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dmayer84
10-15-2006, 06:16 PM
I need to get a new car to tow my boat, can't keep borrowing my dad's. Looking to get some suggestions and opinions on different cars and how they do towing. I dont want to get something that will struggle towing like my dads 4Runner.

wakebrdr142
10-15-2006, 06:37 PM
I love the looks of the new Tahoes. You didn't mention your price range, new or used, etc.

dmayer84
10-15-2006, 06:40 PM
Looking to spend around 30k have to stay under 40k, want to go new but I will go used. I just looked at a used Tahoe 2001 66k miles no hitch and no transmission cooler dealer was asking 18 for it.

wakebrdr142
10-15-2006, 06:55 PM
Tahoes
Yukon
F-150
F-250
Tundra

These would be my preferences. That tohoe sounds a little high but the milage looks good.

Carbon Dreams
10-15-2006, 06:56 PM
Stay away from used 1/2 ton Chevy's. 8.5" 10 bolt C-Clip rear ends are not good! Look at a used Toyota Tundra. V-8 good drivetrain and bomb-proof. If you want a used SUV the Toyota Sequoia is also a great buy. Stay away from any used Ford.

If you want new, the Nissan Armada/Titan, Toyota Tundra/Sequoia, any of the Dodge line, the choice is endless...

Happy hunting!

Archimedes
10-15-2006, 07:09 PM
07 Avalanche LTZ.

duckguy
10-15-2006, 07:21 PM
selling mine for 33,000

bigmac
10-15-2006, 07:27 PM
I need to get a new car to tow my boat, can't keep borrowing my dad's. Looking to get some suggestions and opinions on different cars and how they do towing. I dont want to get something that will struggle towing like my dads 4Runner.

I think any 1/2 ton-based truck/SUV will do fine, but do make sure it has a towing package (transmission cooler, class III/IV hitch, and a round 7-wire connector socket).

I'd be partial to a new GM vehicle for its 5 year/100,000 mile powertrain warranty and flex-fuel capability.

sanjuan23
10-15-2006, 07:30 PM
The Answer to all your problems!!!:D :D

duckguy
10-15-2006, 07:32 PM
Titans are nice

ctkiteboarding
10-15-2006, 07:44 PM
used dodge 20k

bigmac
10-15-2006, 07:50 PM
Titans are nice

They are indeed. I looked hard at them, wasn't put off by the early reports of poor reliability. Great ride, great towing capacity but a lot more than needed for a 4000 lb boat/trailer and you pay for that with gas mileage. I ended up with a GMC Sierra because it was a lot cheaper, better mileage (18-20) and capable of using E85.

dmayer84
10-15-2006, 08:03 PM
Im liking the new Chevy Avalanche. I think im going to go look atone this week and the new warranty makes it more appealing. Gas mileage is not a huge factor, only have to go 2 miles to work. The fact that it takes E85 is good too but gas just dropped to under $2 a gallon.

bigmac
10-15-2006, 08:15 PM
Im liking the new Chevy Avalanche. I think im going to go look atone this week and the new warranty makes it more appealing. Gas mileage is not a huge factor, only have to go 2 miles to work. The fact that it takes E85 is good too but gas just dropped to under $2 a gallon.
Yeh...gasoline is fairly cheap. For the time being. I'll bet we see $3 gasoline again before I trade this current vehicle in, though.

...anyway, the E85 is appealing to me because it's just that much less oil to import from OPEC or that cretin Hugo Chavez.

Archimedes
10-15-2006, 09:18 PM
Im liking the new Chevy Avalanche. I think im going to go look atone this week and the new warranty makes it more appealing. Gas mileage is not a huge factor, only have to go 2 miles to work. The fact that it takes E85 is good too but gas just dropped to under $2 a gallon.

I've got 3,000 miles on mine so far and love it. I got the 4wd LTZ with every option except nav. Stickered at around $45.5k, paid just over $38k. Tows great, luxury car ride, and a really nice interior. autoride is nice for towing.

dmayer84
10-15-2006, 09:47 PM
I've got 3,000 miles on mine so far and love it. I got the 4wd LTZ with every option except nav. Stickered at around $45.5k, paid just over $38k. Tows great, luxury car ride, and a really nice interior. autoride is nice for towing.

Dont think ill be able to afford the LTZ since im still paying off my X10. I like the design now a lot better than the old style. Good thing I know a couple people that work at a chevy dealership.

Ryan
10-16-2006, 02:28 AM
I need to get a new car to tow my boat, can't keep borrowing my dad's. Looking to get some suggestions and opinions on different cars and how they do towing. I dont want to get something that will struggle towing like my dads 4Runner.

Any '05+ v8 4Runner won't have any trouble pulling that boat. Even the '03-'04 v8 would do great. But, if you're looking to go big, new and keep the & low... I have seen new: '06 loaded 4x4 EB Expeditions for $31,400; '06 Yukon XL Denali's AWD loaded for $34k-ish. I've got mixed feelings about the year end deals. The deal's got to be really good because you're already eating one year of depreciation upon purchase relative to current model production.

I'm obviously not just shopping for a bigger boat :D Lower gas mileage here I come.

PendO
10-16-2006, 02:39 AM
Looking to spend around 30k have to stay under 40k, want to go new but I will go used. I just looked at a used Tahoe 2001 66k miles no hitch and no transmission cooler dealer was asking 18 for it.

I'd go new, its a buyers market right now, and the 07 warranties are much better ... if you don't need room for kids you can get good deals on 1/2 ton pickups ... just make sure you get at least a 3.73 rear axel ... I wouldn't want to tow with a 3.42 ... some manf. already have rebates on 07's :)

BrianM
10-16-2006, 09:07 AM
I'd go new, its a buyers market right now, and the 07 warranties are much better ... if you don't need room for kids you can get good deals on 1/2 ton pickups ... just make sure you get at least a 3.73 rear axel ... I wouldn't want to tow with a 3.42 ... some manf. already have rebates on 07's :)

GM has big rebates on the '07 Classic trucks but keep in mind that the all new GMT-900 '07 half tons will be out any day.

Workin' 4 Toys
10-16-2006, 09:17 AM
Yeh...gasoline is fairly cheap. For the time being. I'll bet we see $3 gasoline again before I trade this current vehicle in, though.

...anyway, the E85 is appealing to me because it's just that much less oil to import from OPEC or that cretin Hugo Chavez.
We'll easily see $3+ again next summer, maybe even by spring.......Or dare I say $4 a gallon next time around:mad:
And I would go for an E85 capable rig.....
Until I can get one to run on Hydrogen, oxygen, or a mixture in the form of water and not sacrifice power...;)

BrianM
10-16-2006, 09:41 AM
We'll easily see $3+ again next summer, maybe even by spring.......Or dare I say $4 a gallon next time around:mad:
And I would go for an E85 capable rig.....
Until I can get one to run on Hydrogen, oxygen, or a mixture in the form of water and not sacrifice power...;)
My Avalanche is E85 capable but it doesn't do me any good. Closest E85 station to me is about 350 miles away in Houston. E85 is kind of a p!ss poor alternative anyway. Fuel cost is about 10-15% less but mileage is 20-30% less. Sorry but I'll burn fossil fuels and support the middle east before I will buy those economics.:(

sanjuan23
10-16-2006, 09:42 AM
The Titan is E-85 capable. But I havent passed a station carrying the fuel yet. Oh well!

Tryin-again
10-16-2006, 09:56 AM
My Avalanche is E85 capable but it doesn't do me any good. Closest E85 station to me is about 350 miles away in Houston. E85 is kind of a p!ss poor alternative anyway. Fuel cost is about 10-15% less but mileage is 20-30% less. Sorry but I'll burn fossil fuels and support the middle east before I will buy those economics.:(


What He Said^^^^ :rolleyes:

Also - You are supporting some of us local guys also..... Thanks.. :D

#47of100TeamMC
10-16-2006, 10:04 AM
The Answer to all your problems!!!:D :D

I'll second that! I Love my Titan. Amazing power and torque for towing the boat. Honestly the best purchase I've made to date. I wouldn't trade it for anything. I Looked at Full size everything. Ford/Chevy/Dodge/Toyota and I was running not walking but RUNNING back to the Nissan dealer to make a deal. amazing track record, and the versatility is unmatched. LOTS of awesome options. I could go on for hours. But I'll stop there cuz that's plenty more than my alotted :twocents:

#47of100TeamMC
10-16-2006, 10:08 AM
They are indeed. I looked hard at them, wasn't put off by the early reports of poor reliability. Great ride, great towing capacity but a lot more than needed for a 4000 lb boat/trailer and you pay for that with gas mileage. I ended up with a GMC Sierra because it was a lot cheaper, better mileage (18-20) and capable of using E85.

Just as an FYI the Titan is also capable of E85. But Why when it gets 80% of the fuel economy. which costs you more than just paying for the 87. I'll support the farmers and buy corn but not to put into my fuel tank.

OOPS Sorry SanJuan23. I didn't read all the way up to the top before posting on this topic. My bad.

dmayer84
10-16-2006, 10:21 AM
I'll second that! I Love my Titan. Amazing power and torque for towing the boat. Honestly the best purchase I've made to date. I wouldn't trade it for anything. I Looked at Full size everything. Ford/Chevy/Dodge/Toyota and I was running not walking but RUNNING back to the Nissan dealer to make a deal. amazing track record, and the versatility is unmatched. LOTS of awesome options. I could go on for hours. But I'll stop there cuz that's plenty more than my alotted :twocents:

The price of the Titan is alot better too, especially for someone that just got out of college. Looks like im gonna have a lot of shopping around to do.

nuckinfutz
10-16-2006, 01:11 PM
Just got me a new tow Vehicle.. (since were on the subject!).

I havent towed with it yet still need to break in (500 Miles before tow). Although my old one (05) did very well. Just recently I pulled it down to California from WA and never dropped below 60 up the pass.

http://www.telcon-solutions.com/wakeboarding/DSC00014.JPG

ski36short
10-16-2006, 01:30 PM
[QUOTE=#47of100TeamMC]. amazing track record, [QUOTE]

Who has an amazing track record, your local Nissan dealer?

bigmac
10-16-2006, 01:46 PM
E85 is about $.40/gallon cheaper than regular around here. As the price of gasoline goes up, and it will, the fact that it's only 15% gasoline should give a price advantage compared to regular. Now, this assumes that the various states won't jack around with the taxes and eliminate that advantage - not a safe assumption.

Whatever one's take on personal economics relative to E85, I believe that it's to everyone's overall advantage to support alternative fuels and decrease our dependance on oil from elsewhere. IMHO, the fact that American's are still buying big vehicles and won't use E85 is indicative of the fact that, as a nation, we just don't get it. People say that they're less interested in an E85-capable vehicle because gasoline is so cheap. We Americans go along, fat, dumb, and happy (especially fat), paying some of the lowest gasoline and heating oil prices in the world. Then, when basic world economics catches up with us and gas hits $3, we get an astonishing amount of outraged whining. I can only imagine what Sizzler thinks, while he's been paying more than twice that for years. Lemme tell ya, it's only just starting. Chindia is just ramping up. When they get there, our lack of interest in alternative fuels and is going to bite us in the a$$ big-time.

IMHO

dmayer84
10-16-2006, 01:50 PM
E85 is about $.40/gallon cheaper than regular around here. As the price of gasoline goes up, and it will, the fact that it's only 15% gasoline should give a price advantage compared to regular. Now, this assumes that the various states won't jack around with the taxes and eliminate that advantage - not a safe assumption.

Whatever one's take on personal economics relative to E85, I believe that it's to everyone's overall advantage to support alternative fuels and decrease our dependance on oil from elsewhere. IMHO, the fact that American's are still buying big vehicles and won't use E85 is indicative of the fact that, as a nation, we just don't get it. People say that they're less interested in an E85-capable vehicle because gasoline is so cheap. We Americans go along, fat, dumb, and happy (especially fat), paying some of the lowest gasoline and heating oil prices in the world. Then, when basic world economics catches up with us and gas hits $3, we get an astonishing amount of outraged whining. I can only imagine what Sizzler thinks, while he's been paying more than twice that for years. Lemme tell ya, it's only just starting. Chindia is just ramping up. When they get there, our lack of interest in alternative fuels and is going to bite us in the a$$ big-time.

IMHO

I want to have a car that is E85 capable but there isnt a single station that has it available in NJ, probably because of all the oil refineries.

Archimedes
10-16-2006, 02:24 PM
E85 is about $.40/gallon cheaper than regular around here. As the price of gasoline goes up, and it will, the fact that it's only 15% gasoline should give a price advantage compared to regular. Now, this assumes that the various states won't jack around with the taxes and eliminate that advantage - not a safe assumption.

Whatever one's take on personal economics relative to E85, I believe that it's to everyone's overall advantage to support alternative fuels and decrease our dependance on oil from elsewhere. IMHO, the fact that American's are still buying big vehicles and won't use E85 is indicative of the fact that, as a nation, we just don't get it. People say that they're less interested in an E85-capable vehicle because gasoline is so cheap. We Americans go along, fat, dumb, and happy (especially fat), paying some of the lowest gasoline and heating oil prices in the world. Then, when basic world economics catches up with us and gas hits $3, we get an astonishing amount of outraged whining. I can only imagine what Sizzler thinks, while he's been paying more than twice that for years. Lemme tell ya, it's only just starting. Chindia is just ramping up. When they get there, our lack of interest in alternative fuels and is going to bite us in the a$$ big-time.

IMHO

Well that all sounds good in theory...but there isn't enough farmable acreage in the entire country for E85 to make any significant dent in our fuel needs. And demand for it's use for fuel will drive up the price of food, feed, etc. Plus ehthanol production has it's own environmental issues as well. There is no easy answer to any of this, or it would have presented itself long ago.

One thing to remember is that it is in Big Oil's best long term interest to keep oil prices only moderately high, to discourage not only investment in alternative fuels, but also investment in drilling in high cost areas (where there's thought to be large supplies of oil BTW). It is not in Big Oil's best interest to have $4 a gallon right now or anytime soon.

Plus, if you're following the markets right now, you'll note that the big reason for the run up in oil prices was not 'basic world economics' supply/demand per se. It was speculation in the energy markets coupled with instability in Iran.

nuckinfutz
10-16-2006, 02:46 PM
I have a heated steering wheel now!

dmayer84
10-16-2006, 02:57 PM
I have a heated steering wheel now!
Wish I had one when I was at school, -30 is cold especially on a leather wrapped wheel.

sanjuan23
10-16-2006, 03:01 PM
The price of the Titan is alot better too, especially for someone that just got out of college. Looks like im gonna have a lot of shopping around to do.

Wherever or whatever you decide be sure to mention (if you finance with MFG.) that you are a recent college grad. Decent cash incentives

nuckinfutz
10-16-2006, 03:01 PM
OK OK,

So heres a good question.

At what time in point will E85 exceed the price of oil? There is no question of IF, but more like When.

Deisel used to be a by-product of Gasoline and now has a higher value ($). Bio-deisel used to be cheaper, and Used fryer oil used to be free for those vehicles that were able to run off of it. So, E85... Will it boost my economy? Make us americans skinnier?


Good words to live by... "Supply and demand" which means your damned if you have and damned if you dont have!

nuckinfutz
10-16-2006, 03:23 PM
Wish I had one when I was at school, -30 is cold especially on a leather wrapped wheel.

Dude, I cant even fathom what -30 is like!

dmayer84
10-16-2006, 03:25 PM
Dude, I cant even fathom what -30 is like!

Feels about the same as -10. It had to warm up to snow.

JohnE
10-16-2006, 03:37 PM
I love my Avalanche, FWIW. I had an '03 and now have an '05. You can't compare the ride of the Avalanche to that of a pick up.

bigmac
10-16-2006, 03:42 PM
Well that all sounds good in theory...but there isn't enough farmable acreage in the entire country for E85 to make any significant dent in our fuel needs. And demand for it's use for fuel will drive up the price of food, feed, etc. Plus ehthanol production has it's own environmental issues as well. There is no easy answer to any of this, or it would have presented itself long ago. I agree completely.

Plus, if you're following the markets right now, you'll note that the big reason for the run up in oil prices was not 'basic world economics' supply/demand per se. It was speculation in the energy markets coupled with instability in Iran.Some validity to this point IMHO, but there is a significant component of supply and demand, and we'll see that become more prominently reflected in our gas prices as we see the only other two countries more populous than us, China and India, emerge further onto the oil-consuming stage, I believe.

Tryin-again
10-16-2006, 03:52 PM
Some validity to this point IMHO, but there is a significant component of supply and demand, and we'll see that become more prominently reflected in our gas prices as we see the only other two countries more populous than us, China and India, emerge further onto the oil-consuming stage, I believe.


What He Said ^^^^^

Also most of the "Big Oil companies" are national oil companies. Their inventories/ capabilities are state secrets and many are using the proceeds for national needs. Quite a few are not reinvesting in the future or development of oil reserves... This is creating quite a potential train wreck for the future - (the whole world market)...

Diesel
10-16-2006, 03:55 PM
No one has mentioned that it takes more crude oil to create one gallon of E85 than to simply make refined product. So while you think you are lessing our dependance OPEC is laughing it's *** off.........:(

bigmac
10-16-2006, 04:02 PM
No one has mentioned that it takes more crude oil to create one gallon of E85 than to simply make refined product. So while you think you are lessing our dependance OPEC is laughing it's *** off.........:(Can you cite that? Last I read, the net energy gain from E85 was a factor of 1.27.

Tryin-again
10-16-2006, 04:10 PM
Can you cite that? Last I read, the net energy gain from E85 was a factor of 1.27.


I heard a number like that also....

Diesel
10-16-2006, 04:11 PM
Can you cite that? Last I read, the net energy gain from E85 was a factor of 1.27.

I'll see if I can dig up a source on the net...........

Most studies do not factor in crude used during the production of the corn. Tractors, transportion, processing, etc. I am quite confident your 1.27:1 ratio does not account for these consumptions. Plus to make a completely accurate comparison you do have to factor in the BTU loss of E85 vs. the refined when used in autos. All critical factors which are ignored when making comparisons. I think we all agree E85 is not an answer.

Diesel
10-16-2006, 04:13 PM
Regarding BTU difference......

Ethanol supporters and detractors agree that ethanol reduces gas mileage, because of its lower energy content. But by how much? The Iowa Corn Growers E85 Web site says that if you have a flex-fuel vehicle and burn E85 (85% ethanol, 15% regular gasoline), you'll experience a gas mileage drop of 5-15% compared with regular gasoline. Taking the middle, a car that gets 25 mpg on regular gas would get 22.5 mpg on E85.

Others say the gas mileage penalty for E85 is more severe. For instance, a story in USA Today this week told its millions of readers that the E85 mileage penalty is 28%. That means your 25 mpg car now only gets 18 mpg if you flex to E85.

from here (http://www.agriculture.com/ag/story.jhtml?storyid=/templatedata/ag/story/data/1147098565893.xml#continue)

Tryin-again
10-16-2006, 04:20 PM
I'll see if I can dig up a source on the net...........

Most studies do not factor in crude used during the production of the corn. Tractors, transportion, processing, etc. I am quite confident your 1.27:1 ratio does not account for these consumptions. Plus to make a completely accurate comparison you do have to factor in the BTU loss of E85 vs. the refined when used in autos. All critical factors which are ignored when making comparisons. I think we all agree E85 is not an answer.


ANother thing that doesn't really have to do with oil - The increased amount of clean water that irrigated corn would need - we already have issues with aquifers and water as it is......

bigmac
10-16-2006, 04:22 PM
I'll see if I can dig up a source on the net...........

Most studies do not factor in crude used during the production of the corn. Tractors, transportion, processing, etc. I am quite confident your 1.27:1 ratio does not account for these consumptions. Plus to make a completely accurate comparison you do have to factor in the BTU loss of E85 vs. the refined when used in autos. All critical factors which are ignored when making comparisons. I think we all agree E85 is not an answer.Sigh...as you can imagine, this tends to be a politicized issue. Here's what came up off the top of google from the National Vehicle Ethanol Coalition (http://www.e85fuel.com/news/072005_pimentel.php):

In June 2004, the U.S. Department of Agriculture updated its 2002 analysis of the issue and determined that the net energy balance of ethanol production is 1.67 to 1. For every 100 BTUs of energy used to make ethanol, 167 BTUs of ethanol is produced. In 2002, USDA had concluded that the ratio was 1.35 to 1. The USDA findings have been confirmed by additional studies conducted by the University of Nebraska and Argonne National Laboratory.

These figures take into account the energy required to plant, grow and harvest corn—as well as the energy required to manufacture and to distribute ethanol.

The net energy balance of ethanol production continues to improve because ethanol production is becoming more efficient. For example, one bushel of corn now yields at least 2.8 gallons of ethanol—up from 2.5 gallons just a few years ago.

Diesel
10-16-2006, 04:24 PM
RE net gain..........

No energy benefit'

Turning corn, soybeans and sunflowers into ethanol uses more energy than the resulting fuel generates, according to a study from Cornell University and the University of California-Berkley.

"There is just no energy benefit to using plant biomass for liquid fuel," said David Pimentel, professor of agriculture and ecology at Cornell.

It takes a large amount of energy to grow corn, including energy from machinery, fertilizers, herbicides, irrigation and transportation. There are also environmental costs because corn uses nitrogen fertilizer that contributes to water pollution, according to Pimentel.

Taken from here (http://www.findarticles.com/p/articles/mi_qn4196/is_20060205/ai_n16051242)

This guy Pimenel seems to be the only one in the industry who has taken a look at the complete picture. Most other research reads as propaganda. Plus we haven't even touched on the subsidy issue or the artificial market price floors.

dmayer84
10-16-2006, 04:25 PM
Is ethanol availble near anyone? From what I can tell it is not widely available yet. I know though that some of the local stations around me are selling gas that is 15% ethanol.

bigmac
10-16-2006, 04:28 PM
RE net gain..........

No energy benefit'

Turning corn, soybeans and sunflowers into ethanol uses more energy than the resulting fuel generates, according to a study from Cornell University and the University of California-Berkley.

"There is just no energy benefit to using plant biomass for liquid fuel," said David Pimentel, professor of agriculture and ecology at Cornell.

It takes a large amount of energy to grow corn, including energy from machinery, fertilizers, herbicides, irrigation and transportation. There are also environmental costs because corn uses nitrogen fertilizer that contributes to water pollution, according to Pimentel.

Taken from here (http://www.findarticles.com/p/articles/mi_qn4196/is_20060205/ai_n16051242)

This guy Pimenel seems to be the only one in the industry who has taken a look at the complete picture. Most other research reads as propaganda. Plus we haven't even touched on the subsidy issue or the artificial market price floors.

Yeh, that's the Pimental study (http://hubbert.mines.edu/news/Pimentel_98-2.pdf) - apparently the only one of 10 different studies that found energy loss, as refuted in this article (http://www.e85fuel.com/news/072005_pimentel.php). I also note that that study was from 1998.

Diesel
10-16-2006, 04:35 PM
Yeh, that's the Pimental study - apparently the only one of 10 different studies that found energy loss, as refuted in this article (http://www.e85fuel.com/news/072005_pimentel.php).

And who wrote that article................a bunch of corn growers who would are heavily vested in public opinion regarding E85. They have a huge $$$ interest while most independent studies don't. I find it quite interesting that most independent studies disagree with the vested proponents of E85. To me one side is bias, the other has nothing to gain (at least from what I can see).................I tend to believe those who don't have $$ in the game.

bigmac
10-16-2006, 04:48 PM
I find it quite interesting that most independent studies disagree with the vested proponents of E85.

No doubt there is political spin - although I'm not convinced that David Pimental is immune to that either...

Anyway, you say "most independant studies"...I could only find Pimentel's report, which certainly appears to be arguably refutable. You have others?

Workin' 4 Toys
10-16-2006, 05:02 PM
Was this about a new tow vehicle? Or an E85/Gasoline debate? :purplaugh Amusing.....

I'd like to use Hydrogen myself, what's the probability that it will cost equal or more to "make" than the commodity (would it be classified as such) itself...

nuckinfutz
10-16-2006, 05:09 PM
Was this about a new tow vehicle? Or an E85/Gasoline debate? :purplaugh Amusing.....

I'd like to use Hydrogen myself, what's the probability that it will cost equal or more to "make" than the commodity (would it be classified as such) itself...

Did I mention Air conditioned seats?

Workin' 4 Toys
10-16-2006, 05:10 PM
Is ethanol availble near anyone? From what I can tell it is not widely available yet. I know though that some of the local stations around me are selling gas that is 15% ethanol.
Yes, its all over here.

I wonder how many of the stations around here will have all the LSD Diesel fuels that are needed including the new for '07 ULSD, all 3 grades of "regular", E85, Kerosene, Racing fuel, and propane. Seems like they are going to have to expand all the fueling stations....:rolleyes:

Workin' 4 Toys
10-16-2006, 05:11 PM
Did I mention Air conditioned seats?
Go for the Land Rover, its got a heated steering wheel........:rolleyes:




EDIT: I just NOW noticed your previous post.....

nuckinfutz
10-16-2006, 05:22 PM
400+ HP, 417 Ft Lbs Torque.....

CottagerGreg
10-17-2006, 12:16 AM
This is what is needed.... caught my attention at the NDRA finals this weekend in Norwalk, Ohio...

This is "baller"
http://s117932057.onlinehome.us/gallery/albums/album18/IMG_0108_copy.jpg

dmayer84
10-17-2006, 12:38 AM
Went today and looked at Durango's dealership had a 2005 listed at 35 that they were offering new at 24 since its 2 years old. Tried to go look at an Avalanche but the guy that worked at the dealership didnt really want to help me. Guess he figured that I couldnt afford it. Wanted to go and look at it for the first time at a dealership other than one I would be buying from.

PendO
10-17-2006, 12:50 AM
Guess he figured that I couldnt afford it. Wanted to go and look at it for the first time at a dealership other than one I would be buying from.

There is no greater satisfaction than driving to the dealership that wouldn't help you ... in a new car from a different dealership:) Priceless:) For me one of the best car price research tools (for finding invoice) is www.carpoint.com (http://www.carpoint.com) where you can build and price a vehicle MSRP and Invoice (although it may be a little off on invoice, it is a good starting point) ... if you think you may have kids/spouse in the near future get more seating to start with, as it SUCKS outgrowing a car when you are still making payments on one:)

dmayer84
10-17-2006, 12:56 AM
There is no greater satisfaction than driving to the dealership that wouldn't help you ... in a new car from a different dealership:) Priceless:) For me one of the best car price research tools (for finding invoice) is www.carpoint.com (http://www.carpoint.com) where you can build and price a vehicle MSRP and Invoice (although it may be a little off on invoice, it is a good starting point) ... if you think you may have kids/spouse in the near future get more seating to start with, as it SUCKS outgrowing a car when you are still making payments on one:)

The part that I walked away laughing at is that I went and looked at what they had in stock for Avalanches before I went inside, and they had a wide range from basic to fully loaded about 5 total. For the 5 minutes that I did talk to the guy at the dealership he told me that they only had one in the low 50's. Dont know if this is just one Chevy dealership that is like this or I should go see my friends Dad that works at a different one.

Archimedes
10-17-2006, 02:04 AM
The part that I walked away laughing at is that I went and looked at what they had in stock for Avalanches before I went inside, and they had a wide range from basic to fully loaded about 5 total. For the 5 minutes that I did talk to the guy at the dealership he told me that they only had one in the low 50's. Dont know if this is just one Chevy dealership that is like this or I should go see my friends Dad that works at a different one.

Well the Avs are in somewhat low supply, but they can always do a dealer swap. BTW, there is no Avalanche in the low $50s, so that one must have had the dealer installed undercoating package... The top of the line LTZ with every option won't cross $50k and Avalanches can be had for 20% off sticker. Do an Edmunds TMV calculation at Edmunds.com and that will tell you what the real price is in your area.

When I looked they only had one LTZ in the color I wanted within a 500 mile radius, but they did a dealer swap and still gave me the price I wanted.

Workin' 4 Toys
10-17-2006, 10:20 AM
I have not seen an avalanche around in the color that was at the auto show. It was a burnt orange. AWESOME color.

LakePirate
10-17-2006, 10:44 AM
I have not seen an avalanche around in the color that was at the auto show. It was a burnt orange. AWESOME color.


Pops has an 04 in that color.


The dealers claim that they don't sell so they don't order.

Get UMP to order you one.

Workin' 4 Toys
10-17-2006, 10:57 AM
Pops has an 04 in that color.


The dealers claim that they don't sell so they don't order.

Get UMP to order you one.
I have to wait 2-3 years to ask UMP to order me something that may or may not be hard to get (starts with cam and ends in aro), I'd hate to ask for too many favors......;)
But is the color I was talking about....

LakePirate
10-17-2006, 10:57 AM
On topic with the E85 debate

In Atlanta, a company called C2 Biofuels LLC is exploring a $150 million to $200 million plant in South Georgia that would make 50 million gallons of ethanol a year from wood pulp. C2 in December signed a deal to work with Georgia Tech researchers to create technologies for such a facility.


Although ethanol can be made from wheat, sugar, soft wood and other feedstocks, corn remains the major feedstock in ethanol production.



This C2 company claims that the pulp wood fuel produces a greater ratio of energy than standard E85 refining methods. Probably due to the lack of plowing and such. But it takes a day or two longer to grow trees.

Just another log on the fire, but this industry would help put jobs back in rural America where the raw materials are located and the plants that were there have long been closed.

If we are solely dependent on corn I can see it now, oh there is a drought in Kansas, E85 prices on the rise.

Tryin-again
10-17-2006, 11:08 AM
On topic with the E85 debate

In Atlanta, a company called C2 Biofuels LLC is exploring a $150 million to $200 million plant in South Georgia that would make 50 million gallons of ethanol a year from wood pulp. C2 in December signed a deal to work with Georgia Tech researchers to create technologies for such a facility.


Although ethanol can be made from wheat, sugar, soft wood and other feedstocks, corn remains the major feedstock in ethanol production.



This C2 company claims that the pulp wood fuel produces a greater ratio of energy than standard E85 refining methods. Probably due to the lack of plowing and such. But it takes a day or two longer to grow trees.

Just another log on the fire, but this industry would help put jobs back in rural America where the raw materials are located and the plants that were there have long been closed.

If we are solely dependent on corn I can see it now, oh there is a drought in Kansas, E85 prices on the rise.


Texas A&M is studying the use of mesquite to make ethanol.. They Figure to put small plants in the area where the trees grow to make the hauling of wood cheaper. The cool thing is that mequite will grow back in 8-10 years so it is self renewing... Also you can still use the land for raising cattle, etc and generally mequite is considered a pest here....

bigmac
10-17-2006, 11:14 AM
Pulpwood is big up here too - aspen and popple trees are generally considered weeds. The do indeed grow back fast. Here they're used for manufactured wood products - the stuff (even the stumpage) is ground up and compressed with some kind of cyanoacrylate binder into all manner of weird shapes. Not much such wood left over for ethanol, I suspect. Too bad because raising that stuff does nothing to the aquifers since irrigation isn't required.

Archimedes
10-17-2006, 11:39 AM
I have to wait 2-3 years to ask UMP to order me something that may or may not be hard to get (starts with cam and ends in aro), I'd hate to ask for too many favors......;)
But is the color I was talking about....

There was one in that color sitting on the lot here about 6 weeks ago.

Workin' 4 Toys
10-18-2006, 11:57 AM
There was one in that color sitting on the lot here about 6 weeks ago.
Probably sold pretty quick. It looked real good at the auto show.

Ric
10-18-2006, 12:01 PM
Stay away from used 1/2 ton Chevy's. 8.5" 10 bolt C-Clip rear ends are not good! Look at a used Toyota Tundra. V-8 good drivetrain and bomb-proof. If you want a used SUV the Toyota Sequoia is also a great buy. Stay away from any used Ford.

If you want new, the Nissan Armada/Titan, Toyota Tundra/Sequoia, any of the Dodge line, the choice is endless...

Happy hunting! woah this is news to me...
Which half tons? All Chevy half tons?

Workin' 4 Toys
10-18-2006, 12:02 PM
woah this is news to me...
He's an airplane guy..............;) :rolleyes:

Ric
10-18-2006, 12:03 PM
He's an airplane guy..............;) :rolleyes: hahahahahhahaha

east tx skier
10-18-2006, 12:29 PM
woah this is news to me...
Which half tons? All Chevy half tons?

The used Ford thing doesn't comport with our experience. Knock wood, maintenancne has been minimal as have mechnical issues. Wife bought her explorer with 40,000 miles and it now has 234K miles. Bought my expedition with 63,000 miles. It now has 85K miles. Maintenance and mechnicals have been minimal if you count air conditioning leaks as mechnical.

LakePirate
10-18-2006, 12:36 PM
Todays word of the day - Comport

comport \kum-PORT\, transitive verb:
1. To conduct or behave (oneself) in a particular manner.

intransitive verb:
1. To be fitting; to accord; to agree -- usually followed by 'with'.


Nice 'en

Archimedes
10-18-2006, 12:38 PM
woah this is news to me...
Which half tons? All Chevy half tons?

Same here. Towed with a Chevy 1/2 ton extended cab for years with no problems. Great truck. Just bought an Avalanche (qualify as a 1/2 ton?) and it tows great.

Ric
10-18-2006, 12:38 PM
The used Ford thing doesn't comport with our experience. Knock wood, maintenancne has been minimal as have mechnical issues. Wife bought her explorer with 40,000 miles and it now has 234K miles. Bought my expedition with 63,000 miles. It now has 85K miles. Maintenance and mechnicals have been minimal if you count air conditioning leaks as mechnical. we could have a tug o war between my half ton chivvy and any of the aforementioned half tons :D

Tryin-again
10-18-2006, 12:38 PM
Todays word of the day - Comport

comport \kum-PORT\, transitive verb:
1. To conduct or behave (oneself) in a particular manner.

intransitive verb:
1. To be fitting; to accord; to agree -- usually followed by 'with'.


Nice 'en

Looks like Eastie's been reading the Thesaurus -

I think I'll just stick with Hustler...:D

LakePirate
10-18-2006, 12:39 PM
Same here. Towed with a Chevy 1/2 ton extended cab for years with no problems. Great truck. Just bought an Avalanche (qualify as a 1/2 ton?) and it tows great.


Unless you bought the 2500 'lanche

Archimedes
10-18-2006, 12:43 PM
Unless you bought the 2500 'lanche

My bad. I thought the 1500 series were the 1/2 tons.

I can tell you I had my boat towed by my dealer for my water test using a big Chevy diesel dually (2500 or 3500) and it sucked big time. I'm sure that thing could pull a stump out of the ground but it was a horrible tow vehicle for a ski boat.

east tx skier
10-18-2006, 12:47 PM
we could have a tug o war between my half ton chivvy and any of the aforementioned half tons :D

With a 3.33 rear end, I'll never win it. But it pulls the boat and trailer fine. I'm hanging my hat on reliability at this point.

east tx skier
10-18-2006, 12:48 PM
Looks like Eastie's been reading the Thesaurus -

I think I'll just stick with Hustler...:D

I am a Thesaurus.

LakePirate
10-18-2006, 01:07 PM
My bad. I thought the 1500 series were the 1/2 tons.

I can tell you I had my boat towed by my dealer for my water test using a big Chevy diesel dually (2500 or 3500) and it sucked big time. I'm sure that thing could pull a stump out of the ground but it was a horrible tow vehicle for a ski boat.


Pardon me, I should have added to my comment.

Yes you have a 1/2 ton. If you had purchased the 2500 then you wouldn't have. Sorry for the confustion.

Towed my bote with my brothers F-350 dually. Didn't even know it was back there. East bound and down on I-20. Never got below 85. :D

Workin' 4 Toys
10-18-2006, 01:09 PM
I'm sure that thing could pull a stump out of the ground but it was a horrible tow vehicle for a ski boat.
I have always wondered if this saying was ever. I had a Ford 02 3/4 ton Diesel 4X4crew cab until just few months ago. I had my first opportunity to put this saying to the test while I had it. So I took the guy up on the offer. Locked in the hubs, put it in 4 Low and stabbed it....And yup, it was true, pulled it out with the roots and everything. I thought the Loud snapping noise was the hitch coming out from under it. But everything was fine, and it did the trick. So it was then called the stump puller.
And it was an AWESOME tow rig for the boats, Jeeps, cars, quads, Snowmobiles, and people. I do miss it.....(alittle)

Workin' 4 Toys
10-18-2006, 01:11 PM
Is that pronouced The-sour-arse.....8p

Archimedes
10-18-2006, 01:14 PM
Towed my bote with my brothers F-350 dually. Didn't even know it was back there. East bound and down on I-20. Never got below 85. :D

The problem with the truck I was referring to wasn't power or open highway performance. It was the low range gearing and the suspension. I just don't think a truck that's designed to be pulling 10-15,000 lbs does very well with 3-4,000 lbs behind it. On anything but smooth pavement, this truck was bouncing the boat all over the place and in stop/start traffic the low gearing bounced the boat around as well. You really felt the boat back there. Could have been exaggerated by bad fit of the hitch/receiver on his truck. I was nervous because I was about to hook the boat up to my little Touareg and tow it 3 hours home. Turns out my Touareg was a 10x better tow vehicle for my X-1 than that torque demon was, even with the horrible hitch/receiver tolerance on my Treg.

boatdad
10-18-2006, 02:55 PM
Does the short wheel have an effect on towing a large boat? I have a 2006 Suburban and was looking at getting a Armada.

LakePirate
10-18-2006, 03:06 PM
Arch

That is very odd. Why didn't the hitch fit very well? Wrong size ball or something?

I am assuming what you were referring to is similar to towing an empty utility trailer.? Short wheelbase, single axle, not enough weight on the leaf springs to make them behave.

Archimedes
10-18-2006, 03:20 PM
Arch

That is very odd. Why didn't the hitch fit very well? Wrong size ball or something?

I am assuming what you were referring to is similar to towing an empty utility trailer.? Short wheelbase, single axle, not enough weight on the leaf springs to make them behave.

Not the ball, I'm talking about the way the removable hitch/ball fits into the receiver on the truck.

The Touareg's are notorious for a horrible fit between the hitch and receiver. What's worse is the OEM receiver coupling is really short and has a heavy weld right behind the opening, which precludes mounting one of those simple receiver surround clamps.

The fit's not great on my Avalanche either, but at least I can get the clamp mounted and tighten it down snug. I can tell you that it makes a HUGE difference in the towing on my Avalanche. I towed the first weekend without it and then with it. I'll never tow without one again.

LakePirate
10-18-2006, 03:24 PM
One of these type of things

Video (http://www.hitchrider.com/images/movies/hitch-vise.mpg)

JKTX21
10-18-2006, 04:02 PM
My Expedition tows well, and I've heard you can't lose with 22s

http://i16.photobucket.com/albums/b19/JKTX21/Trucke.jpg

Carbon Dreams
10-18-2006, 10:28 PM
Does the short wheel have an effect on towing a large boat? I have a 2006 Suburban and was looking at getting a Armada.

I normally pull with my MegaCab, but...

I pull with our Armada half the time. All I can say is, wow. Tows straighter than our old 'burb. Decent power and phenomenal drivetrain and airbag leveling system. Sometimes I prefer to tow with it over the pickup. Awesome turning radius and hellaroom. I am towing our X-45 and the 21 LSV 'BU before that. I was very suprised how well it handles the X-45 yacht:D

You cannot go wrong with the Armada. We will trade it in for the '08 when it comes out. We couldn't be happier with the Armada.

Workin' 4 Toys
10-19-2006, 08:31 AM
http://business.inq7.net/money/breakingnews/view_article.php?article_id=27538

No offense, but armadas are some fugly vehicles...

ski36short
10-19-2006, 01:25 PM
I agree. They kinda have that Quasimodo look about them.

Carbon Dreams
10-19-2006, 04:10 PM
Definately a love it or hate it look. When shopping, we thought that it had the most bang for the buck. The looks are still growing on me like my hair used to:o As far as a tow vehicle, I would take it over any ford I tested, the Tahoe, and Sequoia. Don't even look to europe for a tow rig. If at all interested, anything with a Cummins will yank 'til the sun goes down. By far the best diesel applied to a pickup, ever! Used '03 with the 6-speed will run forever.

sanjuan23
10-19-2006, 04:23 PM
Just think there is rumor floating around that the 09's will have a Cummin's power plant. Again all speculation but if it were me that would be the choice for the Armada/Titan Diesel powerplant Powerful, effiecent and smooth.

Archimedes
10-19-2006, 04:34 PM
Don't even look to europe for a tow rig.

Well I'd disagree. The Touareg V8 is an excellent tow vehicle and the V10 with 500+ ftlbs of torque is an awesome tow vehicle. I've seen Touareg's pulling 30+ ft Scarabs.

endl
10-19-2006, 04:51 PM
Definately a love it or hate it look. When shopping, we thought that it had the most bang for the buck. The looks are still growing on me like my hair used to:o As far as a tow vehicle, I would take it over any ford I tested, the Tahoe, and Sequoia. Don't even look to europe for a tow rig. If at all interested, anything with a Cummins will yank 'til the sun goes down. By far the best diesel applied to a pickup, ever! Used '03 with the 6-speed will run forever.
I have a 06 Dodge Crew and it will pull the X-45 on cruise control faster than I want to go. Great tow vehicle. I get about 17 on the interstate empty and about 10 towing hard. Nice to have the heavy vehicle to help stop it also.

Ric
10-19-2006, 04:52 PM
I have a 06 Dodge Crew and it will pull the X-45 on cruise control faster than I want to go. Great tow vehicle. I get about 17 on the interstate empty and about 10 towing hard. Nice to have the heavy vehicle to help stop it also. carbon is particulary anti domestic tow vehicles

PendO
10-19-2006, 05:06 PM
just ordered a set of 20" snow tires ... legal to put on come Nov. 1st :)

bcampbe7
10-19-2006, 05:11 PM
just ordered a set of 20" snow tires ... legal to put on come Nov. 1st :)

Did you get your new tow vehicle?

PendO
10-19-2006, 05:21 PM
Did you get your new tow vehicle?

YUP:)

I get to drive it on Weekends and when it needs gas!

Carbon Dreams
10-19-2006, 05:22 PM
carbon is particulary anti domestic tow vehicles


Nope, ya missed that one. I gave all my efforts to try and find an SUV that didn't break the bank and still had all the stuff while being "domestic". Whatever that means... Check your build facilities on Chev, Ford, Dodge to see if was made in Mexico or Canada. Anyway, we found that the Armada regardless if it is an import made the most sense.

If the big 3 offered a suitable competitor with the same options and as good or better quality, then yes, I would buy it.

BTW, last I checked, I drive a Dodge MegaCab every day. Definately the best of the best for hauling, towing, or just generally making smoke. :cool:

PendO
10-19-2006, 05:28 PM
I like my Dodge truck ... even if it is German:)

Carbon Dreams
10-19-2006, 07:07 PM
I like my Dodge truck ... even if it is German:)

Ya, Das is gut.

Ric
10-19-2006, 07:36 PM
Nope, ya missed that one. I gave all my efforts to try and find an SUV that didn't break the bank and still had all the stuff while being "domestic". Whatever that means... Check your build facilities on Chev, Ford, Dodge to see if was made in Mexico or Canada. Anyway, we found that the Armada regardless if it is an import made the most sense.

If the big 3 offered a suitable competitor with the same options and as good or better quality, then yes, I would buy it.

BTW, last I checked, I drive a Dodge MegaCab every day. Definately the best of the best for hauling, towing, or just generally making smoke. :cool: seemed like you were beating up the dom's pretty consistently

I still want to know what you meant about chevy half ton gear failures

Carbon Dreams
10-19-2006, 07:56 PM
seemed like you were beating up the dom's pretty consistently

I still want to know what you meant about chevy half ton gear failures

After having 3, yes three scattered rear diffs rebilt in my Blazer, I got tired of it and had a dana 60 built. Oh ya, my 'burb also blew the spider gears. It was my tow rig at the time. And yes, I serviced the fluids regularly.


Where do I start. C-clips are bad. When you do break one, the axels exit the housing with the wheel attached. Happened to me twice. The spider gears, Ring and Pinion gears, are too small for any thing related to heavy duty. Not enough fluid reservoir.

The 3/4 ton Chev's are fine... Great engines and getting better all the time transmissions ala Allison.

Not bashing at all just life lessons learned the hard way. When you are sitting on the side of the road with 100's of parts in your hand, you re-evaluate quickly. I would hope that some GM experts could re-educate me on the benefits to C-clip weak rear ends.

That's all for now.

bigmac
10-19-2006, 09:47 PM
After having 3, yes three scattered rear diffs rebilt in my Blazer, I got tired of it and had a dana 60 built. Oh ya, my 'burb also blew the spider gears. It was my tow rig at the time. And yes, I serviced the fluids regularly.


Where do I start. C-clips are bad. When you do break one, the axels exit the housing with the wheel attached. Happened to me twice. The spider gears, Ring and Pinion gears, are too small for any thing related to heavy duty. Not enough fluid reservoir.

The 3/4 ton Chev's are fine... Great engines and getting better all the time transmissions ala Allison.

Not bashing at all just life lessons learned the hard way. When you are sitting on the side of the road with 100's of parts in your hand, you re-evaluate quickly. I would hope that some GM experts could re-educate me on the benefits to C-clip weak rear ends.

That's all for now.My son blew the Eaton differential in his 99 Silverado a couple of years ago with 140,000 miles on it, but otherwise I've never heard of that in the other ten GM C/K1500's we've had since 1997.

bfrank
10-19-2006, 09:59 PM
Diesel!!!!!!

Diesel
10-19-2006, 10:19 PM
After having 3, yes three scattered rear diffs rebilt in my Blazer, I got tired of it and had a dana 60 built. Oh ya, my 'burb also blew the spider gears. It was my tow rig at the time. And yes, I serviced the fluids regularly.

Where do I start. C-clips are bad. When you do break one, the axels exit the housing with the wheel attached. Happened to me twice. The spider gears, Ring and Pinion gears, are too small for any thing related to heavy duty. Not enough fluid reservoir.

I would hope that some GM experts could re-educate me on the benefits to C-clip weak rear ends.

That's all for now.

GM 1/2 ton rearends are not any worse than any other mfgs. They all use c-clips and there is nothing wrong with a c-clip rearends unless you break an axle (very rare on road) or don't keep up with fluid changes or use out of spec fluid. They have their limits and as long as you stay within those limits you should have no problems.

What year Blazer gave you all the trouble?

I am curious about the Dana 60? Did you switch to all 8-lug running gear and go full float or did you have a 6-lug semi float built? If it was the latter a 30 spline dana 60 with pressed sealed bearings is hardly stronger than a 10-bolt and has it's own failure characteristics. In fact I have seen more sealed axle bearing give up the ghost on semi float 60s than 10 bolt failures.

Personally I will never own a tow vehicle with independent rear suspension. Too many things can go wrong and the benefits simply do not outweigh the potential failures. Plus I do not like the constantly changing caster in the rear wheels. IRS has its place and it is not on a tow vehicle.........JMHO.

Carbon Dreams
10-19-2006, 11:47 PM
Years of failures were '87, '90, '93. Maybe all is well with the newer ones?

The Dana 60 proved its weight in gold. No failures at all. Yes it was the converted 6-lug "Ford" conversion. I removed the press fit bearings and had them inspected after 80K miles. No wear to speak of. Had the backlash checked in the Ring and Pinon with no adjustment needed. For me it has been flawless, much like the 10 bolt stockers have been for others. I wish my stock rear ends had been as good! Sure would have been a whole lot cheaper.

Have had no issues with IFS rear so far. Knock on wood. Towing heavy loads since early '04. For the long hauls and the heavy hauling I still use the Dodge exclusively.

Boy that would be interesting if the rear caster kept changing!:) Maybe you meant camber?? So far no weird tire wear on the Armada. Maybe due to the airbags and limited travel while under weight? You are right, though, a better towing idea is to have a solid rear...Maybe the IFS guys can chime in.

Ric
10-20-2006, 08:54 AM
well at least it makes sense now .. I've run a half dozen or more chevy halfton's in the past 10 years and never an axle issue
They had a front disc brake issue in the 90s :rant: but no diff issues.
Just wanted to be clear on your comments about half ton chivvy axles....

Carry on

Ryan
10-20-2006, 01:45 PM
I was looking at the new Expedition EL yesterday. I did not have time to go for a test drive though. Has anyone driven the Std or EL model with the 6 speed tranny? Any impressions?

I wasn't that impressed with the previous 5 speed and 300hp combination. Curious if you get better feel and acceleration off the line with the new setup.

Overall I like the features on the EL but the nose and guages are throwing me off. They look great in pictures, but less so in person IMO. Of course I lean Suburban/YukonXL, and Seqouia, but I am just starting to shop all large SUVs am far from picking a favorite. I don't know if I can even consider going Nissan because I want me kids to be able to open the rear door. And that high handle alone kills it for me.

bfrank
10-20-2006, 06:06 PM
Why are there so few replies about diesels? 2003 Ford F250 Lariet 6.0. I pull through the Arizona Mountains at whatever speed that I like. It does not matter what the grade is. Average 16.5 MPG, 17 to 18 MPG on the flat. I would never go back to anything but diesel after owning one. There is nothing like cruising uphill at 1800 RPM and being able to accelerate... Use to be a frustrated driver with an F250 5.9 Windsor gas. I pull anywhere from 4,000 LBS (PS 190) to 7,000 LBS (25' boat with 454 longblock).

Ric
10-20-2006, 06:19 PM
Why are there so few replies about diesels? 2003 Ford F250 Lariet 6.0. I pull through the Arizona Mountains at whatever speed that I like. It does not matter what the grade is. Average 16.5 MPG, 17 to 18 MPG on the flat. I would never go back to anything but diesel after owning one. There is nothing like cruising uphill at 1800 RPM and being able to accelerate... Use to be a frustrated driver with an F250 5.9 Windsor gas. I pull anywhere from 4,000 LBS (PS 190) to 7,000 LBS (25' boat with 454 longblock). It was in the paper yesterday... Production and sale of all deisel light duty trucks will be banned in the US after January 2008... Probably why there is less chatter these days.

bfrank
10-20-2006, 06:23 PM
What is the reasoning for that? Emmissions? What is the definition of light duty? What paper?

Ric
10-20-2006, 06:25 PM
What is the reasoning for that? Emmissions? What is the definition of light duty? What paper? it's a smaller story but I know you've all been following it

Ric
10-20-2006, 06:30 PM
Frank, I'm only kidding.... FRANK


Frank come back it was only a joke

Frank?

Somebody call him before he goes out and sells his Diesel this weekend!





Congrats on reaching regular status as well

bfrank
10-20-2006, 06:34 PM
sell it? It sounds like it will be a collecters item

Ric
10-20-2006, 06:37 PM
whew thought we'd lost ya!

bfrank
10-20-2006, 06:39 PM
truck for sale. collecters item. no longer available after 2008. get yours now

Ric
10-20-2006, 06:51 PM
I'll give you a grand cash right now

bfrank
10-20-2006, 07:00 PM
If you can find me in the next 5 minutes, meet me at the truck, its yours for a grand...

Ric
10-20-2006, 07:01 PM
no-can-do, I just dropped a c-clip out of my differential in my chevvy trying to get outta here

bfrank
10-20-2006, 07:02 PM
good one, nice try anyway.

Carbon Dreams
10-20-2006, 07:57 PM
no-can-do, I just dropped a c-clip out of my differential in my chevvy trying to get outta here

Told ya so...:D Now that was good!

Ric
10-21-2006, 01:04 AM
Told ya so...:D Now that was good!

heheheheheh Dont bring that nissan over here carbon, I will tow it off against it's will:rolleyes:

PendO
10-21-2006, 01:34 AM
washed it for the first time tonight:)

PendO
10-21-2006, 01:35 AM
I'll replace with some sunny pics when I get a chance:)

dmayer84
10-21-2006, 02:06 AM
Lookin for some help, trying to get either a Durango or an Avalanche but my dad wont cosign with me saying they are too big. He wants me to get an FJ Cruiser, tow rating 5000, which really wont get the job done, unless I want to get stuck. Just getting agrivated, and id rather get the better credit rating for the better financing.

PendO
10-21-2006, 02:17 AM
Lookin for some help, trying to get either a Durango or an Avalanche but my dad wont cosign with me saying they are too big. He wants me to get an FJ Cruiser, tow rating 5000, which really wont get the job done, unless I want to get stuck. Just getting agrivated, and id rather get the better credit rating for the better financing.

Well, the good thing is you have until next spring before you will need a tow vehicle in the Northeast:) The avalances are sweet ... you will probably be better off if you can get your credit rating to a point where you don't need a cosigner ... also, insurance is a BEEEACH for unmaried males under the age of 25 ... you might want to check insurance rates before you get a vehicle locked in.

Ric
10-21-2006, 10:26 AM
Well, the good thing is you have until next spring before you will need a tow vehicle in the Northeast:) The avalances are sweet ... you will probably be better off if you can get your credit rating to a point where you don't need a cosigner ... also, insurance is a BEEEACH for unmaried males under the age of 25 ... you might want to check insurance rates before you get a vehicle locked in. UMP can help you get your wedding planned over the winter months too

Ric
10-21-2006, 10:28 AM
washed it for the first time tonight:) COOL Keep an eye on the axle clips

dmayer84
10-21-2006, 11:14 PM
After many hours of discussions I am getting a 2005 Durango brand new. Bringing it home next week some time.

6ballsisall
10-21-2006, 11:18 PM
After many hours of discussions I am getting a 2005 Durango brand new. Bringing it home next week some time.

Dmayer.......man I hope it's not to late to swing you in a different direction..............:rolleyes: The Durango and I have some history.......

dmayer84
10-21-2006, 11:22 PM
Dmayer.......man I hope it's not to late to swing you in a different direction..............:rolleyes: The Durango and I have some history.......

Well I am getting the extended warranty 7yr 100,000 and the standard bumper to bumper is 3 yr 30,000 and powertrain is 5 year 70,000. But I might as well ask what happened.

6ballsisall
10-21-2006, 11:25 PM
Well I am getting the extended warranty 7yr 100,000 and the standard bumper to bumper is 3 yr 30,000 and powertrain is 5 year 70,000. But I might as well ask what happened.


It's a total POS.......Erkoehler has one as well and has similar issues. Fit and finish is not good at all. Known issues w/ the brakes (they squeal like no other ALL the time) drivetrain problems.........keep on going. Cruise control went out on my 04' the other day and I only have 40k miles. We have been in a lawsuit w/ Dodge for over a year now........BTW, I have the same warranties you want to get as well, they are only good if they can fix the problems. All this info coming to you from a long time Dodge customer.......

Hoosier Bob
10-21-2006, 11:27 PM
I thought you said car? You can get a pretty bad arse hitch on an Accord! As I read through I realized you were not in need of a car at all! Antway I think it was SanJaun who had the Titan and I think that ride looks bad arse! As far as the Durango good job on the warranty but regardless I think you will enjoy it. I am now a Chrysler employee as well due to a partnership that has been struck. I just picked up 25 more Chrysler dealerships so I will like them period!8p

PendO
10-21-2006, 11:27 PM
It's a total POS.......Erkoehler has one as well and has similar issues. Fit and finish is not good at all. Known issues w/ the brakes (they squeal like no other ALL the time) drivetrain problems.........keep on going. Cruise control went out on my 04' the other day and I only have 40k miles. We have been in a lawsuit w/ Dodge for over a year now........BTW, I have the same warranties you want to get as well, they are only good if they can fix the problems. All this info coming to you from a long time Dodge customer.......

It's those damn Germans:)

PendO
10-21-2006, 11:28 PM
I just picked up 25 more Chrysler dealerships so I will like them period!8p

such a whore :)}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}

PendO
10-21-2006, 11:32 PM
For an 05 w/ any miles that is a pretty significant price to pay unless it is loaded and rolling on dubs.


What kind of options does it have? What trim level is it?

Hoosier Bob
10-21-2006, 11:32 PM
OK Jeff! We all get it! I know of most of the items mentioned. Drivetrain most of all and towing will not make it go away. Assuming an 07 I hope the problems have been resolved. Make sure you take into consideration the rebates on these vehicles right now are nice. Put it asside and I am sure you can upgrade the rearend! Trans, transfer, and shafts are fine but there have been problems with the rearends. Other than that we all trade and trade often so you should be ok. Many owners here have had issues and there may be something out there assuming the deal is not done that may be more cost effective in the long run.
Take care and make it your decision.
Hoosier!
Jeff can answer a ton of your questions in a PM! He has been rode hard by Chrysler but still owns a Jeep!

Hoosier Bob
10-21-2006, 11:33 PM
Yes I am!8p I will make them feel like John Holmes!8p such a whore :)}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}

dmayer84
10-21-2006, 11:41 PM
For an 05 w/ any miles that is a pretty significant price to pay unless it is loaded and rolling on dubs.


What kind of options does it have? What trim level is it?

SLT Premium stereo, 4.7 L v8, 3rd row seat, of course towing package alloy wheels, rear heat controls sticker on it was high 35's.

Hoosier Bob
10-21-2006, 11:46 PM
If you are still wondering I can see what they are getting at the sale. I am assuming no negative EQ for trade and such. I have no problem finding out. Remember a ton of those rides were sold with 5-8k in rebates. $35k could have easily been around 27k or so. MSRP as of late has really not meant so much. 06 and 07's have some really nice 4-5k rebates right now. If you already signed relax but if not good ifo is here. We are all brothers and yes sisters. OK RIC is kind of both!

dmayer84
10-21-2006, 11:53 PM
If you are still wondering I can see what they are getting at the sale. I am assuming no negative EQ for trade and such. I have no problem finding out. Remember a ton of those rides were sold with 5-8k in rebates. $35k could have easily been around 27k or so. MSRP as of late has really not meant so much. 06 and 07's have some really nice 4-5k rebates right now. If you already signed relax but if not good ifo is here. We are all brothers and yes sisters. OK RIC is kind of both!

All that i signed is that we agreed on a price, everything right now as far as he knows depends on insurace for me, I did leave a deposit on it though and filled out a credit application. I originally went in looking for an 06 and they had this 05, what would be awesome is 0% on the 05. Im still working on gettin my down payment together though so nothing is written in stone yet.

Hoosier Bob
10-21-2006, 11:58 PM
Keep me posted and send some PM's. Send me the info and I can find out if all being considered the deal is fair. Remember the new have some great discounts. Yes Jeff is right about a bunch of the troubles experienced with the Durango. I work with over 100 dealers in my area and I am sure I have some contacts in your area. If needed give me a hollar! Or Holler! I do not know which!

rstitson
10-22-2006, 12:00 AM
You say the 4 runner struggles... I was looking at a v8 2004 4runner 6,000 lbs towing capcity. Is your fathers a v8? Will be towing an x-15 behind it. Currently have a GMC 1/2 ton but won't work on a long trip with family.

Hoosier Bob
10-22-2006, 12:04 AM
I had a 4 runner 4 banger pull my old Nautique for awhile. I may know nothing but if you can get a 4Runner with a V8 I would bet you will love it! They (Toyota) know more and do more for the customer than we will ever know. Ever hear anyone who owned one complain? Test her and hook the ride up and see for yourself. I did not see the 4 Runner comment but have a hard time believing it is not very capable.
Two Cents!

dmayer84
10-22-2006, 12:06 AM
You say the 4 runner struggles... I was looking at a v8 2004 4runner 6,000 lbs towing capcity. Is your fathers a v8? Will be towing an x-15 behind it. Currently have a GMC 1/2 ton but won't work on a long trip with family.

He has the V6 in his, but one thing that I noticed is that at higher speeds the trailer was doing more of the driving, but I do have a single axle trailer. Only really ran into problems when going up a hill, at one point I lost traction. I wouldnt reccomend doing a lot of towing with the 4runner and a fully loaded car, I just dont trust that much weight on it.

tex
10-22-2006, 12:07 AM
My favorite tow vehicle?

2002 Blue Prostar 197, 0 Flex Tower, Perfect Pass, and The Preditor

It tows me well!

Hoosier Bob
10-22-2006, 12:08 AM
So how does it do on the street, DORK? WILL YOU PLEASE SEND ME SOME OF THOSE VIKES!

tex
10-22-2006, 12:23 AM
So which would be worse?...hull on the streets or tumbleturns on the street?

Hoosier Bob
10-22-2006, 01:21 AM
Sorry I missed your sign off Tex! Man I have had a fewplenty! Typing g e tting s l o w I can 't. Ju st , making no s ense hav e to sign off n m ow! MEOW!

6ballsisall
10-22-2006, 10:18 AM
I bought my Durango for just under 30k in June of 2004. It stickered for 40,139. It's a Limited fully loaded w/ every option. FWIW

André
10-22-2006, 12:27 PM
I bought my Durango for just under 30k in June of 2004. It stickered for 40,139. It's a Limited fully loaded w/ every option. FWIW
So,Jeff,tell how you like your Durango...;)

dmayer84
10-22-2006, 10:05 PM
Decided to go and get my deposit back tomorrow. Just gonna wait till the spring and not get something that I could end up hating because of problems. Thanks for the heads up. Just hoping that my car will make it through the winter.

Doug G
10-22-2006, 11:52 PM
I have an 04 Durango. Bought new now have about 74,000 miles on it. I do 105 miles a day minimum and it has been great. I use it for work, towing the boat and running fire calls and have had no problems. Knock on wood ... When I was researching it in 04 the tow rating and consumer reports was one of the best for the class. I have not had any of the electrical gremlins they are reported to have. Clean livin I guess. My dad does more miles than I do and has been driving Chrysler products for years. He hasn't retired one with less than 150k miles yet and has had the same good experience that I do. On the other hand I have never had a Chevy go more than 75K without costing me big $$$.

Chrysler has my business. Now I just have to figure out what the tow rating is for the new Charger :D Just my :twocents: FWIW

erkoehler
10-22-2006, 11:54 PM
Are you on a volunteer fire dept, or?????

Doug G
10-22-2006, 11:55 PM
Yes Asst. Chief of local VFD.

6ballsisall
10-23-2006, 12:00 AM
So,Jeff,tell how you like your Durango...;)

I am numb at this point w/ the POS. I am beyond the car........BUT I could easily go postal on Daimler Chrysler with no remorse.........:rolleyes: