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View Full Version : Help me choose my first boat... Opinions on X1...?


IXFE
02-28-2007, 04:49 AM
I'm a newbie, so first an introduction :)

I am new to boating, but I've been "shopping" for years. I've learned enough to know that I don't want an I/O, so I began looking at all the tournament tow boats. I'd like to stay on the small side (20-21 feet) so garage storage won't be a problem. I also want to keep the price down (for sure under $50k, but ideally under $40K).

Boat will be used for family outings with wife and four small kids (7, 5, 3, 1) in the Willamette River and some local lakes. We plan to wakeboard, ski, and tube. I want v-drive for the family friendly layout.

I have only test driven one boat (a Malibu Sunscape 21 LSV), but I'm looking at many others "on paper" at this point.

I saw my first X1 last year at the dealer. Don't know why but I just loved it. I think I like the idea of the narrow beam. Seems like it would make for a very nimble ride and leave room in the 2-car garage for another car.

I also like the "Mastercraft on a budget" price of $43K incl. trailer (sad that they had to raise it $3k from last year). I know you are all going to say that price is an illusion because I'll want to add options. But honestly, what's wrong with a base model? I'd feel incredibly lucky just to have a new Mastercraft. I don't really care if it doesn't have tunes. As my first boat, would I really miss anything?? Seems like it has all the basics. If I walked into the dealer and ordered the base model, could I get a discount to bring it under $40k?

The other option I'm considering is a used X1. I've also looked at the older X-Star and X-2.

Anyway, I did a search and couldn't find many posts about the X1. Is it an unpopular boat?

I appreciate your feedback :)

X-45
02-28-2007, 05:19 AM
Welcome to the TT. Your going to get a lot of help as soon as everybody wakes up. But for you price range you can get a nice MC. The X1 is a new name for a very liked hull. It was the X2 before It got a forked bow, and the original X-star and before that the 205. I think that is right. With four kids you might enjoy the forked bow. More room up front. Go talk to a dealer you might be surprised what he needs to move.:twocents:

Maristar210
02-28-2007, 06:34 AM
Welcome.

I would ask if you were going to pay for the boat or finanace it?

If you were going to finanace I would not recommend just getting the base model. Later when you decide you should have gotten perfect pass or a bimini or many other popular options you will have to ay for that in cash. Better to get a little more up front. Ask your MC dealer what otions are popular and why and how much do they cost? Look for a leftover '06 and you should be able to get a nice deal. I bought an '04 in '05and saved quite a bit. Good luck in your purchase, keep us posted with your progress.

Steve

Archimedes
02-28-2007, 09:59 AM
I have an 06 X-1 and love it. Great size, great performance, and more interior room than you think, particularly in the bow. Skis well, boards well, cruises very well, and it's easy to trailer compared to some of the bigger boats.

I would suggest at least getting the base stereo. It's not a lot of money and it really adds to the enjoyment of the boat. I'd also recommend you get the cockpit remote as well. You can do that yourself if you're minimally handy with tools. I didn't have it originally but don't think I could go without it.

If you look at a used one, make sure you understand what options are on the one you're looking at buying. The options on this boat are very pricey and just a few of them can have a big affect on the 'value' of the boat.

Prostar19
02-28-2007, 10:02 AM
I would reccomened that you get the center ballast. It is very difficult to put in afterwards and really makes a difference.

trickskier
02-28-2007, 10:19 AM
Welcome, I have an 06 X-1 and love it. Like X-45 said it is the original X-Star hull. I like the V-Drive for the extra room and storage space you gain. Two options you really need consider are board racks & a bimini top. The board racks will keep the clutter out of the boat. With small children the bimini is a most on hot days.

I have a friend (jcrosby150) that has the MariStar 200 which is the same as the X-2. I've driven both and they are both great boats. You will not go wrong with either.

Good luck on your purcahse. If you would like to discuss you can PM me and I'll give you a phone number to reach me.

east tx skier
02-28-2007, 11:09 AM
Anyway, I did a search and couldn't find many posts about the X1. Is it an unpopular boat?

I appreciate your feedback :)

Haven't read the other posts yet, but if this is repeated, it bears repeating. That hull is the best selling hull in the history of MC. 205 96 and forward, Xstar/205V (99ish), X2 (2004ish), X1 (2006). So, in a word, not an unpopular hull.

Welcome.

sand2snow22
02-28-2007, 12:12 PM
Welcome. The Sunscape 21 is quite a bit larger boat than the X1. I'm in Portland, I have an 2005 X2 and I'll send you a private message (PM).

Datdude
02-28-2007, 12:16 PM
Get a radio.....................it adds a lot to the enjoyment of the boat........unless you are anti-music;)

Gozar
02-28-2007, 12:24 PM
I looked at the X1, X9, X15 and the X2.

It came down between the X15 and the X2. The X2 won due to garage limitations and a few personal preferences.

Check with your local MC dealer. If you can carry the finance for a few years there is a "Cash Rewards" offer from MC and possibly an additional one from your dealer.

If you follow the steps exactly you can receive up to 20k in rebates after 3 years.

(remember that it will be considered taxable income though)

I was able to get my MC dealer to come down 9k off of list for a fully optioned out (minus seat heater and shower) plus 20k in Cash Rewards putting my total investment after tax, fees and six year full warranty around 52k.

:cool:

P-hat_in_Cincy
02-28-2007, 02:20 PM
the Prostar 205V hull (1st X-Star, then X2, now X1) is great! We found out how much we loved the hull a couple years into owning our '02 X10. We have never looked back, although the X10 was a great I/O-to-inboard transition boat for us.

Our 205V was pretty basic sitting on the showroom floor, but we added some 'musts'....tower with racks, driver stereo remote, bimini, PP, and tower mirror arm. Other than that, I added (meaning I did the work) additional stereo components (2 amps and 1 sub) and fully automated ballast. Ballast addition is actually pretty straight forward if you have the confidence to do it.

Obviously you need to select the boat that works best for your situation, but it sounds like you are focusing in on (arguably) one of the original and still highly regarded wakeboard hulls out there.

Good luck!

Harvey
02-28-2007, 05:12 PM
I have owned a 1996 205 DD, a 2001 Xstar, and an 06 X1. I am addicted to the hull. If you go with it you will not regret it.

As mentioned if you are financing it go with a couple options that will make your boating experience better. The center ballast is key as are the bimini and board racks. Trust me you will regret not having the racks. You can live without the dual axle trailer, the sub amp combo, factory stereo, perfect pass (unless you like staying married), the larger motor, pop up cleats, etc. But tripping over boards and skis laying all over the boat will make boating a not so fun experience.

You can add a much better stereo than the factory for less money if you are at all stereo savy or have it put in with the components you want for the same or even less. I loaded my 2006 X1 up with almost everything (didn't get the heater or shower) and I paid just over 50K in prime spring buying season 2006.

sand2snow22
02-28-2007, 05:15 PM
IXFE, here is a picture you requested......

http://i77.photobucket.com/albums/j55/bryanmclean18/DSC02149-1.jpg

IXFE
02-28-2007, 07:25 PM
Great responses! This is very helpful. Lots of follow-up questions below.

I would ask if you were going to pay for the boat or finance it? If you were going to finance I would not recommend just getting the base model.


Yes, I am planning on financing through my credit union. They offer 7.25% for 12 - 20 year boat loans. Is that good?

Good reminder about getting key options up front. I never seem to have mod money laying around after the fact. :(

Check with your local MC dealer. If you can carry the finance for a few years there is a "Cash Rewards" offer from MC and possibly an additional one from your dealer.

If you follow the steps exactly you can receive up to 20k in rebates after 3 years.

(remember that it will be considered taxable income though)

I was able to get my MC dealer to come down 9k off of list for a fully optioned out (minus seat heater and shower) plus 20k in Cash Rewards putting my total investment after tax, fees and six year full warranty around 52k.:cool:

Good to know that dealers can come down that much from list price.

I have heard about this 3 year rebate program. Sounds sketchy to me. What happens if I miss the postmark date by two days?? I miss out on 20 grand?? Can you elaborate on what these steps are that you speak of? Also, why would Mastercraft offer such a silly promotion? These are not cell phones afterall.

If I add up all the options you guys listed as very important, this boat starts to feel pretty loaded. :o


Bimini - I can see why this is important with kids
Perfect Pass - What's the difference between this and cruise control?
Base stereo - The kind of music my kids might want to listen to is not the kind I want to blast for all fellow boaters to hear (Hillary Duff anyone??)
Cockpit remote - I assume this means the radio is in the glove box on the other side of the boat.
Center ballast - We are beginners so I'm not sure this is necessary. But I admit it would be nice, if for no other reason than resale value. Does the center ballast help the boat plane faster??
Board racks - I agree here.
Tower mirror arm - How is the mirror normally attached? Why is this better?


Options mentioned as not neccessary:


Dual axle trailer - I will be pulling with a 2006 Honda Odyssey (I know, I know). I'm inclined to go single axle to keep the weight to a minimum (dual axle weighs 180lbs. more), but doesn't the dual axle reduce tongue weight? This could be important when driving up a wet ramp with a FWD V6. Thoughts on this??
350hp motor - Big motors are always tempting; however, the hp/weight ratio with the 310hp motor is already very good compared to other 21 foot tow boats (mainly due to the X1's relatively light weight). Is the extra 40hp noticeable? Is the boat underpowered with the 310hp?
Pop up cleats - How can you tie up the boat without them? I am surprised these are optional.


One last question (for now). Does this boat come with a storage cover?

ProTour X9
02-28-2007, 07:30 PM
Good Questions......................................... ..............:D

Gozar
02-28-2007, 07:35 PM
Good to know that dealers can come down that much from list price.

I have heard about this 3 year rebate program. Sounds sketchy to me. What happens if I miss the postmark date by two days?? I miss out on 20 grand?? Can you elaborate on what these steps are that you speak of? Also, why would Mastercraft offer such a silly promotion? These are not cell phones afterall.

You have a seven day window to send out the docs certified mail. (purchase order and a few others) Then after 3 years you have another 7 day window to send in your claim with more paperwork inlcuding a certified birth certificate. Most people procrastinate and don't realize it takes 6 weeks to get a duplicate of your birth certificate.

These promos are out there because people are freakin lazy and don't follow directions and that is what they are counting on.

My wife is a CPA and we won't miss a step. We already finished step one and it is fully documented and approved.



If I add up all the options you guys listed as very important, this boat starts to feel pretty loaded. :o


Pay it now or pay it later. :D

Maristar210
02-28-2007, 07:40 PM
Great responses! This is very helpful. Lots of follow-up questions below.



Yes, I am planning on financing through my credit union. They offer 7.25% for 12 - 20 year boat loans. Is that good?

Good reminder about getting key options up front. I never seem to have mod money laying around after the fact. :(



Good to know that dealers can come down that much from list price.

I have heard about this 3 year rebate program. Sounds sketchy to me. What happens if I miss the postmark date by two days?? I miss out on 20 grand?? Can you elaborate on what these steps are that you speak of? Also, why would Mastercraft offer such a silly promotion? These are not cell phones afterall.

If I add up all the options you guys listed as very important, this boat starts to feel pretty loaded. :o


Bimini - I can see why this is important with kids
Perfect Pass - What's the difference between this and cruise control?
Base stereo - The kind of music my kids might want to listen to is not the kind I want to blast for all fellow boaters to hear (Hillary Duff anyone??)
Cockpit remote - I assume this means the radio is in the glove box on the other side of the boat.
Center ballast - We are beginners so I'm not sure this is necessary. But I admit it would be nice, if for no other reason than resale value. Does the center ballast help the boat plane faster??
Board racks - I agree here.
Tower mirror arm - How is the mirror normally attached? Why is this better?


Options mentioned as not neccessary:


Dual axle trailer - I will be pulling with a 2006 Honda Odyssey (I know, I know). I'm inclined to go single axle to keep the weight to a minimum (dual axle weighs 180lbs. more), but doesn't the dual axle reduce tongue weight? This could be important when driving up a wet ramp with a FWD V6. Thoughts on this??
350hp motor - Big motors are always tempting; however, the hp/weight ratio with the 310hp motor is already very good compared to other 21 foot tow boats (mainly due to the X1's relatively light weight). Is the extra 40hp noticeable? Is the boat underpowered with the 310hp?
Pop up cleats - How can you tie up the boat without them? I am surprised these are optional.


One last question (for now). Does this boat come with a storage cover?

Okay .....

MC Cruise has historically had surging issues. I have seen this with my brother in laws X10. It slows in the corners, is way too late to sense and all of a sudden hammers the throttle. Not a big deal unless you are at the end of the line, then it really really blows. Especially if you are a beginner. Take note here if no where else.

Stereo is all about re-sale.... get the base one...

Cockpit remote? I'd skip it....

Center Ballast will help keep the bow down at lower beginner speeds. If you are a new wakeboarder you do not want to go 20 mph but the boat may plow at 15, plane at 16 and then quickly accelerate to 20 because its on plane with the throttle in the same position. Sense the need for Perfect Pass yet?

I financed mine two years ago @ 6.75% for 15 years

Dual Axle trailers are much harder to move around if you are storing them in the garage but are preferred if you are going to be trailering long distances. I don't trailer much distance at all and I have a single....


Tower mirror IMO cleans up the sight line. The other one mounts on the tower and allows a space between the top of the windshield and the top of your sight line. I'd go for that one if I were you.

Pop up cleats? Who Cares?

I have the standard 310hp motor as well. The guys that really need the bigger motor are the ones with longer boats and the ones who are serious slalom and barefoot enthusiasts. Mine rips my arms out of joint if I am not ready. 310 sounds fine for you too....


Whew ---- hope this helps

Look for a leftover X1 and amke a good deal, You'll be happy !!!

Maristar210
02-28-2007, 07:50 PM
You have a seven day window to send out the docs certified mail. (purchase order and a few others) Then after 3 years you have another 7 day window to send in your claim with more paperwork inlcuding a certified birth certificate. Most people procrastinate and don't realize it takes 6 weeks to get a duplicate of your birth certificate.

These promos are out there because people are freakin lazy and don't follow directions and that is what they are counting on.

My wife is a CPA and we won't miss a step. We already finished step one and it is fully documented and approved.



Pay it now or pay it later. :D


Gozar is this through MasterCraft?

I hate rebates and no I'm not lazy, I hate the basis behind it that a certain percentage of people will forget and this is calculated into the amount. If the rebate company decides you did not fill out any portion of the paperwork you will miss the window in which you have to get your money. I have seen this with a printer I bought from HP. Not another HP in my house.

Rebates are based upon if ou do everything right in thier opinion, not your opinion. Loss of complete control AAAAWWWHHHH

KnoxX2
02-28-2007, 08:01 PM
What Happend Maristar?

Maristar210
02-28-2007, 08:09 PM
What Happend Maristar?


Dude.... I wish I knew?

My stuff locked up ad I was trying to just get out. Somehow that allowed me to post 7 or whatever posts in two minutes. I have no clue.... sorry guys !!

trickskier
02-28-2007, 08:15 PM
Dude.... I wish I knew?

My stuff locked up ad I was trying to just get out. Somehow that allowed me to post 7 or whatever posts in two minutes. I have no clue.... sorry guys !!
Finger get stuck on the enter key????? Or was it Skidog's Peacock pecking at your keyboard???

KnoxX2
02-28-2007, 08:16 PM
That was funny................. Opened to the last pg and saw all the posts and thought Maristar must have fallen asleep at the keyboard and had his finger on the send button...............LOL

Maristar210
02-28-2007, 10:04 PM
ETS or B Campe

Thank for dumping the stupid duplicate posts. Sorry for that - thanks


Steve

Gozar
02-28-2007, 10:52 PM
Gozar is this through MasterCraft?

I hate rebates and no I'm not lazy, I hate the basis behind it that a certain percentage of people will forget and this is calculated into the amount. If the rebate company decides you did not fill out any portion of the paperwork you will miss the window in which you have to get your money. I have seen this with a printer I bought from HP. Not another HP in my house.

Rebates are based upon if ou do everything right in thier opinion, not your opinion. Loss of complete control AAAAWWWHHHH

I received 10k through MC and 10k from my dealer. I too hate rebates. You have to make sure you don't screw up but being given 20,000 reasons not to is a great motivator. :D

That and my wife is a CPA who quit work to stay home with the kids so she is making sure it is perfect.

IXFE
02-28-2007, 11:13 PM
I received 10k through MC and 10k from my dealer.

You already received the cash?? I thought you had to wait three years and your MC is a 2007 model. How's that work?

Gozar
02-28-2007, 11:28 PM
You already received the cash?? I thought you had to wait three years and your MC is a 2007 model. How's that work?

No, not yet. You have to wait 36 months.

Thus, two negatives.

You have to float the 20k for three years and the 20k will be considered taxable income. (This is not available in all states)

Not doing it is like throwing away money though. It isn't that hard.

Also, I refuse to pay retail/list for anything. I don't expect the dealer to eat a loss but I will not contribute to a house in Hawaii. :D

JR34
03-01-2007, 12:52 AM
ok can someone please educate me on this $20,000 rebate you guys are talking about. Is it a current promo? Only on certain models and if so which ones? This is the first I have read on this so would appreciate any info you guys have.

Thanks

Gozar
03-01-2007, 01:08 AM
ok can someone please educate me on this $20,000 rebate you guys are talking about. Is it a current promo? Only on certain models and if so which ones? This is the first I have read on this so would appreciate any info you guys have.

Thanks

http://www.cashrewardsinc.com

It is offered in Washington.

SaltwaterMC
03-01-2007, 01:41 AM
I would say go for the bimini, I think you will really be glad you have one in the summer time. Definitely do the base stereo, I think you'll be glad you did. As someone said earlier, I think it would be wise to do the center ballast tank as you may not find it a huge plus now, but as you and your kids progress in wake sports I think everyone will be wishing they had it, and it is virtually impossible to install one after the fact. I would certainly add board racks, I would STRONGLY recommend the rotating ones as they are not only convenient in the fact that they do swivel and clamp down the boards (instead of using a bungee), but in my opinion make the boat look soooo much better. As far as the tower mirror, I have one and certainly think you could get by without it. The only other option I would want to consider would be PerfectPass. While I know it is an expensive accessory, the performance it offers while towing is priceless to me. Driver is happy because they don't have to worry about constantly maintaining speed and the rider is happy because they are locked in to his or her desired speed. In reality though it's your boat and you know what options would be best suited for you and your family's needs, but I hope this helps give you some guidance!

sand2snow22
03-01-2007, 01:42 AM
ok can someone please educate me on this $20,000 rebate you guys are talking about. Is it a current promo? Only on certain models and if so which ones? This is the first I have read on this so would appreciate any info you guys have.

Thanks

Offered through some dealers. Nothings free, the cost of it is added on top of the boat. Do a search it's been discussed on here frequently.

sand2snow22
03-01-2007, 01:46 AM
I would STRONGLY recommend the rotating ones as they are not only convenient in the fact that they do swivel and clamp down the boards (instead of using a bungee)

I couldn't agree more, they're the best in the business and you can put surfboards in them!! IMO they help the value of your boat, but what do I know?

Gozar
03-01-2007, 12:55 PM
Offered through some dealers. Nothings free, the cost of it is added on top of the boat. Do a search it's been discussed on here frequently.

Not true unless you allow it to happen that way.

I received 9k off of list price plus the rewards. Are you suggesting I could have received 29k off of list?

Harvey
03-01-2007, 01:04 PM
Yes, I am planning on financing through my credit union. They offer 7.25% for 12 - 20 year boat loans. Is that good?
Yeah that's pretty good


Perfect Pass - What's the difference between this and cruise control?
There is a difference but for a recreational boater there is not much. The mastercraft cruise will surge some but if the driver is paying attention they can correct it.


Center ballast - We are beginners so I'm not sure this is necessary. But I admit it would be nice, if for no other reason than resale value. Does the center ballast help the boat plane faster??
The center ballast will help the boat plane faster but only if you fill the back tanks. I have seen the center ballast help the slalom wake a little as well.


Tower mirror arm - How is the mirror normally attached? Why is this better?
It is normally attached to the windshield behind the passenger, which means they will smack their head on it and you will have to have Xray vision to see through their head. The tower attachement is nice because it moves the mirror up and in front of you like a true rear view mirror.


Dual axle trailer - I will be pulling with a 2006 Honda Odyssey (I know, I know). I'm inclined to go single axle to keep the weight to a minimum (dual axle weighs 180lbs. more), but doesn't the dual axle reduce tongue weight? This could be important when driving up a wet ramp with a FWD V6. Thoughts on this??
I WOULD BUY A BIGGER VEHICLE TO TOW WITH unless you are only towing it short distances.


350hp motor - Big motors are always tempting; however, the hp/weight ratio with the 310hp motor is already very good compared to other 21 foot tow boats (mainly due to the X1's relatively light weight). Is the extra 40hp noticeable? Is the boat underpowered with the 310hp?
The extra is noticeable but not at the end of the rope. I load my boat with over 2K in ballast so I really use it. I had the 310 on my 01 Xstar and truth be told it worked well up to 1200 lbs ballast and 5 people in the boat before I started to notice it having difficulty planeing.


Pop up cleats - How can you tie up the boat without them? I am surprised these are optional.
Who ties up? We are too busy skiing/wakeboarding!!!!


One last question (for now). Does this boat come with a storage cover?
If you buy it then it comes with it. I think the X1 $43K price includes the cover. The MC cover is AWESOME. Great fit and keeps the water out.

P-hat_in_Cincy
03-01-2007, 01:16 PM
My opinion...
On both MC's I've owned I have had the 310 engine and I am perfectly fine with them. The only thing I'd suggest is getting a prop that suits your needs. Adding all the ballast I have, I re-propped the 205V and it's a rocket ship out of the hole (sacrificed some top end). Eric @ OJ Props can help you when/if you get that far.

sand2snow22
03-01-2007, 01:41 PM
Not true unless you allow it to happen that way.

I received 9k off of list price plus the rewards. Are you suggesting I could have received 29k off of list?

All I'm saying is that you can't expect to receive $20k in rebates for free, I don't know how much they cost, but they cost someone something. My guess is that they cost the dealer $1-3k, the dealer then puts that cost on top of the price of the boat. I could be wrong?

Jesus_Freak
03-01-2007, 02:18 PM
I WOULD BUY A BIGGER VEHICLE TO TOW WITH unless you are only towing it short distances.

I vote that you are OK with the Odyssey. That is partially because I have been using a minivan to tow boats for 10 years, and partially because I would disagree with whatever Harvey says. :D 8p (J/K)

Archimedes
03-01-2007, 04:25 PM
http://www.cashrewardsinc.com

It is offered in Washington.

That ad reads like those old 'Change Bank' commercials on SNL.

How would this work? MC gives them the present value of $20k and then three years down the road this program gives the customer the $20k. Am I the only one who doesn't understand how this makes any sense? Sure this isn't ponzischeme.com?

Gozar
03-01-2007, 04:31 PM
That ad reads like those old 'Change Bank' commercials on SNL.

How would this work? MC gives them the present value of $20k and then three years down the road this program gives the customer the $20k. Am I the only one who doesn't understand how this makes any sense? Sure this isn't ponzischeme.com?

I will let you know in 3 years.

I don't bank on anything until it is in my account.

I can say this...it is legit according to the CA State's Attorney office.

Same in Washington.

Look at it this way. Most of these type of rebates wind up with less than 50% of the people going back for them.

Safely invested money grows at least 7% a year. Do the math and you can see that after 3 years even the fractional investment from MC invested plus the lack of 100% redemption turns into a fine business for someone with no risk to the manufacturer.

JR34
03-01-2007, 05:01 PM
so you walk into MC dealer..negotiate price as usual. then after all that is buttoned up in 3 yrs (assuming you follow all steps) you get a $20,000 check? So for a Prostar 197 you pay say $5k off list (whatever that is - say $50K. So pay $45K at time of sale and then $20 K back later so into the boat for $25K? I have no idea if these #s are off but

That seems too good to be true - the only catch is timing of the paperwork you need to fill out?

Gozar
03-01-2007, 05:29 PM
so you walk into MC dealer..negotiate price as usual. then after all that is buttoned up in 3 yrs (assuming you follow all steps) you get a $20,000 check? So for a Prostar 197 you pay say $5k off list (whatever that is - say $50K. So pay $45K at time of sale and then $20 K back later so into the boat for $25K? I have no idea if these #s are off but

That seems too good to be true - the only catch is timing of the paperwork you need to fill out?

Not all models carry 20k. Most are 10k.

The catch timing are small windows 3 years apart. One week to be exact.

When sending in the final claim you need to send in a certified copy of your Birth Certificate, a recent utility bill, the original certificate and proof of your account being current.

Most people drag azz and then realize that they don't have the paperwork they need and I can tell you that getting a birth record in seven days is almost impossible.

That is one of the ways this succeeds. People in general are lazy.

X2M
03-01-2007, 05:31 PM
Is this only available through Copes or are other dealers offering the same thing?

Archimedes
03-01-2007, 05:56 PM
Safely invested money grows at least 7% a year. Do the math and you can see that after 3 years even the fractional investment from MC invested plus the lack of 100% redemption turns into a fine business for someone with no risk to the manufacturer.

Except if you read their website, it says that they don't keep the unclaimed money; they donate it to charity.

The present value of $20k at 7% interest is $16,325 and that would assume zero cost of managing the program. I still don't understand how any of this makes sense financially. You can't tell me MC sells a $60,000 X-2 and then just hands $16k+ of it back to the customer.

Gozar
03-01-2007, 06:00 PM
Is this only available through Copes or are other dealers offering the same thing?

Cope and others. ;)

erkoehler
03-01-2007, 06:00 PM
On an X1, PS190, PS197, X7, 214, X14 you are eligible for $5,000 after 36 months.

On a MS200, X2, MS215, X15 you are eligible for $10,000 after 36 months.

On a MS230, X30, MS245, X45, Xstar, PWT Xstar you are eligible for $15,000 after 36 months.

On a MS280, X80 you are eligible for $20,000 after 36 months.

The payout is not gauranteed even if you meet all the deadlines. However, there has only been one instance where 100% wasn't paid, and in that case they paid out 87%.

erkoehler
03-01-2007, 06:02 PM
Is this only available through Copes or are other dealers offering the same thing?


Most dealers seem to be offering the program, but not all. It was a incentive that the dealers could choose to participate in if they wanted to :)

Gozar
03-01-2007, 06:10 PM
Except if you read their website, it says that they don't keep the unclaimed money; they donate it to charity.

The present value of $20k at 7% interest is $16,325 and that would assume zero cost of managing the program. I still don't understand how any of this makes sense financially. You can't tell me MC sells a $60,000 X-2 and then just hands $16k+ of it back to the customer.

I don't claim to entirely understand the business model.

What I can say is that the escrow account grows to cover costs since the dealers and manufacturers are not putting in 1 for 1 dollars they needs to in order to cover 100% redemption.

My wife is a CPA and she went over this program with a fine tooth comb even calling the State's AG office.

Gozar
03-01-2007, 06:13 PM
The payout is not guaranteed even if you meet all the deadlines. However, there has only been one instance where 100% wasn't paid, and in that case they paid out 87%.

That is exactly what we were told.

Nothing is guaranteed but I wasn't gonna ignore the fact that the possibility to recover another 20k in 3 years on top of a good discount to begin with.

cmack
03-02-2007, 09:22 AM
We just purchased our X-1.
Here is a run down of what our boat included (to start) for 47K:
MCX Engine (If we had ordered the boat, we would have gone with the RTP)
Bimini Top
Stero CD w/4 Speakers
Tower Mirror Attachment
Tower Cover

These are the items we added:
Depth Guage $400 option but Dealer took care of that.
Cleats $200 per Pair (you have to add them if you want them)
Upgraded Racks $1200
Tower speakers w/lights $1700 (I opted out of the amp and install fees because they wanted too much for that)

I did not get the keel balast. My wife skis, we will keep that space open for storage until/if she learns to wakeboard.

