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george111
10-02-2006, 11:32 PM
I have a "94 205 which seems to want to grunt to a hesitant start. It starts, but it sounds like it does not want to. I have a new altenator and I measure 13.75 V when the motor is running. The battery is new and well charged. I have cleaned the terminals at the altinator, battery and the starter(including the seloniod). My gauge reads about 6 volts before I crank the engine and never gets above 12.25 when the engine is running, despite the fact that the battery reads 13.75 when the engine is running.I intend to replace both the starter and selinoid this fall as I bought the boat 2nd hand and want it to run next summer. I intend to replace all major connectors(battery, starter,altenator). I do not have a wiring diagram. My question is what else should I be looking at on an older boat(525hrs) electrically? What other contacts should I be cleaning? Are volt meters worth replacing or adjustable? I am in Pennsylvania, so there is moisture. Any suggestions about that?

How difficult is it to drop the gauge pannel other than the five screws?
Am I going to get myself in a lot of trouble doing it? I worked in the Navey on electrical and electronic stuff but it has been about 40 years and the stuff is different. Cost is not a big problem, pride is!
Thanks for your help,

George

george111
10-02-2006, 11:41 PM
I forgot to ask, any suggestions as to where I could get a wiring diagram?

Thanks,

George

erkoehler
10-02-2006, 11:42 PM
You can drop the gauges pretty easily....go for it take a look :)

There are a few MC techs on the board, and I'm sure that they'll be along in the next 24 hours to help you further.

Hoosier Bob
10-02-2006, 11:44 PM
My first guess would be the battery. Either not enough amps or coroded connection. Are you saying it turns over very slowly? Regardless if you have a fuelie or carb it seems to me you have enough from the alt and it is firing so my guess would have to be the battery/connections.
Good luck, keep posting, post some pics of your ride and let us know what you find!

MarkP
10-02-2006, 11:45 PM
Hey george,
That sounds Bad!! You had better unload it!! Let me know;)

george111
10-02-2006, 11:49 PM
It is not the battery or its connections. I have two batterys and change them. The terminals are "impecable." The batterys show full charge after I change them and test them. So it is not the batterys or the connections. I suspect it is somewhere else, which is why I asked the question.

Thanks,

George

MarkP
10-02-2006, 11:51 PM
It is not the battery or its connections. I have two batterys and change them. The terminals are "impecable." The batterys show full charge after I change them and test them. So it is not the batterys or the connections. I suspect it is somewhere else, which is why I asked the question.

Thanks,

George
WELL,

if you insist on keeping it,
Donít waste any time on it and bring it to Edís Generator Service in the South Hills.. itís a few miles South of the Liberty Tunnels on 51..
They will test it and fix it..
412-881-0300

JimN
10-02-2006, 11:52 PM
Check the ground on the back of the motor. It's either loose or rusted. Low voltage gauge reading is usually a good indication of this. A bad motor ground will also kill the starter.

Hoosier Bob
10-02-2006, 11:53 PM
I am not as knowledgible of the 205. Eastie may be able to enlighten. The ignition switch may be the culprit but you can reach that without disassembling the dash. I will check for some diagrams.:(

george111
10-02-2006, 11:57 PM
Hi Mark,

I bought this boat after mine was lost in the Pisstburgh floods of 2005.
The lost boat was a malibu which we had beaten the hell out of ,but we loved it. I now have a newer mastercraft that has been nothing other than a pain in the ***. Newer, less hours by half , but a pain. I have done more work in the last year than I ever did in 10 years with the Malibu. I am not knocking mastercraft, just my boat, which I never tell my wife that I think is a piece of....you know.

george

george111
10-03-2006, 01:07 AM
Thanks for all your responses. I will consider all and any that you suggest.I know that this is not a Battery prob, or its connections, but am curious as to what it could be? Please see my original list of questions to see if you can help me.

Thanks,

George

cwright
10-03-2006, 11:55 AM
I had a suburban do this once and finally pulled the starter, took it to a parts store that has a tester (they do it for free),, and it was drawing way too many amps when energized. Not sure if the motor rotor was bent, or why it was drawing too many amps, but it was. Bought a new starter (based on the failed test) and my problems went away, for two years. happened again and fortunately I had bought the lifetime warranty and had the receipt so I took it back and got another one. Never haappened again, sold the burb 5 years later.

Testing the starter might be a reasonable thing to do, even if it only serves to rule it out.

pkskier
10-03-2006, 01:17 PM
From personal experience I know that the solenoid can become weak over the years and cause the problem you are describing.

Hunterb
10-03-2006, 01:18 PM
You must test the starter. I had a similar situation with my truck recently. The starter would turn slowly regardless of the battery/cable/connection situation. Had the starter rebuilt and reinstalled it and it turned over so fast it scared me.

Bruce

JimN
10-03-2006, 03:16 PM
Thinking that a battery or the cables won't matter when the battery, cables and starter don't really care what you think. The clamps are only part of the equation. The motor ground, solenoid contacts, etc all need ot be checked in order to find hte source of the problem. Another thing that I haven't seen in this thread is the mating surface of the block and starter, This is where the starter, and therefore the solenoid, get their ground reference and if there is resistance, the voltage drops and current increases. This not only causes the starter to turn slowly, it also causes a lot of excess heat at the solenoid contacts and in the windings of the starter. Arcing at the brushes doesn't help, either.

Starters need regular servicing and in a boat, it's a lot more important than in a car or truck unless the on-road vehicle is driven through water or is usually in a humid environment. If the shaft and gear aren't lubed frequently, they like to freeze in place. Not only can this cause total starter failure, it kills batteries (which then kills the alternator) and if the Bendix can't extend fully, the gear beats the crap out of the ring gear on the flywheel.

george111
10-05-2006, 10:46 PM
I want to thank all of you who have replied with suggestions. You cannot believe how helpful you have been. I have not explored all your suggestions as I intend to do that this weekend. You have given me a lot to research and I suspect I will find some of my problems.

Thanks again,

George

Hoosier Bob
10-05-2006, 10:58 PM
We all like to keep our rides running George so keep us updated and post some pics of your ride. Some great advice so far.I want to thank all of you who have replied with suggestions. You cannot believe how helpful you have been. I have not explored all your suggestions as I intend to do that this weekend. You have given me a lot to research and I suspect I will find some of my problems.

Thanks again,

George

george111
10-05-2006, 11:23 PM
I am not sure you REALLY want pictures. I have a ski boat because my kids wanted one and we belonged to a water ski club(subsequentualy.) I like my ski boat, though the "kids" are no longer living here and we love our small club. However, I spend no time cleaning or tending to the boat. It is for my and my wife's pleasure and should take care of its self. Our marina puts it in and takes it out. They store it and fix it. That is their job and I pay promptly.

I have learned to fix some problems recently due to expediancy, otherwise I would have waited. When I want it to run, I want it to run. So, sometimes I have to speed up the process by doing it myself.

My boat is party central for lots of kids. They can eat popcorn, slop pop drinks and spray shaving cream. I think kids should have fun. I have seen parents force their kids to stand on a hot dock and eat for fear that some dropping may fall on their boat. Not me. Boats are for fun. Used and abused.

My kids, who are grown now, used our boat big time, and at times abused it, for which I barked some, but not a lot. We had memorable times on that boat. Times I will never forget. I wish all of you the same.

The popcorn,chips, and slopped pop are easy to clean if you just leave the cover off on a rainy night. God cleans it!

Thanks again for all your good advice, and I will use it. Clean the boat; no way!

Thanks, George

george111
10-05-2006, 11:35 PM
As an addition to my prior post:

I did not mean to offend any of the "purist" here for their love of their boats.

I just think of mine differently than many and for that reason thought "pictures" were a bad idea. Mine is but a tool for fun and I care nothing about beauty. I put it in in the Spring (late April and it comes out in early November) no bottom cleaning needed by my standards.

That is just my opinion and I do not fault others for their different opinions.

George

Hoosier Bob
10-05-2006, 11:41 PM
No offense taken here. Your experiences are very frustrating. I expect a lot out of my ride as well. I have ridden her hard and put her away wet many times! MM2.75. She is just a boat and regular care is expected and deserved. Soon the ride will be fixed and the abuse will continue! Hey, you can talk about all kinds of crap here that has nothing to do with your ride!
So do you like beer?

Farmer Ted
10-05-2006, 11:42 PM
I am not sure you REALLY want pictures. I have a ski boat because my kids wanted one and we belonged to a water ski club(subsequentualy.) I like my ski boat, though the "kids" are no longer living here and we love our small club. However, I spend no time cleaning or tending to the boat. It is for my and my wife's pleasure and should take care of its self. Our marina puts it in and takes it out. They store it and fix it. That is their job and I pay promptly.

I have learned to fix some problems recently due to expediancy, otherwise I would have waited. When I want it to run, I want it to run. So, sometimes I have to speed up the process by doing it myself.

My boat is party central for lots of kids. They can eat popcorn, slop pop drinks and spray shaving cream. I think kids should have fun. I have seen parents force their kids to stand on a hot dock and eat for fear that some dropping may fall on their boat. Not me. Boats are for fun. Used and abused.

My kids, who are grown now, used our boat big time, and at times abused it, for which I barked some, but not a lot. We had memorable times on that boat. Times I will never forget. I wish all of you the same.

The popcorn,chips, and slopped pop are easy to clean if you just leave the cover off on a rainy night. God cleans it!

Thanks again for all your good advice, and I will use it. Clean the boat; no way!

Thanks, George


why didn't you buy another Malibu?

Ryan
10-06-2006, 11:46 AM
I had this issue and the solution was a new starter motor. Fires up really fast now. I had gotten used to the slow turning starts, and the associated fear that it wouldn't start. It's nice to trust the boat now.

MarkP
10-06-2006, 01:16 PM
why didn't you buy another Malibu?
Because he didnít want everyone to laugh at him;)

george111
10-07-2006, 09:40 AM
TO: Hoosier Bob, Of course I love beer. Coronas when it is hot and Penn Pilsners when it is cold.

To Farmer Ted:The other boat I was looking at was a Malibu and I now regret not buying it. The first thing I discovered wrong on the MC was the computer which had water in it. The old one now hangs on my office wall as my "Most Expensive" art piece. I have had some trying times with my MC, but eventually I will work the bugs out. It has been a "learning experiance."

To Mark: When I could not get the MC to start at the ski island docks, the guy that fixed it owns a Malibu. Do you think I laughed at his boat?

Again, thanks to all of you for your help. I will be crawling around the MC this weekend looking for bad grounds. I use to think that had to do with coffee.
George

JimN
10-07-2006, 11:17 AM
George- you really need to consider the fact that the previous owner just may not have taken care of this boat the way he should have. If the computer had water in it, it wouldn't have gotten there from being dry all of the time. The ECMs are sealed at all edges. Did you see anything that looked like pry marks? That's where the water got in and even if there aren't any, it's a Delphi or maintenance issue, not MC. You haven't had the boat very long and have had problems with it- can you list the rest and from your experiences, were the others due to water getting into the wiring or contacts? The ECM and starter are from that and it's possible that he soaked it. You could have bought any other brand and still had the same problems.

george111
10-07-2006, 01:55 PM
Hi Jim,

I am only joking about MC. I like the boat and realize that anytime you buy 2nd hand there can be suprises.So do not think I am here to slam MC. I appreciate this board and the help I have been given.

George

MarkP
10-07-2006, 02:05 PM
Hi Jim,

I am only joking about MC. I like the boat and realize that anytime you buy 2nd hand there can be suprises.So do not think I am here to slam MC. I appreciate this board and the help I have been given.

George
Good point! It is sometimes a crap shoot when you get something usedÖ

Hoosier Bob
10-07-2006, 07:07 PM
I have been watching for two hours and the guy hasn't missed yet! What a talent!