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Workin' 4 Toys
02-20-2007, 11:58 AM
I am speechless......

http://www.ryanpatrickhalligan.org/

Kevin 89MC
02-20-2007, 12:10 PM
Wow. I'm so not ready for my girls to grow up. Thanks for posting that.

JimN
02-20-2007, 12:18 PM
There was coverage of his case on TV last night. His mom said she really had no idea of his dispair at all.

Kids are very good at hiding their feelings when they want to. They figure out what their parents believe and then use it to manipulate, in some cases. It can be crying excessively/getting comfort, being really good and then getting away with things because the parents will generally think "Oh, he's always been such a good boy" and anything in between and it applies to girls at least as much. More parents need to realize this and I think it's even more of a problem when the parents were older when they had the kids- it has been so long since they were kids that they can't relate well and a lot of signals are completely missed.

Sodar
02-20-2007, 12:22 PM
It is very sad and tragic that this young kid felt the only way out, was taking his own life, but bullying has been going on for ages and will continue. I was bullied a TON in grade school and high school, it took a high school transfer to get away from it, but "It is a part of life!"

3event
02-20-2007, 12:39 PM
True, bullying will happen, and we don't serve our children well by sheltering them so much that when they get out and independent they are ill-equipped.

But we sure as he!! have to be more careful as parents, with the communication tools that now exist and can take these things to a whole new level. Look at the stories of people that have been "owned" on the net - it is very very easy to do a lot of damage to someone while sitting at home in your room on the PC. I think many kids (and adults) check their ethics (if any) at the door when engaging in this kind of behavior and are able to pull off the kind of abuse they would never undertake person to person. It's so easy and the group think dynamic can snowball quickly when feedback is real-time online.

peason
02-20-2007, 12:47 PM
This really hit home:
I just went through this with my son. He was being bullied at school and even had some of his friends walk him to classes to avoid being harassed. One of his friends parents called me to let me know what had been happening. It all came to a head with the other kid confronting him physically at a recreational facility. After, speaking with the other parent I had a long discussion with my son about what had been going on- and I found out that this individual has had a grudge against my son for a long time. My son had mentioned the problem just the night before this physical confrontation and he said it was no big deal. After finding out the history of what had been going on and that this kid came after him - I immediately told him I was going to call this kid's parents and get this to stop. My son pleaded with me not to make matter's worse by calling, so I said I would think about it. The next morning my wife and I met with the school administration to discuss what was going on and they also suggested we call call the other parents. I ended up getting a hold of this kid's parents and got their side of the story - did not get much air-time to let them know what my child was going through. (no great surprise) But my main goal did get through - I wanted this to STOP! and they agreed to get thier son to put an end to it. I suggested that we all meet with the boys and they did not think that this was necessary. It has been a couple of weeks now and I check with my son every day and everything seems to have stopped. My son does very well in his studies and has a very good group of friends - I hope this has taught him that he can come to us with any of his problems. I also want him to learn to help any one else who is being bullied. It sure was a learning experience for my wife and I!

milkmania
02-20-2007, 05:25 PM
depression is some really messed up stuff!

been to the dark side only twice in my life, and the only thing that comes to mind is......

you have to ask for help!




no one knows what's going on unless you tell them.

Bruce
02-20-2007, 05:54 PM
Never take anything with kids for granted. My teenage granddaughter recently tried to take her life. But look at the person. She attends an all girl Cathloic school (soph . 10thgrade) She is gorgeous, a cheerleader, student body officer, had the lead in school play at her brothers all boys school. Devout Christian, sings at Mass etc. loved by all. Suddenly her three best friends turned on her because one of them did not get invited to a party. They thought she was responsible.(She wasn"t) For the first time in her life she is faced with rejection, and to make matter worse it came from her buddies. She wasn't equipped to handle it. Nothing meaner than a buch of teenage girls when they choose to be. Her parents never saw it coming. As her grandparents we never picked up on it. She was always loved and admired by all who knew her. Fortunately she telephoned a young friend(someone she has met on a church retreat) and he telephoned my daughter.
Thank God it has a good ending. It was awhile before she could make herself go back to school etc. but she did. She has gotten professional help and things are fine.
Just know that there is all kinds of "bullying" and it just doesn't happen to the "nerds"
I hope in some small way this sharing will somehow serve you as you go through the challenge of raising kids.

Workin' 4 Toys
02-20-2007, 08:03 PM
"It is a part of life!"You certainly have an interesting perspective.

Sodar
02-20-2007, 08:50 PM
You certainly have an interesting perspective.

I am not trying to be mean, harsh, crude or insensitive, I am just simply stating that there are people out there who are not nice to others!! It happens to the younger generations, as well as older generations. My perspective comes from years of being harrassed and bullied, you are never going to beat it, so you just got to accept as a part of life and deal with it.....

JimN
02-20-2007, 08:55 PM
A lot of bullies do it because the victim doesn't have the nerve to stand up to them. Freshman year in HS, there was a guy in my homeroom who went from being a pretty decent kid in fourth grade to being a weapons-grade A-hole. He gave a lot of people shnit and unfortunately, we were also in the same PE class. There was also a little weenie in homeroom who sat if front of me and, let's call him Bob ('cause that's what his name was). Weenie boy had Bob as his protector, for who knows what reason. They were a lot like the cartoon characters- big dumb one and little cocky one with a big hat. Anyway, weenie boy did something and I reacted to it by swatting his hand out of my face. He told Bob, Bob told me to come to him. I said no, and he told me again. The guys next to and behind me thought I was going to get the crap beat out of me. I pretty much did too but I was sick of the guy. Oh, yeah- between fourth grade and freshman year he must have spent all of his free time working with weights. That SOB was ripped and this was freshman year! Homeroom was finished and when I walked out the door, he came up and said something really lame but I never had any problems with him again.

I saw his brother and one of his friends get in a fight with the brother of a friend of mine and one of his friends- Bob was there but another friend of mine knew him too and we didn't have any trouble but if he fought like his older, much smaller brother, I wouldn't have wanted any part of it. It was ugly!

Getting back to the point, bullies are usually very insecure and have almost no self esteem. The thing that makes them happy is being able to control other kids who are usually smaller and/or weaker, one way or another. I can't imagine what Bob's home life was like for him to be that way.

Also, most of the guys who tried to throw their weight around in HS are dead now and have been for quite a while. Most, if not all, got into trouble with drugs, break-ins (one stole the service revolver of a friend's dad while he was at a party) and I don't know what else. I knew all of them and had a couple of run-ins with two others but some were actually friends of mine before they became boneheads. A lot were suicides.

milkmania
02-20-2007, 09:09 PM
I am just simply stating that there are people out there who are not nice to others!!

I will agree with that....
but, do you know why that is?

Sodar
02-20-2007, 10:44 PM
I will agree with that....
but, do you know why that is?

My own personal take on it??? Or is this a religious based answer???

My own personal take is that many of the people in this world are mean, because they have an insecurity with themselves that usually makes them very unhappy and feel that they can boost their morale, but stomping on others. In young generations, bullying is a form of social group acceptance and mob-like mentality.

Workin' 4 Toys
02-20-2007, 10:54 PM
I was a little thown by your comment Sodar......I guess I felt a little more heartwrenched by the situation. And your choice of words threw me.


To drive a young boy to suicide by bullying him over the internet and other means, I can only hope (and I use hope) this is not really "part of life"...

Sodar
02-20-2007, 11:00 PM
I was a little thown by your comment Sodar......I guess I felt a little more heartwrenched by the situation. And your choice of words threw me.


To drive a young boy to suicide by bullying him over the internet and other means, I can only hope (and I use hope) this is not really "part of life"...

No No No.... I even said that it is horrible that something would drive someone over the edge to take their own life... I was just saying that bullying is a part of life, right or wrong, it is there. I am really not a hard, insensitive person!!!!

Willski
02-20-2007, 11:40 PM
My whole take on the story is, you expected sick and twisted out of a select few adults. Kids are generally cruel, and sometimes mean to another to make themselves look better, but to actually formulate a plan to humiliate someone is a little different.

Leroy
02-21-2007, 12:40 AM
Sad story, surprisingly the parents did not call the principle or teachers at the school. We have had to deal with various forms of bullyiing and found the teachers/admin very effective at controlling situations.

THere is also an element of hands off parents and I know I'm as guilty as anyone, but we want to believe our kids can handle themselves and we are working, etc.

milkmania
02-21-2007, 01:18 AM
My own personal take on it??? Or is this a religious based answer???

My own personal take is that many of the people in this world are mean, because they have an insecurity with themselves that usually makes them very unhappy and feel that they can boost their morale, but stomping on others. In young generations, bullying is a form of social group acceptance and mob-like mentality.

good answers, but not exactly what I was thinking...
I see a lot of kids that are mean, spiteful, disrespectful.
and my opinion is that is starts in the home!

I helped give my 3rd grader's class cookies, drinks, snacks, etc. and noticed that VERY FEW said thank you. maybe 3 out of 25

Mentioned it to the teacher, and she said over the years it's seemed to have gotten worse, and she's pretty discouraged about it.

my children have been raised to never disrespect others, and one of my 11 year old daughter's pet peeve is holding the door open for someone, and that person not acknowledging her efforts! (young and old alike)
Hell! her 9 year old brother even thanks her!

trickskier
02-21-2007, 11:24 AM
good answers, but not exactly what I was thinking...
I see a lot of kids that are mean, spiteful, disrespectful.
and my opinion is that is starts in the home!

I helped give my 3rd grader's class cookies, drinks, snacks, etc. and noticed that VERY FEW said thank you. maybe 3 out of 25

Mentioned it to the teacher, and she said over the years it's seemed to have gotten worse, and she's pretty discouraged about it.

my children have been raised to never disrespect others, and one of my 11 year old daughter's pet peeve is holding the door open for someone, and that person not acknowledging her efforts! (young and old alike)
Hell! her 9 year old brother even thanks her!

This is a very tragic story...........

I agree with you Milk........It starts at home, and a lot of kids today have not been taught any manners or how to respect others. It seems that a lot parents would rather be friends with their kids instead of parents. Some may not know how to be a parent.

From day one my wife and I have taught our kids to say Yes Sir, No Sir, Yes Maam & No Maam when responding to adults. I cringe when my kids freinds respond with ah huh and yeah......But, you have to watch out for the Eddie Haskell's of the world too.....

My sister-in-law has twin boys that everyone affectionately refers to as the Tasmanian Twins. They have yet to come to my house and not break something. The last time they were at my house, they kicked a panel out of my screen door and laughed about it. Sad part is her response was boys will be boys. She offered to pay, but that's not the point, they don't respesct other people's property.

This young man had some personal problems and his parents worked hard with him to overcome them and be accepted. Unfortunately, the parents of the "Bully" didn't do their job as parents and teach him to respect others.

What the girl did was totally selfish. She probably won't realize the magnitude of what she has done until she has childern of her own and experience how much you love something that is a part of you.

JimN
02-21-2007, 11:44 AM
"It seems that a lot parents would rather be friends with their kids instead of parents."

Welcome to what happens when the parents were born in the '60s. Personally, I think a lot of the problems we see now are due to the lack of discipline and rebellion in the '60s. Everyone wanted to love everyone else and throw the rules out the window. Sure, it's nice to get a hug but those kids sure dropped the ball when you look at what the results are when they had kids of their own.

I'd like to see a comparison of who hated "The Establishment" and who became exactly that when they got older. My guess is, the majority of them.

trickskier
02-21-2007, 12:46 PM
"It seems that a lot parents would rather be friends with their kids instead of parents."

Welcome to what happens when the parents were born in the '60s. Personally, I think a lot of the problems we see now are due to the lack of discipline and rebellion in the '60s. Everyone wanted to love everyone else and throw the rules out the window. Sure, it's nice to get a hug but those kids sure dropped the ball when you look at what the results are when they had kids of their own.

I'd like to see a comparison of who hated "The Establishment" and who became exactly that when they got older. My guess is, the majority of them.
Growing up in the 60's I remember the "Revolution" My parents always treated me as an adult. However, they never treated me as friend and never had a problem with disciplinary action when necessary.........8p

Most of the time I deserved it.............:rolleyes: