PDA

View Full Version : winterizing an LT1


mika
09-11-2006, 11:43 AM
Hi all. Sick of paying for what I can do. So this year I am winterizing my self. I have searched this forum and have found some great information. Thanks to all that have added their input. However in a search I ran across one thread that made me think. It was a thread that said all you had to do with an LT1 was drain the block and exhaust. Granted the thread author lived in LA so I was thinking that might be the reason. However I live in MI and just wanted to make sure that pulling coolant throught the LT1 was not a problem. Thinking that RV antifreez might have some issues with the aluminum heads. Any input would be welcome.

Also just to confirm Dextron III for the powerslot correct?

Thanks

I wish summer was not almost over :(

JimN
09-11-2006, 12:01 PM
When I worked for the MC dealers, we put fuel stabilizer in the tank and ran the motor to normal operating temperature to make sure the stabilizer went through the whole fuel system, change the oil and filter and run it for a few minutes to get the old oil mixed with the new (to dilute the old stuff), fogged it thoroughly, shut it down, pulled the plugs and knock sensor, removed the lowest parts of all hoses and drained them and then cranked it over to get the rest of the water out. Service the starter,disconnect and remove the battery, spray corrosion inhibitor on it, clean and reoil the flame arrestor, do any trailer service needed, clean what needs cleaning, hang at least one Damp-Rid (or equivalent) in it and cover it up, making sure it can breathe. Put all motor plugs and the knock sensor in a Zip-lock bag and attach it to the steeering wheel or in the drink holder on the dash, in clear view, along with the hull plug. If you have a heater, drain it and blow compressed air through it, at low to moderate pressure. If you want, run RV anti-freeze through the heater system without getting into the motor. If you have a ballast system, drain it and run RV anti-freeze through that, too. Remove the impeller from the raw water pump or remove the cover from the raw water pump.

NOTE- if your motor has a petcock on the block, don't just open it, remove it completely so any sand or silt can be removed. The water needs to gush out, not just trickle out. If it trickles, send a thin wire into the block and move it around so the garbage can be loosened. If needed, get a hose bib and shoot water into the block to cause the stuff to loosen.

Don't use RV anti-freeze and definitely don't pour regular anti-freeze in it!

In spring, change the spark plugs and if you use reformulated gas, take a fuel sample before going out and replace the raw water pump impeller. Either fill the tank completely or run it very low and put tape over the tank vent and filler cap. Tarp tape is great for this.

Dex III is fine but check what is in it now to make sure it's ATF or 20W. You should be able to smell the difference.

boatless
09-11-2006, 12:29 PM
I wish there is a completed detail list of how to drain the water from any part of the engine that need to be drain. A list that has pictures. And how to change the the fluid in the pro-slot.

boatless.

east tx skier
09-11-2006, 12:32 PM
In the FAQ thread, there is a winterization checklist attachment. There is also a link to an article on aquaskier that contains pictures of the process.

boatless
09-11-2006, 12:40 PM
east tx skier,

Could you link me to that site ? I went to the FAQ and did a search, it came up empty.

Thanks,

boatless.

east tx skier
09-11-2006, 12:42 PM
You betcha! The aquaskier link appears to still work.

It's getting cold/warm outside, what do I need to do to winterize/dewinterize my boat? (http://www.tmcowners.com/teamtalk/showpost.php?p=103139&postcount=6)

boatless
09-11-2006, 03:42 PM
east tx skier,

Thanks so much. I do have a few questions. What engine do you have and is your boat still under warranty ? I have an LT1 with power slot and heaters. It said I can't use the pink antifreeze then what do I use ? And more importantly, where are the pictures. How do I know where and what to disconnect ? :D

Thanks,

boatless.

Ben
09-12-2006, 07:53 AM
It was a thread that said all you had to do with an LT1 was drain the block and exhaust. Granted the thread author lived in LA so I was thinking that might be the reason. However I live in MI and just wanted to make sure that pulling coolant throught the LT1 was not a problem. Thinking that RV antifreez might have some issues with the aluminum heads. Any input would be welcome.

I wish summer was not almost over :(

Mika, ditto on the weather, especially this week.

I unfortunately used marine antifreeze my 1st year (dealer said to do so), but haven't used it in the past few years, since consulting this site of "experts". Do what Jim said. My only addition is that my boat hibernates about 2 hours south, so I tow it with the engine block plugs, etc out for 2 hours, which may bounce a bit more water around & out. If you are nervous, just drive around locally a bit, maybe hit Walton Rd. in pontiac, that would certainly get any water out.... Either way, no antifreeze has worked for me & the LT1 for a few years now....

PM if you have any ?'s or want to call.

east tx skier
09-12-2006, 10:22 AM
east tx skier,

Thanks so much. I do have a few questions. What engine do you have and is your boat still under warranty ? I have an LT1 with power slot and heaters. It said I can't use the pink antifreeze then what do I use ? And more importantly, where are the pictures. How do I know where and what to disconnect ? :D

Thanks,

boatless.

Mine is a 351 HO and well out of warranty, but by and large, the procedures are the same (though the parts such as oil filter, fuel filter, etc. may differ). The pictures are in the "aquaskier link" in the link I posted above. That's a chevy motor, though not an LT1.

As for the antifreeze question, I'll let JimN address that. I'm not familiar enough with antifreeze and how it might negatively affect aluminum heads to really speak to that question. Now as your heater goes, you might want to use it there if you can't get all the water blown out. But I don't have a heater and am not familiar with the procedure.

I have winterized my own boat using Jim's advice along with other tips I've picked up. I don't bother with antifreeze. I just drain it, spin the water pump, and drive it around up and down hills for 10--15 minutes to make sure the water can drain. I have never had a problem. But again, I am in a warmer climate. Jim is not necessarily in a warm climate though.

captain planet
09-12-2006, 03:16 PM
Hi all. Sick of paying for what I can do. So this year I am winterizing my self. I have searched this forum and have found some great information. Thanks to all that have added their input. However in a search I ran across one thread that made me think. It was a thread that said all you had to do with an LT1 was drain the block and exhaust. Granted the thread author lived in LA so I was thinking that might be the reason. However I live in MI and just wanted to make sure that pulling coolant throught the LT1 was not a problem. Thinking that RV antifreez might have some issues with the aluminum heads. Any input would be welcome.

Also just to confirm Dextron III for the powerslot correct?

Thanks

I wish summer was not almost over :(

I have winterized my 1998 Anniversary since I bought it new in 1999 (has the LT-1). I fill the tank and add Sta-bil, warm the engine, change the oil, drain the block, drain the heater hoses, then fill the heater with low-tox antifreeze until it comes out the other heater hose (reconnect hoses), start the engine and let the pump pull 3 gals of low-tox antifreeze into the block while I am fogging the engine. Turn off and clean up engine and K&N air filter. I don't drain the antifreeze I leave it in the engine. I haven't heard anyone tell me that leaving in regular anti-freeze (even low-tox) over the winter is a bad thing. :confused:
If it is it must take longer than 8 years to have an effect.

My buddy sprays his engine with WD-40 at the end of the season and his engine really looks nice.

east tx skier
09-12-2006, 03:41 PM
I remember trying to figure out what the deal with antifreeze and aluminum was. I seem to recall something about phosphates in antifreeze being the issue. Jim will know the answer to this.

JimN
09-12-2006, 04:17 PM
Aluminum is a very reactive metal and because of this, any anti-freeze needs to be compatible with it. Remember the first Dex-Cool in Saturn cars? Texaco didn't make the coolant quite right and it ate through thousands of radiators.

Also, we were told at MC training specifically not to use any RV anti-freeze on the LT-1 or any other aluminum motor.

captain planet
09-12-2006, 05:43 PM
I contacted Indmar today about antifreeze in my LT-1. Here is my question:

I have a 1998 Mastercraft 30th Anniversary Prostar 190
with the LT-1 350 HP engine. Two questions for winterization. I winterize
the engine with regular antifreeze after I drain the block. Is it OK to
leave the antifreeze in over the winter or will this damage the engine? I
would think that it would be OK since a Corvette uses regular antifreeze.
My second question is what is the recommended oil for that engine? I
believe it is 20W50, however my owners manual is with my boat (an hour
away). Can you please confirm these two questions for me?

Thier response:

The anti-freeze will not hurt the engine. We winterize several thousand
engines per year here and we do not use anti-freeze in any of them. It is
really not needed if the engine block and manifolds are drained of all
water. Also, you have to be sure to drain it out in the spring before you
put the boat in the water as it is against the law to just back the boat in
the water and flush the anti-freeze into the lake.

The manual for that engine did call for 20W50. If you have a hard time
finding 20W50 you can use 15W40 which is what we use in the engines today.

Larry Engelbert
Indmar Service

Hope this helps for all those with the LT-1.

JimN
09-12-2006, 06:54 PM
OK, your question and Larry's answer was regarding regular anti-freeze. That should never be introduced to any waterway for any reason, in any quantity. I would re-pose the question to be about RV anti-freeze.

I have never used any kind of anti-freeze in an LT-1 and have never had a motor freeze. The theory behind completely draining the motor is that if there's almost no liquid in the motor, it can't expand enough by freezing to do any damage. If the water behind the thermostats is either isolated from the anti-freeze by one ot both thermostats closing or there isn't enough anti-freeze in the motor, it can freeze and cause damage.

If it was my boat, I would drain it. JMHO

east tx skier
09-12-2006, 09:22 PM
Jim, I have a print out of your winterization instructions from the first or so incarnation of this forum (I think they were specific to the LT1). I used them to make that list I have on here along with some of your other posts from back then. Thank you for making it easy and understandable. This will be my fourth year to DIY it. I have a ball with it and have learned a lot of about the boat in the process. Always satisfying when it actually starts up come spring, too.

JimN
09-12-2006, 10:59 PM
"I have a ball with it"

Doug- you need to get out more often.

Actually, the list works on any motor.

If the boat is on the water normally, and the oil can be changed before running it to the launch, that's best. The easy way to get the whole thing done is by putting the stabilizer in when it's at the dock, run it around to get it up to temperature, get it on the trailer and fog it, shut it down and pull the plugs and hoses. Otherwise, change it after the last run and do the rest later. A short run to the launch won't really hurt anything- it's still fresh oil and filter. Drive it home or to the storage location and by the time it gets there, the water is out. Then, spray the anti-corrosion, clean it, hang the Damp-Rid, bag all of the plugs and put them where they won't be missed, cover it and service the trailer.

Having a check list is the best way to do all of this. A local boat dealership may give you a copy of theirs, too.

captain planet
09-13-2006, 09:10 AM
Jim, Yea, I didn't ask him about RV antifreeze because I have been told NUMEROUS times not to put it into a motor with alum heads. The part I wanted clarified for my own use was the part about leaving the regular antifreeze in over the winter. I read somewhere on here to drain it out after running it through your engine because it might do something to it if you don't remove it which didn't make sense to me.
Anyway, I thought a response directly from Indmar on this board would be helpful.

JimN
09-13-2006, 09:27 AM
The regular anti-freeze isn't as bad for the aluminum as the RV type but the regular kind can't be introduced to any body of water. If the DNR sees you launch a boat and there's a green plume behind it, they'll fine you, may confiscate the boat and mount you on their wall like a bass. That stuff is really toxic to just about all animals, even in small concentrations. I can't think of any real benefit to using it and it sounds like more trouble than it's worth. Draining it, cranking it over for a few seconds to clear the circulating pump (which I omitted before) and removing the raw water pump impeller or removing the cover plate has worked well for a lot of people, even here in the frozen tundra.

captain planet
09-13-2006, 01:44 PM
Yea, I completely flush my engine and contain all antifreeze/water mixture that comes out of the engine in the spring. The three gallons of low-tox antifreeze that I start with usually ends up being around 12-15 gallons of antifreeze/water mix to dispose of.

east tx skier
09-13-2006, 02:13 PM
"I have a ball with it"

Doug- you need to get out more often.


Ain't that the truth. :)

captain planet
09-13-2006, 02:18 PM
You know, I would like to winterize my boat by just draining the block and engine of all the water, but I am afraid I would miss something that woud cost me in the spring. Other than the two ports on the block and the ports on each exhaust manifold, what else is there? Disconnect each hose? I hate to use/waste antifreeze for winterization, but having something cracked in the spring doesn't sound very fun.

east tx skier
09-13-2006, 02:26 PM
You know, I would like to winterize my boat by just draining the block and engine of all the water, but I am afraid I would miss something that woud cost me in the spring. Other than the two ports on the block and the ports on each exhaust manifold, what else is there? Disconnect each hose? I hate to use/waste antifreeze for winterization, but having something cracked in the spring doesn't sound very fun.

The four plugs you mentioned (take them completely out; don't rely on just pulling the petcocks; I replaced all the petcocks with brass plugs for $2). If the hoses are level (e.g. from the tranny cooler to the pump housing), I pull both ends, if they are more vertically inclined, (e.g. the hoses going from the tstate to the exhaust manifold, I just unhook the bottom). Lastly, pull the kill switch/safety lanyard, and spin the motor over for 5 seconds or so. This will get the water out of the pump housing (these hoses are disconnected). Shoot a flashlight into the plug holes and make sure there isn't rust or something clogging them. A coat hang wire can be used to ensure no blockage. Shine the light into the tranny cooler to check for debris, too.

mika
09-18-2006, 12:11 PM
Thanks Ben. You are so right about Walton Rd, LOL. I talked to Indmar and the tech there said no worries with either RV or regular antifreeze in an LT-1. However I am thinking about using none. Hey has anyone tried to simply hook up an air line and blowing out the passages, kind of like a sprinkler system? Just a thought I have not worked out logistics in my head yet it that would work (raw water pump and he engine pump). Going to bring it home soon, so I guess that does mean summer is over :(

mika
09-18-2006, 12:18 PM
Well since finally reading all the other thread I am going to go the route of no antifreeze. Thanks for all your input it is priceless. :D

east tx skier
09-18-2006, 12:35 PM
Thanks Ben. You are so right about Walton Rd, LOL. I talked to Indmar and the tech there said no worries with either RV or regular antifreeze in an LT-1. However I am thinking about using none. Hey has anyone tried to simply hook up an air line and blowing out the passages, kind of like a sprinkler system? Just a thought I have not worked out logistics in my head yet it that would work (raw water pump and he engine pump). Going to bring it home soon, so I guess that does mean summer is over :(

Based on my rudamentary understanding of all of this, I have never understood it to be absolutely imperative to get all traces of water out of the engine, hoses, pump housing, etc. If there is a drop or two still in there, so long as its expansion can't crack the block, hose, pump, etc., then all will be well. Pulling the boat over hill and dale would be enough to satisfy me that an unplugged motor will have released sufficient water to prevent freezing problems. I can't imagine that anything left after that would pose a threat. Given the $$$$ we put into these boats, I understand why we worry though.

Some believe that antifreeze has value for its rust prevention as well. While I have read that RV antifreeze may or may not really do all that much in this area, in my case, there's already rust and I can live with it.

If anyone would like to elaborate on any of this, or if I am incorrect, please don't hesitate.

mika
09-18-2006, 12:44 PM
Yeah I have the same rudamentary understanding.

Actually I am looking forward to winterizing the boat. BTW EZ nice pictures of your boat.

JimN
09-18-2006, 02:47 PM
I really would like to see some consistency regarding what should/shouldn't be done. We were told specifically that RV should NOT be used, now Indmar says it's OK. If the formulation has changed, fine but that should be stated, too.

If Indmar says it's OK, the choice is up to the boat owner, I guess.

NeilM
09-21-2006, 02:13 PM
I really would like to see some consistency regarding what should/shouldn't be done. We were told specifically that RV should NOT be used, now Indmar says it's OK. If the formulation has changed, fine but that should be stated, too.

If Indmar says it's OK, the choice is up to the boat owner, I guess.

My MerCruiser manual also stated not to use straight RV antifreeze because it has no rust inhibitors in it.
I know the pink stuff I buy says nothing about rust...

This year, except for the ballast system, shower, and the heater, everything's dry -- I took JimN's advice -- will let you know how that worked out next summer :huh:

JimN
09-21-2006, 05:17 PM
I would blow air through the heater core. Those haven't had any problems with corrosion, AFAIK when RV anti-freeze was used.

Larry115
09-17-2013, 03:45 PM
Hi .....I just purchased a 98 205 with a vortec engine. I'm looking for detailed descriptions on how to winterize my boat. It will be stored inside, but stored in the Pacific Northwest where it snows a lot...
Thanks, larry

FrankSchwab
09-17-2013, 05:24 PM
Post 4 of this thread?

jakethebt
09-17-2013, 05:53 PM
http://www.mastercraft.com/teamtalk/showthread.php?t=51183