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DanC
08-09-2006, 08:55 PM
For those of you with trailers that have brake problems (like mine had) or problems towing when empty :)

Check out this link, http://www.ufpnet.com/
Click on the Actuators button. Look like yours?

At this link http://www.rbbi.com/folders/show/98imtec/misc/awards.htm I found this about UFP trailer parts.

Boating Writers International administers the Innovation Awards 1998

TRAILERS
Unique Functional Products' Disk Brakes

UFP introduces a new disk brake and surge hitch designed especially for
marine use. The hitch and brake combination eliminate chucking, that
uncomfortable back-and-forth lurching caused by the trailer braking at
different rates than the tow vehicle. This is not an automotive product
converted for marine use, but rather a system that has rust-proofed all
potential binding points, eliminated all metal-to-metal contacts in the
caliper slider and pivot pin and uses all stainless steel in the brake pad
surfaces.


How can you blame MC designers for using the "Product of the Year"?
;)

betsy&david Harrison
08-09-2006, 08:59 PM
It looks very much like what is on my trailer. B

Jim
08-21-2006, 01:42 AM
For those of you with trailers that have brake problems (like mine had) or problems towing when empty :)

Check out this link, http://www.ufpnet.com/
Click on the Actuators button. Look like yours?

At this link http://www.rbbi.com/folders/show/98imtec/misc/awards.htm I found this about UFP trailer parts.

Boating Writers International administers the Innovation Awards 1998

TRAILERS
Unique Functional Products' Disk Brakes

UFP introduces a new disk brake and surge hitch designed especially for
marine use. The hitch and brake combination eliminate chucking, that
uncomfortable back-and-forth lurching caused by the trailer braking at
different rates than the tow vehicle. This is not an automotive product
converted for marine use, but rather a system that has rust-proofed all
potential binding points, eliminated all metal-to-metal contacts in the
caliper slider and pivot pin and uses all stainless steel in the brake pad
surfaces.


How can you blame MC designers for using the "Product of the Year"?
;)

Dan,

What type of actuator did you have when you were having problems?
Was your trailer made by Reliable?

Jim

bigmac
08-21-2006, 08:45 AM
That UFP actuator isn't what's on my 2004 MC trailer, but is what came on my buddy's 2005 Four Winns trailer. I've had occasion to pull that empty and loaded and it works very well. No hopping, no surging, no brake issues of any kind in hauling the thing all the way from New York.

Ric
08-21-2006, 11:11 AM
That looks exactly like the actuator that was on my '00 190 but it is not exactly like the actuator on my 05 197

DanC
08-21-2006, 12:19 PM
Dan,

What type of actuator did you have when you were having problems?
Was your trailer made by Reliable?

Jim

I haven't had any problems with my actuator. I don't know who made my 2003 MC trailer but the actuator looks just like the UFP one. I haven't had problems with the chucking or hopping.

I was referring to the many posts about the fact that ALL ~2003 MC trailers have a marginal design flaw in the calipers that cause them to start dragging after the pads wear down past half way point. MC issued a service bulletin but I guess some dealers don't get them, don't read them, or pretend not to know about them. Since the trailer is out of warranty by the time the problem appears (depends on how much far you trailer), it can take some "persuasion" to get a dealer to take care of the problem.

Apparently "a system that has rust-proofed all potential binding points, eliminated all metal-to-metal contacts in the caliper slider and pivot pin and uses all stainless steel in the brake pad surfaces." can still have a catastrophic problem if the tolerances of the caliper's cylinder bore are incorrect.

With all the bashing of the MC trailer and condemnations of "what a poor design" I just thought it worth noting. MC designers made what appeared to have been a superior design decision (as noted by the BWI) by choosing a "product of the year".

Sh*t happens, even to good designers.

Andyg
08-21-2006, 12:47 PM
My 2003 trailer doesn't have that actuator on it. The day I looked at my boat the salesman/owner at my dealer told me the brake actuator needed to be replaced before I could take delivery. Something about some corrosion on the one that was on there.

The best part was when the dealer hooked up the brake line to the master cylinder they managed to loosen one of the brake line connections further down the trailer tongue. It ended up spraying brake fluid everywhere. And of course it had to be DOT 5 so it likes to eat paint. You can see that my trailer tongue has been corroded due to it. It is a long convoluted story as to why it isn't fixed so I won't go into that.

bigmac
08-21-2006, 12:50 PM
With all the bashing of the MC trailer and condemnations of "what a poor design" I just thought it worth noting. MC designers made what appeared to have been a superior design decision (as noted by the BWI) by choosing a "product of the year".

Sh*t happens, even to good designers.

IMHO, it's not the poor design - Sh*t happens. It's what you as a company do about it once that poor design is uncovered. Recalls, extended warranty, replacement of components that are reported to be constantly failing...I've seen other companies address a similar situation that way. When I complained about my trailer hopping around unloaded with a MC rep (not dealer), she addressed it by telling me, essentially, "Sh*t happens". IMHO, they own that poor design...but they're making me own it.

The concept puts me in mind of MasterCraft's in-tank fuel pump design.

Ric
08-21-2006, 12:53 PM
anybody wanna bet on whether there have been discussions at mc about dropping the trailer line and going to an outside manufacturer the way the other boat manufacturers do?
mc trailers are beautiful but they need far more attention from design to manufacture to q/c to warranty because these are essential to a great day at the lake for the majority of mc customers.

DanC
08-21-2006, 01:30 PM
anybody wanna bet on whether there have been discussions at mc about dropping the trailer line and going to an outside manufacturer the way the other boat manufacturers do?
mc trailers are beautiful but they need far more attention from design to manufacture to q/c to warranty because these are essential to a great day at the lake for the majority of mc customers.


An outside manufacturer is not necessarily the answer. The SBT trailers under the Malibu's have had a lot more problems than my MC trailer. And my DHM wasn't too great either.

Correct Craft made their own trailers (don't know about now) and they were great.

BigMac
??? I don't see many inboard companies sending out a recall notice to their owners on their boats.
And I have seen Malibu address their (Reliable's) torsion bar failure/recall the same way. No recall or service notice, they don't say a word until it fails, then you have to complain really loud to get it taken care of.

bigmac
08-21-2006, 01:51 PM
:twocents:

BigMac
??? I don't see many inboard companies sending out a recall notice to their owners on their boats.
And I have seen Malibu address their (Reliable's) torsion bar failure/recall the same way. No recall or service notice, they don't say a word until it fails, then you have to complain really loud to get it taken care of.I'm not saying that MasterCraft is any better or worse than any other mfgr. That's irrelevant. I'm saying that in response to those well-documented and oft-reported problems, a response of "Sh*t happens" isn't OK. The fact that Malibu or CC do the same doesn't make it so.

IMHO

Ric
08-21-2006, 02:51 PM
not saying that an outside mfg of 3000 trailers a year would be the best solution either, but what's going on now is not good, this I can attest.

DanC
08-21-2006, 03:41 PM
:twocents: I'm not saying that MasterCraft is any better or worse than any other mfgr. That's irrelevant. I'm saying that in response to those well-documented and oft-reported problems, a response of "Sh*t happens" isn't OK. The fact that Malibu or CC do the same doesn't make it so.

IMHO

I think you're missunderstanding my point because I agree with this statement 100%! I still can't get over how the industry will not send out a recall for a known defective part (other boating industries do, the ski/wakeboard industry doesn't).

My point was I thought it ironic that an engineer chose a Product of the Year and it failed big time. A MC engineer didn't cut corners, didn't pick the cheapest part. As an engineer, that is an "oh sh*t". I agree that "sh*t happens" is a disturbing and unacceptable response to true design problems.

east tx skier
08-21-2006, 03:43 PM
Correct Craft made their own trailers (don't know about now) and they were great.


Currently, they don't, but I believe Ramlin is the same design as the old CC trailers. Around here, most of the CCs are on Dorsey Trailers.

bigmac
08-21-2006, 03:47 PM
I think you're missunderstanding my point because I agree with this statement 100%! I still can't get over how the industry will not send out a recall for a known defective part (other boating industries do, the ski/wakeboard industry doesn't).

My point was I thought it ironic that an engineer chose a Product of the Year and it failed big time. A MC engineer didn't cut corners, didn't pick the cheapest part. As an engineer, that is an "oh sh*t". I agree that "sh*t happens" is a disturbing and unacceptable response to true design problems.I see the irony. My dysfunctional actuator is the same one AndyG posted, however, not the UFP.

http://www.ufpnet.com/images/Products/actuator.gifhttp://www.tmcowners.com/teamtalk/attachment.php?attachmentid=12992&stc=1&d=1156175231

east tx skier
08-21-2006, 03:49 PM
If it makes anyone feel any better, I burned through a UFP master cylinder in less than two years.

Jim
09-14-2006, 11:22 PM
I see the irony. My dysfunctional actuator is the same one AndyG posted, however, not the UFP.

http://www.ufpnet.com/images/Products/actuator.gifhttp://www.tmcowners.com/teamtalk/attachment.php?attachmentid=12992&stc=1&d=1156175231

I too, have that same dysfunctional actuator. Not happy either. Especially when you pay big $$$ for a premium product.

boatwake
09-15-2006, 12:08 PM
It sounds like we are all in agreement that MC probably did their best when they designed/manufactured their trailers. However, now that they know that many of the trailers they produced try to rip the rear end of your tow vehicle off when towing empty and braking, I would expect that they would step up and recommend a fix (even if the cost comes out of our pocket). This is more than a quality issue. An event that causes you to lose control of your rig would be considered safety issue in my book.

Jim
09-16-2006, 10:13 PM
Boatwake,

I agree, you could not have said it better! I wonder if MC will step up to the plate??

mika
10-10-2006, 04:59 PM
I have a 98 with the UFP part and it works perfect. Granted I have the drum brakes but I have had ZERO problems. However I also don't neglect my trailer either. I do annual PM and keep everything working at 100%. I fix problems before they fail. I have many trailer all of different makes from boat to enclosed cargo trailers and they all can have problems if you dont take care of them. Infact the trailer is getting a full restoration next summer when the boat is in the water.

east tx skier
10-10-2006, 05:25 PM
I have a 98 with the UFP part and it works perfect. Granted I have the drum brakes but I have had ZERO problems. However I also don't neglect my trailer either. I do annual PM and keep everything working at 100%. I fix problems before they fail. I have many trailer all of different makes from boat to enclosed cargo trailers and they all can have problems if you dont take care of them. Infact the trailer is getting a full restoration next summer when the boat is in the water.

As for the first master cylinder, I cannot rule out neglect as my boat was not my boat for the first 10 years of its existence. As for the second UFP master cylinder, which didn't last two years, what sort of neglect would cause its failure? I like to think I baby both my trailer and boat, but if I'm overlooking some routine maintenance, please tell me what can be done to prevent such premature master cylinder failure on a garage stored boat that is probably towed fewer than a one thousand highway miles per year.

bigpack20
10-10-2006, 05:29 PM
I know this is not about trailers but dose any one know the best way to get the marks off he rubber that goes around the boat that you get from the dock.

sanjuan23
10-10-2006, 05:34 PM
I know this is not about trailers but dose any one know the best way to get the marks off he rubber that goes around the boat that you get from the dock.

Just out of curiousity do you know how to start a new thread? Would be the best way for you to get an answer out of the smart kids. Think I have noticed two responses from you today with the same question. Click East Texas Skier's FAQ Section for some help.

TMCNo1
10-10-2006, 06:11 PM
I know this is not about trailers but dose any one know the best way to get the marks off he rubber that goes around the boat that you get from the dock.

But, it may be related somewhat,

Lacquer thinner will remove anything that has marked them, sometimes the screen printing on TRAILER guidebar covers will streak the rubrail, try that first, but scratches and gouges you may have to live with, unless you replace the black insert. Keep a good coat of protectant on the black after you clean it up.

DanC
10-10-2006, 06:25 PM
I have a 98 with the UFP part and it works perfect. Granted I have the drum brakes but I have had ZERO problems. However I also don't neglect my trailer either. I do annual PM and keep everything working at 100%. I fix problems before they fail. I have many trailer all of different makes from boat to enclosed cargo trailers and they all can have problems if you dont take care of them. Infact the trailer is getting a full restoration next summer when the boat is in the water.

I agree with your statement about maintenance.
However, the problems I was referring to are acknowledged design problems (with the disc brakes, not the drum brakes) addressed by two service bulletins (guide pins and calipers) covered extensively and painfully in other threads and on other web sites. My thread started with the thought that it was ironic that MC was taking a verbal beating for fielding a product that independently received a "product of the year" award.

btw, I have owned and towed boats for over 30 years and this is the first time I have had a trailer fail on the road. Two years old, always garaged and the calipers locked up, just like the service bulletin said they would.

TMCNo1
10-10-2006, 06:52 PM
I agree with your statement about maintenance.
However, the problems I was referring to are acknowledged design problems (with the disc brakes, not the drum brakes) addressed by two service bulletins (guide pins and calipers) covered extensively and painfully in other threads and on other web sites. My thread started with the thought that it was ironic that MC was taking a verbal beating for fielding a product that independently received a "product of the year" award.

btw, I have owned and towed boats for over 30 years and this is the first time I have had a trailer fail on the road. Two years old, always garaged and the calipers locked up, just like the service bulletin said they would.


I do not think that the UFP brake systems have been used by MC on their trailers for several years. I am researching to find out who the current manufacturer is and I will post the name when I find out.

michael freeman
10-10-2006, 07:00 PM
They had to replace my actuator on my trailer when it was brand new. It was leaking break fluid on my drive way. I wasn't used to having trailer brakes and wasn't impressed until they put on a brand new actuator (warrenty) and the trailer works great now.

Is the problem with an older version of the actuators or on the new ones? I haven't had any trouble with the new actuator with the boat on or off the trailer, but this is my first summer with the boat.

MCX2RYD
10-22-2006, 07:11 PM
Has anyone replaced there tailight on a newer MC trailer. I cannot seem to get it out. Any special way to pop it out. Seen a screw underneath it what does that do? It just turns and doesnt come out?? Help me out please I dont want to break anything!!

JKTX21
11-13-2006, 04:30 PM
Bump

I am looking at switching over to a tandem axle trailer. I don't tow very far now, but I might if I had a tandem. I'm sure some of you have opinions about the pros/cons. Also, is it common for a trailer shop to take a trade-in for the existing trailer?

Sodar
11-13-2006, 04:50 PM
In my opinion Tandems are the only way to go, not matter what the size of the boat is. The only 2 reasons I could see for not having a tandem would be 1) that the trailer is RARELY used or only used for short distance and 2) the boat needs to make a tight turn to fit into a garage (tandem makes it hard to crank with two wheels fighting each other). If the boat in the avatar is yours, it looks like a '95-'97 prostar 190, which is the same boat I have on a tandem trailer. Check out my photo gallery for pics of it on a tandem... I personally love the look of the extra set of wheels. As for trailer being taken in on trade, it does happen, but I would only expect about $700 out of a used trailer. When I was considering putting my boat on a galvanized trailer, the trailer builder only offered me $1000 and I had just finished completely restoring it with LED's, Disc Brakes, swing tongue, etc. I really do not think you will be disappointed with a tandem. I am currenly looking for a PS 197, but am having a heck of a time finding one on a tandem, but I am set on finding one, or buying the boat on a single axle and switching it over to a tandem upon delivery.

JKTX21
11-13-2006, 11:37 PM
Kind of my thoughts too. I rarely move my boat by hand, but I hear it's pretty tough with a tandem. When I go more than the 1 mile from storage to ramp, it's usually 60+ miles. So I am constantly keeping an eye on the brakes and tires, and I know a tandem would tow better.

Keep me posted if you hear of any good deals in Texas!

DrSki48
08-26-2008, 12:47 AM
I think I'm going to have to have somebody attach a whole new breakaway tongue. Anybody have any other suggestions? Also, how can I get a hold of some of those rollers for the trailer prop guard cross-beam. 39470