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View Full Version : Homemade Fake-a-Lake


etakk7
10-24-2006, 09:14 AM
Using a number of ideas from this forum as well as lessons learned along the way in my 2000 Prostar 205V, here is my homemade fake-a-lake system. I wanted to use the "bucket" method because I have low water pressure at the hose and because I wanted to be able to suck water into the engine, so I scrapped the idea of making a Fake-a-Lake with a plunger (although I'm convinced it could be done for $5 or so).

What I ended up doing was using a ball valve (no flow restriction) screwed onto the original thru-hull intake. Running the ball valve wide open would be for normal operation, allowing the water pump to draw from the lake. Closing the ball valve allows me to "tap" into the raw water line without sending some of the water back out the bottom of the boat, also ensuring no air leakage. This picture shows what the system looks like for normal operation.

http://i32.photobucket.com/albums/d17/ektakkunen/DSCN2898.jpg

When I'm back in the driveway for winterization procedures, I close the ball valve and attach a hose to a galvanized T-fitting, so the water flows through the T-fitting and into the raw water pump.

http://i32.photobucket.com/albums/d17/ektakkunen/DSCN2893.jpg


Notice I had to cut my spa hose into two parts in order to assemble it in such a tight space. I wanted the system to be easy to assemble, yet 100% secure and airtight.

http://i32.photobucket.com/albums/d17/ektakkunen/DSCN2894.jpg

I can place a ten foot non-collapsable spa hose into a bucket next to the engine, and the suction is great for water or anti-freeze.
http://i32.photobucket.com/albums/d17/ektakkunen/DSCN2895.jpg

etakk7
10-24-2006, 09:15 AM
While I was at it, I also installed the Y-adapter for the heater to run hot at low RPM's. This involved cutting into the raw-water hose and installing the Y fitting that I bought from Wakeside for $35. I also had to cut about 5 feet off of the 5/8" return hose from the heater which previously ran into the back of the engine.
http://i32.photobucket.com/albums/d17/ektakkunen/DSCN2902.jpg
http://i32.photobucket.com/albums/d17/ektakkunen/DSCN2901.jpg


All of the installations were in "theory" and not necessarily guaranteed to work, but I can report that the boat has been lake and driveway tested extensively and the whole system works great, and I even have heat at low RPM's now.

Thought I'd share some pics if it would help anybody in the future!

sizzler
10-24-2006, 09:36 AM
pretty neat....but get those leaves outta there:D

Sodar
10-24-2006, 09:44 AM
Looks good!

etakk7
10-24-2006, 09:54 AM
I have not experienced it first hand but people say that a wet leaf and white vinyl do not mix! Luckily I did it on a dry day. Unfortunately, on October 4 at the cabin in Northern Wisconsin it's very difficult to keep leaves out of the boat! I made sure to vacuum once it was safely in the garage.

east tx skier
10-24-2006, 09:54 AM
Nice job. Will cut down on the time for sure. Make sure you have adequate water pressure at your house to keep up with the boat.

etakk7
10-24-2006, 09:57 AM
Yes, that was my concern, so I use a 5 gallon bucket, filled to the top, then start up the engine and keep the hose going into the bucket. The boat pulled in the water slightly faster than the house could pump it into the bucket, but I was able to run the boat long enough to get up to operating temp.

Leroy
10-24-2006, 10:17 AM
Nice looking install! I would like the same thing in my boat.

VTJC
10-24-2006, 01:55 PM
What size ball valve and other plumbing id you use? Where did you acquire it? Thanks, Jamie

loeweb
10-24-2006, 02:20 PM
Looks Great! I have some questions about this whole thing. Why not just disconnect the hose from the through hull intake and put it in a bucket from there? Is the ball valve necesary or is it just something else to worry about when putting the boat back in the real lake come spring? Just questions from a rookie boat owner. Like I said the setup LOOKS great.;)

dmayer84
10-24-2006, 02:22 PM
What size ball valve and other plumbing id you use? Where did you acquire it? Thanks, Jamie

I built one similar for my boat last week. Attached is the parts list of what I got, all that is not needed on there are the brass screws, and you need to get hose clamps for it, I already had those. I ordered from McMaster-Carr at noon and the parts were at my house by 4pm via UPS. I used a washing machine hose to hook up from the hose to the intake on my system, but any female to female hose will work.

etakk7
10-24-2006, 02:30 PM
I bought everything at Home Depot. I can't remember exactly what the ID of the ball valve is, but it screws onto the thru-hull water pickup fitting. Previously, the raw water intake hose was clamped onto this fitting. I know the raw water intake hose is 1 1/4 OD, and I believe 1" ID. Therefore I believe the ball valve was 1" ID. All the other plumbing should be the same.

I would take off your raw water hose from the thru-hull and measure first, since you will need it to come off anyway. That was the toughest part of the process for me, I actually had to cut mine off it was on there so well. When you have determined the ball valve size, just pick up the rest of the fittings right there in the store to make sure they fit. Also pick up some pipe thread sealer to keep things airtight.

etakk7
10-24-2006, 02:39 PM
loeweb, that was the initial plan. As it turns out, the hose was a royal, royal pain to get off of the thru-hull fitting. I had to cut the darn thing off. After getting it off, I didn't feel like I could get it on there very securely unless I screwed it on, which is very difficult to do in such a tight space with such a non-flexible hose. The way I've got it set up now there is no risk of a hose popping loose.

Beyond that, because the hose was so non-flexible and also not very long, it would not have reached a bucket. This may work in some direct drives, but not in my v-drive boat. I need a bucket both for the lack of garden hose water pressure, and to be able to suck antifreeze from a bucket.

Obviously it would be catestrophic if the ball valve were closed when I ran the boat in the lake. Although I'm confident that it could not close on it's own, I'll probably use a couple strong zip ties just to be sure.

dmayer84
10-24-2006, 03:04 PM
loeweb, that was the initial plan. As it turns out, the hose was a royal, royal pain to get off of the thru-hull fitting. I had to cut the darn thing off. After getting it off, I didn't feel like I could get it on there very securely unless I screwed it on, which is very difficult to do in such a tight space with such a non-flexible hose. The way I've got it set up now there is no risk of a hose popping loose.

Beyond that, because the hose was so non-flexible and also not very long, it would not have reached a bucket. This may work in some direct drives, but not in my v-drive boat. I need a bucket both for the lack of garden hose water pressure, and to be able to suck antifreeze from a bucket.

Obviously it would be catestrophic if the ball valve were closed when I ran the boat in the lake. Although I'm confident that it could not close on it's own, I'll probably use a couple strong zip ties just to be sure.

I installed mine inline with the hose with my vdrive. Worked great winterizing the boat and I can also hook the garden hose directly up to it.

loeweb
10-24-2006, 03:17 PM
does it matter if the fake a lake is hooked up before or after the tranny cooler? I know on my '88 the hose is so short from the intake to the cooler that it wouldn't reach to a bucket, but from the cooler to the impeller pump, that hose woould reach. with the boat just idling the cooler is a non factor right?

dmayer84
10-24-2006, 03:26 PM
does it matter if the fake a lake is hooked up before or after the tranny cooler? I know on my '88 the hose is so short from the intake to the cooler that it wouldn't reach to a bucket, but from the cooler to the impeller pump, that hose woould reach. with the boat just idling the cooler is a non factor right?

Well your not running the transmisson on land so I dont see why you would need to have water go through the transmission cooler, but don't quote me on this I could be wrong. I would probably have put it in front of the tranny cooler with the same idea.

etakk7
10-24-2006, 03:41 PM
dmayer, are you able to get antifreeze into the engine with your setup? That was the main reason I went with the spa hose, I was able to keep the 3/4" ID without any reducing points and it can't collapse with the suction. I understand not everybody uses anti-freeze obviously. My boat is just up the road from Duluth, MN, however.

dmayer84
10-24-2006, 03:50 PM
dmayer, are you able to get antifreeze into the engine with your setup? That was the main reason I went with the spa hose, I was able to keep the 3/4" ID without any reducing points and it can't collapse with the suction. I understand not everybody uses anti-freeze obviously. My boat is just up the road from Duluth, MN, however.

I havent tried using it to put antifreeze in I just drained the block. If the engine is running at idle I think using a garden hose that is cut off to suck antifreeze from a bucket would be fine. I still watch to make sure that it didnt. Here is a link for kink resitant hose, If it wont kink I dont think it would collapse on itself.

http://www.gilmour.com/Garden_Hose/Specialty/Marine-Recreation.asp

Tom023
10-24-2006, 04:12 PM
Similar to the one I did last year. I use the zip tie method to make sure the handle doesn't get switched to the closed position while on the lake.

M-Funf
10-24-2006, 04:14 PM
I've got a similar setup on my boat, except that it uses a simple hose spigot as the valve. There's a female thread on the bib, so all you have to do is attach the end of a hose to it...

You can see the spigot in this picture near the engine end of the intake hose...

http://www.imagestation.com/picture/sraid192/pe259c7c698a72a457052eae57f3d89d6/f1c13220.jpg

It works O.K. When I turn on the water, it runs out the bottom of the boat, and when I start the boat, it stops running out the bottom and goes through the engine. I did worry that I wasn't getting enough water to the motor, so now I have a short piece of hose that I attach and put into a bucket, then run the garden hose into the bucket to keep it full...that way, I get a full column of water to the motor...

dmayer84
10-24-2006, 05:19 PM
Similar to the one I did last year. I use the zip tie method to make sure the handle doesn't get switched to the closed position while on the lake.

The ball valve that I used acutally has an attachment for a lock so that it cant get turned without taking the lock off/

emnesto
10-24-2006, 10:33 PM
I have not experienced it first hand but people say that a wet leaf and white vinyl do not mix! Luckily I did it on a dry day. Unfortunately, on October 4 at the cabin in Northern Wisconsin it's very difficult to keep leaves out of the boat! I made sure to vacuum once it was safely in the garage.
Looks like a great installation. What can you tell me about the other items requiring winterization (anti-freeze). If I build from your example, and suck anti-freeze from a bucket, will it flow through the transmission cooler? Similarly, will the antifreeze flow through the cockpit heater? Do I need to have the cockpit heater running to make that happen? Thanks for the great pics.

erkoehler
10-24-2006, 10:53 PM
UM...anybody else notice the trans fluid in the bilge? You may want to look into that :o

TRBenj
10-24-2006, 11:05 PM
I've got a similar setup on my boat, except that it uses a simple hose spigot as the valve. There's a female thread on the bib, so all you have to do is attach the end of a hose to it...

You can see the spigot in this picture near the engine end of the intake hose...

http://www.imagestation.com/picture/sraid192/pe259c7c698a72a457052eae57f3d89d6/f1c13220.jpg

It works O.K. When I turn on the water, it runs out the bottom of the boat, and when I start the boat, it stops running out the bottom and goes through the engine. I did worry that I wasn't getting enough water to the motor, so now I have a short piece of hose that I attach and put into a bucket, then run the garden hose into the bucket to keep it full...that way, I get a full column of water to the motor...

This solution is simple and effective. I am often confused why people go to such lengths to make things more difficult for themselves.

You worry too much about the hose not providing enough water, though. Even if the RWP is capable of moving more water, the motor doesnt need it. The hose provides more than enough to keep the impeller lubricated. There is no load on the motor while running in neutral, so youre not in danger of overheating. Ive never moved off my regular temp of 160 on the hose.

dmayer84
10-24-2006, 11:23 PM
This solution is simple and effective. I am often confused why people go to such lengths to make things more difficult for themselves.

You worry too much about the hose not providing enough water, though. Even if the RWP is capable of moving more water, the motor doesnt need it. The hose provides more than enough to keep the impeller lubricated. There is no load on the motor while running in neutral, so youre not in danger of overheating. Ive never moved off my regular temp of 160 on the hose.
I put a ball valve in because in case that something else beyond it such as the hose hookup fails I still have something keeping the water out of the boat. I may have to get towed in but its better than filling with water and having the engine rebuilt. My dad is an engineer guess some of it rubbed off on me.

etakk7
10-25-2006, 10:17 AM
UM...anybody else notice the trans fluid in the bilge? You may want to look into that :o

I took the pictures after I had sucked in the antifreeze AND drained it. I know some people keep the antifreeze in the system but I opted to run it through and then drain it as well. I didn't have the boat on enough of an incline to have it drain out before I took the picture.

It's antifreeze that you see and not trans fluid. My trans fluid is motor oil anyway.

Tom023
10-25-2006, 10:24 AM
I put a ball valve in because in case that something else beyond it such as the hose hookup fails I still have something keeping the water out of the boat.

That's why I went with the ball valve as well. An added benefit of the ball valve is in the event of a major hull breach...you close the valve, attach a hose and put it in the bilge and use the raw water pump to remove the water. A bilge pump really will only remove incidental water. It's unlikely any of us will ever have to worry about that, but it's an available option.

The use of spigots in marine applications is considered a no-no for various reasons, but we are not talking about ocean going yachts here so it's probably fine.

etakk7
10-25-2006, 11:40 AM
I used a ball valve to stop water from flowing out the bottom of the boat when I suck from a bucket.

The other reasons above are just added benefits in my mind. Since the ball valve is completely non-restrictive, it doesn't change the volume of water being sucked out of the lake, and therefore doesn't do any harm to have one. I didn't think the restrictive nature of a spigot would necessarily allow a hose to be hooked up and have antifreeze be sucked into the engine.

etakk7
10-25-2006, 11:59 AM
Looks like a great installation. What can you tell me about the other items requiring winterization (anti-freeze). If I build from your example, and suck anti-freeze from a bucket, will it flow through the transmission cooler? Similarly, will the antifreeze flow through the cockpit heater? Do I need to have the cockpit heater running to make that happen? Thanks for the great pics.


I don't see why it wouldn't flow through the tranny cooler, being that I have tapped into the first point of the circuit. I wasn't sure if the antifreeze would flow to the heater either, but I can tell you that using 5 gallons of antifreeze and then draining everything, including the heater lines, that the antifreeze did in fact flow through the heater core. I saw red inside both ends of the lines. You don't need to have the heater running but you do need to make sure the lines are opened for water flow (some boats have a faucet type crank to close the flow to the lines)

Some people leave the antifreeze in everything. I used "burst proof to -50" antifreeze, and to be quite honest, it could actually get to that temp near Duluth, MN. I'm not in the business of taking chances on the actual temp it would burst at, so I took the safe route and drained everything. Any undrained pockets of liquid are at least anti-freeze, not water.

BuoyChaser
10-25-2006, 12:53 PM
That's why I went with the ball valve as well. An added benefit of the ball valve is in the event of a major hull breach...you close the valve, attach a hose and put it in the bilge and use the raw water pump to remove the water. A bilge pump really will only remove incidental water. It's unlikely any of us will ever have to worry about that, but it's an available option.

The use of spigots in marine applications is considered a no-no for various reasons, but we are not talking about ocean going yachts here so it's probably fine.
what a great idea on using the intake to empty water from your bilge...got a great story from my '85, took out the plug on my boat when it was on the lift one time...

well sure enough that time i was with my buddy who right before dark his battery was weak and we were stranded...cold and no other boats around, so we called my brother-in-law and in the process he agreed to come out, but he was clueless with boats, then as we were explaining all the details to him, his phone died...so couldn't tell him to put in the plug...after driving about 5miles to get to us, the stars were almost buried below the water line and water was sloshing around the floor...

i did a baywatch jump and kept the boat running with bilge all the way home after putting in the plug...talk about scary, thought i might lose an arm in the pully if i wasn't careful...needless to say the boat never conked out and toed the '89 Ski Supreme home!!!

but would have been great to thought about removing the raw water intake at the time!!!

Hoosier Bob
11-05-2006, 07:05 PM
I decided to winterize today myself. I never have used the FAKE"O"LAKE but decided to make one myself. One bucket $3.98, one fitting threaded 1.25" to hose 1.25" $.99, one threaded 1.25" pvc fitting $2.29 and one FLex Hose at $9.00. As we all know the cooling system will draw more than our hoses can pump. That is why you fill the bucket and run. The system worked perfectly and even stores all nuts, hose clamps, fog oil, carb cleaner and Stabyl neatly!:D
I forgot ACE charges $2.00 for the lid for the bucket!

Hoosier Bob
11-05-2006, 07:08 PM
Pic number II!:o

Hoosier Bob
11-05-2006, 07:08 PM
Last one!:o

By the way, you can remove the hose from the trans cooler in seconds and install only takes a couple of seconds more! No need for clamps!

Chief
11-05-2006, 07:56 PM
The MC dealers are putting in an order for a hit on you bob. That invention just cost every dealer 1.65 million dollars! :)

Chief
11-05-2006, 07:58 PM
I decided to winterize today myself. I never have used the FAKE"O"LAKE but decided to make one myself. One bucket $3.98, one fitting threaded 1.25" to hose 1.25" $.99, one threaded 1.25" pvc fitting $2.29 and one FLex Hose at $9.00. As we all know the cooling system will draw more than our hoses can pump. That is why you fill the bucket and run. The system worked perfectly and even stores all nuts, hose clamps, fog oil, carb cleaner and Stabyl neatly!:D
I forgot ACE charges $2.00 for the lid for the bucket!

Total Price $22.01. Doing it yourself PRICELESS!

Hoosier Bob
11-05-2006, 08:03 PM
I hope so! I need someone to put me out of my misery!8p
It only took about five minutes to assemble! I could have epoxied but it only dripped a couple of times after I screwed the fitting into the bucket.

BuoyChaser
11-05-2006, 08:19 PM
I decided to winterize today myself. I never have used the FAKE"O"LAKE but decided to make one myself. One bucket $3.98, one fitting threaded 1.25" to hose 1.25" $.99, one threaded 1.25" pvc fitting $2.29 and one FLex Hose at $9.00. As we all know the cooling system will draw more than our hoses can pump. That is why you fill the bucket and run. The system worked perfectly and even stores all nuts, hose clamps, fog oil, carb cleaner and Stabyl neatly!:D
I forgot ACE charges $2.00 for the lid for the bucket!
what about your impeller, had you removed it, is that why you went right to the transmission cooler???did you get all your stuff at ace???what size was that "Flex HOse"???

Hoosier Bob
11-05-2006, 08:30 PM
After I ran the engine and made sure the treated fuel was in the carb (ten minutes) I then fogged the carb heavily and shut her down. Pull the impellor, Water Pump Hose, block drains ( the Trans hose is already off), exhaust riser plugs and put her away! The hose is 1.25 flex from Napa. The bucket and fittings were under $10.00. If you want exact PM me and I will get my reciept with exacts. The thing was very nice and worked perfectly. You will need to have a 1.25" hole saw!

Sorry I forgot to add the $15.99 for the case of beer and the gas it took to drive to Ohio and back to get it! $26.00 fuel and $15.99 beer! Love those BLUE LAWS!