together in a tige and then look at an MC.

If you compare their wakeboarding boats to the X-series boats they don't have standard stereo, they don't have standard cruise control, they only have 34 oz. vinyl, and their 24 foot boat has a lower capacity than the X-45.

Not the best written post I have ever made as I was bouncing between programs to get all of that, but there is a start for you.

And thats just for starters!!!!!!!!!!:mad: :D

mccobmd
07-24-2007, 04:33 PM
I looke at Tige when I was shopping for my X1. The problem with the TAPS which is a glorified trim tab is it can shape the wake, but the hull and weight form the wake. I would also echo the quality. Have him compare the vinyl quality and the tolerances for fit. It was attention to detail that sold me.

ttu
07-24-2007, 04:34 PM
sorry forgot.

tige does not offer perfect pass. it was some weird system that you could not preset. something similiar to cruise.

cbryan70
07-24-2007, 04:41 PM
Ok my buddy owns a tige. There hull is warped and their dash window falls through going to the bow of the boat. Look at tige's warrenty.....they have never "had to" replace a boat due to defective hull. My buddy has had other marines look at the boat and they all say the same thing that the hull is warped but tige still has not done anything to solve this issue. When buying the boat like others have said look at past experiences of other customers and their problems. Who has handled them the best, who stands behind their products and warranty's?

Sodar
07-24-2007, 05:13 PM
We bought a new 1997 Tige pre2001. We had sooooo many problems with it that we ended up selling it after 4 months. The windshield on our was also a big problem, as well as a bad fuel tank, faulty wiring, and TONS of spidercracking (hopefully someone bought the factory a countersinking bit, to stop the spidering on all factory mounted hardware). The biggest kicker though, was our shaft alignment and oil pan. The motor mounts were set sooooo low, that a bolt coming through the bottom of the hull, punctured the oil pan and put 6 quarts of oil in the bilge. I HATED that boat. Hopefully, Tige has started to get things right, cause they seem to sell a lot of boats and have a HUGE market share here on the Left side of the country!!

KnoxX2
07-24-2007, 05:17 PM
Funny thing is that I here alot of people talk about price and by the time you option out these other boats brands you could have gotten a good MC for the same price..... Just my 2 cents

endl
07-24-2007, 05:18 PM
Hey Sodar you lefties have a lot of BU's out there also huh!

KnoxX2
07-24-2007, 05:18 PM
There is a BU factory in Ca.

endl
07-24-2007, 05:24 PM
There is a BU factory in Ca.
Not what I meant.....

Sodar
07-24-2007, 05:30 PM
Hey Sodar you lefties have a lot of BU's out there also huh!

Yeah, Bu's are big too. I would honestly say though, that Nautique has a pretty good hold on the market. Their SAN 210, AN 210 and SV 211 are seen very often. I think the local dealer also has a lot to do with it... he is pretty good from what I hear.

If I could give a market share rating to So Cal/Colorado River Area it would go like this.

25%- Nautique
20%- Malibu
20%- Tige
15%- MasterCraft
15%- Centurion/Other Price-Point Boats

This is by no means an accurate depiction, just my personal observation

Set
07-24-2007, 05:39 PM
I just bought a 2005 Prostar 197 with 1340 Hrs on it and it drives and handles better than any boat I've ever had.Everything is still tight on it and you know what they say "Tight is allright".I'm sold on them and if the boat he's about to buy isn't a MC his next one will be.


Good Luck
SET

M-Funf
07-24-2007, 05:42 PM
I say keep the American Skier until he can decide. If I remember correctly, they have a flat wake and ski well...mid 80's...Old School Cool :cool:

JBaker
07-24-2007, 06:07 PM
I am going to give him a call tonight (he lives out in AZ, I’m in St. Louis.) He is really not concerned with any price difference. I have already talked him blue in the face about quality, but he has toured both plants and swears Tige is a better built, more heavy-duty boat (that may be were I when I needed the baseball bat.) I used the 8-10 year old boat barometer before I purchased my MC (less than a year ago), but he refutes that for Tige because their new plant has only been open a couple years and there they “build ‘em like tanks.” It is funny that Captain mentions the windshield because this is the main point where he finds the Tige superior. He thinks the MC windshield feels a bit cheap.

So here’s what I got:

-Resale value
-Obstructive black dash (I totally agree with this)
-Perfect Pass
-Fiberboard floor
-Quality vinyl
-Removable carpet
-Stereo

Anything else? Thanks again.

Sodar
07-24-2007, 06:10 PM
I am going to give him a call tonight (he lives out in AZ, I’m in St. Louis.) He is really not concerned with any price difference. I have already talked him blue in the face about quality, but he has toured both plants and swears Tige is a better built, more heavy-duty boat (that may be were I when I needed the baseball bat.) I used the 8-10 year old boat barometer before I purchased my MC (less than a year ago), but he refutes that for Tige because their new plant has only been open a couple years and there they “build ‘em like tanks.” It is funny that Captain mentions the windshield because this is the main point where he finds the Tige superior. He thinks the MC windshield feels a bit cheap.

So here’s what I got:

-Resale value
-Obstructive black dash (I totally agree with this)
-Perfect Pass
-Fiberboard floor
-Quality vinyl
-Removable carpet
-Stereo

Anything else? Thanks again.

If he is in Arizona, than MasterCraft Boats of Arizona should be a selling point right there... they are world class.

ttu
07-24-2007, 06:12 PM
I am going to give him a call tonight (he lives out in AZ, I’m in St. Louis.) He is really not concerned with any price difference. I have already talked him blue in the face about quality, but he has toured both plants and swears Tige is a better built, more heavy-duty boat (that may be were I when I needed the baseball bat.) I used the 8-10 year old boat barometer before I purchased my MC (less than a year ago), but he refutes that for Tige because their new plant has only been open a couple years and there they “build ‘em like tanks.” It is funny that Captain mentions the windshield because this is the main point where he finds the Tige superior. He thinks the MC windshield feels a bit cheap.

So here’s what I got:

-Resale value
-Obstructive black dash (I totally agree with this)
-Perfect Pass
-Fiberboard floor
-Quality vinyl
-Removable carpet
-Stereo

Anything else? Thanks again.

going back to my time between the x2 and the rz2 i also do recall the swivel racks sucked along with the operation of the tower bimini

Ryan27r
07-24-2007, 06:19 PM
Also resale value will play a factor. MC will hold up better.

What is the TAPS system?
It is a trim plate that Tige says will replace the need for ballast. It does not it just shapes the wake like the trime tab on any other boat.

JBaker
07-24-2007, 06:19 PM
If he is in Arizona, than MasterCraft Boats of Arizona should be a selling point right there... they are world class.

Where is that? He lives around Flagstaff, but does most of his boating on Lake Powell. He checked out the X-45 at Utah Watersports (he says they have multiple in stock that he likes the colors of.)

Thanks TTU, I will mention the racks and bimini.

endl
07-24-2007, 06:23 PM
I am going to give him a call tonight (he lives out in AZ, I’m in St. Louis.) He is really not concerned with any price difference. I have already talked him blue in the face about quality, but he has toured both plants and swears Tige is a better built, more heavy-duty boat (that may be were I when I needed the baseball bat.) I used the 8-10 year old boat barometer before I purchased my MC (less than a year ago), but he refutes that for Tige because their new plant has only been open a couple years and there they “build ‘em like tanks.” It is funny that Captain mentions the windshield because this is the main point where he finds the Tige superior. He thinks the MC windshield feels a bit cheap.

So here’s what I got:

-Resale value
-Obstructive black dash (I totally agree with this)
-Perfect Pass
-Fiberboard floor
-Quality vinyl
-Removable carpet
-Stereo

Anything else? Thanks again.
Front bow room
Ladder
Removable ski pylon
Real Ballast Tanks
2 Coolers
700 lbs of love

Ryan27r
07-24-2007, 06:24 PM
Yeah, Bu's are big too. I would honestly say though, that Nautique has a pretty good hold on the market. Their SAN 210, AN 210 and SV 211 are seen very often. I think the local dealer also has a lot to do with it... he is pretty good from what I hear.

If I could give a market share rating to So Cal/Colorado River Area it would go like this.

25%- Nautique
20%- Malibu
20%- Tige
15%- MasterCraft
15%- Centurion/Other Price-Point Boats

This is by no means an accurate depiction, just my personal observation
Wheres the other 5%?

Sodar
07-24-2007, 06:27 PM
MasterCraft of Arizona
2655 East Magnolia St., Ste. 100
Phoenix, AZ 85034

http://www.mastercraftaz.com/

These guys are truly great!

djhuff
07-24-2007, 06:27 PM
Sounds like he drank some of that Tige "kool-aid"

You don't just "start" making good boats because you opened a new factory. We sat in the rz2 for a while at the boat show (wasn't looking at one, but no one else was in it and we wanted to sit and take a break), and EVERYTHING felt cheap. I specifically noted all of the vinyl, and the driver's seat felt like it would break loose under my weight.

He went to the MC factory in Vonore??? That's a long way to go.

Some people you can't convince. If he's set on a Tige, just make sure you are around when he is fed up with it and wants to trade into something else, then get him the MC.

endl
07-24-2007, 06:28 PM
Wheres the other 5%?
ut oh chalk one up for the 15 year old.....

Sodar
07-24-2007, 06:28 PM
Wheres the other 5%?

Random stuff like American Skiers, Hydrodynes, Orions, WakeCrafts, etc.

KnoxX2
07-24-2007, 06:36 PM
It is a trim plate that Tige says will replace the need for ballast. It does not it just shapes the wake like the trime tab on any other boat.

If so why don't all the pros ride a Tige?

captain planet
07-24-2007, 06:42 PM
I am going to give him a call tonight (he lives out in AZ, I’m in St. Louis.) He is really not concerned with any price difference. I have already talked him blue in the face about quality, but he has toured both plants and swears Tige is a better built, more heavy-duty boat (that may be were I when I needed the baseball bat.) I used the 8-10 year old boat barometer before I purchased my MC (less than a year ago), but he refutes that for Tige because their new plant has only been open a couple years and there they “build ‘em like tanks.” It is funny that Captain mentions the windshield because this is the main point where he finds the Tige superior. He thinks the MC windshield feels a bit cheap.

So here’s what I got:

-Resale value
-Obstructive black dash (I totally agree with this)
-Perfect Pass
-Fiberboard floor
-Quality vinyl
-Removable carpet
-Stereo

Anything else? Thanks again.
No backing plates on their hardware, lag bolted ski pylons on v-drives, most of their hardward is not thru bolted, cheap vinyl.....did I mention they don't put backing plates on thier hardware? If he sees one with ballast, ask him how long it takes to fill, how many pumps they have and check out the plumbing job on the ballast system. I have seen some that been really poorly done. All things you don't want to have to try to fix when it is 90 degrees outside and the sun is shining.

Ryan27r
07-24-2007, 07:13 PM
Knox I implied that Taps is a joke they claim it replaces the need for ballast when it does not. All it does is shapes the wake like any othere wakeplate...

KnoxX2
07-24-2007, 07:16 PM
Agreed......

Ryan27r
07-24-2007, 07:35 PM
At least on two things

Roonie's
07-24-2007, 07:54 PM
Yeah, Bu's are big too. I would honestly say though, that Nautique has a pretty good hold on the market. Their SAN 210, AN 210 and SV 211 are seen very often. I think the local dealer also has a lot to do with it... he is pretty good from what I hear.

If I could give a market share rating to So Cal/Colorado River Area it would go like this.

25%- Nautique
20%- Malibu
20%- Tige
15%- MasterCraft
15%- Centurion/Other Price-Point Boats

This is by no means an accurate depiction, just my personal observation

Here is last years overall market share numbers if any one is interested.

1. Malibu (24.7%)
2. Mastercraft (19.6%)
3. Correct Craft (13.92%)
4. Moomba (9.97%)
5. Centurian (9.34%)
6. Tige (7.23%)
7. Supra (6.2%)

http://www.wakeworld.com/getarticle.asp?articleid=1015

TX.X-30 fan
07-24-2007, 08:02 PM
The one thing I dislike the most about Tiges is the dash. It is all black and I feel that it just comes up too high and restricts visibility.




Hey hey whats wrong with a black dash. :confused: :confused:



24841













:D :D

JBaker
07-24-2007, 10:10 PM
Here is last years overall market share numbers if any one is interested.

1. Malibu (24.7%)
2. Mastercraft (19.6%)
3. Correct Craft (13.92%)
4. Moomba (9.97%)
5. Centurian (9.34%)
6. Tige (7.23%)
7. Supra (6.2%)

http://www.wakeworld.com/getarticle.asp?articleid=1015

Interesting, but not very comforting being a new MC owner. Why do think Mastercraft is losing market share faster than any other manufacturer?:confused:

dmayer84
07-24-2007, 10:29 PM
Hey hey whats wrong with a black dash. :confused: :confused:

:D :D
Compare that to this and yours looks 1000 times better.

edit/ Why you would put the switches directly behind the steering wheel is beyond me.

Roonie's
07-24-2007, 11:01 PM
Interesting, but not very comforting being a new MC owner. Why do think Mastercraft is losing market share faster than any other manufacturer?:confused:

You can be a yugo and mass produce 30,000 units or you can be a Ferrari and produce 500. Not saying one boat is one or the other but you get the idea.

These were last years numbers and I think this year already they have increased some.

Ryan27r
07-24-2007, 11:40 PM
So whats the significance of the flaming banana?

dmayer84
07-24-2007, 11:42 PM
So whats the significance of the flaming banana?
:banana: Its Peanut Butter Jelly Time:banana:

JBaker
07-24-2007, 11:50 PM
Oh yes and, If you are going to ask him about how many ballast pumps he would like in his new mastercraft, ask him if he know how much it costs to replace one when one goes.

Or I could ask you if you would like some cheese with that whine...and banana.

Ryan27r
07-24-2007, 11:53 PM
Doug they hold up fine when you treat them half way decent heck. The X9 I am associated with has been abused and its pumps have held up fine albeit they had problems till the yellow impellars.

JBaker
07-24-2007, 11:55 PM
Nice, on this site if you complain about a crappy design you are a whiner. Let us ignore the fact that the design eats s***.

Create your own thread and maybe the reaction would be different. But I am trying to find reasons that the 2007 X-45 is better than a 2007 Tige 24Ve, which has nothing to do with why a 2001 X-Star didn't work out for you.

I can't imagine thread jacking for whining would be popular on any site.

Ryan27r
07-24-2007, 11:59 PM
Yea accept for the garage part that means nothing imho...

Ryan27r
07-25-2007, 12:00 AM
Cool , Im done here. I dont know a whole lot about TIGE. All I know is that, the Tige would have to suck pretty bad if it isn't better.

Have a nice evening.
You have that right and they do...

Sodar
07-25-2007, 01:49 AM
Here is last years overall market share numbers if any one is interested.

1. Malibu (24.7%)
2. Mastercraft (19.6%)
3. Correct Craft (13.92%)
4. Moomba (9.97%)
5. Centurian (9.34%)
6. Tige (7.23%)
7. Supra (6.2%)

http://www.wakeworld.com/getarticle.asp?articleid=1015

Very Interesting. Just to state my point of view again, my numbers were just a personal observation of my region. I know that in other regions, MC's are the dominent boat. I think dealer support comes to the surface more than boat quality. If I was to by an MC which had crappy dealer support or the dealer was 100 miles away, as opposed to purchasing a Bu' that had a dealer 3 blocks from my house and had awesome support, I am sorry to say it, but a Bu' would be sitting at my dock!

Sodar
07-25-2007, 01:51 AM
Hey hey whats wrong with a black dash. :confused: :confused:



24841





Everything!!!! JEEEZUS!!!! What was the designer smokin' when they put that thing into production??

:D :D

fintek9
07-25-2007, 01:51 AM
come to think about it, I don't think i've seen only 4 Tiges on all my lake outings from fishing to skiing ever since they've come out!
What's that tell ya!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Roonie's
07-25-2007, 10:36 AM
I have rarely seen any Tige but have seen a lot of Supra and they have less market share overall. As Sodar said it all depends where your at and how many dealers around.

TMCNo1
07-25-2007, 11:02 AM
One reason black dashes were put into production is, any light colored fiberglass or vinyl material will reflect up onto the inside of the windshield and hinder your forward vision. MC started using black on the fiberglass dash/deck portion in 1987 when the introduced the new generation ProStar 190. I can lay a beige towel on the black above my '89's gauges and the inside of the windshield looks like it is fogged up from the glare, so now I have dark red towels and it doesn't glare.

jlf
07-25-2007, 11:16 AM
I think the best advice you've been given is to tell your brother to test drive both of them, ride behind both of them. Hopefully the result will be he likes the MC better. It sounds like he really has his mind made up already. Seriously the test drive is the best way to go.