We also got the Cash Reward option of 5K. I hope to not find that there is a 20k Cash Reward on the X-1. I believe the $ amount goes up with the price tag on the boat.

Personally, I needed the cleats. We are always Loading and unloading friends, dogs, in-laws.
I thought I read in here someone who added the center ballast after the fact?

All in all we feel like we got a good deal on the boat. Buying the X-1 does feel like being nickel and dimed to death. I think the dealer saw our *** expression when he said the depth guage was an option.

cmack
03-02-2007, 11:48 AM
So now I was worried about the choice to not upgrade to perfect pass. I called PP and asked about the install for the X1:
Per PP:
They said the install is 30mins -- All Plug and Play. They X1 is pre wired for PP so you only have to plug in the module. The price for the kit for X1 is 900.00.
This is a fine option for me, I will try the MC Cruise and will add the PP later if needed.

CottagerGreg
03-02-2007, 07:20 PM
Congratulations on your puchase!!

you wil love your new X-1


what colour did you get by chance? pictures?

KnoxX2
03-02-2007, 07:30 PM
Congrats on the new boat cmack.........

Hoosier Bob
03-02-2007, 07:40 PM
Very cool reading through this thread! Now post some pics of the new ride!

Leroy
03-02-2007, 10:28 PM
ERK; What does it cost to get a $10k policy for the dealer? $1500?

If you can read that site and feel good about this program good luck.

The money invested by your sponsor to fund the program must 'mature' prior to being available for redemption.


Most dealers seem to be offering the program, but not all. It was a incentive that the dealers could choose to participate in if they wanted to :)

Gozar
03-02-2007, 11:15 PM
So what? If I get the 20k great. If not, I am out zero, nothing, nada.

If I do get it then not only did I get my boat for 9k under list but I got another 20k off of that!

For me it is a win/win.

ERK; What does it cost to get a $10k policy for the dealer? $1500?

If you can read that site and feel good about this program good luck.

The money invested by your sponsor to fund the program must 'mature' prior to being available for redemption.

Hoosier Bob
03-02-2007, 11:27 PM
If the policy is insured and not bonded you only have to lose the dealer dropping the boat's cost by the policy amount. If you can fulfill the qualifications and are somewhat organized why not take the risk. My only issue is bonded policies only cover the cost and if they are off target that is what you will recieve after the usual court/attorney and what have you costs. The insured poilicy will cover in the event of a miscalculation or a catostrophic event such as excessive claims.:confused: So what? If I get the 20k great. If not, I am out zero, nothing, nada.

If I do get it then not only did I get my boat for 9k under list but I got another 20k off of that!

For me it is a win/win.

Leroy
03-02-2007, 11:41 PM
If you are happy great, but it is costing you. You should be getting what the dealer is paying for this promotion. I wonder how long this promotion has been out. I've only heard of it for 3-4 months. Financially it acts like a pyramid scheme. From what I saw the money going in is only enough to enable a small fraction of the people to receive the money.

So what? If I get the 20k great. If not, I am out zero, nothing, nada.

If I do get it then not only did I get my boat for 9k under list but I got another 20k off of that!

For me it is a win/win.

Gozar
03-03-2007, 01:25 AM
Like I said, I shopped the price with several dealers in my area.

I got 9k off of list. The next best I could find 2 hours away was 7k off.

If everyone else out there is getting much better deals I would love to hear about them. :D

I think I am willing to gamble the $1500 or $3000 to see if I get the 20k.

Also, you think MC would put the reputation on the line for a pyramid scheme? Really? I think their legal team might have something to say about that.

TX.X-30 fan
03-03-2007, 02:09 AM
You would have to be a total dip-shi$ to think this stuff works.

Leroy
03-03-2007, 07:53 AM
It is a local dealer decision and I do find this program offensive. If I were offered this I would walk out on the deal. But that's just me.

Sounds like you have the best deal there and I do wish you the best and hope you get your money, but that will be between you and the Independent Third Party Administrator for Cash Rewards.

atlfootr
03-03-2007, 08:06 AM
I'm a newbie, so first an introduction :)
I saw my first X1 last year at the dealer. Don't know why but I just loved it.
I like the "Mastercraft, I'd feel incredibly lucky just to have a new Mastercraft.
I'm considering a used X1. I've also looked at the older X-Star and X-2.

Anyway, I did a search and couldn't find many posts about the X1. Is it an unpopular boat?
I appreciate your feedback :)First and foremost welcome aboard, for honest information seek out "Trickskier".
Since he owns one, he's the one to tell YOU everything you want and need to know regarding the X1.

JohnnyB
03-03-2007, 08:34 AM
I looked at the X1, X9, X15 and the X2.

It came down between the X15 and the X2. The X2 won due to garage limitations and a few personal preferences.

Check with your local MC dealer. If you can carry the finance for a few years there is a "Cash Rewards" offer from MC and possibly an additional one from your dealer.

If you follow the steps exactly you can receive up to 20k in rebates after 3 years.

(remember that it will be considered taxable income though)

I was able to get my MC dealer to come down 9k off of list for a fully optioned out (minus seat heater and shower) plus 20k in Cash Rewards putting my total investment after tax, fees and six year full warranty around 52k.

:cool:

Haven't read the rest of this thread yet but saw the 20K rebate after 3 years with Cash Rewards. I would bet that MC has no part of this. This is a promotion most likely put on by the individual dealer. These have not been reliable over the past several years as the companies have gone bankrupt due to lawsuits by those who didn't file their 'rebate' correctly. There is another thread discussing this.

Buyer beware....if its too good to be true, it probably is....

atlfootr
03-03-2007, 08:38 AM
Haven't read the rest of this thread yet but saw the 20K rebate after 3 years with Cash Rewards.
Buyer beware....if its too good to be true, it probably is....Speak the truth, brother.

JohnnyB
03-03-2007, 08:44 AM
Do a Yahoo search on Cashable Vouchers. This was the last company to set up a rebate program under the same pretenses. I have a friend that lost 5K on a 3yr snowmobile rebate and another who lost 10K on a boat rebate....both should've been paid out this June.

Both my buddies looked at it as a gamble and realized going in that they were overpaying on their purchase by a grand or two and realized that this was a gamble.

They both lost!!!

I'm disappointed that this type of thing is tied to MC because past ones have gone belly-up and reflect badly on the dealer and their brand as a result.

Gozar
03-03-2007, 10:33 AM
Haven't read the rest of this thread yet but saw the 20K rebate after 3 years with Cash Rewards. I would bet that MC has no part of this. This is a promotion most likely put on by the individual dealer. These have not been reliable over the past several years as the companies have gone bankrupt due to lawsuits by those who didn't file their 'rebate' correctly. There is another thread discussing this.

Buyer beware....if its too good to be true, it probably is....

Mastercraft is involved.

If you had read the thread you see that a dealer even laid it out.

I said it at least 5 times in this thread alone:

1) I received 9k off of sticker. Is everyone doing better than that? (seems to be no response to that question)
2) I don't bank on anything until I have it in my hands.
3) If it works, great if not I still have my boat.

Gozar
03-03-2007, 10:34 AM
You would have to be a total dip-shi$ to think this stuff works. Get some balls and buy a boat or not. No offence, but come on?????????????? :confused:

These things do work if managed correctly.

If you think I am a dip-shi$ then oh well. The reason they can work is because of dip-$h*ts that are too lazy to redeem.

And for your information I purchased my X2.

TX.X-30 fan
03-03-2007, 10:53 AM
Good luck with the plan. Was not calling names just despise this type of stuff. Sorry if I offended you in any way. Hope you get that MC you want you will love IT as we all love our MC's.

sand2snow22
03-03-2007, 11:58 AM
OK, Gozar, I'll bite. How much did you pay? $9k off of list doesn't tell me anything. Base list, fully loaded list? We need to know all of the options on your boat.

PendO
03-03-2007, 12:17 PM
Mastercraft is involved.

If you had read the thread you see that a dealer even laid it out.

I said it at least 5 times in this thread alone:

1) I received 9k off of sticker. Is everyone doing better than that? (seems to be no response to that question)
2) I don't bank on anything until I have it in my hands.
3) If it works, great if not I still have my boat.

Congrats on the new X-2!

MC is involved to the point that they can sell more boats if people overspend on a boat with the promise of getting part of their money back in 3 years. THE CASH REWARDS PROGRAM IS THRU A 3RD PARTY, NOT MASTERCRAFT. Not all dealers participate, as undoubtedly some are concerend with how their customers will react if they (customer) does not get to claim the cash reward.

1) 9K off sticker ... depends on the model, but that is nothing special, mine was XY+K under MSRP. (But who the hell pays MSRP? ... and different models/options likely have more profit built into the MSRP)

INTERESTING sidenote, CC does not allow their dealers to sell boats under the cash rewards program (or so I was told by a rep at the boat show) ... it is a financial transaction separate from the purchase of the boat, aside from you having to essentially lay down a bet (1500+) ... and you can collect on the bet if you follow the instructions to a T.

IMO ... cash rewards is a good option IF you are not counting on the $$ ... it is a sidebet, and the ante into the pot is added into your purchase price.

Not true unless you allow it to happen that way.

I received 9k off of list price plus the rewards. Are you suggesting I could have received 29k off of list?

Actually, you could have had 10,500 off (the 9000 they came down and the 1500 you didn't know was added in to cover the initial cost of the program)

ridehype4life
03-03-2007, 01:56 PM
You will love your new boat. congrats.

http://i36.photobucket.com/albums/e37/Vaughnwarrior09/SupafreshX1004small.jpg

Leroy
03-03-2007, 02:16 PM
I really like that boat, what color did you get Gozar? Pictures?

dapicatti
03-03-2007, 02:18 PM
Did I miss the pictures of the new X1?

Gozar
03-03-2007, 02:28 PM
I really like that boat, what color did you get Gozar? Pictures?

Pictures are in my photos. I just picked it up after getting the second battery put in. Finally in my garage for good.

To answer the other question of what list was for my boat:

Options are the following:

1) MCX
2) Tube Inflator (I know, but it was there...)
3) Mastercruise
4) 4 tower speakers with lights
5) Cocktail table
6) Bow filler cushion
7) Second battery
8) Boat cover with tower
9) Bimini
10) Depth finder
11) Tower mirror
12) Fiberglass swim platform
13) Transom remote
14) Drivers remote

List was 68,555.00 without trailer

Trailer list was $3500 or so.

Sub total $72055.00

Tax - $4880

6 year full warranty including wear/tear items $3000 (100% refundable if zero claims)

79935.00

Paid 70k OTD including fees

Gozar
03-03-2007, 02:45 PM
BTW:

Congratulations on your new X1!!!

I apologize if in any way I de-railed this thread.

I hope you and your family have years of fun and safe enjoyment! :cool:

PendO
03-03-2007, 05:34 PM
Trailer list was $3500 or so.


What manf. is the trailer, the pics of the boat are great, looks a bit different than the regular T/A MC trailers ... so can someone answer me this, when a dealer puts a new boat on a non MC trailer do they have it shipped trailerless from TN to the dealer?

Gozar
03-03-2007, 07:08 PM
What manf. is the trailer, the pics of the boat are great, looks a bit different than the regular T/A MC trailers ... so can someone answer me this, when a dealer puts a new boat on a non MC trailer do they have it shipped trailerless from TN to the dealer?

The trailer is made by Sportboat. I have no idea on the shipping though.

The trailer is very nice. It has a ton of braking. In fact, it seemed to require less braking from my truck than normal as if the trailer brakes where doing most of the work.

The mfg makes that trailer specifically for the X2. They also do other models. I was given a choice but I liked this one better overall.

PendO
03-03-2007, 07:16 PM
The mfg makes that trailer specifically for the X2. They also do other models. I was given a choice but I liked this one better overall.

Good choice, you were able to save a bit on that, and there are those who have had some issues with MC OEM trailers (bunks, calipers). I remember once when we were trading a boat in and they wanted to tell us how much (little) the used trailer was worth, and how much a new trailer cost ... we offered to put the new boat on the old trailer if tha was all it was worth:) As it turned out, the new trailer became ... shall we say, more reasonably priced:)

dougau
03-04-2007, 06:27 AM
Been the whole route with I/O and now have a 2006 X2 - can't say enough about it!!! Would give the extra room of the X2 a consideration so you will have no problems with space. We regularly have 10 people on and it doesn't feel cramped - all the kids and their friends! Look at getting as many options like stereo etc as you can 'cos the almost come "free" with a boat that is not brand new compared to buying them with a new boat.

Whichever one you buy - you will not be unhappy, I am sure of it!

Archimedes
03-04-2007, 03:46 PM
I was told by a guy who worked at 'the large regional dealership in question' that the Sportboat trailer thing is a bit of a scam run by 'the large regional dealership in question'. They market it as a better trailer and charge a $500-$1,500 premium for it over the MC trailers. Rumor is they actually buy them cheaper than the MC trailers and make a big margin on selling them. I looked them over closely and didn't like them as much as the MC trailer and I've heard the same from the tech I mentioned. He said they're a good trailer, but no better than the MC; just a better margin for the dealer.

When I was shopping for my X-1, I asked why the Sportboat trailer was more expensive and the salesman told me "the Sportboat trailer has disk brakes, unlike the MC trailer which has drums...":confused:

Archimedes
03-04-2007, 03:51 PM
Pictures are in my photos. I just picked it up after getting the second battery put in. Finally in my garage for good.

To answer the other question of what list was for my boat:

Options are the following:

1) MCX
2) Tube Inflator (I know, but it was there...)
3) Mastercruise
4) 4 tower speakers with lights
5) Cocktail table
6) Bow filler cushion
7) Second battery
8) Boat cover with tower
9) Bimini
10) Depth finder
11) Tower mirror
12) Fiberglass swim platform
13) Transom remote
14) Drivers remote

List was 68,555.00 without trailer

Trailer list was $3500 or so.

Sub total $72055.00

Tax - $4880

6 year full warranty including wear/tear items $3000 (100% refundable if zero claims)

79935.00

Paid 70k OTD including fees

Well if that is your deal, without considering the Cash Rewards ponzi thing, then that's a pretty good deal. $63k+TTL for a loaded X-2 sounds pretty good for this time of year on an 07. Dealers around here were selling their 06 X-2s with decent options for mid-high $50s last September when I bought my X-1.

I think part of what makes your deal look so good is because of the huge 2007 price increase. I've been curious about whether MC was going to be able to get anything near these new MSRPs.

Gozar
03-04-2007, 04:20 PM
I was told by a guy who worked at 'the large regional dealership in question' that the Sportboat trailer thing is a bit of a scam run by 'the large regional dealership in question'. They market it as a better trailer and charge a $500-$1,500 premium for it over the MC trailers. Rumor is they actually buy them cheaper than the MC trailers and make a big margin on selling them. I looked them over closely and didn't like them as much as the MC trailer and I've heard the same from the tech I mentioned. He said they're a good trailer, but no better than the MC; just a better margin for the dealer.

When I was shopping for my X-1, I asked why the Sportboat trailer was more expensive and the salesman told me "the Sportboat trailer has disk brakes, unlike the MC trailer which has drums...":confused:


I have no doubt that the dealer makes better margin on these trailers. I was given a choice between the two with zero cost difference to me. I liked this trailer better. I thought the welds were cleaner and the fit/finish was just as good if not better than the MC trailer.

I am sure they are very comparable.

Gozar
03-04-2007, 04:21 PM
Well if that is your deal, without considering the Cash Rewards ponzi thing, then that's a pretty good deal. $63k+TTL for a loaded X-2 sounds pretty good for this time of year on an 07. Dealers around here were selling their 06 X-2s with decent options for mid-high $50s last September when I bought my X-1.

I think part of what makes your deal look so good is because of the huge 2007 price increase. I've been curious about whether MC was going to be able to get anything near these new MSRPs.

That was our deal.

Now, IF I get the cash rewards then it will be a smoking deal. That is the way I look at it.

ironj32
04-27-2007, 01:11 PM
i just got a 2000 xstar (205v hull) this winter...it is an awesome boat. you should be able to find quite a few with this hull for under $40k. you would be VERY HAPPY with an X1.

Loffgren
04-27-2007, 05:34 PM
Get the X! !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

RexDog1
04-27-2007, 06:43 PM
I would reccomened that you get the center ballast. It is very difficult to put in afterwards and really makes a difference.


What he said^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

I have a 2005 X2 and the center ballast is a must, both for handling in the rollers,
And wake size!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!:D